Layered Minimalism with Elizabeth Bolognino

Welcome to How to Decorate from Baller Designs, a weekly podcast all about the trials and triumphs of decorating and redecorating your home. I'm Caroline, I'm on the marketing team, and I'm Taren and I'm a product designer. I'm Liz, I head of the Creative Team. Where are your hosts? Join the expert team at Baller Designs for tips, tricks, and tales from interior designers, stylists, and other talents in the design world. Plus, we'll answer your decorating dilemmas at the end of each episode. We love answering your questions, so don't forget to email us at podcasts at Baller Design and startnet now on with the show. Our guest today is interior designer Elizabeth Bolinino. Her rooms are characterized by her layered minimalist look, sleek, refined spaces that blend contemporary lines with traditional sensibilities. Her space is highlight how to use a neutral palette while still creating warmth and familiarity in your home. Her firm Elizabeth Bolinino Interior has offices in Westport, Connecticut and South Florida and her work can be found across the country. Elizabeth, welcome to the show. Thank you for having me. How are you? Wonderful. So happy to have you. I knew as soon as we saw your or we knew as soon as we saw your portfolio that we wanted to speak with you because we love a more traditional look, but there's something about the sleekness and the more contemporary vibe of your portfolio that it has all those things but it never loses some of those more traditional, like that familiarity that I think we all appreciate. And so we wanted to kind of discuss how you blend those two and help maybe our listeners do the same. How can they kind of blend in some more contemporary lines but also include that warmth that all of your rooms have? So maybe you can just kind of start where you think that design sensibility came from and what was the genesis of the style? Sure, for you. Okay. So I am from Georgia. I am not technically Italian, which I think is a good way to start because sometimes people are like, oh, you must be from Northern Italy or I just married. I married into it. Okay. All right. Did you know that we're all in Atlanta? Oh, no. I'm from Atlanta. Oh my gosh. How funny. Okay. We'll have to revisit that maybe towards the end. I don't want to get shot of track. Oh my gosh. Okay. I'm from Atlanta. Well, I guess this starts my story. So I grew up in Atlanta, Buckhead to Alvarada. It was my trajectory. And I went to college. I went to undergrad at Georgia in Athens. I had a great time and then met a boy and the boy took me up to New York because he was from New York. And I had never thought about leaving this out, but it just happened. And I just knew we were going to leave this out. So moved to New York and started my job as a 22-year-old, newly graduated human in Soho. And I was technically working for a very early social media platform. And it was awful. I hated every second of it. I hated everything about it. And I just knew right away that this was not the life for me. I did not want to be chained to my desk for the rest of my life to make a living. And I took my portfolio from school at the University of Georgia and applied to Pratt. And I was like, I want to take what I had studied, which was graphic design and front-end web design at the time and extrapolate that into a 3D environment. And so I went to Pratt. And it was the hardest three years of my life. I still think back at those times. And I'll tell you, besides having a baby, hardest they've ever done. So hard. It was terrible. And awesome at the same time. So when I was at Pratt, I got a Master of Science in Interior Design. And my first job was with, it was actually an internship with this very acclaimed hospitality firm called Yabu Pushleberg. And Yabu Pushleberg, they designed like the fanciest hotels you can think of, like the four seasons and the St. Regis and the think of the wildest craziest place you've ever been, they probably designed that property. So I was picked from my professor as a choice to be an intern. And I went to work there. They were based in Toronto, about the head and office and so on. And just enjoyed every second of it. Everything I knew about design at the time was steeped in tradition. And they took all of that and they said, what if you thought about things a little differently? You know, why do the frames or the mat around an image have to be symmetrical? And then they had this new developed way of standards that was not mine. And I loved every second of it. There was this girl who worked with us who now I think she lives in Hong Kong or something. And she was older than me and I totally revered her because she was so chic and cool and beautiful. And I was like, you know, literally like 23 and had next to zero dollars to my name and was just trying to make everything neat. And she looked at me and she said, I'm going to tell you one thing. And she said, trace paper is cheap. And I loved that because what she was trying to say was, you know, it's okay to come up with an idea and to ball it up and put it in the trash can and do it again and again and again. And that really stuck with me. And I still tell people today like we had somebody do start with us this week. Also went to Georgia, by the way. Our new studio assistant Joe and I told him I was like, listen, trace paper is cheap. Just go out and do it like show me what you got. So anyways, long winded way of saying I started it. Yeah, we push the word. And then realize after seeing how long a hospitality project actually takes to get done that I wanted ultimately to end up working in people's homes. And I would go to I would walk home from my office in Soho and I'd walk by you know, retail store after store and then I stopped in front of Mr. Ralph Lauren stores. And I said, hmm, that reminds me a little bit of my life back in Georgia. Reminds me a little bit of this Southern, you know, steeped in tradition that I grew up around. It'd be really interesting to see how, you know, my career thus far that has been very steeped in modernity in the Bauhaus tradition and going to school at Pratt and all this would connect back to more traditional American value and traditional American design, maybe more traditional English and French design. So I applied to go work at Mr. Ralph Lauren's company and they took me in. So my design style is a mixture of it's like the crossroads of that modern contemporary look and the traditional honoring tradition that I have learned from my roots and also working at Ralph Lauren. Yeah. I can see that in certain ways. There was even a project which is actually one of my favorites that was a loft. One of the things that I found really interesting is you're in a lot of cases your rooms, the furniture itself is very sleek, more contemporary shapes. But then the shell, the room itself is more traditional, you know, moldings and marbles and more traditional, I guess materials that you've applied in a more minimalistic way or a more contemporary way is that something that is more intuitive or something that is purposeful and sort of something that you're doing intentionally. I'm definitely doing it intentionally. Like 100%. It's from the beginning that was sort of a thing. It wasn't like just yes. I think design magic happens when you tow the line between contemporary aesthetic and traditional motif, traditional things. And what it does for me and the way that I sell it through to our clients is you have to hedge in this business we are constantly hedging against something dating itself. You're going to spend a lot of money with me. You know, I'm not the cheapest person to design with. So how do I protect that investment? How do I protect that the decisions that we're making are decisions that will be good in five years, in 10 years and 20 years? And I have clients, I had a client actually yesterday text me because we had a piece come out in a magazine and we actually completed that project five years ago and she literally wrote to me and said, I love this house just as much today as I did five years ago. is nothing I would change. And we do this by number one, we educate our clients. There's always a why behind the decisions that we make. We educate them on the design history element of it, which is huge, which is why we always hire out of design school. Very important. Even if there's something that we do that is minimalist or stripped down, there is something in history that has preceded our decision that informs the decision. And that is why it's so important. We always tell people this, even if we don't end up getting hired, that you have to hire somebody who knows design and art history, because they will inform every single decision that they make. And is the why behind the design different for every project that you're taking on? Or is there a thread that's coming through? That's a great question. I would say yes, the why is different? Because the question's different. Every client of ours is different. And we have some clients that skew traditional. And then there's actually some new projects that you all haven't seen yet, because they're not on our website yet. One of my more probably one of the most my most gratifying projects we've ever done is one of the most traditional projects that we've ever done. And they're the programming of that house and the people are the opposite of say another project that we just finished out in Bridgehampton. And you know, I think there's elements of there's a through line for both of those eat the ones that skew traditional and the ones that skew more modern or contemporary. And the way that we connect those things is through layered minimalism. And as layered minimalism as a method that you apply to different styles of design versus it being its own style. So I look at people that I review are like Thomas O'Brien, great example, Ralph Lauren, great example. People who have the ability to design, you know, one project could be very contemporary. And it sits right next to a project. But there's a sense of connection between those two through the magic is made. And people will write to us and say, you know, it's it's crazy that you have this one project that's light bright airy, a Morphus furniture next to this next project that is more steeped in like George Smith, you know, or something that's very British and traditional. But like why and how do those two things relate oddly? They do. I can't figure out how, but they do. And that's the magic in my opinion. Can you walk us through more of your design process in terms of you've got a new room you're starting from zero? Like what are the questions you're asking yourself? What are you adding? What are you taking away to that is inherent to that layered minimalism? Sure. So this is something else I think about all the time. So I think I think I think it to myself first and then I tell everyone I know Versailles started as a white box. A project in the middle of nowhere in the United States, whether you have a billion dollars of zero dollars started with a wall. And we add to that. Okay. So you got to start somewhere and every single decision whether you, whether it becomes like super minimalist or very or neat starts with the same white wall. You know what I mean? It's just all about layering a decision. So our process. So the first thing we always ask our clients is how do you want your space to feel versus we do not say how do you want your space to look? Because most of the time they can't answer it. But they can surely answer how they wanted to feel. And many times we have, you know, there could be partners in a relationship or a family and they've got 14 different answers. So how do you take those ideas? One person may say I wanted to feel like bright airy. The next person in that household says, Oh, I wanted to feel academic moody bohemian. And then there's a third person that's like, Oh, well, I thought it should be like floral and you know pink. So how do you take those things and meld them together? So number one, how do you want your space to feel? And then we get into the details. So we will go, we will measure, we will get all of these space, you know, put into AutoCAD. We start space planning and then we start pulling images. Images could be magazines, they could be books, they could be, you know, it could be the inside of a banana peel. You love the color. It could be, you know, it could be your grandmother's dress that you have in a photo that you have had on your nightstand for 14 years. And we take those things and we pull them together conceptually as one image. You know, and we typically will take the words that were given to us, put them on the page and we apply that to an amalgam of imagery together. And how do those words inform how you're feeling when you look at a space? And then we move on to the next slide, which is going to have a totally different vibe. Same words, different vibe. And so without thinking anything about space planning, we start with just the vibe. And most likely we will land on something where somebody's like, that's the vibe. That makes me feel refined, sophisticated, academic, airy, whatever they are. And so that starts to inform our design process. And we take that, we pair it with space planning. And by the end of that first phase, which we do call concept and discovery, then we know we have a, we have an aesthetic direction, we've got a written direction and we've got a quantitative space plan that's been approved. And how much time is that discovery session going? Depends on the size of the project. Because it's so high level, it doesn't mean you have to have a million boards, you know, but I would say we try to keep it, we try to keep it pretty quick because we want to get into the details. Probably about three weeks to a month. Okay. Yeah. Yeah. But you want to give it enough time to respect because that's really the launching part for everything else that moves forward, right? Totally. And it becomes this checklist for us where, you know, you come up with this idea, does that feel refined academic and airy? Well, if it doesn't, we're going to have to move on to something new. So it does. And most often than not, there will be something that comes out of that first session that our clients really connect with that ends up going into our DD phase, our design development phase, where we'll take that and we'll start to build something off of an idea. But I would say a lot of the work that we do, which I'm sure you'll hear this all the time, is so intuitive. There's a lot of space in, how do I say this? There's a lot to be learned from the moments between the words where you're intuiting maybe what's happening in somebody's mind or how they're acting or if they're trailing off and looking at, you know, that incredible piece of abstract art that's behind you right now that I'm looking at. You know, like, where is it going? So we take a lot of time servicing our clients, not just with the end product but with the process. And more often than not, I would say 95% of the time, that's how I think the work maintains its longevity and also how we re-retain our relationships with these people because I tend to do projects after projects after project with the same families. So the one that we just published a few days ago, I'm about to start our fifth project for that family. That's amazing. Yeah, yeah, that's incredible. Yeah, by this time, I'm sure the research and development phase is a day, right? Yeah. Like really exploring the space more than exploring them. Yes, and exactly. Like the first project we did for them was in Manhattan. The second and third, well, the second one was in Amaghanza and the Hamptons. The third was in Manhattan. The fourth was in Manhattan and the fifth is in Maui. Oh, wow, that's so different. Yeah, incredible. Look great. Places to travel to for your project. I know. I'm really lucky. And we're working on something at Costa Rica right now, which is like so exciting. and gratifying in every way, because it's such a different flex for us, creatively, creatively from my studio's perspective. So that's super, super, super exciting. - Yeah, and do the sourcing of the furniture, is that totally different when you're working in a different country? - Yes, kind of. - For this one, I would say yes, and we're not there yet. So we're just approaching this, whether it makes sense to, you know, use our trusted vendors here, which we have these longstanding relationships with. Take everything, put it on a shipping container, and have it leave the port of Miami, because that way we can control it, right? - Right. - Or does it make more sense to use local vendors, which we're also, you know, we're looking into that too? - It's different, it's really different. I mean, our European stuff, I would say, we use mostly the same vendors, but in Latin America, it's a bit of a different ball game, simply because, you know, we've got weather elements that we need to deal with, particularly their half the time in that country. It is dry as a bone, like Southern California, and then the other half of the year, it's wet, it rains every day. You know, you're gonna have a monkey coming through your back porch. How do you deal with that? Like we had, we literally had a conversation today about big cats. - Oh, yeah. - Yeah, big cats, because we've got this house that we're developing right now that is, it has an open breezeway. And so what happens if it's a quark, it's a quark, it's a quark. - Yeah, that's a problem. - Yeah, that's not a consideration that I have thought of for my own home. So, wow. I, you know, I never thought about it until we got an email about big cat training about four days ago. - Wow. - Yeah, I initially like, think, go to shopping brain, and I'm like, okay, I know my trusted places, and if I were to go someplace so wildly different, like, I would be at a loss. Yeah. And how do you bring your aesthetic to a new market for us? You know, these are two, we're building two custom homes that are rooted in tropical modernism, but it's under, you know, the EBI, the Elizabeth Boyle, and you know, aesthetic. We're doing the exteriors and the interiors for these. And it's gonna be totally new for the market in the country. So, we'll see what happens, we're excited. - Well, I just have to, yeah. - Can't wait to see what tropical modernism shakes out to do. - I wanna ask for, you know, you've found these words to kind of describe it. How do you research from there? Like, what is your, your process here creatively on? Finding again that intuitive area between, again, modernism, tropical, and where do you find yourself, like kind of finding inspiration? - Well, there is a tenant of layered minimalism that is always rooted in nature. So, that's gonna change depending on where the project is. So, in context with Costa Rica, we are certainly looking at, you know, native things in Costa Rica. And the last thing I wanna do is bring something that feels like, how do I say this? To somebody who hasn't done the research on it, it might be fine, but when you realize if you bring in like a straw basket that clearly that straw does not grow in Costa Rica, then I have not done my research and I'm gonna look silly. So, you know, I think that's the first part is, is researching the environments our projects are in and seeing how can we like the materials, yeah, bring the materials in. And also the sense of academia about, you know, are there Costa Rican furniture designers or maybe Latin American furniture designers that we may not know of, but are super cool. You know, how can we integrate their story into our projects? Because for, it doesn't matter if our project is in Georgia, New York, Costa Rica, LA, whatever, we want to honor the tradition of those we learn from, the architects, the landscape designers, the furniture designers, the historians, like, like, would none of us would be sitting in any of these rooms, had somebody before not come up with a good idea. So, let's honor them. Did that answer your question? No. - Yes. - Are we sure? - We did, we did, yes. (laughing) No, I think, you know, the people listen to this podcast, trying a lot of times to figure out their ways of reasoning and rationalizing decisions and things they love. And we talk a lot about location and the effects that location have upon design. And you, you know, you're speaking to it. And again, you have this different language of talking about this minimalism. And in a different way. And I think I just wanted to look at different ways to make it approachable. 'Cause I know you talked about a lot of it is intuition. And some people like, how do we build that confidence to really find, you know, the areas of appropriate research kind of, you know, to honor the location, to honor the materials of the location. So that's why I was just interested on what you were, you know, other than big cats, which is obviously a very interesting thing to-- - So different. - I think it relates back to, like, your personal story first to as a, if you're, if you're decorating for yourself, that's a good place to start. Like, how do you apply the layered minimalism method to your own project, your own home? And the last thing that any of us, what we want to do is walk into a house that feels like your neighbor's house. That is the worst, right? Everything's gray, there's no, there's nothing that reflects you as a person or a community, as a family. So I would always start with the things that mean the most to you. And that could be anything. I mean, it could be a box that you had that set on your night stand for 25 years. So what is it about that and why does it mean something to you? And maybe it's the, you know, it could be like a, I'm using carved box that I'm thinking of as an example, but, you know, build a story around these things that are important to you. It could be your grandmother's chair or mint coat or whatever, like start there, because you want to make sure that your story is different than everyone else. And that is what makes design so special is it is really a reflection of who you are, your interior design. You know, that's what we're trying to do. All we're trying to do is take our interior design and put it out to the world, right? To make us like, who am I to everyone else and who am I to myself that I can live in this container that represents me? And it's a very long, very difficult question to answer, but that's what we're trying to get at. Do you feel like the, when the, the home that you're living in reflects you as the person is just more comfortable to live in? Like is that sort of the end goal? It's just a more enjoyable house to live in because it's reflecting who you are. Definitely. And I think, I think sometimes people, like when they come to this house in Connecticut, where I am now, you know, I'm in a very traditional house right now. My, my home here is quite traditional. Now, when I lived in New York, where, by the way, our studios are in Union Square in New York. And when I lived in New York City for 19 years, my homes were not traditional. My homes were very contemporary when we lived there. But I always feel like I'm like a horse with blinders on. Where like, you know, you look in one direction and you're in this contemporary environment and you're like, oh, that's me. And then you just flip a little bit and you're in this traditional environment and you're like, oh, I'm home like. But here in this house, you know, it's very, very traditional. And I do feel like it's representative of who I am and who, who I like, the person I am when I'm in this house. When you moved from your more contemporary space in New York to your more traditional home in Connecticut, what percentage of your, you know, sort of furniture and your things, did you move and reimagine in the more traditional space? And what did you have to edit? You know, that wouldn't necessarily work. Like our sofa, the main things, and I think this is also a tentative layered minimalism too, is that we tend to look for pieces that have a neutral base. Like, I'm looking at the sofa that we brought from New York in the other room here. And it's like a Jean Michel Franc style sofa that I have repulsed that thing probably four times. And I'm about to do it again just because I do not see the benefit of throwing something out. If the shape still has longevity, it's timeless. I can replace the cushions fine. We can repulsed for it fine. But I just don't see the benefit of choosing something new. There are things in this house that we brought with us. So like these bookshelves behind us, we brought. But there's quite a bit of new stuff here too. Just you may have, I imagine you went to a bigger space. So then you have to get new things. But just my, I'm asking because I'm curious how, you know, how you can reimagine something that maybe isn't a totally different environment, but it still works because then you've sort of put it in a new context with new pieces. And so it's before maybe it fell contemporary, but now it feels more traditional because of definitely. Yeah, I see. I think the way that you style something and how you contextualize like a, let's talk about like maybe like a console or a buffet or something like that. That is something that you can totally make feel different. Based on the wall color, the wallpaper, if there's a stack of books on it, if you've got bar utensils on it, you know, it may be in a place. It gets a lot of light. So you have, you know, a beautiful floral arrangement on it. So it's not so much maybe about the furniture itself. It's really more about how that furniture accentuates everything else in the room. And those are the pieces that are, you know, the ones that will end up coming from your grandmother's house to, to this house. Or if you buy something new, that's when they hold on to you. We've talked about contemporary, but I'm curious about the editing process. I, I feel like that is, to me, that's the trickiest part, right? It's, it's easy to add stuff in many ways. It's harder to know what to take away, right? And to know what to leave out of your design, to make it, to make everything more successful. What are some things that you think about leaving out or taking away to get that minimalism part of the layered minimalism? So we don't, we, we always tell our clients that it's not necessarily about like stuff on stuff on stuff. It's about the quality of the stuff or the story that the stuff is telling us. So there should always be a hierarchy whenever you're looking at anything. There should be a hierarchy. And I think for, you know, as a, as a tentative layered minimalism, a really great example for us is that we tend to not use fringe. Just because that's something that would probably be removed if you were a true minimalist. However, I think if you accentuate a fringe, like I would never take like a tassel fringe and put that on the bottom of a sofa that had 14 different pillows on it and had a crazy rug under it. To me, that's too much, right? However, I might take a fringe because it's something that's traditional, reinterpret it and elongate that fringe. Maybe the fringe is out of linen or out of a hemp or something that's just not expected, but honoring the tradition of what that French signifies and using it in a different way. I would do that. So it's all about the reinterpretation. And it's literally it being an adornment. I want to go back to something you said about layered minimalism being rooted in nature. And I think when we think about like the first thought about contemporary minimalism, I would think, you know, colder shapes, a little bit harder shapes. So I, that stuck out to me. Can you explain a little bit more about how layered minimalism is rooted in nature? So I think typically when people talk about minimalism, their minds will shift to cool tones, right? Like whites and grays and blacks and whites, maybe sometimes primary colors. And what, as you, as you bring in something that comes from nature, you're automatically bringing something that, especially if it's from your area that you feel comfortable with inherently into the room. And typically that is not going to be gray or white or black. It's going to be something probably browner. And so we're always trying to balance the cool and the warm tone through all of our fabric selection. If you look at any of our projects, you can see that there are cool tones and most of the time they are accentuated by something that's warmer. Even in the room I'm in right now, like the drapes, I'm looking at the, the color of our, the lino dreams behind me and then the color of the wall. Like that is a very, very, very dark, dark, dark, dark green. Like a teal color, but super dark. So how do we balance that? If those were gray, then this room would feel so different. Or the another thing that I think people don't typically think about when talking about minimalism is the color temperature of the lights. You know, we're looking at minimalism, minimalism, typically 3,000 and up Kelvin. Yeah, what's your Kelvin, Elizabeth? Oh, good question. Everybody's got their favorite Kelvin. Our Kelvin is between 23 and 27. Well, that is pretty warm. Yeah. 23 is, is pretty warm. Yeah. Yeah. 23 is like candle, 27. You know, I would say our house is between 23 and 27. And my kids are really affected by it. My kids, my kids have a very visceral reaction at this point because they've grown up with warm lighting to cool lighting. And it affects them. Oh, yeah. My kid as well, like, cannot be in a room. That is too cool with the lighting. Minds being just overhead lighting. Like I will go into a space and I have unfortunately become the person. Like, can I adjust some things in here? Like, same. I mean, I would close friends. Let's be real. I'm not going to, I don't want to offend anyone. But if it's a close friend, I'm going to be like, something's off in here. You guys, the lighting. Yeah. It's even dark out right now because it's about to rain. And I am like, it's too dark in here right now. I need my warm lamps on, but I can't reach them. So I'm just sitting here in the dark. It feels like, cause I don't want my overhead on that I can't reach. Well, how like a candle or candlelight affects your dining experience at a restaurant. And totally or like, and I think that harkens back to the nature element. It's like that element of fire. It makes you inherently a little bit more comfortable. And that's why when you go and even, you know, when you see like the fake flames at first and you're like, oh my god, they've got fire. And then you look closely and you're like, oh, it's not real. But you still felt that at first because you, the perception of something that's natural was brought into a space. You know, another thing that I recognize in your work is there's an inherent youthfulness to all of your work. And I wanted to find out where that's stemming from. Is it color? Is it texture? Is it humor? Is it, is it, you know, just adding irreverence? Where, where are you coming from with all of that? I am so glad that you just asked me this because I really appreciate it. I do not think that as a designer, y'all we should not take ourselves that seriously. Come on. Like at the end of the day, you can make something beautiful without it having to be so serious. But there is such a high level of sophistication in your work too. So there's, there's that juxtaposition of something being irreverent or being playful. Yet still really highly sophisticated. I think it's a combination of, of understanding who came before us. That's number one. Honoring tradition. Having fun, not knowing that, you know, to me, having something whimsical or a little off about design is what makes it interesting. So we always do that. We always throw something in there that's a little like funky. Whether it's an object or piece of art, like I always think about those, those pink. book who was at Mel Bachner, I forgot who makes them, but there's artwork that is a little cheeky in like a very high level way or just something that shows that the people in the space are not taking themselves too seriously, even though they have the ability to be very serious. That's magical to me. And I think a lot about my husband told me this story once about being in, he was at Chris Blackwell's house for a party or something. This is many, many years ago. And Chris Blackwell is a record executive that started Island Records down in Jamaica. And he went into the bathroom of wherever they were. And it was just this very private moment and looked up on the wall. And there was this handwritten from Bob Marley of like no woman, no cry or something super significant, but so private and personal and just to have the bathroom. Yes. Just out over the fireplace or something. No. To have whoever put that there as a genius be it shows who that man is and see to have that like personal interactive private moment with a piece of art. Definitely a one-on-one moment. So significant. That's magical. And so it's like how can you how can you create those devil in the detail moments for people with an object or something funky or a bench or whatever that ends up being. That's magical. And it doesn't have to be expensive. That's the most important thing. It does not have to be expensive. I want to ask you a question. And this is going to be revealing of my own house. But I look at some of the spaces in your portfolio and they're so beautiful and so sophisticated as we've mentioned. And I'm like where are there, where's their stuff? Where's their Chachki? Do they have a junk drawer? There's this gorgeous, gorgeous closet in your Grennit just a project. And there's just ginormous island. This is the rounded island I think. And it's this huge space. I'm like that is so beautiful. And the image is so striking. And then I'm like if there were actually my closet, it would be completely covered in Chachki's and junk. So I'm curious. Do you think that does your do you walk away and your client lives like the image images or and they have that discipline or do you know that there's a layer of personal effects that are going to be added after you leave a billion percent? Yes. It does make me feel a little bit better I guess. Okay, so that without giving way too much, that closet is incredible. Number one. And there's a part of that closet that when we were prepping for the photo shoot that we opened up and there were head like head to toe boxes from Hermes head to toe and I was like oh my god. Your Georgia accent came out. That is not. Well, and I and I that's a one off though and I will say that listen, like we're all real people, right? I've got three kids and most of our clients have kids. And so we like to say we like to design things for real life where there's a place to put stuff. If you if you're having an impromptu dinner party in one hour, you need to cook and you need to clean up. It is our responsibility to make sure that there's place for all those toys that you can clean up like you don't even have kids within one hour. And if we haven't done that then we would not do a very good job. So we plan for it. Yeah. But I think there's a difference between a photo shoot and real life. Because the because you know the I think and the way that you've styled the way you've styled it is really reinforces that minimalism. I think which you know is again so engaging and gorgeous for a photo. And so I guess I was just curious maybe what the the push and pull was between styling for the this your portfolio and you know to showcase the work and then the way that it's maybe styled and lived in on a day to day basis. That makes sense. Well and I I think that having like it depends on the person too. You know for us personally from me and my family you know I'm in a room full books right now. I'm in a room with records and big speakers because my husband is of true audiophile and musician. And I would never or style this through different than how because I think it lends so much to our story. So the styling really depends on our clients and like what they're trying to say like I'm looking at both of your bookshelves right now and I can tell that you both are collectors and you read and you reference things. And if you had changed if you changed that all the books behind you to be like objects white boxes with like a ball on top or whatever like I would perceive you differently. Right. True. Yeah. So I think it's all about like how what kind of story are you conveying. And as long as like I can get that story out of our clients then we're going to make something really beautiful. But if you have a question to any other designers listening if you all don't ask the question I don't think you're going to get as good of a product than if you did ask those questions. Really really loving your work. Um it's stunning. Thank you. I've so much to show you that I have not that's not up yet just because they're in between publishers right now we have to wait. We'll come back another time and we'll follow your Instagram so we won't have that's it. What has been your favorite project recently? Yeah. And it doesn't have to be one you've shared yet. I guess visually if you can share. Okay. Um Lee. Yes. So I have I've three I can't make up my mind. That's good. The first one is we just did a renovation of a kitchen in my our farmhouse in upstate New York. That is like the the heart chakra of our family is at this our property. And we did it in a manner that is very different than the work that I typically do. And I'm in love with it. And I will I cannot wait to show you actually was it maybe Instagram? Yes. Okay. We haven't shot it yet but that that one that one is so great. Um and then we just finished a house in bridge hampton for an art collector a lovely family. This is that was the second project that we did with them. It's very contemporary. It's on the polo fields right literally abuts the polo fields in bridge hampton. And so when you're when you're looking out their backyard you can see polo players practicing and horses and it's just so crazy cool. Um but we know her really well. And this that was our second project. So they own the Tribeca loft on my website. And then we did their house in bridge hampton which we have not we finished the photoshoot but it's not been published yet. And then we have a third project coming up on the upper west side for the same family. Yeah. So that's super exciting. Fabulous. And then I guess our the third one I was thinking of is truly this this more traditional project that we just finished in in the cat skills called Mary Weld. Very traditional. It's a legacy house so it was built to be standing within you know for the next 250 years for this family. They live in Los Angeles and they they come to summer and the Gatscombeounds of New York that they've been doing that since you know the 1800s and we built a house from the ground up and it was just it was so hard because the contractor was difficult but the outcome was incredible. And I know how much it means to them and what this what this place this retreat provides for their family. It's just it's it's so awesome. It but so different than anything that we've ever done before. It looks like there's might be a little bit of it on your Instagrams. Yeah. Everybody can go. Yeah. Do a little digging. Your Instagrams definitely a great kind of look into it just because you have inspiration and work pictures. I do want to know what's what's the fox. Oh, oh good question. Great question. So the fox fox every like like you go, who scroll and then you'll run into a fox. - Yes. - You'll be dead deep. Anyway, yeah. So I am a redhead. I think you are too, right? Do you have red hair? - Yes. - Yes, does, yeah. - Yeah, I can see it. So it's been like a defining part of my life just being like a redhead. And as I was younger in the South, my hair was a bright red. And so I always thought about the fox as being my spirit animal. Because they're a little quiet. They're smart. They're a little, I wouldn't say sneaky. I would say they're more just like, maybe more tenacious. Tenacious smart. Definitely not like gonna be on the front side of things, but more on the back side, kind of making sure everything runs well. So I feel like that's my spirit animal. So that's why the fox pops up. And people send me foxes all the time. - They're lovely. - Oh, and for this Miracle Project, the one that I told you I love. So when we were in construction, a fox used to visit us. - Oh my God. - Oh, that's cool. - I'm not seeing any foxes, Taren. You have some egoized. - Oh, I saw them. - I saw them. - If you go, if you like, scroll down. - It's just, I was getting her whole whole. - Yeah, I just did my digging. That was all. - We used to post a lot more inspiration than we do now, just because we have such a body of work now. We just want to stick to. And also, I haven't been posting as much lately, simply because I needed to take a minute from that. But we did a few days ago, and this is like out of my comfort zone, we got scammed by a furniture vendor. Did you all see that? I posted it. I posted it on my stories. And it's the first time it's happened to me in this way, but I said something and our community, it was incredible. Like I was like, I, for you know, to the interior design community, I wanna let you know this is happening to us. This is the downside of interiors. We found a piece, we really loved it. We put it a positive down. It was this custom piece made in Europe. They kept writing to us, and then all of a sudden they ghosted us. Like completely. - Oh my gosh. And I decided to like warn people, and the response was incredible. Because it was, I thought it would mostly be designers saying, like, okay, thanks for letting us know. But the furniture makers, it was incredible. Like we had makers, small makers, large makers, people who wanna protect the craft of what they're doing, reach out to me and say, we are so sorry that this happened to you. Whatever we can do to make it better for you, this is not who we are. And it was just such a beautiful moment as a designer sometimes, so I think we feel alone, 'cause we all work in these like, and we're not alone. And it, just from the community standpoint, it was very rewarding in that sense. So, I'm sorry that happened. I know. - I have heard that that's been happening more regularly, especially with antique Steelers. - Oh wow, really? - Yeah. - Oof. Yeah, it's like here that. - Yeah. I, and the amount of other designers that wrote to us, I had, we had three different designers write to me, specifically about the same mentor that we got to come from. And now we're all connected with each other, which is a good thing. But there were the other designers that were like, yeah, I'm going through the same thing with this vendor. I was told to contact this vendor about making some custom metal doors for me. And then we got them and they did not work. Like, it just goes to show how, I think how the internet and really doing your due diligence on who you're working with, where the stuff is coming from, AI, that could trick you in two shakes of a lamp sale. - Yeah. - So you gotta be careful. And so it's all about talking to people behind a product, instead of just, you cannot just buy. - Right. - So that's why we make great relationships with people, and we depend on them. And they help us out when something comes in broken. Or, you know, I go to them because I need to find X, Y, or Z. So anyways, it's not always fluff and pillows and lemonade. - Oh my gosh. - While you were talking about your coaster rica project, that to me, it's like, oh gosh, the logistics would be so challenging, but. - Well, I'll keep you all updated. - Yes, please do. - You're gonna see it on our Instagram, shortly. - Yeah, your Instagram is beautiful, so I encourage everyone to go. Can you tell everyone where they can find and follow you? - Yes. So I am Ebola, you know, which is E, B-O-L-O-G, N-I-N-O, Silent G. If I'm me on Instagram, you can find us on Pinterest. I'm technically on TikTok, but I don't really use it so much by choice. But yes, please follow me. Reach out, say hello. - Wonderful. - Love it. - Well, thank you so much for chatting with us, and sharing your work and that's our show. We appreciate it. - Thank you so much for having me. - And that's our show. You can find all of the show notes on our blog, howtodecorate.com/podcast. - To send in a decorating dilemma, email your questions to [email protected] so we can help you with your space. - And of course, be sure to follow us on social media at BallardDesigns. - Don't forget to subscribe wherever you get your podcast, so you never miss an episode. And please leave us a review. We'd love to hear your feedback. - Until next time, happy decorating. - Happy decorating.