Little Gold Men's Unsolicited Advice for Hollywood in 2026

This episode of Little Gold Men is sponsored by Universal Pictures, presenting Wicked for Good. Now nominated for seven Critics' Choice Awards, including Best Picture, and five Golden Globe Awards, including Best Actress Cynthia Arevo, and Best Supporting Actress Ariana Grande. Hello and welcome to Little Gold Men, Vanity Fair's podcast for Film, TV, and Awards Lovers. I'm Rebecca Ford. And I'm John Ross. Well, John, the Academy released its Oscar shortlist on Tuesday. And I know we say this a lot, but this is when things are really kicking off. The Oscar race is really coming into clearer focus, I think. Yeah, it's true. So the shortlists are for the below-the-line categories, and they're voted on by the membership of each of those branches. And it starts to give us a sense of what movies, people across the industry are seeing, what they're liking. Rebecca, did anything pop out at you this morning when we went over the shortlist? Well, I don't want to be a downer to start off this, but I think we immediately texted about how one film is very much missing from this. And they should have appeared on some of the shortlists, which is the Testament of Andly. They didn't get score, which is very surprising because it's Daniel Blumberg. And they also had a song that was in the running. So I think that's a bad sign for that movie. Yeah, I agree. Especially the song, because it is a musical, you know? Right. So when the original song doesn't get in this shortlist, that is a sign. I just don't think people are seeing this movie. And Daniel won last year for the brutalist. So I also look at it now. I don't know how locked and loaded Amanda is in the actress category. I kind of thought she was a lock, but that only is if people see it. And it's beginning to feel like people just are not seeing this movie. Well, I want to jump to casting because this is our first real look at this new category and what the nominees might look like. It's a mixed group on the shortlist here. I think a lot of the films we expected, you know, one battle, hamnet, sentimental value, sinners, wicked, like these are movies. And Marty's Supreme. And Marty's Supreme. Yeah. Ensembley movies, movies that are in the best picture race. I wasn't surprised by any of those. Were you surprised by any of the others that were included? I guess I wouldn't say surprise, but it was nice to see three international films also get in there with the secret agent, sentimental value, and Sarat. I mean, Sarat overall performed better than I think any of us would have expected. It got onto four shortlists, cinematography, score, and sound. And then also, like we just said, casting. So that bodes very well for that movie. It means that a broad group of people have seen it. And I think that it is a little like when we talked about the casting in the mailbag episode. I said, I think they're going to go a little in the vein of like lifetime achievement. I mean, a lot of these casting directors are major players. Alison Jones for weapons, Bernard Telsley and Tiffany Canfield for Wicked For Good. They're huge Broadway casting directors, Francine Mayslers for sinners, Jennifer Vendetti for Marty Supreme, Nina Goldz for Hamnet. So it is a lot of the like heavy hitters in that field that got recognized. Yeah, that's why it's such an interesting mix because I think those are all. You've listed all these really big names in casting, but then it's also with these international people. I would assume that sort of they're not as well known to the casting community. And so to include them, I think is a pretty significant surprise in my opinion. And I think speaks to how strong those international films are this year. And then I wanted to jump to song, which I always think is a really interesting category. Things that I was keeping an eye out for did happen. Like both Wicked songs got in, which are new, of course, Golden from K-POP Demon Hunters. Sinners got two songs, which I thought was pretty notable. I mean, there's a lot of strong music in that film. And it is such an important part of the story that is not surprising. And then, of course, Diane Warren is back, another short list, maybe another nomination. That would be her 17th nomination without a win if it happened. So, you know, that is one thing the Academy is very consistent on is making sure Diane Warren is included. That's true. I guess, you know, who do you want to see on the stage the night of? Obviously, we want to see a performance from K-POP Demon Hunters. Of course, I think that Sinners would be cool to see up there and would deliver something fun. The Avatar song is performed by Miley Cyrus, and she's, you know, always something to watch. I'm not sure that song will make it into the final five. What do you think? I kind of think it might, but I really, I think people are going to see the movie. And, you know, Miley Cyrus has been out there promoting the song and, you know, has the story, how she sort of ties it to the fires. And there's an emotional tie narrative for her there. So, I think it could be possible. Do you think we're going to get both Wicked songs nominated or just one? I don't know. It's hard different. Wicked is a wild card this year. Yeah. I don't, no place like home is the slightly more liked song, right? No, Girl in the Bubble, I think is. See, there we go. There's the more like a song. Okay, so this is the problem. Yeah. Like, I'm not so embedded in the musical. So, honestly, I saw the second one, and I couldn't really tell which ones were the new songs or not. I'm not sure they'll get to just because they got so much love at the Academy last year and they opened the show. So, I think that does play a little bit into your head when you're voting. But it's also like, you know, it's a musical with songs written for a musical, which I would hope sort of gives you a little bit of an extra bump. But that's not always the case as we just saw with Anne Lee. Yeah, I feel like Girl in the Bubble is pretty locked in for a nomination. And maybe that gives a scenario on a performance. I don't know if she'd perform again. I mean, that's another question. Like, do you perform back-to-back at the Oscars or do you step out the second year? Hopefully. The Oscars hope so. Yeah. But there's a lot still to be determined here, but these short lists are giving us, I think, a lot of clues into what might happen up next. Yeah, overall, I would say just broad strokes, I think, you know, train dreams did pretty well, which is a good sign. Frankenstein up and down got all of this craft's love. We've been talking about that happening, but to see it come to fruition. I think Boads for me, well, that it will get in there for best picture. And I think it, it bodes well for Caramere as well. Otherwise, I feel like it was kind of what we expected. Yeah, there weren't as many surprises outside of Anne Lee as I thought there might be. So I think we're in a good place with our own predictions, which we'll get to in a little bit. Which is the most important. Is that we are right. Yeah, that's what I'm looking at it through that lens pretty much primarily. So today on the show, because it's our last episode of 2025, we're looking back at the whole year in entertainment. And this was a good year in a lot of respects, but we have some notes. So we're not making New Year's resolutions for ourselves. We're giving the industry some advice in the hopes that Hollywood will make some New Year's resolutions and fix some stuff that needs fixing. And we're also going to give our predictions for who we think the 10 best picture nominees will be. So to help us close out the year, we're joined by our wonderful VF Senior Editor Hilary. Hi, Hilary. Hi, everybody. I think I've been downgraded from your closest friend, but it's okay. But you're wonderful now. I mean, who's not? There's a lot of work you got to do this episode. We'll see how you're doing by the end. Oh my god, I'm being evaluated. Is this my year end review? All right, so let's get into it. If you're going to distill this year in entertainment to one word of phrase, what would it be? I mean, I guess chaotic, especially with the end of the year and the box office being so unpredictable. Yeah, or like conglomeration. Things are kind of getting tighter and tighter together. There's fewer and fewer players with every passing moment it feels like. Yeah, I think it's like impossible not to have the Netflix Warner potential acquisition at the top of your mind. When you think about this year, just because it just feels like such a seismic change. But that's only been the last couple months. Well, there was paramount earlier this year too. True, true, true. Yes, it's just one after the other. I mean, I feel like I would just summarize it as just like change. Like everything just felt so tumultuous a lot of the time. Tumultuous, that's a good word. There you go. Oh, yeah, that might be the best word. Because chaotic implies that there's no rhyme or reason. But tumultuous, I think, captures, things are happening. All right, Hillary, you don't need to edit me live on air. I don't die. Well, I think we're all hinting at the ways that are saying flat out of the ways that it was sometimes a hot mess. But we did have a lot of successes in other ways. And as people who love this business, we love Hollywood. We want to do everything we can to help keep it on the right path. So today, we're offering up our little gold men unsolicited advice for Hollywood. So I'll kick it off. Obviously, there were a lot of things that struggle, especially towards the end of the year here. A lot of star vehicles really struggled with the box office. So I am putting it out there for distributors that it is time to put your faith back into the platform release. Movies that need a strong word of mouth need the platform release. They need the time and theaters for people to discover it and share their thoughts on it with other people and get those people to see it. And if you put these little movies in 2,000, 3,000 theaters on their first weekend, the narrative is going to become that they failed. And that is really, really hard to overcome in this current system where there's enough movies to choose from and not enough people who want to go to them every weekend. So you need to start off as a success in your narrative. And I think the platform releases the way to do that. And like a similar kind of a jumping off point from that is if you have a movie that has a big built-in audience and people are going to want to see it, then put it in a movie theater. I still can't believe that Universal did not put the New Bridge of Jones movie in theaters that it debuted directly on peacock. And I just can't imagine all of the enormous amounts of money left on the table from them not just putting it in theaters when the other three movies were all in theaters and all made lots and lots of money. Well, also, they did release it in theaters internationally. Right, where it was just domestically, it didn't release it. Which was even stranger, yeah. And it performed, yeah, like you said, Hillary, it performed internationally. So it was like Americans were deprived the ability to go see this movie and. Yeah, deprived of the pleasure of seeing René Zalweger and Leo Woodall make out on a big, big screen. Yeah. And she would tell a Geophore, she got to make out with two very handsome men. And you got to watch it on your laptop at home, that's not fair. I feel like you should have been in the picture room for this Hillary because it makes you wonder like, are these execs or whoever's making these decisions underestimating? Who will go to the movie theaters? I don't know because I understand that while you're developing the film, it's hard to make these decisions. Of course, it's easy for us to say after success, same with K-pop demon hunters. We can be like, of course, they should have known, but. Well, K-pop demon hunters isn't a proven property. Right. Obviously, there are millions of people who love K-pop and who would have responded to that movie if it had gone into theaters. But Bridget Jones is proven IP, and so therefore, that decision makes even less sense. I think for Bridget Jones, they were trying to pump up the numbers for Peacock actually. I'm sure they got some papers out of it, yeah. Yeah, I think there was a little bit of a strategy there because this whole year for Universal has been about like, how do they grow Peacock? But I'm gonna piggyback a little bit off of it on the whole movie theater front, which is, I think that movie theaters need to figure out some sort of dynamic pricing. We all know about like the AMC club and people use that, and it's pretty successful. But I think that part of the problem is that those smaller movies cost the same amount as seeing like a big Marvel movie on a Saturday night. And I think there has to be some sort of negotiation. We're in the age of dynamic pricing online and on our phone. And God knows we've all experienced dynamic pricing from Uber. And so I think that there's something that can be done there because I think this sort of flat pricing that's going on is affecting independent films the hardest. So you want those prices to go down. You wouldn't want the pact. Yeah, we have a ceiling. Right. No, I'm saying down. Yeah. Okay. I'm saying that that they have to reflect the audience's willingness to onto what they'll pay. And I don't know anything about those budgets or how that works. I mean, I know that movie theaters make their money from the concessions, right? That's the whole thing we've been told. But I think that like if maybe in week and three a movie goes down to from 16 to $10, I have a feeling where people would go. I really do. I just think that where the cost of living is very, very high right now as everyone knows. And this is sort of they're not really responding to that in in the theaters. So that people feel that they can afford to go see Avatar in the same month as they see Marty Supreme. This was also help with my platform release. Exactly. They're all together. We are solving the theatrical problem. Finally, I don't know where where have you guys been? Don't you tell people these ideas in 2021? My first submission of unsolicited advice doesn't have anything to do with yours, John. This is an incredible segue. Great one. Thank you. No, it was the editor. I submit this for the approval of Midnight Society. A press tour is not a movie. You can hire the most charismatic actors. You can hire people who are great on the internet, who have big followings, who can give a sound bite, who love doing little videos like Vanity Fair's lie detector. You can have the most charismatic beloved celebrities in the world going on a press tour and it will be great. But if the movie itself is not as fun as the press tour, then you have a problem. Sometimes these things match. Sometimes with the first wicked movie, that press tour was incredibly entertaining and the movie itself really held up. But with, I'm just going to say it, fantastic for this summer, materialists this summer. I know that John, you are a fan of materialists in a way. And that movie made money. That movie did make money, but the movie is so much less entertaining than watching Dakota Johnson and Pedro Pascal have a conversation. This is like an old Jean Siskel line, which is like if the movie isn't as entertaining as watching the actors have dinner, then it sums down. And like the modern corollary of that is, would I rather watch Dakota Johnson and Pedro Pascal talk to a vertical camera or what I rather see them in a movie? And if the answer is the first, then I think you have a problem. I think it makes it even more noticeable because what I watched fantastic for, I was like, these are the most charming, charismatic, talented actors. So why is the movie so boring? Yes, it's almost like frustrating because I know this can be better because I've seen them sitting in a junket doing adorable interviews and this is so stale. And we know that executives or producers or directors or whoever are hiring certain actors because they know that they're going to be great during the promotion of this. And they already have an online following. And so they're banking on that press tour, helping the movie, but I think you're right, if people are expecting something that's charming and wonderful like those actors and then they don't get it, it's worse for everyone. I also think the nature of the press tour has changed and there's a lot of internet e stuff that's going on and I think it's successful in that we're seeing it and it's breaking through on our phones. However, we don't know that it's related to the movie. So when you go on a talk show, you do the talk show interview and then they show a clip of the movie, you know, Timothy doing Marty's supreme stuff is so about the name of the movie, the movie, the movie, the name of the movie. So it'll be interesting to see Marty's Supreme Christmas Day. Yeah, so it'll be interesting to see if this version of it works better because it's been so movie focused. Yeah, I mean, his vibe is matching the movie this time, which I think because this story is all about a man's greatness, you know, aspiring to be great. It really works with the whole stick he's doing this time around, but whereas, you know, Robert Pattinson and Jennifer Lawrence are promoting this movie about this very arty movie about postpartum depression. And so those are two actors that can give a very entertaining, very fun interview, but yeah, it's not going to match the movie. Right. We're going to take a quick break when we get back more of little gold men's unsolicited advice for Hollywood. Don't go away. This episode of Little Gold Men is sponsored by Universal Pictures presenting Wicked for Good. The American Film Institute and the National Board of Review, both called Wicked for Good, one of the best films of the year. Now nominated for seven Critics Choice Awards, including Best Picture and five Golden Globe Awards, including Best Actress Cynthia Arevo and Best Supporting Actress Ariana Grande. Welcome back to Little Gold Men. Let's keep the advice coming. John, do you want to go next? Okay. I'm going to do one really quick, where we're not even, we don't even need to discuss it. The multiverse is dead. I don't want any multiverses. I don't understand what's going on. Nobody else does either. I feel validated now after 10 years of multiverses. You want a single verse? There's a single verse when things were becoming like, who can forget in multiverse number four scarlet, which did it? And I'm like, I can forget. I have absolutely no idea what's going on in this movie. I want an absolute moratorium on them like cut like they're not allowed at all. Well, but what that mean we wouldn't have things like Black Panther. But I think that the problem that John is pointing to is that something like Black Panther is really good in the parts of Black Panther that aren't as good as our where it has to connect in with all the rest of the Marvel movies where there's like a weirdo extra scene that is necessary in order to serve as a lead up to the eventual movie where all of the superheroes are in the room together. All right. I see. I just want a Black Panther movie just focus on making that movie. Right. Which they have. I mean, that's why we're crying. Yes. And like the most recent Superman movie is a standalone. And I think that worked very well. It introduced a whole new universe, but it didn't feel like it had to tie in all of this other stuff like Robert Pattinson, Batman didn't like show up in the last minute or something. Yeah, like I think that that was refreshing. So you will not be seeing the upcoming Avengers movie of 2026 John because I assume that's going to be 50% explaining how we got to where we are, which I won't know what is happening either. You know, I have to see if for professional reasons, I will see it, but you won't like it. Typically, I'd be seeing it on a plane as you're supposed to. So you can Google the character sitting there being like what the hell's going on? Yeah, like I don't know what the hell is going on. Why is some of these people in 20s costumes? All right. That's a good one. I like it. Hillary, you got another one for us. Yeah. Sure. Should we move our attention over to TV a little bit? We've talked a lot about movies. I mean, this is maybe kind of a truism, but I still feel like it's worth pointing out. People like network TV formats and when they're done well, there's really nothing like them. I mean, we should have more streaming platforms leaning into that in a way where I have to emphasize the quality has to be high. It can't just be here's a cop show. It has to be something like the pit, which is a medical drama that's very well thought out, and it's a high quality version of this very old format that's, you know, got a little extra Zaz from, you know, being told in real time format. But just, yeah, just the procedural setting, the fact that a season is 15 episodes long instead of eight or six or something like that. Like network television has lasted as long as it has for a reason because these kind of formats are very comforting and when done well. I just think that they scratch an itch that you're not going to get anywhere else. So it was encouraging to me to see that the pit not only was something that a lot of people watched, but it got awards recognition. Like I would love to have more shows like that. And I'm going to add to that a little, which is these super short episode orders are too short. So like over compensating with its eight episodes. It should have been at least 12 episodes. It's getting a second season, but it would have built up even more of a fan base if it had what was the old proper amount of episodes. So like, you know, six or seven years ago. The shortest episode orders were 12 and then they brought them down to eight. And that's like what a limited series is. And so I agree with you, Hillary, part of part of also the pit success was that it was more episodes too. So you really were getting into it. And that's what you want for television is you want the audience to get more and more invested. And it's hard to do that when they're like only eight episodes in a series. And then you're waiting two years and a weekly release format is very important. And yeah, you're right. The second season of the pit is debuting next year. Like they are not waiting three years in between seasons. They are just going for it. And that is I think a great way to get people's attention because there are so few shows that are prestige that are actually doing that. Yeah, I agree back to the old ways of making television that worked for, I don't know, 60 years actually worked for a reason. Yeah, that's why I have always been a fan of Abbot Elementary because I feel like they are doing so many episodes and it still feels fresh and it's possible, you know, and I think the success of the pit and other shows is showing us that I know it's a lot of work for the people on it. Of course, but also creativity is born out of those limitations too of like in our standards, the people have to hold two of budgetary restrictions like I think that those are all good things and they actually feed creativity and yeah, getting getting back to that process. I don't know, I would I would love that. It's a lot of work Rebecca, but if you remember for the writers strike, this is what they were asking for. They wanted longer seasons because being a TV writer was too much of a gig job because the episode orders were so short. So yeah, it's a lot of work, but it's also means you're consistently working. Yeah, and don't have a job for 10 weeks and then have to figure out where your insurance is coming from. Exactly. Yeah, so I think people are into this this pit model and I hope that it gets adapted by the, the other streamers. I think it will. Yes, well, if Hollywood does anything, it's follow us success with that is true. 12 more of the same shot. Well, with an attempt to recreate it, that may or may not work exactly. Well, while we're sticking with TV, my next one is sort of related. I want more surprise award winners like Jeff Hiller who wanted the Emmys where he was basically the surprise nominee and then went on to be the winner. And I have rewatched that clip of the other nominees being so pumped when he wins. It's so beautiful. If I'm sad, that is my feel good clip currently because it's so beautiful. And I don't think we get that a lot. I would love to see something like that happen at the Oscars in March. Like I just, he's the perfect example because he is a working actor who delivered incredible performances in this underappreciated show. And he got that moment. And, and I think, especially with the Oscars, we're seeing a lot of the same film winning and a lot of categories over and over again. And there's nothing that makes an award show more boring than that. So I want, I want a couple of these every year. So I can rewatch the, you know, we have to somehow fix awards shows that tell me surprising. Yeah, voters, it's up to you. Vote for something surprising and deserving. I think there's plenty of options, especially this year. So we'll see. Okay, I think we each have one more piece of advice. John, you want to kick us off? Mine is, if your project is going to be expensive, we better see that money up on the screen. And I'm looking at you, electric state. I'm looking at you, fantastic for and even quite frankly, smashing machine. You want to see it on the screen and not in Dwayne Johnson, thank you. I don't even know if it's going to the stars pockets for smashing machine. I'm not even sure if that was what it is. I just, some of these movies, they're like reporting these really high budgets and I don't see where that money is going. I want to see special effects that are groundbreaking or sets that are incredible. Like, you know, I look back to the day of like the Matrix and like when you saw that first Matrix and it did that sequence with the cameras going around. Like your jaw dropped. Remember like there used to be like, you're talking about bullet time. Yeah, bullet time and even in the second one where they built the highway in Australia to do that whole car sequence, it was like we used to sometimes go to a summer movie and like see like what was truly movie magic. And I feel like now we are not seeing that and I demand for it to come back. And they better give Denis Villano a trillion dollars to make that bond because he does put that money on the screen. Do movies are expensive movies that look expensive. Yeah, exactly. And that's I think why we love them is because like you're looking at it and you're like, whoa. How they do that that looks like something. And then I mean, not we're really ragging on Fantastic Four. But but I was looking at Fantastic Four and I was like, they might as well have just done like toys. It looked really cheap. It looks flat and you could argue that that was an intentional production to sign the design decision. I don't know. But when they hold that baby, the CG just drove me insane. James Cameron would never. Okay, so here is my last piece of unsolicited advice sex sells. This is something that we already know. This is not news, but this year, especially in the second half of the year and especially on TV, we've had a run of. I mean, for lack of a better word erotic erotic series. There's heated rivalry on HBO Max. And there's hunting wives on Netflix. Just these are, I guess it's maybe not an accident that both are also very queer. But these are sexy shows where people are really getting into it and the audience is responding. I think that we are going to see a lot more graphically sexual TV shows in the new year. And also last year in movies, baby girl did really well and knows for ought to, which was horny as hell. Yes. I agree with you, Hillary, more sex and good sex. I feel like we've had so many years of people talking about blockbusters, especially like all the sex being drained out of them. And now it feels as though we're kind of on the other end of that pendulum swing. Yes. At least on TV, maybe you'll leak into movies more. Yeah, I think the house made this coming out pretty soon is. Oh, they're second there's quite sexy and in certain. I mean, that movie is a whole lot of everything, but I think they embrace it. It's a lifetime movie, basically, that's fourth theatrical, but I had a great time. But self-aware. Yeah, it's really a fun watch. The interesting thing about a couple of those shows you mentioned, Hillary, I feel like they really snuck up on everyone, like they were discovered. And maybe that was part of the strategy was sort of to release them and then let people discover it, but it really worked. No, the word of mouth was really great on both of them and then yeah, they snowballed into these big hits. Yeah. All right, I'm going to wrap it up with my final one here, which is a little cheesy, but whatever I'm doing it. And that is to celebrate our wins because I feel like, wait, we've been hating for the past half hour. And that's why I'm here to bring this back to the positive light here. And I think in general, that's the habit of reporters, of media, of executives, is just to coin out all the things that aren't working. Because there is a lot of fear, of course, in the industry right now, but there have been some huge wins. I mean, I know when sinners came out, everyone was very happy and did well, but also the narrative was like, look at this crazy deal Ryan Kugler had. Oh no, our other filmmakers are going to want this deal. And I'm like, guys, just be happy that this movie worked and made money. There's a lot of nitpicking about like exact budgetary reasons that like maybe it wasn't as much of a hit. Is everybody wants you to believe it did feel like a weird bad faith read. Yeah, a lot of pessimism, you know, one bad off to another, the whole conversation obviously it's a very expensive movie. But it, I would say, has made people so excited about movie going again in a way that can't be counted in dollars. And that's a win for everyone who works in this business. Because I still run into people who are excited to talk about that movie and that doesn't happen every week in Hollywood. So, yeah, I think we all need to just be happy when there's things that are good. Love the good news as much as the bad, you know. And accept it for being good news. Right. You don't have to say a butt, yeah. Yeah, not everything needs a butt. Yeah, however. Except for he to break me. All right, we're going to take a quick break and when we get back we'll share which movies we think are going to get the best picture nominations. Stick with us. This episode of Little Goldman is sponsored by Universal Pictures presenting Wicked for Good, the epic, electrifying and emotional conclusion to last year's Oscar winning Wicked. Deadline calls the film a masterpiece and the movie we need right now directed by John M2. Wicked for Good is now nominated for seven critics choice awards including Best Picture and five Golden Global Wars including Best Actress, Musical or Comedy, Cynthia Rivo and Best Supporting Actress, Ariana Grande. For your consideration and all categories including Best Picture, now playing in theaters. Welcome back to Little Goldman. The time has come for us to share our best picture predictions. I shared mine with listeners back in August objectively far too early to be doing something like that. I think I'd only seen a couple of the films and I looked back at the list and we're just not going to talk about it anymore because I have some crazy stuff on there. But now we have a lot more information and I'm feeling pretty good about like eight out of ten of my picks. How are you guys feeling? Yeah, I'm at like nine out of ten. It's like there's one slot that I think could go one of two ways. I feel like it could go one of four ways, but we'll discuss. John, you feeling good? I don't. No. I think I have some wild cards in there. We'll get into it. I'm banking on a little bit of popularity of certain films as pushing them over the edge, but I could be wrong. John's going to guess that the Gilded Age somehow gets dominated for this picture. As it should. Well, none of us have seen each other's picks on this. So we're reacting in real time to these, which I think is really fun. So I think what we'll have everyone do is go through, just read off your choices, do a little explanation of who you want, and then we can debate once we've all revealed our picks. Hillary, you want to kick us off? I would love to. All right, so here's my list, Frankenstein, hamnet. It was Justin accident, Marty Supreme, one battle after another, the secret agent, sentimental value, sinners, train dreams, and wicked for good. And that is the one that I am not totally positive about. But I just feel like the first one was such a big Oscar movie that I snuck it in. Okay. We feel the same on a certain thing you're just talking about, but we'll get there. Yeah, yeah. You're about to see a theme. Okay. Are we ready? One battle after another, hamnet, sinners, Marty Supreme. It was just an accident, sentimental value, Frankenstein, wicked for good. Jay Kelly. Oh, twist. Train dreams. Okay, well, here I'll go now. Frankenstein, hamnet, it was just an accident. Jay Kelly, Marty Supreme, one battle after another, sentimental value, sinners, train dreams, wicked for good. Wait, Rebecca, do we have the exact same one? You guys are completely insane. Yes. The only difference between your lists and mine is that I did not include Jay Kelly, but did include the secret agent. Okay. That was my only one. I am shocked that you guys didn't actually. No, Hillary, secret agent was the only bubble one for me that I was going to swap with Jay Kelly. But for me, I always rely on the power of the Netflix machine and the amount of people that see all the Netflix films regardless just because of the platform. So that was my reasoning, but you definitely could be right. Yeah, I mean, I think that the Netflix machine will power Frankenstein, which feels like a movie a lot of people like, but nobody loves. But I just don't know about Jay Kelly. I felt like it was a really strong contender before anybody had seen any of the movies. But now that it's time has come and it's just not really a performing. I really liked it, and I would put it on the list. I think that if I were in charge of making the nominees, I don't know if it has the juice. I did the exact same thing. I didn't want to overindex on international feature. Like we know that international features are going to be represented a lot. And it was just an accident as the front runner. It is. Sent them out of value is doing very well for itself as well. And I felt a little nuts putting another one on there, even though I think it could totally happen. I think the globes going so heavy on international kind of warped my sensibility. That's a totally different voting body granted. It isn't a very international one. And this secretation is definitely gaining steam, but I feel like it's still a very long movie. It's an international feature. I just don't know if it's going to have enough widespread, like be seen by enough of the, you know, complete voter body to make it in here for best picture. Okay, but John is banking on the power of the Netflix machine. I am banking on the power of Brazil. Brazil. I mean, yeah. Which is more powerful. We'll never know. That's true. No, Hillary. It's a joke, but it's true. Yeah. They are very enthusiastic about this film. And then for Wicked, in some ways, for me, Wicked is maybe more of a bubble than Jay Kelly. But again, I agreed with you, Hillary. I just think that it's really popular, people have seen it. I think it's going to show up on people's eighth, ninth or tenth on the ballot. So I think it'll get in there. Although it is clear now that there is some Wicked fatigue combined with this film is in as exciting perhaps as the first one was to voters. Yeah. My question was whether it will get in or whether Bagonia gets in, which none of us have on our list. But I don't know if you can totally count it out just because your ghost plus Emma Stone are such like a winning Oscar combination. Even though nobody feels that passionate about this particular movie. If Emma was doing a little bit more, I would say yes, because she's her head. No, I mean, I meant campaigning wise. She basically did pre-release press for this film. And she did a fair amount of it, but she didn't do quite the whole, you know, road show for the post-release. And that to me is going to result in the film not getting the love that it needs to last all the way through January. I almost like an hour ago, guys, pulled Wicked and put Bagonia in because I had sort of talked myself into what Hillary's saying. That's a filmmaker and a star that people love. There has been a lot. I mean, obviously critically it did very well. But also, I do feel like people like to talk about that movie and are seeing it or have seen it. So I really was on the fence too. And I don't know. I wouldn't be surprised if it showed up, honestly. Yeah, it does seem very much like the last two spots are changeable. But otherwise, I think the list seemed pretty locked. Like, 10 movies is a lot of movies. But it does seem like at least eight of these are pretty sure things. Yeah. What I think is interesting is that train dreams is on all of ours. And I definitely, I don't think we would say that even three weeks ago. The momentum has started to build. So the one studio I feel like we may be underestimating here is Sony Pictures Classics Blue Moon. I know Ethan Hawke is very much in the actor race at this point. But that distributor has a way of getting their movie seen in a way that's very quiet. And I think very graceful. But sometimes they do surprise. I had Blue Moon on sort of like an alt-slist for a while, thinking there could be a possibility. People really love that movie. I mean, I really love that movie. I would be thrilled if it made it in. It seems maybe still too small, but I mean, maybe Sony Pictures Classics plus the star power of Ethan Hawke. And, you know, him and Richard Linclater are very like winning duo too. I think that there's some possibility there. I agree. But what about Avatar? We don't think Avatar is going to, I mean, the Academy loves Avatar, don't they? Yeah, it's a good point because way of water got a best picture nomination. And that wasn't that long ago. But it does feel like for people who have seen this movie, there is not as much love for it. There's some criticism that it's too similar to the previous one. But you have to remember that everyone who works on Below the Line votes for best picture. And anyone who works at any sort of craft would see this movie and just be blown away. Like the other ones. I mean, it's a marvel. Like no one makes a movie like that except James Cameron. And I wonder if that gives it a boost, but I do think that's sort of the argument with Frankenstein this year. It's like, it's such a craft movie that helps it get a boost there. So I don't know if it's enough for Avatar to get best picture. But it's crazy that none of us put it on. Well, I haven't seen it. There's a little bit of like bias toward movies that I have actually watched on my list. But yeah, I do think that it will get a lot of nominations for a lot of Below the Line stuff and maybe not necessarily get over the finish line just because it feels like a third movie in a series that is not doing something different. What's interesting, and it's not on any of our lists is Testament of Anne Lee, which would be on my list if I was voting. And it was one of my favorite movies of the year. But I think when it underperformed at the indie spirits and then also not getting any love on the short list, that's pretty alarming. What do you guys think? Yeah, I mean, as I said when we did that mail back episode and that sweet summer child of a listener. Anne Lee is going to take it and Lee is going to tie all about Eve. I was like, I don't know. It just feels, it just feels small. It's funny because the movie is big. Yeah. Like it's so ambitious and it's so wild, but it's weird. People are not talking about it. I mean, I feel like I gauge a lot of this by being in rooms and seeing what people want to gush about. And it's surprisingly not other than Amanda, which people do want to talk about because she is incredible. Is it just that it was a late release? I mean, it was at the festivals like other movies. It's not like it came out of nowhere. Yeah, and I thought I would sort of compare it to the brutalists journey, obviously same filmmakers, but in general, same ambition and a starry lead role and all that, but I don't know. It just hasn't landed in the picture conversation. Is it because the brutalist was about to say it's because the brutalist was a big ambitious movie about a man made by a man. And this is not this is about a woman, a woman who, a woman who doesn't have any kids pointedly. No, I think that searchlight had a little bit of a strategy where they wanted to have this be seen late in the process, but I'm not, I think there's a lot of films this year. It's possible that over this Christmas break, everyone will see it and then we'll see more widespread love for it, but so far it's been pretty muted. I wonder if, because that late strategy really worked for a complete unknown for searchlight last year, I wonder if they thought maybe they could sort of replicate that, even though I only was at festivals earlier in the year. But yeah, I mean, there is such thing as a sort of Christmas success surprise when it comes to award season, because you're so fatigued on a lot of these other movies that have been around, but I think you're right with this year. It's just, it's, it's wide open in a lot of ways. So what you're saying Rebecca is song, song, blue coming out. Well, it's the American hustle lore. Remember when American hustle got all those nominations that it came out very late, all the Academy, you know, prognosticators and consultants were very into after that, they were like, no, no, no, it's important to be last. The most important thing is to be last and then you see this last year with Enora, which was like one of the earlier releases, it's just like, or Oppenheimer, which was over the summer. It's just, there's trends and people like follow the tea leaves, however they feel that it works for them. Yeah, earlier releases have been doing well lately. I mean, everything everywhere all at once was out for like a calendar year before I want to ask her. Well, everyone has a couple of weeks to just sit in front of their screens or head to the theater and see all these movies and catch up and then we'll see whether these predictions pan out. Hillary, thank you so much for joining us today. Thank you as always for having me. Your favorite guest. Say, say, Chris Murphy is going to get super mad. Our favorite friend. Yes. Thanks for tuning into Little Gold Men. We'll be taking a break for the holidays, but we'll see you in the new year when we'll be sharing our live conversation with Joel Edgerton of Train Dreams, our predictions for the Golden Globes and so much more. This episode of Little Gold Men was produced by Michelle O'Brien with Mixing by Boomi Hadaka. We had engineering help today from Vince Fairchild. Our executive producer is Steven Valentino. Thanks so much for listening and happy holidays. The American Film Institute and the National Board of Review both call Wicked for Good one of the best films of the year. Now nominated for seven Critics Choice Awards including Best Picture and five Golden Globes Awards including Best Actress Cynthia Rivo and Best Supporting Actress Ariana Grande. [BLANK_AUDIO]