Olugbenga Ogunbowale - "If there is something that Africa can learn from America, it's that abundance mindset."

We're listening to "Limitless Africa," the podcast that looks at how Africa and America can work together for share prosperity. It's sponsored by the US Department of State and the Scene Fire Foundation. Maybe you are in a city like Lagos, and you can survive, you know, five, six hours of traffic. Tell me, what is it that you can also survive, right? What is that problem, you know, that is facing in your business, in your organization, that you cannot somehow? So, yes, there are things that Africa can learn from America and things that America can learn from Africa. This week's "Limitless Africa" is about Yali, the flagship program for the Mandela Washington Fellowship. The Mandela Washington Fellowship for Young African Leaders is the flagship program of the US government's Young African Leaders Initiative, also known as Yali. Since 2014, the Fellowship has brought nearly 6,500 young leaders from every country in Sub-Saharan Africa to the United States for academic and leadership training. These fellows are between the ages of 25 and 35, and they are accomplished innovators and leaders in their communities and countries. One of them is Oleg Bangal, Ogun Boale. He completed the Yali West Africa program in 2018, was a 2019 Mandela Washington Fellow, and an alumni ambassador in 2020. Since then, he set up ventures like Grant Master, helping secure over $13 million in grant funding for clients and students. He also set up E-Power, where he consulted with Mita and Google on digital skills, training SMEs and startups in Nigeria and Ghana. I wanted to speak to him about his experience with the Yali program and draw out some valuable lessons for young Africans looking to supercharge their careers. Oleg Bangal, welcome to the Limitless Africa podcast. Thank you very much. Obviously, I'm really excited to be here. Thank you. First of, can you please introduce yourself and your work to the Limitless Africa listeners? Oh, yeah, sure. I'm Oleg Bangal, Ogun Boale. I describe myself as a social entrepreneur since an intersection of AI, funding and impact. I'm the co-financing of Grant Master, where we've helped startups and NGOs secure over $13 million in equity-free funding. Now, I remember when I first came across the Mandela Washington Fellowship around 2016. It wise and still is on every aspirational young leader's vision board. Tell us about your time on the Yali program, why did you apply, and how was your experience? So I applied because I wanted to do more. I had a passion, but I needed a structure. I was running local initiatives, but I really wanted to just understand how to scale my impact globally. Right? At that time, we had already consulted with Google, we met up, you know, done some things in Niger and in Ghana, but I really just wanted to do more because the scale of the program was much. At the time, the focus was really like to release it on employment. And really, what happened? What capitalized that was that there was news news item that I saw on TV, you know, where about 4.6 million units, I applied for, I applied for a mere 4,000 jobs, right? Millions of years of clients were very, it limited a number of jobs. And for me, when I saw that, I'm like, "Huh, this is an opportunity, it's an opportunity to train an 10-year generation on digital schools, an opportunity to help people, you know, escape from poverty by giving them information." Right? And so I was already doing that, but I really just wanted to do more. I wanted to torch more lives. And that was why I applied. But to be honest, my journey to the community, Madela was still fellow, was not a straight line. I applied four times. Four. Well, four times. So for three years, I kept getting rejection emails, right? And it was not fun at all. It was not fun. I kept getting rejection in it. The four times that I tried, I got to the interview two times. That's the semi-final. Two times. The first interview was disastrous. And then the second interview, well and well. And this express really taught me that, you know, rejection is not a wall. It's feedback. Rejection is a redirection because every single time I was told, "No, I've got an email saying, "Thank you very much for applying." You know, a beautiful love letter that said, "You know, when I want to reject you, it was just feedback." Because every single time I got that message, I was able to go back to the dream board. I was able to improve something in my business. I was able to, you know, take the feedback and basically improve it. And so by the thought attempt, I had the receipts. What was really missing was the massive impact, right? By the thought attempt, we had done the consulting with Meta and with Google, right? We had a real traction. We had done more numbers. So by the time I met the interview for at the thought attempt, right? By the time we were discussed, I knew I was going to select it. I knew it. You see it in the highs of the interview me, that they were really impressed by the work that they were doing. They were really impressed with it. And I just knew, like, I just told myself, "Bring that you're going to America, right? This is it. You're going." And so, for me, it was not just about, you know, a trip to America, you know, yes. Of course, it was a trip to America, but it was more than that. It was about a bridge, bridging the gap between local impact and global scale. And of course, it was life-changing. And if you want, you know, we can talk about some of the things that are still out for me. I'd like to share that. I'm happy to share that. But let me first know. We're definitely going to get into some of those during the conversation, some insights from the Yali program, but I think also some really practical advice for young entrepreneurs who want to go global. What would you say it was specifically about the Yali experience and your exposure to the American way of thinking and doing that has allowed you to bridge that gap between local and global and to be able to take your business to your rights? Oh, thank you very much. Okay. So, I think let me just start by saying that the experience, the Madagascar Fellowship Experience was really life-changing to me. I was stationed at Northwestern University and Northwestern as Kellogg School of Madidment, which is one of the best business schools in the world. Right? So, three things really stood out for me. First was the rigour. Right? First, you know, pouring town or looking at fine buildings and meeting fine people. We had sessions, sessions that get an invest already and it just shifted my brain from running a small business to be in an investable enterprise. Right? Africa does not need more small businesses. Africa needs investable businesses. And what would you say is that difference? Yeah. So, an investable business, a business that is deliberately built. A business that has recurring revenue that is solving a major problem and that the founders are looking beyond survival. A lot of times in Africa, because there's a lot of unemployment, we have people who build businesses just simply because they want to survive. That's a fine starting point, but you should not stop there. You should start thinking, "How can I grow this into something that essentially helps more people that changes lives, that we write someone's story, because we need to go beyond survival." Right? And that was one thing that I really took from some of those sessions, right? When you spend time around some certain kinds of persons, they expand your thinking. The kind of persons that are brought, they brought one of our lecturers at saw this company for $250 million, you know, who made some investment bankers and they were talking billions. And when you can see people like this, people like yourself, they have twice, just like you, right? They eat just like you. And they think it big and doing big things. Something shifts. There's a shift. So for me, that was really the first day. That exposure to people that are already doing big things, that rigor, the sessions, the intentionality of the sessions, and the exposure that we have to people and places. That was key for me. So the rigor. The second was self-discovery. So we took a personality test called the Clifton Strength Test. And before that time, yes, I had taken some free personality tests online, I was not even serious with it. Right? First time, I was able to take that particular test and that test was a revolution. Because I was able to understand myself better like, oh, so this is the reason why I am the way I am. Because of course, if you ask people that are very close to the tutorial, that bigger can be very blunt. They cannot think that nobody else will see. That's the thing that bigger will see. And so when I talk or I communicate sometimes, I can come across as, oh, it's too serious, you know, it's too blunt, you know, when I'm associated with all the time and all that. When I took that test, that was the very first time that I realized, aha, this is exactly why I am the way I am. And so the test was like, it was like, wool, you know, it was taking, you know, from my eyes. And basically, that experience just gave me permission to lead, you know, the way I naturally do, right? Now, this is not to say that, you know, if you take a personality test and you see that, okay, this is the way you are, that you should not change, right? As a leader, of course, you should improve yourself, but you should spend more than building up on your strengths, you know, rather than spend time, you know, chasing other things, right? You should spend time building on your strengths. So I just want to do, like, put that balance so that someone listening to this would not be like, oh, yeah, when they are giving me permission, you know, to not improve and to just take what I have, no, that's not what I'm calling. When you take a personality test, you know, a test that gives you strength test, it actually, you know, tells you more about who you are, you see, they actually do work on the areas that you need to what, double down on, and for me, that helps me, you know, double down on naturally what I already do, which is planning bigger, moving fast. And the top thing is, this is funny, it's a culture shock and the food, but I took a long run out, diary, you know, and, you know, basically, granite and diary saved my life, because I was just struggling with the food. But I think the highlight was the fellowship we have, the summit we had in DC. So the way Mandela wants to fellowship, you know, works is, you go to an institute in university, it's a six weeks program, you spend about four weeks, four to five weeks in that institute, and then you spend one week in Washington, DC. And I was also chosen to give the Ignite Talk for my call. So there is this talk, which is that if fellow, you are the competition in each institute, and someone who will be selected to deliver a speech, like a tattoo, like a tattoo at Washington, I won the competition at my institute, I was selected to give the talk, and then, you know, went to Washington, delivered the talk, and, you know, it was really a good experience. It was a very good experience, you know, standing on the stage, sharing my ideas. Very curious about the kind of ideas that you have to share with the class. Oh, yeah, it was one radical idea, it was feedback. That was the title of my talk, it was feedback, right? And the talk was about the fact that in a lot of times, you know, you're working with people, but do you really understand them? Do you really listen to them? Do you really take our time to actually try to understand the other person's point of view? Right? Do you take feedback seriously? Right? You know, feedback is the foot of champions. And so my talk was about people realizing, especially as young leaders, we have, you know, people that are working with us, we have people working for us. So the question is, do you see yourself as a leader of your business or your NGO or wherever you're working? Do you see yourself as the only authority or do you actually take feedback because the problem is that if you don't take feedback as a leader, you have a lot of blind spots. And people will not want to tell you things because they already knew that you will not even listen in the very first place, right? So you miss opportunities, opportunities to get feedback, opportunities to hear stories, opportunities to hear ideas that can take your walks to the very next level. A feedback can be uncomfortable, feedback can be brutal, but if you really, really pay attention and you look beyond, you know, the hago, maybe the emotional of bruises, you just might find a jam, you know, you just might find a jam and that feedback that you got. So that was, that was like the form you have to turn. I absolutely love that you say feedback is the food of champions. Personally, I'm going to remember that. How would you say your understanding of leadership changed while you were in the U.S. on the yearly program? And would you say that African entrepreneurs are exposed to enough training and enough resources on not just how to be good technical entrepreneurs, but also how to be good leaders who can actually steer businesses that survived and that can go global? Yeah, I think definitely the dull experience, the Madagascar Fellowship, you know, really helped shape me into a better leader and it was, let me step back a little bit. When you are sent to the institute, you have to stay with, I think around maybe 25 other fellows, I'm not sure of the number, but it's somewhere between 20 and 30, right? And, you know, as young leaders, wherever you're coming from, you're probably the best person who was something, you know, in your small corner of the world, but then you get to meet other people who are doing incredible things, you know, in their own corner of the world. And you suddenly realize that, well, you know, there are other people who are doing amazing things and then you begin to learn from their stories, right? They begin to tell you things. And one other thing that I learned also from that experience, just sharing those companions to the other young leaders is that, and even also spending time in the United States, I got to realize that no country is perfect. Every single country has its flaws, has, you know, issues that they are working on, issues that they are working through. No country is perfect. But the difference is that when you have that, you have leaders who have vision and come back, the vision with execution, amazing things will happen, amazing things will happen. Right? And that, you know, came to the soft in my interactions with other young leaders from Africa and also even as we interact with American leaders around, you know, in Chicago and in Washington, right? So for me, it was really just seeing that leadership in action. I remember that we went to, we visited the world bound, we went to small businesses, went to a tech hub, right? And for me, the, what I took away from those trips was the abundance mindset. In many parts of Africa, we are trained to money scarcity. The American mindset asks, if resources were not an issue, how big could this get? Does the American mindset, and I know that, yes, Africa is rising, Africa is rising. But if there is something that Africa, you know, can learn from America, it's that mindset, that abundance mindset. Now, if there is something that America can learn from Africa, it's absolutely resilient. It is resilient. And average Africa is very, very resilient. It's the reason why Africans, you know, succeed wherever they go in the world. Right? It's because we're resilient. Since you can survive a blackout, you know, in Ibadon, Nigeria, and you can survive, let me see, as high as from parcodes, what are some of the things that we do with it? Tell me, what is it that you cannot survive? Right? What is that problem? You know, that is, that is facing in your business, in your, in your organization that you cannot somehow. So, yes, I, I mean, I think that there are things that Africa can learn from America, and things that America can learn from Africa. For me, I think too, you know, the abundance might set, and also systems, Americans own systems. There are a lot of systems. And you know, when you look at the Madela Washington, Washington Fellowship, it's called a cultural exchange. It's an exchange. So, you learn things from there that you bring back home, but you also teach the people that you meet there. I'm sure, definitely, that the, the people that I met over there is certainly learned from the two things from me. Right? It's that framing that when you go on the Madela Washington Fellowship, you're not just going there to learn, right? And you're not just going there to be taught, but that you're also going there to teach Americans, to teach fellow Africans about your own culture, about your own way of doing things, so that you're able to sharpen each other in that way. And it's, it's that resilience that has allowed us to build the kind of things that we've built, whether it's in the NGO space or in entrepreneurship. And speaking about working in entrepreneurship as well as in NGOs, you work with both. And actually, people write winning pitches and winning grants. Tell us a bit about that. And maybe also give us some insight into what are some of the things that people get wrong when they are approaching a funding or investment opportunity. Oh, fantastic. All right. So, part of our work on ground must start is, you know, working with clients to help them put together proposals to win funding for their work. So clients range from startups to small businesses to NGOs, and we also do training. So people who may not be able to afford to arrive now, you can join our training, our very affordable, and then you learn how to put together proposals, you learn what funders are looking for, you learn how to tell your story because a lot of funding and fundraising is storytelling. It's really storytelling. See, facts tell stories tell stories tell, let me take that again, facts tell stories tell transportation list of persuasion. And the best way to transport people is to tell them a story is really to tell them a story. And in fact, let me tell you a very quick story, since we're talking about stories. In 2020 during COVID, schools were shut down. I don't know where, where you were in the world, but you would remember that it was a very turbulent time. There was this school owner called Natin, who was just weeks away from closing that school. You know, because the parents could not afford to pay the school fees. And someone told her about me because the person you that I had won some grants, you know, in the past, there was no grant master's at that time. There was nothing like that at that time. And then she reached out to me, and she was like, you know, I know that it's not possible for a primary school to win grant funds in, right? I'm just reaching out, you know, just to see what is out there. And then I told her, you know, because she was on the opinion that the people that I won grant funding are, you know, the startups, you know, the big engines, you know, when you read, take crunch and take cover, a lot, you do that if people that win grant funding. And so my first job was convincing her that someone like her, doing running a business like herself, could win grant funding. That was my first job. I was hoping to put our financials in order. And this is a lesson for small businesses listening to this podcast. You have to have documentation for your business. You have your financials should be in order. It should be digitized. So that it's not when you're applying for an opportunity that you start running a health health care. Right? Make sure that your financials are digitized. The size of your business is not, it's not what we disqualify you. I think the lack of documentation is the number one thing I would disqualify. If there are no records, no proof of what you're doing, right? And so that was the first thing we did. So we helped up, put our financials together, then I walked you down on the story telling. I asked that question. Like, okay, tell me what would happen if the school were to shut down in this area, all be the impact. Did all of these kids that are paying a very tiny amount of money, would they be able to go elsewhere? What would they have for their future? And if you told me story after story after story of young people, including the ones that were sitting in scholarship, and I was able to pack in that story, no, I'm going to Facebook grants, a primary school, one of Facebook grants, and that was really what inspired me to start Grandmaster. So in terms of people that are listening to the process and I think, you know, how can I push myself, come for me? The first thing is documentation, picture that you're already studying in your country. Another thing is your financials, right? A lot of small business owners and enjoy leaders at detail of this, which is you run your organization through your personal bank account, right? You're not ready for the big, you're not ready for the big gigs. You're not ready because nobody will give you grand funding. If you cannot show that you are disciplined with funding, where you're always comming being your funds, your personal funds, with the funds of the organization, right? So you need to separate them, right? You are not your organization. So you need to separate them. That's the second one. Make sure your financials are in order. And the third one, you know, which I mentioned earlier, is storytelling. You need to learn the heart of storytelling. Right? You need to learn how to tell your story. There's a way to tell your story that you appeal to people that you pass across the message that you get them to go along with you on that journey, right? That's the power of storytelling. And really, when you look at even the application of a Mandela Washington fellowship, that is the ultimate experience of storytelling, right? Because there were some other persons who were doing amazing things, but didn't get into the fellowship. Not necessarily because they were not doing amazing things, but because they could not communicate it. Talent is universally distributed, but opportunity is not. And yelling is a bridge for opportunity. And I'm grateful for that opportunity that I had, you need to learn to network, to share to meet people of like minds. And really, hopefully to this podcasting's past, someone are there to apply for an opportunity that will change their life. Yeah. I really like what you say about, you know, the importance of documentation because they also tell a story, right? It's a track record of how well you manage resources and whether or not funders and investors can trust you with that, but I also like this idea of narrative building and being able to find your narrative, find your story and own it and refine it. Until you get to a point where you're able to confidently sell it. Like you said, facts tell, but stories tell. You've also helped quite a lot of people actually apply, right, for the early program as well as that Mandela Washington Fellowship. And these are programs that are incredibly competitive because it really is about sourcing the very best talent from the continent. What would be your top tips for someone who is thinking of applying for these opportunities? A very interesting question. So I think the first is the authentic storytelling, you know, which goes back to what I was just talking about. Don't write in what you think the U.S. State Department wants to hear. Write about a problem that keeps you awake at night. You want to be specific about your contribution. So authentic storytelling, right? You want to tell the story of impact. You want to tell the story of outcomes. You want to tell the story of people who have gone through your program, your business, your organization and have achieved something remarkable in their lives. You want to position your organization as that change agent, that unlock, right? So it's a before and after story. You want to share the before. What was the state of this person, what was the state, what was the problem that it was children with? It's like the era's journey. What was the problem, what was the challenge that it was struggling with, right? Because really our jobs are social entrepreneurs are jobs, a job is really not to force our ideas down anybody's streets. We are more like fascinating titles. The people that we help already lead us, right? What we simply did was to help point them in the right direction, you know, as a fast little. And so authentic storytelling, right? That's how you win. That's tip one. Tip two is focus and impact, not potential, right? My knowledge and information is very, very competitive. I told you my own story. I have applied four times before I go in. Of course, some other people applied once and then they got and it's really about the stage where you are, the stage that you are when you apply, right? So focus on your part, no potential, MWF is not a scholarship where you apply and then you say, you know, I'm hoping in the future when I do this, when I do that, no, no, no, no, the best proof of what you can do is what you have done, somebody did not get that. The best proof of what you can do is what you have done and what do I mean by that? When you are planning for competitive scholarships, they are interested in what you have done. They will use that as a barometer to determine what you can do in the future, right? So yeah, they invest in leaders that are already leading and that's about receipts. You need to have receipts. It's one of the receipts that you can be given a seat. So a lot of people are demanding for a seat but they don't have the receipts. I know that I'm rhyming right now but you want to focus on impact? Receipts before the seats. Absolutely. So you want to focus on impact, not just the potential and I think the thought point that I will share with all the listeners right now is. You also want to ask yourself, so what, that's the so what factor, right? If you win this fellowship, how does it benefit your community upon your return? Especially if it's an international trip like MWF, right? You want to connect this fellowship directly to a local solution, right? Because they don't want people that will just go for the fellowship and come back and then nothing will change, right? They don't want that. I'm a very good example. I went to the fellowship, I was leading E-Power, that was the company doing digital training. I returned from the fellowship and then I launched Grandmaster, right? So I was not the same need I went to the fellowship that came back, you know, to Nigeria, I was not the same need. It was a different need, right? So just to summarize, the tip one is authentic storytelling. Tip two is focus on impact potential and tip three is the so what factor, right? Because if there are two people applying for the same opportunity, a bit of you are the same experience and there's nothing else to separate you. If you promise to come back to return and do something, you know, without knowledge, they would most likely back you. So, and these are tried and tested because we're talking about over $30 million of funding and investments that you have been able to secure with organizations that you've worked with. It's very evident, I think, even from this conversation that there is a lot of mindset work that still needs to be done as far as African entrepreneurs are concerned, very brilliant, talented and resilient, but perhaps there is something we can learn about, like you said, the abundance, mindset and our ability to solve problems. Knowing what you know now, after you have been a part of the fellowship, what advice would you give other African leaders who want to expand their influence and go global? I think my advice would be, start where you are, what you have, start where you are and what you have. A lot of times, young leaders want to go on fully funded fellowships, they want to get those scholarships, they want to get the global opportunity, but they don't want to put in the work. You know what to say? A success is what happens when opportunity is preparation. Right? And so, I'm saying, I thought you were going to say the other one, if you stay ready, you don't have to get ready. Oh, fantastic. Right? You know, I love that. I love that. Right? And so, I think that would be my message, you know, for young people, the way to make a difference is to not be a spectator. You want to be spectacular. You don't want to be a spectator. But in other things, be spectacular. It means that you're not sitting around with an opportunity. You are making a difference, you know, with what you have, when you're hard. A lot of people are self-absorbed, you know, you're just focused on me, me, me, me, me, right? Why not flip that script? Right? Even if it's once a year, do something for someone else. It does something to you. You know, there's something that you feel good about helping other people. Right? Do something for someone else. And the beautiful part of it is that when you help other people, right, it's just a lot of the universe. Someone, somebody will remember you. That's the way this works. That's the way it works. Right? Someone will remember you and, you know, you just open doors for yourself. Right? So, if you want doors to open for you, you know, try and leave the door open for someone else. Right? So, I mean, start with what you have where you are. And I love what you say about opening doors for others, right? Because we speak about African culture and how we can kind of learn from the American way of doing things and adopt that with what we know that we've grown locally in our own countries in order to become a success. And helping people next to being part and being active in your community, having a sense of community is something that is very, very African, quite inherently. So, I'm very glad that you mentioned that because I also think it's one of those soft skills and it's one of those things that people don't recognize as a necessary, be successful. And so, I really like that you focused on the ability to embrace your community, to recognize what you have and to start where you are so that you're not consistently waiting or only waiting for the big opportunities. And just to bring our speaking about big opportunities, we have done all of this. All of this incredible work. You have amassed all of this wonderful year's knowledge and you are doing the work. As you're saying, you are doing the work. But what can we expect from E-Power, from Grant Master, what can we expect from you in the future? Perhaps a pet business? I don't know. I'm just putting it out there. I like this. I love the way you're set to be off. This is a set off. I love it. Okay. So, what you can expect is A-HAR, just in two letters, A-HAR. This is the artificial intelligence age. And we are heavily integrating A-HAR into our processes. We are currently working on a product called Grant Reset that we're going to launch at the end of the month. And what Grant Reset does is, Grant Reset helps you find the grants that you qualify for and helps you write proposals. Like, you would not be able to tell the difference when you see it. Like, was this written by A-HAR? No. It looks like it was written by A-HAR because, of course, it was trained on $10 million of what a proposal of successful grant proposals. Right? So, that's a product that we're working on. It's called Grant Reset. And you can, shamelessly log. You can pull www.grams.ai and sign up for our week list. We're going to learn to product at the end of the month. And the reason we're launching this product is simple. We want to democratize access to funding, access to grant funding, access to opportunities. We cannot wait to check it out. And I love how there's an intersection to all of these topics because earlier in the season, we actually had a conversation about Africa's AI future and the AI race. And why Africa needs to be at the forefront of that. But according to you, Rengar, what would you say is the one thing that we should talk about, that we don't talk about enough, when it comes to Africa's limitless potential? Demographies destiny, right? The only continent that is not shrinking population wise is Africa. So, the world is not ready for what is coming. Africa is going to take over the world. The world is not ready. When you look at the other continents, yes, there is this wave of anti-immigration and people are just looking for immigrants to blame everything on, right? But really, when you look at the numbers, you know that it's impossible for the most advanced economies in the world to grow without immigrants, right? So if there is a young person who's listening to this call and maybe, just maybe, you're thinking of studying abroad, the relocation of abroad or doing something, something abroad is in your future. I have good news for you. The world needs you. The world needs you. The advanced economies right now, yes, there's a wave of, you know, anti-immigration, you know, there's this trend of blaming everything on immigrants, but they cannot achieve their own economic potential without a new wave of young people working. Because these economies are hedging rapidly, they are hedging rapidly and you need young persons to do the work. Of course, we're in the age of the AI, so of course robots, we also help, right? And I see young Africans, you know, essentially leading in industries across the world, the demographic is destined. So if you're a young African listening to this, your future is global, your future is not restricted to wherever you are in Africa, your future is global, the world needs what you carry. It's not like you need that reminder, but let me remind you anyway, you carry something, something powerful, something deep, something special, the world needs exactly what you carry and see you at the top. It's a perfect way to end off a very fun and insightful podcast. Thank you so much for joining us that thing up. Thank you. Thank you for having me. Thank you.