Pankaj Balani - Ceo -Delta Exchange - Raj Shamani's Figuring Out

Intro 90%. Speaker 2 Traders New Zealand India US tariffs on. Speaker 1 India ya impact parega country. Speaker 2 Go this is business or yape. Nobody wishes I'll on you, neither do they wish well on. Speaker 1 Grumpy Q. Speaker 2 They are trying to get access to the Indian market. Speaker 1 Then why do you think India Itna's other proactive near cryptopoly? Speaker 2 Hamari Yaha bhatsara population based you have poor just keep pass information. Speaker 1 AI. Speaker 2 War. Speaker 1 What do you think? Speaker 2 US they are winning the war on robotics. Who China? I won't even discount India as of it 12% of all blockchain and Web 3 development go Indians to buy 2028I will be the largest supplier of technical manpower to the crypto space. Speaker 1 AIK through look trading. Speaker 2 The world of trading will be highly impacted by AI guarantee. Speaker 1 Carbon next pretty opportunities. Speaker 2 AI and trading is definitely a big opportunity. Speaker 1 And India, man, what should we buy? Speaker 2 In the crypto space. Speaker 1 To make more money. Actually crypto Bitcoin blockchain in SAB ke baare Mein baad batu thiye or baad lo crypto me passibi invest karna chaate like in samaji na yata Ki shuru ka sekare kya saye kya scam kya risky eka opportunity in SAB savalo ke Ansar dengi hamare aaj ke guest Pankaj Balani Co founder of Delta Exchange India ka sabse bada crypto derivatives platform jinone IIT or ISB say graduate honey ke baad investment banking mekam kya or AB India K top crypto entrepreneurs message crypto derivatives or normal crypto trading say Agar RBI crypto banker to investors India crypto fully support crypto me. What should people buy Just say pesimony kya crypto new stock market ya civic casino jessa gamble kya AIC crypto trading or profitable O sattay or entrepreneurs kya opportunities is industry pesi banana kili ye episode entak zaroor dekhe or other AAP crypto FNO space Co Explore karna chateo to check out delta exchange platform JA upco 10% fee discount be milsatta hai link is in the description. May Ajit 20 year old something mere pas 20. 30-Day Money Plan for 20 Years old Year olds in India are really. Speaker 1 Curious Jesus or or step by step 30 day plan if mujhe is industry secondary first is what should I do 30 days step by step plan like them basic. Speaker 2 Like let's say podcast, first time probability. OK, naturally. Price just give us a surprise news YouTube channel. Yeah, Hamara, Twitter, social media handles, Yeah, important news items to depending on Usk macroeconomic events. Speaker 1 OK. Speaker 2 So just AUS mega inflation Zada yeah Tokyo Gaki fed key expectation of Jaggi rate cut rates inflation or yeah it is Bitcoin, though Bitcoin US made Bitcoin a major asset class established yeah coffee, you know sizable asset class price very coffee very Usk macroeconomic news event directly XYZ company or you are absolutely ready to get some information to sort of you know demand supply. Probably it's moving on, you know, running on fumes to YouTube channel, pay notifications, pay app or resources, Internet live analysis, live analysis. Yeah, product products. So there is an instrument that gives you some sort of a leverage right cap. This is of course every everything is a trade off top loss, top position sizing, body cursor, top futures contract. To use leverage say APNI position go to the magnified leverage is a two way source. So leverage Milray or AP Malaysia -2 five K leverage to any 20% APK capital or 80% leverage is your capital. You know leverage 7 IV position price 20% you will lose all your money. So it's a two way source. It can help you. But I got price 20%. So you have made 100% return. Yeah, to use which is powerful. It's like a good car and a great car, but you need to, it will just, you know, you'll hit the wall and you'll crash. Speaker 1 Like you said, research probably indicators, echo and all of these things common scam crypto match. Crypto Scams Explained Crypto underlying asset of as in futures and options of actual token. Speaker 1 OK. Speaker 2 You are just getting the upside in Bitcoin. You see the regular Bitcoin future shortcut. You are playing for downside in Bitcoin. You are not basically selling without owning, right? So when you are trading in futures and options, you are not actually ownership. You don't have the ownership of the underlying actual title. Price change right? Actual title. That's a platform definition. There is no logic, this is just. Speaker 1 Fun fun. Speaker 2 Yeah. And at that time I saw a lot of people saying to statement, right? Then you realize you're not. Yeah, right. Yeah, of course. Reality. If you go back in history of time, you'll find this in stocks as well. Speaker 1 Yeah. Speaker 2 Right. There's a reason IPO company which is a great process, but listings or people will collect money and then they will disappear or things like that from the way you think about. Speaker 1 It. Speaker 2 You fall down, You were standing on a hollow surface and I just pulled the rug under your. Speaker 1 Feet tell me one thing, explain me this OK, basic and this is you may personal forget podcast. You may personal think of me as your somebody who's in who's a young young chap coming to you in office and trying to understand this. OK, you are. Speaker 2 Not people look back at these times and they will be. They will. Speaker 1 Be marked in history India, US tariff India, Russia or like India, China. We are not enemies. We should look at together or something, something. OK, impact country go India. This is a golden period in India right? Tell me what will happen other US situation? Explain me this. Trump x Crypto x India This is business or nobody wishes I'll on you, neither do you. They wish well on you. You know it's just business. Normal business situations may life may apne couldn't see what are the situations Curry only right people who are working with they are also negotiating with them, right? Once you're on a negotiate negotiating table, you look for the best deal for yourself and once you're out of the room, you don't hold it against them. Then why did they look for the best deal for them? This is their job, right? So best relationships foster when both the parties, you know, have something to gain out of each other. So we will have to see how this evolves. Speaker 1 Because. Speaker 2 He's trying to get a better negotiating deal for him. They are trying to get access to the Indian markets and not just India. We are not a special guest there. They are trying to get access to OK government right or or Republican Party. So USA karaki pelagi hamayi or market asani onachi aki serif bharke lokamare markets market by hambi bharke market right? Why are we importing everything? We should also be exporters and why are we importing everything? We should also be making it here. So everyone wants to be self reliant. They are also looking at they do then look where they are top economy, ho to innovation, maximum value, right? You can clean your own house, right? But you will think here it's time. So what you what will you think? Either you will find someone to clean that house or you will buy a robot that that can clean your house, right? So you'll find something of that solution. So you will find either a human resource or a technology, and that goes for every. So it becomes a compulsion for you to innovate. So once you are an economy, Mahapita innovation is a compulsion, right? But I'll be self innovations in the world we are spending a lot on just getting too much from other countries. So we should try and be more self reliant or guess a passive related. Because again, you know when you are making a lot of money, you don't think like this. When you're not making a lot of money, you want to think like this so you can make a lot more money because. Top interest payment, Tax collector interest payment interest there U.S. dollar, U.S. dollar, Vico U.S. dollar $8 Kitty job US say ₹100 like 85 rupees, like a 70 imports to see countries other import, right? So this is what they're trying to do. What they're trying to do is change the world order a little bit in terms of trading relationships or they're trading relationships with them. He just did a business market looking innovation. Speaker 1 What do you think is with India? Speaker 2 India may they have a bunch of things that they want to good goods or services sectors services to us or India donate coffee business to US. My agriculture is largely, you know this thing highly automated that they can make a lot more and they can sell a lot more. They're looking for markets where they can enter and they can sell more. They're looking to increase their businesses agricultural. Speaker 1 Market. Speaker 2 Agriculture is one of the Space India discussion order. Speaker 1 Agriculture. I didn't know care Discussion. Speaker 2 Order agriculture. Produce. Yeah, agriculture. Speaker 1 OK, basic cheese. Speaker 2 Basic. Speaker 1 Cheese and. Speaker 2 Local farmers. Local farmers population to humge as a country and this is the right stance key. Do you have to follow the pricing that we have here? Speaker 1 The US, in simple words, Volta, one of the things is. Speaker 2 I think it's a primary research space. OK, but though I might not be, I will be largely correct, but I might. Speaker 1 Be US, India pay taxes. Speaker 2 Level playing field. Speaker 1 Level playing, right? And one of the things, one of the things is agriculture. Or India minimum selling price farmer, local farmer. Speaker 2 Tofir Kalko Agario market dynamics change of food about expensive home grown capacity, right. So it is not just about farmers with the immediate impact man, it is about everyone, the food, just which is the basic self-reliance. Both important, self reliant. Speaker 1 Isn't it more about like what I was reading? These are the oil or weapons, majority oil and major oil buyers. Oil, Weapons & Global Trade And. Speaker 1 Major companies. So it's that also KR oil is one of the big, big, big commodities. So that is one second is defence and weapons, the US Abney Menge weapons, Menge aircraft source of defence, but overall all. Speaker 2 This also forms a part of trade. It's not the trade. Speaker 1 But it's majority about that I don't defense oil or agriculture sub combined. He was us because. Speaker 2 India, US problem, they are in such kind of a discussion with every country. Speaker 1 Right. All of a sudden, president her country. Speaker 2 Exactly. Usk trade finances right to India, relationship to to UK, Japan, China, India. So they are trying to do this with everyone. It's not just us. We are a big economy. So our relationship with them is important and that's our relationship with them from our point of view is probably very important. But from their point of view, they are looking at 10 other relationships or what they are trying to do is how do we, you know, basically US is in a bit of a financial, you should say here, the financial health of the country is not the best. So they are trying to get that financial discipline right. Debts, culture, interest payments, but interest rates or you know, currency bought strong U.S. dollar, those unk markets are competitive, exports competitive. So what they're trying to do is reorganize their life in such a fashion, keep business. Speaker 1 That I agree and think about. But from a outsider's perspective, I mean they're much more experts in the world and I think US economist, strategist expert right key India amarali bhati Bhatia bhat long standing alai hai tere saluta company strength key in cinema gandhiji MA Agar hame. China's AKI countries say AKA Pangal energy sought Karnichi properly and then we should move to another jodh Thoda's favor maybe a OBSASE Bhatkar AK time pay. Why her economy say they're dying to do it and can he be usually have they seen. Speaker 2 They have struck deals with you. They have struck deals with Japan and Korea. Speaker 1 EU, Japan, Korea is anyway and growing down economies, right, Fast growing economies, major economies, growing economies Brazil, right Brazil. Speaker 2 Like I said in a negotiation when they enter into maybe at least what this is what they projected, but it doesn't matter reality here negotiations are lendy negotiations are long and extensive and take time and will have will not be one way this thing. The main criticism that I've heard of U.S. government is that they are trying to do this very quickly and then people get a little unsettled. How can you put a timeline to this? Let's do it. But you know, give me chance to reorganize myself. This is your. Speaker 1 Entrepreneur So. Speaker 2 He's like. Speaker 1 Let's do. Speaker 2 It now, yes, strategic versus tactical difference because in business world timelines are shorter, you're used to quarterly updates to your investors, right and things change every quarter and in larger strategic world things are take time, but Inca impact Padega world order people again start to become friends. That's what I believe. Speaker 1 There are no permanent enemies, no. Speaker 2 Permanent you know we don't look at or they don't you know they they spoil all our relationships with us. So plus people to people news in the short term makes it look like life will completely change when you meet an American, your interaction will not change with them at all. Why will it change? Speaker 1 And did they say India and China it's? Speaker 2 Again, the same thing. Speaker 1 Do you think keye civic show hair because E core apna Ek strength of the Khani satne milke towards the West or do you think he actually started as open new bridge for. India & China: Friends or Foes? US, I think from coming from a business world, this is again business. Speaker 1 From a business point, but do you think he had long standing? Is it a start of new? Speaker 2 Relationship supply demand relationships is changing. Let's say you get these mics and some from some vendor. Now he starts to change the game that look you know you have to give me X number of orders and I will do minimum 2 AMC minimum one AMC contract and do repair. And you were saying right so then what will you do? You'll start to look at other vendors relationship or you know time, but now you'll re look at but Asani you will let your guard down. No, of course. So this in my opinion from a business point of view is similar. People will start to look at reorganizing their trade when their trade on with one partner is changing. They will look to change their trade with other partners so that Asani they have the best hand in negotiation. Speaker 1 Which is fair or Yahi horai? Speaker 2 Kafi, Sara. Analysis. You know, speculator. There's no bot speculation over here because this has become the central topic. Speaker 1 In the world. Speaker 2 Now in the world and every facet of life, it's touching. Look, you and I are talking in a podcast about this, you know. Speaker 1 But because yeah essay type K moments akonai pataki die down die down Yeah, golden opportunity with in time yes Kiki bohot saree cheese up and down business business reshuffle relationship up and down import export new schema golden opportunity for entrepreneurs. Speaker 2 I was just. Speaker 1 Reading about China, India pay sanctions take India right Chinese entrepreneur yes that is for China. This is big from India similarly. Speaker 2 These are Palace, just Vietnam. They were doing transshipping through Vietnam. Speaker 1 Big ship, big money, right? I know a friend, China's India directly trader, simple trader and I think electronics bathroom something big business, trading business triple digit cross and China, China or India to Vietnam, China or Vietnam India, Vietnam India. So he saved that money just and he made money. Global News Updated loophole Figure out China. Speaker 2 Up for this even for us like not just India this became hub and this was a big distinct for them. Speaker 1 China say my Vietnam jaga was the. Speaker 2 Opportunities to or ha MATLAB Joe Hamne Baatkari this is my line of work where to we follow this kind of news very closely and we basically interesting. We like that exciting and then we are able to relate things as well. Just say agriculture came about Curry here as an EA Captain News berly to to be said a farmer impacted everyone in the society is impacted right. So self-reliance get the important user government self-reliance. It is important or 20 23 October may Bitcoin pay ETF approval or BlackRock, which basically said key individuals can easily and corporates can easily participate in Bitcoin by just buying an instrument that gives them the upside of Bitcoin to up synthetic participation directly. Bitcoin there I pick instrument carrier Bitcoin the price code tracker It's Kanam unit carrier fund key was temporized 30,000 Koski was a surprise rally Ganesh Rukia then the second catalyst was of 60,000 OVA before Trump's selection, a Trump election was very favorable for Bitcoin because he had said look I want to make USA crypto capital of the world. So this is again thinking this is 1 good thing about him right he's thinking Agar industry buddy OTA. We want to make sure that we and our companies dominate in in this space. Speaker 1 US. Speaker 2 So about industry basis already create industry crypto early or late? Crypto as an industry is very early, it's almost starting, but that does not mean the Bitcoin price, you know, right. But crypto as an industry, it's very early US or generally as a society, they were a little more open to this generally, but price 60,000 election went to 100,000, right? So this moves in Bitcoin in the last two years, this price rally and all these things has been driven by a institutional and retail participation through an ETF, which is a sophisticated and you know, BlackRock, Justin Armand Waldemar or very favorable Trump administration for crypto. But self-reliance, key industry, industry or investment formal coffee commitment coffee government. It's important for you as well to start creating bases in this industry. Industry semiconductors. If we had started early, it would have been very useful, right to ask Sarif ABS Johan or globally Sari Sari fabrication Taiwan. Everyone is reliant though there is a there is a merit to self-reliance. There's a serious merit to self-reliance, particularly if the industry becomes very big industry a sector about or apka usme Sara ka Sara touch pointy foreign hai yafir imported tofir app pic you know dominant maker power or domination Your benefits for Jesse make data 12% of all blockchain and Web 3 development developers programmers who Indians. Speaker 1 12%. Speaker 2 12% second largest in the world the US OK Junai had way last year. OSMI I17 percent to buy 2028I will be the largest supplier of technical manpower to the Web 3 and crypto space. That is the projection the Abido Hamne Industry Co, formerly Bhajjada, promote Miniki in our. Speaker 1 Company could be promoted. Speaker 2 Positive ecosystem benefits, right? As a country Job creation right Yeah key job creation Hoga or my industry may usually count as salaries. Other thing up to Yadav prompt engineers difficult to find out that to premium multi though there is a lot of benefit to getting there early and building right and then you also build it on your own terms. Just say a member that on US name stable coins core regulate there's a cryptocurrency which tracks the price of U.S. dollar. How does it track the price of U.S. dollar X table coin pitcher back the US dollars a fully take care the US dollar the company company go U.S. dollar the US dollar the US dollar goes company like this company. U.S. Treasury medal is a specific interest to U.S. Treasury medal. Will pesa be total dose was a daiso billion or one of the largest buyers of corporate treasuries? McAfee but a player obvious table coins. India is 10th largest lender to US in terms of governments. The largest is Japan $1 trillion bond daiso billion is it China UK economy scale crypto industry in terms of lending to us right. So what's in economy already right U.S. economy yeah right though ecosystem right as a country where? Why India’s Still Slow on Crypto Do you think India actually it was other proactive new crypto? Speaker 2 I think as an economy, as a country, Hamesco, as an opportunity, Dekhnaji. Speaker 1 Dekhnaji, we established that. Speaker 2 We established that what? Speaker 1 Do you think is it because Hum Loko is? Is it because Kemari bought gullible and small industry? Is it because key? Is it because key the importance energy? Is it biggest game technologically advance in a top level? What is the reason? Yeah, 56783. Speaker 2 OK, so the second point probably Hamari is a problem. Hamari population base, population basement population base. You have too poor. Just keep pass information. Research, research, research, right. That's why Internet is is research Yeah but research resources but population and just protect the government is not really wrong in being cautious. But then there is a fine balance between kaseya aapko caution ko kaseya aapko managed karna hai apne logo ko Ki asana ho Ki galat actor Sajan Spaceman or asana ho Ki wo be up careful right to APO Industry Co industry may innovation but protections we built right or locally industry to promote foreign players to discourage industry locally growth problem solved. Speaker 1 As a common man, negative angle for XYZ. What If Crypto Gets Banned? So opportunity loss. They had stopped banks from servicing crypto companies. Crypto companies go banking services, but crypto companies business challenges because how will they do those may basically to industry taker took a big hit or industry how do you pay your employees now? Speaker 1 Exactly. Speaker 2 So this became a challenge. Speaker 1 For worst case point, 1%. Speaker 2 What do you think? What will happen? Global economy? Indian economy, right? The world price for support economic kidneys of the world denominated Yeah related platform mainly opportunity. Here's a question. Speaker 1 Here's the third experiment. Speaker 2 Yes. Speaker 1 Paisa, her government for the good, for the bad, for the ugly. Up and down the regulations the governments get technically, but tell. Speaker 2 Me. Speaker 1 Why would any government leave Hamari currency globally traded her country APNI currency? Speaker 2 Stock trade and. Speaker 1 Government has nothing to do with it. But then in a great scenario, Sabagar Banjati currency Banjati which initially was the. Speaker 2 Idea it was not, it was a marketing this I'll tell you OK, OK. Explain why is it important to innovate in crypto? Crypto as an asset has established a position in the mainstream asset class. Speaker 1 Crypto asset case. Crypto: Asset or Currency? Asset price, market or market perception, value right though asset is just that, Bitcoin or price. Trade crypto. Crypto assets just for distinction. Speaker 1 Intangible values like it's just but real. Speaker 2 Value, Real value. Economic value determined, right? Yeah. Real estate income, right. Intrinsic value, intrinsic value, intrinsic value to. Basically, your first office would have a very different position in your heart, right? Yeah. Versus another person who's renting that place. Yeah, right. So intrinsic value can be different for different people. But wait, philosophical discussion. So let's come back to value key CB asset code just go key, right? International trade, locally strong currency relative to other currencies. Yeah, right to network value. Yeah, participation and value to have demand supplies determine or as a hoga key value largely and Galatogi market cap perception. But yeah, yeah, idea, theoretical constructor. OK, hardami Hari asset key value, demand or supply discussion, Kya. Yeah, you know money and the control of these things important to innovation industry, important industry, innovation industry or as a large economy you don't have a foot in the door then you will be left behind in this. So even if you don't have have ambitions of becoming very big in the space or dominating the space. Minimum table sticks to Hamarabi is my participation industry buddy 20 4 cross 7 trading 24 cross 7 trading equities or markets infrastructure developed developed 24 cross 7 trading Apple stock tokenized a company 1 token is backed by 1 stock of Apple. Now that it's a token it it can be traded 24 cross 7 because this kind of infrastructure already 24 cross 7 trading company. So over the next 5-7 years it is quite possible real world assets what tokenized or it bought by the team real world assets which is about or about 24 cross 7 or trading service. You know price opportunity example the 24 cross 7 market asset against push shares against add Friday Evening News. You have 50% 75,00,000 thousand, either you get more collateral or you know the chances to 24 cross 7 Trading is very important for this right collateral management real time pricing available. Her time is very valuable for the economy to escape crypto as an industry broader economy. 24 cross. 7 trading. Speaker 1 Infrastructure. Most of the things real world back assets. Speaker 2 US may which exchanges trade Chicago or ESR exchange? They have attempts to go for 24 cross 7 trading already have this technology. Central banks Central bank digital currency Central bank digital currency is powerful tool. I'll tell you how Bank account, bank account, branch banking, banks usually. Instrument Ajay give a mobile Sahi bank account call pay as in puraka pura digital banking. So that is very powerful. Just say CBDC. They think let's think of this as digital cash a substitute for cash Yani. It doesn't take a notage of digital XR peg a notage or digital or it parts are peg a notage iska matlab Agar mane apko pasadia parts are peg a note. Those from bank involved UPI transaction get through those from banking kapura infrastructure involved. So there's a cost to that. But digital transfer garpam apko parts are peg a note peer-to-peer, just my bank and I involved. That is basically a peer-to-peer settlement mechanism without involving a third party. If you go and read Bitcoin white paper, the first concept paper of Bitcoin, this paper is about peer-to-peer transactions. This paper is about peer-to-peer settlement of money. And it is not so much about key control, casser hoga or economy. This is more about how to do peer-to-peer transfers. Hamne as a society, Hamne communication, physical mail, e-mail page, Hamne social media, just every gossip. We changed, right? Hamne as a society, transfer of money, pay, look money. Instead of storing it physically, we can store it in a bank account, which is basically some numbers. There's no physical cash, just numbers. It's a Ledger, but digital technology with how do you do that? It's my challenge. It's my challenge here. I gotta make photo, same serial number, powerful, just the way we send emails. And then you're able to spend that cash. Now you can send an e-mail to someone in the US overnight. Speaker 1 But then is may involvement of banks is not there? Yes, involvement of government is not there. Speaker 2 Yes, for every transaction. Or to imagine the power of that power of cryptocurrency. So this is how Bitcoin was defined. Bitcoin architecture very powerful, right? Right, Somehow it can be validated. Loophole, but it means any possibilities to control of power economic system telecommunication. You can build your own satellite and you can, you know, build your own telecommunication network. And but you put your own telecommunication network, it will get spotted and you'll be shut down, right? Or you can put your own social media or there are a lot of other things that you can do. So what we have to think about is what are the positive use cases of this and how we can absorb that. And there will be side effects of it. We will cover those slowly. We have to be confident that we'll be able to do. Speaker 1 But tell me yes, RA use cases yes RA cheats a almost her country right on economic experts what crypto experts debates and which countries world power like what technologically both advanced what is called promote let's say us as a country, Germany as a country, you're welcome and do it right. Why China Avoids Crypto So that's one side of country. But then at the same time those country is it India, China, India we will see OK, we don't have a clear stance China and a straight up like we won't do it when China technologically was advanced. In fact, there are both speculation again. New world order may China will rise to the top right whose country is the. Speaker 2 Second largest economy it is already. Speaker 1 It's already and there is a speculation you maybe go US, which might or might not be true. What do you think? Or technologically, why do you think China is saying no? Speaker 2 China for a very China for a very long period of time was very one of the largest markets for crypto for crypto only lately in 2019, they were also one of the first countries to experiment with CBDC. They the way they make their decision making, they can be very quick when they decide. For example, Hong Kong is one of the one of the biggest destinations for crypto. Hong Kong has a very clear regulation. Hong Kong may up business full suit of regulation you. This is how it is done. This is how it is not done and there's complete clarity and it has. It was a second country to come out with an ETF after US. And the aim in Hong Kong is to become the hub for crypto trading in Asia. So they want to make sure that they take the market. So the way China would play is also through it's different verticals and then you choose which sector you go after. They have their own constraints. Speaker 1 Constraint to China. Speaker 2 Yeah, China just economy may capital controls is you know a big challenge. Capital controls as in kidnap China K or kidnap just in China is about constraint. Just have land X number of years. You can do certain kind of businesses, you cannot do certain kind of businesses. You're allowed to take certain money out of the country. You're not allowed. India may be rules, Indian may be rules are Hamari Jassi and business Arabia. Though China may be but I think rules but in rules could be monitored. Though Indian nature steply are woke up comparatively coffee progressive he transactions for track and then we'll know the rule break China regressive time in the sense they have a lot of Chinese people participating in crypto on offshore Chinese exchanges. They have people in Hong Kong and they can travel freely between Hong Kong and they can do it, though difficult but. Speaker 1 Anywhere Chinese play money destination for a lot of reasons. Speaker 2 Which is fine. Let's try and find a common ground or common ground nickel. Speaker 1 What is Abidis India? Give me one. What's your view? Speaker 2 Because China might also come out with a positive thing on crypto any day. So whatever answer I might give might be very short sighted. What's your? Speaker 1 Sense. Speaker 2 My sense is they will be. They will. We want to make very strong moves in the crypto market very soon. Speaker 1 Fair. Speaker 2 My reading is they did it in 2019 and they did it to curb the flight of money. Speaker 1 And do you think China could just stand, say promote Karna business? Is it good? I'll, I'll tell you right, China, one of the entrepreneurs I was talking to and he explained me very nicely on the podcast Global companies level playing field name like Amazon, Google, whatever XYZ global companies, internal system of right and Chinese entrepreneurs opportunities momentums, Amazon, Flipkart, Flipkart. Speaker 2 Totally. Market players were dependent tofair. Yeah, foreign players were dependent. Local industry growing. Speaker 1 But they could Jesse Hamare der e-commerce as an industry multi brand retail up 51% Indian 50 percents are the foreign right. That's a very simple basic rule. Isiliya hamaredar Naika Storybani Isili Hamaredar Flipkart Storybani retail Indigenous Indian brands, right? Orfair isiliye Unko bit Karnegli Hamaredari quick commerce neck kill kardi. It's just amazing. It's amazing And OK, let's talk about. Speaker 2 Deep you said China has done a lot of work in AI, they focus specifically on AI or 20/17/2018 so they put dedicated focus key industry to 20/17/18. The newspaper articles of you will see they were doing a lot of they had a lot of focus on AI and that is where you see that you know, you have now start to see the fruits of that, you know, effort. So AIP to Kafikam those are chat bots was first introduced in Facebook in 2018. Key chat bots will be a big thing or OC times a natural language processing or AIP. And China actually got a lot of researchers made their made attractive grounds for a lot of Chinese students who are in US to repatriate back to China and start doing a research. So they've done, you know, they've given serious thought to this and they have decided that, look, this is 1 area where we want to be hired. Speaker 1 What do you think? Too early. Speaker 2 Too early. Who Wins the AI War? I won't even discount India as of it because we have a lot of data. So ultimately, it is quite possible that who has the data wins. Speaker 1 But still, what do you think? Speaker 2 Abhito, I think China is doing very well on AI which is related to. Speaker 1 China, US India the bought beach heavy at this point but abhil again number of people Joe AI engineers you know harsal hamaredar bohod zaadam versus. Speaker 2 You know. Speaker 1 Consumption economy, you know, production economy, production economy, more AI engineers every year, Hemlock globally, AI engineers, Ethernet supply country. So maybe that's a plus sign for us. Speaker 2 It is a plus sign for us to AI engineers from Manar AI consider the consumers right or you have to openness of either. Speaker 1 But and who do you think China or US Messi con AI war jitra be? Speaker 2 Usus Clear winning the war on robotics. Who, China. Speaker 1 China Robotics. Majitra. Speaker 2 Because it's a need, factories may. Speaker 1 Robotic. Speaker 2 Population that this thing is changing population demographic dynamics is changing the aging population, though, if you whatever what can do the same thing. Plus population is getting richer. Yeah. So once you start to get rich, you don't want to go into the factory and sweat it out. Speaker 1 Right Robotics is a need. Robotics India, You. Speaker 2 Need to real reality is best innovation needs certain India. Speaker 1 You need. India can need. Speaker 2 Of course, you know we have a lot of poor people. We need to lift people out of poverty. We need to grow fast to ABI Hamaripas. There are too many. Yeah, as a country we are not that rich as of it to. Speaker 1 Foreign capital country. Speaker 2 OK, So you will get redundant very fast. China demographics change oriented, they have a need key robotics maneuver together. India, we have a large population, young population, we need to find jobs for them. We need to find, you know, opportunities for them because you want to be in a place where they are able to maximize their output and talent and youth. If you have 27 year old, 29 years old opportunities. Speaker 1 Though or trading, they are spending a lot of money and in fact Jinki income come about trading versus the high paying income high income group. This is data by not me. This is government data publicly out there. Speaker 2 Probably because of the idea you know I. Speaker 1 You lose Kare will be mid income and low income. Speaker 2 Versus large income, this is important. 5, 1000 rupees ₹10,000 or option of expire disproportionate, you are counted as one. But or it was a chance this thing you just wanted to try it out once, right? Number of investors versus traders, not just in India, everywhere in the world traders only 5%. So 1 is to number of people who are actually trading are about 5% of the total number of people who have who are investing or who have DMAT accounts, let's say. So just say US. Maybe I got my dictum. So as per CME, when talking about Robin Hood data, again, of all the people who have accounts with them, only one to two of 20 million people who have accounts with them, 1 to 2 million trade options and futures. Speaker 1 But this is also true, right, 90%? Speaker 2 Traders those 90% me how many a qualifier Joe Key .200% defending. Why 90% Traders Lose There is a merit to the gravitas of this point. Right? Published, yeah. They wanted to just try it out. For example, there's a restaurant, but then they realized they are on a highway and most people come and have a cup of coffee and leave because a lot of people came and they were just wanted to, you know, experience it and never came back. Minimum X dollars or loss amount say 9010 K 5050 5050. Yeah, everybody's winning nobody market, Yes, SA went against your portfolio called niche La Sakte, right. So Agar up insurance or bury Bardini, right, many. But technically for example where every time you buy insurance, more often than not you will not end up realizing the value of insurance. You cannot look at that as money wasted. Yeah, that is the cost of protection, right? You should ideally be happy, right. Not everyone is looking at put options and others as insurance and there are people who are using it for speculation whose case may MERA logic, but OBX segment has just qualified markets me data analyze numbers 1910 say casual traders go include U.S. Markets, crypto markets, you know, equity markets, markets, but Java, OK. And this has to be taken with a pinch of pinch of salt. Speaker 1 Tell me AIK, through look trading we have come up full circle screenshots and they're like oh they're making money. Using AI to Trade & Profit Right. Speaker 1 Is it? Is it the future? Speaker 2 OK, this is the future that AI and bots or AI powered bots will be trading. Speaker 1 Bot trading. Speaker 2 Bot trading manually bot is nothing but. Speaker 1 A. Speaker 2 Set of rules or charge APD say kafi programming because it can write the entire code to in fact Hamari platform pay you can use AI to write a code for you to write a bot for you. Delta Exchange pay available API Copilot. Of course, manually difficult to to models what improved that will be heavily guarded to as we perform heavily guarded algorithms star traders her industry Joe highly sought after yeah, investors, you know marquee investors or let me give this as a problem to what can AI, what does AI do actually, it analyzes a lot of data and it can do a lot of computations very fast Yeah, right. It just it's rather at the core of it, it's rather brute. Speaker 1 Force. So logically, brute force can help you with some sort of information leverage, yes, and that information edge that you have. Speaker 2 Which you were not allowed to get earlier because that brute force was very time consuming. Exactly. Is now a lot faster. Speaker 1 So then technically, if you know how to use it well, you can make some money. Speaker 2 So, yes, so the question is not about telling AI tell me how to make money, it's about giving that AI, OK, analyse this for me and how can somebody learn this information pattern pattern manually signal generate up or patterns of is is is asset key trading a streaming pattern identified. This was a tough problem. Can you identify a pattern in this assets trading history? Speaker 1 Right. But now that's happening. Speaker 2 That is, these are the kind of things that we will be able to do with AI. And then the competition will be amongst AI trader one versus AI trader 2. So bots will compete against one another who has more alpha. OK. So the world of trading will be highly impacted by AI, guaranteed. Speaker 1 World of everything will be highly impacted is already getting highly impacted by this. OK, history is historical data score AI tell me top three historical events so that other future maybe people can look forward to it. When Crypto Slowed Down So let's take US election. That was a big one. That was a big one. That was a big one. Trump Jita Trump Jitnege bad because Trump Neburata Mesco crypto capital and people did it. So that was one I say. Or. Speaker 2 Positive side, negative side, Bitcoin ETF approval was a landmark event, say validation at a Spaceman SIE validation Tabata when Alan Muscat started to buy Bitcoin back in 2020 in his Tesla. Because all these are signals of validation, Yeah. So news items where at least crypto has more. Speaker 1 BlackRock. Speaker 2 Adopted BlackRock so let's do it OK Trump election was a signal that he had gone out in the Bitcoin conference prior to election and said that look I will make US the crypto capital and now they are coming out with the regulation which are very pro crypto. Speaker 1 And and negative event without. Speaker 2 Negative events may negative events moves, watch out for them. Or you could be positive events when move to the to when this there was a FTX exchange with the job pay issues with it. Right when that event happened market crashed. That was one of the the most recent crashes which recycled the crash. Just doting, which was about there was a coin called Luna, which was an algorithmic stable coin. They were trying to do everything with algorithms or stable coin HOGA, which will be backed by, you know, not by Fiat currency, but other things. Yeah. And this is where, you know, issues happened and there was a big crash. In fact, that was the bigger crash which crashed Bitcoin from 40,000 to 20,000 and 2526 recovery FTX news happened. Yeah. And in fact, they were correlated because I think FTX was largely exposed to exposed to the vote of event event to us kebab, you know, cafe collateral, short collateral and they started to come short on a lot of things. So the May of 2022 to November of 2022, it was a very tricky time for crypto. Yeah, similar events have happened in the past. There was a major hack in crypto that happened in one of the exchanges. Again, we're happy Bitcoin price coffee crashed to SA events where crypto price crashed here 2017 guy crashed 20,000 the price 2030% but futures market bought liquid. So futures market now liquid price, it was already, it had gone from 13,000 to 20,000 within a matter of month. And because there was no instrument too short, you know it just was going parabolic and 1020% overnight. Speaker 1 And now that you look at all of this market right or subject to crypto, dicto, global news, finance sector, world geopolitics, all of these things are happening around the world. Carbon next buddy Opportunity purely from the point of business and money. The Next Big Opportunity Across the globe are crypto markets man. Speaker 1 Both opportunity with that. Speaker 2 Too, AI is definitely a big opportunity, which I think is specific, yeah, it will touch a lot of areas of our life. So AI and trading is definitely a big opportunity and the new set of algo traders that are coming, they should definitely, you know, look to a sneaky opportunity. Speaker 1 And crypto. Speaker 2 This is 1 very big area that will come about crypto. Crypto markets made to Mujhe Laktaki penetration and CBDC's will be a very big opportunity. If rightly done. That's a very good opportunity for the society, not maybe for entrepreneurs because it's more of a government play entrepreneur. Crypto driven use cases is a very big opportunity. Remittances use case is a very big opportunity for. Speaker 1 Example So what can I do Mego here with our crypto market? What should I do? What should I buy? What should I invest? What should I build? Speaker 2 Building a company that facilitate real world remittances. Speaker 1 OK. Speaker 2 Using the crypto technology can be a very big opportunity. OK, right? There are companies who do that, but nobody has really cracked it and made it mainstream because nobody is trying to do it. In my understanding is that people have not really solved that problem where the, you know, you will have to go and identify a market, a pocket and then solve that problem for that pocket. So that is 1 very big opportunity. Joe Curry, Jasik. Speaker 1 OK and India ma'am, apart from this could I select what should we buy? Speaker 2 For in the crypto space. Speaker 1 To make more money. Speaker 2 Yeah. I think having some exposure to a new asset class which has the possibility of which has, you know, lot of possibilities is a good idea. Speaker 1 Yes, you. Speaker 2 Can is. Speaker 1 It clear. Speaker 2 So buying a certain coin that will increase in value, Yeah, I will. I'm not the my world is more what is going to change the price today? Speaker 1 What is going to change my world is. Speaker 2 More about and it Change can be up, change can be down, change can be sideways. No changes also change, right? Because no change means volatility coming cooling off, right? So it's a very big change for an options trailer and what changes prices on cryptocurrencies. There's a lot to do these days with the global news. So how the geopolitics and Russia, Ukraine settles that will that's going to have a big impact on all the markets. Speaker 1 That's a global epicenter. Speaker 2 Yeah, or Gisuka impact. Speaker 1 Because Jason Sanchez Bandhu in Russia is a global event for me. What's in Sanchez Bandhu anywhere? Global economy, oil and natural gas or moment? OK, what's next and situations then there'll be a lot of speculation for traders also, for investors also and for opportunities also and plus war, settled countries, migration. Speaker 2 Real estate. Speaker 1 Real estate, especially economies like Dubai, yes, won't be. Both impact hidden country and there'll be an interesting change to see. Speaker 2 That will be an interesting change to see oil prices pay supply market. So oil prices will should go down. Speaker 1 And interconnected business, there'll be like a lot of changes, so. Speaker 2 People because oil prices suddenly go down. Yes, there'll be a certain pocket, but overall as an economy we are exposed to. Speaker 1 Yeah. OK. Here's a question which is my last question for you. OK, which is India key traders and global traders make care difference here Kya income behavior pattern with I guess it change with Kisemi her Kisiko technically Ade Logan Joe as a skill use Karte Ade Logan as a gambling as a addiction, right? Like is it the same or is it there is some kind of behavior to key awareness and education levels? Speaker 2 I don't, OK. Indian vs Global Traders I think largely same, but there are certain products that are popular in certain markets or woke naturally trained product. Speaker 1 Give me an example. Speaker 2 Does I say India is one of the largest markets when it comes to derivatives? OK, India is the world's largest markets in derivatives to India major audience in terms of derivatives ETFs and all joking mane coffee bath Curry is brought coming US more how popular to serve Bitcoin many coffee popular to market to scale already a appetite. China may for example, derivatives are not that big for some reason right, but stock general stock investing is very big. It's a one of, you know, of course big economy is a big stock. Speaker 1 Market. Speaker 2 Though her market may Kushnagar's products so then Joe's market K idiosyncratic out there are those key reasons. So thank you just around the history here just a popular way or you know year differences up to India, US, Korea are top three markets when it comes to leading derivative players in the world. Part of the reason is you happy Joe exchanges economies in products design pay in products user friendly innovations countries exchanges in products this is. Speaker 1 The only major. Speaker 2 Difference as a global economic discussions, maybe we don't talk about it too much, but it's a big economic center, right. Collectively, Europe put together each of these countries are decent sized economies. Yeah, couple of trillion dollars, countries to own countries, product set those largely traders. Same for trader psychology, same. But which market trading mindset? Speaker 1 Yeah. And follow up to the last question is then because derivatives Kibatkari products Kibatkari you know Chinese market, India market, U.S. Market you said psychology history in all if you have to put it, do you think then crypto and the world of crypto new stock market key is just a casino with better marketing? Speaker 2 Meaning it can evolve as a new shape of stock market. It is not a casino with better marketing because with the poor marketing right? And we should stop, we should not just look at crypto as a trading asset. Ultimately crypto as an industry will thrive when there are use cases built, right? Because otherwise Bitcoin primary use case, store of value, right? Ethereum primary use case smart contracts, which is basically how you use the Ethereum network how you build just a minute programmable stable coins Ethereum network. They are also programmable use case the. Speaker 1 Biggest There are a lot of There are going to be a lot of use cases. Speaker 2 Social media use cases, you can discern good quality or real news from fake news by some sort of a reward token mechanism, right? We'll figure out. Karna Padega figure out. But you can do this kind of discerning of how to separate real from, you know, rumor by having a reward built in to use cases to or people will go and build them. Smart entrepreneurs will come out and build applications and top and underlying this will become more like a technology and this will happen with AI as well. So that's why I said we are very early. This is infrastructure. This is laying out the groundwork. Yeah, the roads and the factories, you know when you have cars plowing on them, that is where you know the real flowers will blossom though. Yes, Ochnaki, just trading already an assets key. That's the only use case is a big short cycle trading over here. Markets build price discovery over here and use case payments. Price discovery just got price available near payments. My guess is useful. Speaker 1 Fair. Final Thoughts Perfect. Thank you so much, Sir. Thank you for coming here and talking about world economy and a lot of stuff. Good Sir. Thank you so much. How are you? BTS I'm good, I'm good. Speaker 1 How do you live? Speaker 2 Bangalore but I keep shuttling between Bangalore and Dubai. So I have basis coffee industry to coffee industry interaction. Speaker 1 Thank you so much. 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