Met Gala 2026 Recap: Beyoncé, the Bezos Backlash, Kim Kardashian, and Vogue's Silence

Today's episode is sponsored by Margot. If you are shopping for sandals this spring, I want to put my favorite pair on your radar. The Margot wrap sandal. I live in New York and when the weather's nice outside and I have to look nice, these are the shoes I reach for. You can dress them up or dress them down. I can commute in them. I can walk all over the city in them. Just a few days ago, I had to run around Manhattan all day and I comfortably did. I'm not kidding, guys. 11,000 steps in these shoes. When I can't wear a sandal, I often reach for Margot's ballet flats. And I know back row newsletter readers love their low-heeled winter boots. You can check out these styles and more at margotny.com. That's ma-r-g-a-u-x-n-y.com. And first time buyers can get 10% off with the code back row. The 2026 Mechgala was unprecedented. Thanks to a reported $10 million donation by headline sponsors Jeff Bezos and his wife Lauren Sanchez Bezos, this was the most controversial Mechgala I think ever. But what effect will all that controversy and backlash have on the Mechgala itself or the Met Museum itself, or any of the stars who decided to go in spite of widespread calls for a boycott? To discuss all of that, plus the other biggest narratives from the night, including Beyoncé's return, Lauren Sanchez's inspiration being Madam X and much more joined by my friend Heather Cox of the Drinks with Brods newsletter and GoFegerself.com. Today, it's the biggest narratives from the 2026 Mechgala, I'm Amy O'Dell, and this is the Backrow Podcast. (air whooshing) I am here with Heather Cox of GoFegerself and Drinks with Brods. Heather, thank you so much for being here. My pleasure. Where else would I want to be on, Met Tuesday? In this Riverside chat room, that's the only place to be. We're sadly, sadly without your partner, Jess today, but we miss her. I enjoyed your coverage in the newsletter this morning. It was so funny as always. Thank you. It's hard to tell because as you know, when you're doing it all the night, like right afterwards, it's a bit of a fog. So I woke up this morning and I was like, what am I right? I don't remember. No, it was funny. We're gonna talk about some of the things that you guys said, but I wanted to talk today about the biggest narratives. And I think that the biggest one is the Bezos backlash, right? I want to know from you. So in New York, that backlash feels very acute. Of course, many of the demonstrations are taking place right under my nose. There were projections over the weekend on buildings. And I don't know if it was exactly his penthouse in New York City or like just buildings that he could see from his penthouse, but this activist group, everyone hates Elon was protesting signs like boycott the Bezos, Matt Gala, Jeff Bezos, can pay more tax, that type of thing. And then the group over the weekend too, they hid like these little tiny bottles of fake pee around the museum and they put up like a VIP bathroom with plastic water bottles across the street from the museum over the weekend. Calling attention to the fact that some of these Amazon workers have to pee into plastic bottles because those are the conditions of working in the warehouse or delivering for Amazon. So that's what we have in New York. But from your perspective, was there any discourse about this in LA? - Not that I wouldn't presume to say I'm necessarily part of the discourse in LA, but you would never know any of that was going on as far as I know unless you see it on the internet. It's just not. It's so far removed from us geographically that I think there's not a lot of bleed. So you might get a little bit in terms of the usual pop culture writers and stuff who are covering it through the course of their jobs, but in terms of the city itself, as far as I know there was no sort of matching protest or any kind of counterculture going on to do with that here that was concurrent. - Yeah, and then actually the day of the gala, I noticed there were other groups doing demonstrations. So I want to talk about those. I don't know if you had a chance to see these. Let me see, one was like, oh, the ball without billionaires. - Interesting. - I thought that was great. So it featured a fashion show with the theme labor is art riffing on the Met theme, which was costume art and the dress code, which was fashion is art. And this ball without billionaires, it started former or current employees of Amazon Whole Foods and the Washington Post, which is kind of incredible. They were the models and they were closed by emerging designers and also involved in this particular demonstration with Gabriella Krefat Johnson, who is a former Vogue global contributing editor and stylist and it was co-hosted by Abbott Elementary Actress Lisa Ann Walter. - That's cool. I don't think I knew Gabriella was not at Vogue anymore. That's a really interesting assemble and I actually think that who would have been a lot more fun and more interesting than the Met itself? I mean, not that the Met as a spectacle isn't fun to observe just because of the sheer scope of it, regardless of what the other issues are. But like I think that that's a very clever form of protest and it's very upbeat. And I think, I don't know, there's something to it when all these protests have an undercurrent of joy, even though the thing they're protesting is inherently not joyful. - Yes, there's something that we've profound about that and the fact that they were able to find that and bring that to the streets, I think is incredible. - Yeah, so this took place in the meat packing district, which is I don't know, a 70 block south of the Met basically. - Right, out of its orbit. - Yes, and when you look at these pictures, people look happy. - Yeah. I mean, we had a great weather in New York the day of the Met. It was a beautiful day, it was like 70 degrees. Like everyone here looks just like happy and joyful and they're making a statement about labor and labor rights and Amazon and inequality. And they're doing it with fashion. So it was very notable to me. And then there was another protest actually near to the Met, like just blocks away as I understand it. This was by a New York-based advocacy group Rise and Resist. And they staged Resistance Runway. So same idea, they're doing like a little runway show. And the photos, they're just joyful. It's like people wearing really creative things, sparkly embellishments, hats, heels, holding signs that say arrest Trump, your red carpet is stained with blood, war, we are making a killing trillionaires for Trump. That's a hell by a guy sort of dressed in character of a gilded age, I guess railroad tycoon. There's someone with a skirt made of posters that say climate emergency, baseless green washes, his climate crimes. And then a huge sign behind the models that says, tax the rich. So, and these people, they look like they're having fun. I mean, this I think is like the kind of activism that fashion can inspire that is genuine versus the kind that we saw around 2020 when it was like this performative corporate bullshit. And it is definitely a very different and inspiring way to engage with the concept of fashion as art. I think the publication that I kind of wish would engage with this right now is Vogue. I think Vogue could have a really interesting conversation about the intersection of that with what they sponsored. And I would respect them if they did. I think that's a real missed opportunity. I, yeah, thank you for bringing that up. I don't think that Vogue acknowledged this at all, which was a glaring. It's like, that is not surprising. I totally get that. But it was a glaring omission because the conversation around the baseless is and the protests against them and the message of the protests and the determination of the protesters to embarrass the baseless is was so strong this year. For weeks leading up to the gala. Like unprecedented, I would say, unlike anything, I think we've seen relating to this event. So that happened. Billionaires participating in this before. This is not the first. There have always been present. They just haven't been as high profile and haven't been as low. Then it hasn't happened. I mean, I think everything has a tipping point, right? And I think it's because of the state of things economically and otherwise, you know, they're socially politically all of it. And they're perceived role in that. It's like a perfect storm. But people asking, well, why is it such a big deal now? And like, well, that is the deal. It's the context. Everything has its context. And the context now is more sort of dire than it has been in the past. Yeah, absolutely. And equality is obviously really bad. The tech industry, billionaires, are super unpopular. But yes, I think it was a glaring omission for Vogue, not technology. I do see it. It's very much putting their fingers in their ears and being like, la, la, la, la, la. And it's-- I understand if that's a line, they feel uncomfortable walking. But I think there's a way to do it. I think, and the fact that they didn't even attempt is-- It's kind of pathetic. I'm just going to say it because, yeah, it's kind of pathetic. I mean, we just saw them spend how many weeks telling us about what it's really like to be Anna Winters assisted and their interviewing Anna Winters assistance and their peeling back the curtain and being really super honest. And then it's like, cricket's about this. Yes. And it's also hard not to look at it also in concert with Devil Wars Prada 2, which was a mess. But I think-- I thought I enjoyed it. I had super low expectations, and I still was sort of like-- I don't know. Like, I think-- I don't know. Anyway, that's a separate side conversation that I don't know. Full of their pod with anything. It's one of them. I'm not a time. I just don't. But there is this nugget in the movie that Vogue runway sort of improves its own fortune. by developing a social conscience. And yeah, you argue that rejecting one billionaire by finding a nicer billionaire to bail you out is not actually forming a social conscience. But you can also make the claim that that particular billionaire responded to the pieces that they were doing at runway that had a bit more of an awareness and were less from an ivory tower. And it's interesting that that is happening in theaters right now when Vogue itself is trying really hard not to have a social conscience on this particular issue of which it is a huge part. - Yeah, and people have, people point out, I'm sure you see this on social media, like, oh, but it's charity. And like, it's not what we want them to do with their money. And like, to a degree, yeah, but it's not just charity. This is business. This is business opportunity for all the brands who are there promoting their clothing. This is business, big business opportunity for Vogue and Conte and asked, perhaps more than anybody else because they are selling those sponsorships. You know, I've seen reports in the past that those sponsorships of the McElla livestream go for like seven figures. - I'm sure. - And, you know, the first line of the Vogue McElla livestream on YouTube. And I thank you guys, watch this as did I last night. But the first line of that livestream was like sponsored by Colgate, eBay, Eli Lilly and On. - There were so many. I mean, and it's hard to know exactly what the flow of cash is with these things because obviously Vogue and Conte are gonna profit from it. Obviously, it's supposed to be raising money for the Costume Institute. Where did the Bezos money go? Did it go toward Vogue, Conte, the meals, the exhibit? Like, I don't know. I don't know the answer to that. Like, I think it's tough. I agree in theory that, yeah, this is kind of what you want billionaires doing with their money is like funding the stuff that's important to the culture, right? But, sure. This is obviously not why they're doing it. But again, is that why any of them are doing it? I mean, you look at all these hospitals that have billionaire names plastered all over their cardiac wings. And you're like, well, that person probably is also, are there ethical billionaires? I don't think so. So that person probably also has some ill-gotten gains and they just wanted to see their name on a building. But like, that building's doing a lot of good. So, I struggle with that because I do, like, I think it's 100% of valid criticism to be like, he bought her a party. (laughs) It's social status. Like, like, it's so obvious. But then you're like, well, did the, if the money went to something good, like, does it, does it wash it? I don't know. I mean, I, I want to say no. But then you're also that same person who's like, I'm going to such and such hospital wing to get my mammogram. Or I'm going to a university that has, you know, my alma mater has a lot of building sponsored by the people who own McDonald's. And I'm like, you know, it's tricky. It's one of those lines I think everybody has to figure out how to walk for themselves. And I don't know that we all have a clean answer. I think that they get a lot out of it. That's my instinct. I think we'll have to see kind of like where this conversation goes because it's not done yet. But I think that I think that is that they are making themselves much more visible in this process. So we talk about how well, there's always been billionaires circling the met. There's always been a presence there. I think I think meta, even though this was Zuckerberg's first, I think meta has always sort of financially been involved or at least I hope I'm not. In recent years more and more. Yeah. Yeah. I think they have always sort of had a financial finger in the pie or so. I don't. But but because of how visible they are and how much they've been sort of running in fashion circles with Anna and that whole the whole wedding, splashy wedding in Venice, the Vogue pieces that New York Times piece about, you know, everyone should be happy. Why not Lauren Sanchez Bezos? Yeah. Crime of fucking River. I think that's really the piece that pushes people over or that at least has has brought this conversation has turned up the volume on it because they are really, really making it about themselves. Which is why I thought it was very intriguing that he snuck in the back door last night and didn't want to record it with her. Yeah. Tell of that was no photos of him from the carpet at all. I think in the past in like two years ago when she went, well, they both went, I think they did pose on the carpet together at some point. I've not seen anything like that yet. No, I looked last night before I went to bed and there were a couple pictures of him inside, but I didn't see any of him on the carpet and I think it would have been impossible to have avoided seeing one if if one existed. And I couldn't decide if that was, yeah, was that cowardice on his part? Was that was it? It's very, it could have been a security concern safely. A security concern. Like, yeah, I don't know. But I thought it was interesting that like all of a sudden. There was a part of me that was like, oh, you're throwing her to the wolves. Okay. I don't know. I think she likes the spotlight. But I do. I don't. I think and I think she's completely creating a bubble around herself to where she probably has convinced herself. Any number of things are true about it that are not. Yeah. And if you look at the comments on her Instagram as I pointed out on this podcast before, they're all positive. So someone is filtering them. But what I want to say about all these tech people and I want to get into this more in just a sec. But what I want to say about these tech people, I think that the money that they spend on this Mac, I think it's pocket changed to them. I think it's walking around money. And I think the ROI they get out of being in that room is just so much greater. I think it makes their companies seem probably cool to a lot of people probably makes them seem cool, probably makes them seem like more palatable and tasteful than they really are. And like, you know, Instagram is the fashion world's social network and fashion brands pay money to promote on there. So I think that, you know, from a business perspective, they are getting a lot out of being in that room too. And the same is going to be true for open AI who was there this year. Snap was also there. Yeah. So I think they're getting a lot more these tech companies, these tech people out of being in that room than the monetary cost of their seats. It's hard to tell because how much of that is the networking they're doing in the room in terms of sort of what you would think of as consumer visibility. I don't know if it really matters because I don't think those guys are getting the kind of coverage they might imagine they're getting. Like, for example, we may have ignored Miranda Kerr completely by accident. I don't know, but like she's married to Evan Spiegel. I don't think I could tell you what Evan Spiegel looks like. He walks the red carpet with her, but we would only, if we covered her, we most likely would only have used a picture of her. I don't know what a lot of these billionaires look like I, other than Zuckerberg, I guess. And I think I just think people aren't as interested in them and they're not getting the pop culture facing coverage. And so where is the business benefit for them? Maybe it is just being in the room with the corner story, Hudson Williams, hot young thing at the moment and being able to make relationships and make partnerships that will pay off down the line in terms of something that is super visible. I think they are getting and I've had more time to like look at things I know because it's morning for you afternoon from me. But I think that they are getting that kind of coverage because they had any fair, did a whole Instagram slide show like the tech out and like look at these tech eyes who are at the back out. Because they still, you are, they still, you are coined termed in that. Do you think so? They didn't credit me. They're not gonna. But it's possible. I will say that mind melds can happen. I mean, it's true. Yeah, Esquire also called it the tech out. I did a story and like I think that we'll see like more content in the future like there will be selfies with celebrities or whatever that Mark Zuckerberg and we may want to as post. I think in the past, I don't, I just really don't think it was that big of a deal to people and I, and again, what is it about this year? I think it's people trying to find a way to cover the fact that all these people were there. But maybe also trying to have their cake and eat it too. That's a very sanitized way of covering it being like look, the tech gala when like what people like you and me are really talking about are like whether the. It is the tech out what it means. Yeah, man, if you're not going to do a gallery that's like hey, are these people gross because they need them just as much as anybody else? But that's why independent media is great. You know, people sometimes ask why we had a couple people get a little happy with us for covering it at all. And in addition to just it's the biggest night of the year and fashion, it would be it would be I don't know you can ignore it. But I also think that's what independent media does. Like I like to think that us being able to go on our website and call Lauren Sanchez a dope is something that I'm pleased I have the freedom to do and I would like more publications around that can do that as opposed to the ones that are like look at all the tech money, starry rich men and Silicon Valley. Welcome to New York. Like that's not a value to me. Yeah, so I'm going to go subscribe to back row back row dot net slash subscribe and drinks with broads dot sub sec dot com. Yes, ma'am. Okay, yeah, go support us because we're going to tell you the truth unlike the Kanye Nass publications covering their own event. So let's talk about some of the tech people. So we went over the vaso says we'll have more to say about that. Open A eyes ahead of partnerships Charles porch Amazon executives Christine Boe Shamp and Jenny fresh water. Serge Brin Google co founder whose girlfriend I think is a gut health influencer I was reading recently. His net worth according to Google just before I got in this podcast $200 billion. Instagram CEO Adam Moissari was there of course. Snapchat co founder Evan Spiegel again with Miranda Kerr like you said I don't know his net worth something in the billions. But yes, they they were there. I don't remember those seeing many designers last night. How about you? There were a couple, but again, I have to be honest. I tend to not pay attention to them. Vera Wang for sure was there. My course that's right. She looks good. Actually. Yeah, my course there. I think Mark. Oh, top word. Okay, well, maybe I'm wrong. It was interesting. Who? And Alexander Wang. Oh, yeah, he's been live back in. Yeah, he's for sure back in. Although only one person wore a arena shape wore him and look ridiculous. But yeah, so he was there. I don't know. Tory Birch was there, which makes me okay. That will so they're more there than he did. And I think that you know, I'm a lot. Depending on who you read and what you're consuming. Like you. If you read our website, you're probably not going to see them because we don't Stella was there, but we tend to cut them out of the pictures. Like we take the pictures of the outfits that are just on the celebrities or just raising, we kind of just sort of leave the designers out. And same with the billionaires. So like that's probably where my bias is coming from in terms of I'm being like, I don't think I'm seeing much of that coverage. Well, yeah, because I'm not writing it. My face has been up until now. So I think they were there. They they did the usual, you know, they go in on the arm of somebody and the couple of livestream videos. Michael Cours dressed quite a few people, but I only saw him do interviews with Anne Hathaway and I sort of felt like that was she was his number one girl. And that was his number one product of the night. And it was fabulous. So it was like a hand painted full-scrusted gown on her. Yeah, it was interesting. It was nice. It was interesting. I guess I guess classy. Yeah. We're going to take a quick break and we will be right back right after this message from today's sponsor. If you are shopping for sandals this spring, I want to put my favorite pair on your radar, the Margot wrap sandal. When I can't wear a sandal, I often reach for Margot's ballet flats and I know back row newsletter readers love their low-heeled winter boots. That's maorg. A UX and why. Dot com and first time buyers can get 10% off with the code back row. Yes, I just feel like the tech people got more attention because this term tech, Gala is per meeting. I just felt like they were more intriguing. And maybe they spent more money. I don't know. I don't know who spent more money. I got a slang. I completely ignored. I just was like, I don't care. I don't want it. And I'm annoyed. Like the whole embrace of AI is a whole other thing, but I'm like, I think it's balsy to have open AI in the building. But yeah, I can't. Because it's a publishing company that's putting it on. So I think that's the fear, right? That all this all publishing is going to become AI slop. And I know there's other uses for AI. It doesn't necessarily mean writers are going to be replaced. There's other things they do on the back ends with AI. But as a as a writer, you sort of see that. And it will get started to see writers get replaced at. We are. Are they going to have a magazine and replace it with bots? Maybe I don't know. I don't know if that's what that meant, but it did sort of give me a moment of being like, Oh, God, really? Or it's bad enough that Reese Witherspoon is lecturing me about needing to understand AI. But like, does conda and ass really need to bring them into the fold like that? They want their money. They want to talk for fundraising. I saw the fundraising this year was a $42 million last year. It was 31 million. So I did think it was interesting that prior even to the gala, Andrew Bolton came out and said that the costume institute's been really frugal the last couple of years you guys and they've really sucked away and saved so that they might be fully independent. I think I said in two to four years. And I thought it was sort of, I was really curious if that was him subtly trying to be like calm down. Everybody we're not going to need billionaires forever. I think so. First of all, I think that's unrealistic. I think they will always need and want billionaires. They will always want more like good for them for being frugal, but like guys, but good good luck to them. I hope they can do it. Oh, yeah. I think there's a lot of donations suddenly being like, you know what? We're good. We don't need it. Does that also mean that he's looking to a future without a met gala? It sounds like it. I think so. I think so. I mean, look, there's lots of donations. Rich people give money to the costumers that you behind the scenes. Sure. It's not just the gala. So, you know, the basil says could have done that too, but no, they chose to like specifically orient it around the gala. Yeah. So that Lauren Sanchez could appear there and have the spot. I see. Mingly, it'll be very interesting to see if in the next couple of years, anything happens in terms of a shift where the actual costumants do, it really does try to sort of step back from this event because it is such a marquee event. It does so much for them. It does actually, I'm sure there's data somewhere on the effect it has on people's knowledge of the exhibit. They're understanding of the exhibit of what it even is of like whether they want to actually take a trip out to go see it. If they don't live in New York City, you know, I'm sure they crunch those numbers, but I'm super interested to see because it was, it was, it was a very interesting time for him to make that comment. It was before the event knowing that all of this controversy was brewing about the Bayzi. I don't know. You mean that there are the New York Times article he talked about this? Yeah, I think so. I think it was the times I couldn't remember where I saw it, but yes, it was, I read it a few times where he was like, we've really, we've really been good about our money. I was like, good, I will see what happens with it. I don't know. I also wonder if that has anything to do with Anna. Maybe, or do we think that if he feels like it wants Anna's out of the picture, if she ever is, that they won't have it? Yeah. My understanding based on my reporting is that that event is, it's, it's Anna's might and force that brings it together in the way that it comes together. And I was trying to determine last year if Chloe Moll is being trained to take it on, because I wasn't, and I wasn't hearing that she's like around, like learning. A condesore told me she's being trained in all aspects of the job allegedly, but I don't know. Yeah, but it is interesting that that the costume institute was kind of like distancing or trying to distance a little bit from this event. And I did not go to the press preview. My name, morning where they unveiled the exhibition for reporters and we saw Lauren Sanchez and Anna went through there. And they both made brief remarks. It just looked like unfun. Nobody looked like they were having a good time. I don't know. I don't know. At that point, I'm like, do you really need that event? Either like, I think we've read all the materials about the event at that point. Like, there have been countless articles about, here's the theme, here's the dress code, here's what it means. Let's talk to Silas, the weekend of the Mac out, to see what they think the theme is and what it means. Like, we've seen all of that. So I sort of feel like in the inundation of other events besides the actual gala is also kind of unnecessary. Like, don't, it's interesting to think about whether that is just this whole thing is is her and how much of it exists without her. And I also may also say that kind of at this point applies to Vogue too. I don't know. It was not always her. It certainly became her. And Chloe Mal is not her. And I know she claims that was the point. But I think I personally think that if Vogue is going to keep going, you need like a cult of personality there behind it a little bit. And I don't think she has that. I think the leader of leaders of like high fashion institution really benefit from that mystique and that mystery. Did you catch Chloe on the red carpet last night talking about being the vibe police? No, I did not. Yeah, she said that she's the social chair or something like that. Hey, let me put that full of this out because I did see why you're looking for that. I didn't see that she said something about how she was happy that people weren't leaning into nudity. And I was like I copied milk. Here's what I wrote in my recap. I had a editorial content Chloe Mal who spearheaded this recent effort to interview Anna's former assistant stopped to chat for Vogue's red carpet livestream. She said she was on the host committee this year and that her job was to make sure everyone is schmoozing correctly asked if she was the vibe police she conceded I'm the vibe police. But I argued that the real vibe police was money. So there you go. I don't know. But that just that doesn't sound unbalanced. It's like that sounds so un-fucking fine. And then you see these people at the resistance runway and they know like no billionaires. Right. That's fun. What is having fun? Correctly. Please tell me. Okay, so I didn't put this in my story but she said because they I to the credit of Carol Vienn and Ashley Graham who I think struggled as you pointed out in your recap because that type of live red carpet coverage is really hard in fairness to them. And they did not seem totally prepared but they did punch in and follow up on that and they were like what is schmoozing correctly? Exactly why I think any journalist would have done. And Chloe was like you know if you see someone like a loan you go up to that and you're like hi can I introduce you to so and so. It's like maybe the person wants to be alone. Yeah that's a tough one. Like someone else was telling me over the weekend like a real like fashion industry person was like the event itself like you have to have fun at the parties beforehand because the event itself is just not fun because there's just so much pressure. Well and you think about how much like I was watching that live stream right and so they had different camera angles and he didn't always I wasn't always completely oriented like where was I you know like someone's walking down this hallway have they come off the red carpet are they heading to the red carpet like did they just get out of their limo I don't know where this hallway is right but you would see somebody walking in the hallway and I like for example when Sarah Paulson showed up and I was like oh I'm pretty sure that Sarah Paulson and like a dollar bill. Yeah Mattie Ficale and then we saw nothing of her for like 45 more minutes and then she was on the red carpet and I my chat with Jessica is constantly me being like oh my god they're so and so. God I saw them on a live stream 45 minutes ago walking down this hallway. Clearly there was like you they weirded it online between arriving and actually doing the red carpet and then you think about the people who like Connor's story who drew the short straw of being the heated rivalry guy who had to arrive at the beginning like Claire Foye who was there so early that everybody forgot she was there. She was really and you think about when they went in and then how long they had to wait before everybody else even got there and like then everybody got stuck behind you know the big like Madonna and Beyonce who had eight you know Madonna I think had seven women around her okay with her veil which I didn't count to see if it's the same number of women that's in the painting she was referencing but it was she needed handler regardless. Anyway, she had a lot of them and they were doing a lot of stopping and spinning and wrangling and so people got even further backed up because like the livestream cut out after Beyonce and we still haven't seen Cardi B, we haven't seen Rihanna, we haven't seen A.S. Apraki, we haven't seen A.O. It's a debris, I don't think. Yeah, I'm pretty sure they weighed in a line. They like you there. Yeah, and they can sometimes be waiting. I'm sure Beyonce's not made to wait. I think they sometimes do have to wait. And there's another job, I think, keeping because you used to when right at the beginning of the carpet, you used to actually sort of see the crowd of celebs like James. That's right. They started to be waiting and they've sort of separated that a little bit more so that when you're looking at the red carpet, you're not seeing the log jam. All of that to say that like I can't imagine the event is all that interesting. If you finally go through the red carpet and you get in there and you're like, oh my god, there's two and a half hours before Rihanna's even going to leave her hotel standing here. Anyway, so I think that's another narrative though. It's like how fun is this thing really? Right, I know. Is any joy? Thank you. That's where that's where your girl Gwyneth, I think. Wasn't she the one who was kind of like, oh, it's not that. Oh, yeah, she said, she has said, yes, my girl Gwyneth Paltrow. Yeah, that is not fun. It's like, she was like, it's like hot and like crowded. I think that's what she said. Yeah, and like, honestly, she's probably right, you know, it looks fun from the outside, but that's the event where you're sort of like, once I get to the top of the stairs, can I put on sweatpants and go home? Is it cool? But she, yeah, I think she kind of tried to like walk it back because I think there was some, perhaps misunderstanding around whether or not those remarks were like for public consumption. But I do think that's kind of the flex is like being like, oh, I don't want to go. It's not fun versus like actually going. Well, that was Maryl, right? I think I saw a story yesterday that somebody was like, well, Maryl's not attending and they were like, but Maryl has in fact never attended it. She's never gone. Yeah. Yeah. I think her quote was, it's not really my scene. It's not her thing. That's not her thing. She does it. But you know what? That's not brand for her. Like it would be weird if she went, even though she's promoting this movie, that doesn't make sense for her. We don't see her at fashion shows. She's not like this a conspicuous consumer, really. I mean, when she's promoting the double or his gratitude, but otherwise no. And she's Merrill. Like she doesn't, she doesn't have to promote herself outside of what works she's contractually bound to promote. You know who Merrill Streep is. You know her brand. She can afford to just sort of sit at home and hang out and drink champagne, Martin Schward, and watch the live feed, which I'm sure is exactly how it played out. You think she watched the live feed? No, I don't at all. I don't. I think she's asking my finger to shoot. Reading a book with like a cup of tea or something. Yeah. No, I was like reading a book or you know, watching a foreign film. I don't know. She was doing something totally different. Yeah. Call it next to your daughter is being like, "Oh, you're having fun." Oh right, right, right. Yeah. Okay. So maybe we're watching the gilded age again. So I think another narrative is the theme. And I think that the tag and the basis is kind of overshadowed it, but it did break through. It did break through. This was so funny to me. Did you see the Whitney Museum? I saw this year before you got on. The Whitney Museum, kind of like through shade at this whole event and they posted on social media. I hear by order all celebrities to attend an art history class. That's really fun. Museum on museum violence. So funny. I love it. I love it. I thought it was a fun theme though. And I think, you know, I think you could tell which celebrities were better coached up than others, you know, like who? Who was better coached? Yeah, I think Angela Bassett did a really good job explaining the painting that her dress was based on and then sort of she made sort of a laughing reference to the fact that her version, her interpretation was I think she called it like a soft, a soft nod to the aging body because the girl in the painting she was evoking as young, which she said every, she said it with like a laugh. But I thought she did, I mean, I thought she was pretty clear about what their inspiration was. But then there were others who were like, oh, it's birds and birds are important. A lot of birds. Like red is like passion and art. A lot of birds. A lot of people kind of didn't didn't seem to understand. And I actually think I'm actually super curious whether Lauren Santos really 100% understood some of the references that she was making because obviously her outfit by scaperally was supposed to evoke Madame X, the famous painting by Sargent and you know, the woman in the black dress and he scandal a society because he painted it with her strap down and people were so horrified that he repainted it with it up and yada yada. And we had a couple different Madame X's and I read the vogue story in which she talked about that dress and you know, she, she mentions working on it with Danny Rosemary and she mentions law, roach helping her and figuring out and all she really talks about in terms of the references is the strap and being like, oh, it's just such an interesting piece of art to me because you know, it talks about the the ways that we view fashion as changed and like what scandalous has changed. That's really all it was. It's a very superficial read of that very superficial read. It's really famous for the part. I really need me wonder. I'm like, did someone get something past her on this one? Because you know, there's so many deeper themes to that one of which is that the subject of the painting was reportedly a massive social climber who married a much older man with means. I wonder if she woke up this morning and was like, oh, I don't think so. I mean, that's assuming she read anything about it when she woke up. She just looked at the pictures. But like her take on, I was basically like, oh, it's just so interesting how people perceive an outfit across time and I wanted a waist. I'm like, those are those are her two is that she she wanted to be snatched and she then she thought it was about the scandal of the strap and I was like, it is, but it's not. So I thought that was one that she either willfully ignored it or perhaps it was pitched to her with a slighwing kind of smile and a little bit of information left out. It's impossible to know if she understood all of the sort of undertones of her picking that dress or why it could have been seen as a subversive choice. I don't know if I think she's self aware or I don't like I think to her, you have a sense of humor about yourself in order to fully know and jump in with the feedback. I don't think she has a sense of humor about herself. I don't think so either. I mean, I would suspect that to her it was a dress she saw in a painting and it's maybe a painting she's heard of before. And it was sexy and somebody was like, oh, she's the ultimate sexy like it's the ultimate sexy painting or something like obviously it's not, but like that you feel like the conversation that was had to sort of bolster this idea in her mind focused on some details and not others. Yeah, but I was back channeling with a historian last night who was like the dress isn't blue, the dress is black. This is black. I know. I don't know why she did. It was the wrong strap that was falling off. Yeah, I don't know. I didn't look too closely at, I think Julian Morris was the correct side and Claire for was no, it was actually not Julian Moore, but I did like hers better. That was an interpretation of the same thing, right? Yes, Julian Morris and then Claire for was also Madamex and I can't remember which story. Okay, well, that's too many Madame X's. So then my question is, I guess, too many. You need one Madame X and I guess they should have like a sign up sheet somewhere like someone's got an Excel. They're like, okay, Sanchez already called Madame X. We can only have one more. So I do know that Anna kind of clears like 80% of the looks or like historically, that's what she's done and the reason she does that aside from her controlling nature is just to ensure that people aren't wearing the same thing, which is actually a nice courtesy, I think, to provide your guess when the whole point is just for them to get photographed wearing a dress. So they're not supposed to wear the same thing, but I think you also, they maybe need to add a column on their spreadsheet for inspiration because you don't need three Madame X's. No, you don't. And like I heard the word Climped mentioned a bunch of times last night too, it just sort of felt like there were certain go-to artists that people just sort of threw out there as the reason for the season. And I just, I mean, some of them were fun. Some of them I didn't really care. Like I think, I think if you're having fun with it, go like Robert Woon, I don't even know what he was doing. He was just like mannequins everywhere. Everyone's got extra limbs. That was just, I don't know what it was. It was fun. But it was, it was striking, it was weird. It was, you know, and that's kind of what I liked seeing that stuff that I got to do. And I, even though it's ridiculous, sometimes I get annoyed when something comes out and I'm like, look, like Amanda Sifred, she had this pink prod dress that was pretty and probably the Oscars would have looked great, but I was kind of lazy. Like what is the point? But also the themes are so loose at times anyway. And sometimes I find myself being like, yeah, okay, I don't know what, I think Jenny, Jenny Kim had a beauty. I think she was in a beautiful blue gown that I was like, I don't know what that's to do with the thing. Either way, man, I love it. So I'm gonna let that one go. So I guess it's subjective, right? I mean, it's always subjective, but yeah, I think it's good. I art, you know, art is subjective. So I guess that's, I guess that's the broadness of the theme. I think it's good to have that mix. What I really, I mean, I totally insane gowns with bubbles coming out of them and like Julian Moore, which I thought was beautiful and elegant and like kind of perfect. Yeah, I thought, yeah, I thought I think whose bubbles were creative. It almost felt more if they did a tech gala, that would feel, you know, it was very high tech, whatever she had going on. It should revisit the tech stuff next year, maybe? Now that it's coming up, I mean, I think it was 10 years ago, which was the monest machina, the intersection of fashion and the handmade and the made and that. I think that was one where Claire Danes had the light up dress by Zach Pozen. And so this felt more in that vein to me, honestly, but it was, it was Iris Van Herp and yeah, well, so my question about that dress was, does she turn it off when she goes inside and she's actually around real art? I have no idea. Like, like, do you think the bubbles is just like combing over with the art generating bubbles? Is it just blowing bubbles or? I think it has like a surface where you cut off a leg and so the bubbles are going to turn this regenerate. I think it had a little holes maybe more than one and the bubbles coming out. Yeah, bubble machine. Yeah, I was trying to figure out if the, yes, I couldn't quite figure out if the bubbles were, I don't know, I would assume she would have to have turned it off, right? Did she make a, like was she noisy? Did she need recharging? I just think you don't want the bubbles touching the like, touching the arm out of the eggs like a real amount of excess. I'm sure. I mean, I would imagine as soon as she got to the top of the, I haven't seen any pictures from inside yet, but there's a part of me that wonders if there was a different thing she changed into like almost immediately. So that could be probably can't sit down. But I thought it was like enjoyable to see. Yeah. I like Ayers and her pen as well. But one thing I will say about this theme and the, the dress is in the discourse around art, even though it was very elementary. And the, the celebrity's picked the most obvious references. I do think that was the whole point of the museum telling the costume institute to feature the Met's permanent collection because as Sean Talfernandas, the fashion reporter said recently on this podcast, the idea behind that is to ensure that the public is kind of appreciating the whole museum, not just the costume institute because he asked the costume institute will bring people through the doors, but the museum really wants people to get interested in the other things that they have to offer. So I think that the theme really served that purpose. Like there was discourse around it. Like we were talking about art. We had the museum on museum violence. We did. And I think you always are going to learn something about a different influence. I thought that last year too. I, I actually, I always complain. I'm like, I wish someone put out a pamphlet. Like I, in the moment, I want to know about what went into all of these outfits. And sometimes they tell you and sometimes someone doesn't get interviewed and you don't find out. And I learned a lot last year and I feel like there were times when I learned a lot this year. And I actually was not familiar with the painting that Madonna referenced, which I think I'm going to botch this. Was it Leonora Carrington was the artist? I don't know. It's fascinating. We have it. We covered her on the website and in drinks with broads, I think today in woodlinks. And it's, you know, it's a, it's very, it's similar but not identical. But you can tell when you look at the painting, you're like, oh, yeah, this is a female artist's work that she is evoking. And I was not familiar with it. And so I was like, this is school. That's kind of a nice idea. And I think it's really smart of the met to sort of cross promote itself that way. Now, did they put paintings out for people to consider or were the stylists sort of given the mandate to like, please draw our website or walk through our galleries and find something? Heidi Klum was the only one who actually mentioned walking around the met looking for inspiration. Heidi Klum. But she was Halloween. Yeah. And I love that about her. I got to say for so many years, she was reliably naked at everything and you were just like, ugh, boring. And Halloween was the one time of the year that she just really went all out. And so I feel like she heard the word costume and she was like, oh my god, I've got it. I know this. And I actually thought some, she looked crazy, but that was some insane artistry because you looked at her and you did think, like, oh, is that, is that hard? Is that paper mache like what's on her face? How was that working? And she was sort of like, look at it itself. It's latex. I can sit. Like dance. Like she was, she was loving showing off this optical illusion that she'd created or that her people had created. And so I thought that was great. I really was like more of cookie Heidi Klum always. Yeah. So it also was a little bit of a different way to represent sculptural art. Yeah. And the fact that so many of these dresses and that one included the art, it's the craft. Like the fact that that dress existed, it looks the way it did, but felt the way it did is art just in and of itself. Yes. And a lot of the dresses that were inspired by sculpture like Kylie Jenner, Kim Kardashian, it was like sculpted boobs and nipples and belly buttons and just kind of obvious. I'm kind of tired about that. Oh, why? Like, what is up with a Kardashian's and nipples? I just like, why is that their thing? Like, him sells the skims bras of the built in nipples and then two of her sisters wore them on the neck last night, which they claimed was a was not intentional, but I was like, Kylie Kendall. Yeah, I was like, it really feels cross promoted a little bit. Like it feels like your, well, Kim had nips too. Yeah, hers were like, you could sort of believe that they were the metal sculpted barbarella whatever, but theirs felt like, I don't know, I didn't think that. I thought Kylie really had a nip. I'm not sure if I'm really, I thought Kylie and Kendall looked terrible. Kylie was wearing scabrelly. Yes, and it just looked so cumbersome and heavy. And I remember, that's the one that I think she said took like 11,000 hours to make and there's 7,000. Oh, it does have a nip. Okay. Yeah, it has on the top. It was dropping off of her body and mononip bodysuit. I don't know. I was super under one on that. And I thought Kendall was really bright. Apparently when she got it side, because that bosom was being on winky on the red carpet about like, oh, there might be a surprise, which why you would do that inside and not on the red carpet. I don't know, but she ended up with some kind of wings like that she unfurled and they were like half painted wings and then the bond is yeah, and the bottom. Sorry, I'm switching geners on you know, I apologize. Yes, there's just too many geners. Too many of them. And they both had nips. Yeah, she had the, Kendall had the one nip hanging out and then the other part was covered. And Zach was all like, oh, I had this outfit was inspired by, he listed like seven inspirations and about how light and airy and graceful they were. None of which is reflect on her. Oh, Nike. The goddess Nike, right? I don't know. That whole thing was, I didn't get them at all. I don't know. And then I need to screw. Yeah, so my other narrative was just like kind of the most interesting looks. So yeah, so the nipples for sure, the Kardashians and their nipples. Yeah. I liked some of the outfits that were designed nudity rather than actual nudity, beige nips aside. I liked Chase Infinity and that very rainbow colored sequined gown by gosh, I can't remember because it wasn't Louis Vuitton and was it Tom Brown. It sort of depicted breasts in the front and then the rest of it was swirls and stuff. But I thought that was really effective and I Jeremy Pope wore a sort of a shirt that was a sequined reproduction of a muscular torso. And I thought some of that stuff was more interesting. You liked that stuff. And the people, I thought it was, you know, I appreciated it. And I appreciated that instead of the obvious, which was, you know, the Gigi Hadid of it all where you just wear a naked piece of mesh. Yeah, there wasn't as much of that as I had thought. And here it is. Like that. No, but I wanted to talk about Stevie Nicks wearing Galliano for Zara. Yeah. I mean, was that a Mac Gallaud Bingo card? No, I just looked like why. I think was this the first thing because they announced that collaboration and March, I want to say. Yeah, not all that. Maybe the first thing I'm going to say from it. I didn't really understand why Stevie Nicks. Maybe they have a relationship from him. She did some singing inside with Sabrina Carbina. I think they did Lance Light together. They did, but I wasn't sure why she particularly was Zara, the Zara, Galliano thing happened. I don't know. Especially because it was her first Mac Gallaud. And I mean, I guess I, with the top hat and everything, I suppose it did sort of seem Galliano. But again, where he land on that really depends on how you feel about whether he's rehabilitated himself or not or whether he sincerely has made up for, he was pretty heinous back in the day. And that's fine. He said awful, awful things. He's an understand. Okay. And that's a little bit more difficult so we can get some more specific information. Stevie Nicks makes a surprise and totally fab appearance at the 2026 Metcala. Naturally, the iconic Fleetwood Max singer brought her witchy, whatever kind style. For her first Mac Gallaud, she opted for custom John Galliano for Zara. It's a silk taffeta ensemble in midnight blue with a crinoline silhouette and an embroidered overly skirt covered in tool and chiffon roses and applique. Okay. Yeah. Velvet Jack in a top hat adorned with a feather. Okay. Created collaboration with Stephen Jones. He's a real thing. And she also were Tiffany, but it doesn't say anything here about any inspiration. So no, I didn't see that. I think he just, I think Galliano's here. I just wanted to make a splash. Yeah. I mean, I guess that's what they've got to do. They've got a warm us up for that. They do. And like, nobody cares anymore. It feels like he's wearing fashion. No care. I care. People have been wearing vintage hair. They've designed when he was in the throes of being heinous and they don't care. Like, they just don't care. So after, and after a while, you started to think, am I the only one chirping about this? Do I just need to calm down? I think it's just the press. No, I don't think we should calm down about it. I think that what he said was, you know, really vital. I don't know. It is complicated because I think a lot of people like the idea of forgiveness. Yes. I also watch the documentary. I don't think he seems sorry in his documentary. There's an element of contrition that has to be part of it. Like, obviously, I agree that everybody should get a chance to sort of grow and change. And I guess there's people who I just don't see that from. He's one. Chris Brown would be one. Dolce and Gavanna would be another one. That's my personal interpretation is that I don't really necessarily see any regret in any of that. And that's why I'm low to stop bringing it up. Well, he doesn't have a lot of reason to feel a lot of regret because he's always had like Anna Winter in his corner, whose triumphs his rehabilitate him and wants to do an exhibition at the Met Museum about him. There's never been any real consequences. There's never been any. I mean, yes, he sat out for a little while. He was benched, but he was never going to be out and everybody knew it. He was briefly benched. Yeah. It's also snow. This is like nobody, nobody really gets canceled. No, no, not even not even Kevin Spacey. Apparently, he's still working. Yeah, nobody really gets canceled. No, hardly once he might be the one. Maybe. Yeah, well, he's in jail and right. If he wasn't in jail, would that be still be true? I don't know. He was at the Mech Allen many, many years. He's in the first Monday in May. Anna's like fretting over how he's going to feel about his seat. Okay, but let's talk about Beyonce before we go. Yes. She hadn't been in 10 years. She wore this skeleton inspired dress by Olivia Roussneung, who was up until recently, the creative director of Balmain. She came with Blue Ivy, who was wearing Blenciaga, sort of really cute, I thought inappropriate for her, like white Blenciaga look with like a very cute jacket. She's 14 years old, typically you're supposed to be 18. I guess to go, but she got to go because it rhymes beyond say, "Yes, fair." I don't know, would you think of Beyonce's return? I was underwhelmed. Look, I think she, of all of the hosts, I think she went the hardest. I thought Venus Williams looked the best, but and I thought hers was really creative, and that's a, you know, that was wonderful. I thought Beyonce went the biggest, obviously, in a way. - Definitely. She's your volume. But I didn't, I wasn't that impressed by it. I was not captivated by the execution on that. It reminded me a little bit of one that she wore, obviously more than 10 years ago. I don't think it was the last thing she wore at the gala. And I believe it was by Javanshi, 'cause the last couple of years she went, that's who she wore. I was like a black and purple, ombre feathered bottom of the dress, although the train was nowhere near the length of this one, it was much shorter. And it had sort of see through elements and some black detail in it. - Yep. To me, this visually, this skeleton look that she created with the silver sparkles really evoked that, even though obviously her reference here is a skeleton, and there it was not. But I did laugh because like this design, I don't know why it didn't just stop at her pelvis, why her spine had to go all the way down to the floor. It was like, is this her lizard spine? Somebody in the comments on our website was like, is it a mermaid skeleton? Is that it? Is like, what's happening? What is their understanding of anatomy? Oh my god. - What? - And when she'd walk, when she walked, like the spine part that came like, that was down on her skirt would just sort of do that. And he would like, her spine is just a rough-- - Like a tail. - I don't know, Beyonce, I didn't love that look. - No, I didn't. - I thought it was good from my friends. - When you couldn't see it, and all you were looking at was that train on the stairs, she understood the stairs. Like I often find the stairs to be underused as a photographic moment. I never get tired of a photo of a train on the stairs. I know that's probably very basic, but I just don't get sick of it. But it's telling that I liked the outfit better when I couldn't see anything but that part of it. Like I just thought the skeleton part of it was really literal, I guess, and in a way that didn't excite me. I didn't think their interpretation of it was exciting. As you said, I thought it was a little bit silly, as I said already. And I think honestly, like, one thing that it did is it really made Blue Ivy pop in comparison. Like that dress from Balenciaga was very simple. - Super cute. - But I thought she looked fantastic in it. It's, I don't know how she pulled that off. She's 14. It's a dress you could see on a much older person, but she didn't look, it didn't look too old on her. Like there was just something, I think it was a somehow, her vibe just meshed with it really well. And I think she did a real credit to them all. I think I thought she looked great. I think, you know, I understand why Anna isn't inviting celebrities on their own who are younger than 18. I don't really mind them letting celebrities who are the co-hosts bring their kids. I was fine with that. And I thought she looked awesome. - Well, I bet Blue Ivy's gonna have a big role in Act 3. And I'm really, really excited for Act 3. So, you know, people really wanted this to be a hint toward Act 3. - Yeah. - I'm sort of, now that we've seen it, - Do we think is Act 3? - I don't know if it's a hint toward Act 3. - I think she was trying to nod to the theme and just kind of get us excited about her return. - Yeah, I don't think, which we aren't. - I think right in that, I think if it was about promoting anything, I think it was about giving the spot, seeding some of the stage in the spotlight to her daughter. And she even said, like the reason for coming back and like the fun of it for me this time is getting to see it through her eyes and getting to experience it with her. - That's cute. I mean, it's too bad that it was like boycott the bass. It was Matt Gallup, that's still cute. - I know, I think, I don't think it really can have mattered that much to any of them. - Yep. Okay, so I wanna call out one more thing before we go, which is that Casey Wasserman was on the red carpet. - Nobody gets canceled. - Yeah, so he, Casey Wasserman is the guy who's selling his talent agency, like super major talent agency that used to represent Chapel Rhone and he received, I don't know, backlash or scrutiny over emails with Galein Maxwell, the Epstein co-conspirator. Yeah, I just wanna point out that he was there, like, yeah, okay. - Nothing. - Yeah, nobody cares, nothing matters and nobody cares. - Nothing matters. So then, closing note, like all the negativity, the controversy, the protests of this gala. Do we just forget about it in a couple of days and move on? Does it affect any of the celebrities who went, I was listening to Jennifer Welch, if I've had it this morning and she was talking about how, she thinks it's a very, very bad look for the celebrities. I don't disagree with her, but it's just like, you know, in the imagination of the general public, like, does it stick to any of these people? Or do we just move on in a couple of days? Like, we always do from everything bad that seems to happen. - I think it only sticks to the ones people already dislike, I think that's human nature. I think not a single person who is excited for Act Three is gonna not buy Beyoncé's album, even if they hate the bezos and they hate it. - She will be forgiven. - She will be out there protesting. They're all gonna buy that record. I think, you know, they all are gonna go to Sabrina Carpenter concerts. I think if you already disliked Blake Lively, for example, you're gonna maybe hold her feet to the fire, but if you like her, you don't care. If you, you know, and that's true of anybody, I don't, I think for whatever it's worth, I would be interesting to see if I'm wrong, but I think all of this stuff is gonna be fairly disposable. We will still be talking about the bezos, but by June, I don't think anyone's gonna be thinking about the myth. - Yeah, and then in the fall or the winter, when they announced the next year's theme, I do think it's still possible for them to do something that's not so tacky and gross as like invite bezos money to pay for it next year. I mean, look at last year. Last year, I think was really sort of a well-liked and admired event, super fine tailoring Black Style, celebrating Black art, Black dandism, and fashion sponsored by Louis Vuitton, but it just went over much, much better. And I think that they can probably do that. - We have a law here, and I'm hoping what they learn from it is not what I cynically said, which is that nobody cares. I hope what they learn from it is like, we have some time to sit back and sit down. - But that nothing matters. - Is that the question at this time? - Nothing. - Nobody cares but that nothing matters, yeah. - Yeah, like I hope, because I think, I mean, because the thing is it does matter, whether anyone's feet are really being held to the fire, I don't know, but like, the stuff is important, and like they have a chance here to try to do something different, and to not bring this back upon themselves, because I do think as much as this will die down very quickly in the news cycle, replace it with something else, it is an annual event. If you do it again next year, it's gonna come back next year. Like the story isn't gonna go away just because the news cycle quiets. So you have a couple months, guys, to chill out and figure out how to fix it, how to be better in 2027. - Yeah, I think just don't ask the basis to pay again. But anyway, let go of Lauren Sanchez-Vogue. Oh my God, please. Lauren, go underway. - We'll walk out of her anal canal. - Let her go in her way. Maybe pass her after they had any fear. - Yes, let her go. - Okay. - How are always so great to have you. Thank you for coming on the back. - Thank you for letting me come in, Vent. - Yeah. (upbeat music) (upbeat music)