419: Ohio House of Horrors: New Photos from Inside, 16 "Almost Feral" Kids Rescued & Very Dark Timeline | The Sider Family

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ohio just cannot wrap their heads around this it's just shocking 16 kids in that kind of condition those innocent children ranging in age from one and a half to 18 years old they were found in what police described as the most horrifying scene they've ever witnessed in their careers and they're asking the simple question how was this able to happen hey true crime besties welcome back to an all-new episode seriolously hello hello hello and welcome back to an all-new episode of seriolously with me your host annie elise also your true crime bff breaking down all the cases that you want to know all the details about new cases breaking cases you know old cold cases whatever it is i'm here to do the research the deep dive the go to the dark corners of the internet so that you don't have to and let me just say this first and foremost okay i hear you guys i promise you i am not ignoring you i see your dms i see your emails i see your case requests and i hear you i see you i know i wanted to get this episode out way sooner than it's being released but here is the problem with that first and foremost there was so much information that we needed to obtain not only because it's a pretty giant case but also because there are so many elements to it that are kind of being like hush-hushed so we had to file a bunch of formal requests we had to dig deep we had to then vet all of this information to see what's real what's not what's a theory what's you know all of these things and so i didn't want to prematurely release an episode on this case until i fully had all the information to where i could give you start to finish everything that we know about this case and if you're like uh annie i have no idea what case you're even talking about well let me just tell you because we are going to ohio today and more than that we're going to ohio today and we're going to ohio today and we're going to ohio today we are going to do a deep dive into the trenches of hell that is the house of horrors that was discovered now like i said i have been flooded by you guys with requests to cover this case and it's you know i had to come through it's a crazy one you're going to be with me for a minute but i also want to warn you it is not for the faint of hearted because this one it's tough and disturbing and gross and very difficult to wrap your mind around how like things like this actually happen people like this actually exist this case has truly shook an entire small rural community to its core people are angry they are disgusted and most of all they were shocked that this happened right under their noses it's just shocking 16 kids in that kind of condition this is going to last a long time being shocked it's not going to go away in a year it's not going to go away in a couple of years it's going to be long lasting that's the truth now i want to get right into the details but like i said i do want to give you just this blanket warning that this is one of the more disgusting cases that we've ever covered i covered the robinson family a while back not too long ago and i thought that was tough this is so ultra disgusting i mean the details are just beyond diabolical and absolutely unthinkable as a parent in fact another reason it took me so long to get this episode out is because in addition to fact finding and getting to the bottom of it i also had to take breaks throughout because i just couldn't stomach it truly so if you have to pause or skip i totally understand we're going to be together on this i've got all of my notes right here in front of me i'm going to break down the whole timeline what happened when it was exposed the backstory of the people involved the house and the conditions and what that means allegations that are happening right now that are so vile i can't even like make sense of it myself there is so much to go through so let's start with the timeline of how this all unfolded on tuesday june 30th 2026 vinton county sheriff's office and the ohio bureau of investigations otherwise known as the bci they executed a search warrant at 182 omer street in hamden ohio now when the sheriffs entered the home and i'm going to get as well later on because it's not for what they found shockingly enough but when the sheriffs entered the home they found 16 children ranging in ages from one and a half to 18 years old and they were hidden in a small 12 by 12 room now this property itself was incredibly tiny but think about that for a moment a 12 by 12 room with 16 kids shoved in it some kids technically an adult 18 years old although frail and so on but they were hidden in a small 12 by 12 room and they were small due to being emaciated which i will get to as well but that is you're crammed you're not necessarily quite shoulder to shoulder but pretty freaking close and the condition of this room and this house could only be described by ohio attorney general as pure evil investigators say that when they were conducting like i said this unrelated investigation they made this horrifying discovery they did not expect to find them inside the home no less the living conditions the amount of children and just everything that was about to unravel now the four adult members of the home gary senior christina gary jr and elizabeth siders were all arrested the 16 children were removed from the home and they were taken to local hospitals for observation and treatment but this news when it became breaking news it sent shockwaves through the town honestly the entire country everybody was just trying to figure out like what happened here we often hear the term house of horrors right it early on got dubbed after the turpin case which is actually more in my neck of the woods back in california in the riverside area but it's when the living conditions are so vulgar and hellish that there's no other way to explain it other than a house of horrors feces on the wall buckets you know no food roaches what you name it you imagine it that's what it is and so when these headlines broke and everybody saw oh my god 16 kids rescued from this tiny little home and this 12 by 12 room what really is going on here photos of the people involved also started going viral which i'm just gonna say were these photos are like a freaking jump scare okay but everybody was trying to be like you know trying to figure out what happened here so on wednesday july 1st 2026 the vinton county sheriff ryan kane and the vinton county prosecutor william archer and also ohio attorney general andy wilson they held a press conference because they wanted to discuss not only the details that they could discuss about the case but also more details on the arrests of the four family members now let me do a little bit of family lineage for you really quick and i'm going to do my best to explain this as easily as i can photos on screen for those of you watching the video version of this so that you can follow along because there are a couple of things that i want to talk about duplicate names and when we get to the children a lot of them are only going by initials to protect their privacy but i want to illustrate what this family tree i guess you could call it looks like so gary senior and christina are the grandparents of gary junior gary junior is married to his wife elizabeth and the two of them are parents to all of the children allegedly and i'm going to get to that in a little while okay so the four family members are the parents of gary senior and christina four adults each are being charged with 16 counts of endangering children a count for each child who was rescued from the home all four adults are currently at the time of this recording being held on a three hundred thousand dollar bond gary senior christina and elizabeth have waived their right to a preliminary hearing that happened just a couple of days ago now let's go through the details of what resulted in this discovery why did they even have a warrant to go and search this house no less lead them to something that they absolutely did not expect well for about a month the authorities had been conducting an investigation the details of this investigation were not discussed in the press conference but stay tuned because, you know, as your true crime bestie, I had to come through. I did some digging and I figured it out. I got all of the details for that, which I'm going to get into. But they were doing this unrelated investigation. The attorney general said that the evidence shows that the four adults were, quote, pretty good at hiding these kids. And neighbors in the area also apparently told investigators that they had no idea that kids even lived inside this home. This was after the Sider family had moved in four years earlier. But can you imagine that? And we hear that again a lot of times in these house of horrors type cases where the neighbors say, we had no idea there were even kids there. Nobody's ever out playing. They're not neighbors who wave to you when they're getting the mail. They keep their shades covered, their blinds closed. So it's once again just very reminiscent of history and pattern that we see, unfortunately, in these types of cases. So during the time that we were in the house of horrors, we heard that the neighbors had moved in. During the press conference, Attorney General Andy Wilson and Sheriff Ryan Cain described the conditions where the children were found. And rather than me regurgitate that information to you, I want you to hear exactly from their mouths how they described it. Because it's difficult to hear, but also incredibly important to hear. So take a listen. It's almost indescribable. So the sheriff was on the scene as well. I probably ought to have him come up. But, boy, it. I've seen livestock lived. Mostly kept better. So you've got to come up here. As I was saying, most of our livestock was kept in better conditions than the children. It was extremely high presence, I'm sure, of bacterial and human feces. It was just a disgusting scene. Can I ask for both of you, what did you feel like walking through there? Not necessarily what it looked like, what the description, but what was going through your mind? So it was disgusting even where the kids weren't. I would think it's typical. Most law enforcement have experience with homes in a similar fashion. A large number of people, though, the children were kept in a similar fashion. They were kept in a roughly 12 by 12 area, it seems like, is where they've spent the most of the last four years. And that's what it looks like. In a weird way, you're hit with most two emotions. There is joy when we realize that we're about to change 16 lives for the better. Now let that just sink in for a moment, okay? The fact that he said, that livestock were kept in better conditions. Animals. And look, I'm not trying to shade any animals and say that they don't deserve to be well kept or well taken care of. But the fact that there is this comparison about these children and livestock being cared for better than these living kids, which I get that livestock's living too, but you know what I mean. It's just deplorable. Now you may have also, if you've been following this case or on social media actively, you may have seen some quotes from the Attorney General about the children living in third world conditions and, you know, saying that's how bad this was. But I also, again, want to play his entire quote for context. So again, another little bit of a warning because this is very sensitive for a lot of us. But take a listen. To describe the conditions, adding on to what the sheriff said, I didn't actually go into the room where the kids were. I just looked through the door. That was yesterday. I can still smell. I can't get the smell. I cannot get the smell off of me or what I'm saying. I can't get the smell off of me or what I'm saying. And again, we've got to make sure the kids are safe. We've got to make sure they're placed in good, solid therapeutic placements. And we have to hold accountable the people who are willing to do this to their own family. He also said, and this is a direct quote, that the kids were, quote, almost feral. And he detailed that some of the children are unable to speak, have developmental delays and challenges, and that an 18-year-old could not even write her name. Okay. Heartbreaking, first of all. First and foremost, that some can't speak. They don't know how to communicate. They either have a developmental delay to where they're unable to speak, or they simply have never been educated on words and how to speak. The 18-year-old not even knowing how to write her name. I think that it goes so much farther beyond just the neighbors not knowing the children are there. I would argue, and I'd probably bet my life on it, that there was not. There was not a single day in which any of these children attended any sort of educational program whatsoever. And sure as shit, not homeschool, right? And so it's like, for me, when I hear all of that, it breaks my heart because the first thought that comes into my mind, of course, is like, why on earth are you continuing to have children? Like, clearly you don't want them, right? But also, how did this go unnoticed for so long? Which, I know I keep saying it, but just stay with me. But to all of it today, I am going to unpack everything for you. No IDs, no anything, to where there really isn't any sort of track record as to where they are, where they're going, or, again, what their medical history is. They also asked anyone who knew the family to come forward and to please provide any information. They also said that they would be reviewing whether or not the family was reported to any children's services agencies in the past. Then, at the conclusion of the press conference, authorities made it very clear that at that point, it had only been 24 hours since this incident. And that it is an open and ongoing investigation. They also said that because of that, they faced a lot of challenges based on the children's conditions. Because, think about it, if these children can't properly communicate or express what happened, what they went through, different things that occurred over the years, it's going to make it all the more challenging for the investigators to get a clear picture as to what is truly happening within these four walls. So, like I said, they said that it's a big challenge, and because of this, they do expect more charges to be filed while they continue investigating, and that the search warrants would be sealed until they conclude their investigation. Because they don't want anything to be in jeopardy, they don't want anything to, you know, give them any sort of, hinder the investigation in any way or anything like that. So, with this, after this press conference, obviously everybody had questions. A lot of questions, including myself. And you already know what that means. The moment I start getting questions in my mind and I start going down the rabbit hole, I know I'm going down the rabbit hole for you guys as well. I am going to dig deep, I am going to figure out everything there is to know, and try to make sense of it all. So I'm going to break down everything that I found, I'm going to give you some context and some background so that you can really understand what is going on here. Because when I say that it is a lot to wrap your head around, I truly mean it. I am going to break down everything that I found, I truly mean it. Or maybe you're just looking for something that works better for you and your family. Either way, they make it simple to see your options. No guesswork, no surprises. Ready to see how easy and fun shopping for car insurance can be? Visit Progressive.com and give the Name Your Price tool a try. Take the stress out of shopping and find coverage that fits your life on your terms. 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Toyota. let's start with the house okay the first thing that i want to address is the location of the house because if the smell and odor was so bad and lingering all over the place and in such horrific conditions you may be wondering like i was okay well then how did it go unnoticed i'm sure at one point or another in all of our lives we grew up in a house or a neighborhood where there was always that one house on the street where it was kind of like you kind of side-eyed it a little bit you're like their lawn is unkept or they all they have window coverings all the time or they have foil on their windows and maybe this is just me but i would imagine some of you have seen it in your lives at one point to where you're always kind of like something that's the weird neighbor that's the neighbor we never see but if you kind of ignore it and you just chalk it up to maybe they're lazy maybe you never think that anything super nefarious is going on or god forbid if you do hopefully you call the authorities but in this case given not only the smell and odor but also the odor of the house and the odor of the house only the conditions which i get you can't see they're not visible from the outside of the house but the odor the lingering smell all of these things it does beg the question of how it didn't go noticed and how there weren't any neighbors raising the red flag kind of ringing the alarm being like what is going on here now the case itself took place in a small rural town of hamden ohio as i mentioned earlier now the population there is only 727 people it includes only 230 families and 338 houses hamden is located in the southeast area of ohio and it's located in vinton county which is the least populated county in all of ohio with a total population of a little under 13 000 residents so not a big city not a mega area to where maybe there would be more opportunity for passerbyers and things to catch on to and report maybe also because it's more small town small families people kept to themselves maybe in these more rural areas i don't know but to be honest the only thing that i could really find is that the county is home to a lot of historic covered bridges that's pretty much it i couldn't i dug deep and that's really all i could find however one thing that i do want to note before moving on to the house itself is that the median household income in this area is less than 30 000 which is 50 000 less than the national average so i do think that it's important to know that when we talk about these warning signs that were missed and that i personally do think some of the neighbors missed that is a detail that is important and comes into play with all of this because you can't necessarily blame the neighbors obviously not they're not the ones to blame the adults in this situation are the ones to blame but also when there are fewer resources and fewer opportunities it does make it more challenging to be the karen on the street or to be able to have access to see things or to know or the internet or you know all of these different things so i just want to throw that out there not that i think anybody would ever blame the neighbors for this but also there are elements that roll into the bigger picture of the area itself the population the median income and all of those things so the karen on the street now according to property records it had one owner who died just before the cider family moved in i've seen some comments out there speculate that they could be squatting in this home or that the home belonged to another family member and then they began renting it for about the last four years but unconfirmed 100 what exactly is going on and what situation led to this family being in that house according to tax records the house is made of wood and was built in 1900 and it was built in the early 90s and it was built in the early 90s and it was built in the early 90s and it was built in the early 90s and it was built in the early 90s it has one bedroom one bath and a partially finished basement now because so many of the details still have not officially been released although we have been able to get our hands on some of them i just want to say this too that and i'll identify this as we go there is a lot of theorizing out there on the internet a lot of speculation of course and a lot of just people kind of commenting with their what they heard or their neighbor who heard something or they know someone who knows someone or whatever and i will always clarify when those moments come so you know what is fact versus speculation but one of the things that i do want to start with in regards to that is that i have heard that the kids were hidden in the basement in that unfinished basement area now with that a few photos have actually been released which it was taking a while to get photos because they were holding everything so close to the vest because of the integrity of the investigation and because so that show the inside of the home and honestly it's hard to tell which room is the basement versus the bedroom based on these photos because every room looks pretty similar and for my audio listeners i'm going to go ahead and put the photos on the youtube version of this so you can pop over to the video version and check it out yourself but let me just tell you this the conditions inside this home they were just as disturbing as the allegations themselves photos show this house that is just overwhelmed by filth mountains of trash covering nearly every room moldy clothing and garbage just strewn across the floors and walls that appear to be stained from years of neglect and i wish i could convey the conditions of this house and how deplorable it truly looks it almost looks like a house that has been abandoned for years stacks of trash up to you know cockroaches uh it almost kind of looks like a landfill like that is how deplorable these conditions were we also of course know that the house reportedly reeked of cat urine well i will say this one of the photos that was released it did have a footnote at the bottom that said it was the basement but like i said i think it's very difficult to tell which room is which so unless we have the body cam footage doing the actual walkthrough to see where things are logistically it's difficult to tell which room is which so unless we have the body cam footage doing the walkthrough to see where things are logistically it's difficult to know but even so that room that was labeled as the basement it was so packed with debris that much of the space was no longer even usable and outside of the house more piles of trash just surrounded the property alongside these run-down vehicles that also were filled with garbage cigarette butts wrappers it was just the entire property was a disaster a filthy disaster it's like landfill meets cockroach infestation hoarding problem just no condition for any human to ever live in which i think is why there was the comparison that livestock is treated better but it really puts into perspective just how awful this home was and also what led to the horrific hygiene problems that i'm going to touch on later in this episode as well but again you can pop over to the video version to see these photos but i am still a little bit confused on the room situation so i'm not certain if they were held in the bedroom or if they were held in the basement but it is a small house in general it's only in one bedroom so what i do know is the room that they were found in regardless of where it's located in the house it was only 12 feet by 12 feet now to give you a better visual of what a room that size looks like the room would have been smaller than a one car garage it's also about the size as a horse stable which to give you an idea of how many people a room like that size could hold and hold comfortably i'm going to put on screen for the video watchers a 12 by 12 tent and in this image six adults are sitting in it six now we know that 16 people were found in the room again i get it and i sorry i keep saying again which i need to get better about that but i know that a lot of these were children and so they would be smaller they would take up less room all the things but also it's like you still need room to stretch to do like do exercises to move to walk to be mobile so 16 people in a 12 by 12 room is unthinkable another thing that i want to briefly talk about is the sheriff mentioning that there was a large amount of human feces and urine in this room with all of these children which considering that this house only had one bathroom for 20 people i think that you can put two and two together on what was going on there again it's almost like the blueprint for any house of horrors type case where there's either a bucket used or a corner used but the sheriff described it as feces everywhere and just deplorable conditions overall so now that you have the lay of the land of the house itself and everything that was discovered i want to get into the family tree which i'll be honest with you after looking at this and looking at all the connections it's looking more and more like a family wreath not a family tree but things together and woven together rather than independently branching out so for this part keep in mind this is alleged information at this point it is just speculation and it has not been publicly verified i want to start with the adults as i mentioned gary senior and christina are married they are the parents of gary junior and also four other daughters now don't hold me on this i can't confirm how many total kids they have because more and more keep coming out of the woodwork. every single day, but I want to focus on Gary Jr. since he was involved in this situation. Gary Jr. also goes by the nickname Bub, which he is referred to by family members, and he's also referred to that through social media handles. Gary Jr. is married to Elizabeth. Now, Gary is three years older than Elizabeth, and he met her when she was roughly about 12 or 13 years old. There are some posts on social media with information from a family member named Lynn as well, which I want to touch on this information because it's important here, especially when you talk about lineage and the children and potential developmental delays and things like that. Because according to Lynn, Elizabeth and Gary Jr. are distant cousins. They met because their families lived a couple trailers apart in Ohio as well, and she would apparently go over to the Siders' house for play dates. Well, Elizabeth eventually got pregnant with her first child around 13 years old. However, that child was allegedly not Gary's. Unfortunately, that child later passed away. Now, through all of this, even though they were both incredibly young, the Siders had no issues with the relationship between Gary and Elizabeth, and apparently Elizabeth would oftentimes stay over there. Even so, Elizabeth would often run away to go be with Gary if her parents ever told her no. This happened multiple times, and she also told her parents that she would leave for good. Unless she was allowed to marry Gary Jr. So, when Gary turned 18, her parents didn't want any trouble, they didn't want her running off and abandoning them, so they signed emancipation papers, which basically it means that you're free to make your own decisions and live as an adult, basically. I'm paraphrasing here. But because of that, Gary and Elizabeth crossed the border into West Virginia, and they got married when she was just 15 years old. So, Elizabeth then had her second child around the same time as Gary Jr. and Elizabeth. and Elizabeth. So, Elizabeth then had her second child around the same time as she married Gary. All 16 kids who had been removed from this house allegedly belong to Elizabeth and Gary Jr. And I say allegedly because I'm going to get into more of this later, but let me start with there. So, all 16 kids allegedly belong to Elizabeth and Gary Jr., who Elizabeth married him when she was 15 years old, okay? Also, a family member said that they were distant cousins. Now, the children are listed in court records as follows. The first child who was unconfirmed and passed away, unconfirmed to be Gary's, I should say, and passed away was from 2006 to 2007. Then, C.S., also known as Chloe, was born in May of 2008. And actually, I'm just going to give you guys the years for now, just so it's easier to track, because I really want you to hear the year and see how back-to-back all of these pregnancies really were. So, C.S., a.k.a. Chloe, was born in May of 2008. And C.S., a.k.a. Z.S., a.k.a. Zoe, 2009. C.S., who was potentially Christina, 2011. K.S., also known as Kayla, 2012. B.S., a.k.a. Brooke, 2013. G.S. III, a.k.a. Gary III, 2014. L.S., 2016. B.S., 2017. J.S., 2019. E.S., 2020. N.S. and S.S., which was a couple of years ago, were born in May of 2011. And this is Elizabeth's first set of twins, 2022. Then, Faith and Bailey, the second set of twins, November of that same year, 2022. And unfortunately, those twins passed away at birth. According to their death certificate, the twins' manner of death was listed as natural, and they lived one hour after being born at just 24 weeks. The cause of death lists respiratory failure because the twins were born conjoined, face-to-face, at the chest and the upper abdomen. Which, I know you all know what conjoined means, so I don't think I need to explain that, but just in case I do, it means that they were attached, face-to-face, from the chest and upper abdomen. And the next set of twins, the third set of twins, B.S. and W.S., was 2024. Then the fourth set of twins, I.S. and I.S., 2025. This means that Elizabeth has been pregnant for almost 20 years, straight. Also, that she had four sets of twins within three years. The longest gap, when I broke down the math, because you know, when I saw all these years, I was like, okay, I need to like really break this down and figure out how long this was between pregnancies. I know if you've had birth, you know, you like wait six weeks before you can even have sex again, but then like they have Irish twins, these twins, all these things, like there's all these sayings for how quickly children come or can come. But the longest gap between the kids is two years and one day. The shortest gap is 11 months and two days. And I just want to read those years off for you once more. And I'm not going to say the names, but just the years. 2007, 2008, 2009, 2011, 2012, 2013, 2014, 2016, 2017, 2019, 2020, 2022, 2022, 2024, 2025. It is wild. And look, I know there are women out there who feel called and born to be a mother and they want to have a huge lot of children and more power to you. But I would argue, this is just my opinion, so take it with a grain of salt. I would argue that this is abusive for someone to give birth this many times back to back like this, especially starting at just 15 years old. That should be a crime in and of itself, depending on the circumstances in which she got pregnant. So like I said, the shortest gap is just two years and the shortest gap 11 months. So now that we've unpacked all of that information, I want to move on to the crime itself. There is a lot of verified information out there. There is a lot of unverified information out there. And I just want to go through what's out there from the authorities and what I can confirm. Insurance isn't one side of the coin. There's a lot of unverified information out there. And shopping for it shouldn't feel like squeezing into something that just doesn't fit. That's why drivers have enjoyed Progressive's Name Your Price tool for years. With the Name Your Price tool, you tell them what you want to pay and they show you options that fit your budget. Enough hunting for discounts, trying to calculate rates and tinkering with coverages. Maybe you're picking out your very first policy, or maybe you're just looking for something that works better for you and your family. You know that moment when everything lines up, when life gives you the green light and you just go? No hesitation. No friction. Just a car that's right there with you. Go like you mean it. Earlier that the police were conducting an unrelated investigation on one of the adults in this house, right? And that that's what led them to this horrific discovery. Well, as I did my digging, based on this court document, police began investigating Gary Jr., the alleged father of all of these children, regarding a situation that took place in May of 2026. And on June 28th, because of that situation, an arrest warrant was issued, and it was issued for indecent exposure. These charges ended up being, issued for Gary Jr., which is why law enforcement was there to search the house. Because apparently, aside from just being a hell on earth father and husband and human being, he also is like showing his thing around town. Now, I want to share this too. Unconfirmed. But I have seen some reports that state that there may have been a threat to take their own life and a well-being check, a wellness check performed that ultimately sent the police there. Because someone was threatening to take their own life. And that the charges stemmed from an incident involving a 13-year-old girl. Which, I don't even want to go there. I don't want to imagine if that is true and this poor young child. But I have been seeing a text message regarding this circulating on social media. Now, let's talk about the discovery for a moment, okay? At least three windows of the home were open or bursted out. And the home's door was missing or open. Several items were also piled in front of the house's front window. Investigators said that the children were kept in that 12 by 12 room for nearly four years. So it's not, not that it would make it okay, but it's not like these kids were held in this 12 by 12 room for a day or a couple of hours or coincidentally being punished, you know, when these officers came to search the house and that it was all a coincidence. There are reports that that they had been held in there for four years. Which, if you remember, the Sider family moved into this home four years ago. Meaning they allegedly have been kept in that small room, some of them, since birth. It is horrific. I don't even know another word to describe this. And in those conditions, you move into this new house and just lock all these kids away as if they don't exist. You aren't feeding them. You're not taking care of them. You're not allowing them to be out in the sunlight to play. You're not educating them. It is deplorable. It is the most depraved thing I think I have ever heard. As I said, too, officers noted that the conditions inside the home were horrific and beyond comprehension. They also, as I had mentioned earlier, too, described it worse than what livestock lives in. Now, investigators are not clear if the 16 children all lived in that one room together or if they were forcibly confined to it. But I would argue. Even if they say they all lived in that room, they all shared a bedroom, I would argue that that is forcibly being confined into this room. Because even if that's your bedroom, that's not the room that you're choosing to live in. Where's the bathroom? Where's the living room? Where's the family room? Where's a kitchen? Anything else like that? You are being confined to that room. A bedroom is a bedroom to sleep. And I get it. You hang out. You do all those things, too. But I would argue they are forcibly restraining, not restraining, but holding these kids in this room. And that it's not just 16 kids sharing a room, which how do you even sleep at that point, right? Imagine, again, think illustrating a 12 by 12 and 16 kids ranging in ages and sizes lying there on the floor, whether they're all parallel to each other, they're intersecting, whatever it is. How do they even all sleep? I'm sure some are sleeping, sitting up, crouched in a ball, small. Some aren't sleeping. It's horrific. And I know I keep saying that word, but truly, I don't even know what other word to use to describe it. So, there was also an incredibly foul smell that was coming from this room. Large amounts of those human feces were found inside the home as well, which contaminated the entire space with significant bacteria. First responders have halted any further investigation of the house itself because of how bad the conditions were, because they said it needs to be deemed safe. It needs to be free of contamination. There's so much bacteria in there, even with hazmats, it's a little bit of a concern. So. They can't even investigate any further until they, like, deem it safe for their team. The house was also filled with cockroaches, other bugs. The kids were covered in bug bites and scratch marks, which, imagine, you have mosquito bites, you have other bites, you have roach bites, it's itchy, you're scratching, maybe fleas, ticks, scabies, who the freak even knows? The kids also showed signs of extreme neglect, which, hello, we all know that, and they appeared frail and malnourished. First responders noted that the kids were frightened and that they were extremely quiet during the entire 20-minute drive to the hospital. Seven children were admitted to the hospital for treatment, including two that were airlifted to intensive care units. Officials also noted that if they had found the children 24 hours later, there would have been at least one fatality. Which, can you even imagine? Such deplorable conditions that one, if not more, but one for sure. One for sure is on the brink of death, and that just 24 hours later, they wouldn't have survived. As I mentioned, too, some of the children cannot speak at all, or they have incredibly limited speech. Investigators also said that that oldest child could not write her own name, but I do want to say that may or may not be true, considering that the oldest child does have an active social media account, and her former boyfriend posted screenshots of their conversations to debunk this claim. So, I think that kind of implies maybe she just didn't want to cooperate with the authorities and give them her name or write her name, or maybe it's easier to, I don't know, to type. I don't really know. I'm not an expert on any sort of developmental delays, so I don't even want to speak on that, but I just want to share the information that we have. So, while we're actually on the topic of social media, interestingly enough, Elizabeth's family is speaking out on Facebook about this situation. And I think all of us. All of us likely agree, based on the amount of people involved, that some family members may or must have been aware of what was going on, or have had some sort of inside knowledge into all of this. But according to Elizabeth's family, they had absolutely no idea. Because once Gary Jr. and Elizabeth got married, they apparently slowly started distancing themselves, which her family says that he slowly took her away and started isolating her. Now, I don't want to defend anyone. But based on this Facebook post, which I'm going to share from Elizabeth's mom, it looks like it was brand new information to her as well, that she had no idea. Personally, I would think that if her mom did know what was going on, she likely wouldn't be sharing this news article saying, like, Oh my God, can you believe this? Or I'm so shook, and all these things. I can't think of any reason why any family member would post about it. But they did not stop there, because other family members also chimed in. And I want to start with her two brothers. The day of the arrest, Elizabeth's brother Jeremy posted this on Facebook. It's been 15 years. You lost touch with your family, followed another, and look what happened. Which, again, I'm not trying to put blame on anybody, but I also do have a question with that. If you shook his hand a few months ago, depending on where you were, even if you weren't at the house and you couldn't see the conditions, wouldn't you notice the lack of hygiene? And wouldn't that set off some sort of, you know, red flag, bell, alarm, signal, siren, something? And maybe not, and I'm not blaming the brother, don't get me wrong here, but having a visual of just a couple months, this isn't something that just happened over the last few months. This is something that has been brewing for decades. So, if you saw this in person, in person, clearly you would know that something's afoot, right? I don't know. Elizabeth's older brother Joey has also been outspoken about this case, posting multiple videos and doing live streams across TikTok and Facebook. However, I want to just say this, there is a lot of speculation about Joey's motive, and if he's just trying to use this situation as a means to go viral, which is really disgusting if true. And this all basically stems from the fact that Joey himself has served time for child endangerment, and this was back in 2018. So, for that reason, and that reason alone, because he served actual time for child endangerment not too long ago, I will not be sharing any of his posts or platforming that monster. Another family member, Tiffany, who is related to both Gary Jr. and Elizabeth, also took to Facebook, and with a pretty lengthy post. In the post, she made it clear that she was not defending Elizabeth in any way, and she believes that she's guilty, and believes that the justice system should handle it however they see fit. But what really caught my attention is that she posted photos of what Elizabeth looked like before she even met Gary, and back when she had her whole life ahead of her. And this is one of the things, the side-by-side comparison, that I have seen go absolutely viral. Viral on social media, too, because it is such a stark difference. And I get it. Age, time, conditions, means, all of these things change somebody's appearance and are contributing factors. But in this image, when Elizabeth is young, and she just looks bright, she looks vibrant, she looks happy, and comparing that side-by-side to her mugshot and what she looks now, like now, it is jarring, it is incredibly scary, and if you haven't seen the photos, and you're listening to the audio version of this, hop on over to YouTube after this, cycle through the photos that I've shown, you'll understand what I'm talking about. So Gary Sr. and Christina's son-in-law, Ronnie Fletcher, also spoke out about this case. And he also said that his family has been receiving death threats. He told a local reporter that they were good parents, and he cleared up that this was not generational trauma or anything like that, because what happened, only represented the fact that they were good parents, and he cleared up that this was not generational trauma or anything like that, and he represents this one house. Take a listen. It's been awful for the people that had no idea that was going on in the house that are related to this family. I mean, we've had death threats, we've been told that we need to be put in front of, you know, execution line of guns, and, you know, killed, and, you know, burned, and, you know, I mean, it's been bad. Gary and Lynn did not raise their children that way. The four daughters that got out are successful members of society, we've raised our children, our children have, you know, college degrees, or, you know what I mean, whatever, like, you know what I mean, and for us to be put into all this, and there's generational incest, and, you know what I mean, this is going on, generational, it's not true. This is all into that one home. The last time we heard from them, we gave them a car, and it's probably close to a year ago now, other than them, you know, Lynn calling us and asking for money, or, you know, they needed help with the water bill, or, you know what I mean, whatever. And if we had it, we sent it. If we didn't, one of the other daughters did. So we've done what we could for that family at the arm's length that they was keeping us at. Now, I have also seen some other posts from Gary Sr. and Christina's family members saying that the two of them would never allow any of this to happen, but that both of them have been sick for quite some time and not doing well, stating that Christina may even have dementia and that she may truly have had no idea what was happening inside the children's room or that one 12 by 12 room. Now, there is also some speculation that Gary Jr. could have been abusing the three other adults in the home. This is based on what appears to be ligature marks seen on the wrists of Gary Sr., Christina, and Elizabeth. These marks were seen during their Zoom appearances. However, to be fair, I just want to play devil's advocate for a moment. Those marks could have easily been from handcuffs from their arrest because they were malnourished and frail and, you know, you bruise easily, you mark easily. So until it's confirmed, I can't make the judgment just yet, but I do want to share that there were in fact marks and some people allege that it's because he was the one orchestrating this, executing this, and forcing this to happen. Insurance isn't one size fits all and shopping for it shouldn't feel like squeezing into something that just doesn't fit. That's why drivers, have enjoyed Progressive's Name Your Price tool for years. Enough hunting for discounts, trying to calculate rates, and tinkering with coverages. Maybe you're picking out your very first policy or maybe you're just looking for something that works better for you and your family. Progressive Casualty Insurance Company & Affiliates. Price and coverage match limited by state law. Go like you mean it. Toyota. Let's go places. Now between the national attention that this case has received from the media and from the family social media interactions, it should come down to the fact that it's not just about the car. It should come as absolutely no surprise that this case has spiraled out of control. There are so many people talking about it online. Anytime there's a case, too, with limited information, people go into overdrive with speculation and theorizing and discussion and, you know, public discourse. And so there is just like a tsunami of internet chatter, okay? There are multiple Facebook discussion pages. There are Reddit forums. There are hundreds of rabbit holes to jump into. So with that, I wanted to talk about some of the very hot topics that I keep coming across on these platforms and break them down for you. Because these are more theory-driven. Nothing has been proven at the time of this recording from law enforcement. But I want to share with you what people are saying and allow you to do your own research, form your own opinions, and decide what you believe is true. Some people are suggesting that Elizabeth and Gary Jr. are not the biological parents of all 16 children. Many people believe that some of the older kids may have given birth to some of the younger children. And this is based on four different factors. One, the police have not confirmed that all of the children biologically belong to Gary Jr. and Elizabeth. Number two, DNA testing is being conducted on all of the children. Number three, there is a significant lack of government records for the children. And number four, the four sets of back-to-back twins. Now, I'm not saying that it's impossible for women to conceive four sets of twins in that short amount of time and to do so naturally. But it would be very difficult for a woman's body to sustain those pregnancies and then recover properly. So with that, a lot of people believe that the twins are basically all to help cover up the births of other children. However, authorities have not confirmed that the children were sexually assaulted, that they are the result of incest or anything like that, unless you argue the incest of Gary Jr. and Elizabeth being distant cousins, whatever, you know, if that ends up being true. They're not saying that this is the result of any sort of incestual assault. It's all alleged right now. But it does beg the question, could it be true? And also begs the question, is that the motivation? For why there are so many births back-to-back? Why children continue being born? If Gary Jr. is the frontrunner of all of this and the dictator of all of this, is it because he has sick perversions, given the indecent exposure charge? How dirty and deep does this truly go? There's also another theory that I want to touch on really quickly, and it is a vegetable oil theory. And buckle up, because it is very disturbing. Now, this theory stems from a theory that I've been studying for a long time. It stems from an interview with Ariel Gutierrez, who works at a local Dollar General store in the area. She had interacted with this family very often, including the night before their arrest. According to Ariel, the family would come into the store just before closing almost every night. And it was usually Elizabeth or Gary Jr. with one or two of the smallest children. And when they were in the Dollar General, they'd keep these kids as close to them as possible. She went on to say that when they came in, the kids would appear to have their, their hair in front of their faces, almost blocking their eyes and so that they couldn't see the face, like fully through their hair. She also said that the stench of these children and of the adult as well would fill up the store, prompting employees to give them free hygiene products so that they could address this issue, which she said it seems like they never even used these products. But I mean, imagine that for a moment. You're an employee. This family just continuously is coming in night after night, very unhygienic, horrific odor, so much so that you're grabbing hygiene products and giving them to this family for free, shampoo, soap, whatever. But then they come in the following night, clearly have not used these products, but once again are buying vegetable oil. Because what really seemed to catch her attention was that all they did every single time they came in here, night after night, was buy the same products. Water, vegetable oil, and sugar. Now what caught people's attention was that, the vegetable oil in all of this seemed to be the focus. Because it seems like a very odd thing to purchase so often, so frequently, considering that these kids were malnourished. But that's where this theory turns very dark. Because some people are assuming that they were actually feeding the younger children and the babies pure vegetable oil. All because vegetable oil is cheap, it's an ultra calorie dense food, and it's often been used in famines, as well. And so it's something to where you're not physically starving them, I mean you are technically, yes, starving them, but like you're giving them some sort of sustenance, but it's just vegetable oil because it has so many calories and it'll fill you up faster because of its consistency. Do I think that is true or not? I don't know. But my gut tells me there probably is some validity to it because we know they were kept in a room, we know that the conditions were hell, it's not like they were whipping up, SpaghettiOs in the kitchen for these children and to be buying a product so frequently back to back, what else would you be using it for? You're not cooking in the kitchen. You're not frying chicken. I don't know if that's what you use vegetable oil for. You can obviously tell I do not cook. But what else would it be for? You're not bathing with vegetable oil. And maybe I'm completely dense and I don't know. So please sound off in the comments if you know what it could be used for other than this. But based on what we know and the conditions they were found in the house itself, like what else realistically could they have been using that for so frequently? There's also a lot of talk about black mold poisoning, okay? Many people believe that the house has black mold and that that would explain why Gary Sr. and Christina have not been in the best of health. Black mold poisoning can be very similar to black mold poisoning. Black mold poisoning can be very similar to dementia, the onset, the symptoms of it, because it causes brain fog, sudden mood swings, depression, anxiety, insomnia, chronic fatigue, and headaches. Now, while others believe that when Gary Jr. and Elizabeth moved into the home about a year ago, even though the whole family moved in four years ago, or not the whole family, but the older people, and there's mixed reports, okay? Some say that it was just Gary Sr. and Christina who moved in four years ago, and that's not true. and Christina who moved in four years ago, and that Gary Jr. and Elizabeth with their children moved in one year ago, but then there's other reports saying that. they all moved in four years ago. So it's still a little bit muddy with that. But so my point is that while some believe that they moved into the home about a year ago, they say that for the most part, Christina is the one who took care of the kids. So then once her health declined, things spiraled out of control. Which I mean, with 20 people confined in one bedroom and one bathroom in this type of house, or in a one bedroom, one bathroom style house, I should say, things of course could deteriorate very quickly. It would not take much effort for things to go downhill. However, personally, I'm not entirely sold on the black mold theory, because I don't see how everybody could be suffering in that house, except for Gary Jr. And that he's the one who has no symptoms. He's fine. He's okay, whatever. And as far as Christina, I mean, it is possible that she was helping with the kids. But again, it's just speculative. There's nothing confirming it. Everything that we continue to learn about this case, and everything that I have seen through my research, this is only getting darker and more disturbing. Not only the discovery itself, which that is haunting, that is horrific in and of itself, even if that were just, you know, it, cut and dry. But learning about potential familial crossover in their lineage, incestual relations, and giving birth to children. The horrific and deplorable conditions of that 12 by 12 room, the vegetable oil theory, the fact that Elizabeth may or may not have given birth to all of these children and had been pregnant for 20 years. It's my opinion, she is a victim herself. Truly, I believe that. Because she first got with Gary Jr. when she was, what, 12 or 13 years old, then got pregnant around 15. Or got pregnant and then got married at 15. Way too young to consent. Way too young to be adulting. And the fact that she had threatened to run away, and so her parents felt that they had no other choice but to emancipate her so that they wouldn't lose her, and let her marry Gary, that makes me wonder, was there some type of grooming going on with Gary, who was a few years older than Elizabeth? And something, her being so young and so impressionable to where, you know, she felt as a young girl, she had to keep going back to him. She had to run away to be with him. And because he had some sort of heavy influence on her. And this is not proven. This is just where my mind goes. Because when I break it down in my mind, knowing that she was so young, that she kept going back to Gary, that she married him, started having children with him, and from that point on, all these back-to-back deliveries happened, whether they all belonged to her or whether some were from her own children. I think she is absolutely without a doubt a victim in this situation. Do I think she's not responsible? Absolutely not. Let me, like, she is 1,000% responsible. Even if she has developmental delays herself, and it's this lifelong situation of grooming and Stockholm Syndrome, or whatever elements you want to argue, she should have done something to protect her children. So I think that she needs to face the music with all of that. But I also think that two things can be true at the same time. I think that the villain in this story, and I think that she can also be the victim in this story. And I don't think that there is a world in which a 13-year-old is potentially groomed by an older person, which she wasn't technically an adult, so I want to be careful with my language, but potentially heavily influenced, and then impregnated shortly after, and has all of these back-to-back pregnancies, and health issues, and things like that, and isolation from her family, and living in these situations. I don't think there's a world in which you can't say that that person is a victim. But we also are going to be receiving a lot more information in the coming weeks, maybe even coming days, depending on what has been released since I am recording this episode. And once we have more of that information, of course, not only will it paint a much clearer picture, but I think we're this is only the tip of the iceberg of something very deeply disturbing. That's just what my gut tells me. In my time, I've covered multiple House of Horror-style cases, especially when there are so many children involved, and so many births involved. And it's never, and I don't want to say as simple as it seems, but it's never just the surface-level information. It always goes deeper. And I'm sure it's going to be very upsetting what we find out when we find out. Now, before I go, there are a couple of updates that I want to give you before I sign off, because as I mentioned, this case is moving incredibly quickly. There are new updates coming out every single day. And sure enough, after I recorded this episode, even more updates came out. So I'm recording this pickup to drop in just because I really want you to have the most up-to-date information as possible when this episode releases. But again, there will be lots of updates to come, so definitely expect a part two. But anyways, wanted to put these updates within this episode. So on Wednesday, July 8th, Gary Sr. was released from prison, and he was taken to a local hospital. This was after he had a medical emergency inside the prison. With this, the judge modified his bond and also ordered a competency evaluation to be conducted within 30 days by forensic psychologists. Which I think is very interesting, because if this dementia argument, I'm just going to call it that, it has any validity to it, surely they will be able to address that through medical evaluations and even through a competency evaluation. So we will see what comes with that. On Wednesday, Elizabeth's attorney also filed a motion asking the court to lower her bond, arguing that the current $300,000 amount is excessive and that it violates the Eighth Amendment's protection against excessive bail. According to the filing, Elizabeth is not considered a flight risk, she has no known criminal history, and he argued that there is nothing to indicate that she would refuse to cooperate with investigators or the court. In fact, he said that she's willing to comply with whatever conditions are required for her release, including wearing a GPS monitor, providing a stable address, checking in with a bond officer as often as the court orders. And he had also put in a quote there about the fact that her goal is to reunify with the kids, which she knows will not happen unless she goes through the appropriate channels with the court. She said, So he said, you know, she's highly motivated to cooperate and comply with any of their demands because her goal is to reunify with the children. Now, here's what's interesting. Rather than asking for a traditional cash bond, he requested that she be released on a recognizance bond, but still having those conditions attached. He also pointed to what he described as the family's extreme financial hardship, arguing that investigators themselves documented this home as being in extreme poverty. Direct quote. Not my words, his. And he said that because of that, he said the court is well aware that posting a $300,000 bond is simply isn't a realistic possibility for her, which I understand like the Eighth Amendment excessive bond, but also usually we do see a very high amount in bond, right? Because if it were easy, everybody would bond out and then there would be lots of dangers to society lurking around. There would be witness intimidation. There would be people taking their own lives. I'm looking at you, Fotis Doulos. So I understand that they can't afford the $300,000, which you usually post 10%, but still even $30,000. But that's kind of the point in all of that. Not only to protect all the victims involved and protect the investigation and the forthcoming trial and all of that, but also because of the actions and the severity of the actions. But I understand it. He's doing what attorneys do. He also wrote that based on his conversations with Elizabeth, as I mentioned, her primary goal is to be reunited with her children. And again, as he put it, she understands that any chance of reunification would be impossible if she failed to appear in court. He also said, and I thought this was very interesting because we've been talking a lot about the kids, about the lineage, about who is the parent of who, and he said that he believes that Elizabeth is the biological mother of all 16 children. What's interesting though, is that a source that we were able to obtain, has obtained birth records for four of the 16 children, including the youngest and also the oldest. And those records do in fact list Elizabeth as the mother and Gary Jr. as the father. That being said, I certainly definitively can't speak to the parentage of the remaining children because those records have not been independent. No, hold on. That being said, I can't definitively say whether or not all of the children belong to Elizabeth and Gary Jr. I'm not sure. This is the only thing that we've been able to confirm. And again, that is birth certificates. It's what you write down. It's not DNA testing, but I haven't been able to confirm anything regarding the remaining children because those records have not been independently confirmed yet. But even so, I know there's rumors, as I mentioned, about some of these children being the product of other children. If they all do belong to Elizabeth, I already talked about how I believe she's a victim and was groomed. And it's almost like she was just there for breeding, just constantly back, to back. And maybe that's for Gary Jr.'s own sick perversions. maybe that's because neither one of them had completed an education level beyond the ninth grade and there seemed to be some developmental issues as well in addition to that maybe it's because they did get entangled at such a young age well not him but her like i think there's a lot of things but i think she still is a victim in this and two things can be true i think she's also a perpetrator but it seems to me that if all of these children do in fact belong to her and they carry her dna and his dna she i think was just yeah a breeder in his eyes which is incredibly sad there also is another rumor going around right now that i just want to mention but i haven't been able to confirm it but the rumor is that elizabeth is pregnant again currently right now however it is just a rumor at this point it has not been confirmed her attorney hasn't confirmed it but i at least wanted to mention it because if you have been following this case chances are that you probably saw this floating around out there so i know that what we talked about today it's a lot and it's really horrific it's heavy and it is incredibly dark topics regarding this case so i'm sorry and i want to thank you for listening but i also do want to end it on a bit more of a positive note since then since this the arrest since the rescue all of the things it looks like all 16 kids are set to make a full recovery yes they will have a long road ahead of them as far as rehabilitation and therapy but the community has completely rallied behind them just like they did the turpin girls and a whole turpin family as a matter of fact but i say turpin girls because a lot of them have been outspoken but in moments like this when they can't lean on their own family all you can really lean on are state resources federal resources or community and look i fucking hate to say it but state resources and federal resources are not the same as state resources and federal resources sometimes only go so far and they take it takes forever and jumping through so many hoops to even obtain those resources so community is really what it boils down to and luckily the community has really rallied behind them state social workers said that they have received calls from over 60 people in the area who are offering donations and who are offering to help with long-term care and i think that that is incredible so i will certainly keep you posted on this case if you're not subscribed on youtube really quickly press the subscribe button if you are not following on the podcast hit the little button in the top corner make sure you're following because as soon as we have more information which i'm continuing to dig on the back end with my team and we have filed a lot of documentation so that should be coming in any day now but once we have that new information i will certainly be doing a follow-up episode with you this is something that i know hits close to home for a lot of you listening and watching and like i said at the top of this episode i get your requests i see you in the next episode and i'll see you in the next episode i hear you but for me i find it more beneficial when i can scrape through all the information and kind of tune out the noise and give you everything at once rather than jumping on immediately and being like okay let's figure this out together as we go let's look here and like do a bunch of piecemeal things so that's why i waited a few days longer than i i know ideally many of you wish you know this episode came out so that is what i've got for you today i know it was tough but thank you please keep all of these children safe and healthy and i'll see you in the next in your thoughts and prayers and let me know in the comment section the q a section on spotify and the review section on apple what you make of this and what you think the truth is again i am annie elise thank you so much for tuning in and until the next one be nice 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