The following program contains names, places and events that have been anonymized or fictionalized for the purposes of protection and safety. The following program is provided for entertainment purposes only and any commentary from the hosts are strictly conjecture and should not be held as making any definitive statements about the truth or identity of any particular individuals or circumstances. If you or a left one are involved in an abusive relationship, please call the National Domestic Violence Hotline at 1-800-799-7233 for support. Hi happy dating detective's Monday. I desperately need a Mackenzie undercover. I desperately need one. This one is not the same as your typical Mackenzie undercover. It's it's a Mackenzie undercover but I didn't there's not she she didn't give me a lot of information but she did say that there was a conflict of interest which is enticing to me because I'm like we and this is why I haven't shared the story because I'm like hmm is this my story to share but is it someone in your personal life? Like I'm like no and because this is my story to share so this is me sharing my dogfish I'm sorry I'm sorry to screech anyways yeah we don't I'm not apologizing for screeching you should if anybody we I feel like we've had some like new listeners lately Mackenzie hit a million followers on Facebook which is crazy it's so cool because that goes to show you like how many people you can inspire just by showing up and just be yourself which leads me to our audience and that's why I always show gratitude because our audience listening means that someone had a platform and someone was given an opportunity to share and our guests to share their story could have saved someone's life or help somebody get out or help somebody get help and so you never know how you showing up makes an impact for others and that's what makes me so grateful for our audience so thank you for supporting our show support each other and it's just it's so amazing in the last three years the community that you all have built so we're really grateful I feel like the last episode especially there was a lot of support in the comments for each other like people educate each other on academics anonymous and stuff like that so it's really cool to see and I did want to just give a quick intro to anyone who's new to us hi we're the dating detectives my name is Hannah this is Mackenzie hi this is a Mackenzie undercover episode you probably know that because you clicked on it but that is an episode where Mackenzie our PI tells me a story of her PI undercover journey usually crazy crazy shit that she doesn't realize as this crazy as it is and it's fun it's just so fun because there's you just don't know what people are doing behind closed doors so sometimes our stories are from guests that we prep and you all can submit your stories and we love giving a platform to survivors of dogfish and that brings me to my next intro if you don't know what a dogfish is because sometimes we forget that we made that word up because it's very much our it needs to be the dictionary it's our word how would you describe a dogfish a dogfish is someone who is who they say they are in the physical form but they are lying about something that is fundamentally makes them who they are so who they are not as a physical person but right it's not a catfish no their picture is who they are yeah but they are conning lines scamming they have another family or another life or something that just makes them a lying lie in our pants yeah con man and they're conning you in some way obviously our show is a lot about dating and relationships but I'm excited because it sounds like you have a dogfish today who might not be and that doesn't just because it's not a dating dogfish doesn't mean it can't be a work dogfish a friendfish yeah but we appreciate you so thank you so much thank you to everybody who came to CrimeCon thank you to everybody who has followed our socials and you know Patreon oh yeah our Patreoners that we have the five dollar tier which we've always had but then we recently over the last couple months added the nine dollar tier which we call the girlfriend experience because like add free listening and you get the whole no it's just a funny way to describe it but thank you to our patreoners and if you want to join the patreon we'll put that in the show notes last thing we have live shows coming up July in Chicago August in Florida will be in Orlando in Tampa the dates and the info is in the show notes come see us we want to hang out with you and now I'll be done I'm ready we know good and damn well y'all Midwesterners we got a lot of Midwesterners so come to Chicago July 16th get your tickets there's a lot of tickets being sold I don't know how many are left so please come see us and get your ticket soon it's the time is approaching quickly so please come see us bring your friends bring a date let's do this so would be a fun first date actually oh my god fun trial by fire too if you bring a guy it's like are you cool with this kind of thing because if you are we can be friends totally so let's get into the McKenzie undercover sometimes these stories are really heavy and it's it's fun to kind of lighten it up a little bit and kind of bring the real detective side of dating detectives so with every McKenzie undercover I like to ask Hannah how do you think it starts Hannah hmm I think someone gives you a call and says they are suspicious maybe of their spouse cheating somebody cheating am I in ballpark um yeah kind of you know we deal with dog fisheries so kind of yeah ballpark but context clues but here's the kicker okay so I do get this call from someone who has my who got my number if this is a refer a friend situation right and she tells me that she wants to do surveillance on her husband because she wants to know who he's seeing because she or fem tuition her spidey senses are kicking in and she's like he's just acting a little funny he's acting weird I know him better than this the connection emotionally is not there and I just have this feeling okay I've seen this film before love it right he's not careful he's being lazy but the emotional attachment is not there and she proceeds to tell me about her husband and how she's suspicious of him but also she thinks that he's doing something with either his brother or his brother is helping him cheat on her or something and she said they're really close because they're brothers but she just has a feeling that the brother is involved somehow and so she wants to find out what's going on because it's just a little weird okay but then something clicked in my head so first of all I'm a private investigator so I recognize patterns and whenever she was telling me about this situation it clicked in my head I recognized a pattern and I was like I started panicking and I was like I can't take this case because I know who this is oh my gosh okay so this was a conflict of interest basically because you know I'm like oh I know who this is whatever conflict of interest but not because of anything related to private investigation but because of a client I took as a makeup artist oh a bridal makeup that I was hired to do so I've been so I've been a PI for 20 years and as I sat on surveillance I learned how to do makeup that's what I did to kill the time on surveillance we're talking for eight 12 16 sometimes 24 hours on surveillance and what I did was I played makeup and I got really good at it so I started doing makeup people started hiring me professionally and I got really good at it people wanted me to do their makeup so I'm doing like proms and brides and headshots and just whatever engagement photos, homecomings, everything so I get hired to do a makeup party for a bride and three of her bridesmaids okay so I'm like all right I can do that no problem this is what like you pay me to do this so this is not something I was hired to do surveillance on this is just a makeup so I go to this really beautiful venue out here in the Tampa area and I meet this beautiful bride and she's in her early 30s and her bridesmaids are about the same age maybe a little younger so this is a young-ish crowd like Hannah's age you know wait this is so perfect because I literally this weekend was a wedding with my friend and we're all early 30s and bridesmaids in makeup and now I feel like oh my god that is so fun this is the timing of timing so there I was mine in my own business doing the bridesmaids makeup while the bride is getting her hair done and you switch so you have one doing their hair one doing makeup and then you switch off so you have a hair girl there whatever and when I say mining my own business no I wasn't I was listening you know they're gossiping and chatting and listen I'm just there do I'm just minding my own business doing the makeup but also kind of in my head I'm thinking thoughts on their conversations are gossiping whatever I don't have much to say because I'm being a good girl okay but you have a lot of things to think I have a lot of things but but again I'm here to do makeup it ain't none of my business still mind in it but it's none of my business so most girls in my makeup chair that's what they do to kill time is they'll gossip with one another and you know it's not my place to interject or say nothing and I find this interesting too is that most people they want to hear the drama which is why they love like when I said when I tell the P.A.
They love hearing it 'cause they love that it's not their problem. One big and sad. It's like you get to hold the baby but give it back. It's not your problem, right? So I'm doing one of the bridesmaids makeup and I wasn't being nosy or anything, yes I was, but I could see that she was quiet and she wasn't super participating in the conversation or the gossip, anything like that. She's just kind of on her phone, minding her own business. So I'm just listening to all the other chatter in the room that they're being silly. And the bride starts talking about experiences that she's had with the groom and kind of like, oh, I can't believe I'm marrying this guy. We've been through so much blah, blah, blah. Well, it gets to a point in the conversation where my ears perk up because she starts talking about how she and the groom's brother had a thing at one point when she was on a break from the groom, like they were on a break, you know, the Ross and Rachel, like we were on a break. And the brother was also on a break from his wife. So he was married? Yeah, so he was married and she's engaged. I think you're gonna need a pen and paper. I'm not even lying. All right, all right, no pencil, pencil's out. Okay, so the bride and we're gonna call her Cynthia. She has a thing with the groom's brother while they are both on a break from their spouses. But the groom doesn't know this and the brother's wife apparently doesn't know either, okay? So they hooked up but she could never tell that to her groom because that's bad for business. Like you're about to marry this guy. Like don't say that. Like she's getting changed. Yeah, that changes some things. Yeah, and so she's talking about how like he doesn't need, like it's not important. It's not imperative for him to know they were on a break. They were both doing things the right way. They thought it was done, you know, whatever. So they hooked up, it doesn't matter. I feel like there's a code. There's like a code where you don't hook up with your ex's brother or your brother's ex. You just don't. But then if you do, do you say something to relieve your own guilt or do you not say something just to avoid other people getting hurt for no reason? Okay, for me, I would wanna know if the person I was with had hooked up with my sibling because I might end it. But that's my choice. I'd like to make an informed decision. I mean, I will. I understand that. Yeah, I'd probably end it. I'm pretty confident. But then some people, but then some people like I feel like a lot of people spill the beans or they they admit they confess to an affair or whatever for their own guilt. And I feel like if it's not necessary or the relationship is going to end or just whatever the case is. If you're doing that for your own guilt, why hurt someone else? If it's not going to help. I guess if in the event that you break up and you maybe hook up with someone that would hurt them, but you're not getting back together, then maybe that is like, that's between them. I don't need to start that drama. Yeah, because what's the point of hurting somebody you want to? Yeah, exactly. But if you're getting back together, they're not there. For me, this is relevant information. If you absolutely and sleep with my brother, please let me know. Oh, crazy, right? You guys a couple of years ago, I built a pool in my backyard. There was nothing out there. And ever since then, I have found the coolest patio furniture and outdoor summary stuff. And I got it from Wayfair. They have the best stuff, especially for your outdoor space. So good for summer. And your backyard looks incredible. I mean, if someone hasn't tried Wayfair yet, they are probably doing way too much work to get things for their home. Because everything you could possibly need is at Wayfair. It's true. 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We're doing a giveaway with Balesa where everyone wins a free spicy toy, yet you heard that right? A fully free whisper vibe or a free rose suction toy with any whisper order. You know that viral rose shaped suction toy that's like all over Instagram. I see it all the time. It retails for $99. You could get it free. That's very iconic. What you have to do is click the link in the episode description or head to bbvibes.com/detectives. That's b-b-v-i-b-e-s dot c-o-m slash d-e-t-e-c-t-i-v-e-s. So I'm doing the bridesmaids makeup and I'm seeing her texting, but I'm not, I'm not paying attention. I'm focused on the makeup and I'm just kind of casually looking down at her phone. I'm still me, like I'm still like, oh, it's going on. And I see that she's texting hubby. So it's hubby with a heart and it's like a picture of them little circle on the iPhone, right? You know what it looks like? And so I'm like, oh, she's, she's texting hubby. And what she's texting him is she's just taking selfies of herself as she's getting her makeup done. And she's like, oh, I'm just getting my makeup done. Look at this. And oh, whatever. So just basic chat with a fella named hubby. Well, then a little time goes by, I'm still doing makeup, they're still chatting. I'm still minding her business and looking down every once in a while. And I see that she's now speed texting someone, but the heart was gone. So I knew it wasn't hubby, but I couldn't tell what the name said. So I have no idea, right? And I'm like, not a clue. I don't know what it's got. I don't know who she's. You don't have a guess. Right. Like, I wasn't. I would have had to like squint and like look down closer because she's speed texting the phones moving like this is this fire, right? And I'm like, dang, she's really getting on it. Like she's furious. And as I'm doing her makeup as she's speed texting, I noticed that because I'm doing her makeup, I'm an inch from her face, she starts to perspire around her hairline. And that sometimes an issue and you got to like blot it or whatever. But the whole time she's in my chair, that didn't happen until she starts speed texting. So I noticed this is so interesting. The combo of being the makeup artist and the PI who picks up on every little detail is like such a recipe. That's why I was like, that's why I was like, I can't tell this story because it's not mine to share, but also it's not not mine to share. So anyways, so I look down she's speed texting and she's perspiring at the same time. So I'm like, Oh, that means that the the body is responding to something anxiety, right? Like she's getting literally heated over something. And so I'm I'm just kind of blotting her head. I didn't say anything like, Oh, you're sweating like nothing like that because I didn't you don't want to bring attention to someone when they're self conscious about stuff. So I try not to say things like that. I just use extra setting spray blotted off and just try to like extra setting powder whatever. Well, at one point she's she starts like perspiring more and more. And I just I'm still kind of being nosy looking down at her phone. But in all capital letters between the blue and the gray and the blue and the gray, all I see is you fuck Cynthia in big bold letters. Now remember Cynthia's the bride, okay? And I'm like, Oh, and mind you, the conversation that she's having that the bride is having is about how she hooked up with the groom's brother. So this might be texting the brother. So I'm thinking, Oh, she's definitely texting the brother because at the same time she's going, You fuck Cynthia, which is the bride. And I'm like, Oh, Lord, it's right when we're talking about the brother. And again, none of my business, but also yes, huh? Can I just say also on your wedding day, why are we bringing up the hookup with the brother? Like, yeah, especially if some of your bride's mates or anyone doesn't know that, like this is not the time to spread the rumor. No. And I'm thinking, Okay, this is like last fling before the ring type conversation. Like, Oh, no more of that. And so I didn't I kind of chucked. I thought the same thing. And I was like, Well, it's, you know, they're getting married and you're kind of like looking back on how you're not single anymore, whatever, not my circus, not my monkeys. And I'm not sure if they knew that I was a PI, like I had no idea in that moment. So I couldn't read everything she was saying because again, I was
also doing her makeup, but she's getting pissed. They're going back and forth, again, with a big blue box and a big gray box and a big blue box and a big on the iPhone, because you can see, and it's fast, like it is rapid fire there texting each other. It's clear that there's a fight happening or some kind of disagreement. So we're gossiping. The brother's wife is not in the room. So again, I'm me. And so I figure I'm going to stir the pot a little bit. Oh my god. Oh my god. Oh my god. And I'm like, okay, I want to participate in this girl conversation. So I see what she's doing. And I want to get more information, but I can't just ask her because it's none of my business. So I figure I'm going to make a joke and like see it, like just kind of interject and be like, oh, I'm a girls girl too. So I made a joke with the bride. And I look over at her and I said, Oh, girl, are you sure he doesn't know? Like he hasn't hired a PI or anything, right? Just totally silly. Like, oh, you know, last fling before the ring, you silly girl. Are you sure he doesn't know? So funny. Okay. And one of the other girls made a comment like, yeah, he better show up at the altar blah, blah, blah. And she's like, girl, he's going to show up. And it was all in good fun. Everybody was laughing. Everybody was smiling. Nobody seemed to feel any type of way. But my bride's made is sweating profusely now. So they're going to need more powder. There's other girls in and out of the room as they're getting their makeup done. And one of the girls, I think she was like a friend or cousin of the bride or something. So she says, Oh, speaking of PI, the brother's wife, she definitely need to PI because she suspected brother of cheating on her even after they got back together. I have a theory. And then she says, which I don't even know if they really took a break. So yeah. So now I'm thinking like the bride just said that we hooked up with each other while we were both on a break. And now she's learning that maybe that was a lot. Yeah. So this bride's made whose makeup I'm doing turns white as a sheet. And it was like a faucet turned on. And she starts pouring sweat from her hairline. And she's on this text message machine just like she's texting so fast their smoke coming off the screen. And her thumbs are just a fly in. And all I see on her screen is I think your wife could fucking know about us. Done, done. So now I'm like, wait a minute. So now she's for sure texting the groom's brother, who the bride has already said that she had a thing with when they were both on a break. And she was like innocently saying like, we were both on a break. Like, I feel bad, but we were both on a break. We didn't do anything wrong, right? And I did not have my glasses on. I don't usually wear my glasses when I'm that close. All I know is that when I look at her text messages, imagine me standing up. She's sitting on a high, like a bar, high, like bar stool. And her phone was down like kind of in front of her belly. So that's how far I had to look. And in that moment, I did not need to pair glasses. My vision was 2020 Spider-Man. And it was like X ray vision. And oh, I think you're what's so it's like when moms get adrenaline to like lift the car off their kid, you're like, my eyes are going to work right now. It's true. It's so true. And it's like this instinctual like one time I had Ryan and a car seat in Sam's club. And I had him unbuckled because I had just changed his diaper. And he was just, he was like, I don't know, three or four months old. However old he was. And he arched his back and rolled out of the car seat from the top of the the Sam's club shopping cart. And in an instant, I had grabbed him by his onesy two inches from the floor and snatched him up like I was a freaking superhero superhero. And it's just that like you said, just in that moment, like, my being involved in gossip is not quite as high stakes as saving your children's lives. But to us, it's pretty close. I thought when you are me, I was like, wait a minute. If you guys have seen any of my social media, as you might see that I've lost 175 pounds over the last couple of years. And what that means is I have a little bit of a softer belly. And I have a a little bit of more cushy, mushy parts that, you know what, I'm still really proud of my body. But one pain point that I've always had with like undergarments and panties and bras is that they squeeze those soft areas. And it kind of creates like a busted can of biscuits kind of look scams also so uncomfortable so uncomfortable. And scams has totally solved that problem for me, which I'm, I have been so skeptical about undergarments, but skims makes it so that they fit so perfectly, so comfortably. And they have sexier kind of styles like with the thongs and a little bit less coverage. But then they also have fuller coverage for moms with bellies like me. And I really feel like there's something for everyone. The skims' intimates are, I'm, I'm converted. They're so good, especially they're everyday cotton line. I love the cotton t-shirt bra because it definitely actually works under a t-shirt. And I've had some skims t-shirts and they are very comfortable, but like certainly form fitting and the fact that I can wear the t-shirt bra under them and not look like I've got all kinds of lines everywhere pretty impressive. I love the cotton thong too. I love it. Every day cotton. It's easy. It's, it fits everybody and you can wear it under any outfit. Shop everyday cotton and all of our favorite bras and underwear at skims.com. After you place your order, be sure to let the note we sent you. 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[email protected] to get your first year of Monarch core half off at just $50. That's 50% off your first year at Monarch.com with code dating. So the mama of one of the girls, I don't know which girl, I still to this, they don't know which, but she was the mom, she and she just told us the mom. So well, the mama of one of the girls chimes in and says, Oh, Mackenzie here is a private investigator. Oh, Mackenzie, you should do the investigation. I already did. No idea. No idea of what's going on. She's just blind as can be. This is a beautiful day for a wedding, all these things. So she says, you should do the investigation. But I'm sitting here doing the makeup of a girl who has turned into a faucet texting the man saying, your wife knows about a blah, blah, blah. And as soon as the mama said that she drops her phone, like she looked up real fast and it startled her. So her phone falls to the floor. So, you know, I've been down. I pick it up for her or whatever and hand it to her. But that's how startled she was. Oh, yeah. Well, I want to just quickly ask, is the vibe of these girls talking about this man like truly just silly kind of like, how, how this is so funny? Like this is a joke. Oh, Mackenzie should investigate or are they kind of like passive aggressively piss that the brother might be sleeping with a bunch of people. The bride included. This was very like, oh, girl, gosh, memories. I can't believe it. Oh, you're getting married now. And now you're grown up. And they were all like the vibe was very chill. It was so light. It was so light. But the only thing that wasn't light was my girl. But I couldn't say that because I'm doing, I'm there to do her makeup. I'm not there to interject or be judged. I'm that's not my business. Again, yes, huh. But also it was. All right. So she drops her phone. She drops her phone. She's clearly freaking out. But she, you could tell she's trying to hold it together. But she's shaking. I'm doing her makeup. And you can see that she's shaking. Her neck is turning red. She's dripping sweat from her hairline all the way around her head. And so I'm like, oh, this girl is panicking. She is for real not stable. And meanwhile, she's yelling at this guy that she's texting. She's yelling at him for sleeping with the bride. When the bride was on a break from her husband and he was on a break from his wife. But then they start fighting about asking him if the wife really knew they were on a break or was he lying? So now I basically know that she slept with this guy or is sleeping with this guy. Right. And he's been telling her potentially that it's okay. Maybe they're open. Right. And that break. And now she's saying, were you really on a break or were you lying? Because the other other girls comment that she made or whatever. So you've got this married woman cheating on her husband with this dude who has a brother marrying her friend. And her friend slept with this brother while they were both on a break allegedly from their spouses. But the brother potentially wasn't on a break. It sounds like this is the type of woman who doesn't care that she's sleeping with a married man. But she would care if he slept with another girl and cheated with another girl.
- A little bit of a questionable ethics going on up there. - Well, that's the thing is that this is very hypocritical at this point, and I'm like, oh man, there's some days of our lives shit, right? Like, if you don't know what days of our lives is an old soap opera, the best one there ever was. Anyways, and so this is the freaking disaster mess, but it's still really light in the room. And nobody's, everybody's like, "Dumdy, dum is a beautiful day." - Wait, so is the bridesmaid also marrying? - Well, yeah, as far as I know, because remember, the first guy she was texting say "Hubby" on her text message. So I'm assuming that's legit, like her actual hut. And she was having regular like normal conversation with him, like, "Look at me getting my hair and makeup done." - Yeah, and she had like hearts next to his name, I remember. - Yeah, that's, yeah, it's at "Hubby" and a heart. So she's cheating on her husband, right? My bridesmaid that I'm doing her makeup, she's cheating on her husband, and mad at the man she's cheating with for cheating on her with her brother's fiance, or with his brother's fiance. So again, like you said-- - I've got it written down. - So like you said, it's basically she's mad that the guy she's cheating with is cheating on her, I guess. So when they're talking about, oh, and this is all happening in a matter of very short minutes, okay? So she's like, "Oh, Mackenzie, you should do this investigation. Listen, lady, I've already solved the crime. I've already got all the hands are done, like it's solved. I like hire me, pay me, it's done." So I'm kind of giggling like a little giddy school girl, being a girl's girl and just being like, "Oh, yeah, no, I'm definitely a private investigator. You should be careful, like just being silly. Pretending I don't know nothing." 'Cause at this point, I just got to, I don't want to cause no problems. And you're just trying to do your job. - I am just like, you know, yeah, I'm a private investigator. Like the girl whose makeup I was doing didn't catch on. She didn't pay attention to what I was saying. Like she heard it and she registered it and she reacted to it, but it wasn't until I said, "Oh, yeah, like you should be careful. Like, it totally investigates you." So I'm the phone is going face down. - I got jokes, right? So anyways, her makeup not even blended. Like I'm not even done. I remind you, I'm still blotting. I need like a friggin' beach towel, okay? She's halfway done. She's like, "Okay, well, thank you so much. "Looks great, looks great. "Awesome, thank you. "Jumps out of the chair." And she's like, "Oh, my makeup looks wonderful." And she's running away and everybody's looking at her and I'm looking at her, like my brush is like mid-air. - Like honey, you're looking like this. - And I'm like, "Zeebra, we gotta blend those stripes." - I'm not done. And she's like, "Oh, I have to use the bathroom, "like my stomach, whatever." Like she's trying to like get, she's like, "Oh, I'll just finish it. "It's fine, I gotta use the bathroom." Like she made it seem like maybe like she had an emergency and she's rushing me to get out of there. And she looks like trash. Her makeup is not done. Her eye shadow is done. - You like do not tag me as your makeup artist. - Don't please, there was no shimmer. Like there was no, it was uneven. I wasn't done. So she's out of my chair, she's gone. I don't see her again. And I finish up the other girl's makeup. I'm doing touch-ups and I'm helping them find their lippies and all these things. And the jokes over, like it's getting closer to time and they're putting on the dress and everybody's talking about their outfits, whatever. (upbeat music) - Only fans, we have all heard about it. And if you've been listening to us for a while, you know we've talked about it. We've talked to creators. And I know you might know creators in your life or maybe you just know of someone. So-and-so is mom, an old classmate, actual adult film actors. But even though you know what only fans is and we've talked about some of the dogfish sides of it, I am here to challenge what you think you know about it. From the earliest days of the internet, people have been taking their clothes off and posting pictures of themselves online. And for almost as long, other people have been getting rich off of it. Then came this website that promised to put adult content creators in charge of their own destiny. Now it turns out there's actually a lot more about companionship and connection than we think and a lot less about taking clothes off. Well, okay, maybe not. It's still clearly a lot of taking clothes off. But in the new podcast, Only Fantasy, journalist Leon Neyfak teams up with OnlyFans creator and comedian Gracie Canon to bring us a show about the changing nature of explicit content, sex work and human intimacy itself. Listen to Only Fantasy wherever you get your podcasts or binge all episodes of Only Fantasy ad free, right now only on Audible. Start your Audible subscription in the Audible app or on Apple Podcasts. (upbeat music) So they do the wedding and I made sure before I left that everyone was setting sprayed. I even called the girl back over and I'm like, let me just spray you. What am I, like she, I don't know what to tell you. She wouldn't let me finish her makeup but you could tell she took her fingers and kind of blended it a little bit. But I knew that my dogfish bridesmaid would be a sweaty mess just from nerves and anxiety on that not to mention the wedding. Like it's outside. So you have to setting spray, okay. I need you to be bulletproof 'cause I need my work to look good. I need you to be confident when you're wearing your beautiful dress and you're walking down the aisle, whatever. Anyways, wedding goes off apparently without a hitch. It's fine. I don't need your nothing. I'm just like yikes dipped out of there so fast. I wanted no part of it. I was like, I don't want no more part of the shit show. That was wild. And I was like, whoo. - Was the wedding like really big or was it smaller? So they decked out on the sweating. - Yeah, and I looked at the pictures after and she, the bride had such amazing things to say about my work and she called me out on her social media. She's like, oh my gosh, like my makeup looks so good and she, that's what people do. Like they love your work. And so and that helps me like get more clients, right? So that's good for me. So anyways, I just think it, I just always think it's, I mean, it's sad when somebody spends a ton of money on a wedding. - Yeah. - To find out that the bride's up with their brother or whatever it is. - But in this case, the wedding goes off without a hitch and I'm like, good for y'all. - At least you have that day. - This is amazing. What great memories. I don't think nothing of it. And I am someone who I wanted to know after that what happened but I was not gonna spend the time. Like I do not, I had to learn a long time ago that I'm not gonna get closure and I had to be okay with that in the course of my job, right? So fast forward, two weeks later, we're back at the call that I got. The groom's brother's wife. - Shut up. - Who had gotten my number from the referer friend mom? - Who tells me that she wants to do a surveillance on this fella because she wants to know who he's seeing. - Oh, so they're all giggling. Oh, we should hire a PI, that's funny, that's funny. She's like, bet. - Let's do it. - And so now the groom's brother's wife, now she's calling me because she got the, I guess somebody had went to her later and said, "Hey, you need to call this PI or whatever." But when she called me, I didn't register who she was. Like I didn't put two and two together. And so she just tells me she says, like I just didn't make that connection. - And she's like, I got your number from a friend and I think he was in shooting. You get those calls every day. - Yes, and so I let her go into detail and she tells me that she's like, my husband is just basically lazy. He's not being careful. I can tell when he's not emotionally attached, but that he's, if he's not getting it from me, he's getting it somewhere and like all these different things, just femtuition and she's like, I know something is wrong. I just, I could feel it. And then whenever I got referred to you, it kind of solidified that, okay, this was a sign that I should hire a PI just to see. And again, she wasn't certain, but she was still certain. She was trusting her femtuition. - Right. So then she tells me about the husband and the brother and she was like, oh, my husband's brother recently got married, blah, blah, blah. And she starts telling me this whole story. And then it clicked and I was like, oh! So now I'm sitting here and when someone calls me and says I want to do this, I want every single detail. And not only am I going to vet them and do a surveillance on them, but I'm going to vet you. I want to know what you're going to do with the information once I give it to you because that's a liability on me. I want to know where you psycho. I want to know what proof you have, what you've gotten, what you've done so far. I want to know all the things, right? - Good. - So, but me being the ethical person that I am because I don't want to lose my PI license and there's I think the lowest fine you can get is like $25,000 for fucking it up as a PI, right? In Florida. And so I'm not trying to get fined. I don't want to lose my license. And also I'm just, I'm the person who never did drugs. I don't really drink. I'd never skip school because I'm paranoid. - And you care about people. - And I care. - You handle their case the right way. - I feel like you should do the right thing all the time as much as possible. - So, I'm so interested in like what is the code for somebody coming to you as a client, as a PI, asking you to solve a case that you actually already have previous information about? Like is that valid evidence? - So that was my problem. So if you come to me and I already know the case, there's a conflict. If I already know the answer for me, it's conflicting. And so as the owner of the business and as the holder of the license, I want to do what's right and I want no questions. I don't even want it shady. I don't want a gray area. Like I want it to be known yes or no. And if you have to ask the question, it's always no. You know what I mean? Like if I have to ask them, I don't want to risk it. - Is this gray, then I'll do it again. - But then can she just be like, all right, as a girl, can you just tell me what you know? - Right. So there's another issue is because I do hold this license. Is it ethical to share as someone who was just a makeup artist? And so being the ethical person that I am, I wasn't about to spill somebody else, somebody else's secrets. So I couldn't tell her or I wasn't gonna tell her that I already knew even though it wouldn't have been illegal, it wouldn't have been like anybody would have understood. - Yes. - It was still a conflict of interest for me. And I would have known that I'm taking this person's money, knowing that I already know the answer. - No, but what if you didn't take her money? Like what if you didn't take her money and was like, I'm not gonna take on this case [BLANK_AUDIO]
because I actually have information about it already. And I'm happy to share that with you just as a civilian girl who was the makeup artist at your brother's wedding. - Because then it becomes a matter of, this is a makeup artist that I hired that I can no longer count on for her confidentiality and discretion. - Oh, she's even got the makeup code of ethics. I love it, you're better than me, girl. - Yeah, so when you're doing somebody's makeup, you have access to all this gossip and all this information, but they've hired you into a very vulnerable, very private place. Like when you're doing someone's makeup, that is very intimate. - And the glam squad knows the glam. - Yes, a hundred percent. And so that's why I was like, well, even as a PI, if I'm just a girl who knows this, I know this because in my professional work as a makeup artist, I'm not about to spill that either 'cause that's not the right thing to do. - And the minute you do that, the minute you lose clients, it's like, she told-- - Oh, this makeup artist, say nothing around her. So either way I would have lost it. For me, it had to be ethical on all fronts. So I aired on the side of don't say shit to anybody. And I think it was, to this day, I think it was the right thing to do. - I think so too. I totally understand, but I would have been there like rocking back and forth wanting to tell her just, just text her, text her. - Oh no, I wanted to check myself into a fucking mental institution because I was like, I don't know how this ended, but I can't tell you. - So I'm trying to do the right thing. And to be honest, I don't owe loyalty to any of these people, like, as far as, oh, I should be quiet because of this or, oh, you know, I don't owe loyalty to anybody, but I did. I owed loyalty to my makeup clients, which is this bride and her bridal party. I owed my discretion and my silence to them. But then as a PI, I also owed my loyalty to my license and to my business and to me as a person, just wanting to do the right thing, you know? So either way, I couldn't. - And also you've made it very clear through all of your McKenzie undercover's observant report. So even though you've seen these texts, you've heard these conversations. You still don't know the full story and can't, you know, be the reliable source of it. - And then if something happens, and there's even, if there's, if I'm giving information based on the fact that there's no anticipation of litigation, now I can be held for slander, libel and breach of contract. But the reason I can tell you guys now is because I've changed enough details in this story where no one could say, oh, that's me. And so legally, I can tell you this. (laughing) - Wah-wah. - Wah. All right, so what happens when you're on this call? How do you let her down? - Okay, so I told her, I said, let me send you information to a friend of mine who's a really good PI because I think he has better resources than I do when it comes to this. Because I just, I don't know that. I think I made up something about being on the phone and I was like, he's really good with phone forensics or whatever, I made up something that made it seem like he was just better at it than me. - So you did not say that you had been the makeup artist? - No, I didn't say anything. And she didn't ask and I didn't say. So I just basically said, I think you'll be really, I think this person, and I referred another investigative agency another guy that I know that was really, really good with domestic cases, which is cheating and spousal stuff. So I sent it over to him and I said, I don't wanna know. I'm sending this over to you. I would like you to call this lady. I think she could use your help. And I told her, I said, let me send him your information. He's really good at what he does. And she never asked me, well, why can't you do it? - When you called the other PI, did you tell him the information you had already? - No, and here's why. I sent him the information and said, hey, I think you have a lot of resources that can help this person. But most PIs to get a really good investigation are really good surveillance. We don't wanna be biased by having that prior information because then you start looking for it. And so then it's a confirmation bias situation. So I just sent him the information, and say, hey, here, talk to this lady. Like, you know, just kind of referred the information and said, I think you can help her. - Makes sense. - So anyways, I sent him the information. I never asked him about it because I didn't wanna know. But I did do a deep dive on the social media on-- - Which is totally legal in just a way, sir. - Totally legal. If you post it out there on the WWE, it's legal to get, it's legal to talk about is my business. - That is my business. And so I did do a deep dive this past week on the social media. And the brother who she wanted to do surveillance on and her now have a joint Facebook account. So they have, like, it's like, you know, - Jim, yeah. - Jim and Joan Smith is their Facebook name. Like, they have a joint Facebook account. I'm sorry, but anytime you see a joint account like that, I guarantee one of them has cheated. And that's how-- - You're kidding me. - Most, 99% time. If it's a joint account, one of them has been-- - I do feel like sometimes it's that one of them just, like, doesn't know how to use Facebook. - No, yeah, that's true too. But most of the time, one of them has been disloyal and they said, the only way I'll stay together with you is if you share your Facebook. And we have access to, we're gonna do everything together now. That's most of the time when you see it together. That's because someone probably sees it. - Stop. - I have people I'm gonna go down the rabbit hole with now. - No, seriously, go on your Facebook and see who's together. 'Cause this is someone who probably went on-- - It's like, you can't-- - He was liking people on their own. - Yeah, DM-ing or liking other people's posts. And, you know, they felt that was cheating. And so they went to therapy. And they said, well, you can do this together. And he said, okay, well, that's what I'll do then so that we, it's fully transparent or whatever. - Oh, that's such a nightmare. I would never want to be in a relationship where I felt like I had to, like, - Right. - I can't have a social media account. - But sometimes for people to overcome, the heart rate of cheating, that's, they're like, well, if we're gonna, if I'm gonna be with you then, we're gonna just do this together, right? - Yeah. - So I did do a deep dive. They have a joint Facebook account. And as far as any other social media, on the bride, the groom, the other bridesmaids, nothing, it's all, I didn't do a super deep dive. It's locked down with our friends. - But they're still together. Like, the bride and groom are still together. - Yeah. - I found nothing that showed that they were separate. They still have the picture together on their Facebook and on their Instagrams. And the posts that are not private, I was able to see and you can tell that they're still together. - And did you, were you able to find the client that was sitting in your chair? - The bride's face sitting in the chair? - Yes, yes, yes. - No, I couldn't find any of her socials. - You wonder if she's still with her man. - But again, I did the only ones that I did the deep dive on are the client and the groom's brother. - Oh, I probably could have gone. - Lord, there's a level of, there's a level of a rabbit hole. Like, I will go to the depths of depravity in a rabbit hole. I will end up on the dark, dark midnight, dark ass web. I will end up in federal prison. I will go down some rabbit holes. So I have to stop myself. And that's why I was like, you know what? For the case, just to give some kind of closure for this case, I only, I think as far as I went, but you could probably, I could probably do more. - I respect that. I mean, I have a feeling this messy, messy friend group is either still together covering stuff up or just outreaking havoc with other people. - But for me, it was so wild that these, and what's interesting is that back in the day, like several years ago, that would have never happened. But now more and more women are talking about their openness and more and more women are owning who they slept with. How many they don't care? Like they don't have shame by the number anymore. And they're talking about it more. - Okay, yes. And I think there's a difference between being like sexually open and liberated and then being like proud of shooting. - No, yeah, a hundred percent. - It's like annoying that that is a side effect of freedom. - But that's what I, that's what I talked it up to was that everybody's so free now. They just, they just say anything they want. And they're just sharing their, their gory details all willy-nilly. - Well, I mean, this is women in men's field, like think about locker room talk. Like that's, that was bridal, bridal sweet talk. Like, that, bridal sweet talk is, yes. And they're, I might not like it. I mean, I don't like it among any gender. And we all have to not sleep with our partner's siblings, first of all, and not sleep with our friends' husbands. - We heard of it. - Second of all, it is weird. Like, I would like to put that out there because I am like hard-known, absolutely not, couldn't even wrap my head around it. But I do know that sometimes people like, are close in age with their sibling and grow up with them. And maybe there is somebody that they like, both have a relationship with. Like, my dental hygienist once told me that she slept with brothers. And like, she was like, the family really liked me. So when I came back with the other brother, they were like, great. And I was like, okay. - But do you see what I mean? Like, we are, like, we're shaming less and less for who we've had sex with. But I think that also comes with like, hey, let's calm down on the cheating also. - Yes, please. Yeah, that's kind of our whole thing over here at the day that it had just calmed down on the dog fishing. - Sibling fishing, oh my God. Sibling, or dog fishing law. - Dog fishing law. - Dog fishing law, ew. Also, I did not watch this show, but I do think the summer I turned pretty. - I wanna watch then. - The bride of the wedding, I just went to, actually, is still mad at me for not watching it 'cause she used to love it so much and hold watch parties. Shout out to Catherine, you looked beautiful. And I love this wedding, I just went to. Love is real, guys. Just 'cause your story's like this. - And you guys know the Hanna's word. - Hanna loves a good love story. So if you have one that ends great, like, we love those two. - Yes, please. Yes, please. I would really love that. And you can send it because we like to read,
email stories on Patreon sometimes, and you can go back and listen to all the Patreon episodes when you join. So if you really need some new ones, you have bonus episodes going back three years. Just saying. You have a lot of binging to do. Mackenzie, I am so in awe of your ability to balance being the queen of gossip and also keeping your mouth shut when necessary. It is a very difficult balance. Oh, it's and I'll have you know, I'm so worried that like I'm getting in trouble. My whole life like I'm I'm paranoid about getting in trouble. So but like with stuff like this, I just feel like I want to be I have built a reputation on doing things the right way, showing up when I say I'm going to show up. I want to do the right thing, but if I'm not bound by any kind of like I'm hiring you to do a PI job or hiring you to make a job, I will gossip all the live long day. Gossip saves lives. Gossip saves lives. Gossip does save lives because you know what to be serious. We don't know what STIs are going around that bridal suite and that groomsman. That's another thing like she's like a man cave. She slept with him and a bride slept with him. So now they swap in spits and now they basically. It's dangerous. It's dangerous. It's dangerous. It's not informed consent and it seems like a soap opera and it's funny. Funny. Ha ha until it's not. But it also goes to show you how it actually is really common. Ask me. I know with these cases that I work. It's common for people to be like I think people are doing things like you think you see these happy marriages on social media and I'm telling you they not all happy. They are somebody doing something to somebody else. I'm telling y'all everybody thinks it's all fun and games, but I'm telling you you don't know what goes on behind closed doors. So don't ever compare yourself to somebody else or somebody else's relationship period. For crime con, I was making some like social media videos which I will post very soon. But one thing I did was like put together trivia questions. Oh, so I wish that a lot of stats. The first question I'll ask is statistically do you think men or women cheat more? Women. Actually men. However, but not by not by like a crazy amount. Right. Like the statistics are and also it's like who's admitting it, you know. That's what I'm saying was like for me and my business it's always the women. It's women. But statistically based on this poll it was and I have I have this the source if anybody doesn't believe me. I'll tell you where I got my info. But there is one age range where women cheat more than men and I will give you the options. Do you think it's 18 to 25? Do you think it's 40 to 55? Or do you think it's 65 plus? I thought it was 40 to 55 because that's the age range that people hire me. But it's actually what was it 18 to 25? 18 to 25. And I of all three. I mean, I never want anyone to cheat. But I do I look at college years and I'm like. Yeah, that's right. That was a mess. That was a mess. But if you ask someone who isn't a private investigator who doesn't have who isn't privy to those kind of stats, like I can tell you because 18 to 25 girls are not hiring a PI on their on their spouses. I mean, they do, but it's not very common. 40 to 50 years old. You've got kids together. You've been in a marriage for several years. That's when it's happening. And then when you're after past that age, the older folks, they just the older folks just don't give a shit. They're all having a good old time in Boca. But I thought that was interesting. What country has the most admitted based on pulling cheating in it? That was a weird way to phrase that. What country is it? Thailand. What really? I like weird trivia. I know I do too. I thought that was really fun. And you did. We had so much fun with that out of crime crime. You did such a good job with those. So interesting. We had so much fun. We loved meeting so many of you. And I think it got me so excited for the live shows coming up because I feel like we'll get to keep that going. I want the live show so bad. I can't wait to squeeze your necks. And if you have questions about the McKenzie undercover stories, you know, I try to ask the questions that y'all are thinking, but you have to come see us live. So you can ask her. You can be like, yo, I'm still thinking about this one story. Tell me this is this. Yeah. You can get right to the source. So it's going to be really a no brainer. We love you so much. And we can't wait to meet you. And thank you to Patreoners and thank you to listeners. And you should comment on Spotify or wherever you listen. If they have a comment section and tell us like what moment in the story made you go WTF? What? And when you share, when you share your stories, you can just email us and investigate at the dating detectives podcast.com. But also we appreciate when you share our podcast on your social media because I think every episode we get someone that says, oh my gosh, so and so shared this and I had no idea this was real. I didn't realize I was in a dogfish situation and I was able to get out and stuff. So you just never know how impactful you can be. So thank you for sharing always. We're so grateful. I also want to shout out Jess, a girl who I was with at the wedding this weekend because she got her whole lab listening to it. She's like, thank you, Jess. And she was just talking about like there are conversations that come up among her friends and her relationship that she are prompted to have based on these stories. And I love that. I hope we give you a like a safe space to talk about things that maybe are more difficult to bring up, maybe with your children or your spouse, whatever. Like you can talk about it in the context of a dating detective story if you're not ready to make it a real conversation. Yeah, and we should also I would also like to ask if you have your own wedding fish, bridefish, roomfish situation, bridesmaid fish, dogfish and law, dogfish and law, send them in because I would like to hear is this like is this common? Is this something you've experienced or what? It's crazy though. So but thank you guys for listening and as always trust your memories.
, and I'll see you next time. Bye.
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