Media Corruption and Public Trust in Journalism with Roby Alampay and Jaemark Tordecilla

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You're listening to Puma Podcast. I just welcome this opportunity for all of us to talk. As I said before, if we do something wrong or we don't, we don't have something wrong, but if we do something wrong, we will do something wrong. So I think it's just healthy, or okay, I will lean into this. I will lean into this conversation. The other side of this, and you went through this because you're a TV person. There's an active choice of the network. If you see the platform, you can see it. You don't see it. You see it. You see it. You see it. Okay. Thank you for your time. I'm Rob. You know Pai Puma Podcast and we are the editor at large. Puma Podcast, Jay Markton, D'Cilia. You're here for an episode of "Take a Take-A-Nac." Always timed in a man J, yeah? I'll start by, of course. We want to talk about media ethics, always timely, always important. But of course, you know the moment we're having right now. We're talking about Mayor Vico Soto's post about the corruption in the media. You shared that post. What was your instant reaction? It's a scenario with the 100%. Obviously, my reaction was a reaction to the post of Mayor Vico. My reaction was a reaction. I actually shared the sentiments prior to posting it. I felt like, "Off the interview, right?" So that was the first thing. After I shared it, I did have time to think, "10 million," to talk about it. But I was breaking it down in terms of how libelous is it? My deniability was that I was breaking it down in terms of how libelous it is. I don't know if that's enough. But for me, I shared it because the bottom line for me was not Kourina Julius Babau. The bottom line for me was his saying, "You want the corruption, right?" It seems like all acknowledge that we are, we are going to be affected. There are sins of commission, there are sins of omission. For me, that's why I shared it. I was familiar with Julius Babau's interview. Even before this sharing, even before the elections, I found it odd. Like, when I was younger, I found out that I had a career in life style treatment. I found it odd because Julius Babau is the face of a prime time use program in TV5. And then, on your off time, you're going to consort with Chaiting Nathisepin Politico, but the rich and famous. And obviously, Metlit Metton had to make them closer to the masses. So, Menjo of Nion, in Simulapalang, is there a line there being crossed? Especially since you're still the face of a prime time use cast. You already know that I didn't know there was such an interview. I just mentioned it after the post. But it was off. We always talk about bloggers and content creators and news personalities. Are there no lines anymore? Or is journalism or is being a journalist something you can turn on enough? The answer is no. I remember they've been as a Senate hearing type. We weren't even talking about journalism at that Senate hearing. I was talking about the Senate hearing. But we were talking about influencers and content creators. At the same time, Mocha Uzon was at that time and an officer with the Presidential Communications Office. And we were asked a similar question, "Is there a line between her being a content creator and influencer?" And being a public official? And you know, there are a lot of things that we can talk about here. But at the same time, Mocha thinking, "No, if you are a purveyor of news, information, commentary, you can't really say that. This is a journalist. This is a public official. This is a private citizen. I do think that you offer yourself up there as a credible face and voice for reliable information. There's just no getting out of that." And in the same way, on the other side of it, your interview with Kila Diskaya, I think. - Kuyakurl. - Yeah, that's right. And that's right. It's not that bad. It's not that bad here. It's like a private citizen. No, you couldn't take away. I think that's splitting hairs when you say, "It's not that bad because of the campaign period. This was before the ban on campaign materials and so on." I think all of that just acknowledges it. That you know that there's a line. So there was a line on both their sides. And for me, Indy Mupuiding Sabihin Muradion. I'm trying to figure out why I am so bothered by this. And I think it goes back to "Napagusa Panateni" to my episode "Snaten" in Pumapadkasiong. Episode "Naten" with Atom and "Volt" of 5P in India, right? I think it's very important to be conscious about who we platform and whose stories we center. Especially given that there's already very low trust in media, media organizations in the Philippines. And so I find it so problematic that the stories you would choose to center. Atom Maiyaman. Makagandayonkoche, right? Instead of the communities we're trying to serve. And that was the big lesson of fight and many other media organizations around the world too. You know, center the voices of the audiences and the communities we serve. And in this case, in India. So I think that was my first problem with it. Even before the 10 million. Even before any talk of whether there was corruption or not. Even before any allegations. Because as we know, trust in media is low. And I feel like when you see the media, we'll see that if you make a lot of money. That's a lot of things. But it's a very simple thing because it's a discourse. I have an essay writing on Facebook. We'll see that in the media the past few days. But of all the sectors who have been involved in this corruption issue. We have government, resmen, we have private businesses, contractors. And we have India. Only media is doing any kind of soul-searching among their role in this. Because there is no soul-searching in my policies. There is no soul-searching in the business. And we'll see that in our industry. We'll see that the role we're in in the future is to make our question. Is that so? Is that so? Well, I think that's an interesting point. But I'm sure, if I'm political, right? I'll tell you. That's why you're looking for soul-searching. Because the day after tomorrow, you'll see that you're looking for soul-searching, right? You'll see that you're going to sell it and so on. So now you have a moment where you miss more, you have to reflect. When you say political, by the way, let's use, not only the politicians, but let's use Dikusoto. That's what he was. He was a politician. Basically, he was saying to me, "Hey, it's not like that, it's like that, it's like that, it's like that, it's like that, it's like that." Or even for the businessmen, for the big businessmen, or even private citizens, that's what he was saying. He was saying that he's going to sell it, he's going to sell it, even if he's going to sell it. And so on. I think they will say, I think, and they will have a point. That's what he was saying. We'll see what we're going to do. We'll see the day after tomorrow, hours after tomorrow. Now you have a moment. And that's why you're talking about this. So I hope personally, I just welcome it. I just welcome this opportunity for all of us to talk. It's just like you said, if one day, if one day, or we can't say it, I don't know if one day, but if we can say it, we'll have a point. We'll have a point. So I think it's just healthy. Oh, okay. I will lean into this. I will lean into this conversation. Oh, the other side of this. And you went through this because you're a TV personality. Mm-hm. But there's an active choice in the network. If you see the, this is what the platform is. Isn't it? You don't see it. It's in Julius Babel. If you see it, it's just like the TV controller and then later on, the front line, same with Godina Sanchez. Why is there not a more soul-searching discussion among media executives about, you know, who we put on camera and who we give this platform to because they might turn around and do vlogs with questionable personnel. Even those who don't do vlogs with questionable personalities, but they do vlogs with artistas, you know, they said that they deny it. Oh, that's an anonymous vlog. They deny it, I know. But what do we do about these personalities? Because someone who worked behind the scenes. Yeah. In the respect of our new friends, from the Greer Report TV, even if it's a basketball, we call it the GME, that's the basketball. When you see the PT gel, the reporter, because they respect the cameraman of the drivers, from the reporter. So, your help to this higher pedestal, should there be more soul-searching from news executives and media organizations about who we put on camera and who we give this platform? I absolutely agree. By the way, let's give everybody context. I was an executive at TV5. I'm no longer am. Actually, right now, he's picking it on and off. I have to always come clear. I'm now at PLDT. I'm no longer with, I'm no longer with TV5. But that's the point, do I? I resigned all my shows at TV5. When I took the job, due to it's a PLDT. Yes, I'm still the owner of my own media startup and I have to walk that hydrope also. It's not easy and there are dilemmas that come with that also. It's a long-awaited sponsor. It's a long-awaited partner, right? It's a long-awaited career-leaning program. I wish. I wish. In that, right? So, I completely, I guess what I'm saying is, I know, I do have that hat and I do have that role, both in this small media startup as well as in one of the biggest networks in the country. And what I can say is, absolutely, yes, there has to be soul-searching, there has to be policies. And I think it's safe to say in a manner, it's not as if it doesn't happen. It's not as if it is not happening. I've worked with my counterparts. We're all friends. It's a small family of media, including the executives, especially those who came from from Jornalism. And I can honestly say, you know, when I have conversations with executives, news executives from ABS/CBN, GMA, Iqao, Mataskarate, Executive Karindosa, GMA, we've had conversations, not just at our level, but about how all the way to the level of owners, they have to contend with these realities. And they have to contend with these dilemmas. Because it's not always true that, for example, the platform that is based on Angkor, or the Angkor-credible reporter of Inaket Gilwanga. Sometimes it's the other way around. Sometimes the market dictates that the potential of the reporter is in the social media, and it's a superstar. That's right. It's a hit-down when it comes to reporting. And a lot of things come into play, but what I personally guarantee, is I have seen it at all levels, not just at the level of reporters, and journalists, and editors, but all the way to owners, there are these conversations. And those are real dilemmas. Which is why it's different from the networks. There are networks that allow their Angkor to endorse products. There are networks that say, "Nahindek, if you use Angkor or you're in the news, you're not allowed to endorse products." But both of those come with acknowledging that, "Mahirapu mana pera sa pili pinas." Right? Whether you're a reporter, or a media company, especially in this day and age. This is not to excuse or to say that any kind of behavior does not have a line behind it. But for me, it does say that, that's why we call it ethics, because it does get into a lot of areas that we'll need navigating. I'll quote, "I think my brother, as much as I hate to." But "with brother." To Jigo. I think it does Jigo say that. As you know, ethics is not a line in the sand. Ethics is a compass, so that when you're in areas where there are no clear lines, you allow that compass to guide you. Something like that. And I thought, "Okay, that's a..." And I think some people have a different appreciation of ethics. No, ethics is a hard line in the sand. Yeah, we're having this conversation, and I'm sure inside networks, these conversations are happening inside media core organizations. I don't think our audience knows that those conversations are happening. Is there a prescription where we used to be media executives? Both of us. Now we're not. Is there a way to get the audiences into that conversation to explain ourselves? Is that a worthy endeavor? Yeah. That's a good explanation for the audience. To make the trust continue and continue. I think these conversations help. And this is why we're having these conversations. I'll give you an example. But like, I wanted to ask you when we got this conversation, Jay. I think it's a whole lot. What's your experience with one being a struggling, impoverished media person, and being face-to-face with the corruption? And so you just try to refuse as rude as they will make you feel like you're being rude when you don't take it. There are other times that I was editor-in-chief for a long time. And I have a lot of things to do in the office. So if you have a foundation, you have a lot of things to do. And I can't do it forever. So you have a level of nothing like 10 million pesos. That's a good question. But I don't have a lot of things to do. Oh. How old are you? I was born in the first 10 million pesos. But the first encounter with the gift was not cash. I was a reporter in the police speech at the Western Police District. I mean, just a few weeks into the job. So, you know, you should cover the police with City Hall. And then you have City Hall. And then you have to pay for me. And at that time, you don't need to convert it. My salary was, I think, my take home was $4,500. So you don't need to adjust. That was below minimum wage. I was earning less than a public school teacher. So, the last kilo of the gas is nothing to scoff at. But I said, "No." "Sabinung ta'unung." "No, because you're so busy." "I'm okay, I'm okay, I'm okay." But also, "No, but also I'm like, "Oh, it's you." This is how it starts, right? But "Sabinung ta'unung," "Konsihal." "Boss Kuhunin," because if you don't know Kuhunin, you'll be able to list it on your own. And then you'll be able to earn money. You'll be able to earn money, right? So, this is what I'm saying. What do you do here? To your point, you don't need to do that. You just need to pay for it. And that's it. You don't make, you know. I have had experiences where the stereotypical, "Ah, abutan gala ng etbelok," with... An developmental dream illusion. That's what I'm talking about, that's what I'm talking about. Junkets for me is a great area, because as much as you'd like to think, "No, we'll pay our own way to cover Zambuanga or Basilan or some province or even Cebu." The reality is, there are no expenses for the media companies. So, I've had those offers also. But I ask this because, you know, one thing that I don't know if this is true, for you, when I ask that, you have to think, because actually, you don't have a common. I mean, I don't have an experience. "Mascomon, you matreten ka, or mapegali tangka, or ithreten ka, or ia belaka, or ithreten ka." That is actually more common than actually getting bread. So, I have another question. One of the Western Police Districts, I have a reporter saying, "Hey, we're here, or we're here." Hmm, he said, "We're here, or we're here." He said, "We're here, and we're here." So, we got an owner-type Jeep, because this is what we call a "Bowat Station" of the Western Police District. Because it's a 'Bowat Station'. It's just a lot of things. When I was in the Police Chief Don, and before I was there, I was there, and before I was there. I was there for coffee or coffee. I was there for lunch. And then before you get back to the base, that's what I was looking for. That to me was clearly not culture. Yes. It wasn't typical at all. Because it was a jane, it was unique. But, as a young reporter, I didn't know that there were some beats. I also felt like, "What are you doing here?" Because if you look at their credit, if you look at reporters, you can see that, it's just like that. That's what I was looking for. Because I was there for lunch. It wasn't a man, right? I was there for a coffee. But I was there for a long time. We were there for a long time, but we do acknowledge that. These are things that happen in media. Yes. Surely, we don't have that. You know what I'm saying? The conversation between you and 10 million. No, no. But these are, again, these are personalities in a position of privilege. They don't give up their lives. So, if the accusations are true, then that is very infuriating to us. But the other side of that is corruption or accusations of corruption has long been a caged, used against media here in the Philippines. I'm sure we don't have the context. The personalities accused of giving favorable, introducing this context, are privileged personalities. They don't give up their lives on journalists. If the accusation makes it even more infuriating, because for a long time, corruption has been used as a caged against media. In the provinces, that's used as a justification, attack media, and even, you know, to physical violence. So, any accusation or any misdeed is actually put, puts our, you know, we're going to borrow it in the near future. What do you think about that discourse? Because it's just a big deal. It's just that there's a lot of media in the Philippines. Yes, there's a lot of media in the Philippines. There's a lot of media in the world. 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And there's a lot of media in the Philippines. and for what they say is, "Galingaño, ya manang dapad, dapad, eti ka?" "Dapad eti ka, la, tapos, acaka bakit tambabau dapad investigative." "Dapaparang bitin ma, bahko magkober kayo puru papia u lang." "Pogatapos, gagawinapisi aej, gagawinang rappler, gagawinang TV5, gagawinang JMA, ABS, mga kasamanatin sa jario." "Gagawinang inquire, na filmi pinstar." "Bukut sa wala magbaba sa aeja?" "Di nurena manbaba yalan." So that becomes a real problem and like I said, it goes back to the original post. Not the original post, but the post of Mayor Vico. For me, the 10 million unfortunately distracted all of us. All he was trying to say, which is why I personally shared it and liked that post, is because he was saying, "Gusso nyo pagu sa apa nyong corruption, ayo nyong harapin nyong kata to hana na." "Lahat tayo, lahat tayo maikina laman jan." "Whether by sin of commission or by sin of emission." And I think that's a perfect way to end this podcast. Thank you guys for listening. If you like this conversation, follow us on Spotify and YouTube. And if you love this conversation, tell a friend about it. This episode was engineered by me, Anthony Top Yes. J. Mark Dirty Celia is our editor at large. If you liked how we do conversations, follow us on Spotify, YouTube, or wherever you get your podcasts. For more updates, we're also on Facebook, X, Instagram, and TikTok. Thank you for listening and until next time. [Music] ACAS powers the world's best podcast. Here's a show that we recommend. I'm Eden Cher. And I'm Brock Charlelli. We played best friends on the middle. And became best friends in real life. We're here to re-watch the middle with all of you. Each week we'll recap an episode with behind-the-scenes stories, guest interviews, and what we think now. Many years later. There's a lot to dive into, so let's get to middleing. [Music] ACAS helps creators launch, grow, and monetize their podcasts. Everywhere, acas.com.