Olivia Miles’s Historic Season, Dream-Fever, and Which Teams We Would Let Ruin Our Summer, With Steven Ruiz

It's Bob and everybody, it's Logan Murdock here from The Ringer, the 2025-2026 NBA season is here and we got your group podcast needs covered. On The Ringer NBA show, be sure to check out Group Chat with Justin Barrier, Rob Mahoney and Jake Hyleman on Sundays and Wednesdays and real ones. On Tuesdays and Fridays with myself, Rajabell, and Howard Beck, get your Ringer-related NBA podcast fix on Spotify or wherever you get your podcast. And of course, come find us on YouTube, Twitter, Instagram, and TikTok at the Handle Ringer NBA. Welcome to The Ringer-WNBA Show. I'm Sierra Chou. I am joined by Steven Ruiz for the second time in a couple of weeks here. The people love you. We have to have you back. The Indiana Fever just played the Atlanta Dream, the Atlanta Dream got their lick back, played the game that we kind of were hopeful, like we expected them to play a couple of weeks ago. We're going to talk about that. We are going to do basically the WNBA version of, "Who would you let ruin your summer?" It's a Nick's tape summer, it's everybody's going to be outside this summer. I know a lot of people are probably starting to tune into the WNBA after locking me after the NBA season finish. We kind of wanted to give you guys a sense of basically what bandwagon you can join in a way. What it might cost you? And maybe you find the love of your life, who gets a ring. This is a WNBA version of bandwagon Bachelorette, I guess. I should have come up with a name for it. It's got to be Love Island theme. We're in the summer. I feel like. It's got to be Summer House themed. I haven't seen Summer House yet. I'm not a Summer House guy, but I am very locked in on Love Island, both versions, UK, US. So that's how I made it. I need to get into Love Island. I've had a very Summer House summer, which is actually just in the Hamptons. So let's start with the Atlanta Dream. And look, so before we recorded this podcast, I was kind of in the bow of, this is a great guy on paper, you know, retains all the previous reagents, obviously, has gotten great reviews, looks, you know, it gets Angel Reese, you know, add her to a team that already emphasizes report shooting in Carl Smesco system that emphasizes offensive rebounding has a ton of tips. But on paper, I just wasn't feeling the spark. I just wasn't feeling the spark. I felt like there was some effort problems, some consistency problems, and I don't want to be the person that after one great game, one great effort, I'm all in and I've forgiven the past, but I'm kind of talking myself into it. And I have to start with Ryan Howard, just like thank you, Ryan Howard, when Indiana played Atlanta last game, Tyler De Luca was on and we kind of let her have it, you know, I think just coming off of what Indiana had went through against Portland, the Katelyn Clark foul trouble, the sort of, the whole world sort of like colliding against the Indiana fever. You're playing your off, you know, you're playing the team that beat you in the playoffs. You've got the Angel Katelyn aspect of all of it, and I expected on it, frankly, a lot more entertainment and just a team that would want to take it to Indiana's throats. Instead, what we got was sort of like this flailing effort from Ryan Howard and Alicia Gray, who were both kind of happy to take threes in the Indiana front court dominates their their matchup as well, which is just not something you'd expect out of this matchup. We got the game that we wanted from the Atlanta dream. We were, I was thoroughly entertained and it starts with Ryan Howard, who was so aggressive, going downhill to the rim, getting Katelyn Clark in foul trouble. Alicia Gray was able to get to her left all night long. You had Jordan Canada too, was getting into the lane as well, but it really, to me, starts with with Ryan Howard, with the defense that she played. We even got my favorite thing, which is Ryan Howard at the fore for a very brief period in the second half, but I just couldn't be happier with the performance of a player who I think just has all the potential in the world, but has these moments where it just kind of settles for the three-pointer in this game, I just felt like it was one of the better, I think she had finished with 16 points in five assists. I think one of the best 16 point five assists performances that I've ever seen, only three three-point attempts, six assists. And finished it on the box quarter, had two steals, but I felt like had way more deflection. Way more deflection, I feel like I counted three just in the first quarter, and turning those immediately into points at the rim, super impressed with her. Yeah, but I agree with everything you just said, but my comparison would be, and I swear I'm not going to use reality TV show comparisons, this is my only one, please feel free. I just met them on Lova's blind, and I fell in love with them in the pods, based on everything you mentioned on paper. This is going back to preseason. Then we go to the Mexico or wherever they go for the little honeymoon phase, and then you're starting to realize what they present it on paper isn't really what they are, and they're not as deep as you thought they were when you all you could do was talk to them and think about them on paper, and just to extend the metaphor right now, I think this is the moment of this game tonight, is a situation where I shouldn't have to ask you to do this. You should want to do this on your own. If this is what they are going for, then I'm totally bought it, like put a ring on them right now, but I just don't trust them, and this is the perfect game for them to put up this type of performance. Like you said, this is their app. I'm surprised they didn't get up for the first game, but I think losing that game and the fact that they already have juice for this game anyway, they're already get up for it. It's like the perfect storm for them to have this type of night where they're everything you think they're going to be on paper, and then like Angel Reece, even with the foul trouble in the first half, this was the ideal game for her. I think she didn't try to be the playmaker on the perimeter. She just got into the post, she got the ball, they finally fed her the ball, and she was good around the rim, which is something that's kind of inconsistent with her. Yeah, I was really happy with how they use Angel Reece, that's definitely something that we've been critical of. So that's kind of where I'm at this place where I'm like, are you going to couple of therapy? Are you listening to her, is it finally getting through to you, what we're trying to say to you? I do have some concerns. Where are you in the not-so-youngment experience? Is she struggling because she hasn't gotten to play the three? Is it something that just gets better when Bri Jones is back? They need her back in a bad way, even with this one. I feel like I finally got to see everything I wanted from their bench, from like a second half of Tejina pal pal perspective, from just the Isabel Burles run, but they have to finish with Hillman because, I mean, O'Cott just looked exhausted. And they're both in, her and Reece are both in foul trouble, Aliyah Boston has taken it at them and the front court sort of survives, but it's a question. Yeah, they definitely weren't thriving. The front court survived, especially on the defensive end, like Aliyah Boston in that first half of the fourth quarter just took over and just like was getting in their chest, they couldn't do anything about it. But I think it's just the expansion of a role by necessity because of the Bri Jones injury. There's more pressure on her to defend starting Biggs and I think we saw that tonight really take a toll, but she hit some threes. But that's the big thing if she could just, I don't know, if Bri Jones comes back and she goes back into the role she was in last year and she gets, she gets to stay in the corner and just hit open threes, I think she could do that again. She's shooting, I think like 26% from three coming into tonight, but that's what it is. I think when you put role players, when you elevate role players who are really good in their role, but you elevate them into a starting role. This is what we tend to see. I think there's a good chance that Bri Jones kind of fixes Naz Hillman, but I don't think she fixes the problems that Atlanta has going forward in. My biggest concern is the rim protection, especially if like OCOTS out there and we saw today, like OCOTC can't play in the game like that's up and down. I think that's why Shmezco was like hesitant to play here. I don't think she got it into like the four minute mark in the second quarter. No, you want Ciga Coney first. Yeah, right. And she gave him some good minutes. He was a little more mobile. And then you kind of, I would, I would say get like, why isn't she getting in? Like they cannot stop fostering down low. And then I saw why she wasn't getting in. She was exhausted. She was exhausted after like two minutes. Yeah. No, so that's interesting. So rim protection is your biggest issue with them. My biggest issue with them is actually their half-court offense. And I think that Bri Jones fixes so much of that for them. I think that she unleashes Alisha Gray. I think that she really helps to heen a pal pal. I think she puts not his helmet back in her right place. I think she opens up some gravity for Angel Reese. But it does, it still is one of those things where you have questions. Right. And I would say this game didn't really answer them because they got to play in transition so much because I think they turn over the fever like seven times to have 20 points off. Now that I'm thinking about it, a lot of Alicia Gray's. drives to the basket, we're kind of in transition. So I think if you do slow them down, are Ryan Howard and Alicia Gray gonna be as aggressive as they were tonight? I don't know if that's the case. - That's a really interesting question. Yeah, and that is for me so much of like where everything hinges for the dream. I think they are still firmly sort of in that pretender class for me. But I still liked a lot of what I saw today. I think a lot of it does like if they had like 50 points in the paint, like going into the fourth quarter is pretty incredible, what they were able to do. Although a lot of that was fever was a fever side of things. But yeah, like look, I'm just happy we saw signs of life. I'm happy that they are starting to do some of the things that we've perpetually been asking them to do. But you're right, it's a consistency thing. Yeah, and I don't know, I feel like the fever's defense is like the get right game for some offense. Like you see the best of some of these offenses. - This is so sure. - Like even going back to like the beginning of the year, they played the Mystics and I'm thinking like, we gotta get the ball in Sonya's hands and we gotta let her be a score. That was the one game where I feel like the defense didn't take her out of the game and make her kind of play left handed, so to speak. The Portland game, any of the Valkyrie's game, the second Valkyrie's game, there's a lot of examples of this and that's my biggest concern with them. Like going into the playoffs, if they come across a good offensive backward, what are they gonna do? And I don't think they have an answer right now. - No, they're kind of, they're firmly my, I don't feel like I'm dating you. I feel like I'm dating your potential team. - Yeah. - So look, there are a lot of things that went wrong in this game, right? I think the late game offense was a disaster. Caitlin's still getting targeted on the defensive end. She's still giving up more isolation points than anybody in the league by a pretty wide margin. She sits most of the fourth quarter because she picks up five fouls. Zero fourth quarter points after what was probably one of the best offensive, maybe the best offensive half, I've seen her play this entire season, as far as balance, like you're seeing the mid-range, you're seeing her finishing, the spin move on Tahina pal pal. By the way, they had kind of a game within a game moment as well, where I think maybe they shared some words after that and they kind of went at each other, but kind of on the court, both kind of got out of their offense, anyway, I digress. Stephanie's challenge management was also a disaster. Caitlin picks up a couple fouls on Ryan and Lish that, you know, like I just think you could have gotten some of those overturns. She decided to use it on a 50/50 play on Sophie Cunningham that wasn't going to cost them any points with a player that you're not really worried about or getting into foul trouble anyways. That was an issue. The front court is an issue. Stephanie is completely giving up on mobiles and at the end of this game, KK Simpson is spastic. She has moments where she is deflecting the ball and then you're out running and you're playing fever basketball, but there's also like, gosh, if you actually, if she lets Angelry's get the catch, like then she's not going to do anything about that. Like she gets lost on cuts. Like she's just, she's a young player. She's a young player that shouldn't be finishing in these moments, but this fever front court is so thin, the freever back court defense, not just Caitlin, Sophie Cunningham is letting Lish go left all night. Kelsey Mitchell's getting worked as well. But here's my thing. I think when you execute against a fever, like Portland did, like Atlanta did tonight, like playoff teams will, like playoff teams that get to scout in our high level off offenses and have great coaching and take advantage of their mismatches do, they, I just don't expect them to win those games. I just don't expect them to win those games at all. And I just found myself thinking, I don't think that there have been, there has not been one stretch during this season where I have looked at the fever and I've been like, oh, that looks like a team that could attend for a title. No, not even like during the four game winning streak, I wouldn't say, like they almost blew that game to Washington. They got bailed out with some questionable defense at the end of that. Connecticut was up in the fourth quarter against them. I believe, I think that was Saturday. For me, they're the, I don't like you. I like the way you make me feel. Ooh, the highs are high, the lows are low. I'll go on vacation with you, I'll go on vacation with you, but I don't want to live with you type team. And they're just like one big dopamine hit when you're watching their games, like even when they lose, there's something that you're going to be excited about. And when they win and they're playing their A game and Katelyn's firing threes from 30 feet out, like it's exciting to watch and you could talk yourself into them being a contender and you want them to be a contender just because you want to see this at a high level in October and September. But like you said, you just got to keep watching and they're like two games later or like two quarters later, you're going to see why you don't believe in them. Are they the one night stand that would ruin your life if you actually tried to get consistent, like date them consistently? Yes, yes. And you know that going in and you still do it. That you know what I mean? That's kind of why you're into it. Yeah, you know that you know the cost of the ticket. Yeah, yeah. You have no one to blame but yourself. Melody's true. If I win and put it like money on the fever, win in the championship, that's on me. That's not on them. I can't blame that. That's true. I mean, hey, people show you who you are. You have to believe them. That's that's that's good dating advice that I usually don't take. It's just, yeah, it's tough. And there were a lot of bright spots in this game. I do feel like they are attacking mismatches better. Alia Boston was just dog walking, not as hillman. There were some good role player moments, especially in the last like four games. But their last win against Atlanta was probably their best win of the season. Maybe Valkyrie's stuff, like just kind of pulling it together in that second half was a good moment for them. But I just don't really, this team doesn't give me a lot of reasons to have faith in them. And the front court to me is just such a glaring problem alongside the fact that it feels like Steph White just seems like she has this hard line where she wants this team to take everything away defensively. But they can't even do the basic stuff right against the good teams. And then you end up having these nights where because they don't want to give away any threes, it's a layup line for an Atlanta dream team that actually decides to attack the mismatches that are available to them. Yeah, I would say, and one other thing about the fever is they, you look at the other contenders and you have something to look forward to. With that lay in it, Bri Jones is going to come back with Las Vegas when they start caring when they get to the playoffs or Kennedy Carter is like totally healthy. They don't really have anything like that coming back. It's Minnesota obviously. Neffesis is going to come back eventually. How does it get demonstrably better without like a major trade at the deadline? I don't really see how their problems get solved over the next couple of months. No, and they're kind of in that boat, too, where they just don't, they never, they don't, I don't know that, I feel like they'll get somebody in the international market. Like they're not one of those teams that, they do a pretty good job of in-season personnel scouting. Like they're able to get Eric McDonald, Dotticee Sims, like Ariel Powers was good for them. So maybe there's some type of sort of, like maybe when Eric comes back, but really what you need is a front court player and they just don't have that right now. At this point, I'm not watching. It's kind of to your point of, you know, going on vacation with somebody, but not really feeling like you can commit to them. Like I love the theater of watching them. I am here to be entertained. Like in a matchup like this, I am here for like, Sophie Cunningham accusing Angel Reese of elbowing her. I'm here for like Angel Reese mocking Caitlin Clark flopping. I'm here for the Tahine at Powell versus Caitlin Clark stuff. Like I am here for all of the things that make the fever an electric team to watch, but I don't, they, their aspirations are not to be a league pass favorite. - Right. - So hang a banner for that. Yeah, yeah, hang a banner for league pass. - We might here, we might give you a banner at the ringer, but we don't think anybody else is. - Do you know who would be perfect for them right now? Natasha Howard, instead of mobility, too. - Oh, that hurts. - That hurts. What should we move on to the Minnesota links? - Yeah, this is going to be like the most optimistic one. I feel like I don't know how you feel about that, but like. - Well, yeah, absolutely, but I'll let you first, yeah. - This is the one that's not going to make me feel like an asshole. Like I'm putting a ring on it, and I'm setting the date for October. Like I'm ready, let's go to the altar right now. If this is what it looks like without Neffisa, and I think how it's set up right now, Neffisa coming back, it's not going to throw a wrench. I think it's just going to keep rolling along. They are number one in offensive rating, number one in defensive rating. They are lapping the field in net rating. You look at their underlying stats. You can't really find a problem outside of what I think was their problem last year, which is defensive rebounding in front court size. And we've like even like against the Aces, you've kind of saw that with Melissa kind of just being big, bigger than them, getting offensive rebounds. Obviously Wilson was able to shoot over their defenders. And that's not a problem that Neffisa necessarily solves. She's not the biggest, you know, front court player. So, and I like, I don't even think. - Well, there are the second best defensive rebounding team in league this year. - I have them, I thought maybe I have the stats wrong. had a man ninth and double. offensive rebounding percentage, but maybe I'm looking, I'm looking at the basic stats. No, you're right. Sorry. Yeah. That's my bad. Yeah. And that, but like that's the only issue and you're, you're picking knits at that point because like they play well defensively. They're well coached. Their schemes are good. Offensively, like they have the biggest cheat code in the league right now outside of like an Asia Wilson post up. And that's Olivia Miles Picking Roll. Yeah. Um, this is like my, like, am I being loved bombed? Is this too good to be true? It is. It must be like Olivia, Olivia Miles is love bombing the entire basketball watching country, right? She is Olivia Miles is love bombing the basketball gods right now. She is, she is highlight real logging. Um, she is, she is spamming pocket passes. Um, she right now is existing on a really rare plane. And I am finding it so fun to watch because obviously she is proving that she is transcendent, transcendent and generational. And all of the platitudes that we bestow on, you know, young fun geniuses like her. But to come into the league, come into a league like the WNBA where we are also pretty used to seeing rookies struggle. Um, and to make it look easy and to be on a heater. Uh, it's just, it's just incredibly fun. Like I'm, I'm tuning into the Olivia Miles experience every day. And I'm like, when is she going to have a bad game? Like when is she going to meet the defense that makes things hard on her? Because the Valkyrie against the Valkyrie is a go under. Okay, she decides she's going to go eight for 11 from three. And she's also, she's giving you those like, Lynn Sanity. I'm also next build a moment. Right. Like, um, she's a borderline MVP candidate. I think it's borderline. Is it borderline? I'm like, I would put her second right now. It's borderline. Yeah, that's just like Angel. Asia is just so much farther than everybody else. Um, but she's all W. She's been the best guard in the league this season. She has been incredibly efficient. Um, and I, I, I started going, I went through some of the, the stats like comparing her to other players, 15 games into their first season. And she has the best plus mind is in history for any player in their first 15 games. That's ridiculous. She has 285 points in her first 15 games. That's eight all time. That's more than Candice Parker. That's more than Diana Tarrasse. It's more than Kaylann. It's more than Stewie. Um, of all 47 players who have scored at least 200 points in their first 15 games. Miles is by far the most efficient of all of the guards. Um, she's also the most efficient of any of the top 25 scorers in their first 15 games. Oh, and by the way, she's a passer. Right. Like, she runs the offense. She has this responsibility made on her. And it's like not facing her in the slightest. Like you could see, like Courtney Williams last year had the point guard responsibilities. You can kind of see that take a toll on her game. And you see it this year. How much better she is when she's playing off the ball. We're talking about a rookie. And like you said, like you're dealing with the physicality of the WMBA coming from the big 12. Like that, that's very impressive. She's on like at the rate she's shooting three's over the last couple of weeks. She could have a 50 40 90 season. Yeah. I think she's at, she's over 50 and she's over 90. And I think she's at like 37 and a half of threes. And that's another crazy thing. Like, she's like 56. Like that's the other thing. Yeah, yeah. She with room to share 62% from two pointers. Yeah. And another reason why she's just one big green flag. We're using the relationship metaphor. It's like every time you think you have an issue with her, she corrects it right away. Yeah. Like when we did the under 25 pod, you, you had mentioned the three points, you know, which at the time wasn't great. And then since then she's just been on a heater. I think there was like talk about her not using her left enough. And like over the last two weeks, she, it's like she's doing it for fun. Like I can't say enough about her. It's insane. And like, one thing I will say is like the Caitlin Clark stands who are like trying to like kind of detract from her, like, just shut up. Like you're being a loser. If you don't like this, you're a loser. Yeah. This is, this is great. You're not a basketball fan is what I would say. Yeah. I mean, there's, yeah, you hear the criticism of she doesn't get defended the same way. Well, you can't, you can't defend somebody that way when like, because here's, here's, here's the thing. Olivia Miles is having maybe the best start to a WNBA career that we have ever seen. So I think a, if you're a fan, if you're a fan of Caitlin or Paige, like I think you have to just like take a step back and say, Hey, this actually has nothing to do with my, with my player. Like this isn't some setup, you know, this isn't somebody trying to diminish my player. Like I laid out just the stats. That's just now the only rookie season that's even comparable is probably Candace Barker, maybe Asia Wilson. Um, even then Olivia is just so much more efficient. Like 15 games in Candace was 79, 4 assists, steel 2.4 blocks. Like that's probably better just given the fact of like the overall game and the defensive ability. But she's shooting 47% from the field. Well, Olivia is like 56 and 39 on, 91, 92 actually, with like three-point shooting at it and running in offense as well. Like at that point, the only thing you're arguing about is your preference as far as what kind of player between the two that you're into. But like 15 games in, we'll see what happens with this is like every, all three of those players have very long careers ahead of them. Like nobody has written the final chapter on what their destiny is. But right now 15 games in, she's probably been the best guard of all time, 15 games in. She's been better than Diana Tarasi, 15 games in. Certainly. And she's better, she's been better than Caitlyn and Paige too. Like this is just true. It's not like a, it's not like a conspiracy or anything like that. Um, and like when you talk about the defensive coverages and things like that, it's like, well, you're not going to trap a player whose turnover rate on high risk passes is that low. Like people trapped Caitlyn and Paige early because it was beneficial for them to do so. It doesn't make any sense to try to trap Olivia Miles when this is like, I will give the fans this like, Minnesota has a much better offense. They have spacing with the, with coffee and they have direction with Natasha Howard and they have Caleb McBride who is kind of having like one of the all time defensive seasons that you can, you can have at 34 years old on top of just like carrying more of an offensive load. But look like this is, this is part of the reason that people want to see Caitlyn diversify her game more to is so that she won't get covered the way that she has been historically, right? Like, Olivia just makes it tough on you. She makes it really tough on your defensive coverage as far as what, like, what you can actually do. Yeah. And she has like a mid-range pull-up. Like, you can't really play drop coverage on her. Like even like the Aces were kind of doing that. When they, when they were trying to put two on the ball, she was blown right by whatever the, even like Asia was, she was blown, like, she wasn't. Even Jackie Young too. She was making Jackie Young look like, like, these are two really high level defenders. Yeah, she just, she has already made the adjustment that we're kind of seeing. I think we are seeing those adjustments from Caitlyn this year. Like, we're seeing more of the mid-range game, especially like dealing with contact. Like, people can't even get, be physical with miles because she's too damn fast and she just dribbles around it. Like, I think even, I think in Miles, she puts you in a cage as well. Right. If team, which is also what Caitlyn is starting to do, sorry, go ahead. No, if teams defended her like Caitlyn, like, her numbers would look even better, I think, especially on the assist side. Like, I think she's averaging like six and a half. That, that number could easily be nine. That's the thing. People like now, for the last few games, the sparks and the Aces have tried to turn her into a scorer. And she's responded with two career nights. Like, she's like, okay, we're just like, it's just, let's just sit back and enjoy this. Like, maybe at one point, like regression to the mean will hit, right? But like, as of now, I think all I can do is look at what's in front of me and just be astounded by it. I have no other choice. And that's like the fun way to watch basketball. Exactly. I agree. I agree. I agree. I agree. Um, but it makes me obviously, I think we both feel very good about the Minnesota links who already look like a contender. Um, let me ask you one question. Let me ask one question. If we went back in time two weeks ago and retorted that pod, would it live you if you number one now? Because I think I think so. No, I think I would put her number one right now, because I mean, I remember when we talked about it too. And this is Steve Stevens referring to, we ranked the top 25 players under 2025. And this was before the Valkyrie's game. And, um, where did you end up breaking here? I think I had her fourth or fifth. Okay. I can't remember. I think I had her fourth as well. Um, let me, let me just quickly go and check. But, um, point being, I think at that time, wait, no, I have six on my guard. Not good. Um, I think the thing with at the time was sort of like, hey, we have to see what this looks like against real defences. Because at that point, Minnesota schedule had been a little bit like, yeah, they had a couple games against like what we know now to be like a pretty bad Phoenix team, especially as far as perimeter defense goes. Um, that Valkyrie's game was that night and she was incredible. And, um, from then on, like, yeah, like you have, you take the aces to the brink. Really, you're finishing shots over Asia Wilson that are making Kennedy Carter, like, uh, like shake her head on the bench. Kennedy Carter who's probably the best isolation score that existly. It's just different. Like it's just, I don't know, you just, just let's just sit back and experience it. It's, it's a thrill. It's really fun. And you're going to be wrong in the long run if you're like, they say, you're going to be, yeah, it's not going to be enjoyable. It's like hating on LeBron in like 2006. Like, yeah, just come along for the ride. Yeah, the fuckery is not over. It's not anytime soon. Did you want to hit the aces next? Yeah, let's do the aces. Okay. Um, so the aces had a blowout loss to Dallas and they pull one out against Phoenix by the grace of Asia Wilson and the list of Smith. They already have a ring. You already as far as players that you can trust in high leverage moments. You're already there with them. Like, I trust Asia Wilson, probably more than I trust anybody else in the league who isn't named Chelsea Gray. I trust Jackie Young. At this point, we have to, we have to talk about the season. The list of Smith is having. It's more like, are we buying property, right? Like how long, like, how long is this run going? Cause it's like the only problem is every once in a while they forget to do the dishes because they get bored. They play with their food a little too long, but I have no, I have no problems. I have no, I can't come with an actual qualm. I have some maybe, maybe we'll see what happens with Kennedy. She's been hurt and then ill and then change her Instagram bio to free agent. So we'll see what happens with Kennedy. And after that, I'm kind of like, hey, like, you guys, it's almost like you, you guys were like, we have all of this stuff going for us. Let's buy us, let's, let's buy a Ferrari. Like, let's, let's just buy like a red sports car, right now, just to spice it up. Just to spice it up. And we don't necessarily need it. Although, I guess the question becomes do they need it? If I had one nit to pick, it might be their bench production. But how do you feel about their defense right now? Because they are like 10th and defense rating. I don't, I'm with you where I think it's like, they, they, we saw it last year, like last year, at this time, we were probably panicking about them. I think they were around 500 and then like, they go on that streak at the end, and they just run through the playoffs. I think I feel the same way about the defense. I'm concerned that they don't cover enough ground on, on defense. And maybe that's just them kind of coasting through the season, because they know once they get there, they're going to turn it on. Jewel Lloyd is a concern for me, like, if she is not making threes, she is a liability on the court, because she is a cone on defense right now. Yeah. Like those, those like cut ups of Portland attacking Caitlin, you could have made one of those for her against the wings, like they were just whatever they wanted. And the transition defense was very concerning, especially against the wings, like a walk away, it was just beating them down the court in the first quarter, like every time. But it with them, like, you know what you got? You know what you got at home? Like, you don't need to go. You don't want to be out here. It's that one thread on this. You're trying to be out here. No, no, like, you know, what's at home. You know what you know what's at home. So like, even if there is, there are some things you can pick, like the defense, like, you're not going anywhere. So like, shut up about it and wait a couple months. It'll be better. Yeah, I think, you know, just looking at some of the defensive issues, like, Asia and drop coverage hasn't been great this season. I'm kind of like, I don't care. Like, oh, Asia and drop coverage, like, we'll be fine. I think that, yes, the, the back court, I think that Chelsea Gray is not going to play defense consistently 44 games in a regular season. She just isn't, but, you know, just trust her, I guess. I think you're right. Like, I think that there are plenty of lay reasons for faith, but they aren't flawless. Like, they're not infallible or unbeatable. I just feel good. I also feel a little bit better about the defense, because of what Nellissa Smith has been able to do this season, particularly last night. Like, I, and, and, and, you know, I think I think, like, we've been in a number of moments on this spot where we pointed out different moments where it's like, Oh, Nellissa Smith is talking defensively. And that just wasn't the case a year ago, but like, there are moments where she's firing them up. Like, she's communicating. She's telling Jackie young where to go. She's getting steals. She's going coast to coast. And she's expanding her offensive game, too. She is like, she has like these no, no, no, yes, floaters as well. And she's almost like, I, I dare I say she's probably one of the best role players in the league already for a team that has that right now. Yeah, three, three kind of all star type players. But yeah, I think I'm with you. It's sort of like a grass is always greener. And I'm seeing reasons for improvement. I also wonder if like, we'll get the second half. Jewel Lloyd improvement as much as I like, I do worry a little bit about the bunch of bridge production, but I'm like, Dana Evans is going to be back at some point. Maybe things do work out with Kennedy. If not, um, no, there is a point in her life. Well, we're Jewel Lloyd was like a 19 point per game score. So I don't think she's like forgotten how to do that. I'm going to lay away. I'm going to see what the commissioner's cup looks like they have two game the Liberty and the aces are facing off in the commissioners cup the Liberty have home core. They actually also play each other a couple games before. And they also have like a matchup against the links in July as well. So I think like we'll get to see what they look like against really good teams. Um, and I imagine it'll probably be a little bit more fired up as well. So Yeah, I'm just like you said, like, well, let's like talk to me in August. Honestly. We haven't even seen like the best of Jackie young this year. I feel like she's had a slow start to the season. I think for maybe for some personal reasons. Yeah, even like defensively, I don't think she's been at her best, but I think that when the playoffs roll around, she will be there. And that's like the thing with them. If they're in a close fourth quarter game in the playoffs, like, who are you taking over them with the players they have with the closures they have nobody. And you're not even thinking twice about it. Yeah, I'm with you exactly. Where are you at on New York? Uh, they're tough because like, god damn, they have so many scoring options. Like watching them on Sunday against the mystics. I was like, uh, they start benching their starters. I know they have saw too coming off the bench. You know, hand is when she gets going. It's just like, I don't know how you defend them. But I don't know if they can guard the ball right now. And that's an issue in a league where you might run into Olivia Miles and the playoffs. And like, that's the one red flag. Like, for me, they're like the type that you usually go for. And you've been burned by that same type over and over again, but you're going for it anyway. And you don't care. And the red flag for me is the, is the, uh, the Backward defense. But other than that, like, yeah, yeah, it's all that. Yeah, I mean, they're kind of like, I'm not, I'm not deleting hinge yet. Mm hmm. But I might in a few weeks. Like, I kind of, I need to see what they look like healthy as they got Sabrina back, saw too still on a minister's restriction. I do agree about the perimeter defense, but I do think likely, you know, like the only fee bitch being back is already helped with that so much. They're eight know since you got back. So I just like, how can you like, how can you really have too many nits to pick with a team that, um, is on an eight know streak when undefeated in the commissioners cup games, um, is hosting the commissioners cup. And you see a game like last night in Chicago, like Sabrina, as much as like, you know, I do, I've criticized your primary, primary defense in the past, then the past AI will say it's improved. It is certainly better than last year's, um, last year's, um, But, you know what? She's just, she's never, she's never too scared of the moment. No, she's never too scared of the moment. Like she kind of, she dribbles it down against Chicago. And she's like, it's me. It's me. And she gets to the ring. She gets a great shot. Easily. That's it. Easily. That's a great shot. And you need players like that. Um, you need the player who you can get you like the game three game winner who has ice in their veins and just doesn't care. Um, and they had multiple players that could do that. Like, you know, and it's like, I don't think she's the ball is going to be in her hands is they have so many options. But if it needed to be, she's not afraid of the moment. She'll take like a one-legged three point leaning three pointer. Yeah. So, yeah. When you have offensive options like that, like, I think your ceilings always going to be high. That's kind of where I'm at with them. I do have concerns about the defense. I've concerns about their ability to just move in general outside of Stewie, because I think JJ has also has her nights at this point on defense with a pick and roll defense is just really tough. But, and then there's a lot to your stuff as well. Um, but the offensive ceiling is just so damn high. So I JJ had one, one play where I think it was hawk as was driving out of the corner and she was like under the rim and she just did not move. Like she just let hawk as she just rolled out the red carpet is like I'm not contesting the shot whatsoever. And you see like five of those plays a game with her, but I mean, the way she shooting right now, like, kind of tolerate it. Well, that's where I love the potential to like I just love what she's doing is a pick and roll initiator as well. Like this feels like long overdue for her to really get to play around on the perimeter as well, the confidence that she's shooting with it is really fun to watch. Um, and the way that when she's on and she's shooting and she's facing the floor, it just opens up the floor for New York and they're so great at attacking advantages as well. Um, you know, using stewies a screener in those situations, um, you know, using Leonie as a screener. Now, Sab is back and she's being used as a screener too. They do more fun inverted stuff than just about any team in the league. They're kind of like Phoenix last year and they're just getting started because they haven't been healthy. I look at them, when I think about them as a championship contender, I'm like, "Okay, if you can just be good enough defensively, that you can blitz the crap out of teams on the offensive end and have the type of offense that doesn't rely on your defense to care you, obviously, who doesn't like transition points, but this is a team that can be really great in the half court as well." Already is really great in the half court, despite all the injuries, they're the number two half court team in the league. Minnesota is number one, which makes tons of sense. Even defensively, they're not that bad. I think they're fourth and rating and I think the way they play defense, kind of expose their guards a little bit because they do like to switch at times, they do throw some zone at you, but they force you to make shots and they're going to lose that one on one sometimes, but in the long run with the way they score the ball, you're going to have to keep up with them. I don't know how many teams can do that. They play harm reduction defense. I feel like they know what they are and they're going to try to not let you get the best shots in basketball, and they have some breaking case of emergency helpers as well, like the only and Stewie, and you know, you can get something out of the rim protection every once in a while as well, but they're just so damn talented, they're so damn efficient. I'm just excited to see what they look like in a couple of weeks. I hope that they're able to stay healthy because I just think from a basketball beauty perspective, like even seeing the things that saw two was starting to do, attacking mismatches in the post. Just even coming off the bench in general, I'm very curious if that's something that they stick with or if it's something that will go away once or minute's restriction is over, but she's really kind of been like a Swiss army knight for them, like she's shooting the crap out of it lately and getting a ton of assisted shots and just like destroying smaller players in the post. That's exactly how you should be using her. Yeah, she looked a lot faster last night's game, like just driving to the passage, she's getting past her defender. We're owed this. After last year, we kind of got robbed from like a true liberty playoff run and they look so good early on that the injuries happen. So I think like the basketball gods owe this to us to keep them healthy. Isn't this what you want from a super team, right? Like I feel like we have this sort of as fans, we have this sort of like secret handshake agreement, right? Where if you're going to stack the deck, that's fine, but you better give us something beautiful to watch and return. And that's where I think some of the frustration with the liberty in the past has been where they haven't completely maximized their offensive talent. They haven't shown us like new pathways to get the ball in the basket. And I think that this liberty team can actually do that. I find that I just find them highly entertaining. I find them to be even on the nights where like things aren't going as well. Like they're just, they're much better watch. Yeah, no, it feels new even though it's like largely the same core as we've seen in the past couple of years, but it does feel fresh and feel new. I guess that's what the coaching change was for. Yeah, for sure. They're here on, they're in LA on Sunday. I'm very excited to watch them. All right. Well, should we talk about their, who do you have next, who do you want to talk about next? Do you want to do the Valkyries? To the Valkyries. All right. They're my, it's not them. It's me team. Oh my god. Like kind of same. Okay. It's like everything on paper. They're third and offensive rating, third and defense rating. Like I know they get a lot of their hype because of their defense, but like offensively, you see like they have options that when Gabby Williams is playing like you did last night against the wings, like Veronica Burton, they have options. I think by one concern with them that I can't get over, even though on paper, I, they look like a contender is they don't really have someone who could throw the ball down low and get you a bucket. Like so long, kind of kind of playing that mid post area, but they don't have that easy source of bucket. So Burton and Williams are off then you start to see those slugs of games where it's like played in the six season 70s, but their defense is going to keep them in that and like I trust the coach. I trust like not only the, the scheme, the defensive scheme, but the personnel is just so good because they have those two guards at the, the, the tip of the spear for their defense. I think they're going to give any team they come across in the playoffs issues, like even if it's like a battle test team like the Aces, but I just don't think they have enough yet. Like get back to me next year. Yeah. I'm in the exact same place, actually. I would be surprised if they didn't make the second round and I would be surprised if they made it any farther. That's a perfect way to put it like they beat everybody that they're supposed to do. They do what they're supposed to do. They're like, they're like the person with the incredible morning routine. This is going to sound hypocritical because my girlfriend's a vegan, but it's like they're a catch, but they're vegan. Like they're just too healthy. They're a little boring. Like they're kind of in their like carl era of summer house where like they're working on themselves and you just don't want to mess with it. Because like when I think about what can make them better too, like I look at, I look at the fact that Kia Stokes is a starter for them. She has a worse net rating on the team. The starting lineup in and of itself is a bit of a red flag. Like they are not inefficient starting lineup. I think the shooting itself is a little bit gimmicky. They're second in the W and accuracy. I just wonder if that will come down to Earth at some point, but they have a philosophy of how they want to play. And even if it means losing a few games this season, I think that they're playing the long game. And who am I? Who am I coming up like just like landing on fuck boy island to be like you, I won't like go away from this long term vision that you had so I can have a little bit more fun this summer. You don't want to ruin their lives. You don't want to be the one ruin there. I don't want to ruin their lives. It's not them. It's me. Exactly. Exactly. Like focus on yourself. Queen. I love what you're doing. Let's see what free agency looks like next year. Let's see. Let's get Janelle Salon. Some more reps. I think I think that's if I had one major issue, it would be Janelle Salon's minutes. Beza be Kia Stokes minutes, especially because she's playing better defense this year if that's what Natalie Nacasse was looking for from her because she might be the answer to some of your questions. And I think you would want to go into free agency. Being a better idea of knowing what you have with her, especially because it's a year where you're not going to know what you have with Ilyana Ruppere who is also 24 years old and has a lot of potential. But congratulations to her. She is pregnant. She got the ring. She's doing the whole thing. She figured it out. So the youth is there, the potential is there, the vision is there, Veronica Burton having a great season. Gabby Williams showing us what she can do on both ends of the floor. Kayla Thornton, it's tough. Like it's been a little bit up and down for her, right? Like climbing off that injury. You see, well, I wonder what that looks like in August, but I'm kind of just like, I want to leave them alone. Like, you do you, I'm going to be liking these stories from the sidelines. Like I'm keeping tabs. I'm keeping tabs, but I'm going to I'm going to stay in my lane. You stay in yours. And let's see what happens. Yeah, I think I think we're all in on the long-term vision, but we're just here early. Yeah. All these, any issues that you can come up with are soft. And you don't waste like, you don't waste like what, what, what could be like long-term, like your wife on a summer fling. That's a good point, too. Yeah. That's a good point. Like if you look, you know that you're just like that way, you go with, you, you do that with a fever. You know, you go with, you go with Indiana in these spots, you know, you're going to have a ton of fun. It's going to be a great summer. It's the first time that the word great summer in Indian, Indiana have ever been used in this. Great point. What do you, what about Dallas, where you had a Dallas? I can see a future with them, but they're not mature enough to get in a committed relationship right now. Yeah. Because I like the vision, like when they're playing up and down and they can play fast, we saw it against the Aces. It looks amazing. And I think they're the team that puts the most pressure on you one through five, 94 feet, like especially now that they have a walk we're in the starting lineup, I think she started the last two games. That just makes our offense a lot harder to guard in the full court. And like when she's putting pressure on the rim, now you're opening up three point shots for AZ. Now you're opening up driving lanes for page. And then Jessica Shepherd is a player who commands attention on the perimeter, even though she's not much of a perimeter shooter, just because if you play off her, she's going to pick you apart with the passes. And like the inverted picking rolls with her, like the Aces had no answer for that whatsoever. They have so many options, but you're not going to get to play like that in the playoffs. And when the game slows down and Paige is having one of those nights where she's kind of, you know, a little bit passive and then teams are able to crowd the pain around Jessica Shepherd. I don't know what their offense looks like. So that's my one concern with them. I think that they need to get a little stronger underneath you. I think they can bleed a little bit with a rebounding. And I don't think like a lot of Smith is like solving that because that's been the one thing you can nitpick about her defense in the past. So that's my one concern. I think like if they run into a team that can bully you in the post, it's going to happen. Yeah. No, I'm with you. That's actually my issue with them too. I'm like, okay. Like you're an absolute catch. Like you're cool. You're fun. You're young. I think you might have a credit card addiction. I'm a little worried about the future financial stability because I'm looking at some of the things that you did this summer and you might regret some of those purchases. And I just don't know if I could, I couldn't, I would introduce you to my parents. I would not want to get into a mortgage with you right now. introduce them to my parents. I would introduce them to my friends, but I don't know about parents. Maybe next year. Maybe next Thanksgiving. And you know what, that's fair. That's fair. The physicality is definitely an issue. Like, there's just a who they wish to land a Smith would have been whole in the wall. And it's just. You keep the basket coming off, it's going to solve it. Like, Jose Fernandez that's what everyone is putting a lot on this mask. No way, right? That's limiting. Maybe. I don't know. I've never played WNBA basketball in a mask before. But many other players have and it hasn't just tanked their game. This is true. This is true. It probably isn't like the big solve that they think it is. But that's sort of the stuff that you have to tell yourself when you're when you're when you're you know, there are already in a committed relationship. And I think getting getting out of it is going to be complicated. So, you know, this is this is some of the bargaining that you start to do. Internally, you I don't take off the mask all season. Because like, what if I take off the mask and I continue to play like this? Then it's real. Yeah. I keep it on. Keep it on. I would want to know. I think I think you got to go deep down. She knows face your problems. She's the only one that does it. No, you got you have to have it head on. You have to have it head on. She's got at least believe. She has to at least believe. And if she doesn't, then we're talking different problem. But yeah, I think that it kind of has a downstream impact as well. Like, it puts more pressure on page and easy to defend. Easy is low key kind of been their best perimeter defender this year. She's actually been a really good perimeter defender this year. So any of the pre draft concerns with that, I always thought they were overblown because of her size and how smart she is, which is her hands. But they're they're putting a lot of pressure on their best players to kind of do some of the dirty work as well. And it's it feels like it's just tiring them out sometimes. They just getting a lot of like difficult assignments. Like, she's guarding like the best player in some nights. And like, I don't think you should do that because she's carrying such a load on offense like creatively. Exactly. Exactly. So it's like, yeah, it's like, I gosh, it's kind of tough. Like if Lan doesn't figure this out, I don't know really what happens for their long-term potential. Like, it's funny. I looked at this offseason. I had definitely had some like I had some, you know, I think you can pick some nits with their with their drafting, especially with what Olivia Miles is doing right now. You can pick some nits with their free agency. And like, maybe this could have been the year that they set themselves up to be like the bell of the ball. And it kind of might end up on that pretender line. Like, they're not really they're not really a contender. They're a playoff team. I wouldn't want to play them in the first round. No. But I'd also think that I would I would solve them. I think that most teams that are ahead of them would solve them. You don't want to play them in like a three games here, like a short series, like a longer series later or you're not worried about. You just don't know like AZ is a 17.3 quarter page goes off. Like there's just things that can happen. So I wouldn't want to play them because they just they have the star power. But yeah, I'm like less terrified of them than I was like a few weeks ago, I guess. I do like Joseford. I do like I will say that he's going to be over. Oh, he is a he is a press conference delight. However, I do think that he needs to find some ways to make life easier for his best players. That's right. That's right. Yeah. Actually, this is speaking of Dallas and Jess Shepherd. Were you at all surprised with how high she ended up being on the all-star voting? Is this like just an epic moment for page motion? I think so. I think that's part of it. And I have a theory that like the angel fan base and the Caitlyn Clark fan base is not voting for one another are kind of like elevating some other players because they were surprised. Both of them are we're surprised. They both were. That also, I mean, gosh, like the all-star voting was interesting. Like you have Asia comes in first. I think that this summer and just like the finals and the game winner and stuff is just definitely raised her profile. Paige is just a huge star. Like she's like the globe trotting it girl of the WNBA at this point. Jess Shepherd has been awesome. Like she's kind of been playing this like Dremel and Greene. She's like top five in like win-share. She's been great. So it's like I talked into Kai's about this last week. And I was like, well, yeah, check she like I would probably have to think about giving her an all-star vote. I haven't really like thought about those things like in depth yet, but she's definitely up there. But it is kind of funny. And when I say funny, I mean, it is, I mean, to stay on theme, one of the more epic fumbleings of a bag that the Caitlyn Clark shoes are finally coming out. Like in year three when she's like number five in all-star voting and like the excitement around her is maybe in all-time low since not that like I still enjoy the Caitlyn Clark experience. And the shoe is still going to do fine. But the motion is kind of on pause and it comes out October 1st and you're kind of banking on a deep fever final, finals run, which anything can happen between now and September. But right now you and I talking doesn't seem like either of us have a lot of faith in that. No, they almost had a disastrous night because I think tonight was the first time she used it and she lands on Angel's foot and almost rolls her ankle. Oh my god. That would have been the worst advertisement ever. But like, what took so long? I think they signed the deal in like 2022 when she was still at Iowa. I don't know what goes into designing a shoe, but it can't take four years. Like, why did they wait so long? And that's, yeah, I don't know, like you hear the theories and stuff. Like, I mean, the thing is, Asia and Angel are both of two shoes come out in the time that it's taken for one Caitlyn Clark, signature shoe to come out. There's this sort of massaging it. I mean, like, and she was very meticulous with all the details and stuff. And I was like, what's she? I don't, like, I don't, I do believe, I wonder if some of this is like a lack of urgency on on her part as well. As far as like, it just seemed like, especially like in the midst of everything that was going on in 2024, even like prior to 2025, it was probably hard to actually focus on getting a shoe out there. But for me, if I'm Nike, it's just like, God, what are we doing? Like, this is out of all the, all the moments in the last three years when this could have happened. This might be the worst. Yeah, probably. I do like the shoe, or maybe last year, when she was injured, yeah. I do like the shoe from like a basketball person. I don't think I would wear it out in public. Like, I think like Angel Reese's shoes, Angel Wilson's shoes look good like on the court or off the court, but I think that's where they might have missed a mark. But like for an encore shoe, I think it looks good. Say that. I like the shoe. I do like Kobe's back today. Yeah, I do like the shoe. And I think it has like a lot of good design potential. Also, like, I'm also just like one of those people, I'm like, I don't know, like, it's weird. Like, I feel like one of the expectations of a sports writer now is, is you get online and you're like, and this is how I feel about that design. I don't know, like that's fair. It's a shoe. You should be able to be like, I don't know. Like you don't always have to have a take. I don't have a take on the shoe design. That's that's where I'm at with it. All right, do you want to rattle through some of the last ones that we had? Seattle is a, you're in different life stages. She's just too young for you. Yeah, they're way too young. The son are, they're way too young for me. And I wouldn't be interested, even if I was. Well, they're moving across the country soon. Like, that's the other part too. Like, you just don't want necessarily moving to Houston, going to make it better. Absolutely. Well, from a basketball standpoint, from it, from emotion. I think, I think that they're going to blossom. I think they're going to have a big blow up when they go to Houston. The sky are sort of like, you don't watch summer house, but they're sort of like the west of, of, of like, reality TV world where like managed to pull a batty, never know what to do with a batty, self sabotage, fumble the batty. Like, this is sort of like the Chicago sky cycle at this point. Like, you get like all of the people who've walked in and out of those doors from Candace Park, O'Lean, Adelaide Dawn, Sylvia Fowl's, Clea Copper, now Angel Reese. And now you've been gifted Sydney Taylor. And, and you managed to get Skylar Dickens in the offseason. She's already telling you about yourself. And this is like, you can't help this. It's like, this is the type of person that you want, but you can never really quite live up to what they expect you to be. Yeah, I like that one. I feel like when anyone leaves them, they kind of go on to a bigger and better relationship. They're that person. Oh, everybody has a blow up after leaving. Yeah. Yeah. The Mercury, they're, they're the, I can't fix them, team. They just been through too much, shit. They're too jaded. They've been burned too many. Like, I feel like you look at their stats and they're not as bad as their record implies. But then you watch them and you're like, I don't think this is going to get better. But, you know, yeah. You start talking to them at the bar and you realize that there's just no life behind their eyes. Yeah. You're like, oh, you have something happening. You know, like, there's just, this is a problem for EMDR. This is not for me. The sparks I have, they take you on an expensive date, but they can't pay until midnight because the direct deposit hasn't it yet that's a good one for them there I love the idea of them but I don't love them the temple for me they think they're ready for a relationship but they're not yet no they're not for them it was their their tastes is too expensive like I can't afford the dates I have to take them on and it's not worth it like I don't I don't know if they're good enough for me and that was just like the back court is very expensive for them to be a 500 team the mistakes they're in a bad relationship and they're taking on their their partners personality it's rubbing off on them in the wrong way that's a dig at Sydney Johnson I just I'm counting the days until we have another touch wait what is like why why don't I like Sydney Johnson yes yeah I don't like the way they they play on either side of the court I think they play a 90 style of basketball where they prioritize the pain at the expense of giving up three-pointers like if you watch them every team they play has their best three-point shooting night and it's because they want to play in gaps they want to cut off driving lanes you have Shakira Austin who is a really good rim protector you have cheeky area fin you can get in in the way so I don't think they need a play like this and I think he's just like stuck in this old mode of basketball the kinetic game to dedicate game that was a well-coach game I will give credit where it's due but I even like the rotations are are vexing sometimes like Alithia Flores comes off her best game she hits two threes when she hasn't hit any threes and then the next game she gets no minutes like she literally doesn't come off the bench so just a lot of a lot of things and probably it's just me being an emotional fan thinking they should be better than they are fair fair they do have enough great individual defenders including Flores citron cheeky on the perimeter as opposed to at the rim that they probably don't need to be playing as I was a great source as an underrated defender to see I feel like she got like a reputation as maybe just because she's like five six all Australian that she wasn't gonna be a good defender but she's pesky and like she'll get up under you I I'm interested to see how the msix defend Olivia Miles they're playing them next week I get to see her rip my heart out in person and you're looking forward to it that's the kind of data you are no I wanted to have I want her to go for 40 and just yeah I want to be on my face of living yeah please please kill me hit me with the truck but I do think our guards to give and I'm saying our the guards can give them give her some issues so we're down a little bit just because they're very quick and very underway on defense that's kind of a real noted aim reunion too you're going to have cast Prosper Sonia citron and Olivia Miles that'll be fun that will be a fun game yeah yeah um see oh last thing we should get get to so the WNBA announced yesterday that in 2027 the season will be expanding to 50 games um curious what you thought of this I feel like it's maybe a necessity just because you're adding teams but I think we saw like last year them expanding to 44 and then there were a lot more injuries and I think a lot of people were tying those two together I'd be interested to see if that can trim continued this year uh but we got to get better at scheduling the games if we're gonna be adding all these we can't have like we already can't yet we're not even doing like with the 44 that we have no 4 10 pm eastern games at once uh last night what what was that and the night before you had one game the day after you have one game like we got to spread these games out yeah um here's the thing I I think that uh and you know like I think when things like this happen like the the general narrative ends up being well look what an exciting moment for the league the league is growing and of course it is like we're all seeing um all of that I do not think that we are yet at the place where the demand for WNBA games yet outweighs its supply I think scarcity is actually to their benefit yeah I think in general is from a viewing experience and like for like the stakes of a regular season as far as like the games actually mattering for the playoffs um the league benefits from scarcity from if the larger scheduling issues around like when the games are like what time they are weren't so glaring I think the Thursday Friday sort of Sunday slate is actually like almost like football-esque like they kind of like have been being able to do the best of both worlds as far as like being a league that has a lot of games but sort of still feels like it has this sort of like weekly storyline and I worry the going to 50 games or or potentially 52 which they could I think in after 2029 um would risk that like I should think the league is like I'm I'm a touch nervous about it to be honest no no I agree I feel like it makes sense to kind of like own not one day of the week but maybe like a section of the week like you're saying like if you own the weekend and you you fans knew like oh Saturday night we're gonna get you know a marquee matchup Sunday afternoon on CBS or whatever I do think they've done a good job of putting good games especially on the Saturday Saturday night on CBS has been amazing like they're slate um but yeah especially if they're not gonna fix the schedule I don't know how do they just have like a dog like you know when they like record the dog hitting balls into a bucket and they're like that's who are predicting to win the world cup or whatever is that how they make the schedule because it makes no sense I will ask I will ask and I do think making the schedule is a a gargantuan to ask and maybe I wonder if maybe the amount of networks that are involved in WNBA also have an impact to like it's hard to plan doubleheader when you have to like change the channel I don't know what the networks necessarily want to work together um maybe they want to counter program a little bit maybe like who knows um I think that's things like that they just do have as much as I do love to be like and here's another thing Kathy I do think that there might be more at play here but you know what I'm gonna look into it I appreciate that yeah having the wings and boundaries playing as like the counter program when you have mercury aces I just feel like that was a bad move yeah that's already anticipated yeah that's yeah well it's tough because it's like I don't know how good you thought like wings mercury would have been um compared to what we expected to be like aces aces or sorry aces mercury right that's like a finals rematch but that's true Phoenix hasn't really been very good um that's also what makes some of these things tough like I think honestly like League got pretty lucky with it's a dream fever angel Caitlin scheduling given that we didn't know that she was gonna be you know what um it's a bit of a crapshoot but they could also just do a much better job of staggering the games also league pass just now I'm just ranting but league pass is absolutely useless this year yeah it's been yeah I I feel like I barely use it and I have to log in every time I open the app it's that's a technical issue but I don't think you need it to really follow the wheelchair well every time I want to watch a game on league pass it redirects me to a different network right exactly it's like you know you got to go to peacock actually yeah or you got to go to the USA network which unless you want to watch storm Sun that's what you got it for I mean I'm I'm locked in for storm Sun I have no problems watching storm Sun but I don't like being redirected every single time I want to watch a watch a game um hey that's the nature of this streaming economy I guess that's what it is um Steven thank you so much for hopping on this was a fun episode I enjoy talking to you and thank you to Stefan Anderson for producing and congratulations to Stefan Anderson his uh his nicks won the title he was at the championship parade earlier today and somehow he is still alive and well to be able to produce this podcast and I imagine he is I think I think it's to find you're trying to channel this nicks energy into a liberty title right okay awesome um oh thank you thank you just thank you Steven and we'll talk to you all soon