Machine Design Fundamentals: Drives, Gears, & Engine Components

(upbeat music) - Hello, welcome to "The Iphone and Bendy." I'm William Gallagher, sponsored this time as Masterclass. And our topics, well, I don't think you're gonna be surprised to talk 'cause I can see it in your eyes, AirPods 5. That's all you're thinking about all week, isn't it? But, I'm sorry, you're just gonna have to be a little bit patient because that's a tiny, tiny matter of the iPhone, I need to say the iPhone fold. It's not the iPhone fold, it's not the iPhone Ultra, unfortunately it's not the iPhone Bendy. I was hoping for that. The iPhone duo is here. And I have the perfect person to talk about. Well, unless you're a John Turner song, the second perfect person, Wes Hilliard joins me as ever. And Wes, I'm so keen to talk to you this time because you've been on this dramatic journey. You went from, with very good reason, doubting that the foldable existed. Down to thinking, well, is it actually worth having a foldable? And now, well, I know you're going to buy one, but I don't know. Is that for work or because you've joined us? You've joined the fans of foldables? - Well, I gotta say, William, first off, the event was amazing. The dress coordination was great as usual. I always love it when Japanese executives wear their fancy blazers with their anime t-shirts. I'm talking about the Nintendo Direct, where Zelda was revealed for the Nintendo Switch. And that is all I'm going to talk about today. I don't know what you're on, but actually-- - I actually thought I'd like the outfits people were wearing in this. I noticed those. I was with you for me. I thought, no. Okay, well, all right, Nintendo, something. Zelda, that sounds really new. - Yes, the event was great. We'll get into our preferences. Our likes are dislikes in Apple and Saturn Plus. Of course, stick around for that. The duo though, this foldable iPhone. - Yes. - I have a lot of feelings. I think Apple did a really good job pitching it. There's a lot to get into. So let's just dive right in. It is the squat form factor. It has a hint. - Right, but hang on. I think you're just trying to prolong here. I wanted to know, are you buying it for you? Are you buying it for work? Are you in two minds? - Well, see, this is a trick. As the keynote was playing, they started with iPhone 18 Pro and variable aperture. We'll get into that in a moment, but that portion of the keynote made me wonder, am I making the right choice? Am I gonna miss out on this really cool photography system? Photography is so important to me. I'm sitting here considering should I just buy both phones? What's gonna happen here? And we get to the iPhone duo and I immediately realize, no, this is the right choice because it is such an interesting device. I think Apple knocked it out of the park. They did better than even I thought they could do. I know Apple does great with vertical hardware and software integration, but the way they've sold this device and the lack of compromises that are there, there are compromises and we'll get into what that is, but there's not as many as say with the iPhone Air, for example, and I just find it a very interesting device. So I think at this point, even if I wasn't working for Apple Insider, it would still be very competitive with 18 Pro, but I think the foldable would went out just out of sheer interest for the novelty of what this is. And that's enough to persuade you against even variable aperture. I mean, I'm not a photographer, you've been a pivot to that and you're willing to set it aside. - Well, I don't wanna get into it too much here 'cause we'll have our own segment on that, but I'll put this as a little placeholder. Variable aperture on a phone is interesting. Apple's not the first to do it. Their variable aperture is fairly wide. There's some mass that goes into it, but we're going from like 1.48, I believe, to 4.0. It's a range, it's not the widest range in the world. For example, most very good DSLRs, you can buy them going from 1.4 to 20, depending on what you wanna do. But what you get passed for, in most settings, the lighting's gonna drop off significantly very quickly. So there's only so much you can do there, especially on a phone lens that is very tiny. The reason you can get to 20 on larger cameras 'cause the lens is the size of your face. So I get it, I know what I see what they're doing here, but like I said, just put a pen in it. I, Apple's always gonna show amazing photos, beautiful things that would be very hard to shoot without a model and some lighting and a team and very good planning. Those are very much planned photos. Those didn't happen by accident, which is I believe what most iPhone photos are by accident. People who plan those are great, love you, but like my day-to-day life, I'm not planning a photo shoot of my cat. So I wonder how much effect variable aperture would have on my day-to-day life, because if it's anything like my DSLR, I'm probably gonna set it to its lowest set point, keep it there until I think I need to close it up a little bit and focus on the background some more. 'Cause that is generally how I shoot. And the variable aperture becomes less important as I'm walking around taking photos on the fly. So, and even with that control in mind, will it have that much of a great effect on my photos? I've seen examples already from the demos. It's nice. It's not groundbreaking, but it's nice. - Okay, I'll let you down a path there, the various options, so surprised that you were willing to walk away from the, probably the best time. - We'll get more into it in the moment, yes. - Yeah, but I actually also said, join us as, did I say, us who were foldable fans? I'm entertained by the fact that for the past year or more, I have been consistently more in favor of foldables than you. And yet right now, as we speak, I mean, expressly this minute, not two minutes ago, not two minutes from now, I don't think it'd be a good idea for me to buy one. I vacillate terribly on this, and I'm not 100% sure why, but I also can't work out whether it's a bad thing that we've got to wait ages before we can even pre-order. It's October 16th, isn't it? So, okay. - Here, let me take you on a journey, William, 'cause I know the listeners are curious about this, and I think I've gotten a couple of comments on this, actually, elsewhere. So first off, go back and listen. I've always said it, foldables are cool. They're neat, they're fun, they're a nerdy technology, and nerds will always, I love the idea of some good nerdy technology. My issue with the foldable that I have always had and vocalized is, does it need to exist? Is Apple pursuing an expensive niche at the detriment of the fan base that where are they gonna abandon this thing? A couple of years in, because it's just not selling. On top of those concerns, there was zero leaks and continued to be zero leaks. We never got one single proper component leak until the very end we might have maybe got a motherboard that still hasn't been proved, and then girm in the day before the event, his usual pre-event briefing that he posted on Monday night. - Oh, I'm not questioning, you had good, like I said, you had good reasons to doubt it, but I've never seen it as just nerdy. I actually think screen folds out is bigger, is more useful. I like that, and I really want one of those that fold out three times, two times two. - It was never, I'm against this thing existing. It was Apple really needs to sell me on this thing, and that's what I've said repeatedly on the show. As we came closer to June and as at least in software, there was more evidence of this thing really coming in the fall and the rumors just wouldn't stop. I gave up on the idea of, this isn't coming this year because it really seemed like it wasn't coming this year based on leaks and evidence, but increasingly there was evidence that it could be coming or at the very least everyone's wrong. So I just, I gave up on that tirade and was just like, look, let's just pretend it's coming and go from there. So I started discussing it as if it was coming. And I made the decision, I think sometime in June, like with the Vision Pro, I need to cover this apple inside her, this is such a unique and new device. We saw Samsung come out with a version of it early, like they usually do, to beat Apple to the punch. And the form factor looked interesting if Android made it a little bit more boring. I think Samsung's presentation of that device, I don't want that device. I want Apple's device because of what iOS does on that device. So anyway, long story short, the hype trains real, it's easy to get excited about the new thing. And I'll admit, like I am very much an Apple fan, I enjoy their products and technology, and Apple did a really good job pitching this device. So yeah, I'm excited for this device that six months ago, I was very much adamant, may not even exist, because it seemed like a pursuit that shouldn't happen, especially with the existence of spatial computing. And I still feel that way. But I believe it's going to help me color my reviews and discussions of this technology going forward. I am very interested in trying this device out with the existence of my vision probing in the same room. And how those paradigms interact, that's going to be fun. That makes sense. I understand that, or follows through, because it's a genuine journey. I'm just more confused about mine. Because during the presentation, I thought, yes. And then afterwards, I thought, no. And I may have gone between those two extremes a hundred times since I've got the time of deficit income. And if you want more of that discussion, because there is more to say there, that will be Apple inside or plus, as I've said before, our paper is going to show, add free. But let's get into what was announced. Let's talk specs, let's talk devices. Okay, well, all right. But let's start with the one that surprised me the most because it was denied, it was practically denied. Apple pencil, excuse me. Apple pencil brackets, USB-C brackets, will be supported by the end of the year. Didn't see that coming. Still don't know. I presume you can't actually connect it magnetically. I can't see where you would. So I've loose iPad pencil in your bag. But okay, iPad pencil. There's magnets all over this thing. I have a feeling that it'll grab onto a surface if you get it close enough to it. Apple attempted to get a pro magnet in the side along the short side when it's closed or when it's closed alongside, but yes, the side with the touch ID button. Oh, okay. Yeah. Or the side opposite the touch ID button. Anyway, one of those sides would have had magnets for an Apple pencil, perhaps a squat version of it. The magnets were too intrusive. They interrupted your ability to grab the device because then you have to grab around the pencil to open it. It was just too awkward. So Apple gave up. That was a report we got. The report did not say anything about an Apple pencil, USB-C. That was always a potential. I was wondering if that was going to happen. We didn't mention it. German didn't mention it. It didn't seem to be there. Whatever his sources are, didn't know it. Until the night before when he got his preview of the event, basically, I'm sure. Cool. USB-C, Apple pencil. There's no pressure sensitivity. There's none of the barrel roll or anything like that that the pro can do. But it's really almost Apple pencil too, just minus pressure sensitivity. That's the biggest difference. And for some people, that's everything. So keep that in mind. If you're deciding between an iPhone and an iPad, many versus an iPhone duo. Do you think that that was the surprise in Apple's surprise and shine? Strap line since we knew, I thought we think we knew everything else. Okay. It's a good thing that it's coming. I'm curious that it isn't available straight away since the phone is and the pencil is. I don't know what's got to change there, but presumably something in software. A lot of the coming later this year's stuff seems tied to 27.1. There's an Apple health set of features too. Some Apple watch stuff. We'll see. I think, especially since it's coming later this year, it's probably just coming with launch. This device isn't exist yet. You can order it in October. It ships October 23rd. So that is probably when we'll get the software update for support for these things. Yeah. That makes sense. Except, well, speaking of making sense, it seemed once they said there was a pencil. I thought, well, this is a nice thing. That's good. I took it for granted. It would be when you opened it. When you're using it like an iPad, but apparently it's also going to be usable on the front. And I'm wondering what the practicality of that is. Whether people are going to use it. But do you have a pencil on your iPad Mini? And do you use it? I can't remember what you've said. Well, I have Apple Pencil Pro. It can switch between the iPad Mini and the iPad Pro just by attaching it. So I'll use it at times. I'm not much of a sketcher or draw or anything, but it is nice to have when I do want to use it. It's nice for precise photo editing or something of those sorts. Not a highly used utility. It's something William's going to challenge me to a duel. Waving pencils. No, my problem is I'm waving the Apple pencil. I picked it up thinking it was Apple Pencil Pro and it isn't. It's the old Apple pencil for my previous iPad. So now I'm wondering where I put it. Okay. So losing the pencil could be a thing, apparently. I do think it's fine that it doesn't attach because again, it would be an awkward attachment. It's bigger than the phone. There's going to be a case where you can stick it in a sleeve or something or there's going to be a magnetic attachment case or people are going to make what they're going to make. I don't think it needs to attach to the phone. I think it's fine that you carry the Apple pencil in your pocket or bag. It'll be fun to use for the people who want it, especially people who like drawing and sketching. There's people who just like drawing on their phones. I know they buy the rubber tip pencils to draw with. The external display is plenty big. We've been dancing around it. We jumped into some features. I want to talk about the device itself. This thing is specifically 5.4 inches diagonal closed. 7.6 inches diagonal open. The same aspect ratio across both displays so that content doesn't move in any way. And that's what gives us that animation when it's opening. This is magical of it basically stretching into the full display. When my wife saw this, she audibly gasped like it is truly a magic trick. Apple is so confident in this animation and so confident in its hinge that it is encouraging developers to make it a part of the software of their apps. Netflix showed an example of playing their stupid vertical video previews on the external display and opening it to a full width preview using the opening animation. That means there's going to be an open closed angle state API for apps. That's going to be really interesting for a lot of tools I think. I did a piece about this for Apple. Apple has also launched a series of videos for developers of telling them what to do. And there's always been this thing with Apple that they keep telling developers do this follow this thing and they don't ever say why. And some developers look at it and think that's a lot of work for no obvious benefit. We'll get to it when we get to it. And then things like this happen. A new screen size, a new form factor. And suddenly all that work they were nudging you to do makes a big difference. If you had done everything they've said so far, then your apps automatically. They don't look perfect but they look great on the iPhone duo. They're almost full screen. There's just a tiny bit more work to do in the new Xcode 27.1 that you just push it over the line and make your apps great. If you haven't done that though, they're going to look so bad. They will be the iPhone app slapping the middle of the screen, massive black bars either side. It reminds me of when the iPad first came out and there were a lot of iPhone apps that you could press at times two button to make them look awful on the screen. You needed to download Angry Birds HD to get the full screen experience. I have to be careful about that. I mean things have moved on. Yeah, apps are going to be. A lot of apps are already developed for this that's fine somewhere. But things like Microsoft, they have famously taken years to adapt to absolute kind of things. There are going to be some apps that stick after a long time. Apple seems to be doing something here that they didn't ever did for Apple Vision Pro. That's called evangelism. They're going to developers and telling them how to and helping them and giving them. There was a little bit of that with Vision Pro but it was the lightest touch. Whereas this seems like Netflix was in the keynote. Which if you didn't know, Apple and Netflix have not been happy with each other for a long time. And the fact that Netflix even showed up is interesting. I was very surprised by it. Yes, but. The thing is, just following Apple's last couple of years, it was curious. They shifted to these custom sidebars where you get the sidebar in one view. Like in Apple News, you'd see all your content or whatever. A navigable sidebar that lets you jump between publishers. And then there was this little button with a line. And if you tapped it, it would move your sidebar into what was called the topbar. And that topbar became a bunch of little interactable icons. That is what is powering the sidebar on the iPhone Duo. But funny enough, it's still called a topbar in code. So developers are like, "Come on, Apple." So if you've already supported the topbar conversion system that Apple introduced, I think last year and with Liquid Glass and everything, you're ready. Your Apple already be adjusted to move it. to the wider view the iPhone do offers. You laugh then, basically. I mean every developer I talk to you I'm sure I haven't asked them yet but no question they've done all this. It just, it's a little bit reminds me of Android, the fact that if you develop for Android you have to keep track of so many different screen sizes and now Apple's got at least three. So you know, someone pointed out the interesting thing here is there is an adaptive UI system that Apple has been building for years. It was clearly pointing towards this system. Apple debuted at WWDC, the ability to view iPhone apps at various window sizes, when you stretch them. In Mac OS you can also change the size of iPhone apps to be not iPhone shaped. It was clear we were heading towards an adaptive UI that would need to address various rectangle structures for split screen mode, full screen mode, half display, full display. And as long as you've been targeting all that correctly, again you're ready to go minus a few little tidbits. Maybe it's mostly just perfecting your structure. You need to see it on a duo. It's not in the simulator yet. Developers are upset about that but we have a month. So I will say, yeah this is very interesting about Apple. I've seen the preview in Apple's video for developers, so I assumed it was already in. Apple's taken a time to get Xcode out then. That's disappointing. But I think of a month. I think 27.1 beta is going to start immediately after 27 comes out. So within a week we'll probably see 27.1 and that's going to have the foldable emulation and Xcode and we'll start having apps target that system. So that is where that's going to occur. We're not there yet. So speaking to the device size, it is shorter than your iPhone or your iPhone pro. Marketly it looks. Yeah. I mean it looks markedly, markedly short and that's one of the things that's bothering me because I think I might end up using the outside more than the inside in which case why get it William. Well, I think that's kind of the intention. You're not. So some foldables have an external display that is worse in many ways and you're not meant to use it. It's a placeholder for when you open the display. It's a notification system. It's Samsung and a couple of other companies have increasingly pushed for more interactive external displays that are meant to be used like your smartphone. So that is a trend in Android land. It's just they didn't start out that way. They started out as you're getting a notification. You can see a photo of that kind of stuff. Okay. Apple has the full OS on the external display. It's an iPhone and what's interesting here is what you're saying. This is your small iPhone, William. Everyone who wanted an iPhone, many. Here you go. It's expensive. But let me tell you this thing is small. When you close the iPhone, do I want to do that a few times? When you close the iPhone, do it. It is only 0.1 inches taller or I think 10 millimeters. Is that how that works? Not much. We're talking you have to look with your eyes and pull out a little measuring tool to see how much thicker it is than your iPhone 17 pro. Oh, it's thicker. Okay. Yeah. I'm right with thicker. But it's thicker in a way that is almost indistinguishable to the human hand. Our fingers won't notice that. Our pockets won't notice that. It is infinitesimally thicker. The when you open it, it is thinner than any device Apple makes except for the iPad pro. Oh, it's thinner than the iPhone. Yeah. By a long to share that. Yeah. But back to the size that bothers me. I used to be on the pro models and then with the 16, I went up to the pro max and I thought, am I going to regret this? Is it too big? And now I'm hooked to it and you tell me, cut it in half fully and forget the big screen. Here's what's even more funny. You're not cutting anything in half. The effective display size take off the sidebar with the dock or the interactive icons. The interactive content area is effectively the same size as the interactive content area of an iPhone 17 pro, 18 pro, but not because, or yeah, not the pro max, because on the, on the iPhone 18 pro, you have the status bar at the top and you usually have some sort of interaction area at the bottom. That's all going away and pushing all the content to the right side. So there's no bottom tab bar. There's no status bar. It's just your content. So on this device, technically speaking, vertically, you are interacting with the same amount of content with this with a wider view even than your iPhone 18 pro and then you get additional controls on the right side. So that, I think, is very smart. This episode of The Apple and the Side of Podcast is brought to you by Masterclass. The online learning, I took away this a lot. I mean, not just a year. People are passing this straight. I kind of hesitate between calling it, you know, something as I was technical like a platform, but or something more accurate like an experience because that's what it is. What I don't think I've said to you before is that, well, I already knew about this online learning experience originally. I don't actually think it was anything I needed to learn. I mean, yeah, that's not from some egotistical way. It's just as much as I relish my work, it tends to be the same type of things all the time. I didn't think I had a need or certainly the time to take on classes about anything else, but I was given a year of Masterclass as a present and you can do that as a brilliant gift. And so, of course, I tried it out. I mean, obviously curious, but also, you know, so I could say that I had a thank goodness. Thank goodness. Masterclass keeps adding classes because this is superb. Oh, some days I might simply take a break here at my desk and just enjoy having James Cameron, explaining to me the technology he used in Avatar or, or I'll be a Gog actually listening to actual FBI profilers telling me how to read people. Or I might actually settle down and properly study Amy Poiler showing how to use improv comedy techniques just to help me, you know, in situating, talking with people, situations like that. It's having incredible people, people who are practicing what they say and are at the top of their industries, filling me in on how to do it. You can tell I'm quite keen on Masterclass and actually not least because one fee gets you everything. All of this unlimited access to the entire streaming experience with over 200 classes across 13 categories. Right now, as listen to this show, you get at least 15% of any annual membership at masterclass.com/applencider15. That's 15% off at masterclass.com/applencider15. You know I'm going to say this. Head now to masterclass.com/applencider15 to see the latest offer. And thank you to Masterclass. I mean, both for supporting the applencider podcast, but also for all of these classes that I've been learning from. But speaking of me, when you said it was the mini, but now you've lost me again, I'm really, I've got to see this one in person. I feel like this is definitely an advice you'll have to use. And then of course, you open it and then width wise, it's ever so slightly smaller. It's about a half inch smaller than an iPad mini diagonally. You can hold it vertically as well, of course, or any orientation, the software adapts, left handed users. What do you think? I've been hearing about that. Well, initially I thought Apple always showed it to people holding it in their right hand so that their thumb was just on the button, but they did say you can enroll. I mean, that's their word, enroll other fingers. So, you know, whichever pinky is near it, you could do. I get that to work me up. You've kind of got to reach over to the right side, but that's just like opening a book, so I wasn't sure that was a problem. But then I think that actually does bother me and I think might be an issue here is it seemed to me that watching those actors on the video when they had it open and they were holding it in one hand and using the other to type and swipe, that it was a little awkward to hold. And I wondered about holding it for an extended period. And now with the controls ranged towards the right, maybe there is a left handed issue. Well, I would assume this is something that can be solved in software as far as the UI is concerned. Left, do you want to move everything to the left or right side? That seems like a very simple toggle in iOS to invoke, but I don't think it's there at launch, but that is something I feel like Apple could add later. Touch ID, like you said, universal, add all your fingers to it. If you're holding it with your left hand, there will be a finger near that button. You can use Apple Watch will unlock the phone, so I don't think I'm going to be an issue here. And you can also just hold the phone upside down and have the thumb rest. on the touch ID button, the opposite way, we'll see how this goes. - It sounds like a joke, but with Apple Watch, you can rotate it either way that happens to suit you and it adapts to do it. So I hadn't thought of that, but yeah. - I've had many, is a directionally agnostic device. You can literally hold it in any orientation. So I often use it upside down by mistake, just because it's literally uniform all the way across. - Now, there's something else about this, though. The shape of it and the squatness. It's been bothering me visually. It's been bothering me from a sense of usability and you're very persuasive about that. But what about the stuff like MagSafe in it? - So it doesn't mean that it wasn't gonna be MagSafe, but there is except. - Well, because of the shape of the device and where everything is, what's interesting is the MagSafe magnets are pushed right up to the camera plateau. And then there's not a lot of space below the MagSafe magnets because it's a squat device. So if you attempt to stick anything made for a standard iPhone to it, it's going to overlap the camera bar and stick out from the bottom. Like it's just not gonna fit. So the thing is, I don't think this means this is the end of wallets, for example. I just think we have to make a wallet with a magnet near the top, right? Because this is not shorter than a credit card. You can still fit. In fact, I've already found a couple of cases that can hold credit cards in the back of this phone. They're just very ugly. So I'm hoping someone makes a very nice Apple wallet, style wallet that is a little bit more squat with a magnet towards the top that you can stick your credit cards in. I don't really use that very much, but it's nice to have when I want it and I would hate to lose the ability to stick a MagSafe wallet to my phone. - I so don't use it, but it took me a bit to realize what you meant. 'Cause I was thinking wallets was in the app. No, I do see people with it slapped to the back. And I suppose I do carry a credit card around. If necessary, but I haven't used one years actually. So yeah, I pay for everything on the watch, so. - I'm waiting for the day when I don't need to carry my wallet period, but it's still not today. And Tennessee's probably gonna be the 49th state to adopt digital ID. So it'll be fine. I mean, I don't really need it to stick to the phone. This is one of those weird things that we can get into compromises and issues with the device. This is one of those weird things where for the first time, MagSafe accessories are not gonna really carry over. Your battery pack is gonna be stupid on the back of this thing. You can probably turn it sideways and get it to work. This is the iPhone Air all over again. Just there's gonna be new accessories. You're gonna have to get specific for the Duo and already expensive device. That is gonna be frustrating for customers. I'm excited though for the potential of the accessory market. I, there's so much to talk about here. We have time before the device comes out that we'll break it all down. But one of the examples they gave was standby. Standby works in temp mode. If you're aware of temp mode, you open the device halfway and then put it down like a tent. Or if you stand it up with the device partway open, that can also be standby with a clock on one side and photos on the other. You can use the external display as standby. You don't need to have power attached for standby to work. I think all of that is really cool. And I expect we're gonna see some stands and charging stands that adapt to this version of standby mode that will be very interesting. We're gonna see a lot of bespoke accessories for this device and I'm excited about that. - That makes sense, that's interesting. I mean, it's just, this is on my mind because it was only last week that I discovered my wife's car has a MagSafe charging port underneath the steering wheel. Because we use CarPlay a lot but wired CarPlay and the phone is charged at the same time. So never need it to know it and then try it. - I'm gonna have to rethink. - It's a bit whizzy. - Yeah, I'm gonna have to rethink some things. I film the show with an iPhone and there's no reason why the stand I'm using, which is a circle mount. If you have a circle mount, MagSafe mount. So dashes charging stands, the stand from 12 cells, this device, that will all work 'cause it's just attaching to the circle on the back of your phone. But anything that uses that stabilizing bottom magnet that it's a circle and then a line underneath. - Yeah. - Those probably actually will not fit your iPhone duo. This is gonna be a new accessory ecosystem in that way. But circle things should all work without any issues. - That's, you may possibly just save me some money there. - I shoot my YouTube show 58K's using an iPhone, it's my iPhone 16 pair of Macs, it's in a mount on top of a tripod that grips it rather than magnetically attaches. And I just couldn't conceive of wedging the iPhone duo in there, it just feels like how many ways can you try to break this thing? So if I bought a duo, I was going to keep my 16 pair of Macs for filming and it turns out Apple will give me 540 pounds if I turn it in. That doesn't exactly make the duo affordable, but it makes it, well, 540 pounds easier. I want to keep the circle man. - Yeah. So let's get into a couple of things here. I want to talk about displays. I want to talk about cameras. I want to get in the 820 pricing. So we have a little bit of time here, but we got a lot to squeeze in. So the display, first off, you can't make a foldable phone without the inner display being some kind of plastic. Let's be real. There are two layers of glass in this thing for capacitive, like it's part of the touch system and all of that, but the primary interaction layer, the top layer is nanotextured polymer, which is a fancy way of saying plastic. Apparently this is not an issue. Everyone that has interacted with this says it's a premium filling display. You can look at this thing head on and there is no crease. In fact, the nanotexture plays a part in hiding what crease there is. Because if you remember Johnny Suruji, Chief Hardware Officer, he kept emphasizing how flat the display lays. The reason that is is in any other foldable. Part of what helps keep the elasticity of the display alive and preventing overdue stress increasing is to not completely lay the display flat when it's open, there's going to be a little divot in the center where the hinge is. - Oh, that's great. - I hope this found a way to keep the divot present, but not have it visible. You can feel it with your fingers, according to some people. There's a little bit in the center as you're rubbing across, but it is almost imperceptible and your eyes just don't see it because the nanotexture kind of pushes the light away from what crease there would be created there. So theoretically, over time, there will not be an increased crease in the center. And what there may be over time will be hidden by nanotexture. Apple is so confident in this thing not developing a visible crease that they're telling people to open and shut it constantly, basically. I have to say, I keep thinking of those poor devices in Apple stores. They're going to be hundreds of people and they'll go in and they will not take the same care you would have if you'd bought it there. We're just snapping it open and shut. And I'm twitching at the end of the day. - Almost immediately going to see some of the loudest YouTubers go and say, there's my God. - Oh, of course we are. - Yeah, and you know, it's fine. Honestly, I don't really care what reactionary people are telling me. And what I'm going to say, I'm very interested in how day-to-day use is going to look. - Yeah, I mean, same. Yeah, if you run a truck over one half of the iPhone Geo, it might break. That's like a headline. - So here's my thing. I think the problem with the crease before and what Apple is trying to solve for is how just distracting and disruptive it is to the device. Because when you're looking at a edge-to-edge display, if there's a wrinkle in the content in the center because of light refraction, or if there's this noticeable hump when you rub your finger across it, or like if there's just really that much of a distortion caused by this, yeah, it is not premium, it is not ideal, it is not desirable. So Apple seems to be combating all of those specific issues. Visibility, though, is a problem. If I am watching content, and I can see the ghost of some kind of line in the middle of the screen, that's going to be frustrating for a $2,500 device that I'm going to be buying. So I am encouraged by their work here. There are 10 layers, eight of which slide past each other with this adhesive in the center. They've done everything they can engineering wise. They use 3D printing and AI to layer match to ensure that all of the deviations between each layer are identical so that they are not unnecessarily rubbing in some way. We'll see Apple did not provide a fold estimation number or testing number or anything like that. But again, they are so confident in their system that they are telling developers to make folding a part of their app scheme. Like, make a game where you open and close the phone to do something. Right? Oh, I like that. That's in the developer documentation. So Apple is that confident in the system. I'm pretty sure, yes, we're going to get someone who's like, I broke this thing in half on the first day and the crease is so visible. Let's see what real people do with this stuff and ignore the stupid clickbait. And that's all on. So I'm very interested in this. Realized after all these years since I had a flip phone, finally I'll be able to snap the phone shut in anger at the end of a call because yeah, you want to hang up on somebody, me, pushing the button is never satisfying. Is it? I might be revealing something about current considerations that the way this device is made, the way the hinge is made, is you don't make that last little quarter of an inch. It does it for you. Yeah, well, but you notice it in the videos when you're opening it, it snaps into place open and when you're closing it, it snaps into place closed. I personally have always wondered like, like, do I need to gingerly close this thing to make sure that no, Apple forces you with magnet magnets and in the articulating hinge, it forces it into place. It goes click. Even though it's the display is closing against itself, the confidence they have in this design is astounding. I'm very excited to try it out. It's titanium on the rim. We have ceramic shield on the back, ceramic shield two on the front, and of course, the inner display is nano texture. I guarantee you people are going to show us battle damage shattered screens all this nonsense. I'm going to take care of this thing. It's going to be fun. The displays look beautiful. It's identical display technology front on inside and outside. You're not going to see any dip in display quality using either display other than there being a glare on the outer display and no glare on the inner display. 3000 bits of brightness, fast charging on USB-C, 24 hours of battery life using both displays regularly, just to get a few specs out of the way. But real quick, because we need to talk about a couple of other things before we close up the show. And A20 also belongs to A20 Pro. Also belongs to iPhone 18 Pro. So we'll talk about that last. But I want to talk about cameras real quick because that is such an important thing to me. I've discussed on the show the potential of I might need to buy a separate pocket camera. I've been looking at Lacia think is what they're called or I've been looking at Fuji film. I've been looking at Sony trying to get an idea for what pocket cameras look like today. And I've been looking between $502,000 of how good a camera do I need in order to even compete with an iPhone camera. And then Apple announces this device and we get to the camera section. And I can breathe what I think is a bit of a sigh of relief here. Because you did also say at one point, I think during the presentation, you were thinking, do I have to buy two iPhones? You're saying now we know this difference to talk about it. But you're saying you're fine. You're not compromising too much with the duo. Apple was not specific. And I checked some comparison pages and spec pages. This is going to come out and testing. But all Apple said was the main camera is the quote new main camera. And then the wide camera was the same ultra wide camera found in iPhone 18 pro Apple made that distinction now. When they say new main camera, that has meaning to Apple does not say things by accident. That means this is not the 17 or 17 pro camera. It is still a new camera. But they were also careful to say this is not the 18 pro camera. Because if you look at the specs page, it is titled main camera with variable aperture. So from what I can tell, and I may be wrong, someone can tell me, this is the same camera system as the either 17 pro or 18 pro sans aperture. They actually expressly said in the presentation that it's the same camera is on the 18 pro. I took it back to that variable aperture. All right, I'm getting them all mixed up again. Yes, the ultra wide because I went back and checked too, because I thought they said the same thing ultra wide. They were explicit. This is the same ultra wide camera, which is great. It's a good 48 megapixel ultra wide. It takes beautiful macro shots useful for all kinds of things. The main camera is a 48 megapixel camera. It takes 24 megapixel photos. Can do 2x zoom at 12 megapixels, which is useful. Not photographically so, but still useful. But the main sensor and array, the differences are going to be we're going to have to have a whole show on this. But the differences are going to be very minute because the aperture camera on 18 pro requires a specific lens to adapt that is adapting to the changing aperture, right? So from what I can tell, the iPhone Duo has probably the same sensor stack. But the glass, the lens glass is probably something more akin to the iPhone Air or iPhone 18 pro, which is fine because Apple's lens glass is amazing regardless of where it comes from. But the sensor itself, the image signal processor coming from the 820 pro, all of that is the same. The only thing I'm not getting is variable aperture. And there's a few other camera features not coming. So let's get what's not coming out of the way first. I can not because I have to make a note about this to ask you this. There's one little thing I need to know, which is I read you'd make a note. It's called the Samsung Galaxy Z Fold 8 Ultra. Why couldn't I remember that name? That's the one I understand that's basically the same. I mean, I might be re-engineering there. No, that one's actually the one that looks like two candy bar phones stuck together. Yeah, remove the Ultra, the Z8 Fold, that one is the one that looks like the iPhone duo. Well, obviously, of course it is. You can tell that from the name. Yeah, it runs Android, so I don't care. But is it a good comparison otherwise? I mean, I'm on the prices even, do we know? I've looked at it. I believe that the Z8 Fold is cheaper with cheaper cameras. Android's weird because they confiscate everything with giant megapixel numbers. It's 50 megapixels. It doesn't matter. What is it actually doing with that camera system? Android makes that device look much more janky. I will say just because after seeing the iPhone duo in action and then just seeing Android operating on that display shape and size, it's just ugly. You get no animations, no recognition of you opening and closing the device. It's just all static. It feels cold and it feels like the software is distinctly not part of the hardware. It's like it's playing a video of some other operating system. And the Samsung device is these hard edges. They're not the soft edges. I've heard they're very uncomfortable to hold from the people who have them. But yeah, so I don't think we've done that comparison yet. We've done the more expensive comparison, which is closer in price, which is the ultra. I don't know. These comparisons are fun for nerds, but useless because once you're in an ecosystem, they don't matter. You're not going to go buy a Samsung Galaxy, whatever. The duo exists now. If you want a foldable phone, Apple has one. But I want to say camera system wise, what Apple does not offer is I cannot take spatial video or spatial photos on the iPhone duo. Well, okay, on the one hand, that doesn't sound great, but on the other, it never even entered my head to wonder about it. So, okay, are you concerned about this? It doesn't, it's not clear why? That's the case because it seems to have the same spacing, maybe a little bit closer together. Whatever it is, Apple's decided it can't be there. Maybe it'll come in a later update, who knows. It's not necessary because honestly, like I enjoy recording spatial video. I recently did so on a trip to the zoo with one year olds, and it captured some really fun moments that were fun to look at on Vision Pro. But they were not great frame rate wise. This is still a 1080p 30 frame video. It's fine. And if maybe I miss out on it for a generation, it's not the end of the world because realistically, let me tell you, the rule of thumb is don't record spatial video if something you would rather have higher quality of. Don't record a wedding in spatial video because You'll want it in 4K, 64K12. I promise you. Spatial's fun for little moments, not long moments. And losing the ability to do that, I'm pretty sure third-party apps will still be able to force it and that'll be interesting to play with. I think there's an app called Spatialify. There's also the option I believe Apple is heading towards. Apple is going to likely enable spatial video conversion, which honestly might get you better results than actually recording it with these very close together two little cameras. So we'll see in cinematic mode, even on the iPhone Duo can be added after the fact you no longer have to select it just like portrait mode. That's amazing. Which is interesting. And you can do that on the Duo. So I think we'll see that kind of spatial stuff soon because of AI and computational videography. But yes, the loss of spatial is one of those things that is just one more little knife for this device for me because I enjoyed using spatial. But just like with the telephoto lens that is 4x to 8x, I use it so rarely and barely ever get anything particularly photographically or videographically useful from those things that cutting them off entirely will not be a significant loss. It will be a loss. But it won't, I primarily use the main camera and macro modes. And that is what I have with this Duo. So you put something in my head there. And we've talked about the Duo to death, I need to call it fold there. We've talked about death and actually there are more deaths to come. We will definitely be getting more into this. But suddenly when you said that, it occurs to me that you were on the iPhone upgrade program. And when that existed, you had to return the old one to get the new. That's now changed. Is there not an option for you to keep your old iPhone and so's have spatial video recording capability when you want it? Yeah, it's just more trouble than it's worth. And it would also cost me money because the upgrade program you only pay half off. So right now my 17 pro max is, I still owe half of the value of that phone. So if I kept it, I would have another year of monthly payments with of $77 or so. The iPhone Duo with one terabyte is $2,600. If I want to upgrade every year like I have been, I have to do a 12 month lease. A 24 month lease would be about $75 a month. It would actually be cheaper than my current iPhone plan. But I would not be able to upgrade next year if there was a Duo 2. So to play it safe, I'm going to go ahead and do the one year lease the Apple upgrade program. That is going to be $107 per month. And then I still have to get Apple care on top of that. So keeping both would cost me nearly $200 a month. And I'm not going to do that just for the sake of spatial video. No, that makes sense. As it happens, because I didn't upgrade last year, I was on two years, not through the iPhone upgrade program, but I've just made the last payment now. So I finally owned this thing. But there's something odd with leasing and excuse me, not leasing firm, zero percent finance stuff. I notice in the US you have that option of 12 or 24 months. Here in the UK, unless you pay it outright, the option is monthly payments for 30 months. Not 24, not a change, just two and a half years, which seems like a really weird number. I don't know if that will change, but because that's financing versus Apple upgrade, you do not have Apple upgrade yet. No, I know that. But I mean, I was comparing a forget Apple upgrade that exists. Apple also has financing figures on there, and those are much more flexible in the States. So I mean, is it a surprise Apple's handbook? Depends on who you're borrowing from and what they offer. So finally, another thing I noticed on the website, no pro res, no pro res raw, no recording pro res to external media. This is not a pro iPhone. It does not get the pro camera features announced for the iPhone 18 pro. You can still customize the UI, but you're not getting all of the settings available to the pro camera system. Obviously, no variable aperture. I hope that we get shutter speed in the camera app for the duo, because I will be using that. But if we don't, I can always use a third party app. Yes, but Apple specifically calls out no pro camera controls. I never used pro res raw because it's expensive, like it requires a lot of data to record that. So no skin off my teeth. But the thing here is, it's just the emphasis of this is not a pro camera. No, I don't even think we get pro raw photos, like Apple's pro raw capture system, which I used occasionally. I primarily saw it. I enjoy photographic styles more, so I generally don't use pro raw anymore. I used to more because I liked editing, but I find photographic styles gets it closer to what I would edit it as. And now duo does get grain, photographic styles three, which is grain and texture control, which will be massively helpful for photographic styles. And I'm very interested in that. So we've got to move on. We need to have to close up and send you a couple of reviews. I understand a critical of me, so obviously we can skip those. We'll come back to the other items that come out, but of the air pods and the Apple Watch and the Apple Watch Ultra, is there anything that particularly struck you as well, surprising? Or did you want any of these things? Well, I wasn't even sure if there was going to be an Apple Watch Ultra at this event, and they came out with Ultra 4, and they actually did it to William. They convinced me that there's enough there to upgrade, so that'll be interesting. So what persuaded you the new health features? I think that's about it, isn't it? Well, health is universal. I find it interesting that it's doing HRV and more free-get-heart rate checks. It's doing health metrics better and faster and more often, and I'm interested enough in gathering this data that having it be improved is useful to me. Another portion of why I want this hardware is we didn't get to talk about it today, but there's this new audio intelligence system that I find very intriguing. And Apple's going to be making Apple Watch into an AI wearable, so I want to try that first-hand and be able to speak to that experience. So yes, I ordered an Apple Watch Ultra 4. I don't need Airpods 5, and obviously the 18 Pro was announced. We'll get into what variable aperture is and all that. Later, A20 is much more powerful. It's built similar to the M5 series chip or M6, whatever we're on now. It's amazing how much more memory bandwidth there is, the better cooling systems, the cooling systems also on the iPhone Duo. Lots of stuff to talk about. We have time. We will be back on it next week, of course, to talk about it more. But in the meantime, I'm ready. Give me the reviews. I can take it. What have I broken recently? Yes. So let's get into a couple of things. I didn't really get too many emails-wise. I, as someone did, ask about left-handedness with the Duo podcast, though. If you want to have your podcast reviews read on the show, just leave a review. It doesn't matter how many stars. We'll read it here. Leave it in Apple podcasts. I won't see it anywhere else. Someone went out of their way. This is really funny to me. I think we've actually seen this person before and they must have just updated their reviews. I'll read it again. Waveform Podcast listeners. Their whole personality is that they listen to MKBHD. I think they're just going to various tech shows to advertise Waveform for them because their techs is don't waste your time. Waveform is far better. Three stars. Sure, I guess. I mean, MKBHD is great. If you like Waveform, go nuts. I think we're incredibly different shows with incredibly different topics. So I don't think you're going to hear about the depth and breadth of Apple on Waveform, but you go for it. Okay. This is going to be so embarrassing, but Waveform, I thought, isn't that an Elgato microphone? Is it just a technical out here? It's a show, obviously, that I have somehow- Mark has brown lips. Well, I watch his videos. You'd think I'd have known that bit. Okay. Well, I'm obviously missing out. I'll go have a look and you can get somebody else to talk here. This prompted me to try their show again because I've tried listening before and I just- I enjoy MKBHD, but he is very much- there's a reason why he's so popular. It's because he's very broad in a way. I don't think he has bad opinions, but he also- I think it's more of he knows who he's appealing to, and again, it's very broad. So a lot of his topics get into the general AI stuff or Android a lot, and it's just like these are not topics that I'm particularly interested in hearing over and over and over again. So nothing along with the content, but based on this review, just for whatever, I was like, "You know what? I'll try it again." So I added the show, and I want to hear if he talks about iPhone stuff. That'll be fun. But yeah, I mean, listen what you want, but I just I find it very funny that like they're even their name is Advertising waveform like they're are you get like Yes, it's very funny. It's a good bit whoever whoever left that review I also think this person might have left a review before because the name is familiar taught us it is two stars Joyless, they say that they don't usually like reviewing negatively and they've given us a few months But this is and this is interesting to me. They didn't specify who they're talking about but they say they find the show joyless and boring and That their main problem is is the main host with his I know better than Apple speaking Depressive demeanor and why I know better than everyone views that can't find any joy or fun in a subject I Don't even know who they're talking about If you could be more specific that would be helpful. I don't think either of us are particularly joyless or unhappy or Well, I assume that was I sort of call signs joyless and they were kind of like the startling world of of it I'm not 100% sure about it, but then I don't listen to me So, you know, I knew listen to you. I wouldn't I'm missing. I'm very curious and Yeah, I don't think those adjectives apply to either of us. So maybe they've left a review on the wrong show Sorry, this is the Apple insider podcast yet again It took me a beat to follow what you mean. I'm very curious. I thought is that a description but no Yes, I am curious about things not I myself am curious. Okay, I know I'm mansplaining now But I took a lot to catch up there and I wasn't sure where you were going with it, but okay I have not actually read that review But I will have a read of it and see what I think And there's it's just it's so in specific. I could have been left for any show honestly There's no one joyless here as far as I'm aware, but I will say if you want to leave a review Apple podcasts We'll read it here always happy to even if you've left a review before as I've just said you can update a review and it cycles to the top And we can check it out again if you have comments to make or anything like that You can also reach out for email you can message me at westapple insider.com or you can reach out on blue sky hilly tech maston as well and Yeah, I mean obviously we stuck to iPhone do this episode There's actually still more to talk about iPhone duo. We didn't we scratched the surface and then there's like four other products We didn't even discuss yet. So guess what we can show we'll be back This is not the last episode and of course if you want to hear more about this and possibly The other products Apple announced it will be discussed in Apple insider plus we'll talk about that more in a second But William where can people find you? Well, I should say actually this is you say this is the happens how to podcast but it isn't it's the should William buy an iPhone duo podcast and I feel there are many episodes in this series won't be resolved for a couple of months and in the meantime if anybody has an opinion, well, it's going to be yes or no, isn't it really that's not very Excited debating topic, but you can debate it William at appeninsider.com and that should say if you are a writer then in I've done the 58 keys video that's expressed the about whether or not the iPhone duo is worth it's at all for writers Because I mean rights traditionally don't have a lot of money, but there are actually features in here that are really Specifically good for writer. So I've enjoyed exploring that and that's been tempting me to so I'm back and forth again And William technically I've stolen this from you. You're the host today close it up for us And I've always wondered does the main house get paid more than the subsidiaries because you know we should get paid Okay, oh right. Anyway, good time to end. I mentioned contract negotiations wasn't with appeninsider, but there we go Um, yeah, I should say and thank you for well, thank you as for not at all convincing me one way or the other really didn't help But I'll think on what you said Um, I should say more usefully. Thank you to masterclass for sponsoring this. I do really like masterclassy stuff It's great that they sponsor us and appeninsider plus I think I have so much to say about this event Let's hurry up and get to it if you are already a subscriber when you just have to you know Glance you watch for two seconds and we'll be on to that and if you're not you might glance for three seconds and sign up over Patreon which currently is the best option because you get video for the entire show including app side of plus and No ads for that. There is also the airtree version through Apple podcasts connect But simply because of Apple's constraints at the moment you only get the audio version for the full length of that So for the moment patreon is better, but wherever we can get you to be a treat to have a chat and in a moment More and more and more you'll see what happens if you can stick around if not Speak to you next week. Thank you very much for listening to this. It's great that you listen and let's see what happens when we've had What a week and a two days to think about whether or I should buy the iPhone Speak to you that yep talk soon