Matt Johnson: Jelly Roll’s Weight Loss, Running 842 Miles & Escaping Addiction

I truly believe any fit person can run 100 miles. But I don't believe that the reason why they don't is because you can't beat this right here. I think we subconsciously don't want to set ourselves up for failure. We either don't try, or we do things that we know we can complete. I have like official 100 mile races, I think I've done five, and I think I've finished two. Did Texas and 24, I did East to West, I just did it this October, North to South. I'm the only man to cross Texas both ways. Fastest man to do it both ways, and the only man to do it both ways. It doesn't cost you anything. You just get off your couch, and set a goal, and just start. If you want to get into fitness, have someone with you. When you are doing something and you're suffering, when you know that the person next to you is suffering, it changes everything. For somebody that is coming from a similar place to where you were, where did they start? I'm not afraid to fail. I truly believe like that's why I'm different. And if you want to be different, you have to not be. Hey guys, welcome back to the Ultimate Human Podcast. I'm your host, human biologist Gary Brecco, where we go down the road of everything, anti-aging, biohacking, longevity, and everything in between. And today's podcast is going to be a really, really special one because I just followed and spent the last 48 hours with this podcast, really got to know him, see his heart, see how he thinks and operates. His story is absolutely phenomenal. Get ready to be inspired. Get ready to have the limits of what you think you can accomplish in your life just absolutely blown. And when you hear this man talk about his pain to purpose, I think it's going to be very, very inspiring for you. So welcome to the podcast, Matt Johnson. Yeah. Brother, this is awesome, man. We've had a pretty incredible 48 hours. Yeah, yeah, it's cool to, you know, usually when you walk into a podcast, right? Like you just know somebody, know somebody by like a sheet of paper or know somebody by videos you've seen or, you know, but like being able to meet you, you meet, you know, also being together for 48 hours is really cool to, because now I'm sitting here and I just, I feel like I know you. Yeah, dude, I felt like I spent my whole life with you. And for my audience purposes, I'm going to talk a lot about your background, but this is the fastest man to ever run across the state of Texas. And when people think like, okay, we ran across the state of Texas, realize that's 842 miles that he did in a little over 17 days. And I want to sort of back the story up because, you know, there's a theme that runs through a lot of my podcasts, like some of the most impactful, purpose-driven people. Passionate people I've ever had on this podcast have solved the problem in their life. And they've either taken the pain in their life and turned it into their purpose and made a big impact, or they solved the major problem. And they're not always the most credentialed. Like, you know, my podcast is about longevity and anti-aging and biohacking. And you would think it's like all these great PhDs or MDs or researchers, but the truth is I've had, I've had soccer mom sit in that chair that have had more impact on human vanity than the smartest, most qualified PhD. And I think that you fit that category. And I'd love for you to talk a little bit about your background and the military, not everything was roses, you're right. A little bit of time in the Pope Pope. You've been jailed a couple times. You've been jailed a couple times, but who has it? I mean, I mean, I'm jailed. And, you know, I would love for you to talk about that. And then I definitely want to get into our journey with jelly roll because, you know, I was working with jelly early on in his weight loss journey. But when you parachute it in and moved in with him, everything changed for jelly. Like, and his accountability changed. His mindset changed. I mean, you had a demonstrative impact on this man and his capacity to drop 260 pounds. You know, we were talking before the podcast about all of the demons he was struggling with. But first, I want to tell, you know, your story for my audience from military to 842 miles across the state of Texas. Yeah, it was very, um, freaking mind numbing. Yeah, it was very unplanned. And sorry, if I have a raspy voice, or my lips are chapped. You did a lot of yelling. I did a lot of yelling. I heard a lot of Matt yelled for 24 and a half straight out. Yeah, yeah, yeah. We had the boys at 100 yesterday and a hundred miles. And we're a little cook too. Yeah, but do better. I got to tell you, man, you got my son and Kyle and the Nell boys and those runner six of them safely across a hundred miles and dude, it's semi trucks going six feet away from us 80 miles an hour. I mean, the wind would almost blow. Yeah. And I mean, I mean, a lot of people don't know. I mean, I would say the entire, the entire operation doesn't know that the crew that made this possible is the Texas crew that I had. Oh, really? Yeah, I mean, it was just me, Drew, who was out there shooting, Crouchy for Ob. And Amanda, I mean, we're missing one, one of my crew members from Texas. And as soon as Kyle hit me up and was like, yo, like, I want to do this. And then I heard about how the operation was going to be. I was like, I need to bring a couple of people in. And, you know, just so you know, obviously make this part quick. But yeah, I mean, it was very, you know, Crouchy for Ob, Crouchy for me across America. He's Crude Paul Johnson or Crude Me across Texas. He Crude Paul Johnson across America. He holds his own 100 mile records, you know. And he, so he knows how to do that. I'm like, I need to bring Rob in. Amanda, you know, my fiance Amanda, I'm like, I need to bring her in because she's Crude Me. You know, she can help crew the boys as well, knowing what they need. Drew, you know, he's obviously the filmer, but he's done, you know, he has so many documentaries on YouTube about running. Okay. But I knew having him there, you know, Kyle has his own filmers, but I'm like, Hey, if you bring Drew on the film, you're going to have a second. You're going to have somebody else that knows what's going on. Yeah. And, you know, so yeah, the amount of logistics to was my numbing to me. I mean, it was in Cole's chase van. So my every, every athlete had their own assigned van. Yeah. So I was in the one signed to my son and were five of us in there. Um, you know, Andy, who's like the, the absolute guru of endurance running. Yeah. This is a blessing to have him. Yeah. But Cole's sister, you know, myself is fiance Megan. You know, we were all in that van for 24 hours. I got in 20 miles on my accidentally. Oh, yeah. Yeah. That's how it happens. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I know how it happens. Like I told Amanda when we wrapped up, I'm like, Holy shit. I'm like, that was 54 miles. Yeah. And there was times where I wasn't, you know, I was running back. Like that was just running. Yeah. You know, when I would be running, when I would stay up there, I would start my watch. Yeah. And so like that doesn't even count back to the van to the front of the van to the back. And we know when I would come back to talk to you guys. And I'm like, here, no, didn't stop. No, we, we, we, the gun went off and we moved for 100 straight miles. Yeah. And I was watching the comments on, on YouTube, because they live streamed it. And I was watching the comments on YouTube. And I would say 70% of the people in the comments gave them a zero percent chance of finishing 100%. They, they 100% of the people said there's no way six that started are going to come across a finish line together. So the beat the odds for sure. A hundred percent. No one, no one believed in them from the start. Like it's from the time that I got attached to it in November. You know, I was going through comments on Instagram and people were like, there's no way you're going to run a hundred miles. Yeah, the California guard. And yeah. And that's the thing is like, you know, which, I mean, we'll probably dive into this later too. Yeah. But like, there's a lot of people out there that don't really actually know what you're, what they're capable of. Yeah. You know, because running 100 miles is pretty easy. You know, I mean, and when I say that, I mean, I when I don't know, when I say that, I'm easy. So when I say that, you know, this is what I told all the boys is I'm like, I truly believe any fit person can run a hundred miles. But I don't believe that the reason why they don't is because you can't beat this out here. Like that's why the point zero zero, one percent that do finish the ultra marathon, the hundred mile distance, they're able to conquer this. Yeah. And that's the problem with everybody else is that they can't conquer this so they're never going to know. Yeah. And I remember when we crossed the 32 mile mark in the back of my mind, I was like, okay, every single one of these guys is an uncharted territory, including my son. They have none of them have been further than this point. So up till now up to 32 miles, they're like, okay, I've done that before. But now I need to go more than double this distance. And I have no idea if my body is going to break down and be able to carry this. And they were all in that uncharted water. So basically not, not knowing if they could finish or not. But I want to circle back to your background, you know, because I want to delve into that pain and to purpose journey for you because a lot of people listening to this, you know, there's another common theme that runs through my podcast. A lot of people are like, well, how do I find my purpose? I'm in the thought of completing a hundred mile race and doing something that epic and that difficult just to prove to no one other than myself that I can do it is not something that I can wrap my arms around. And maybe starting with the goal that lofty is, you know, way out of bounds. But how did this journey start with you from the military to ultra endurance, ultra endurance competition? I mean, you've got, you've won multiple races in the 5K, 100 K, 100 mile distance. Yeah. you covered 840 some miles across the state of Texas, like go back to the beginning of, what did that journey look like? - Yeah, and it's been a process for me of doing that on my own now as an adult, right? Because there are times where I'm living this life and I kind of sit back and I'm like, how the hell am I here? (laughing) You know, so I think reflection is very important. You know, starting to, how did you get to the military? Like, like, why? Because that's not a choice that a lot of people make. - Right. - And, you know, I was born in a small town. We didn't have stoplights. Like, it was that small. The nearest Walmart was 15 minutes away. - Okay. - So we had a gas station and like a convenience store. - Yeah. - And I was born and taken back to a double wide trailer and then my mom got pregnant with me which she was 17. My dad was, you know, I was out of the picture from the very beginning and it was me, my mom. And, you know, my grandparents, you know, were around and my mom was working two jobs all the way, you know, I mean, shoot until as far as I can remember. She was working two jobs. She was driving, she was commuting an hour to work a nine to five and driving an hour back and then working overnight at the gas station. - Ma. - And so I was rotating a lot through my grandparents' house. And, you know, fast forwarding, my mom got married when I was probably 10. And that was where all of the trauma really, like where it started. And at that point, I had a little brother who was probably three. So I was probably 12. My little brother was about four or five 'cause like we would have conversation. - Same dad. - No, no, no. So my brother and I, my brother and I both have, we have different dads. And then my mom was engaged to his dad and then that broke off. And then she got married. She's been married once. And you know, she was married to this man who was a really good guy at first. And then, you know, about six months in, shit started just really getting bad. There was a lot of, started with, you know, emotional abuse. - Mm-hmm. - Like I remember a time that I tell a lot where my mom went to work and my little brother and I were locked in a bedroom the entire time that she was gone. Like just like you, like chair to the door and we were locked in a bedroom for 10 hours. - Wow. - And trying to comfort my brother through that is I'm 13. - Yeah. - And I'm not understanding like why the hell am I locked in a bedroom? You know, and I'm trying to figure out and I can't get out. And then, you know, then it turned into physical abuse. And, you know, he was, you know, we moved around a lot. We were moving around to different, excuse the government, contractor. And yeah, you know, it got to the point where, you know, I remember a time where my mom was drug by her hair to her bedroom. And I watched that happen, my little brother watched that happen. And it got to the point where my mom started, my mom became addicted to pills because she was trying to exit that life or at least numb it. - Yeah. - And unfortunately in the pill addiction, you know, she got so far deep she tried to commit suicide. - Wow. - And I tell the story of me coming home and finding her face down on the floor in the kitchen. - How do we use that time? - I was in high school at that point. So probably 16. - Okay. - And she was taken away for like three days. Like if you, I guess if you like try to commit suicide, they take you and they like lock you up, like in a facility. - Yeah, yeah. - Especially if it takes, yeah. And so I remember like she was gone for like three or four days. She came back and she like sat me down and you know, 'cause I was old enough, she's like, she's like, I didn't want to, like this isn't me. - Yeah. - Like I just, I have to get, we have to get out here. - Yeah. - And, but she was scared. And you know, that process led to, that conversation led to, he smashed her face off of the front of a car and knocked her teeth out. - Mm. - And it became a big debacle and he left. Like we might, it was a big ordeal that doesn't need to be talked about, but he left. Then, and at that point, you know, there was a, he put us in a situation where, like he didn't want my mom to work. You know, the controlling, or he had access to everything, the bank accounts, the cars, the, and when he left, he took everything. We had nothing. He drained the bank accounts. We had no car. Like it was, it was, I remember it was just, it was bad. - Yeah. - If you want protein to build lean muscle, but without the caloric impact or need to cut, you need perfect amino. It's pure essential amino acids. The building blocks of proteins in a precise form and ratio that allows for near 100% utilization in building lean muscle and no caloric impact. So we build protein six times as much as way, but without the excess body fat we normally get during bulking. This is the new era of protein supplementation and it's real. If you want to build lean muscle without having to cut, you need perfect amino. Now, let's get back to the ultimate human podcast. And from that point on, obviously everything started to get better, but then I had to watch my mom battle, kind of like I did when I was a kid, right? Like where she did everything she could to put food in and give us shelter. - Right. - Just to, you know, back to working two jobs. And she was working overnight. I was taking my brother to school. She was, you know, she was grinding. And that is where I get my endurance from. I know that. I know that I get my endurance and my drive and my will and why I am here is because of, because of who I watch my mother being. - Yeah. - And, you know, so, but I think in that process, that led me to like, you know, 17, as I turned 18 and I was a senior, I was like, I need to get out of here. - Yeah. - Like I've been like that. I didn't like where, like Amanda and I talk all the time. She's like, I wanna, I haven't, we've been together for three years and I haven't taken her back home. Because I don't think I wanna go. - Right. - And I haven't been back to that town since I left. - Yeah. - And, you know. - Yeah, as your brother still in the picture, is he, yeah, yeah, so he actually, he just moved to Austin. - Yeah, he, okay. - Yeah, so he, you know, he went through, actually he went through a big trauma that led, that ended up me is, that's why I'm here. But, yeah, so he lives in Austin now. But, you know, so I joined the military and. - What age? - 18. - Yeah, 18 and I left for basic training in 19. - Okay. - So I had like a seven month waiting period until I left for basic training and, yeah, it was, you know, I actually, we were talking about this. I think I was talking to Kyle or somebody yesterday while you were running. I was like, there was no, like I was a child. Like I can't, we were talking about stuff. - To 18, you're a baby. - I had no clue. Like I didn't even know, I didn't know how to do like, you know, I mean, I knew how to do laundry. But you know what I mean? Like, like, like, I don't know how to wake up on my own. You know, like when you're 18, I just like, you can't find your ass with both hands. - No, and like when I got there, and that was my first time ever away from my mom and obviously through the single motherhood to my brother to all that trauma, like that fuck, like that got me. - Yeah. - Being away and like that was hard. And you know, basic training, they just, you know, they break you down. And it took me, it probably took me a little bit over a month to really adapt and be like, oh, like, I'm not leaving. Like, like, like, like, like, I made this, I made this choice. And like, I'm here. Like, this is it. But it was so what I did is I joined the National Guard because I was nervous going active duty and leaving my mother. Like that is because National Guard, you come back home. - Right. - And it's like, oh, two weeks in the summer, you know, one week in a month. So, so I go, I leave basic training, I come back home right back to that toxic environment that I left. And that turned into, I lived with four dudes. We were partying, drinking, doing drugs every night. I went to jail twice. I was fighting, you know, like, I'm so surprised that those couple, I was not kicked out of the military. Like, I was a, I was not a good, like, I came back and I just, I got swept into this toxic environment of where I grew up, but now as an adult. And now I can make my own decisions around here. Like, you know, like just, and, and I just, I look at that time frame and I'm like, holy shit. Like, how did I not? - It bloated. - Yeah. And, I mean, because I, when I first got in the military, I, like, I have a picture of myself from like 2014 of just like, man boobs. Like, like, I was this body and I was almost 180 pounds. From drinking, smoking weed every day, just like, just horrible. I mean, I'm talking every single day I was drunk every night, like just, just all the time. - Yeah. - And it was, I think, because I just never, I never faced those demons that I had. I tried, I left. - Right. - But then I came right back to that same environment. It's where, people end up failing at things they tried. - Yeah. - And what led me to the ultra running, right? I think it's where we're, where we're going with this. - Yeah, that's what I wanna hear. - The conversation. So 2021, in that time frame, I moved out of that town. I got out of that partying phase. I actually went active, I got an active duty job in the military. - Okay. - Such a blessing. So I was in the national guard but I did almost five years active duty where I worked full time at Camp Dodge which is I was largest national guard base. So I worked at, crazy enough, right? Like during those days of me doing drugs, I got a job at Midwest counter drug where I was, I'm not even kidding. Like I'm pretty sure I was still like smoking weed and I was going to work at counter drug where we were training law enforcement to like, to like kick indoors and find drugs. It was crazy. But, got an active duty job, moved up to Des Moines the Capitol. You know, it was making, I made E5 sergeant, was making probably, you know, four grand a month, got married very young, probably 20, 22, 23, to someone who was 19, 20. And it was, you know, it was a, it was a, it was a great marriage, but we were babies. And I was, and I was still a very shitty person. - Yeah. - And, you know, that, you know, that led me to, when I moved to Austin, you know, there's more I'll cover in the middle but, you know, went through a divorce, moved to Austin. But what got me into the ultra sport was Marcus, my little brother in 2021, had two friends that were murdered. And he was, Marcus was 16. And then those two boys, the two brothers were 17 and 18. - They were brothers? - Yeah, and they were his best friends. And to kind of just be completely transparent and tell you the bond that they had, my little brother's mixed in his dark, like dark skin. And we lived in, in rural Iowa, right? Where that is not, he was the only dark kid in this town. And these two kids, I have their names tattooed right here, Devonte and Malachi, they moved into town and they were also mixed. And so there was a bond between them because, you know, there was a lot of racism towards them and hatred. And they bonded because they were all, you know, when they, when they became friends, they were, I don't know, just seven, eight, nine years old. - Yeah. - And then they grew up together. Unfortunately, they, you know, they were murdered, not in this small town up in the city in Des Moines when they were splitting time with their moms. I think they just got caught up in the wrong crowd as they were getting older and they were splitting time between mom and dad. So I started looking for ways self-help. I'm like, because my brother dropped out of high school. He just, he locked himself in his room, said, I'm not going to school. He gained over 150 pounds. - Oh my God. - And, and like, like at one point, he was, I'm pretty sure he was 300 and some pounds at, at five foot five, I mean, he just locked himself in his room, wouldn't leave, wouldn't, like, wouldn't do anything but just eat. And so I, I'm like, I, like, I, he's gonna die. - Yeah. - You know, and I'm like, I need to, and this was seven, eight months that this happened. Like that, you know, because this was January, they were killed. And I didn't, I didn't get to this point until fall. - Right. - So I was gone on Google and I'm like, self-help books. - Yeah. - And sure enough, first thing that pops up is, can't hurt me by David Goggins. - Mm. - And I, and the only reason, the only reason I was attracted to this book is because it was wrote by a Navy SEAL. I had no idea. And I'm like, oh, like, this guy's in the military, writes a book, you know, like, cool, let's read it. Reading that book, I was like, Marcus, like, we're gonna read this book together. Reading that book flipped my entire perspective on everything. And it wasn't the fact of like, the stay hard, woo, woo, bullshit is not what drew me to Goggins. It was the, if you go and you read those first three chapters, he was abused. His father was an abuser. His mut, like, they were poor. They were, it was him and his brother. I related to, I'm like, how in the hell did this guy write a book and go through this? - Yeah. - And I'm like, who am I? I'm like, I'm like, that was me, like, like, I, that happened to me. I'm like, and this guy's writing books and is one of the most well-known runners of all time. I'm like, and at that point in my life, I hated the military. I was making excuses. I was still drinking. It was post-COVID. - Yeah. - And I was, and like, at that point, I was still drinking. I was, you know, just, I still just wasn't a good person. I wasn't where I wanted to be. So what I did is I am not a great reader or writer. I started listening to the book. And three times a week, I would go out to the track on Camp Dodge and it was a two mile loop. And I would run four loops, eight miles. And in like, Walmart shoes, you know, like, I just, and I didn't, you know, in hoodie and the sweat, they like, - Yeah, you did. - And just, yeah, no clue what I was doing. And I would, and I would listen to his book. And I'm, I'm not kidding. I've probably listened to that book since 2021. I probably listened to that book 15 times. - Wow. - And to just remind myself like, who I can be because he did it. - Yeah. - You know, this day hard, you know, no rest days, like, no, no, that's not me at all. It's just like, if this guy can do it, why can I not do it? - Yeah. - And that's what I'm trying to preach to my audience. - So that was the early days of you just starting to run. - Yeah. - Like, even, even, and I-- - I didn't start running until, I didn't start actually running full time, like, running 30, 40 miles a week until April of 2021. - Wow. - And now we're here-- - The Texas was 2022, right? - No, Texas was 2024 and 2025, I've done it twice. - Right. - Yeah. - So, I mean, would you say that you just fell in love with that or it was an escape? Because I mean, that's like really hard shit. For me, I think the reason I fell into the love of running is because it was the only time in my life that I was able to control the pain that I was in. No one else had any control over me. - Right. - And I controlled the pain. I controlled, like, if you want to quit, you can quit. - Yeah. - And I've been through a lot of things in life and a lot of situations where I was unable to have control over what was happening to me. So you sort of start to fall in love with this, maybe not for the reasons that most people think, like conditioning and-- - No, I was running early on. I was running away from everything. I was using that time of running as long as I could. 70, 80, 90 miles a week and I had no idea what I was doing. I wasn't even eating food while I was doing it. But I was using that time because I was able to, in that moment, I was able to exit the fact that I hated my marriage. I hated the military. I wasn't who I wanted to be. And when I ran, I found out that I liked that person. - And so then this morphs into you reconnecting with your faith, you kind of really dedicating yourself to the sport. I mean, 'cause you're an iconic figure in the sport. And eventually, more sin to you, moving in and living with jelly roll, which is-- I mean, the 16-year-old you looking at, the 28-year-old you, you have to be like, wow. I never thought that I would be here. You know, literally earning and gaining the trust of one of the most iconic musicians, maybe in all time, certainly in that crossover rap country in genre. - Right, right, for sure. - So you start running, did you set this goal for yourself that said, I'm just gonna do something really, really epic? Because Jesse Eitzler talks about this all the time. - Yeah, yeah, yeah. - That one thing you should do every year, that you know you only have a 50/50 shot at completing. And I think most of us don't, I think we subconsciously don't want to set ourselves up for failure. So we either don't try, or we do things that we know we can complete. So we set our goal so low. So for you, when was that big bold audacious goal set for you to like, okay, I'm gonna run 842 miles across the state of Hurricane Texas? - Yeah, okay, you wanna fast forward to Texas? - Yeah. - So what happened was, you know, just to quickly get, to quickly get caught up, yeah. February 2023, you know, I had been traveling, I had been racing, you know, Iron Man's and I was in the military, and the military's like, you know, we don't want you doing this. And at that point, I was a recruiter. And I was like, hey, like I can root, like that's what Goggins did. I was like, I can recruit kids by using this Instagram platform. If I can build it, like can you guys help me? And they're like, no, like we don't fucking, we don't like this. Like we don't want you doing this. - Why that you think that? - I don't know. I think, you know, I don't think that's the military in general. I had horrific leadership. Like everyone on my team was fat. Everyone was out of shape. Like it was the small town Iowa, it was the small town Iowa vibe within the Iowa boys and the Iowa National Guard. Like, you know, well, that's not normal. We don't do that. You know, and like they didn't, they didn't, I didn't have any type of support from me saying I want to do hard things and post about it on Instagram so people can see it. But I never even had, like I didn't even think, and never once in my life was like, I'm going to be an influencer. - Right. - Or you know, like I was just like, hey, people are loving, like people are telling me that I'm just expiring them to run. And you know, like this is cool. Really, like the biggest moment of my entire life, the turning point moment was I came over to Austin and my ex-wife met me in the kitchen and was like, I wanted to go to the horse. As soon as I walked in the door. - Yeah. - And we had been having horrific problems. I was a horrible person. I was a liar. I was a manipulator. I was horrific. And but I never, I knew that I didn't, I knew I needed to get out of that, but I as a man couldn't make that choice. - Right. - I felt like it was my job to like, I don't know, I guess be a shitty person, but I was in this, you know, I'm like, I can't say no, like I'm in, you know. And she met me in the kitchen. She's like, I'm on a divorce. And that was, I got home from Austin on Monday. That was Monday. On Friday night, I was sitting in my upstairs bedroom. She immediately left. My mom had come over. My brother was there. And I was sitting in my upstairs bedroom and I loaded a shotgun and put it right to my jaw. - Wow. - And I was sitting and I was going, I was going to take my life sitting on the floor in my bedroom. And by the grace of like God calling me to Austin, I'm not even joking. I get a text message from a friend, his text message phone call, I don't know. And it pops up and I see his name Harrison Zucker and he was in Austin because he, he, when I was leaving Austin on that Monday, he was like, oh, because he lives in the Midwest and it's cold and that's why we bonded. And he's like, I'm not, he's like, I'm not leaving Austin. He's like, I'm going to stay here for like a month. He goes, he's online coach and he's like, I'm just going to chill down here. As soon as he texted me something in me, I saw his name and it said go, like within me, it was like go to Austin. And I picked up my phone, I texted him, I was like, are you still in Austin? And he's like, yeah, dude. And I go, I'm coming tomorrow. I'll explain more. And he's like, okay. And I, I packed a duffel bag. Yeah. Actually, it wasn't a duffel bag to be completely real. It was a like broken hamper that I'm pretty sure we still have that black hamper that's like missing a handle. This hamper means so much to me. I like put this hamper means so much to me. I like packed up this black hamper. I've just all my clothes and stuff them in there and grabbed my dog and I drove to Austin. Over the last 20 years in human biology, one compound I've trusted again and again is NAD+. It's critical for energy, focus, and cellular repair. But your levels drop around age 30. I used to administer NAD via IVs in my clinics, but now I take Row Nutrition's liposomal NAD, the first oral formula that actually works. Their advanced delivery tech gets NAD straight into your bloodstream. I take one teaspoon daily and the results are real. Clean energy, sharper focus, and better recovery. You can try it risk-free with the ultimate 15 code at checkout for 15% off. Just put in ultimate 15 at checkout. You'll receive 15% off and your cells will thank you. Now let's get back to the ultimate human podcast. Kind of dog, I love dogs. Blue healer. And he is incredible. I drove to Austin and I called my mom on the way down to Austin and I was like, I don't give a shit. What is about to happen? I'm going to figure it out. I had $3,000 in my bank account and I was like, I'll be an online coach. Like, I don't care. I was like, all like, my idea was that I was going to use, at that point, I had about 25,000 followers. I was going to be an online fitness coach. Cool. And to make that story quick, got down to Austin, lived in five Airbnb's over 61 days, ran out of all of my money. I had just won a marathon and didn't Iron Man within the same week. And right after the Iron Man, I had a friend that gave me this bike. I sold that bike to put a deposit down on a duplex and I slept on the floor of that duplex for two weeks. And I just started grinding of like people like you want, I'll coach you $100 a month. And I just slowly like next thing, you know, I got a couch for $100 from the market right down the road. I got a mattress pad. Like I have a picture of the mattress pad with a blanket and a pillow. Yeah, I was laying on the floor. Damn. And then I got a TV. A mattress pad. A mattress pad. Yeah. Yeah. The little pad. Fast forward there. Just started just kept going. Just kept, I just kept going. And the Instagram following started to grow very first brand ever. Keith, I like you. Oh, yeah, yeah. I thought this guy's the love those guys. My brand and they sent me a message and I, yeah, we love to pay you 500 a month to promote our product. Sure. I know. I was like, I was like, are you kidding? I was like, I will give you my, my right arm for $500. Yeah. And, you know, over the next two or three months, I signed another deal. The second deal was an alcohol deal, which was like, at that point, you'll take what after that. I probably shouldn't have done that one, but, you know, I signed the alcohol deal. I started blowing like it was like all the sudden. Mm-hmm. Everything started changing. And I met Amanda and this amazing woman was like, she is amazing. Like first, first day, what a gatherer. She's like, well, she's like, it was Saturday night. We're going to date. She's like, what do you want to go to church with me tomorrow? Yeah. And I'm like, I'll go wherever the hell you want me to go. Yeah. Like, take me, take me wherever she is amazing. Yeah, starting going back to church. 24 hours. The ball started rolling. The followers started skyrocketing. And, you know, that led me to my, my my my my soggy, right? Yeah. Like the big, the big one. And late 2020, all in that timeframe, when I went back to church, right? Yeah. And I met, I think I met Amanda after the leg injury. So I was running, I spent 2023 running from everything. Yeah. Run, just run, run, run. And I, I was like, oh, my leg hurts. I kept running. My leg hurts. I kept running. I did a hundred mile race on a broken leg. Mm-hmm. And I had no idea my leg was broken. And I just thought it hurt. Couldn't finish this race. Go to the doctor. They're like, you have three fractures. Like, like, I have the X-ray of like, like you could see that it fractured in the calcium deposits. Like, I can feel the calcium deposit right here because it's trying to heal itself. And she's like, you're done for six months. Mm-hmm. And that's your identity at that point. Yes. That's everything I have. Yeah. And it was in that moment where I had to like sit with myself. I had to sit with God. I had to, you know, where I'm like, what do I do? Yeah. And one day, just one day, I went to the gym. And I remember exactly where I was sitting outside the gym. I still couldn't run. I still was walking with a limp. And I texted one of my best friends. And I was like, I want, I don't know how it came. I don't know. I have no clue. I said, I just impotent my head. I was like, I want to run across the whole state of Texas. Yeah. And I texted my friend. And I was like, I want to run across Texas. And he's like, you're a logistical nightmare, but I think you can do it. That's a good friend. Yeah. You're out of your fucking mind, but I think you can. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. But that's how we got there. Yeah. And it was 2024 is what changed my life forever. But the money and the logistics, I mean, you know, for 17 days to just be absent, obviously, you're not coaching during that time frame. You're not earning money during that time frame. You get sponsors and you just lived in a van. Yeah. So what happened is, you know, just like what you said, like, like, yeah, yeah, the operation that we had was the exact operation. You know, we had an art game. Yeah. We had an RV and a sprinter van. Yeah. But yeah, I just, you know, I, I overworked my team at that point. You know, I didn't have a lot of, you know, I mean, I had 200,000 followers. I had a little bit of pull on the social media side from brands, but I just started hitting up and I was like, yo, like, how much money can you give me to use your product while I do this event? And you know, I feel like it was so good to do that because now I know so much about business and I had to teach myself all of these things because I didn't go to college as well for the military. Right. And like, oh, like, we'll give you five grand for three reels and a thousand stories. You know, like, it was just, they were just getting me and I'm like, done. Yeah, yeah. And, you know, like, and we accumulated $60,000 the first year through 40 brands. Like, it was, it was, I, I like, I tied my shoes with this. Yeah, yeah, yeah, Drew, you met Drew is now. Total prostitute. One of my best friends and he was, he was the lead content guy out there and I just put him through the ringer with the things he had to do. But yeah, we got, we got $60,000 in the operation was, yeah, we, we cleared, we had a, I had a thousand dollars left when we were done. Like, like, we were, and then we don't, and then I donated it to Valle Fix. I was doing a raise, raise my breacherity. But yeah, yeah, that was awesome, man. And now, you know, so I saw none of that side of you in the last 48 hours. I mean, the, the precision with which you ran this operation to get these guys a hundred miles, like I say, including my son across the desert in the middle of the night. Cause I, I don't think most people realize like running for 24 and a half hours, like these guys did. Just the sheer grind and the, when we got pulled over three times about the police. Yeah, right off the, yeah, right off the bat, dude, we were barely in a night. Let's see the photo combined. He bangs you, throws his lights on him, parks in front of the, front of the convoy, facing the convoy. That was the great, like that was like, face it, delicious. Like, like I was like, I was like, you're going to turn and face us. You're so nice to me. Like, how are you? I'm sure. Yeah. Yeah. And I'm like, just, can you on a shift? Yeah. But, you know, I was impressed with your. for unrelenting commitment to the safety of the runners. I think none of them understood the task that they were getting ready to do. Like I said, there's some eyes blown by a six feet off the side of the road. Half the shoulder was not wide enough for the vehicles to get off the road. And the first thing that cops said was, you need to be on the other side of this white line. The entire time you're down. So to the half the time we're driving on all that gravel, it was pretty crazy. Yeah, I was pissed off 'cause I couldn't sleep. - Uh-huh. - I was always gonna complain about - No, no. - Those sisters sacked out in the back. But, you know, so you do this iconic race in Texas, but how does that jump to you moving in with jelly roll because I do remember during my journey with jelly roll the student Matt, and I know who you were, you know, like was moving in with them to train him and I was like, who's Matt? - Literally everyone, everyone, like, how did this kid just get involved in this? - New stations, we're like, who is this random person? - It was super random. - With jelly. - Random. - Yeah. - I didn't have any, you know, necessarily a problem with that. - No. - We'll look man, he's got a chef, he's got a coach, I mean, it sounds like a great idea. But dude, when you parachuted in and were with him 24/7, you were traveling with him everything, right? - Yeah, yeah, so we went to Hawaii, like in April. And he was landing in LA for like a West Coast stent of like he had things that were, you know, so they got a, they had a house up in Beverly Hills and when I was flying back from Hawaii, Amanda was gonna fly home and I was staying in the IU bird through this $30 million Beverly Hills mansion. - Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. - And I'm like, all right, and it was, yeah, I was the entire month that I was out there where we were traveling and, you know, training together. - Yeah, and I mean, 'cause at that point, Jelly hadn't even walked at 5K. - Yeah, I think the first, you know, my connection to him was Ian, Laurie, his coach. So crazy enough, 2023, when I was grinding, when I first moved off and I was grinding for, you know, selling coaching to people, I get a call. And this guy's like, yeah, like I'm on tour, you know, I wanna run around the island of Bali. And I'm like, oh, like you're like a musician. - Me. - And he's like, no, he's like, I'm Jelly Roll's chef. And I was like, holy shit, like that's crazy. And then come to find out he's like, he won Chef of the Year for the UFC. And I'm coaching this guy. So that's how I got to end with Jelly is, I gained the trust of Ian. And Ian was like, oh, like, you know, match personality, who he is, like, you know, and he pitched it to Jelly, where he's like, because Ian wasn't there the whole time. And the problem was, and you probably saw this with Jelly, Jelly and Ian are like, side by side at all times. - Yeah. - And Ian was gonna be gone and Jelly wasn't gonna have anyone to train with. - Yeah, yeah. - And so it was-- - And that lack of accountability is a decent. - Yeah, yeah, yeah. So they brought in a secondary chef, but then they wanted to bring me in to kind of play that Ian Roll to help him, you know, to have somebody there to train with. - Yeah. - But yeah, I remember my first workout. I wish I could pull it up on my phone. But my, the first workout was like a five minute walk and like 10 seconds of, like, and we use the term run very loosely. - Yeah, yeah. - 10 seconds of as fast as you can. - Yeah. - You know, and then, and then, and that was it. - Yeah. - And then we got in by the time, by the time that I got done right before the two bears, five K, he had, he had ran one mile without stopping. - Yeah, dude, and for him at that time, I mean, that's-- - Even while I was out there, he was still three, he was still right at three, three, three, three, 30 maybe. - Yeah, yeah, and that's a big boy. - Because when I look back at him now, when we were out there, I got a guy look at photos, and I thought he was skinny then. - Yeah. - Now, now he's like, he's-- - It's a game. - Now you look at him and you're like, - Hey guys, this guy's skinny. - So many people. - Yeah. - So I love how, to me, this is like two story, this is like a story of two misfits, with very kind of similar backgrounds, doing something really iconic, because even if you've never done a five K, I mean, to think that you're gonna take a 350 pound man and move that mass over 3.2 miles is a major feat. I mean, getting to the mailbox is a major feat. I remember one of my first conversations with Jelly, and he was like, where do I start? And I said, you just start by walking to the mailbox. Like literally, just, you know, bite size, bite size goals. And it sounds like when you parachute it in, like you just started chipping away with this with these little bite size goals. - Yeah. - I love how you say we use the term running loosely. - We use the term running very loosely. That is a full sentence quote from Jelly himself. - Yeah, he's like, he's like, y'all know, we use the term running very loosely around here. - Yeah. - Yeah. - Yeah. - But you had a major impact on him, and then, you know, finishing this 100 mile race with these guys, I know that it had a major impact. They raised almost $400,000 more. - Yeah, and the documentary, it'll go well over 500K with the documentary coming out and it has to be incredible. - And I think for the people that are listening, so, you know, what does all of this mean? They're like, okay, he had a rough life. Jelly's had a rough life, but look at them now. I mean, there's somebody sitting on their couch right now, maybe listening to this podcast that in a similar situation to you and they have to take that first step. Like literally, just take that first step. What I like about what you did and what I like about what you do is that it doesn't cost you anything to just get off your couch and set a goal and just start. So, where does it, for somebody that is coming from a similar place to where you were, where do they start? How does it start tomorrow morning? What do they get up and do? - Yeah. You know, I think that, you know, I've said this multiple times, you know, if you, you have to set a goal and I feel like the problem with people is is that you're scared to fail. - Mm-hmm. - And you can't, you truly can't be scared to fail. What a lot of people don't know about me is I've actually DNFed more ultra-marathons than I finished. - Wow. - Yeah, that's true. Like I have, like official 100 mile races, I think I've done five and I think I've finished two. - Wow. - Yeah. - And, you know, I'm not afraid to fail. That's why, that I truly believe like that's why I'm different. And if you want to be different, you have to not be afraid to fail either. And what is a failure? You have to define what a failure is, right? You know, if you're sitting on the couch right now and you're like, "Well, what do I show what I do?" Well, you know, tomorrow, if you're fit enough, like go run, you know, set a goal, "Hey, I'm gonna run a mile, I'm gonna run a mile Monday through Friday." - Yeah. - And like, like set a goal. And here's what happens. You run a mile, Tuesday, you run a mile. Wednesday, you wake up and you're like, "Oh, I'm sore, I don't wanna do this anymore." And then you quit, right? - Right. - What do you do the next day? Because what you do the next day defines who you really want to be. - Yeah. - And you have to be okay with that failure because what you do the next day, if you want to sit in chairs like this, that the people that are here, guess what, they woke up the next day and they started over. - Yeah. - And then you start on Thursday. All right, I'm gonna go Thursday, Friday, Saturday, Sunday, Monday, and we're gonna run a mile. And then, you know, next up, the last time you got two days, next up, you're gonna get four. Then you're gonna fail again. And that's okay. - Yeah. - You know, you'll get it. Just you have to be okay with failing. And that's it. Like, people, why don't you start? Well, because it's hard and I might not be able to do it. - Yeah. Well, and you know, I noticed too, like you're very present also. Like, you're not somewhere else when you're doing these things. I'm, I'll never forget, we had just left the 93.5 mile aid station. And my son was in really pretty good shape, but I pulled up next to him and I was, I had got about a mile in with him. And my mind was like wandering around somewhere else and you pulled up right behind Cole and I and you put your hand on our back and started running with us and you were like, hey guys, never forget that this is, this is, there will never be a first time for you to be in this situation. This is the last time that it will be the first time. So just be present, just take this all in 'cause it's an amazing moment. You'll wish that you were right back here at some point and you sort of just, and then you backed off. And it was just such a cool moment for Cole and I because I've been in that situation with Cole before, you know, and Ann Ardaca and when he did the Great World Race and there's nothing to me like no place I'd rather be than in one of those situations with one of my kids and I was like, you know what, he's so right. This is the last time that it will ever be the first time that you've run a hundred miles in Vegas. And my mind just instantly cleared and I was like, I'm just not gonna do anything but be present right in this moment. And what was so cool was the sun was starting to rise and that sun was like caffeine for these guys. - Yeah, even you, even you because you came up and you're like the sun's off, it's caffeine. - Yeah, yeah, yeah. - And it felt like it felt bad and it made, 'cause it was so cold and dark. - And it just sucked for them, not for me. And I look over and I could see the sphere and they had the sphere that was like a sunrise I've never seen before. And it was just that that cold bright morning and it was like a dark night. At that moment, I was like, these guys are actually all going to finish this. You could feel like the energy of the group starting to pick up a little bit. So, thank you for that, by the way, because it was like that. I needed that reframing of that moment just so I could be present. I think a lot of times we just go through life and we never stop to realize it's not the destination, it's the journey. Yes, yeah, yeah. You want to enjoy the journey. And that's the biggest thing is, even downstairs this morning, right? And we were the boys talking about all of the painful times. Yeah. You know, like, they're like, oh, the finish line, right? Because that's probably about damn near the only good time that they had. But they're just, they're talking about those horrible, painful moments. Yeah. I remember, some of them couldn't even move their hips. They were doing this like sidewall. And I didn't know, you know, exactly what I'm talking about. It's like they had braces on their legs and couldn't bend their knees or their hips. And they were doing this sort of weird, because they weren't, they weren't supposed to do that. Yeah. You know, they, they trained for 71 days. What are the top three reasons why I prefer a vertical cold plunge versus a lay down tub? Well, I've used both. When you're in a vertical position, your body naturally regulates your breathing better. So if you're holding on to the sides and you're in a vertical position, you can just focus on your breath work and you can stay calm. A lot of people feel more calm when they're in a vertical position than when they're laying down in the water and think they might slip under the water. So when you're vertical plunging, you're fully immersed faster. You can focus on recovery, inflammation reduction, and you're not struggling to just stay in a lie down position. Your body floats in an awkward way sometimes. So it's just a more efficient, comfortable experience in my opinion. It takes a way less space too. It has a smaller footprint. So you can put these on your patio, your garage, your bathroom, your locker room. You can really put it anywhere. I've got one on my balcony. I've got two on my bathroom. So this is why cold life is my favorite cold plunge on the market. So click the link below and you can order yours today. Make sure you get the ultimate human version. So how do you deal with the mental side of ultra endurance racing? I mean, what percentage of it is actually mental versus physical? You know, it depends on where you're at in the process, right? I would say, honestly, at this point with me, I would say 95% of it is all mental and 5% of it is physical. Once you're in shape to run that distance, like, you know, just like you saw, you know, the reason why cold feels so good today is because he's already done this type of stuff before. The seven marathons in seven days, his body is already like, oh, I remember this. You know, so once you kind of build that base, it's all, it's all here. And I even told, you know, right at the very beginning, even after looking at those guys, I told, I don't know, somebody, Amanda, I was like, if cold was doing this on his own, he would go under 20 hours. Yeah. Like, you know, he's just cold, cold was probably them. I'd call it one, Kyle it to Brad at three. And, you know, the rest of them, I mean, that was actually pretty much how it was. Yeah, yeah, yeah. That's exactly it. Yeah, but you know, once you get there, it's all mental, just like I said earlier, I truly believe anyone can move that distance if you are a fit human, but not everybody can do that. And that's what, that's what sets people apart. Yeah. When we were on the Great World Race, it was it, we were six marathons in and Cole had gotten a really bad stomach bug on the, on the flight from Istanbul to Cartagena. And, I mean, just thrown up diarrhea, probably lost four or five pounds on the flight. He was still sick as a dog. He was fully fast. It had no fluids. Oh, boy. And I remember telling my, telling Max, my head of art production team who went with us before the race, I was like, there's no chance. He's finishing this marathon. And Cartagena was so hot and it was such a hot, humid, sunny, long, unforgiving course. Like just the dehydration alone is going to, he's going to DNF it. I actually ended up running the entire marathon and I'd never run a marathon. Yeah. And I didn't train at all. But I ended up doing that just because I was so worried about my son. And he just went to this place. He locked in because he was in the pain cave from like mile six. Just so dehydrated. And every two and a half miles or these rest station and his Cartagena, right? It's like third world country. So the rest stations were like third world rest stations. They just basically had a porta potty and a little table with some bananas. And he would go into the porta potty and he'd throw up and I could hear up. He had diarrhea. He would sit on the little porta potty toilet and throw it into the urinal. And then he would get back out and start running again. And I was at the end of the race. I was filling little bottle caps full of coconut water. And he would sit on a bottle cap while he was running. It was like the only nutrition he could take. And to this day, I don't know where he got the fortitude to go through that because my level of concern for him was like at a 10 out of it. Especially when you're in a third world country. Yeah. And you're like, we don't have a lot of access as a medical business. Yeah. And I'll never forget. Like I start to get a little delirious. Like I was all full of vigor at the start line. I pull them next to call and I'm like, listen, if you don't give up on this race, I won't give up on you. You know, I'm going to stay with you this whole race. And then like my late teen, I was like, you want to throw in a towel dude. I'm all in. I mean, a lot of quitter in this world. Yeah. The quittance, not as bad as this part. People quit all the time. Thomas Edison, 35,000 times. I'm going to the like ball. I didn't say it. And then I would start to get like sentimental. And I was like, because I was half delirious. And I was like, you know what? I called it. It's no place I'd rather be than right here with you right now. Some day we're going to wish we were right back here. And he looks at me and he goes, Dad, shut the fuck up. I was like, I was like, pull that out. Yeah. Because he was just. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. You apologize to me. Oh no, for sure. I give Amanda that same thing all the time. Why aren't she just, you know, because that's it. That's when you're in there. Yeah. You're in there. And it's just like you're trying to battle yourself and you just can't have anything from the outside world come in. Yeah. Yeah. So I think I think that's the big takeaway from these. It's such a metaphor for life. And you know, if you're sitting and listening to this podcast, you're like, I'm never going to run 100 miles. And maybe you never will. But it's about that. But it's not about that. It's literally about accomplishing something that you never ever thought you could. Every single one of those guys broke down in tears at the end of the, you just saw every emotion, even as we were coming up to the finish line. Brad. Brad just. Brad was going through it. He was, man. And I don't think most people never find that place in themselves. It's such a beautiful thing. You know, and it's not just the pain. It's that overwhelming sense of accomplishing something really, really, really hard. Yeah. Yeah. And that's, you know, I've heard that, you know, it's, I said that after Texas where I was like, I hope, I hope that anyone out there, and Instagram, so I was like, anyone out there can feel this type of happiness within my body. Amen. Like it is the most incredible thing in the world. It's not about just what you said. It's not about running. Yeah. You know, it's not even about fitness. Yeah. Like, you know, if, if you changing your life looks like you're scared to just leave your job and go to a new one, like that, and then, oh, no, like what happens if I don't like that one, then find another one. Yeah. Then find another one. That's the same thing as run one more mile, one more mile. You know, like that's, you have to figure out where you can apply. You know, this type of mental, like, you can't be afraid to fail. Yeah. And it doesn't need to be fitness. Yeah. So what's next for you? Like, what are you, what's your next big bold audacious goal? Yeah. July, the fourth of July. What's your, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I haven't announced this yet at all. It's not a, it's, it's a whole back. All right. This is a, this is 90% confirmed. Okay. All right. So that's why I haven't really dropped the up. We'll keep it between you and me and 20 million people that watch about it. Yeah. Yeah. I'm going to roll in 250 miles from Times Square to the front lawn of the White House on the fourth of July. And my goal is one of our Iowa National Guard units was deployed in Syria and two of our boys were killed about a month ago. You probably saw that. I did see that. That was an Iowa National Guard. Yes. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And my goal is to get a hold of them and get their deployment flag. And I want to carry their deployment flag to the White House. That's awesome. And honor of them while raising money for a veteran's charity. So cool. So that's, that's my, that's my goal this year to be part of the White House. So, you know, the 200, you know, this is our, this is America's 250th birthday. Yeah. This year. So happy birthday America. Yeah. I'm going to be part of the 300th birthday and then, you know, hopefully I can get a hold of that deployment flag and, you know, carry, carry families will do that for me. Yeah. Carry that the way. So, yeah. I'm, I'm excited about that. And you know, there's, there's some, there's some partners involved. I'm just going to leave them out of it for now. Yeah. Yeah. I'm very, I'm very excited to do that. And then, you know, the next one is getting married, I guess. Got it. Yeah. Got it. Got it. It's beautiful. Right off camera bruised up from the fall that she took on the side of the road. I was falling or in a czar eat it out the side of the road, but she bounced right back up. Yeah. And so getting married to a competition is called that is phenomenal. I'll also put in a shameless plug for, you know, jelly. And your run club, which is now one of the biggest run clubs. Yeah, I'll travel. Yeah, the losers run club. Yeah. The large Strava group, a Facebook group. Yeah. Yeah. So we're going to try to break the Guinness Book of World's record on April 19th in Vegas with Dana White. Um, yesterday I was in Dana's office and, and I got him to commit to running the five case. Like I haven't run a mile in 15 years. That's crazy. Like, like, like, like, like, like a Dana White. I'm like, yo, like that, like, that's wild. Yeah, that's why I knew Dana because Dana is one of those guys. If he, he's either kind of all in or all out. Like when I first started working with him and he was like, I'll do whatever you say for 10 weeks. I can do anything for 10 weeks. And then six weeks and he was like, I'm never given this up. But he committed. And so I brought his assistant in. I brought his like right hand Elliott in. I got as many witnesses. I took a video of, and it's Jelly Roll and I'm like, Jelly Dana's in. So he's going to run it. And the whole idea is not that settle hands be record, but just to inspire a lot of people on it. For sure. We want to carry the weight that that jelly lost over that, you know, over that five K. Yeah. That just show people that it's just like what you've overcome, what he's overcome. And just inspire people to maybe choose movement and exercise as an outlet. Yeah. Rather than drugs or alcohol or or or just isolation. And and what I find that happens every time I'm around one of these groups like the great world race or the 100 miles that you guys just did. The unity, the community that comes out of accomplishing something like that is absolutely palpable. Yeah. Like you guys love each other. Yeah. Yeah. I told Kyle, I said, yo, like after this run, like like the six of you will have a bond that that is different than any other. Well, you guys think that your friends now, like you will, like these will be the greatest friends that you have for the rest of your life. Yeah. Because you suffered together. Yeah. That's the type of camaraderie that you see in the military. Yeah. You know, and I've interviewed a lot of a lot of seals and DJ Shipley and you know, Sean Ryan other guys and like talk about how that that, that, you know, that pain is a unifier. Yes. Yeah. Because when you're, you know, and that's something to the audience as well. You know, like if you want to get into, you know, fitness, have someone, have someone with you, you know, you know, if you're just trying to get out the couch, call up one of your friends. Maybe they're just waiting for you to call. Yeah. And because they need the same thing. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Because when you are doing something and you're suffering, when you know that the person next to you is suffering, it changes everything. Because then you can, you know, and you're on head, you're like, well, you know, if I'm suffering, if Gary's suffering next to me, then, you know, if he's doing it, then I can do it. Yeah. So, yeah. So the last thing I want to touch on is is you, you talked about it, suffering some depression after your Texas race. And like post race depression, post accomplishment, depression, whatever you want to call it. How did you, how did you grapple with that? Because now you accomplish this insanely bold, audacious goal. And you fell into depression. And I've had, I've had a lot of athletes talk about that that I, that I know including like John Jones and Michael Chandler, you know, they've always talked about how your identity becomes this iconic figure. DJ Dillishall talked about the same thing, you know, three time UFC champion. And then you're no longer a UFC champion. And like your accomplishments are yesterday's accomplishments. And now you're, you find yourself in this really strange identity crisis. Like, well, who am I now? What's next? Do I have to keep doing this to, to, to get validation? And how did you crawl out of that? Yeah. Well, you know, I want to be completely transparent right off the bat is that, you know, the, the depression was, you know, imagine, imagine going for 17 days and having people tell you all day long, you're the greatest. You're so good. Like, you're the best for your inspiring me. No, other people couldn't do this. You're the go like, you know, and then, and then unfortunately, when that ends, whether it's running or, you know, carrying a, you know, UFC world title, anything like that, when it ends, no one cares. Right. They don't. You know, and like, yeah, okay, maybe you have fans out there that care, yeah, sure, but like the noise stops. Mm-hmm. And when you fade from the UFC, right? Like if you're not fighting, somebody else is, somebody else says the world just always continues to move on. Yeah. And so what I found is, you know, just like what you said, it's an identity. You know, I don't like, Matt Johnson, the ultra runner, you know, the, the Matt Johnson underscore underscore, the Instagram guy, right? Like that's, that's not who I want to be. Right. I want to be Matthew. Like I want to be me. Yeah. And, you know, what does that mean? And, you know, for me, it's like, even this year, right? Like for me, it was, it was so big. I told Amanda after the Texas run, you know, because I did Texas in 24. I did East to West. I just did it this October, North to South. Okay. And so I'm the only man to cross Texas both ways. Wow. Yeah. So the fastest man to do it, fastest man to do it both ways. And the only man to do it both ways. Wow. That's cool. But I told her I was like, I don't want to do anything next year. Like, I don't, I don't want to do this again. I don't want to, like, I don't, I don't, I don't, I will, I don't think I will ever do a 20 day event ever again. Yeah. It's just too hard on the body. Yeah. And, but I told her I'm like, that's when I became, you know, and then I had the opportunity with Kyle in November, you know, October, November, or, yeah, October to become Matt Johnson coach Matt. Yeah. You know, so then it's like, okay, like now I'm coach Matt, like now I have something. So then it was November, December, January. I was wearing the coaching hat and I'm just training. You know, I got just training on my own run of 50 miles a week. I'm lifting in the gym. You know, but like, I know that like this big event yesterday is coming. And you know, so it's just, it's not for your identity. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So it doesn't become who you are. I wind down all of my podcasts and I can't wait to hear your answer here by asking my guests the same question. There's no right or wrong answer to this question. But what does it mean to you to be an ultimate human? That's easy. To me, like being the ultimate human is, is helping others. Like, I believe that we, we are put on this earth to, you know, to not just be for us, but to be for others. I get my most fulfillment when I am, when I am helping others. I never had anyone there for me. Yeah. I never had a dad there for me. I never had anyone telling me how to run, how to lift. Like, I had to go to the gym and just watch people doing, you know, tricep, you know, tricep push downs and I'm like, okay, like I'm gonna copy that, right? Right. Like, if you know something, share it with somebody. Mm-hmm. Be there for somebody. And that, like, to me, like, that is the ultimate human. Like, just showing, just showing love to others. It's just like, that is amazing, man. That's it. It's helping. I gotta say, like, John Maxwell, one of the greatest success authors of all time, he talks about the difference between living a life of significance and living a life of service and like being in service to other people and like how much more fulfilling it is. Brother, man, respect for you, man. Thank you for getting my son a hundred miles through the desert safely. Yeah. Appreciate you. We're gonna follow your story. Which is my audience find you if they want to know more about you? Yeah, Instagram, you know, I've Instagram page @MattJohnson. Google MattJohnson Runner, you'll find all the crazy stuff. And then YouTube, yeah, on the YouTube, you know, we're trying to, I'm trying to, one of my goals this year is I want to hammer down on the YouTube just doing, doing cool stuff and documenting. That's great. You know, I built the Instagram following through all the funny, you know, BS. But like, now I want to really show people like the life I'm living. Yeah. Hopefully they can figure out how to, you know, get there for themselves as well. Sounds great, man. Matt, I hope you come back on the ultimate. Yeah, yeah. Thank you so much for having me. And until next time, that's just science.