Love Island Reunion (with Zosia Mamet) | 67

If you can't tell from the sound of my voice, it is 8 a.m. the morning after the Love Island reunion. And guess who is on their Zoom? Good morning, America. This is us now. Guess, you know how early it is? I haven't even done my morning pages. Really? Mm-hmm. Hunter. Wait, I was going to say, like, this is how serious it is for us. Like, Love Island is that serious that we were like, we got to make sure we get it in there. We have to. No, like, must. And glad we did. Okay, where did you watch the reunion? And just, like, big overall takeaway, were you satisfied? Was not satisfied. I watched it at Zara's house and our friend Zara. Shout out to her. I love when a bitch cooks me dinner. But I wanted so much more. And we'll get to it, but Huda's little, I almost said pickpocket answers, but these little, like, PR answers. No, no, no. We deserve better. I, yeah, I had, um, I expected more. I thought it was going to be a better time. What about you? I, honestly, I mean, I would have watched, like, a seven-hour, like, O.J. Simpson made in America version of this reunion. Would have gone to a theater to see it in one sitting. However, I'm happy with the Andy Cohen of it all. I think that he, like, brought, he applied pressure in a way that I was like, we actually needed that. I'm happy that he. On the red carpets before, he was like, I'm, like, ready for Ace, ready for Huda. And Ace did not get that much. And, you know me, I'm Ace's Aaron Brockovich. And I said, Jeremiah, you're a grown man. Okay. I was going to say, did you have a favorite Andy-specific moment? When he asked Huda, you done all this learning and growing in one month? And now, see, now that's how I know you do it in the artist's way. Yeah. Because you're like, it ain't even possible. Bare minimum 11 weeks. Let's say that. Also, one more thing. Something about the way that Andy addressed Austin, who I truly forgot about, it was given the way he talks to Ramona Singer, where it's like, huh, okay, okay. Like, that is his Ramona Singer tone of voice. Every time I try to forget about Austin, I do see him somewhere on my timeline. Arm around those two black boys, Jeremiah and I can't remember which other one, when he was like my favorite chocolate men. Oh, I haven't seen that. I think about him being like, I have a black woman tattooed on my body. I still don't know what black woman he's talking about, by the way. She still just looks like Kim Kardashian mixed with like, I don't even know who else. But anyway. Okay, let's get into the couples. Yes, yes. So, big feelings about, let's start with Ace and Shelly. Ace and Shelly, I was sitting there being like, twist my little mustache. I don't know. Hunter, you might have made a point. Oh, I made several. Black love every day. I actually did. It's called Love Island, and guess who fell in love? Well, I mean, yes, and I have more to say on this later, though, because I think some more accountability should have happened not behind the scenes for Ace during the heart rate challenge, but let's do a deeper dive on that later, of course. But I'd really be riding for them. But my main thing, though, my main thing with Shelly and Ace, they're no Nicolandria for me, is I need Shelly to be dating a woman. Ace looks too much like a stud lesbian for him not to be one. Like, I want her with her WNBA bag, okay? I'm not going to say Tasha Cloud. I know she's taken, but I need her. I need her court side. It's just like, you are already dating a lesbian. Just round up. You know she bi. We can, we can. She's already prepped. She's off book. Okay. What about you and your faves? Well, you know I love me some Ace and Shelly. I am so happy that, like, they genuinely, truly seem, like, so happy to be around each other. And I also love Ace's little, like, oh, yes, I'm planning to, like, ask her to be my girlfriend. Like, I have, like, a big production plan. Yeah, he always got a production plan. That's for sure. Well, okay. And you would hate that? That's so crazy. Yes. Because who took videos of you when we were in Portugal? Who had to get on? That's called training, first of all. And you're still in, school's still in session. Let's say that. All right. Not too much over there. I, yes, very happy to see them together. Okay, let's talk about, I guess, Iris and Pepe next. I did not. I felt like I did not hear Iris utter more than, like, one sentence. Yeah. But that's what she's known for. Yeah. But I really like her. I watched her whole episode of the Gabby Wendy podcast. And I was like, okay, I'm, like, kind of, like, I'm, we're fucking with Mark. Like, we're fucking with Iris. Like, she is kind of, like, so chill in a way that I see, like, why she kind of came across as, like, very just silent during the season. I think she was, like, the exact kind of white girl a white girl should be on this show. Which is, like, pretty quieter, like, you know, a B character to the whole, the whole plot. And what did someone say? She is who Sierra thought she was in terms of, like, chill, cool girl. Like, Iris generally seems chill, cool, subtle. But Sierra's a little bit woo-woo, though. Well, I know I saw her at Burning Man. No? I don't, her, I, like, I'm about to unfollow her because her social posts are going to get me in the ick. Okay, and then who else? What are the other couples? What's the other couple? Oh, Brian and Amaya, of course. The winners. Oh, my God, yeah. I mean, I'm still saying it. I don't think they should have won. I think we love Amaya. So, wait, who should have won then? Nick and Alandria right there. Oh, yeah, okay. Yeah. The swirl agenda is back with a vengeance, baby. I, I'm going to regret that. But I do think that Amaya and Brian don't seem to have the sustained chemistry that Shelley and Ace have. And Nick and Alandria both have. Whatever on Iris and Pepe, we'll get to that. And I think that we just, we as in America, just fell so hard for Amaya and wanted her to win. But, like, at the end of the day, guys, 50K before taxes, nah, we should give it to real lovers. Nah. Okay. I'm sorry. Yeah, well, wait. That was crazy. Take it if it's. You said, and I, and I turned it off. I turned it down, actually. Yeah, I said, keep it. That's so crazy. Okay, no, I feel like with Brian and Amaya, Brian always kind of felt like a winner by association, obviously. Like, Amaya was a real winner. And I do appreciate Amaya's, like, journey throughout the house. But I think we're seeing now that, like, she and Brian just, to me, clearly read as, like, like, fun, playful situationship where, like, you don't talk in, like, three months. Because he stood up for her, but then also they were just kind of, like, you know, flirty making out. Yeah. I don't know. It just, like, didn't ever feel, like, substantial. Versus Nicolandria, of course, who are, like, I mean, Shakespeare is coming out of the grave to write sonnets about their love. And no, Shonda Rhimes is on her next feature. Well, she's been, she's been writing that. She wrote it. She actually wrote Love Island. She did. Like, with a quill pen. Yeah. But, okay, Nicolandria, I was kind of like, hmm, I kind of wanted a little bit more from Nick this reunion. Like, I felt very. I felt very happy that he was, like, allowing, not allowing, but, like, you know, being the good boyfriend of, like, letting her speak her piece and not, like, trying to talk over her, like, get too involved in, like, women's business. But I did kind of want to hear more from, like, his POV, the Jeremiah stuff, about how he felt about Hoda. Because that was, like, such a funny dynamic of him literally at every opportunity voting for Hoda to go home. And then how does that dynamic carry over into now Hoda is really actively. Like, hurting the feelings of, like, your girlfriend. I don't know. I kind of wanted, like, more. Hearing more from him about, like, his observations. And I feel like a lot of, like, the reunion was so much about, like, people giving, like, firsthand knowledge. But everyone was in the house together. I wanted more people talking about, like, well, here's what I observed and here's how I felt. And Alandria was saying that a little bit, too, that, like, people online, like, don't know about their dynamics, but, like, people in the house are all of a sudden quiet when Hoda is being, like. I'm being bullied by these two mean girls. And it's like, well, okay, Amaya, why don't you say something? Okay, Iris, why don't you say something? Yeah. Sorry to get on my soapbox, but that. No, no, no. That dynamic, I thought it was very triggering. Yeah. Oh, oh, wait. With Nick being. No, no, no. Sorry. The Hoda, Alandria, yeah, Shelly situation. Yeah, yeah. But I did, I guess, one kind of quick popcorn thing about Nick's biggest, I think, moment was, like, talking about the Ciara situation. I'm glad that he, like. That question was directed to him and not Alandria, because, like, he was a person that was in that, like, couple partnership. But I kind of want a little bit. There felt like there was, like, meat on the bone still. Like, Nick had said that Ciara had just, like, been posting, like, the Grease stuff, like, the kind of, like, my friend and my ex are, like, now together. He was after her the whole time, da-da-da. And he was, like, kind of insinuated, I guess, that when it came time to, like, talk about it between them, that she had, like, not been very interested. And I. Is that because she, like, didn't respond to messages? Because she just said that, like, she declined? But, I mean, I can appreciate from all sides how that is, like, extremely awkward. But I kind of wanted some more answers there. I think Nick-A-Landria. Nick-A-Landria Hive. Yeah. We're right where we thought we were going to be, which is on top. Let's just say that. I was like, oh, who's laughing now? This. And I'm going to call out by name. Ayanna Ishmael. Ayanna Ishmael. When she was, like. Oh! I'll start. dating white men if they lasts for more than a month outside that villa well where's your king now you better you better you better get him yeah yeah because i'm like you guys doubted us and look at them now when i say this boy does not play about her there was a video not from the reunion of um her she was walking and he was taking photos of her of every single angle see that's how you needed to be getting me in portugal just up down middle shooting from the hip getting some videos some bts i he does not play about that girl and i love that so much and i love that one moment where um coco tries to kind of come for alandria which like baby well coco's whole energy the reunion i was like first of all girl loki why are you even here like simply i like you're a casa girl the bayang coco with the bayang that's coco with the eyebrows coco without one dark tooth oh i didn't say that well i'll say it i don't know whenever whenever i brush my teeth i think about let me get these back teeth well the moment i was talking about was like she's trying to come for alandria and alandria obviously she keeps it cute she keeps it classy but she doesn't also fucking play and she was like oh i sent messages i didn't give a fuck though and nick immediately cracks this little side smile that's like got her get her again get her for me no like that is that's my number one couple my vote mattered i'm going to the booth every time no i i loved that moment with her five minutes her quick her type five girl i give it up delicious i just i don't know i feel like that coco conversation also gets into some of like the taylor alandria stuff of like oh god they were a couple too um of you know how alandria felt like she had no idea about like taylor saying he wasn't like attracted to her um saying that like he kind of like it just seems so clear to people watching at home that taylor had already kind of chosen clark or was like not that interested in alandria but alandria is like well i didn't see any of those conversations so obviously i'm like i didn't know what was going on and so yeah it looked different to everyone else um but i mean just a lot of people like i think what it was it nick or ace that said everyone said one thing online but like now in real life it's like they didn't mean anything that they said or posted and it's like clock it because why the the coco alandria stuff is like but you did say that i was and some of the other women had like did say that uh what was the white girl said that shelly was like a type of way yeah and it's like okay so you she's like i said it on the podcast but i did a tiktok later well now sister also i just hate those sentences in general no that's what i mean it's like we both have a podcast and a tiktok but i like it's so disgusting you need to air it out right now let's bring it to the red table here and now because why is it that what is it um oh my gosh what did angel reese say the apology needs to be heard i don't know i don't know i don't say the apology needs to be just as loud as the disrespect and hello yeah yeah and i think a lot of girls are missing that and i think if we really want to say it the loudest person missing that was huda shoulda coulda huda i i really i hate a bit too and okay first of all i think we need to put standing on business to bed after the justin bieber thing after how many times i heard it during love island reunion let's zip it no more of that but in terms of accountability and i think part me so much to the the characters or specifically the women of season six was like we did get those real confrontational moments like people weren't afraid to do what you're kind of on this show to do which is like get to the source of like okay what's making you uncomfortable holding people accountable having real senses of conflict whereas the people on this show were so and mostly obviously huda avoidant of real accountability or having like real conversation specifically i want to talk about the dynamics of um huda talking to shelly when they aired that unseen footage about bringing chris back yeah oh and i'm glad you brought it up because i've been dying to talk about it for a fucking hot minute i mean your voice let me get lost there well because i'm yes i get ace about it because when i but okay i know you're not talking about a horse voice girl oh well you know i got that sexy thing going on that's just well listen the ent knows what i go through this is the thing huda has when you talk about accountability i completely see what you're saying but like i huda just says the same thing over and over again and acts like that is like enough and that's not an explanation it's not like even reason even the way that she was watching her face watch her conversation like the playback of her talking to shelly about chris she was nodding along being like okay see look i said it i said it was for both of us and it's like girl but that's not what the point is you can keep i can keep saying the sky is purple until the cows come home but it's not gonna make this guy's purple that's not the truth it's like i feel like i'm talking to someone who is like i don't just like repeating the same thing over and over again um huda said again and again it's for both of us but literally she said in that conversation either you're gonna be happy about or gonna be like bitch what the fuck i knew you're also gonna be like huda don't do it i'm not gonna listen she literally says that in the full version of the clip that she was going to say no matter what shelly said she's gonna do it anyway and she says i'm but she's not doing that in practice she's doing it only for herself and that's fine if you want to do it only for yourself but then you have to be willing to own up to what happens when shelly feels a type of way about that as she rightfully should and also i knew from the first time i saw even the original version of that scene shelly's whole body language in that scene is so like you know when you smile at someone who like it's like i'm it's not even worth getting into with you because you fully are not seeing it because huda again and again says in that scene i it's it's gonna it's gonna be great it's so it's gonna be so good isn't that genius and shelly is like okay i you know okay and at the end of the scene she says we'll see we'll see we'll see so this whole like shelly agreed no she did not agree yeah i mean it's it's funny that you pointed about out the body language thing because i was like even put the body language to the side her literal language was never in agreement multiple times see i think the thing that the the sword huda wants to is like look i said it but like that's one part of a conversation which is not active listening because like you might be saying this thing but you are not listening to the person across from you that is clearly uncomfortable both physically and then and then advocates for herself to be like yeah i don't know i'm it's not really sitting with me and then the huda tries to cover it up by doing a thing that i hate when people do which is like i love you i love you i love you which one shelly does not say oh i love you too girl only until she's she says it but like the fourth time this is after huda has been like aggressively clearly trying to end the conversation too yes yes and i just think like it's so irresponsible and immature of her to think that doing the due diligence is saying the thing and not taking real um not taking real stock of shelly's emotions and what's actually happening in that conversation okay did you i mean i'm like i'm over talking about this damn heart rate challenge but did you think that shelly or shelly or huda was exonerated due to say like the extended footage of the heart rate challenge um no but i think ace should be a little bit more held to the fire about his involvement in it as well i'll just say that his involvement he was laying down she was on top of him no no they'll say the hands were on the ass there was grip there i i don't i just think you know well i don't know everyone says ace is a ringleader i'm like who are you being ringled then answer me that she said small-minded small when he said well you're a grown man so i don't know i was like that's hunter eris coded as hell oh my god absolutely um no but i do i do want to take a moment to kind of talk about the dynamic between huda and alandria and shelly um which really did like make me emotional upset like i it just it feels like the bar and i don't need i don't want to sound like i like feel you know anything that deeply about huda um i think that she has gone through a lot and i think that but she also does move in a suspicious way to me because why is it that she's talking to alandria saying why don't you tell me about like all the racist hatred alandria is like i did i asked you to post about this on my behalf because they're coming from primarily your fans and she's like well i didn't know and i was just so overwhelmed and then ariana asked her point blank why didn't why did you not make a post about it and she's like well i didn't really know and like you know she didn't why didn't she say anything she just didn't know and she's like well i didn't know and she's like well i didn't know and she's like just said that i'm like i need someone else i need andy cohen to like bark back and say what what did she literally just tell you your friend is crying saying why didn't you stick up for me people are like making all these awful memes about me today huda saying i didn't make them you know i didn't know about those specific things totally valid understand but like if your friend is crying coming to you like they're just like all you know remember the in the lives like the days when they're all in the la house together they're all coupled up in bed huda's like you know they don't know anything about nicole andrea's like little baby all this stuff and so the switch up is just crazy yeah yeah i also think what's so insane is to respond to a story specifically of alandria's face being posted onto george floyd's body let's say huda didn't see that fine if someone is telling you that story and your response to all of this is racism is not okay i when i hear your interpersonal relationship with this person like a deep connection deep friendship we never see alandria cry ever and she is like near tears like we were close i'm so confused yeah why it was difficult for you to do anything or say anything and let's make it really fucking clear it's not that hard it's not that hard to make a pose it's actually quite simple you have a team babe if you know i know you got netflix you got a team okay so like but then also i think hoda was like kind of a smoking gun it's like well why did you think that like when i talked about bullying she's like i never i never named anyone specifically and she's like i even said your name like you weren't a bully that you know i really loved you and it's like okay why did alandria feel like the bullying conversation was about her because your fans were putting her in that role and making memes and making posts about her and the the least you could do is just say stop bringing it to alandria because let me tell you um uh ppg they're always like to about each other stop talking to other ppg girls in their comments talking to them crazy yeah it feels like the the bare minimum but of course hoda is like well why didn't you tell me well babe she did you And you have time and you have handlers i feel like i hate this act that people are like oh i just like don't no you've got teams now let's all be real because even amaya amaya told ace i did not realize that alex cooper is going to make that little tiktok i mean i don't even know about that situation but amaya in the moment was like i try to get my team to like get them to take it down like how hard is it even just to extend that level of like i hear you and i want to work on this and i did not hear that at all from hoda and that was most like disappointing sad part of the whole reunion to me because instead she's just like nodding along and andy cone is like what did you regret from this season and she's like well the cursing that i cursed so much yeah yeah but also the craziest part was apparently allegedly she posted an instagram story afterwards not addressing anything about uh shelly orlandria but specifically addressing her dating rumors how she wants to own the narrative over that and then i think deleted it i can even see that and i don't i i honestly do not care about who huda is dating but like that kind of i mean i i'm happy that we didn't hear the phrase like girls girl too much this reunion um because that conversation has ship has left the harbor on that um but i was just really really disappointed oh yeah but it's up from here it's up from here in this conversation yeah we'll make it landry up in the fourth quarter baby oh wait we're going right now we're not gonna have a door yeah we're going marriage kids let's wrap it up baby under i'm done that's all that's all i have okay um was i silent or silenced silenced because you're talking too much okay what else this week and let me say this we have uh zasha mammet and we'll be talking to her about her book does this make me funny and we'll be also talking about the summary term pretty so let me say this looking for a home for your worst opinions are you a hater first but a lover culture second but of course from wondery i'm peyton nicks and i'm hunter harris and this is let me say this let me say this let me say this yo it's the first talk my talk let me say this yo i go off when i want let me say this yo oh my god yeah we love it till we hate it yo get your first i'ma talk let me say this let me say this you know what i've always said women's stories matter they just matter and you know what else matters women's rights and women's wrongs whoo belly bella noche where the hell are you okay okay okay we gotta talk about this we gotta talk about our girl belly i the summer turned pretty is like my addiction like you don't know what it's like to be literally covering your eyes watching this girl terrorize oh my god and i love it and they deserve it when we were in portugal our friend sarah texted me saying listen i know you're fully in another country but just know like this episode this most recent episode hits no it it ended it straight always yeah lines of it lines of belly conrad fan cams unfortunately okay i need to call you out and not call you in no i'll be switching up because i whatever you never shut up about being a yearner i love yearning this yearning here yearning there yearning every damn where so then why do you why do you feel type of way about conrad then he's the real yearner i don't mind that he is yearning i just don't like when it was affecting belly to the point where i was like you're not right now but like you're hot you're cold you're in you're out make up your mind maybe we wouldn't be in this mess god forbid someone be hot and cold yes and no if you bring katie perry into this room one more time leave her at the door we mean she's actually in space where are we right now so drop that down she came back um okay i can recap the last couple episodes actually it would be funny if you read it but i'll read it um okay jeremiah's dad agrees to pay for their wedding but not a new ring interesting um conrad convinces belly's mom laurel to show up to her wedding shower laurel's better than me um at the bachelorette ne belly tells taylor that she still has feelings for conrad and that she never dreamed about having her own family and that she's having a wedding unless it was to him after one edible interesting interesting listen actually i've seen weed and i've been like i'm about to make a mistake um conrad tells belly that jeremiah cheated on her and cabo oh can i say cheated because some people in this room they were on a break okay and he tells her don't marry that boy who cheated on you who also happens to be my brother because i think we should be together and then belly tells con rad this is when i said give me whatever she's smoking she tells conrad you will never be what jare is to me i said what is that about to be the dog with two blue eyes two t-o-o like piercing right after she was like listen he made a mistake and he feels really really bad about it so whoo girl and where is a bad feeling in the room with us right now is it feeling bad in the room with us right now it was actually yeah i felt like it was kind of i don't know belly i listen i know that summer turned pretty is like really packed to the to the top with taylor swift songs yeah but this is this is a show that makes me listen to some sisa about it because what do you mean you cheated on me and cabo and i'm still supposed to marry you and i have a little tiny ring and also getting married at like nauseating country club and your dad sucks and wants to bring his side piece to the wedding that part was crazy no you know who i saw i saw on you uh laurel that's mom's name right yeah laurel when she was all side eyeing the little hussy being like you stepping foot in my dead friend's house how dare it was very hunter yvonne to be like i'm not gonna be nice everybody else being nice don't mean i need to be nice very true thank you thank you for singing me i feel very seen because no i no i'll have an attitude regardless yeah i'll be i'll be alone in it if i have to i don't know how do you feel people some people actually some people on the newsletter and hung up comments are saying that we're being too hard on belly and that god forbid a girl is figuring it out i would just love for her to figure it out like before she got to the altar well that's that now is the time so that time is actually guess what it's right now we're just a little too close for me it's also the thing is though not just belly like pulling back like it's getting a little too christian for me it's getting a little what i'm sorry okay no no let's let's let's i'm glad you brought it there because why where where in the bible does it say what are you talking about two christian she her body count she's had sex with two boys and they're both brothers okay that's not in the bible that's well i think if you read the bible no the bible says you should be married to someone you should be equally yoked you should be in partner and partnership equally what is equally yoked about belly being like we need to rent an apartment and jeremiah is like well i actually don't have good credit so how's that gonna work i just think that the way the show is moving right now is like why does she even want to be married and even the way that she's styled and dressed in this season particularly i know she was like younger before and there's a feeling that feels consistent there versus her adolescence in college is dressing in like these outfits that don't seem in character with belly who seemed a little bit more like free-spirited seemed a little bit more open all of a sudden she's like in a bump it well okay i mean i i see what you're saying but also i feel like some of this is like her having a very specific idea of what it means to be a grown-up and grown-up means like she's like settling i think she's forcing herself to settle in some way because why else would you be with jeremiah and i think that maybe she's like trying to you know act out adulthood and for her that looks one very specific extremely limited way it's like you're 22 you should be in the club you shouldn't be like trying to negotiate this like whatever six-layer chocolate sheet cake i don't speak dessert so i don't know what that's about but yeah i don't know i i feel like she's like playing like putting on a costume that is like happy wife because even when she got that car said belly pusher she's like oh wow i didn't think that i would be taking on that that would be a part of it like i don't think she really imagines herself as like being a wife a bride yeah she just like wants to prove to everyone like she knows what she's doing she's in control of her life and that's why all of that stuff doesn't fit her yeah yeah to me it just felt like out of no where this drastic change i guess this is her only version of autonomy even though like paris was sitting right there yeah i guess and that's why if i were laurel i wouldn't be participating in any of this i'd say do it all on your own and you're You know what? Thanks for bringing Laurel back up because you know what I am into? Laurel and her ex-husband. I love when exes hook up. Oh, they're in the J-Lo Ben Affleck book. They say, yeah, we broke enough, but not all parts. I miss, I don't know. The ex-husband, he just gives me the community dick vibe. I don't know how else to say it. You ever been passed around before? You ever had a seconds? No. Not bad sometimes. No, no, no. She don't eat. She on a diet. I like her trade husband. I'm down with it. Well, I mean, listen, Belly is trading up back and forth between these two boys. So maybe Apple doesn't fall too far from the tree. Do you think she's going to get back with Conrad? Well, I would hope so. I mean, I don't think we've done all of this to not land there. I'll say that. I don't know exactly what happens, but actually I do know what happens. And it's that in 20 years, there's a teenage girl at a dinner table at Thanksgiving dinner wanting to start a fight and says, so wait, why the fuck was my mom fucking my uncle? And we're all at the dinner table together. That happens no matter who she ends up with. Wow. Unless it's someone totally different. Yeah. Imagine. I can't wait to watch that scene play out. We need to do like a fast forward. Yeah. It's like the little like rumor has it of this story. You know the rumor has it, like the kind of graduate fanfic? No. Jennifer Aniston, Mark Ruffalo. Oh my God. Wait, yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. What? It's so good. Oh, you learn something new every day on this podcast. You isn't me. We're on kind of a killer guest run right now. I know, we're tearing. I, well, I'll give us our din. Okay, yeah, yeah. I can do it, but you know, I've got the gay version of it. Totally. Just flesh. Very much so. We're on the up and up. Yeah. Well, with us today, we have Zosia Mamet, an actress and writer. She starred as Shoshanna on HBO's Girls and has also appeared in The Flight Attendant, Madame Web, and you. And Peacock's Lady. And we read her book. We did. We're going to be talking about that today. Sasha, welcome to Let Me Say This. Thank you so much for having me. Of course. So we have a question that we ask everyone who comes on the pod. Do you consider yourself to be a lover or a hater? I think a lover. There's no wrong answer, by the way. No, yeah. It all works. No, yeah. I just realized. I was like not expecting that question. And suddenly I'm like, no one's ever asked me that before. Yeah, I think a lover. I think a lover. Okay. Love it. Okay. And we have a follow-up question, which are you a lover or a hater of Nepo babies? There's also not a wrong answer. I want to know how many other people have been asked this question. I actually, I just shot this movie in Italy with Billy Lord and we had some like seriously deep talks about Nepo baby-ism. And I feel like the overall vibe, was love. Yeah, me too. Listen, I'm from LA. No, I have a theory that everyone, if you're from LA, you're a Nepo baby. I'm from Oklahoma. It's like, if you grew up in LA, you just move different. You know more. You're like, that's a bare minimum. The vibe is different. I mean, I also think like, something I talk about in the book, something Billy and I were talking about a lot is that there's a huge misconception of what that means and what that actually is and like what you actually get from it. And I think for the most part, it's not always a great thing, you know? But I think that the public perception of it is that like, we were just like handed everything on a beautiful silver platter, which is not necessarily true. Yeah. You're like, I wish, oh my God. Life would be so much better. For sure, that would have been great. I would have loved that. Like, I wish that everyone's perception of what it was like to grow up in Hollywood with famous parents was actually what it was. But sadly, not necessarily the case. Yeah, totally. I definitely got that sense from reading your book. We're going to ask, in the introduction, obviously you draw personal and artistic lineage through your parents and your grandparents. Why did it feel important to begin there and specifically to label yourself, we love this, a B minus Nepo baby? And coined that, by the way. Trademark it immediately. Yeah. I think-- that was something, actually, that my editor pushed me for. I don't remember the first iteration of the introduction, but she was like, I think the world wants to know more about where you came from. And then I started to think about trying, with the introduction and the epilogue, to paint a little bit more of a picture of who I was and where I was coming from to try to help color the essays in the middle. And it was my husband's idea to write the epilogue. He was like-- I was telling him all these things that I was anxious about when people read the book. I was like, what if they think I'm a hack? Or what if they just think I'm a Nepo baby? And I had everything handed to me. And what if they say this? What if they say that? And he was like, well, why don't you just write about all of that? Basically, essentially beat them to the punch. If you say it first, it really makes you feel better. It removes the potency if someone says it later. And so I think that was a big part of putting that in the introduction. And because I am a B-minus Nepo baby. I say this. I'm like, there are so many people with way more famous, way more beautiful, talented parents than mine. No. I'm like, I'm not a B-minus, I'm not a B-minus. I'm not a B-minus. I'm not a B-minus, I'm not a B-minus, I'm not a B-minus. I'm not a B-minus, I'm not a B-minus. You Send Me was the one that took the longest. It's also one of the longest essays, but that one was definitely hard to write about. You know, it's about a pretty dysfunctional, abusive relationship, it was like a very, very sad time in my life that really broke me in half for quite some time, and it was tough, because it felt like that essay kind of needed to be written. The first time I wrote it, the first draft that ever came out of me, I wrote in one sitting, and my editor came back with a ton of structural notes, and I actually was like, "I think I need to take some time from this essay and come back to it, and maybe write it with fresh eyes, thinking, like I need to let those notes marinate, I'm really not precious when it comes to my writing." And it wasn't even that I was offended or upset by her notes, it was more that it felt so kind of like touching the third rail, that I was like, "I think it sort of needs to be written in one, and I need to maybe sit with it and come back to it." So that one took the longest to dissect and find the final version of. Obviously, they're two very different mediums, but how would you say your process as an actor is different from your process as a writer? Or how do you approach each differently? I don't actually think that my process is very different. I think the thing that's different that was the hardest part for me about writing this book is that my husband always says I shoot from the hip, that I'm a very like, it just sort of comes out of me, and I'd say that's how I am as an actor, like I always come prepared, I know my lines. I'm like ready to go, but I'm not a big pre-planner. I like to find it in the moment. And I think with writing, it's very much the same for me, but then sadly, different from acting, I get to like, when I'm done on set, I'm like, "Okay, bye. See you guys at the premiere." And with writing, sadly, then there are like, you know, 30 rounds of notes and edits and proofreads. Which makes it slightly harder to be super spontaneous, and detached from the final product, which I feel like I am as an actor, which I find very freeing. And in writing, that's just not available to me. So I think that's where my process differed because it was forced to differ. There's one, like you tell a story in the book that I found really fascinating, I kind of can't stop thinking about that, like an awkward kind of dinner conversation. You say that like, you kind of got an agent that was like your dad's agent's assistant, and then he like, you know, he got really mad at you for no reason, basically. And then you talked to your dad's agent who had been like an uncle to you, and he then blew up at you. And I mean, first of all, it really kind of, what you're saying about like Hollywood not being glamorous, like to grow up in it, really that story came through. I guess I have a couple questions. First, how did that feel for you, like navigating these dynamics as a young actress? And then also, were you like kind of mad that your dad didn't fire this agent, someone who like, was really unfair to you? Probably at the time, I feel like it was. dissipated quickly I say this in that essay that like I think Hollywood really blurs the lines of morality and I think we're all guilty of that to varying degrees and it makes it very hard to know what the right thing to do is like growing up in a family that is literally is and was entirely baked into the industry I feel like I I was maybe pissed but also like didn't begrudge him that he'd been with this man for so long and I write about this as well in the essay that I'm like well karma is kind of a bitch because this human that was like one of my father's best friends ended up you know a decade and a half after that happened like royally fucking my dad over um so it kind of all comes out in the wash I suppose um you got to be like I told you I was gonna say you're better than me yeah I told you so yeah we're pretty over here we're the haters over here yes it all comes around um but yeah I mean I think it's fucking hard it's hard to be in this industry in general it's hard to be young in this industry it's hard to be a young woman in this industry also me too was not a thing when I was coming up um and there are so many experiences looking back that I'm like wow that was really inappropriate and I think like so many industries the entertainment world is very much dominated by older powerful men um and I think as a young woman I think it's hard to be a young woman in this industry trying to navigate that also with the added layer of like feeling guilty a little bit for where I came from and not wanting to like look a gift horse in the mouth I think that just added a element of like nuance and complication to the whole dynamic um where I almost felt like these guys were trying to be a young woman in this industry and I think that's kind of what I'm like I felt like I didn't really have um it like wasn't my place to to feel upset or be pissed at them because I was given this thing that so many other people didn't have yeah um but it also was like kind of useless because they were so bad at their jobs yeah and they and they hated me so much so um yeah it was it was difficult and it like really fucked my confidence for a really long time yeah at the end of that essay I think you talked about how you like signed to your current team who brought you girls well actually it was one of my agents at the original agency that brought me girls oh um he was yeah he was the only one that I liked on my team he was my tv agent he he left that agency not long after I did um and he yeah he's amazing love that the one person you were walking with was like I got you we're gonna figure this out he's like don't you worry yeah he was like we're up from here he's like I actually found the best show ever made I think you'd be perfect for it so that's so crazy our um entire personality yeah I'm just gonna get ahead of the narrative of that really quickly before we get to gross because obviously we've got to talk about it oh my gosh yeah really quick question okay so your husband is on the hunting wives which has been a hot topic on this show and just yeah in in this in this climate which is like in Brooklyn okay around all the lesbians we know also just like the world yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah we're addicted okay um would you be down to play a gun slinging scissoring republican lesbian one thousand percent like you just described my dream role I mean like who who wouldn't want to play that you know this turns into a self-tape like you have the gun on you um oh my gosh no hunting wives is special oh it's good she actually you told me to watch hunting wives and also told me to watch girls so thank you well mother Teresa in the room with us right now okay not too much just do it over there doing god's work yeah um that's what I say that show is so I started so he obviously like told me about it while he was filming it and I was like this can't be as extreme as you're describing because I was in Canada shooting laid so we weren't together and then I the day it came out I was on an airplane and I was like I'm gonna download it and I'm gonna start watching it on the airplane and I was like fully on the airplane like I swear to god I'm not watching porn over here like the shortest would walk by and I would like hide my phone like the thing you have to hit on the tv that's like just so you know there are children behind you you have to like accept it yeah oh my god yeah that was me alone in my own house though I was like oh my god is god watching like oh yeah no yeah did he give you spoilers oh he didn't actually that's a good man I'm trying to think of it or if he did I forgot Lena Denham said recently that Shoshana would be probably like in present day married and divorced from the mayor of New York City and running a zero waste athleisure startup so our question for you is does this track for you and where do you see kind of late 30s Shosh yeah I think she's probably second marriage uh or like second divorce powerful even she could yeah maybe probably um like you know on on the apps swipe swiping she's on right oh my god sure she's right she's right yeah amazing yeah she's for sure for sure um like maybe twins from a round of IVF um probably slept with her IVF doctor second divorce yeah happens to the best of us what I don't know why so that would never happen to me but it could but it could yeah definitely like very wealthy very powerful I think just thriving I think truly thriving yeah which is where we like to see her yes but yeah do you think I don't know if like if a cool breeze brought Ray like through her path that she would be like maybe we should revisit just to see oh my god I hope I hope I thought that I saw it so random I was on this set in Italy where Alex Carpopsi for sure was not and some Italian extra like in the corner I thought was him for a second I got so excited and like started started to wave at him and it was like that's actually not him at all um but I love him so much as a human and I loved them together so much as characters so like yes please that's where we that's where we part girl yeah that's where we separate roads yeah I just want I just yeah I'm like how long do we have no but I also okay we I also want to know uh which girl's character do you think has aged the best and which girl's character has aged the worst in like what way like in culture I think yeah like for example I know which one's the ugliest no but I I kind of have a serious like dresses don't really exist anymore like there's not a kind of like that kind of like hipster no I got clocked when I said that I was like no I think they're they're very real they're just like not on there's not online they're not online their parents are just paying full tuition for them in art school right now I kind of love that for them yeah they threw away they like have a they have like a razor flip phone they live off the grid meeting like at circles like upstate like full blackberry they have a blackberry um yeah I could see that I could definitely see like that brand of human not really existing in the same way anymore um or at least not being considered cool in the way that they were yeah like shosh is the cool girl now in culture where it's like totally like the way that we know her as someone who was like actually she like knew herself and like really fell into the becoming a woman the way these girls kind of went from this idea of womanhood around her to just a mess yeah the the oh my god yeah and also shosh was right about a lot of stuff they did talk to her you they did talk to you like you were a cab driver and that that duck did taste like a used condom understood I tried it I came on set took a bite nope to close this out we want to know if you had to rank shosh's top three crash outs one of them I think you're not going to agree with now one being crack incident of course one being yeah yeah beach house the beach house clearing if you will and the third one was dating ray but I'm curious which one you would have to rank okay and we're talking like what between I guess like which one is her her lowest point I would say yes yes yes it's interesting because like I do I sort I do disagree with you I think I do disagree with you about ray but also I feel like beach house was in so many ways not a low point it was like such a necessary purge that needed to happen like there was all this tension between them there were all these things that I feel like everyone was thinking but nobody was saying and like she was the one that was just like okay cards on the table like yeah uh let's talk about it um which I actually think was yeah so so necessary it just needed to happen totally I think everyone else thought it was a crash up but she was like no we need I'm crashing in yeah yeah I'm calling you out and calling you in like she was crazy but no no no she was on to something she was uh yeah I mean she was just like calling the spade a spade um and then the crack set I don't I I don't know I mean yeah I guess also like one of the most fun episodes of television I've ever shot in my life so it's like hard for me to think about it in a negative way because it was so fun yeah all right um and uh yeah we shot in Bushwick before Bushwick was I remember we were all like we're going where like no one knew where we were there was no cell phone service like you drove into Bushwick and immediately your phone stopped working and that's still true um yeah it was like it was like the tundra I'm like well Shosha's crash outs can be iconic yeah no most of them if not all of them are yeah yes a hundred percent um we're gonna have to offline about Ray but that'll be great you know that'll be private okay and this is exclusive let me say this um Sasha thank you so much and um where can people follow you oh um I'm on Instagram it's just my full name it's mostly content of my horse and my dog um so if you don't want that it goes somewhere else perfect she said you get in where you fit in yes I love it thank you so much you know I really learned that your culture is not a costume and what culture is that tennis culture U.S. open culture let's a day of culture it's a day of culture it's crazy um well yes due to I will say tireless advocacy I have RSVP'd to things that people never RSVP'd to before yeah just to get U.S. open tickets and it worked we went to the U.S. open nothing like the lights on at Arthur Ashe totally I've always said that I've actually always said that but I think if I had to choose between U.S. open tickets liberty game choosing liberty game every time every which way I'll tell you it didn't it didn't it didn't hit for me it was too bright that was my main complaint it was too bright in there the house lights were on what yeah tennis I know but I don't want to be I don't want to feel like I'm part of the game though yeah and like okay privilege we were very close oh we're never beating the boost black girl allegations oh god but yes we're also 24 okay that too get that on the record yeah let me take my chains off granted we went with a brand okay but um being that close I was like this is too much this is too bright I get why people wear their sunglasses but I don't need my skin showing like this like I don't I don't need my to see my pores it was too much and I don't think you should be like that drunk and the lights be that on it was like walking to someone's apartment straight person probably and the overheads on it's like that's too much at liberty you at the club bus club never go playing no soup tosh cloud can I interrupt you for a second sure do not come calmly hairs do not come all right don't just just just sit it out then if it's not for you well I love the elite stay in Brooklyn when Gaza calls I guess I pick up when they say party bus to Arthur Ashe party bus was crazy the playlist was really hitting I said white boys are make they're trying to make a comeback they remember every song yep every song yeah that's all every song when when when Diddy comes on and I go uh-oh no that that really lost me I said only a white boy would press play it's too fresh for that um but no I love the U.S. Open loved that we got to go if you I guess a negative review from you over there I thought I thought the game itself was excellent to what I would rather watch black women play the two boys were interesting though I just I the lighting was harsh and the distance was far was there anyone famous here anyone torn Spike Lee oh cool we saw them oh wait yeah yeah oh okay so the honey this was hitting and was the Paloma and the Margarita as well well that's it for this week as usual we are two online so you don't have to be follow us on socials at let me say this pod at Payton Dix and at Hunter H let me say this is hosted by me Payton Dix and me Hunter Harris let me say this is a production of Wondery yeah I'll go off when I want let me say this yeah oh my gosh yeah we love it till we hate it yeah get your first I'ma talk let me say this let me say this hi I'm Nicole Phelps global fashion news and features director at Vogue and co-host of the run-through podcast each week on the show our listeners get an all-access pass into the world of Vogue on Tuesdays join me as I interview influential designers like Calvin Klein Rachel Scott and Simone bellotti on Thursdays join Chloe Mao head of editorial content at Vogue US and chomanati British Vogue's head of editorial content as they explore fashion through the lens of culture with guests like Doja Cat and Margot Robbie listen and watch the run-through with Vogue wherever you get your podcasts and Vogue's YouTube channel