Meeting our Rainbow Baby : VBAC after loss

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I think what I became apparent is when I felt the responsibility to take my mental health seriously and my therapy goals really, really seriously, just so I can show up as the best version of myself every single day. I have seen so much progress in myself through therapy, and I truly recommend BetterHealth because of the way that they are so accessible. You can do it, like Matt said, online or through the app, and that can work with you and your schedule and your specific needs. Don't let stigma stand in the way of support, start therapy with BetterHealth. Sign up and get 10% off at BetterHealth.com/UnplannedPodcast. That's BetterHealth.com/UnplannedPodcast. It had a lot of fear, knowing that I was going to the same hospital where we delivered our daughter, knowing that I could be in the same exact room where we stared across at an empty incubator. That's where the redemption comes from. Every step of this birth story was shaped by Emerson's story. Poor buddy came out with bruises on his face because he had just smacked into every bone. I didn't even know that could happen. I don't know how you pushed him out that quickly. We have a very special new addition to the Howard family, this name is Fisher James Howard. I was going to say Baby Fisher because this is what we've been calling him. Fisher James Howard, we almost changed his name last minute though, funny enough. Yeah, we kind of freaked out in the hospital. Just because he was born on the same exact day as Abby's dad, and the same day of the week, Abby's brother looked it up and realized that he was born on a Tuesday and so is Abby's dad back in the 70s. Kind of crazy, Abby's dad's name is Matthew. Matthew, so then we were like, well, I guess maybe we could give him my dad's name safe right at the time, but then it's also your name. We've also called him Fisher internally since he was 10 weeks gestation. Then we were like, we're going to confuse our kids. We're going to confuse everybody. But where's Baby Fisher? Because we've talked about Baby Fisher for months now. And I liked the idea, but it just felt, it just didn't feel right and so it was like we got to stick with the original name and because like he's Fisher, like that's just his name. That's just who he is. That would have been really sweet. But he has your middle name. He does, which is kind of fun. You guys share middle names, which is really sweet because you're Matthew James. It's my dad's middle name too. And this is Fisher James. That's really sweet. Sorry, I'm distracted. There's literally sweat dripping down my armpit. I'm so sorry. The hormone sweats are crazy. How often are you getting those sweats? It just really hits me like, do you need like an ice pack? Do you want a drink of a cold iced tea? So hot. No. No, you're good. I'm dripping. That is that fuel. I'm putting an ice beverage. You need to stick that right between my. Okay, you're okay. It's like that's so bad underneath my armpits, so bad underneath these guys. Bad. I'm impressed that you just got him to fall asleep because before this podcast, he was crying and I couldn't give him to stop crying and then you just did. You have the special touch babe. It's the buttpats. The buttpats. Okay, and he just loves his mama. Did you know that a lot of people already knew his name? How? I said, I made a video and I was like, there's a baby name hint in this video and everyone got it. Literally everyone got it. Well, I feel like we should go back to the beginning. Yes. Back to the day of your due date where you went into the labor naturally. If I sound so dumb in this podcast, it's because it's just like right now, I'm like in a newborn bliss, but also some type of fog is hit my brain. You are not dumb. There's a disconnect. There's an unplug that has a switch needs to be turned back on in my brain, but yeah, I feel like my brain has just been living this day over and over in my head. So this should be good to talk about this. It was just like so crazy. What a whirlwind. Right. I said you went into labor naturally, but technically, technically no. Yeah, your water was broken for you. Do you want to tell everyone about what happened? So honestly, the day was the day I turned 40 weeks pregnant and I had a 40 week appointment with my OB that day. And so it worked out because I mean, we slept the whole night, the night before, took the kids to their like little three hour morning preschool and each of their different schools. And then we picked, well, okay, so while they're at schools, when I had my appointment, but you were going to have to end up picking one of them up. And so I was like, I'll just go by myself. These appointments are super quick. Like you, if you've had a baby, you know, like at the end, when you're going weekly, they basically just are like, okay, but great. Thank you. It looks good. See you next week or not. You know, those are kind of like all those appointments at the end. And so I go by myself and like I just go in. They're like, well, would you like to have your service checked? And I was like, sure, why not? We'll do one final membrane sweep just to see. At this point, I had kind of lost hope of like not like going to the hospital before my induction at that point. Like I was like, it's just not my body. It's just not going to do it. And so she goes and then this wasn't even like she hadn't even done like a membrane sweep at this point. She literally just did a cervical check and immediately like there was just like a gush of water. And she goes, oh, I've actually never done that before. But I'm like, she's like, I'm so sorry. I just popped your water. And my water broke everywhere. And it wasn't like a trickle. It was like a gush of fluid. And I was like, you know what? This is actually the best case scenario for me because I would much rather because that's what my induction was going to be. Like the induction plan was literally like if we got to that point, it was going to be way later on in that night. If we could like originally was supposed to be three a.m. Like imagine starting that whole process at 3 a.m. But the plan for the induction was literally just to do just that was to rupture my membrane. And so I was like, well, this is just a million times better because it's now it's before noon. And I got to sleep last night. I got to see my kids this morning. I'm about to go pick them up from school and then maybe we can have this baby before bedtime. Like I was just like, I was just so there's so much like a adrenaline release at that point, you know, because then you're like, oh, it's happening. And it's like happening now. Yeah. When you called me telling me that your water broke, I was just taking it back because I was like, how dumb am I to not expect for this to happen on the day of the due date? Because I was going to go pick up the boys from school. And so we agreed I stayed back, get the boys from school, you do the doctor's appointment. And we just like both didn't really think through the fact that your water could break or by them doing something with the membrane sweep that that could. It's not entirely common, I don't think. Yeah, I don't know. I guess like hindsight's 2020, but you called me and I'm like, how dumb. Like, why am I not there with you right now? Oh, it's fine. I was like not even having contractions at that point. Like it was just it was like totally fine. Yeah. So they gave me like this little tiny pad. And I was like, man, I'm just like dripping out of this office. And this is like a shared office space. It's not just for like OB and gynecology stuff. And I was just like waddling out. And I mean, it's like dripping everywhere. And I'm so excited. I call you. I call I text every like all my friends. And I call my mom. And because I asked her, I was like, so what do we do? She's like, oh, she's like, well, I guess I'll see, like she just stopped the appointment there. And she's like, okay, well, I guess I'll see you at the hospital. And I was like, oh, I gotta go. They were like right now. And she's like, yeah, you gotta be there within two hours. And I was like, oh, okay. And then we were just like, I mean, we're ready. We've been ready for weeks at this point. But for whatever reason, like when it's actually time, you're like, okay, and like we were even planning on going that night. So it was like, we were ready. But um, it's just so exciting. I thought it was funny that you came home. And we just took like 20 minutes to eat sandwiches from Jersey mics together. Because you got a fuel up. I mean, it's, yeah, it's so joke. But I mean, I guess we had the bags packed. Things were ready to go. We're a couple of things that we needed to grab for the hospital. Um, but that was just, that was really exciting. So exciting. And like, we got to give the kids another hug before we left. I mean, they still kind of went about their day. We were hosting swim lessons at our house that day. So we, everyone we saw like, we're going to the house. Abby, Abby's like about to give birth and people are coming over to our house for swim lessons. We're just like saying hi to everybody. And I love it. Yeah. It was great. That was really sweet. Oh, it was so exciting. Yeah. I, I guess we're things kind of took another jump forward to the top. is when you threw up in the car. We're in our brand new vehicle, and it's like, it's one of those things where, I don't know if you guys have ever gotten a new car, but I love that new car smell, and then you just completely. - My bad. - of Chuck, your A and W. Rupier, all over the middle. - My little church, nice. - So then we're in the hospital parking lot. I'm using this towel that I had been sitting on, and so that I wasn't gonna get wet from Abby, like getting the driver's seat all wet from her while I was thinking. - Oh yeah, 'cause there was like a puddle from when I drove home from the OV office in the sea. - Thank goodness I had a towel on me, but then I'm just cleaning puke out of the center console in the parking lot of the hospital. - Yeah, so you know that car's also gonna be sitting in the hot sun for a minute. - Yeah. - While we're in the hospital. - But I think we got all the, I think I got the puke all out. Like I just had to get some, people are like all clicking off right now. They're like, this is disgusting, where he's talking about this. - It's gonna get a lot gross. - But like, we just took hand sanitizer and started spraying it everywhere just to kind of like sanitize and take out the puke smell. But apparently, when you throw up, that's a sign of active labor. So that was like-- - Yeah, okay, also I should say at this point, I was like starting to have contractions. - Mm-hmm. - And I honestly feel like they were kind of close together at this point. - Yeah, yeah. - But I like, they weren't crazy. Like I was able to check in with the lady, and it kind of took a while. And she was like, take a seat. And I was like, no. I'm okay. I gotta stand for just a minute. And she's like, oh, okay. And so, yeah, which is always so funny. And just so America, we were sitting, like going into labor, they're just like, okay, like you gotta pay for your epidural. You gotta pay for how many hours you're gonna be here. - Are you sure that you want the 24 hour package? And I was like, I don't, I, I'm sure. I like just let me go see a nurse, please. And so, we're waiting, and I mean, it really wasn't too long. But get back to our room, we meet our nurse who was so, so, so sweet. And it was just go time from there. Our doula came, Rochelle. And I don't know at this point, I feel like. I was in, I was like so unaware of how fast things were gonna move from that point. Like, I'm really glad we didn't wait for the 5-1-1. Which we weren't supposed to anyway, because they knew my water had broken. But like, if I would have waited till my, we had five minute apart contractions lasting one minute for an hour, oh my gosh. - Yeah, you would have given birth at home. - I don't know, I don't know what would have happened. - I thought of Salaris, you guys, I was tracking Abby's contractions on this app on my phone. And then the app told me, "You better go to the hospital. "You're probably gonna get first to. " - This is as we're walking the halls of the hospital. - Yes, at the hospital. So I'm like, "Okay, I guess we're in the right place." But I think, I think just seeing the speed at which you progress and the speed at which. - I thought I was like going crazy. - The contractions just said you, that's what was weird to me is like, Abby, this was the first time that I like, that I ever saw you have contractions just like where your body made it happen. It wasn't induced by patosis. - Yeah. - There was no drug making your body contract. - Yeah. - Your body was just doing its thing. And I think you described it like your body was having an exorcism, right? - I felt like there were some exorcism going on. Yeah. - Just 'cause like there was nothing you could do to control it. Your body was doing its thing and you couldn't stop it. - What's so cool though is like how it happens gradually. Like I always say like each contraction like prepares you for the next. - Yeah. - And they like get progressively like more intense. And I think that's a great design. Because then I was just like, it wasn't, like it gets to the point where when we were like in transition I was like holy cow. Like this is getting to be really intense. But it's like you're kind of like eased into it if that makes sense. - Yeah. - And so we get there, they put me on the monitors and I had told them like my goal is to not use like any type of like induction medications if at all possible. And especially because this was, I think they call it a tollac attempt to labor after cesarean. Just to like reduce some of our risk factors. I was like, I don't wanna use any like medical, like I was trying to avoid pitocin basically. - Yeah. - And like I don't even know if you can use certain cervical ripening things. But we knew we weren't gonna probably need that. That point because we were already like out of five. So we go into the hospital out of five with my membranes ruptured, monitored me for a while and then I was like, they I think they just mounted me for 20 minutes and then we start walking. - Yeah. - And things are starting to like pick up as we're walking and like that's when you were like tracking them and just getting really, like this was like, really fun and exciting. And then by the end of that, like I think in my head I was like, they told me they were gonna check me at this point. So there's no way I'm gonna like ask for them to check me earlier because I was just like, get to that point. It was nice to have like a marker like that. And so I have my headphones on and like listening to music and like you're just like doing your best trying to figure out what to do. But I feel like at this point, like we were still, no, that was sweet. I feel like we were like, you were hugging me during like contractions and this was like. - That was something that was super cute. Yeah, every time you'd get a contraction, at first you would go to the wall but then you started going to me and just putting your weight on me and I would just hold you. - Yeah, I really liked that point. It was like, it was kind of like, I don't know, grounding to have like you right there. And so then we go back to the room and then they tell me to lay on that bed and get monitored and that, which I understand and like appreciate that they're doing that. But laying down then I was like, oh no, no, no. I hate this so much. And so trying to like lay still while they monitored me and the baby was like getting more painful at this point. This point, not that much time had passed. It had been two hours, I think. - Yeah, yeah. - And I hadn't had any medication or like they hadn't done anything. And so then they're like, I don't know if you're gonna wanna get up again. Like they kind of said that to me and I was being stubborn. I was like, no, because I knew that we had the goal of like being in transition when I got the epidural. So I was like, I know I'm not in transition yet because I don't think they checked me at this point. - They didn't check you. - But I felt like I would have known if I was in transition and turns out I wasn't but I was pretty dang close 'cause when I stood up, I just felt so many different feelings and then I had to go to the bathroom and that's when you really realized, oh, things are happening down there and but then I was like, I'm gonna keep walking 'cause we like, I knew that that was gonna be like, that was just the plan to stay as active as possible before I got the epidural. - Yes. - Pretty soon, I just started getting, I think I started just being noisy in the hallway. Was I being noisy in the hallway? - I mean, you were, you were going. - Oh no. - Oh no. - Yeah, that's what it sounded like. - I was making a scene. I've been embarrassed. I can never watch, I'm not gonna be able to watch that back. - Why are you afraid to watch the video? - I'm just a little embarrassed. - Like the noises and stuff. - Yes. - But you're giving birth, like you're actively laboring your bodies, having contractions, trying to push out this eight pound, 11 ounce baby. - Well, I just, yeah, I watch other people do it, but I'm embarrassing. - Today's episode is sponsored by the ASPCA Pet Health Insurance Program. - As many of you guys know, we have a new addition to our family, but last year we added a furry friend to the fam. It's just the best thing our kids get to grow up with the dog. I love it. - I quickly got more attached to her than I ever thought I would. You found yourself urgently googling things. You're not alone. Pretzel, infamously, A to B. - You did. - And I was panic. I love this dog. And those moments of panic come with pet ownership. 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And so we had to get the fluids. - They kept asking you, do you feel like you need a push? - Yeah, they thought like, yeah. - Babies coming and I think, I think you were just like. - I was like, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. I was like, no, I'm not that, I'm not there. - And at the same time that you were requesting an epidural, there were multiple other moms that were requesting epidurals at the same time, which created this whole backlog of epidural needs and they had to make a decision on, okay, who do we help first? - I'm so grateful that my, I'm so sorry to those other moms, but I'm so grateful that my doctors and my nurses advocated for me because I do know that I was further along them and also because I was a to-lack. Like there's, it does kind of can up your priority in the hospital. - Because at that uterus ruptures, you want to have an epidural for whatever happens after that. - People do it unmedicated, but that was just, that was what we had established like as the plan, ideally with like my doctor and like with my doula and everything. - Yeah. - And so they're like trying to get me these fluids, but the fluids take like 20 minutes and things are progressing so fast. Like I think the contractions were one to two minutes apart, super, super, super intense and like, we almost did not make that because I think 30 minutes after they had the epidural in, he was out. - Yeah, I mean keep in mind you guys, this was the quickest labor that Abby's ever had. - Oh my body had never, like, I took 27 hours. - Well yeah, with your, with our first, it was 27 hours. And then this time around, we're talking six hours, ish, a little over six hours. - From. - 'Cause I think your water broke, well, it depends. We count it from when your water broke or when you started having like active contractions. 'Cause your water broke around 11.40 AM. - Yeah. - And then we got to the hospital, you know, a little bit before, what is that, two o'clock? And then baby was here at 6.42 PM. - Yeah, I'd say from when we get to the hospital. - So we're talking four hours, 42 minutes of labor. - And so that's, I mean, that's a great, ideal, amazing. And so we, it was just really exciting at that point because like, my doctor comes in, she's like, I really feel like it's time. And she was like, you're out of 10, here we go. We're like, shut the blinds, they turn on the spotlight. And it was just like, I feel like at this point is when I like felt like I couldn't like actually, I felt like I was like, oh my gosh, is this like actually happening? It was just so surreal. - Rewind though for a second, because I think there was something, there was a big shift that happened from you having these extremely bad contractions. - Oh yeah, then it got really fun. - To you getting the epidural, like what, what did that shift feel like? - Ecstasy, what's the word bliss? - Yeah, I was like, oh, I mean I could still feel like my contractions, but oh my gosh, like nothing like they were before I was so happy. That anesthesiologist, that epidural, just, you know, can't thank them enough. - It's actually like, just crazy to think that your body's doing all of that without you pushing. You're not making the contraction. - Yeah, your body just knows what to do. - It's happening to you. - It's crazy. But then when you have the epidural, it takes the edge off, or it takes the mega edge off. Like it was that epidural, then I was like talking, which is actually crazy though, because even when it was like in the most intense part of it, I felt somewhat normal in between them. And then I felt embarrassed every time, because I was like, I was just yelling, so then I felt like I needed to like crack a joke. - Okay, first of all, there's no need to feel embarrassed, second of all, most women when they get the epidural, like it just, the way it affects their body, they can't move their legs. A lot of people can't like lift their leg. - Yeah, I guess not everybody. But for you, it was crazy. Like you can move your legs just fine. You can wiggle your toes, all of that. - I put my own legs in those stir-ups, and I'm like, here we go, like what do we have to do? 'Cause I remember that the doctor, you know, she was too shocked. They're the nurses' shock that you can move so well, even after the epidural. - Yeah, I don't know. You would have thought I did hard drugs or something, you know, no life. - Yeah, wait, what did the epidural feel like? Like going in, was it painful for you to see me? - Yeah, it doesn't hurt going in. - Did it just feel like someone was stabbing you in the back? - Feels like a straw is going in your spine. - A straw? - It feels, I don't know how I explain it actually. - That's kind of freaky actually. - It doesn't feel great. - Like a metal needle, like did you just feel like there's a-- - You feel, you feel like going, I mean, they numb the area, but then you can still feel it going in. But you're like, please do it, do it now. - Yeah. - And do it good, do it, get it right on in there. Like, you're so grateful for that, 'cause that pain is so much less than the contractions. - You're tough. - It was great. And so, no, then I was like having so much fun, and I feel like then I was like, I have the clarity of mind to feel excited for like this huge moment that's about to happen, which was like our goal the time I said, my birth plans to have fun, and then the fun started 30 minutes before he came, and I felt like that time I was literally like able to just be like, we're about to meet our son. And I'm gonna cry because I'm so hormonal, but like getting to, like, I'm so grateful for that time, because I was like, these are the last moments before we meet him, and like having that like relief helped me process that. And so she came in at, what was it? 6.45? - No before that, because he was born at 6.42. He was, I thought he was born at 6.52. - I think he was 6.42. - Okay, either way. Someone, she comes in, and she's like, okay, here we go. And then, so part of our birth plan two was for Matt to catch the baby, and I say catch, but like, - Deliver. - Not deliver either, but just like, you know, be able to like, be some of the first hands that like, put him on my chest. Obviously with the doctor's serious assistance. So you glove up, and then it was go time, and then we had two contractions, and then buddy was out. - I don't know how you pushed him out that quickly. Two pushes, you guys, two pushes. - It was such a blessing. Like it was just, we got, it was just. - And on the first push, I could see his head. - Yeah. - He was right there. - Yeah, that's crazy. - Abby actually pushed him out so quickly that poor buddy came out with bruises on his face, 'cause he had just like, smacked into every bone down there on the way out. I mean, there was, I think it was good that you just got about quickly. Like you don't, you don't wanna have a baby just hanging out there. - But I don't know if that has to hurt. - Oh, yeah. But I mean. - That makes me sad. - He's doing great. - Yeah, so he actually came out a little too fast. So his face got pretty bruised, and they had to put a sign on his little bass in there. That was like, I'm okay, I'm just a little bruised from making my grand entrance, because I think that they were a little concerned that nurse's coming in, as they should be, would think that he's not getting enough oxygen because his poor face was purple, I was sad. Like gosh, he came out fast, but he's moving that far. Like, I don't know, that was wild. So he, and so we had our successful V back, but how, I mean, we were kind of like talking about this. It was successful because he was delivered vaginally, but we did have the same complication that we had the first time that resulted in our C section the second time because he tricked us. - He did trick us. We thought he was gonna be a little bitty guy, maybe seven pounds, but he weighed in at eight pounds, 11 ounces on 8/11, August 11th, which one of the chances, the, one of the nurses actually was making a guess of like what she thought the brubing. - And I thought there was no way, I was like, no, we had so many scans, and usually I know that those, they always tell you, they're like, this is our best way of figuring it. They're not the most accurate, but usually I feel like they're always telling you, like, you're gonna have a 10 pound baby and you have a seven pound baby. - Yeah, it was funny though, 'cause people were putting in their guesses, and then somebody goes, wait, what if he's 8/11 on 8/11, and sure enough, that's what he was. - 8/11. - That's what he was. - 8/11, and so we did have a less severe shoulder dystocia. And so I don't even know what our doctor did because she's just so professional and like, she was just so calm and under control. Um, but. She did tell you right before we pushed 'cause we knew that this was like one of our risk factors. Like if it gets hairy, just step away. - Totally and that's what I did. - And so Matt, we could tell that the same thing was happening 'cause his head was out and then I could tell that there was a complication there. And so Matt just stepped away and they did some, some, some. - Did some different maneuvers. - Did some, some. - I was not able to deliver him because of the shoulder dystocia. - Everyone was very calm. - Yeah. - Yeah, I was concerned. - When I say, I mean, am I saying that incorrectly? Catch him, I was supposed to catch him. - Yeah, yeah. - Yeah, you're the one delivering the baby. But. - No, I mean, I feel like the doctor's the one delivering the baby. - Anyway, it was just surreal. It was such a happy moment. I was really happy because I did not see you in nearly as much pain as you were with the first natural birth. You know, when Abby delivered the first time. - I don't even say that too, it's fine. When Abby delivered the first time. It was just so traumatic, so bloody, so horrible. I just felt horrible for her. I just, there was nothing I could do about it at all. So this time seeing it be so seamless and quick and you weren't obviously in pain, but not like, not this like torturous, excruciating, you know, medieval torture device pain that I saw from before. It was just way better. So I was just so happy for you. It was crazy how like all of our hopes like for this birth were just met so perfectly because like the whole time it was like we really hope that the epidural works. And it did. - Yeah. - We hope that it'll come naturally. I'm counting this as naturally. Nope, no induction medications. - No patosin to get them out. - We didn't even have a induction, we didn't show up for an induction either. - That's right. - It just didn't happen just the way we thought. But it certainly did. - And a successful V-back. - Yeah, you guys, the induction was scheduled for 9 p.m. on the 11th. And all of this happened, you know, way before. - And that's only if there's beds available. You know what I mean? It could have been, it could have been way later. - Yeah, so I was just so happy that you got the V-back that you wanted. We got our baby after you'd been pregnant for like a year essentially, after the miscarriage. That was awful, that was horrible. - Yeah. - And so everything happening the way it did. - Ah, I was just so, so thankful, so blessed. Could not be happier. - Yeah. And this is where I'm gonna cry. But so yes, it was like a successful V-back. But then we keep saying like the word redemptive keeps coming up because for me, like the redemption part of the story just really comes in. I don't wanna talk about this too long because I feel like I haven't even collected my own thoughts. Like enough about this. Like there's just so much to it. But this is just, I'll just share like a little snapshot of like how I'm feeling about this birth post loss. I don't wanna speak for all moms, all lost moms. But for me at least, like you've lost, if you've lost a baby, like you've lost the privilege of any of this ever feeling casual. - Yeah. - Not that I ever felt like, I think casual, I don't know the word for it, but like there's a certain element that can just feel like, yeah, I guess casual. Like just like we've talked before, like blissfully ignorant of like what things can look like when they go the worst way imaginable. And so I had a lot of fear going into this bird, knowing that I was going to the same hospital where we delivered our daughter, knowing that I could be in the same exact room where we stared across at an empty incubator knowing that nobody was gonna go in there. And just like even had a lot of fear that I was gonna go into labor at the same time of day, didn't see the same thing as I'm walking into the hospital, see the same like lighting, see like I just had a lot of fears of like walking down the hallway again, just had so many bad associations with that space and like the birth experience because that was a birth, it wasn't my birth, but it was birth. And so I just had like a lot of a lot of fear and just a lot of, I don't know, it was so witty going in. And so I was so grateful that the sun was shining. A room was oriented totally the other way. - Yeah. - And it just felt like a completely different day. They had fetal monitoring on and I was just like up and moving and there was a lot of excitement. And so that's where the redemption comes from. It's like it's not that we were like rewriting that story of that experience, but we were writing a new one where there was like life and hope and also just like a deeper reverence for this experience, this beautiful, beautiful experience, like what it can be because like fully shaped by the story that we had with Emerson. So yeah, I'll probably have a better, I'll probably be able to articulate my thoughts more about like having a rainbow maybe like later on. But like every step of this birth story was like shaped by Emerson's story. - You're doing so good. - And so that also just made everything so much more beautiful like and just so much more precious. Nothing like this, I will like will ever be casual again. Like it will always, it will always be a miracle. And so no matter how it happened, just like having you hear an arm like yes, it's amazing that everything worked out like textbook like we wanted, but like just having every, like just having him there on my chest, like I just couldn't stop saying like I'm so glad you're here because there's just no other words. It's really scary. - Yeah, it was really scary. - I didn't want to voice the negative thoughts, but like I would be lying if I said I didn't have those thoughts of like what if it all happens again? What if the exact same thing that happened last September repeats and that terrified me. So I didn't even want to like let my brain think about that. So I just tried to think like push all the negative ideas out and so I don't know what and I don't know what we would have done. Like I don't know what you do. I don't know what people who have experienced two consecutive miscarriages or in this case would have been a stillbirth. So that was terrifying. So I was just so so happy that it all worked out. Really like it felt like a movie. It was like it was like just this like movie moment of you getting to hold our beautiful little boy after all the hell that you went through last year. And yeah, I just I don't know what we would have done. I mean, I know we would have figured out a way to get through it because if there's anything that you learn from like devastating situations, is that there's life after them? Yeah. Like as much as like it doesn't feel like they're it. There can possibly be like really dark days. Like there is life after. Yeah, there's still hope for the like something like this, you know, I feel like if I could just show, if I could have just shown. Oh my gosh. I feel like it's in as much time as you need it. I feel like I probably wouldn't cry this much if I wasn't hormonal. Yeah, I'm like every, it's a lot, it's worthy of tears. If I could have just shown even just that picture we posted on Instagram, like that one snapshot. Yeah. To my self last September. Yes. To have one of just, it felt impossible at that point. So to see that that would have like been so crazy, but you don't have that privilege, you know. And so that's why pregnancy after loss is so hard is because you just don't know. You don't know and you're more aware than you ever, ever should have to be that you don't know what's going to happen. Yeah. And so that sigh of relief when the doctor put him on my chest is like a, is a feeling that I cannot, I don't have words for. It's just the biggest relief. And he's been such, such a good baby, such a sweet baby, such a chill baby, chill as baby we've ever had. Chill as baby we've ever had. Yeah. We've had some wild ones. And we love them. Yeah. I love them. I love them. I love them. We love them so much that you know, drove us crazy in the night when we got up for the 50th time. I was worth it every time. Oh, yeah. And I mean, we're certainly waking up in the night. But it's just, he's been such a gift and this whole experience was such such a gift, gosh. And it was so sweet because we did. We had him by bedtime. So big brothers got to see him. and hold was so funny, is that our whole, we have such a sweet, close-knit family, we talk about our family all the time. They were there literally minutes after his grand entrance and they came in the labor and delivery room, it wasn't like the postpartum room, like they were in the labor and delivery room. - I made a group chat and so within, I think it was like five or 10 minutes from when you gave birth, I went ahead and messaged a photo to everybody and say, "I know I really can take your family." And then boom, like everyone just dashed over and within, I think within like 30 minutes or an hour, we had your parents in the room, our boys even showed up wearing big bro t-shirts, which was so cute. Your brother was the first one to show up, like when the first one there and Addy came and it was just so, so sweet, so sweet. - And I loved like, you just had this, like newborn, like just gave birth high. Like, it was like, it was like some sort of like, you fork high that you were experiencing with holding him afterward. And that was just so sweet to witness. - Yeah. - Sweating again, sweating a lot. - You're sweating, the postpartum sweats were just hit. - Whoo, sweating a lot. But yeah, it was so, so sweet. Just like the brothers, like our whole family just in there and then, yeah, adjusting to life with three boys started right then and there. - Yeah. - I think there's a lot of emotions from everybody. - I mean, our boys were just, I think curious more than anything, like is this really him? He's the baby that was in Mommy's belly and just. - Yeah. - You know, they wanted a whole thing. - I've been asked so many times by them if there's another baby in there. - Oh, I'm like, is there a baby in there? - But it's big. And I'm like, yeah, then we'll go down, maybe. - Kids never, like, sees to humble you. - Yeah, and they notice that my boobs are bigger so that they're like, is there maybe in there? They actually ask that. - I just think there's a lot of confusion. - I didn't hear the best, that's funny. - So, you know, they're just humbling us. - Thank you to Upwork for sponsoring this portion of today's episode. I'm a huge fan of Upwork. I've actually used the platform before to find contractors to help us. The most successful business owners don't do it all themselves. They delegate. Upwork lets you build a team of highly skilled specialists for every function your business needs so you can focus on what you do best and let experts handle the rest. Upwork gives your business fast access to highly skilled specialists with deep expertise. So you can fill critical skill gaps, launch projects faster and scale support up without committing to full-time headcount. - You can browse profiles, review past work, and get help scoping the role so you can hire with confidence and get started quickly. With Business Plus, you can access the top 1% of talent on Upwork. AI-powered shortlisting delivers a curated shortlist of top freelancers matched to your goals and under six hours. No endless searching required. - Visit Upwork.com right now and post your job for free. That is Upwork.com to connect with the top talent ready to help your business grow. That's u-p-w-o-r-k.com-upwork.com. - Thank you to ZopDop for sponsoring this portion of today's episode. As many of you guys know, two years ago, I was diagnosed with ADHD and I was able to do that because my wife scheduled the appointment for me through ZopDop.com. - With your permission. - With my permission. If you haven't heard of ZopDop, it's an app and website that allows you to book your doctor's appointments on lines that you can take them from the convenience of your own home. They have more than 150 providers with 200 plus specialties across all 50 states. Appointments happen fast, usually within 24 to 72 hours, and you can even score same-day appointments. - You can find and search doctors that are in your network and take your insurance, trying to understand my insurance and connect me with a doctor that is accepted by my insurance and ZopDop makes that so seamless and user-friendly. - Your health matters and taking care of yourself shouldn't be complicated. Find and book the right doctor with ZopDop. Head to ZopDop.com/unplanned to get started and check that appointment off your to-do list at zocdoc.com/unplanned. - My favorite, I think it was Oggy wanted a hold fisher, really, really bad, and then he's holding him for like 10 seconds and goes, "Can you get him off me?" - Yeah, that's mostly what happens. - Can you take him away? - But we kind of have just been like following their elite, I feel like with that type of thing, and like whenever they interact with him, which they do, they like sing to him, try to peek a boo, they asked to hold him, like we just kind of like take their lead on things, and there was certainly some emotional shifts from both of them that kind of surprised us a little bit, and so, and I felt like a little bit guilty about it, and so you left right after, because our kids really needed you, our big boys really needed you to put them to bed. And I was like, "Yes, go, we're okay over here." - That sounds bad. Our oldest was so upset that we weren't putting him down for bed. - I don't think it sounds bad, that's just what happened. No, I was like, they were just like sad that our routine was different that night. - I guess one of our friends, their husband like literally left for the entire night to go be with their firstborn. - It's a big deal for bigger siblings, like especially when they're more away or like four or three. - Yeah, and when you're like a three-year-old, just you know, tantrums hit, emotional-- - They were really sleepy. - Yeah. - But there's just a lot of change happening, and so it's like, we feel like a lot of emotions from all the change happening, like of course they do too. - Yeah, so to try to make the transition as smooth as possible for our four-year-old and our three-year-old, I left for like an hour, two hours to go put them down for bed. - Yeah, not even two hours, but mom stayed with me. - Came back, just traded positions with your mom. Once the boys were asleep, and your dad was at the house with them, because your parents spent the night at our house that our kids could, you know. - Keep their routine as much as possible. - Sleeping their own beds at night, and then-- - And then you took them to school the next morning. - Morning. - Yeah, woke up the next morning at 7.30, and that night, you know, really wasn't too bad. The first night, I feel like, is always the worst. You know, there's so much exhaustion after everything, especially for you freaking giving birth, like it's just a crazy whirlwind. So that first night can be crazy, but really wasn't, you know, we didn't get up that much. - No, I think there's so much-- - I think that's like, maybe we got up in the night? - Yeah. - Maybe four, I don't know. - Yeah. - But left at 7.30, dropped him off, dropped both boys off at school. - I think we learned that, like, maybe we adjusted our post-partum plan more than we thought, just because it was clear that our sons just needed that. - Yeah. - And so they needed to be in their own house, and they needed to have you to come back, like if it all possible, to like, meet their, like to tuck them in, to take them to school, to pick them up from school. They needed that, like, consistency, and they needed it from, like, one of us. And obviously, I couldn't leave the hospital. So I was really grateful that you, like, we were stable, and my mom came to be with me, and you, like, were able to take care of the two older boys, and they, that really helped them a lot, and worked out great, 'cause I was like, "I'm just snuggling, like, this little baby." And I felt pretty good, like, especially, could pick him paired to the recovery, like, post-c section, I felt pretty good. And so, yeah, that was great. - We had a lot of visitors at the hospital. - So many visitors. - My brother, my sister-in-law, your-- - My niece and nephew. - Oh, yeah, niece and nephew, your friends, Val, and Kaitlyn, who did a cameo on your always-year podcast, they came to visit, which was really exciting. - They actually came right after they filmed that. - No way. - Yeah. - That's actually funny. - And so they stopped by after filming that, which was so sweet of them. And my parents came again, they brought the boys again, and 24 hours later we were released. - Released. - Which is such a relief, because I feel like I was starting to get those day two baby blues, I was like, "Get me out of these four walls." - Yeah, I thought it was funny to get it released from the hospital, you guys. We had to, like, sign paperwork and stuff, which makes sense, but because we have a health share, and we do self-pay, and the health share, like, reimburses for stuff afterward, I had to go have a conversation with, like, the finance people or whatever, and they're like, "All right, your total is this much." And then they said, "But that doesn't cover the doctor, or the anesthesiologist." Like, it doesn't pay for that person, it doesn't pay for the OB, it doesn't. And they gave, like, we thought we were, like, paid in full, and they, like-- - No, we know better now. - They hit you with, like, you owe four other people money for the firm. - Yeah, really? - So make it as confusing as possible. - It's always funny, whenever we talk about, like, medical stuff, we always get tons of Canadians and Europeans that are like, "This is ridiculous, I can't believe that it costs that much money to have a baby." - I mean, it is pretty wild. - Yeah, but-- - Anyways. - We got released, and then I immediately felt so much better. And then we needed, I, like, absolutely needed the kids to stay, like, our whole plan, postpartum kind of got readjusted. 'Cause I was like, "I need all my kids, I need my whole family under one roof right now." - Yeah, well, I think it was actually very enlightening because when I would go to the bathroom, they had, like, statistics on the wall about, like, postpartum, and one of them was that 80% of moms experienced postpartum blues, not postpartum depression, but, like, baby blues, just for a little bit, after having the baby. - Yeah, they said, like, it's like three weeks, three days to three weeks. Yeah, and it's it's very common like really the majority of women experience. It's a huge shift. And so you were already really opening up to me about that. And that's when you kind of realized, I think I need like more people. I want to be. I need my kids all here. I need my friends here. I need my family here. Because initially the kids were going to go spend the night with your parents. No, no, no. But then you're like, no, I want my parents to spend the night at my house. I want my kids to spend the night at my, so then we just end up having a movie party. Yeah. We hyped it up to the boys. We're like, guys, guess what? We're going to have a movie party tonight. We're going to turn on turn on Aladdin. Honey's going to be there. God's going to be there. And so I'm sure for you that that was like extremely helpful uplifting. Our friend came and brought us pizza. And then every night since we have had friends and family bringing us meals with a meal train. And like basically anyone that offers to come in, I'm like, please actually just eat dinner with us and bring your kids, bring your whole family. And I know that's not everybody's preference. But like that has been helping me like so much. Yeah. And it's been so sweet. Well, because because postpartum can be very isolated. Totally. So having everybody come dine with us and hang out and their kids play with our kids. Yes. It just makes our house feel like it's full of life, you know? Yes, exactly. And so we the first night, well, I guess that first night our friend's angel, angel and maf brought us food. But then the first night that we had people like actually dine with us was like an adi. Like an adi. They brought us food. Then with brieel. Yes, with brieel. Then then your parents some like were in there somewhere. So I know your parents have like spent a ton of time with us. And then we've had my brother and my sister-in-law Caleb and Abby. We've had Caitlin and Bennett. Caitlin who you guys are going to meet from the always-seer podcast. Yes. So many people in our life have just been coming over hanging out with us. And that's what Abby wanted just to feel feel the impact of our community, which when I thought about this baby for the podcast, we didn't have the community that we have now with Griffin or Oggy. No, we did not. There wasn't like, I don't know if we had a meal trade, did we? No. Like, that was just that was kind of all on us. I mean, we had some friends that were like so nice that just decided to make us food or. Yeah, we had people show up, but this is like entirely different, honestly. Yeah. It's just the community's own to be so much more than it ever was before. Yeah. And it's been such a blessing. And it honestly makes everything about this experience has just been so different because of that. Yeah. And I'm just so grateful. I can't even put to words like the gratitude I feel. And so, um, yeah, this is just like my best advice is that like build out your community. I know that sounds like so easier said than done basically, but like it starts with serving. And it starts with just like making yourself uncomfortable for other people. And I know that that can be like a little bit. I don't know. There's there's conflicting messages out there, you know, in culture right now about that. But like it has just been it's like you don't give to get, but like this is what that that's what community community is, you know. And it's just like just showing up and just that I cannot tell you how so many people have shown up for us. And it's just can continue to show up for us. And I'm just so so so grateful. Like even just like thinking of like getting things for our kids or like can I take your kids and like we'll play with them. And then I'm like, yeah, but let me come to like so it's just been entirely different and just so grateful. Yeah, you've been doing great. I mean, you've been getting out of the house. We just had a date today and got some brunch together. Yeah, with our little third wheel. First date with our third wheel Fisher. So that was fun. And I think, you know, just getting getting out and being about has been amazing. Yes. And I guess we just really weren't able to do that because you had a C section last time, which that recovery was horrible. I mean, that just that recovery was I mean, it wasn't horrible, but it looks a lot different. Yeah, like you don't have as like you can't drive. I couldn't I wouldn't have been able to take into his doctor's appointment. Yeah, like I couldn't lift like his car seat things like that. Like really grateful for this type of recovery process for sure. Now granted, you're still in pain. Like you're still you're still sore down there. You literally just pushed a baby out of there a week ago. I still can't believe that like the fact there's stitches in places. The fact that you like that that entire human was inside your body this time a week ago at the time of recording this. That just like that blows my mind. It's so crazy. Like I said, such such a miracle. You did. Oh, I think we forgot to mention you did have a second degree second degree tear. Yeah, we did once again. I was kind of planning on that honestly. That was also in the birth plan. But I guess they that's what they want, right? Like I noticed, I could see her like pushing down to to force the tear down because you don't want it tearing up. Huh? You don't want that tear to go. No. Vertically. Thank you to Yodo for sponsoring this portion of today's episode. As a parent, sometimes you just need a few uninterrupted minutes and screens can be an easy answer, but we have become the huge fans of Yodo, you guys. We've been recently catching our toddlers in the bathroom listening to their yo-co. Yeah. I love how they have the autonomy to choose the story that they want to listen to. Totally. And the Yodo is a screen-free audio player for kids aged three to 12 that bring stories, music, learning, and imagination together in one simple device. Kids just pop in the audio card and like Matt said, they can take the lead themselves. No cameras, no microphones, no ads, just their own imagination running the show with more than 1,300 audio cards, including stories in Spanish and French. There's something for every age and interest. I know our boys specifically love the Paw Patrol stories. The reason Yodo has become such a big part of our routine is because our kids genuinely love it. If you're looking for a gift they'll actually use and enjoy. Head to yotoplay.com that's Y-O-T-O and use our code unplanned to save 10% off all eligible items. Add a little more imagination and a little less screen time to your family's day with Yodo. Thank you Yodo for sponsoring this episode. But oh yeah and breastfeeding has been like pretty good. Yeah. Why are you saying that? Lots of milk. Abbie guys okay just to fill you in okay. We have a court okay. Four cups. That's how big this container is. It's a it's a milk holder. I'm sure most women you know might might fill this thing up over the course of the week. Every day Abbie fills this thing up with her hawk a bottle. Yes. So she's she's feeding she her milk supply is insane. So she's feeding fisher on one breast and on the other one has the hawka and that excess milk fills up a court every single day. So we have multiple gallons of milk already. Multiple gallons frozen. It is wild. Well okay wait me do the milk. By the time that this is out. I think we have two gallons of milk. We've got two gallons of breast milk. It's been six. It's almost seven days which is wild because my milk didn't even come in for like three or four days. I might be spreading the truth a bit. Okay it's definitely it's close to two gallons. Here's the thing it doesn't really matter. We have a lot of milk and there's like I'm this is I like this. Like people are like oh you need to like limit that. I'm like no I it makes me feel safe to have like extra milk. Like I may I'll enjoy this. It's a blessing. What did you say to the lactation consultant when she told you not to use a nipple shield? Didn't say anything I was just like noted. Well she's like well it's a barrier I was like I I want a little barrier. You're like I got to have. I love the snuggles but like don't for me. I don't need that. But you know what I I admire everyone's process. Yeah you guys Abby stuck to her guns. She brought we brought we had the frozen colostrum with us at the hospital. Anytime we had to you know give a little extra. I'm so glad we had that. We just got out the colostrum that was frozen in the freezer and and boo yeah it was right there. We didn't need to use any formula. No supplementation with formula at all. Period. Yes. Period. We followed her rules. Oh the one rule though we had a revise was the one about me telling like Abby encouraging words when she was having a contraction. She was just like stop talking I don't want to hear you say anything. Did I say that? Not like I mean something along those lines. Yeah. That's what you said. You're like just shut up. I was night. Did I say that? You can tell me to shut up. Oh okay. You you just said like please stop talking. I have a contraction right here. I don't think I said words. I think I was like no and it was so great that we had our duel too. I also need to say that like having her there was so good and just gave us like just so much more support that like we had great nurses but you never know we already get it. Oh yeah. And she was amazing to have there. She got us colvers. She got us colvers and Blake and Adieu. We had double colvers. Got double colvers. Which was amazing. Yes. Oh I mean I was so hungry. And oh what I loved about the duel is sometimes I was like I know I'm supposed to say something right now but I don't know what to say. I don't want to say the wrong thing. And then she like she just knew like she was like a she was an expert birth person. She just knew what to say. Really? And she was like helping you know because I could hear her like telling you like she's in transition now. Yeah she was filling me in on like what was What was happening? - Yeah, and she's like, do this, do this. Like, she-- was kind of coaching you. And then also she like helped me a lot like when things were really intense, she's like put her hand on my knee and it was like felt so like oh my gosh okay like someone's here like I don't know I didn't really want to be touched but then that felt really good. I mean obviously she just has been at so many births she knows what to do. And Abby's doula is trained in placenta encapsulation. Yeah that's right. So I am currently in the process of turning Abby's placenta into edible pills that Abby's going to have. So so far. Let me let you guys know how that is. I've been vlogging the whole process. This is going to be a whole TikTok that I post of me dehydrating your placenta, dropping it up. I made a little heart. Oh I'm excited to show you a little heart. I made you like a heart out of your the umbilical cord. So that's. You cannot post that. Okay well I don't get like flagged as like sensitive content. I have to be creative. It's an organ. It is an organ but there's other people that make placenta encapsulation videos on type talk. You were always going to do this? Yeah. Yeah. I feel like you guys never said that. There's always a doula who is going to be doing this. Oh yeah no so I'm I'm doing it. I actually who was funny, Abby. Oh I thought no one do that. So I did it myself. So she actually just like verbally walk me through it and I did it. So I I was the one that I so what I did I first she because she's been formally trained and so okay. We didn't tell them that Matt was going to do it with the doula. To be fair to be fair because I was going so freaking slow she did have to do some things herself because I was like okay I'm taking a million years to. It's your first time to divide up the placenta but yeah I clean I first start off by cleaning it and then after cleaning it I like sanitized it with I think it was vinegar and then I chopped it up into little pieces to put into hydrator trays and then it dehydrated for 24 hours and then this was right before we went and looked at your house. Yeah. This is right this is what I did. You went straight from there. That's why he drove separate. Yeah the reason I drove. You can see my face on. Yo I did it. Yeah. It's all on video too and and then next I'm going I'm going back over I think in like two days to like literally blend up you dehydrated placenta to put it into pills. No no no you have to be certified to do it. Yeah so she's. He just wanted to be there. Yeah no it's not normal. Totally. No you cannot do this on your own. I thought it would be. No that would be not okay. No because she told us that she does it herself and I was like there's no way I'm like you got to teach me like I want to learn so now I'm not like certified to do it but I. You have to be certified. We shouldn't say that. Yeah but she. She is and so she was like. Also with the caveat there's probably going to be somebody in the comments that's like hey eating your placenta actually doesn't have like scientific backing. You're right. And there's not like there's not firm evidence on it. So it's all it's all based off of women's experiences. Women who have said okay I ate my placenta it made it really helped me with postpartum depression whatever. So that it's all based off personal experience. Okay and also. There hasn't been like clear clinical research to back it up but we thought like dude there's some great vitamins and minerals in there come on. We're the only mammals that don't eat our placenta. Which is what? Back to that. Until now. Abby's eating the placenta guys. No so I'm not the first human that's ever done that. Yeah I'm proud of you for doing that. That's pretty dope. That's because it's kind of sick actually if it's awesome. I mean I'm not eating it. I'm taking it in a pill form. In a pill form. And it's been dehydrated. Is that true? There are no more exceptions. Aquatic mammals. Well how are they going to do? It's going to float away. That is kind of crazy if you think about it. Like this is an organ that your body grew. People are also not following up with these mammals about their mental health. And so I would like to think that they're also finding baby blues. That's a good point. I want to know how I want to see what mental health looks like from a monkey before and after the either placenta. Yes. Mother dogs. Dogs do it. Do dog keep their placenta? Yes I do. Check that. In other news, Abby's been going around and showing her friends pictures of her boobs. Dogs do their placenta. I have. Abby Abby at the at the trampoline park the other day is like she's like hey friends look at this. Well you know why it's been a topic of conversation. I didn't I just I asked them beforehand. It is crazier that it's bigger than your butt at this point. Every time you say that. Why are you always shocked? You know it's just impressive. It's honestly I'm amazed. It's really it's too much. Well this whole past week have been a whirlwind babe but I feel like a lot of people are probably wondering how your mental health is doing after after everything. So good for compared comparatively to like all my like other like postpartum experiences like I feel like so I don't know maybe like the third time around is the charm we've learned from different experiences. So in the hospital they did a really good job of like educating I will say like those videos they had us watch about like postpartum depression versus like anxiety versus like baby blues. Like I feel like that education really like solidified in my head like in the past like I was just having baby blues pretty significantly like I especially got them at the at sundown and like it just starts to feel like you know it's just it's just a hormonal sad like ups and downs and that's exactly how I felt especially well honestly really strong the first and second time this time around like I feel so much better that doesn't mean that I don't still feel like those like hormonal highs and lows I definitely do but just like whereas like say the roller coaster was like up here and down here both times I feel like we're operating at like this type of curve if that makes sense. It was really sweet because I went on a run a couple days ago and I get home from the run and you're in the playroom with the boys they're you know building stuff with their magnetiles you're you're nursing fisher and you just started crying because you were so happy and you and you literally said to me you go this is my dream. See now I'm going to cry again but I've just been like I've just been so happy like I'm just so happy. Yeah that makes me happy. Yeah so happy and so that doesn't mean that there's like not times where I'm like oh my gosh like life will never feel normal again like that's more so like how baby blues hits me is that I'm like oh my gosh like well like life will never feel normal again but then you just always it always comes back around it always feels normal again but there's just been so much happiness and addition to that that it's like been so much more manageable and it's so cool to look at our three and four year old and know that that's what this little guy I know and I also think they're so freaking cute they're so cute they're the cutest I just want to squeeze the things that they say are so funny too and I think that also just makes like the third time around like it's just it keeps getting more special because you you just like when that baby is born you know like you know there's so much good to come like so many good memories to make together and it's just the beginning and so yeah having that perspective has also shaped like my mental health experience like in the past and I also have so many people checking in on my mental health which is really really sweet and like I just yeah I feel kind of like yes like I feel like it's so it's so I think that's just the part of it like we just need to talk about it more and so yeah I just feel I feel so supported I feel so grateful so happy like so there's so much positive that it has like made the baby blues like so much more steady I think there's so many factors at play there's no way to escape the one one last time last time you were going through this postpartum thing you had just had a freaking c-section your body was doing the most recovery I mean like I don't think people nobody can understand how intense a c-section is until they go through it like it's just yeah and I had a fairly easy recovery compared to some like it's it's a major surgery the cut open your your stomach yeah all of those intestines are like pulled out so that they can take the baby out anyway so yeah this time you're not recovering like you're recovering from the regular birth which is which is still it's so intense yeah but the newborn we have an easier newborn than before yeah so we're not waking up as much in the night you've got an incredible community and then what was the other thing oh we don't have another baby because our our boys are oh yeah big rage gap also made this smooth there I believe yeah because we had another kid in diapers last time so it's like I'm just I'm so happy that it's been a lot better of an experience yeah and also we're just more seasoned parents yeah that makes sense like it is kind of like it like we're on autopilot in a way yeah like we that that experience like experience has also just made like for instance for me like his like him getting him crying. I feel like I'm able to talk to the kids like our bigger boys about it in a way that I like wish that I couldn't have told myself the first time. I'm like this is just how babies communicate that they have a need that we need to meet. Whereas like before that like like our babies crying would like spiral me. Yeah. And so like it would I like felt like I couldn't even think clearly because I was just like so concerned. And so there's just like a lot more like experience that has like shaped these I think we know how to operate as a team with a newborn and then also just like having our bigger boys too to like keep us moving keep us getting out of the house that has also just been like really good because that's the biggest thing for me with baby blues is like feeling like oh my gosh life will never return to normal. I'll never do the things I did before. I'll never want to do the things I wanted to do before and the like life as I know it is just unraveling and so like knowing that like they're constant for me and I'm there constant for them. Like it's just like it feels like like if our family is like an ecosystem like his like him adding adding fishard to like our family has just felt so natural. And like relatively seamless. I don't know it's been it's been so good and I'm just so grateful. It's been hard like it's never easy to have a baby. It's never easy to teach a baby how to eat from your body like it's never easy to like have multiple wakeups in the night. It's every easy to heal from birth but like this has been such a blessed experience. Yeah I think the caveat we we do mention is we still you know we're getting up two to three times the night with Fisher. We have a kid probably waking up twice the night. Yeah that's a spooky nightmare you know so that that's like an addition to the wakeups for the newborn and then we also have a three-year-old that keeps getting out of bed around you know nine o'clock ten o'clock especially if he's had like a longer nap that day and he's having trouble falling asleep so it's still not easy. It's a little bit spooky to go to bed knowing that like three different yeah it's three different humans could be waking you up and will probably be waking up at different times. And going to bed knowing that you're not sleeping through the night you're gonna wake up you know three maybe four times. Yeah but you know it's it's so much better. I've got so much more use to that though yeah like it's just like oh that's that's the thing that happens in this season of life. Totally. And I think that also just we know how fast it goes that it's like this is just a snapshot. Yeah. And life will look totally different a year from now and a year and this year will fly and and we're gonna miss it like and so there's just like that perspective that you have to like after all of like the experiences we've had like that perspective shift is like crazy and cool but yeah wow. Well if you found this episode in some way encouraging or uplifting please don't be afraid to share it with somebody that maybe has gone through something similar like we have so that they can know hey there's light at the end of the tunnel for you your story doesn't have to end with you know it doesn't have to end in miscarriage doesn't have to end in this horrible thing and there's hope and so I think especially too like after after having two really tough newborns obviously we've only been with this newborn for a week but he's been the chillest newborn that we've had I mean he's literally he's not crying right now he hasn't cried this entire podcast. He's so sleepy that's the thing. He's sleeping. He's a good sleeper. He could wake up next he can be roaring like a lion yeah that'd be okay too but I babe I just gotta say I'm so proud of you um thanks seeing you just mother and and I'm proud of myself you should be proud of yourself you're you're crushing it I mean you I saw you push a baby out last week. That was so epic that was legendary yes and that was game day and it's just it's sweet because I I know this is something that you've been looking forward to so literally since you were a kid you just you always knew that you wanted to be a mom yeah oh we're gonna cry again and and here we are like you're we have a we have a family of five now it's so cool just like to just really feel like you're like living your purpose like yeah in life like this and I'm just so grateful that I get to it's such a blessing to cry I like love being a mom like literally so much you're so good at I'm addicted to it you're addicted I like I like love love this I love all this but I never did oh wait this is really what I wanted to say I actually was like if I say one thing on this podcast I really want to say this so frick I hate that I'm saying it out the end so move it what is it move this the beginning I know we'll clip it we'll make a clip out of it move it to wherever people will hear it but like if you're listening to this I want to say thank you so much because this is why I get to spend so I get to spend so much time and focus my energy of my favorite thing which is my kids and my family and the privilege is not lost I'll be that I get to have this flexibility that I get to call this work while I'm holding my baby that I get to adjust my schedule so I can drop my kids off at preschool and pick them up and wake up with them in the mornings and put them to bed at night and I know that's not the reality for a lot of moms and that breaks my heart and I just want you to know that like because of your viewership I get to like literally live this dream and so like so grateful for the podcast I'm so grateful for our audience and for this like opportunity to have a platform but ultimately I'm grateful because of this like the life that it has given me with my children and with my husband so like I just I just I that thought has not left my mind for the past like seven days and I just really wanted to make sure that like you heard this like you listening to this heard this because yeah it's never been about like likes followers engagement it's been about this and so thank you this is like a this is a gift that just like is utterly priceless and what a privilege like seriously so I just want to say that because I literally just haven't stopped thinking about that haven't something about that so thanks put that wherever people hear you said you said that beautifully yeah that was beautiful yeah thank you I love you I gotta go I really didn't think this was supposed to be like happy you know and I and your thing I'm like so happy that it makes me cry but here we go wrap it up thanks guys thanks guys we'll see you in the next episode thank you guys we love you bye