Speaker 1Hello everyone. Welcome back or welcome to Recovering Out Loud, the podcast where we get real about addiction, recovery, and the messy, beautiful process of rebuilding your life. Today, I sat down with someone whose story is as bold as it is inspiring. In today's episode, we delve into the transformative journey of Eric B., a man who transitioned from the vibrant nightlife of Toronto to becoming a beacon of hope in addiction recovery. Once a successful club promoter entangled in the throes of substance abuse, Eric faced a pivotal moment that led him to seek help and embrace society. Today, Eric dedicates himself to helping others find their way out of addiction. He pursued formal education in addiction counseling, established a rehabilitation center in Etobicoke, and opened up three sober houses in Toronto. Join us as Eric shares his insights on the challenges of recovery, the importance of community, and the power of turning one's life around. Today, we talk about how addiction hides in the psychology of denial and self-deception, why rock bottom is different for everyone, rebuilding identity without substances, the spirituality of recovery and ego surrender, and how real fun and freedom are found in sobriety. I had a lot of fun with Eric today, and I hope you enjoy this episode too. Eric, man, I appreciate you, buddy. Thanks so much for coming here. I know you're a busy guy. You got a lot going on. And I texted you, and within seconds, you said yes. So I appreciate that. That's something that I learned in recovery is when someone reaches out, you do your best to make it work, right? So I appreciate you. Thanks for coming on. Thanks for having me. We met about 10 years ago at Jack's, and I was saying this to you, outside in the parking lot. You had, and I see this in a lot of people that have been working a good recovery program, you had this sort of levity and lightness and zen in you. And you were a young guy. You still are a young guy. But I remember I was attracted to that. And I was like, I don't know what it is that this guy has, but I want it, right? And so I got your number. You gave me your number. And having looked back, you're a great friend. I appreciate you. I'm happy that we're reconnecting again all these years later. And yeah, you've done a lot in the in that time for a lot of guys and girls, but a lot of people in recovery. So why don't you get started? Tell us a little bit about your story and how you ended up here in recovery.
Speaker 2Absolutely. So yeah, what can I say? I strongly believe that I was around recovery for a very long time before I committed on, you know, this program and, you know, entering a program that you know, works for me. But so I really lived a life of like drugs, you know, sex, drugs and rock and roll for a very long time. I started DJing at a very young age, probably around 18 years old. And the, you know, my boss at the time also, you know, was using people around me were dabbling and stuff. I wasn't really like, I didn't know really anything about like heavy drugs at the time. And more or less, it was like, you know, just a lot of weed and, you know, kind of like gateway drugs at the time. And I started DJing, started making really good money, probably more money than a lot of my friends at the time, right? You know, they were all really focusing on going to school and university. And I was just like, working on making money. And I was very successful DJing and emceeing all these, you know, events, working for a corporation at the time. And what can I say, I, I did very well for myself, you know, like, but but I didn't have anything to show for myself. Because everything that I was bringing in, I was spending it, you know, whether it was clothes, you know, girls going out partying and things like that. So I, I started hanging out with a lot of people that were older than me at the time. And even before that, I was just like, you know, I wanted to do this. And before that, my last year of high school, I went to a school called Vaughn, I did, I did a co-op my last year. And I wanted to do it at a I wanted to do it at a record shop. So I applied for this position at a place called tracks records on Yonge Street. And, and I got in. And because I, you know, I like DJing and things like that. So I started working at this place called Tracks, which was one of the most popular record stores in all of Toronto, this was way before, you know, internet and you know, music online and things like that. So all the music that was coming in from, you know, all over the world, that would get distributed here would end up at these record shops, one of them, which being tracks, we were able to, you know, get all the new music, and then all the these big DJs, you know, local DJs from Toronto that were playing in all the nightclubs all over the city, were coming in and, you know, laying down the music, and picking out what tracks they wanted to play for the, you know, the weekend coming up, and, you know, the residencies and stuff like that. So I really got to know a lot of these big DJs and a lot of connections. Yeah, tons of them, right. So. So through that, I started getting into the underground world of, you know, house, house music, you know, raves, you know, after parties and things like that. And I started hanging out with all these big DJs, and we started traveling, I started traveling with them, I became friends with them. And slowly, slowly, I started hanging out with a lot of older people. This one guy who owned a club at the time, really saw this, I guess my personality and being I could be a really good promoter. You know, he loved the, you know, I was really like out there and, and stuff like that. And I was very comfortable on, you know, reaching out to people and inviting people. loud and stuff like that. So he's like, I think you'd be an amazing promoter. And I want you on my team. I'm opening up this club on, you know, downtown, and there's a grand opening, and you're going to be my main promoter. So I, I took on this position, and I started promoting this nightclub, you know, the first nightclub that I started promoting at was called it, which was, it was, he had an after hours called exit for years. And then he opened up like more commercial club called it at the time. So I started hanging out there and promoting and meeting all these lavish people. And, you know, being a something I like to call it, you know, and, and I kind of like really felt like, in a way, like, you know, I had arrived, right, like the book tells me so. So yeah, through that process, I really started hanging out with a lot of people that were older than me. I got introduced to drugs. I mean, you know, I was going to a club called industry, I was a regular there on a weekly basis. So all the biggest DJs from all over the world were actually playing there. And this was a club that was going on for like, two, three days, you know, and, and I started dabbling in pills. I was doing ecstasy.
Speaker 1I was gonna say back then ecstasy was like a big thing.
Speaker 2It was huge. Yeah, you just pop a pill and you could dance for about like three days, you know. So like, that was the first time I did it. And then, you know, slowly, slowly, as you start getting more in involved in it, you know, your tolerance level, you know, rises. And by, you know, the end of the weekend, I was probably doing about like 1015 pills throughout the weekend, just to get the same feeling, right. So yeah, and then and then through that, like I said, I keep going back to that I was hanging out with these older people, they were a lot older than me, probably like 10 years older than me, I really wanted to fit in, I wanted to be cool. You know, they started dabbling in blow. Again, I was probably like, 20-22. At the time, I really didn't know what was going on. But I wanted to be like them, you know, and I wanted to feel like them. So I was always asking them, Oh, what's that, you know, and my buddy was always like, No, you're too young for this. And then one thing led to the next. And you know, I'm doing a little bumps here and there. And then I got hooked on blow. And that was like, probably about like a 15 year ordeal, you know, where, for many, many years, I mean, I didn't think I had a problem. I, you know, one of my sponsors always used to say, you know, you're like a shiner, because you shine on the outside, everything looks good. You know, you got the house, you got the car, you got the girl, you got the money, but you know, on the inside, I was dying. And, you know, I call it a slow burn. And, you know, it slowly, slowly strips you away from all these things that you love, and the things that you you know, you're supposed to be doing in your life, you know, but you don't realize that it's a progressive illness, I call it right. So over time, you start, you know, losing things and, you know, your relationships start getting really, you know, you know, your problems and relationships and business and things like that. And that's what kind of happened to me throughout the years. But I had a business partner at the time where she knew I was just like, I was in the grips of the disease. And I was in this spiral where I didn't have a solution. And I didn't know I could, you know, get out of it really but again i didn't think i had such a problem because when you surround yourself around those people lower companions yeah yeah when you surround yourself around you know those types of people and and and those crowds and those parties like i mean that's the only thing you know you know you that's the normal for you right so that was very normal for a long time but uh she basically gave me a ultimatum basically saying that if you don't go and get treatment um then we're going to fold this business and we're going to go our separate ways and that kind of scared me a little bit at the time i did a walk through of a treatment center called bellwood and uh and i thought to myself there's no way i can be in a place like this like i could do this on my own yeah you know and she um she gave me this whole letter and everything and um basically i uh i kind of like blew everybody off in a way i kind of made it seem like i was doing really well for a long time i kind of made it seem like i had my together i slowed down i could really like manipulate and hide my using um by that time i had my own place so i wasn't around a lot of people um so uh yeah i just kept on keeping on doing what i what i was doing right um and then i got introduced to uh another buddy of mine where we started a promotion company and uh we were promoting nightclubs uh about five six nights a week and i mean you're out drinking five six nights a week you're you know everyone around you is using very difficult to say no it wasn't part of my vocabulary um so again i was just like in the grips of this this you know the disease of uh addiction i think um so yeah i was just like in the grips of this this you know the disease of uh addiction i think um so again i was just like in the grips of this this you know the disease of uh addiction i think um so again i was just like in the grips of this this you know the disease of uh addiction i think um so again i was just like in the grips of this this you know the disease of uh addiction i think um so again i was just like in the grips of this this you know the disease of of addiction, I think for a long time, but I really couldn't see the light. I really didn't think I, you know, I was always justifying my using. I'm not that bad. You know, all my friends are telling me I have a problem, but you're all hypocrites because I'm using with you all. You know, the thing was like, I would I would use and then you know, I'd be using with them. And then also I would use on my own. Yeah. You know, and I had a friend of mine who told me listen, like, when you're by yourself, and you're using, like the party's over. You know, you're not you're not at a party anymore. And then when it came into recovery, I really started realizing there was a difference between partying and using, you know, partying is like, I'm going out, I'm going to dabble a bit, I'm gonna have some drinks, party, whatever. And I can shut it down, you know, and using was, you can't shut it down anymore. It's like, you keep going, and going and you keep getting more and finding ways and means to get more. And, and that's what it was for me for a long time. I, I was taught hanging out with these guys that were older than me, like what you have, you finish, and you get more. There's no saving it for next weekend. You know, there's none of that. So, you know, I like to say I learned the hard way I really, I really realized in life that you are who you hang out with. You know, you are who you hang out with. And, and, you know, the people I hung out with were just a lot of them were users and partiers. And I didn't really have a direction on where they were going in their life. We were just having fun, you know, and I guess I enjoyed it for a long time, until I didn't enjoy it anymore. You know, and there was a lot of nights and early mornings where I didn't like the way I was looking. I didn't like the way I was feeling. You know, I was getting very, very depressed. I didn't want to go to work anymore. I needed drugs, I needed things to use. Just to get me there and to make me feel comfortable in the environment. I became an introvert. You know, I didn't want to be around people as much. I didn't want to talk as much. Right. So, yeah, I mean, it was, it was, it was getting to be very, very dark for me, you know, and I'm just trying to think about the life.
Speaker 1Was there, was there a moment, I can relate to a lot. What you just said, I, we have very similar using, you know, pasts. Was there a moment where you kind of, they, you know, a lot of people say rock bottom, you got to hit rock bottom. Maybe it was more than one, but was there a moment where you were like, man, this is it? Like, I'm done. I'm done.
Speaker 2Yeah. I'm happy you're asking me that question because going back into my story later on where I was kind of like manipulating everybody, pretending I had this all together with my, you know, my first business partner, let's say the second business. partner that I had this promotion company with basically introduced and, and, you know, kind of brought to my attention another letter that said the exact same thing that the first business partner, you know, introduced me to like years before and just basically gave me an ultimatum as well saying, look at like, you've been using for so long already, you know, like, when are you going to change, you know, what are your plans for your life? Like, you, you know, you can't get out of it on your own. You need help basically. And if you don't go and get the help that you need, I'm going to, you know, like, we're going to go our separate ways. Yeah. So, um, so something for me there, like at that moment, I don't know if it was the grace of God that came in or, you know, some sort of awakening or, um, I'll never forget that morning. Cause I read this email. It was an email that he sent to me at like 7am coming off of whatever I was coming off of. And I was just like, wow. Like this guy's right. When am I going to change? What am I going to be using when I'm 50 years old? Like maybe I do need help. You know, maybe, maybe I do need to like surrender to this thing or, or, or go to treatment or whatever that may look like, you know? And I didn't know what that looked like at the time. You know, I was always like worried all, you know, there's this thing, you know, about people in, in rehab or, you know, the stigma around it or people like, you know, there are those people under the bridge or whatever that may look like. But, um, so I said, I will, uh, I'll look into, you know, going and getting help. That's, that's where, that's the moment I kind of hit a real rock bottom. And I said, okay, I'm willing to do whatever I need to do. You know, I remember it very, very well. I was on my porch in the front of my house and I was just like crying out for help. Like I'm done, you know, my girlfriend at the time, she's like, we'll do whatever we need to do. We'll get you the help we need. Reached out to my sister and, uh, and, uh, and, but see years before when I worked for this other DJ company, when I was 20 years old, um, the owner of the company actually gave me a business card and he told me that I should call this, this addiction counselor who was Jay Pasternak, who you had on the show. So I reached out to Jay like years before, you know, coming off a binge of like three days, you know, it might've been like a Tuesday and I'm like, okay, maybe this isn't normal. Like normal people don't, you know, they use Friday night, they go to sleep and, you know, yeah. So this was like Tuesday and I was just like coming down and I'm like, I popped out this card out of my pocket and it was, you know, Jay's number. And I'm like, you know, maybe, maybe I do have a problem, you know, maybe I, maybe I should reach out to this guy. And like, I called him up and I, you know, I told him what I was doing and I'm dabbling in this and that, or whatever it is I was doing at the time. But when I got off the phone, I was like, I'm, I'm so young. I have my whole life ahead of me. There's no way like have that big of a problem, you know, but that was the first time that I reached out, you know, which was literally probably around like 2023, maybe around there, 22, something like that. And I remember, I remember vaguely, like I met up with Jay, we went to a meeting, took me to a meeting, a recovery meeting, and I had no clue what people were doing there. I was just, I was there. People were trying to talk to me. People were trying to like, you know, kind of bring me in. And I remember leaving the meeting and I just, I just went right back down to the nightclubs for another like seven, eight years, you know, so I wasn't ready at the time. I, maybe I wasn't beat up enough, you know, so, but what happened was I ended up, I ended up buying a house in North York and we were, you know, we were, we were partying a lot in this house. Like I rented out the basement to another buddy of mine who was a DJ at another promoter living in the house with me. We were working and stuff, but we were having lots of parties, like a drop house, essentially pretty much. And, and my friend Jay had a recovery house right behind my house. Wow. Right. So he, I would always see guys, I would always see guys in recovery, you know, and I would like talk to them about recovery and I couldn't relate, you know, it was always justifying it. But yeah, one day I went out in my backyard and I'm like, like, I heard this voice. Are you my new neighbor? And I'm like, who's that voice? You know, it sounds so familiar. And then the back window opened up and it was my addiction counselor.
Speaker 1It was funny how those people just kind of come into your life.
Speaker 2Yeah. So I looked up and I'm just like, wow. I'm like, this is, uh, this is like meant to be that I bought a house here and something was looking over me at that time, you know? And I, yeah, and I felt it. So from that moment on, I was like, wow, this is what I want. Yeah. So from that moment on, I started like talking to guys in recovery. Um, you know, I, I, like I said to you, I was like, wow, this is what I want. before in the beginning like i feel like i've always been kind of around it because of that even though i wasn't committed into the program yet and then uh and then what happened was um i uh i kind of um when i fell to my knees that that last um email my friend sent me then i was like okay i'll do whatever i need to do if i need to go away i'll go away lock me up um you know and and i was on a wait list um to go to um homewood yeah and before that i was supposed to go to like antigua like eric clapton's place my parents were going to fork out money i was looking for a vacation i'm going to do this right yeah you know i was like okay i'm going to go away i need the sun the beach but i never ended up going i told my mother i'm like listen i can do this on my own again i suffered for another like seven years but this time i was like ready and willing to do whatever i needed to do you know and if i needed to go away i'm going away so you know we set up a visitation to to do a walk through this treatment center and i'll never forget i remember driving on the highway i was in the back of back of my parents car and i felt like i was like a 12 year old kid you know like there was like i was like where the hell did my life take a detour you know like i ended up in a hallway doing a visitation of this treatment center walking through the hallways you know checking out the rooms and i was just like where did my life take did my life take the wrong turn because everything looked beautiful on the outside like i said to you before it was sex drugs rock and roll life was you know and then i found myself just just at this crossroad i like to call it you know and uh and then when i was there i'll never forget i heard this voice and this voice said like stop listening to yourself and listen to other people that found a solution you know very very clearly and then uh and then i remember leaving there there was a wait list a wait time to get in it was probably about like a couple months so i reached out to jay and he's like listen while you're waiting to get into that place why don't you just go down the street there's meetings at this place called jax and um just start going to meetings you know so that's what i did saturday afternoon i went down a meeting i was like out of my mind still and uh i sat in this meeting and i met these guys that were in recovery and i started hanging out with them and i started going to meetings on a regular basis and i never stopped going to meetings and something shifted i started really changing who i was hanging out with um you know they say if there's one thing you need to change it's everything and that's what i did i stopped hanging out actually with my best friends people that i was using with i said if you love me if you you know if you want the best of me you know if you want the best for me leave me alone for now let me focus on this and and i really started taking this program by the horns and i got um you know i got a sponsor and i started working this program it's funny how you said like you know there was this thing about you where it was just like this i've always been a person where um i've been like not too worried about life or things so my first sponsor always used to say to me eric is like the no worries eric you know like and then when i was taken through the book with this this woman who took me through this you know the program and stuff where she really started working with me on the don't care feelings you know like i have nothing to worry about i have nothing to care about like you know this higher power this this god this faith is going to take care of everything for me and that's kind of what i started working through um so yeah that's kind of what happened i started going to meetings steady um started working this program i i turned my my house that i was living in into a sober living house wow so i started moving guys into the house that had um you know clean time months years actually and um i'd drive around every single night to meetings with my car filled up and i'd go wherever i had to go to pick up guys and go to meetings with them and i kind of felt like i just brought this whole new energy into recovery we started doing retreats with like 30 40 50 kids guys we'd go out to like different places and and you know uh rent cottages or lake houses and stuff like that and just start opening up to each other and sharing and having this camaraderie and this fellowship with each other and that's kind of really where my recovery kind of took off yeah you know and and and i really just i started doing the work i really start started getting down to like the nitty-gritty of you know what we do around here and it's you know freeing myself from the bondage of self and um ego yeah all that stuff that's kind of holding me back and and uh just growing spiritually yeah we always say it's not a religious program it's a spiritual program so um i just try to like be a good person today and um you know love thy neighbor as thyself like all these beautiful things that we learn about you know they work yeah since we were little we learned about them yeah there's something that
Speaker 1happens um i don't you know i i do understand it but i don't sometimes i try to overthink it and it's it's very simple when i'm with new addicts and new alcoholics i'm not thinking about me right i'm thinking i'm not thinking about my problems and poor me and you know um i'm just for that hour two hours three hours whatever it is i i'm able to get outside of my head and ask someone else how they're doing so you know we were talking about it outside today too before we came in here um so now you have three sober houses right that that business grew um you know you you own you opened up a little bit of a business but you know you've got a lot of stuff going on in your life and you've been doing it for a long time so um what like if i were to ask you you know what's the common theme i love this question of like you see a lot of guys come in and girls and you see a lot of guys and girls go back out and relapse too what's kind of the common theme that you see with people that are successful in recovery and putting together time and then you know get to the relapse part too but
Speaker 2what's the comment yeah it's a good question i think like not rushing it like this is i was just thinking about this whole process you know we come into recovery we want to get things really fast i want to get things back quickly you know i have all these you know just because i'm clean 30 days or 60 days i think i'm going to get the world back in my hands and it's not it's not like that like it takes time and and you know they say you know it works if you work it so you have to work this program and it takes time and patience um you know you're changing people don't like to addicts don't even come to that realization you know so it's it's it's a process you know um recovery is a lifestyle yeah this isn't this isn't a you know i'm just gonna go to a meeting once a week and i'm just gonna you know try to stay clean and sober and things like those people will not be successful in recovery this is a lifestyle right like so you like to work out you know you go to the gym on a day you know you you do different exercises on different days you work different muscles plan it out right there are certain things that you have to do so you get the results that you need and you're not going to get big and buff the first day it takes time you're going to see results in eight months from now or in a year from now it depends right so i believe like recovery is really the same thing um it's just it's just for your mind you know it's your thinking that needs to be you know checked right it needs to be changed um you know i kind of say that people need to be brainwashed in recovery and that's the truth right our goal is to like kind of feed people um you know positive um you know reinforcements on a regular basis whether it's just about being grateful or having acceptance in life or getting out of self and doing things for others um you know like all these things these beautiful things love and tolerance of others is our code like all these things that we talk about you know in in meetings or in in the meetings um are things that they're great to speak about at a meeting but it's how am i putting them
Speaker 1in my everyday practice in life the 99 of my life am i practicing it i can be good at the one percent absolutely you know smile and shake hands and kiss babies and meetings it's easy put out chairs i'm great i'm doing great for sure but then as soon as you leave that room the world hits you life happens for sure right now buddy yeah exactly what are you going to do now yeah and they talk
Speaker 2about the unmanageability and and how we can struggle with that because you know we want to live you know we want things a certain way and you know we're not living up to it maybe or you know we want things like like i said before really quickly and really fast and so we struggle with that right and and a lot of people i believe that just they just don't have the right tools or they're not going into their toolbox and using you know what they need to be using like you know you need to take action in this program right so um you know picking up the phone reaching out i'm struggling you know uh whatever i need to go to a meeting i need to pray meditate open up a book go for a walk you know be around like positive people you know people are that are like so today coming back to like i am who i i hang out with today i i'm around a lot of people that are recovered that are living a life that are you know they're happy they're joyous they're free you know they're they're not you know struggling with the obsession of using drugs or alcohol on a regular basis um you know continually working on themselves absolutely in some capacity absolutely this inside work that we have to do absolutely yeah this is an inside job that's what one of my guys said yesterday at a meeting and it's true it is it's an inside job like things aren't going to happen just because i'm sober just because i put the drink down or the drugs down doesn't mean like my whole world's going to change i got to do work on myself that's why we do like you know an inventory we go and clean the wreckage of the past you know we go out and make amends to a lot of people you know there's lots of programs out there that aren't a 12-step or recovery program that they are doing this stuff you know and again it's it's it's trying to be a different person today a different human being um more of a spiritual being i'd like to say and um you know try to live a different life today you know than when i was
Speaker 1out there using yeah you know cheating stealing lying right like this this like bank robber um i love it love that that's great do you um i'm sure you get a lot of uh and we have a lot of people that that reach out to me that watch this podcast that are family members of addicts and loved ones i'm sure you get a lot of loved ones that reach out and say just fix him fix her like help me i don't know what to do anymore he won't stop he can't stop what's kind of like what have you learned about the support system and family and an addict's life and you know how do i support my addict loved
Speaker 3people and i'm sure you can help them and i'm sure you can help them and i'm sure you can help them
Speaker 2listen there's lots of programs out there that are going to help support family members and loved ones for sure um you know they need their own program because the you know this this the addict and the disease of when he's using and stuff it really affects everybody around him you know or her and uh and a lot of people are going through a lot of things you know when when they're out there using right so um they need their own support network their own community they need people that they need to talk to um you know how to not enable the loved one and and give them money and things like that to go out and use um you know there's a codependency factor there um there's you know communication there's got to be some healthy boundaries set in place you know so these are things that you know again they're taught and they need a program to learn how to deal with the addict themselves when they're
Speaker 1out there using right yeah one of the great things about the rehabs that i've been to um and it's hopefully, God willing, no more, because I put my family through a lot. And I put myself through a lot, too, right? But every single one I went to had a family program, where the family came in and got educated about addiction, on how to not enable, how to support. What's your view on family programs? I mean, you mentioned a lot of it there. Art has a family program, I'm assuming?
Speaker 2Yeah, yeah. What do you guys focus on? We focus on those things, definitely. There's enabling, there's codependency, there's healthy boundaries, there's just educating them on the addiction, what to expect when the loved one comes home, having the support in the community that they need. But again, it's a lifestyle for them, too. When do they start trusting their kid again? Just because the kid's got 30 days or 60 days doesn't mean, OK, here, you know? He's healed. He's fixed. Yeah, he's cured, right? So it takes time. I mean, even-- I see it all the time, people that come up to like a year and then decide to go out, or two years and go out, and then I just see the family just break down again. It's so sad, you know? And I see parents crying all the time, like, help our loved one. I shared it yesterday with actually a family member, with a mother. I said, listen, I can bring a horse to water, but I can't make them drink it, right? It's really up to the individual who has to put the time and effort into their own recovery if they want to be successful. How willing are they, you know? I was willing to do anything I needed to do to get my drugs. So I've got to be willing to do whatever I need to do to be free from the obsession of using, or the thought of using. And the longer I am clean and sober, I feel like the harder I need to work in my recovery. Because I'm coming up to like 15 years in October, and you think, OK, maybe you can be normal again, or-- you can have a drink, or smoke a joint, or people are doing mushrooms now, and DMT, and oh, they're good for PTSD. And you just hear all this stuff that's happening. And that might be great, and that might work for other people and stuff like that. But I definitely don't want to take any chances on that. Like for me, it's about being completely abstinent from anything that's going to change the way I feel today. I don't want nothing in my system.
Speaker 1I'm so happy you brought that up, because I had a point in my sobriety today. Luckily, I'm not battling with that thought of like this-- I need to find God through psilocybin or ayahuasca. And I shared about this a lot here. But I was at a point where I signed up for an ayahuasca retreat. I was very close to going. I paid. I was excited. I thought it was the right answer for me. And I remember speaking to my therapist. She's in the program as well. She's sober and clean as well. And she just said, what makes you think you're going to do it once? That was what clicked for me. I was like, holy shit. And it scared me. I was like, I'm going to relapse if I do this, right? So I love that you said, I don't even need to or want to take a chance, because it's not worth the risk, man. The risk-reward factor-- and that's how I have to think today-- is any decision in my life, when it comes to anything, but especially substances-- steroids was one for me, too. I have to look at that again and say, the risk just outweighs the reward tenfold every time. It's not worth it, because I don't know what's going to happen, right? I started smoking meth my last relapse. I never thought I would do that. You know what I mean? I'll be using needles for sure if I go back up. I'm pretty sure, because it's just-- the way my mind works, it's just, I want more. I want more. One is too many, and 1,000 is never enough. We have the disease of more, for sure. And you said-- I love what you said, too, about I have to work harder today, because it's a progressive illness. If that's true, which I've found to be true, that means that I'm more ill, technically. This is my opinion. I'm more ill today than I was 10 years ago. So I have to work harder to keep that at bay. For sure.
Speaker 2Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah. I heard a speaker say years ago, it's like, there's three things that this thing wants to do to you, right? So it's irreversible. Once you have it, you can't go back. There's no going back to just managing or using once in a while, right? And then it's progressive, so it's going to get worse over time, and that it's fatal, right? So at the end of the day-- you know, it's going to find ways and means to kind of take me out, you know? Like you said, it's very patient, very, very patient. It's trying to wait for the right time, you know? Slowly, slowly, OK, you've got 15 years. You don't need to go to meetings anymore. You don't need to work with guys, you know? You own a treatment center. You know, you've got some sober houses. You're doing good. You're doing great. All these things, yeah, right? And then it just starts messing up with your head, and then, you know, it's just waiting for you. It's waiting for you. It's waiting for the right time, you know? And it could be on a perfect day. Sun is shining. You're in Miami. You're in Mexico. No one's going to know. And then, you know, yeah. And it's just the first one that gets you, right? So it's like, for me, I really try to stay vigilant. You know, I kind of wear this program on my sleeve. I tell everybody I'm in recovery. I get approached all the time with drinks. You know, I work as well as a DJ, so I play a lot of night clubs still in the city. I have, you know, a couple of residencies and stuff like that that I DJ at. And for me, what I love the most is that, A, I'm behind a DJ booth, and I can set the vibe for the night. I can play whatever I want, and I can see people have a good time. And I don't judge. I don't care, like, if people are using or doing whatever it is they want to do, and if that works for them, great. You know? I just knew when I was doing that, I didn't know that there was people that were getting clean and sober and that there was a solution. So if I can be that guy in that industry or, you know, in wherever, where they can reach out to me and say, look at, like, you know what, I think I have a problem, or I'm looking for a solution in living a better life, in a healthier life, then they can reach out to me, you know? And I can show them a way. It's beautiful. Not everyone necessarily needs to go to treatment. So my story goes is that-- I never ended up going to treatment, right? I was on that wait list, but I never ended up going because I spoke to my sponsor at the time. I was three months into going to meetings, steady. I had a sponsor. I was, like, doing the work. And I said to him, listen, like, do I need to go to rehab? You know, like, the opening, like, you know, they're allowing me to go now. And he said, listen, if you keep doing what you're doing, you don't need to go to treatment. So I never ended up going to treatment. But I lived in a sober house with guys for two years. And that, for me, was treatment because I'm outside of the box. Like, you know, you said that I only needed to go to rehab. a treatment center and stuff i went back to school at 32 having uh you know some some dreams and stuff like that of opening up a place in recovery and we ended up opening up a treatment center at the time with my my um my sponsor and um you know and it's been a it's been very successful and i'm really grateful for that but at the same time i think treatment's a really good place for people to come and break the cycle of using every day you know a lot of people like need a time out from life not necessarily even addicts just just regular people could could do with just going to a retreat yeah yeah you know have a disconnect yeah disconnect get off the social media get off you know your schedule and your regular uh you know things that you're doing on a regular basis and just take a time out and just kind of get grounded in realizing what you need to work on in your life you know and start working on what you need to do in your life you know and start working on what you need to do in your life you know and start working on what you need to do in your life you know and start working on what you need to do in your life you know and start working on what you need to do in your life you know and start working on what you need to do in your life you know and start working on what you need to do in your life you know and start looking in the mirror you know and start looking in the mirror you know and start looking in the mirror at yourself right and um and that's why i at yourself right and um and that's why i at yourself right and um and that's why i think treatment's really good so it kind think treatment's really good so it kind think treatment's really good so it kind of breaks the cycle of using every day of breaks the cycle of using every day of breaks the cycle of using every day whether it's a 30 day or 45 or 60 day whether it's a 30 day or 45 or 60 day whether it's a 30 day or 45 or 60 day program but the real work starts when you program but the real work starts when you program but the real work starts when you leave treatment right so i believe leave treatment right so i believe leave treatment right so i believe um you know us who have sober living um you know us who have sober living um you know us who have sober living houses wherever whoever has them houses wherever whoever has them houses wherever whoever has them are a lot more successful are a lot more successful are a lot more successful in getting the stats up where people can in getting the stats up where people can in getting the stats up where people can stay clean and sober long term stay clean and sober long term stay clean and sober long term because now you're out of the bubble of because now you're out of the bubble of because now you're out of the bubble of treatment you know you're you're treatment you know you're you're treatment you know you're you're dealing with everyday life you know dealing with everyday life you know dealing with everyday life you know we're getting back into school we're we're getting back into school we're we're getting back into school we're able to navigate through those able to navigate through those able to navigate through those experiences experiences experiences clean and sober with the support of a clean and sober with the support of a clean and sober with the support of a group of brothers in a house or girl you group of brothers in a house or girl you group of brothers in a house or girl you know women in a house know women in a house know women in a house with counselors that you know you can with counselors that you know you can with counselors that you know you can ask questions and have that like ask questions and have that like ask questions and have that like not the thought of okay i'm gonna go not the thought of okay i'm gonna go not the thought of okay i'm gonna go out because life's getting tough out because life's getting tough
Speaker 1And it's and it seems like when you're when you're dabbling with that thought and dancing with that thought, as one of my counselors used to say, you're dancing with this idea of like, maybe I could, maybe I could do it. I'll control this time, this and that. You're not bouncing it off anybody. So it's a great idea in your head. To your point, when you're surrounding yourself with people who are trying to live a better life, clean and sober, you kind of feel obligated if you're working a good program to tell to tell somebody like, hey, I've been thinking about getting back on ADHD medication. That was my thing. I never told anyone. I told my wife, but I was dead set on it. And she her first reaction was, no, you shouldn't do that. But I wasn't telling people in recovery. I wasn't telling them what I was going through. You know, I wasn't telling them my motive behind it. At the end of the day, I was just trying to fix my inside. I was bored. I was scared. I had all these emotions that I wasn't telling anyone about. Right. Yeah. So you mentioned a lot of good stuff there.
Speaker 2I think I just want to say, yeah, I think like addicts or just whether they call. Themselves addicts or not, whatever that may look like for each individual, people that come into recovery don't make the best decisions in the first year and they shouldn't be making the decisions for themselves. You know, they should ask for guidance and direction. Right. Because that can go a really long way in figuring out if they're going in the right direction or not, you know. So that's why there's other people that have come before us that we go to, you know, for advice. And like, should I be going to a wedding like three months into recovery? Is that a good idea? It's a great example. I didn't go to events like that my first year. You know, people are drinking. They're using. Like I go, I put in, you know, a booster and I give them the money and then I'm out, you know. But you got to be very, very careful. I think the first year in recovery, you know, until you have a good foundation and you're spiritually fit and you have, you know, like you're able. Eventually, you'll be able to go anywhere you want to go. I was just going to say that. So I remember very, very clearly one night I was DJing at a place called Parlor Room.
Speaker 1Yeah, I've been there.
Speaker 2And I'll never forget it, but I can't even remember how clean I was. I might have been like five years or six years, but I remember leaving and I got into my car. It must have been like 3.30 in the morning. I was by myself and I just started crying because I really, I was like free. Yeah, that gratitude cry. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, buddy. I was just. Free. I'm like, I'm like, I can go anywhere I want to go. I didn't even think about using. How is that possible? Being in that environment and, you know, being around, you know, people that were using and stuff like that. So for me, that was a spiritual experience. And there's been many, many spiritual experiences, you know, graduating school at 32, you know, was a spiritual experience. I cried. I'm like, you know, to have that diploma and, you know, certificate to allow me to move on. And in this difficult. Direction of helping people and stuff like that.
Speaker 1Yeah.
Speaker 2Yeah.
Speaker 1You know, that's amazing, man. I, you know, I hadn't thought about that in a, in a few weeks, I would say I've had many of those gratitude cries too, where it's just, you can't even believe where you're at. And it's not like, it's not, it's never, I just bought a boat or I just bought a car. Like, ah, it's amazing. It's never, ever that, man. It's usually, you know, for me, I, one of that standing out in my mind is I was driving down to run a marathon, my first marathon, no, my second marathon. And I wasn't a runner. I could never do things like that. Right. I never had the discipline, the energy, the capacity to do that ever in my life. But in sobriety, I was able to do something amazing like that. And I was driving down to the, to the Toronto waterfront and a song came on. It's usually, it usually happens when a song comes out. Right. And it just spoke to me. And I just, I'll never forget it. I was like, I can't believe where I'm at today. I can't believe I'm free. Like you said, I can do whatever I want if I'm willing to pay the consequences. That's what my sponsor said. For sure. Yeah. Yeah. You know, it says that in one of the, one of the literatures too, is like, we can go anywhere. It's funny that you bring that up. We can go anywhere in the world as long as we're on in fit spiritual condition. Right. Yeah. So a lot of people struggle with this. How am I going to have fun in recovery? Like, what am I going to do? I'm never going to get, you know, my big thing when I first came in 10 years ago, my big thing was, uh, how am I not going to drink on my wedding day? I couldn't fathom that. And then people kept telling me, just get through today, man, just get through today. And sure enough, on my wedding day, I didn't have a drink. And that was a miracle in and of itself. Yeah.
Speaker 2I can relate to that because I thought the same thing in the beginning, you know, how am I not going to have a drink of champagne at my wedding? But, um, yeah, it was just about focusing on one day at a time, you know, but having fun in recovery. I mean, that's the whole thing. Like, that's what I really want to bring. Yeah. That's what I try to bring to people because it is possible. I can go out, I can have a blast. I can go to music festivals, concerts. Um, I can go up North, I can be, you know, in the cottage and hang out with people. And my goal is that like, um, you know, doing these fun things and activities is I have a lot more fun when I'm doing them with other people in recovery as opposed, you know, as opposed to myself. Right. So, um, yeah, having fun in recovery, it's, it's the best thing in the world. And today I can feel everything. I'm not blocked. I'm not numbing it with things. I can actually remember what I did the night before the day before.
Speaker 1You know, so, yeah, it's like your priorities change too, right? Like fun, just fun takes on a different definition as you stay sober, right? Like look at that sunset. This is fun. For sure. I never thought that was fun before, but I can sit with my wife and just watch nature unfold. Absolutely buddy. What a beautiful gift that is, you know, but I, I would have said you were crazy if you said that that was fun before.
Speaker 2Yeah, for sure. You know? Yeah. Because there's a peace and serenity that you have within yourself. Today, I think, you know, like you can look at the little things today and be awake to it. I think recoveries about being awake, you know, I heard a speaker say, like, you know, I went my whole life sleeping, you know, dreaming that I was awake, like walking around pretending that I was awake, but I really wasn't just because your eyes are open, doesn't mean you're awake. Yeah. Right. So coming into recovery and doing the work on ourselves, I always say, it's like when we come into recovery, yeah. You're like a baby man, you need to be spoon fed this program, you need to be loved and cared for, and slowly, slowly, you start crawling, and then you start walking a little bit, and you look people in the eyes, and you start building this confidence back a little bit, right? Recovery starts allowing you to become the man or woman that you want to be, that you're really supposed to be, you know, and I believe the drugs and the alcohol just strips you from everything, slowly, you know, so.
Speaker 1Yeah. And I think that's a really powerful thing to do, and I think that's a really powerful thing to do, and I think that's a really powerful thing to do, and I think that's a really powerful thing to do, and I think that's a really powerful thing to do, and I think that's a really powerful thing to do, and I think that's a really powerful thing to do, and I think that's a really powerful thing to do, and I think that's a really powerful thing to do, and I think that's a really powerful thing to do, and I think that's a really powerful thing to do, and I think that's a really powerful thing to do, and I think that's a really powerful thing to do, and I think that's a really powerful thing to do.
Speaker 2I would definitely say that there is hope, and if you want to change your life, you can. You deserve to be happy. You know, you deserve a better life, for sure, but you also have to surrender completely, and if you surrender, and if you are willing and open in wanting to change, there is a solution for you, but you're going to have to do work, and it's just like everything else. Anything you want to do in your life, you have to work at it. You have to practice. You know, even being a father, you go to practice, being a dad, you go to school. or whatever that may look like for you right so i i feel that yeah there's definitely hope for people out there that are struggling like i have faith i see it you know if i see it every day i see i see miracles around me all the time i was going to ask you is there a specific but i think
Speaker 1it's important too is there a specific um case person you don't have to obviously break anonymity but is there something that sticks out over the years that inspires you like a certain scenario
Speaker 2case anybody picking up a year medallion or like a couple years for sure that that inspires me for sure i have like i just i actually just facilitated uh last week a seven-year medallion a four-year medallion and a one-year medallion all in one night and they're all three buddies of mine wow um so for me like what really inspires me is seeing the family members so happy and seeing their loved ones change like for me that like just touches my heart you know brings tears to my eyes and like i just yeah that's the gratitude i get when some when i feel like wow somebody's actually free from that bondage of drugs and using you know and they're living a different life and they're getting married and they're having kids and they're they could never even imagine their life i always tell people you can't even imagine what you're like when you get married you can't even imagine what you're life will look like in recovery it's true you know it's it's beautiful thing right but um i always say normie normies won't understand they don't get it but um i feel like this program or you know whatever program it is that you're doing it's it's uh it's a gift from it's a gift from god for me and there's a power like it's an unbelievable power but um my thing i would just say is that there's hope for sure yeah you know yeah awesome yeah um where can people find you eric do you want to shout out anything um how do we yeah i mean if people are struggling for sure reach out to um you know we have we have a treatment center that people can if they need treatment or they need outpatient counseling or maybe they don't need treatment they just need a day program there's an online program that we offer to people so it's uh www addiction rehab toronto.ca um we have sober living for guys that just want to come in and you know live in a sober living house for you know a couple months um that could be beneficial for them as well um and what else
Speaker 1you can see me on the dance floor yeah i love it yeah i gotta come see you yeah i absolutely love it one of my favorite things to do now is is dance in uh in recovery and and be sober because i i've learned over time that i do actually enjoy the music and you have to you your motive has to be right in my opinion you can't just go to a nightclub to have fun in my in my experience sorry i shouldn't say that i have to go to places with the right motive i can't be going to just steal vicarious pleasure off for sure right yeah i enjoy the music i enjoy dancing and so i love it
Speaker 2yeah so that's funny you say that like for me i i when i stopped doing drugs it really brought me into what i really loved about music itself like i loved music and dancing and then i felt like the drugs and everything just took me away from it so far away from that so now that i'm clean and sober like i just i love the music i feel it i i love the energy of people i love watching them dance and have a good time and uh it's a beautiful thing so for sure you know you can definitely come out and see me play if you'd like and uh that's it i love it man music is the best drug i absolutely believe that thanks so much eric i appreciate you buddy thanks for having me and i wish you all the best thanks brother and many many more yeah thanks thanks for listening please help me
Speaker 4grow the channel and like share and subscribe for more content the discussions and stories shared on this podcast are for informational and motivational purposes only this content is not a substitute for professional medical advice addiction treatment or therapy if you or someone you know is struggling with addiction please consult a licensed physician addiction specialist or mental health professional you are no longer alone if you have any questions or other problems please post them in the comments section below thank you so much for watching and i will see you in the next video bye
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