NBA Eastern Conference Win Totals REACTION - STUNNING Over/Unders For 2026-27

This episode is brought to you by Google Chrome. You think you know a browser, but Gemini and Chrome, that's new. It can help you with practically anything on the web, like restoring a vintage motorcycle from a 50-page restoration block, or finally break down that long article you've had open for weeks. Gemini and Chrome is here for it. Ready to make anything online make sense? There's no place like Chrome. Check responses, setup required, compatibility and availability varies 18 plus. Hello and welcome to the Hoop Collective podcast. We talk about the NBA, which we're doing on Sunday evening. We're all back in the United States. We all had the time zones figured out and the correct days. Joining us from, I think you're in New York. I'm not sure. I am actually in New York right now. But joining me from across the river, I believe, is Vince Goodwill. What up though, Wendy? What up though, McMahon? Yes, I am back from Atlanta. Joining us from Dallas, Texas. Where it's Cowboys time. Thank God. It's Ban McMahon. Howdy, partners. Welcome back to this side of the pond, Wendy. By the way, early season, Texas, or Ohio State at Texas, I should say. We might need a little wager on that one. We can discuss. I don't know. I'm going to watch the first week. Last year they played in the first game and both teams were, both coaches were petrified of their quarterbacks and they wouldn't throw the ball more than four yards downfield. So I think it'll be a little bit different game this year. I watched that from a sports bar in Tamarindo, Costa Rica. I enjoyed the experience that day with the exception of that game. I enjoyed it a lot. How did Ohio State do against Michigan last year, Vince? I can't remember. I have no clue. I just remember Michigan's won four of the last five games, but go ahead. That's true. That's true. All right. So speaking of wins is now, the time has now come for us to talk about the Eastern Conference Over-Unders. We did the Western Conference at the end of last week. When I arrived at JFK, I had a very nice customs agent, Edgar. Shout out to Edgar, who's a Knicks fan. He was talking to me about the Knicks. Very worried about Carl Towns' contract. Very, very grounded Knicks fan. Very happy about their win, still basking in the glory, but worried about losing Mitch Robinson, worried about Carl Towns' contract. I liked it. It was a very. No, I mean, first off, I'm trying to get through the border. So, you know, I'm being very, you know, I'm being very, you know, very engaging, you know. But a very grounded Knicks fan, and I think reasonable. Hold on. That's a long conversation. Was this during a cavity search? What was going on? It was, you know, I will say that the, you know, the speed of global entry was a little bit negated by the conversation. But I'm always, I was waiting for my bags anyway, and I'm always happy. I'm always happy to befriend and, you know, you know, show respect to our frontline responders. It's also nice for you to have a pleasant conversation with Knicks fans instead of having to duck and dodge. Listen, if you're not, if you're in a bad mood as a Knicks fan right now, I don't know what to tell you. Exactly. So I will say this, you know, if you recall in the Western Conference, the Thunders over-under was 60 and a half. The Spurs was 59 and a half. And then 50. And then nobody else had over 50. That is not the case in the Eastern Conference, where 10 teams are separated by basically 10 games. Four teams over 50. Yes. And before I say anything, Vince, before I toss you the Knicks here, let me just say that we can debate about what the actual number is, but every team last year that was non-tanking, had their wins inflated by the tankers. You know, so we, you know, like I said, we could spend hours debating whether the, you know, the Thunder should have had 58 wins or 64 wins or whatever. But all of these numbers coming off last year were artificially inflated. And so I would just say that I would use that reality to guide you, not just you fine gentlemen, but as anybody thinks about this upcoming season, certainly the playoffs were the playoffs. But remember last year that it was a sideways year when it comes to the wins. Okay. The New York Knicks are picked to have the most wins in the Eastern Conference by DraftKings. As a reminder, Thunder 60 and a half, Spurs 59 and a half. New York Knicks, Vince Goodwill, 53 and a half. Over, under, what say you? I think they won 53 last year. Plus 16. Plus 16. The 16 is what matters. The 16 was more impressive. Far more impressive. It's a tricky thing, guys, because usually for me, when you win a championship, there's either the championship malaise or there's this sort of championship arrogance that comes in where you can pick up, you know, five or 10 wins that maybe you don't get otherwise just because you're arrogant as hell and you win the game before the game even begins. That level of thing, like you saw it, I want to say with the second, with the third year to Miami, the LeBron Miami Heat, not saying that this is the super team of that, but once you get the validation of winning the championship and you know how you're going to play and everything sort of. 27 game win streak or 28, whatever it was. Yeah, yeah. And they won like 66 games. I've seen teams in that second year, like everything, just sort of clicks, right? But you're right that they were a third seed going into the playoffs. And I think that was a reason why some people weren't as bullish as maybe we should have been as evidenced by the playoffs. But 53 and can't beat up on Indiana this year, but you can beat up on Milwaukee. You'll probably still beat up on the Brooklands and Chicago's, right? I'm going to take the over because I just because I think 55 or 56 will win the Eastern Conference. It's not 53, 54. Well, I gave that whole speech, McMahon, and he just slapped it right away. I hear you. Now, let me remind you, though, their regular season last year was a roller coaster. Yes, it was. There was a steep drop. Like, what was it, Denny? Was it late January, February when they had a miserable stretch? And I thought 2-9 or something like that. I thought they were just completely unraveling at the time. And obviously, they got it together. You know, you talk about the potential for a championship hangover. Obviously, there's a different kind of target on a team when they come into your building as the defending champs. I do think this is a veteran team. You know, Brunson is definitely a very mature leader. I don't think they're going to get frazzled, you know, too caught up in the hype. I share Cavity Searching Edgar's concern to a certain degree about Katz. If Katz not. If Katz not extend to going into the season, you know, there's some uncertainty there. I share that concern to a certain degree. Well, I'm not concerned about this season with Katz. You know, I'm concerned that if Katz doesn't extend, it's obviously a problem because he's going to be a free agent. And if he does extend and it's for a number that's, you know, basically it's the max, like, I think savvy Knicks fans know that Katz extends to a certain degree. If Katz doesn't extend for the max, could, could be the beginning move of this team not being able to keep its core together. Not for sure, but could. And so I think that's. I don't think the concern is on the 26th, 27th season. Yeah, but we have seen cases of guys where they don't get an extension. They feel unappreciated and that causes issues. I think Katz is in a really good place, obviously, professionally, personally, and by the way, congrats to Katz, one of a few Eastern Conference stars who've gotten married in the, you know, recent, for him, recent days, but recent weeks. Congrats to Donovan Mitchell, Tyrese Halliburton as well. And then there's a loss of Mitch Robinson, bringing in Andre Drummond. You know, that's a, that is a downgrade. Having said all that, I'm going to take over on 53 and a half. I think this team's, you know, somewhere in the 55, 56 point range. It feels like they want you to take the over with this number, doesn't it? It feels like they want you to. Now, the one thing I'll say about the Knicks last year, Brunson, they were very healthy. Yes. Brunson played 74 games and I haven't done the research, but I'm sure some of the games he sat out were for rest. And I know that he had, you know, played through some things. He had the off season, um, hand surgery. Yeah, wrist surgery. OG and Anobi played 67 games, which is, well, I'm going to take a look and see where he was. He played 74 the year before, so he's two, two pretty good years in a row. Carl Towns played 75 games. Josh Hart, who had back and finger issues during the year, played 66 games. Jordan Clark, I mean, you know. Listen, they do have one of the best medical staffs, if not the best medical staff in the league. I didn't even mention Mikael Bridges because you know he played all 82. I mean, he played 82. But there's all the stuff about Casey Smith leaving Dallas and then they immediately win the NBA Trainers Association's, you know, whenever the official word you know trained staff for the year award like so they've got a good chance to have a healthy team because they've got a really strong medical team in place yeah um i mean even mitchell robinson he played 60 games but a lot of the games that he skipped events were precautionary to protect his feet mitch mitch and they were and they were controlling the minutes too you know what i mean right mitch had a healthy year so i'm just saying that um the knicks had a very healthy season last year is that an under that i hear um yeah i'm just what i'm saying is like i i think all teams wins were inflated last year and they had a very healthy year i need to hear one word or the other over he's given the case i don't need headlines you in uh in my life in no in august i just don't need that um you're gonna have to go under on some teams i i'm i'm not betting it i'm not betting it anyway we're not allowed but uh of course i would stay away from this one um holy fence rider did you order the cold red like it's one of the other colonels because here's the thing because if i say it it'll get aggregated but real talk you real talk i think you should probably go under other regions splinters in in other regions i i honestly could go under on every i think it would be a market efficiency to go under on every team and you know all the teams with winning records that's an interesting betting strategy because i just think that last year was so wonked with uh um so that's an under i would lean under there we go benny we had to squeeze and come on come on wendy be a man of your convictions again do i have to play bontemps here and say come on when you're already done it's not a commentary on the next team it's a commentary on the situation all right we get it stop waffling all right mcmahon the second highest win total here a little surprise at this one boston celtics 51 and a half ahead of the 76ers ahead of the pistons ahead of the calves uh ahead of the heat yannis atenecumpo's heat ahead of the pacers and so they were boston celtics 51 and a half they were a 56 win team last year despite jason tatum missing most of the season and then having to ramp back up when he returned with what like about a third of the season left now basically look we're gonna find out whether the nerds are right about jaylen brown's impact or not if they're over the nerds are right if they're under then clearly the spreadsheets don't know what the hell they're talking about so i i just think though that tatum is obviously a you know top whatever you want to say five ten player in the league they've got they still got some you know some pieces around him some depth they've got a system of play that lends itself to a lot of regular season wins now you know it's it's broken down in the playoffs in in the last couple of years but i take over just because i think you know a joe mazzola team with this kind of talent is going to win 50 some odd games and i'm i'm betting it's 53 or more or i guess i'm betting 52 or more why you guys just going over right out of the gate all right vince all contraire corn fritter because i'm not going over i think they will miss jaylen brown a little bit more in the regular season just because the pac-man effect eats up usage eats up games eats up minutes like both ends of the floor i think they're going to miss him and there's an element of toughness that in talking to people around the league that when they said they feared the celtics they were saying they feared the toughness of a guy like jaylen brown more than more than the all-around skill set and everything it was just the element of toughness i'm curious a how healthy is paul george going to be next season this man is old like you know you hit the suspension and everything else and he got to sit for 25 games we're not counting that playing having an effect this year but we are talking about a player who does not regularly attend basketball games in uniform and as you get older yeah you're hoping for 55 games out of him if we're being real yeah that's that's what i'm saying it's a lot of things to me have to go right and you're also asking jason tatum to be the not just number one one a but especially with paul george being this attendance concern jason tatum is going to be over indexed a lot of nights to have to be the number one and number two option what about the little fella payton pritchard that's fine i'm with you i'm with you like that's he's a he's he is a legitimate nba starting level player who has performed really really well uh and he's going to be the number one and number two option certainly over my expectations of him derrick white is his three-point shot going to come back this year i know defensively and everything else how he grades how he rates i just have a lot i just have more questions than answers about the celtics and although i think that you know the joe missoula system kind of breaks down in the playoffs it does work in a regular season but i will probably put them in a 50 win range not 52 so i'm going to take slightly slightly under let me take you back the last 10 years of the celtics 56 wins 61 win this is going backwards say 56 last year 56 61 64 57 51 in the in the second covid year the shortened season they were 36 and 36 that was obviously a down year 48 49 um the 48 win was in a covid shortened year 48 49 55 53 48 the celtics win and you are right vince there's no way to predict what paul george is going to do like he actually shot the hell out of the ball in the playoffs last year if you remember he shot almost 50 on threes when he came back from the suspension he had that like three or so weeks he played looked really good but that doesn't mean anything i have no idea how he's gonna how he's gonna hold up um but the celtics i and i don't think it's an it's an it's an anti they're not like trying to prove jalen wrong or anything i think they want to just prove everybody wrong like one of the things that you you know when you have a team that's had a lot of success one of the things that you try to do is you want to get them coming into a season with i mean coaches of successful teams sit around and plot and think and come up with reasons to energize their team i think the celtics will be energized um and i'm going to almost say that the celtics entered being energized would negate the bump that they got um from you know having the uh the tankers last year the real question comes down to why they just are they good enough hey here's a whiz of the quiz too r.i.p uswb whiz of the quiz which coaches in nba history have a higher winning percentage than joe mazzola i think it's nobody ding ding ding so i am actually after after my speeches i think i'm going to go over there you go wait so i have a question i have a follow-up question can i address uh mr mcmahon can i address wendy as a hostile witness absolutely i'll enjoy the judge is he the judge he's the judge in this so brian winhorse brian keith winhorse even though i'm not sure that's your middle name it just sounds like thomas there we go brian thomas winhorse you're not willing to go over or under on the new york knicks you are willing to go over on the boston celtics are you willing to say that the boston celtics are going to be the top seed in the eastern conference after the regular season i i i see what you're trying to do you're trying to move me into that uh no i'm not willing to say that but i do think that the celtics i think the the knicks could be primed for not having as good of a regular season i'm with you i think the celtics for various reasons are primed to have a good regular season okay um but i admit that paul george is if paul george shoots 42 on threes which is what he shot after he came back last year from the suspension and fills that three and d roll you know probably taking seven plus threes a game yeah if that's what that guy does i'm ready to go i have no way to predict that i don't i don't have a um i do not have like a conviction on it i just think i'm with you my only problem with that thought is paul george being suspended for 25 games meant he got to rest his body and was able to agree fresher and they're going to ask a lot more of him in boston than they did in philadelphia last year i'm just saying like if you said to me like look part of what i'm i'm pricing in with the knicks is i think they just just for law of averages i think they probably won't be as healthy right right right and uh and i think boston you know might be healthier tatum will play more games hopefully so you know yeah boston with paul george coming in might be healthier good bet i know it's it's it's i agree i you guys are right you can pick me up apart on it you're right it's not it's not the soundest argument i'll give it to you more hoop collective podcast after this this episode is brought to you by google chrome you think you know a browser but gemini and chrome that's new it can help you with practically anything on the web like restoring a vintage motorcycle from a 50 page restoration blog or finally break down that long article you've had open for weeks gemini and chrome is here for ready to make anything online make sense there's no place like chrome check responses set up required compatibility and availability varies 18 plus this message is brought to you by apple card shave ice by the beach a trip to the state fair and a throwback flick at the local drive-in they're more than just items to check off the summer bucket list there are also opportunities to earn two percent daily cash back when you use your apple card with apple pay apply for apple card now and use in minutes with apple pay apple pay subject to credit approval apple card is issued by goldman sex bank usa salt lake city branch terms and more at applecard.com i get so many headaches every month it could be chronic migraine 15 or more headache days a month each lasting four hours or more botox autobotulinum toxin a prevents headaches in adults with chronic migraine it's not for those who have 14 or fewer headache days a month prescription botox is injected by your doctor effects of botox may spread hours to weeks after injection causing serious symptoms alert your doctor right away as difficulty swallowing speaking breathing eye problems or muscle weakness can be signs of a life-threatening condition patients with these conditions before injection are at highest risk side effects may include allergic reactions neck and injection site pain fatigue and headache allergic reactions can include rash welts asthma symptoms and dizziness don't receive botox if there's a skin infection tell your doctor your medical history muscle or nerve conditions including als lou gehrig's disease myasthenia gravis or lambert eaton syndrome and medications including botulinum toxins as these may increase the risk of serious side effects why wait ask your doctor visit botox chronic migraine.com or call 1-800-44-BOTOX to learn more 76ers with the third tied with the pistons 50 and a half we'll start with the 76ers uh go ahead vince you guys i suspect you'll be uh in the bond temps uh laying on i-95 a few times in the future i'm not sure if you're going to be able to do that i'm not sure if you're what are we doing here i can't believe it what are we doing yeah that's that's me the acela bond temps used to drive down in the morning and back at night so that's the standard here for you can i tell you a story about bond temps what's that let's let's hear this i don't know if i've ever told this bond temps you know he he just you know he talks on the phone a lot and he gets animated on the phone um he one time was driving to philadelphia uh to go cover a uh um a um 76ers game and he got like real animated on the phone and his um his wallet was on the dashboard for some reason and his window was open and while he was crossing the benjamin franklin bridge he knocked his wallet i mean he said the wind blew it i how could the wind blow it his wallet went off the dashboard out the window and over the benjamin franklin bridge into the school you kill river i don't know if i'm saying why why do you put the wallet on the dashboard of all probably because he had to pay a toll or something his wallet there's like a little the little console the middle section he lost a wallet i never told the story because they don't want to embarrass him but i don't care anymore screw him he's gone now fair game now he so if you make it animated when they're driving with their hands i don't actually i don't even know if that he said though he said the wind blew it what am i supposed to say well i can't prove it well i'm just telling you about how little he was paid so that makes sense as well is that vince if you make it through the season and you don't have your wallet go into the river you'll be ahead of bond temps well uh 50 and a half over under um well for one it would just be my luck that i would knock my wallet out of my car and the next thing you hear is take the train take be safe take the train that ain't gonna work out well hey officer funny thing that happened my wallet and the id was on the dashboard i knocked it out of the car into the water it's somewhere down there but i guarantee you i am who i say i am i'll be calling by the way i am prepared at this time to announce a bounty of 100 for any bond temps wallet paraphernalia that washes up on the street you find it on the shores of the river and let us know i will i will buy it from you for 100 what about credit cards i might pay a little bit more wow i think he canceled them but i mean that by the way that is like a genuine disaster like your wallet goes out the window okay this is a disaster whether you're anything and it happens while you're on the benjamin franklin bridge and it goes over the side correct over under on the sixers vinny yeah my question my only question guys is how many games are lebron james and joel and bead going to play and play together that's the tougher over under and be probably 40 ish based on his recent history and then lebron he played he's played 57 the last two years if i remember correctly and lebron i want to say played 51 i'm not gonna say 60 last year i'm sorry i'm gonna say 51 he played 51 a couple years somewhere whatever it was but maxi and edge come are going to play and jaylen brown is going to play like short of some type of injury they're all going to play and bead and lebron i think you look at those two guys at least for me i look at philly like i look at the knicks where they probably using wendy's thing about those guys being healthy you just want to be healthy by april 15th so i wonder how much they're going to say let's get ourselves right by march 1st let's make sure that we're somewhere in the hunt and then we can press the gas for the last six weeks of the regular season develop the continuity that we need and then go i'm not saying that they're going to just you know bs around with the regular season but i don't know how much the regular season has to matter to them if they're playing this long game of the playoffs that being said i can see them around 50 wins i can see them just saying let's just have home court in the first round let's not make the playoff role too difficult for us and let's make sure that we are as healthy as possible but if indeed isn't healthy as great as lebron's has shown himself to be as great as jaylen brown is i still think they need a lot of minutes and a lot of time to play with each other i think we saw that in the second round last year against the knicks like they didn't have the sweat equity together whether while the knicks had all the sweat equity and the first time that philly faced some adversity they were able to fold it i'm not saying this is going to happen with them i'm saying that that is the value of guys playing together i will put them somewhere around 50 wins like that might be the toughest over under i think of all of them guys for me because you just don't know how many games your two best players are going to play yeah well or i don't know is are they their two best players that's a that's a separate debate but there were 45 win team it did make two splashy upgrades one was a guy who was sixth in mbp voting one is you know still at the age of 41 a no question all-star caliber player and what is he a 23 time all-star i think and still playing at a not yeah i'm changing my mind i'm going over there you go you went over mcmahon mcmahon mcmahon just did it i'm going over well and but here's the thing i do think that it's going to take some time some minutes uh you know some weeks months for them to figure out fit and chemistry because they've got five guys in the starting lineup four who are proven you know all-stars all nba players i believe has maxie been all yeah max has been all nba and and then you know vgs was obviously like a an ascending star so they've got five guys in the starting lineup who want the ball and we've talked about the fit with them and they're not going to be able to play you know i mean 80 85 95 miles per hour and you know and be like the the uh highest speed limit in samoa wendy is 25 miles per hour that's indeed speed is that right yeah that's it's but what day is it uh right it's the same day it's six hours earlier than central time right now in american samoa and western samoa today uh ahead but uh so i just i think it's going to be a good day for them to play and i think it's going to be a good i'm going under because i think it's going to take them a while to figure out fit in chemistry and then as you mentioned how much is indeed in the lineup how much is lebron in the lineup that prolongs that and complicates things i'm going under and leaving open the possibility of them being a better team in the playoffs than they are in the regular season i'd look this up but i'm not really saying this is a defining stat i'm just gonna say in the last nine years you know how many times lebron's teams have gone over and over and over and over and over and over and over and 50 and a half last nine years that's interesting how many last nine so basically the lake the laker year in the last year in cleveland laker tenure in the last year in cleveland what once twice yeah once was once was 52 wow um now um you know the covet years they were shortened but even if you got the percentages so you know lebron hasn't been on powerhouse regular season teams for a while now again he's playing he's making the minimum he is not going to necessarily be the driving force night in and night out that he has been and i agree with your sentiment mcmahon wait they won 53 last year yeah he could go back farther okay that's interesting the second time wow um so uh well i'll just say that i think they can be an excellent team and very formidable and win 48 games because i think i think 48 wins in the eastern conference is going to be a great season this year so i'm going to go under uh i think i think it's just a safe because you don't know about mb you don't know about health and all the other stuff i think just safe to go under i think i think probably going under on the sixers has probably been a profitable uh position um frankly but um i don't i don't i don't say controversially i just think um you know and not only that like um lebron's teams when he's changed teams they've tended to get off to slower starts um when he went to miami they started nine and eight they obviously ended up fine but you know when they went back to cleveland they started 19 and 20 when he went to the lakers i mean again i don't want to make it sound like all of these are all equal because i know this is a different situation but you know once the lakers they missed the playoffs the first year so you know learning to play with lebron takes a while so i mean but is this a different lebron i mean of course it's a different lebron it's a different lebron i mean it's a different league it's a different league it's a different league it's a different league of course of course and i mean i mean i meant that like preaching to the choir i wonder if the nick nurse plan what the nick nurse plan is going to be for four guys who need the ball all the time and maybe not trying to make this a lebron centric offense just to sort of keep him fresh like with all those other places that you mentioned lebron was the guy or at least in the first year of miami he and he and duane were going one one a sort of that uneasy alliance you know for the first year i wonder if this is where maxi and jalen brown and edge come as the rising star like they take the they take the lion's share of usage while lebron revs it up you know what i mean and gets himself right and i'm sure that like you know first off nick nurse is a problem solver coach and even if he does even if whatever the plan they come into the season with doesn't work like like the players on the team and him as a coach can retrofit it midway through and still be very formidable i don't i don't doubt that i just think the the the variables that are out there leads me to believe that they may not rack up a ton of wins lebron clearly didn't love being distant third in the lakers pecking order uh when that was clearly established however he was awesome in that role like the efficiency of the game he was awesome in that role he was awesome in that role efficiency was through the roof yeah they had 53 wins yeah so it was it was the most wins he'd ever had in the regular season as a laker now the there's some wonkiness with the the covid year they probably they probably would have done it in the covid year but um all right uh pistons last season vince were um number one seed in the east with 60 wins the folks at draft kings are like nope you're gonna have 10 wins less well i'm going to see to mcmahon because i went first on no no oh actually i was going to see to you here because you are detroit native yes i am vinnie goodwill and so you know that like i've got my take but i i just you you know this team as a guy who's been around them on a regular basis for a while for the whole you know especially like the whole rebuild and rise that they've had so i want to hear your your informed take here well to expect them to win 60 games next year i think they're going to be the team because they not that they they feasted on everybody last year like they had one of the best records against winning teams last year as well as one of the best records against losing teams you're not going to just feast on the bad teams on your way to 60 as much as it looks like but i wonder about the same questions that everybody else has like last year was so much more continuity like you had you had a lot of people that were like you had a lot of people that were like you and thompson and stewart back and tobias harris as a second option coming back from that that first year and they were banking on a lot of internal growth this year there's been the changes with no more tobias harris and john collins who's a more athletic player but maybe not as stable of just dump it down get them you know get you two or three buckets in a row like that sort of thing i wonder if they're going to take it's going to take them a minute to figure out some stuff as well as the shooting like i want to see if isaiah joe is enough for them because i don't know if kevin herder if that was an overpay to bring him back at nine million dollars a year when you looked at the market of some of the guys who performed better uh than kevin herder but went for less like that's a gamble that they're taking i don't know if the jalen duran thing is going to have some hurt feelings whenever he decides to sign or however that thing shakes itself out and i don't know if that's going to happen but i don't know if that's going to happen but i don't know if that's going to happen but i don't know if that's going to happen i don't know if that's going to happen but i don't know if that's going to happen but i don't know if that's going to happen uh but i do think they'll win at least 51 52 games like they play hellacious defense they play really good regular season basketball defense asar thompson to me is the best defender outside of victor women yama in the nba they're still going to be built the same way the celtics are built to win games because of their system i think detroit is going to be built to win games because of how they play and because kate cunningham is an mvp candidate and going to be consistently an mvp candidate as he's going to start entering his prime so i'm going to go over but i don't think they're getting anywhere close to 60 yeah i'm going over just because 10 wins is a pretty steep drop um you know you didn't mention the departure of beef stew they're obviously betting the b-ball paul reed can be a high quality backup big man the but the biggest question i've got about the pistons is like what's gonna be the lingering cloud when this whole jaylen duran situation gets finalized or at least temporarily settled like is he going to sign an extension like well i don't know but this has been a awfully nasty negotiation and so i've got real concerns there because i understand they believe asar thompson is their second best player but like jaylen durham was an all nba player for him last year uh he was a massive factor and then winning 60 games you can certainly criticize the playoff performance but he was a massive factor and then winning 60 games and you know i i don't know him i like i don't really have a great feel for kind of his his temperament or anything like that but sometimes these negotiations when they're ugly like this can have consequences yeah long lasting and i think and i'm not trying to you know i mean there's certain things that a player does not have to hear when the messaging comes back about why you're not getting what you believe to be your value and those are perhaps conversations that are going to have to be had to clear the air whenever he signs his deal like i don't know if he's going to take the qualifying off it's very rarely someone passes up a hundred and eighty million dollars guaranteed to take nine on the on the on the thought that i'm going to go and get from insert team here like sometimes you sometimes what would a player like that he hears well boston was going to offer me this and sacramento was going to offer me this and team x is going to offer me close to you know over 200 million dollars if we were to work out a sign and trade and then they get that and then they get that and then they get that and then they get that in their head and they can't get it out and i'm very curious for a guy who's still very young who felt like he'd done enough in the regular season to warrant getting quote-unquote his money how that's going to play moving forward he's a professional he shows up he works hard all that stuff like nobody takes any of that away from him i just wonder where human nature comes in after a certain point where your feelings are hurt yeah i want to back up real quick because i forgot to say something about 76 i realize that we're in the dead of the offseason here and like you know people just sort of sometimes invent stuff um the the angst that existed over the 76 year schedule was laughable to me i don't really those angst there was angst yeah because they had the fewest back-to-back games and the fewest three games and four nights and and this is my favorite one no games against the Western Conference for the first 18 games. Do they have to play 30 games against the West? Or did they, I mean, first off, a lot of people think the East is better this year anyway. They're like, oh, they came from no games, no Western Conference games till the 18th game. What a huge advantage. I mean, the low number of back-to-backs and three and four, I did look at that as kind of a LeBron slash and beat from the schedule. But also, the teams that have all these national games. What, do they have one fewer back-to-back than somebody else? Yeah, it's not a huge difference. Also, though, the teams that have a ton of national games, the league is trying to protect those national games. So, like, the higher-profile teams are going to have better schedules also. The teams that don't have many national games, it's because they're not good. Wendy, here's a suggestion. Stop listening to them. But also, the concept that Adam, it was Adam Silver, he was in there with the calendar out going, oh, yeah, let's, let's, yeah, yeah. Like, it was Adam Silver who did it. But, sorry, I digress. I'm going over on the Pistons. I think that they'll defend and they'll win and they've still got a lot going for them. And I agree that I don't know what's going to happen with Durin, but I don't think they're going to have a massive drop-off. I think they're still a very good team. They may be a flawed team, but I think they're still a very good team. This is one of the easier calls. Cleveland Cavaliers, Cavs corner. They won 64 games, two years ago, 50, what was they, 53, 54 last year? 52 last year. 52. And Vegas says 47 and a half, McMahon. Nope. Cavs corner. That's your block, buddy. You start this one. Well, the Cavs, the Cavs made a trade last week. They traded Dennis Schroeder, who's going to go play for his 12th team. And for Trey Mann. This was a financial, this was a financial trade, right? They, this was to free some, or it was to save some salary. Now, Wendy, why would they do that? Well, they're, they're obviously trying to clear space underneath the apron so that they can leave the possibility open of a sign and trade. Whether that sign and trade is Peyton Watson or Jonathan Kaminga. You guys know how I feel about Kaminga sign and trade. It's very hard for me to see the Hawks doing a sign and trade where they take back a player and go into the tax, help Jonathan coming out. But there's creativity, getting another team involved, et cetera, et cetera. Yes. So the Cavs definitely, the Cavs definitely are trying to get Peyton Watson. They're definitely trying to do it. And, and by the way, is it real quick aside? Are the Hornets trying to like recreate, create the German national team? I think they're just trying to get a creator. They drafted, they drafted the two German guys, Steinbach and Anderson, the two guys who play on the German national team. And then they just traded for Dennis Schroeder. Like, are they, is there some crazy maneuver there? The German national team, by the way, is the reigning world and European champions. It's not the strangest decision of all time, but potential future Hall of Famers. Dennis Schroeder, because he's so damn good for the German national team. Hey, I'm just, I'm just saying. Are you saying that the Hall of Fame is easy to get into, McMahon? We'll get, we'll get to the Hornets later. All right. Anyway, the Cavs are, are trying to figure this out and it would, it would probably involve making another ancillary trade, potentially with Max Struess being shipped to a third team and then using that, um, um, the team would have a trade exception or cap space. And then using that hole, you could get the Nuggets, but you know, the Nuggets have to agree to, to, to trade Peyton Watson. You know, I mean, that's a, that's a decision that would have to be made. And so let's just say the Peyton Watson Watson possibility is out there. The one thing the Cavs did in this deal was that they, they wrote the Hornets a $4 million check because they're, they're light on trade assets in terms of draft picks. They didn't have to give any draft capital to move off of Schroeder, who has two years and 30 million left on his deal. And, um, so that leaves them the ability to maneuver with Denver and possibly with Struess. Now, to me, if the Cavs get Peyton Watson in the next, you know, seven to 10 days, um, to me, it will, you know, maybe that's a great move. I don't, the difficulty with Peyton Watson is that he was, was really good last year for a short burst and then the hamstring injury. And maybe it's an incredible opportunity to squeeze Denver. Who is financially, um, impacted. Maybe it's a, maybe it's a, um, um, maybe it's a, you know, it's kind of what the Thunder were doing when they went after Spencer Jones. They were trying to put Denver in a tough, tough position and pull a player out of there. Um, I just, I just think it's a little bit of a, of a risk taking a player who's, who's a top end outputs that you're playing for has been so small. So basically I would say this, if the Cavs get Peyton Watson, the first question I have is what's the contract? Because, you know, you know how I say you, you sign a contract, can you trade it? So, you know, what sort of contract are they giving him if they can pull it off? So anyway, 47 and a half. Um, this is a reflection of, of the way they, I mean, if any, I got to say, Vince, I think this is a, this is a reaction to what's basically been a non-eventful off season. Um, and the fact that they got absolutely embarrassed by the Knicks in the conference finals last year. Um, it's the combination of them both. Is that you saying over Wendy? No, I'm saying under, I'm saying under, but it's more, it's more, because I think that they will, I think, by the way, I think this is about right. Like 47 is about right. Um, and I think, you know, Donovan had a healthy year last year, which helped a lot. My concern is this for the Cavs. If they, what are we seeing that wins and that is winning in the league right now? Youth, depth and size, but certainly youth and depth. And if the Cavs have to, I mean, they lost, um, Keon Ellis. Um, they lost Dean Wade. Um, you know, not the shooter is, you know, a difference making player, but that's a rotation player that they've lost. And the potentially are going to have to, you know, if they're going to get Watson, they're going to probably have to trade strews. That's a lot out the window. Now they, they will probably play Jalen Tyson, their first round draft pick from a couple of years ago, a little bit more, but that's a lot of depth to sacrifice. Um, to get under the second apron and also add up a piece who frankly is, you know, a question mark. So I'm just, you know, I, I'm not in love with the concept of how they've potentially are hurting their depth here. So I'm going to say barely under, but I'll probably would lean under right now. I'm leaning a little bit under. Um, one of the reasons is man, James Harden is going to be, what 37 is, did he, is his birthday somewhere around the corner? Like I feel like it's in September. Yeah, it is. It is. Yeah. Yeah. And at August 26, he turns 37. That's, that's a lot of miles. That's a lot of minutes. Um, I like Cleveland. I think when you think of some of those names that you talked about, like that's the fabric of the ball club that, you know, not just the stars, but the guys who do the little things. Like when I say I have questions about Philly, it's who's going to do the things that, doesn't show up in a statute. Like those guys are the guys that did the things that don't show up in the statute that enables Donovan Mitchell to sort of focus on, you know, being an attacker and scoring and alleviates James Harden from being hunted on defense to large degree. And I think this is to large degree, a show of no confidence, not just based off of what happened with the Knicks. They should have lost in the second round to Detroit. They could have lost in the first round to Toronto. Like they basically get out of those series by the skin of their chin. And then it caught up with them when they went up against a superior team. And then now you're going to say you're a year older, who on that team amongst your key players still has much more upside than not. And it's only Evan Mobley, but have they given the indication has Evan Mobley given the indication that he's willing to take the assertive tone to be what his talent demands. Now, if he turns into that guy, then we're talking about a completely different ball club. But if he's going to be the highly effective player that you're always going to ask of, can he do more? Why isn't he doing more? Then I think that won't say that limits them, but that puts a very hard and sure ceiling on what they're going to be, at least as a regular season ball club. And I think that puts them somewhere around 46, 47 wins in this Eastern conference. Yeah, I'm not, I'm not saying they're going to win 35. I want to be clear. Like, I think that's about right. but right. Yeah. McMahon. I'm higher on him than you guys are. And look, Donovan Mitchell is a regular season winner. James Harden's a regular season winner. We can talk about playoffs all you want, but Donovan Mitchell, the only time in his career he won fewer than 47 games was in the COVID season, and that was a 50-win pace. Hey, that's a good point. That's a good point. I'm going back through Harden now, trying to find the last time he won fewer. than 47 games, and I'm a decade back. I'm going to keep on going, but it's been a while, man. All right. It's compelling. So 2015-16, the Dwight Mayer year in Houston was the last time that Harden won fewer than 47 games. By the way, you could win 47 games this year in the East and be the 3C. Yeah. Dean Wade was a quality contributor. I do think Tyson's going to, I think he's an emerging player. I think he's going to step into that role in those minutes and do well with that. You know, Mobley needs to take a, he needs to just take a leap for them to be anything more than a cute little second-round team, but I think they're probably a cute little second-round team that wins 48 or more games. All right. Fair enough. All right. We got to pick up the pace here. Miami Heat, sixth highest number at 46 and a half. That represents, definitely represents a Giannis bounce. From a year ago. Their team is, got some holes on it. I don't know. It's, you know, Giannis hasn't been healthy in a while. Like this is assuming some pretty good Giannis health here, Vince. And I mean, they won 43 games last year and the bump isn't even as massive as you would expect it to be when you're adding a guy, you know, who's been in. Spolstra squeezes out regular seasons. He's always maximizing the regular season. Absolutely. And I think. And I, while I think that Eric Spolstra has managed more, gotten more out of a little, it's going to be different this year when you have to figure out how many games is Giannis going to play? Like when you look at the last, you know, few years or, you know, just the last few years, you know, the health has been an issue, at least later in the year. How would you maximize the spacing between Giannis and Bam? How would you maximize the usage between Giannis and Bam? I have a feeling that there'll be a better team later than early. I think that 46 feels. I won't say ambitious, but I could see them winning about 45 games and then being held on wheels because my question is about their shooting. Like one of the things and shot creation outside of Giannis, that was one of the reasons why I was thinking that LeBron was ticketed for Miami because he would be able to fit in much better there. Yeah, he would have probably played point guard. Yeah. Like, and Davion Mitchell's a great defender, but you're asking him to do a lot of that initiation. I think, once again, that's going to hurt them in the half court. I think Giannis and Bam defensively, I think they're going to be really good, but I think on a regular season, that's going to be nights where they struggle with shooting, where they struggle with spacing, and I think it catches up to them in the regular season in a way that it won't hurt them as much in the playoffs. Yeah, I'll be quick here. I'm going under. I think that it's going to take a while for Giannis and Bam to figure out the fit. I don't think there's enough shooting for them to really be able to maximize that, and then the question about Giannis is durability. I'll go under here. Yeah, I'm leaning under, too, but more because I just think that it's going to be hard to get in the high 40s in the Eastern Conference. I just think it's going to be. More Hoop Collective podcast after this. This message is brought to you by Apple Card. Shave ice by the beach. A trip to the state fair. And a throwback flick at the local drive-in. They're more than just items to check off the summer bucket list. There are also opportunities to earn 2% daily cash back when you use your Apple Card with Apple Pay. Apply for Apple Card now and use in minutes with Apple Pay. Subject to credit approval. Apple Card is issued by Goldman Sachs Bank USA, Salt Lake City branch. Terms and more at applecard.com. I get so many headaches every month. It could be chronic migraine, 15 or more headache days a month, each lasting four hours or more. Botox, autobotulinum toxin A prevents headaches in adults with chronic migraine. It's not for those who have 14 or fewer headache days a month. Prescription Botox is injected by your doctor. Effects of Botox may spread hours to weeks after injection causing serious symptoms. Alert your doctor right away as difficulty swallowing, speaking, breathing, eye problems or muscle weakness can be signs of a life-threatening condition. Patients with these conditions before injection are at highest risk. Side effects may include allergic reactions, neck and injection site pain, fatigue and headache. Allergic reactions can include rash, welts, asthma symptoms and dizziness. Don't receive Botox if there's a skin infection. Tell your doctor your medical history muscle or nerve conditions including ALS, Lou Gehrig's disease, myasthenia gravis or Lambert-Eaton syndrome and medications including botulinum toxins as these may increase the risk of serious side effects. Why wait? Ask your doctor. Visit BotoxChronicMigraine.com or call 1-800-44-BOTOX to learn more. Okay, in the West, the Clippers are off the board. Yeah. So why are the Raptors on the board here at 45 and a half? Probably because they won 46 last year with Brandon Ingram in the starting lineup. So it's maybe a little bit easy. But I thought they overachieved last year. This is one where Bon Temps was kind of taking a victory lap for most of the season because I was pretty down on the Raptors going into the year. Oh, cross-country Bon Temps. But, you know, I think they overachieved last year. Even if Kawhi's there, how many games, you know, playing 65, is he playing 60? Yeah, you know, I don't know. So I'll go under here as well. I'm going under because I don't know who the hell's going to be on their roster. Yeah, I mean, I can't even. I mean, and let's say they get Kawhi. Kawhi, if he's the player he was last year, like, that's amazing. But, I mean, it's a huge unknown. And here's the thing. Not just the injury, but is Kawhi going to suffer any type of penalty from the NBA? You know what I mean? I mean, on top of. the regular maintenance that comes with a Kawhi Leonard? What if he only plays 30 regular season games because of all those things? Can they win enough games to just not be in a play-in? Like, to me, that's the question. So just being the big unknown, I would say under. There's a lot riding on how this Kawhi trade goes down. Like, I don't think it, like, is going to determine the champion or anything, but this is a very significant thing that, and I'm talking to, you know, executives and stuff, and they, like, trust me, you know, we're in the dead zone here in August, but this is being discussed a lot. People are watching this a lot. There's a, you know, this is a really big deal. We're not talking about it every day on ESPN because it's NFL season, but it should be. It should be like a, you know, it's the biggest topic right now in the league. Well, when Adam Silver decides to make a decision, you know, I don't know, 2031 or so, then we'll talk about it then. I mean, stuff keeps coming out. Is he just waiting for Kawhi to retire first? Like, what the hell's happening? All right. Are the Indiana Pacers fans annoyed that their team, which when we last saw them essentially trying, was in game seven on the road in the head when Tyrese Halliburton had that terrible injury happen, that they are only a 45 and a half over under? Well, Tyrese Halliburton was annoyed that he wasn't on national TV for his return and wasn't even at home. So, you know, I'm sure there's. I'll point out that two years ago, they won 50 games and they were really good in the second half. They were like way better in the second half. If Halliburton's himself, then they're going to be over 44 and a half. They've also upgraded at center since then. Zubats is an upgrade over Myles Turner. I think this is a pretty solid over. Yeah, I think so too. Like he's been playing five on five since April. Like they just, they weren't doing the Jason Tatum thing. There was no reason for them to try to rush him. But no, Jason Tatum, from the moment that he got hurt, he basically put, you know, he put the fast forward button on everything that he was doing. He basically marketed like, I'm going to come back. That was not the strategy in Indiana and, you know, for good reason. So, and I do think despite this being a gap year, they do have continuity that, you know, and continuity to me, Rick Carlisle, to me, top five coach in the NBA, still can take yours and be his, can beat his and take yours, like that sort of thing. He's still that level of coach to me. I think if Halliburton is himself, I think they'll win comfortably over 44 and a half games. It's a big sliding doors moment. Think if they had just gotten a little bit of luck and had gotten that number four pick instead of number five and had to give it to the Clippers. That's a big moment. Yeah, I like him over too. I think Zubac is a very good fit. Now, the thing about Zubatsch is they like to run. and Zubac doesn't, and, you know, Turner spread the floor, which is what they need, and Zubac doesn't. But I think what he can do defensively is a potential, you know, significant upgrade. Defensively on the glass and running pick and roll. You know, he's great at the short roll. I like him for that. Living, still living in the play-in zone here with their new coach, friend of the podcast, Sean Sweeney. The Orlando Magic, ninth at 43 and a half. Also, the Hawks, the friend of the pod, Tim Bontemps. Did I say that? No, he's not. They're tied for ninth, 43 and a half, Magic and Hawks. Okay. I'll start with the Magic. They were a 45-win team last year. With? With Franz missing more than half the season due to injuries. And with Paulo, like, it was a pretty toxic situation for whatever reason. With Paulo in particular and Jamal Mosley, that relationship deteriorated. We talked about it during the season last year. So, like, none of us were surprised that they moved on from Jamal Mosley, who was also a friend of the pod, by the way. But, you know, I don't think they're way over, but I do think they are. Over 43 and a half. And I think they're right in that 45-plus range that they've been occupying. That's tough for me because, like Wendy said, when you think about all the really good teams in the Eastern Conference, like, not everybody can win 50 games. And it's not an indictment of what they've done. Like, Desmond Bain, like, he had early struggles. And then in the second half, he didn't. Like, he shot 43% from three after the all-star break. Like, you start to really figure some stuff out. But. If your second best player is a health concern night after night, and I like Paulo Banqueiro's talent, but I wonder, is he going to harness that? I think they're probably a little bit under, maybe 43. It's a proof of year for Paulo. You know, if Jamal is the problem, well, you know, okay. It's a proof of year now. They played so, they got off to a decent start last year, but they played 500 basketball. For a big stretch of last year. Now, I know that Paulo had the injury. But they were a 500 team for, you know, most of the season. So, I think, I think they got off to like a, well, now that I'm looking at it, they were 15 and 10. So, that's not exactly a blazing start. And then injuries hit. Yeah. And Bain got off to a slow start. I think Bain's going to be more comfortable this year. Yeah. Yeah, they had, yeah. They had a seven-game win. They had a seven-game win streak and a six-game losing streak. That's what I remember. Anyway, they're probably better than 43 wins, their talent. As for the Hawks, Jalen Johnson is one of the most undervalued players in the conference, I think. Also, great contract. 30 mil for him. Like, that's a lot of money. But by NBA standard, that's a really good bargain. You know what's crazy about that contract? Number one, there's no option in it. There's no raises in it. Yeah, just flat. So, it's precise. Percentage of the cap, because the cap's going to go up every year, it's percentage of the cap goes down. Like, that's, you know, that's, they got a couple of wings. You know, I don't know what they can expect out of Kingston Flemings. I don't know if that's, you know, I don't know if they'll do much there. But, you know, they did some things at the margins and they're, you know, hoping for a healthy season. And C.J. McCollum, like, after they got him last year, they just, they just won a lot more. Once they committed to him as a starter, they closed the season on a 19-4 kick before, you know, mailing in the regular season finale. Kind of like over. And they gave the Knicks all they could handle. I kind of like the over. Until the finale of that series. Well. Oh, true. I kind of, well, they got, they inflicted more wounds on the Knicks than anybody else. Absolutely. Yeah, absolutely. I'm kind of, I don't like you saying over. This is third one in a row. My only hesitancy, because I, listen, C.J., I mentioned that stat. I like bringing in Lou Doerr. I like bringing in Aaron Wiggins. Role players who know how to win have, you know, or have been part of, obviously, a winning team before. The only thing I didn't like about the Hawks all season was hiring bond temps. As long as they keep him the hell away. Well, the thing about the Hawks, they have, they're in a decent pick situation. And they have, like, $40 million in expiring contracts. Because remember, they gave, like, Jock Landale a one-year deal. Like, they could be a team that is in the hunt if there's a midseason move because of what they do. I mean, you can't bake that in. All right. The Charlotte Hornets had their best season in, like, you know, seven or eight years last year. And then decided to take their team in the other direction. Traded LaMelo Ball. Traded Miles Bridges. 39 and a half, Vince. I mean, don't get me wrong. I am huge on Conk and Nipple. I like Brandon Miller. Like, I like the fact, hey, if your thought was, we need to give these two young guys as much runway on the floor and in the locker room as possible, I'm 100% with you. 100% with you. But I don't know if that translates to being more than what they were last season. A play-in team that, you know, if Bam Adebayo doesn't get hurt, you know, in that game, you know, maybe they don't even come out of, what was that, the 9-10 game that they were in last year? I wonder if there's going to be a little, like, clarity but regression. Because one thing about LaMelo Ball, he can win you some regular season games with a lot of that. Without question. Hell yes, he does. A lot of that stuff. He's not a loser by any stretch. So sounds like you're saying under. I'm saying under, I think. So, you know, I've been as critical of LaMelo as anybody, but the simple fact is he was a driving force to their winning last year. Offensive rating with him on the floor, 123.2. That's historically elite. Off the floor, 110.6. That's not very good. You know, that's, look, they brought in Dennis Schroeder. That's a trade that tells you they're not trying to take too much of a step back to, you know, give another creator to go along with Cody White. But they made those trades. As you said, to say, look, we're not on the verge of something big now. We want to build around these young guys. And they were willing to take a step back to try to give themselves a long-term higher ceiling. But I do think it's a step back from 44 wins last year. You know, I think they're in the high 30s, but I'll go under here. They're giving big roles to Kobe White and Nas Reed. Now, Nas Reed is a big part of the LaMelo trade in addition to the, to the draft capital. I'm not sure those guys are lifting the boat. I think those are players you'd want to have, but I'm not sure they're lifting the boat. So, all right. Now we get into teams that were tankers last year. Wizards. This is kind of high. This is a, this is. This one surprised me. The Wizards are definitely trying to win. And they're going to have Trey Young and they're going to have Anthony Davis. AD is not going. They're going to get a contract out of the gate. He's going to be highly motivated. Ace or AJ DeBansa. You know, you're going to expect to, you know, come out of the gates, putting up numbers. And they could even do, they could even be a team that looks to be a buyer mid-season because they're, they want to get into the play-in. But 35 and a half is a, like, that's a big jump. From 17, more than double? I mean, this is a weird number, man. Like, I don't know. Maybe I'm underrating Trey Young. I mean, Trey Young is a guy who gets teams. To the play-in, maybe that's, maybe I should pay more attention to it. Look, the Pistons made this kind of jump a couple years ago. That was bringing in a new coach, though. And you said AD is going to be motivated to do what? To get out of town? Or to, because I don't think he's getting paid by Washington. I just don't think he's getting paid by Washington. I don't think AD, I think AD is a pretty business-savvy guy. I think Rich Paul is a pretty business-savvy guy. I think that is a black cloud hanging over this organization. Wow. Hey, Trey Young just got $212 million, and they told AD, yeah, let's see how you play, buddy. AD, who's won a champion. And I don't think, but here's my thing. If you traded for AD, you knew the extension talk was coming. So, unless you were willing to go there, I don't think you should have traded for him. Look, here's what I know. When AD is motivated, he is a brilliant player. Show me the incentive. I'll show you the result. No. He is highly incentivized. When AD is motivated and when AD is healthy. Well, he's going to be healthy. He hasn't played in months. Oh, he's going to be? Wasn't he supposed to be healthy? Wasn't he supposed to be motivated in Dallas? I mean, AD, you can't count on AD being healthy. I'm sorry. Unfortunately, it's just sad truth. Well, when he got to Dallas, he was unhealthy, and they played him. He will be healthy going into the regular season. Was he healthy going into the training camp last year? Because that's what I'm talking about. The plan lasted about a week and a half. All right, fair enough. Show me the incentive And I'll show you the result He's highly incentivized By Big Seas This is We're gonna move on This number is too high Okay Yes The number's too high Chicago Bulls They're not gonna be good 27 and a half I don't I I like the over here I thought Really I think Norm Powell Is a nice boost for them And I think Caleb Wilson Has got a chance to be Have a hell of a rookie year I think Caleb Wilson Might win rookie of the year But you know Rookies almost never Drive winning as you know Yeah But they've got They've got Some I mean I don't think they're good But they've got some pieces I don't know And we're a year removed From all roads Lead to 39 Well I understand that But look at the Eastern Conference I mean You know Most nights They're going to go They're gonna have A talent deficit Most nights Almost every night I'm just glad They chose the direction I'm just glad That they I'm glad that Michael Reinsdorf Put his foot down And they decided to go And now You've got Caleb Wilson Now you can figure out What to do with Patrick Williams Now you You've finally gone somewhere I don't know if they know What to do with Patrick Williams But yeah Look I worked in Chicago For a few years Maybe I have an affinity For the You know For the Bulls And some of their Some of their fans Who are still living off Of six championships In eight years Like I get it But Caleb Wilson I'm with you guys Give me KG vibes But I don't think They're going to win 28 games this year I was a little worried About the way Noah Asenge Played in Summer League How However Matas Buzalas You know You're looking for A step forward from him You're obviously Going to be Showing up to see Caleb Wilson You know Maybe Maybe Asenge Will look better But you know He missed almost All last season With a shoulder injury And then he came out And I don't think It was that great In Summer League 27 and a half I probably wonder Milwaukee Bucks Way down there 24 and a half Yeah They stink Under Yeah they're not Going to be good But yeah Big man That was just so mean I mean Listen man They hung a banner With the honest Everything was worth it But you knew The aftermath Was going to be painful The aftermath is here What's going on With that investigation To Gary Trent I wish I had I wish I had Again I think The punishment is like Yeah Pay him Cool Right Tyler Hero I think is Going to gun And put I would put it this way I would Pick Tyler Hero On your fantasy team This year Unless efficiency Is part of it Because I think He's just going to be A gunner Not necessarily An efficient gunner Most three point Attempts this year Might be Tyler Hero He won't let it fly Yeah He's going to let it fly Like Bam Adebayo's Fist in a Las Vegas Ballroom Yeah , he's going to let it fly Over under 24 and a half I agree with I agree I agree with him Yeah It's hard to pick a team Losing under 24 games But it's just too hard In the East All right Brooklyn Nets By the way Where's their pick? Is that Whose property is It's tied up with New Orleans and Atlanta I can't remember How it all goes Oh yeah One of those types We need Bobby Marks here Tied with the Bucs For the worst Projection in the East The Nets A 24 and a half Not impressed With the Bucs The Julius Randle trade I mean It at least gives them A primary creator But they stink And they owe The Rockets a swap It's going to be A bad situation In Brooklyn I think they win More than 24 games I don't think They're going to be good I don't think They're going to be good But I think they win More than 24 games Maybe they'll win 25 Michael Porter And Julius Randle Are going to have Nights when they're When they're clicking And they're going to beat you You cannot Roll the ball out there But You've guys Have heard me say this before Not like I invented it But The easiest way To guarantee yourself Losing in the NBA Is to play Give a lot of minutes To young guards And I mean They're compelled To play Mikel Brown And Igor Demon A lot Those are Two top eight picks And They have to play them And They're going to lose It's just like I mean I They are Highly Incentivized To do everything They can To get into the play-in Because they don't Control their pick So that That would lead you To believe And I also think Jordy Fernandez Has been coaching With you know One hand tied Behind his back Because the team Didn't want to win And I do think He's a good young coach I agree You know He got extended Because you know He did a good job But It It's just It's hard for me To believe in your team When you're going to play Your Your two lead guards Are going to be In their first And second years It's just It's a bridge too far I like Mike I like Mike Hill But I think I think I think he's really talented I'm with you He's going to struggle I agree But You know There's going to be some nights All rookie point guards struggle Yeah Yeah Luka struggled You know In terms of driving winning By the way To answer my own question About the Bucs Their pick's going to be Either to the Pelicans Or the Hawks It's definitely not going to be theirs They won't have But they don't have a pick next year That's a bad situation Less than ideal They have They have They have Miami's They had something from Miami Or maybe they don't Maybe it's farther out It ain't next year All right This concludes our Over-unders On the Eastern Conference I don't know if If If I had enough unders I I somehow Said Gave this big speech About taking unders And then I went over On the Pacers Magic and Hawks Well you know What I thought you were going to do I thought you were only going to be Firm on your overs And mealy mouth Your unders But you You came a little bit strong Than I anticipated Pause All right Thank you with that All right All right You're cut off You're cut off It's a Sunday night I'm on European time You're cut off Thank you very much To Devon Who's joined us As a special producer On this episode Thank you to Miles Jackson was unavailable And that's what we get We get you Misbehaving like that Jackson or Wrigley Yeah He's in Chicago All right Thank you so much To Vince and McMahon Thank you for watching Listen to the Hoop Collective We'll talk to you later this week Adios amigos As you know Managing maintenance Repair and operations Is never easy But for the ones Who always rise To the challenge Grainger has your back From professional grade products You can count on To fast dependable delivery They're there to help you Keep things running smoothly Plus you don't have to Have to worry about Any other problems They're here to help Answer your toughest questions And because Grainger knows Safety is always a priority They're committed to being Your partner in protecting Both your people And your facilities Call 1-800-GRAINGER Click Grainger.com Or just stop by