Kobe at 17, Sandlot With Michael Jackson & Getting Found at Taco Bell with Ced Ceballos

welcome back all the smoke uh this is day two in l.a right yep we got a good one man uh og learned a lot from this guy watching him um on and off the court this motherfucker used to have the quickest hands i remember being at ucla playing pickup ball coming down the lane thinking i had it and this motherfucker just poking away every time another wrong leg jumper yeah man welcome to the show when l.a's finest says to balos i'm black so right off the rip we got to clear something up let's clear it up let's clear it up what are we clearing up that i that i didn't get stuck in the league i didn't put you in the league he didn't put me in the league he said i put myself in you put yourself in the league man because you got on espn and put me on blast everybody winning my twitter game it was like yeah i want to ask you a question okay do you remember when i tried out for the suns yeah you were all 18 17 18 years old do you remember mike baby mom bringing me in there to try and pick up with y'all and ames did the right thing and he took you wow i can't believe you remember that story but you had the guard uh was it sergeant and i served him up it didn't hurt that jake hitters was agreeing with me so he was there too but jay is the nicest motherfucker i guess we both didn't remember from because it probably be so long ago yeah but explain the story what actually happened well uh phoenix wanted to draft you you were there at the time yeah yeah um uh they wanted to draft them and i think the year before you got in the league they had you at training camp or practice so i don't know how i don't know if it was illegal or not illegal but you hadn't actually entered the league yet yep and um cooking you know what i'm saying he was cooking matter of fact i got a chance to play with y'all i got in trouble because me and stack used to always do before the sham god was the sham god and he'd be like don't be teaching them that stuff i'm like yo he teaching me how to do this before sham god got his name like that but yeah we was doing that move and uh now i do remember that yeah you should get pissed because we used to be over there practicing that and i do remember that so uh nah man you got yourself in the league man you was uh bouncy you know you wanted to fray you you got in his face and uh i wasn't and i already knew i wouldn't be i wasn't gonna make the roster because the roster was full yeah the rocks was full already so they would just give me a chance to get my name in the system which is cool and i gravitated to you because i got in the league at 19. you know and and that's what was like yeah i understand exactly what he's going through yeah this is this is kind of weird you know yeah and uh but you you didn't have no hesitation that you was definitely going to be you know where you are now appreciate it bro so you played well but then you saw is that where you had when you went to mexico for a year or two or two years after that i got drafted by them my name got in the system i went overseas for two years and i had to take a year off because i broke both of my feet then i came back and then he went to the net dominguez dominguez which term was him a lot of a lot of talent has come out of there what was your what was your upbringing like yeah man i grew up in west l.a so you know i'm down the street from the beach and um my brother was that dude how much older is he uh brother six five uh chris sabalos and um you know i know i know it's unheard of for a seventh eighth grader to be getting 50 points a game but he was he was he was killing it and uh he was taller than everybody he was big um and our hood was a we had our robertson park we had a basketball like me chris mills uh craig smith nick young tina thompson you know our our park was you know we i was the first one to make it but our park was kind of nice but um he was recruited to go to dominguez and compton so my mom was like you got to take one you got to take the other one i wasn't i wasn't how much older is he than you he's uh two years older okay so um i had to go to the meetings two hours in the traffic in the in the chevy chevelle with 610 michael moore from marlon vaughn 6-3 me 6-1-2 at the time my brother's 6-4 and the coach was 6-3 earn his car and i didn't play you know me i made one year varsity and that was only because my brother already went to fullerton and my mom was like i wanted to go to fairfax because i wanted to use his voice to get on the radio flea had just dropped bread hot chili peppers and they was filming a lot of stuff on melrose so i was like in order for me to get on the radio i gotta i gotta go to fairfax i gotta get out of compton and go to fairfax and this is right when easy and nwa is about to blow up you know you so you thinking get on the radio and all this back then before who all that yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah that was my dream man uh to be on the radio there was another radio station out here uh k-a-c-e i used to just listen to all the time and they went away but uh the dj's on there and the way they carried their voice easy's move for love you know a couple of snoops albums but um that's what i wanted to do that's exactly what i wanted to do was it djing or making music it was djing okay it was djing um uh that that was my thing and i didn't like i said i didn't play i didn't play varsity to my senior year i didn't get to play big ronnie coleman you all played against him against usc he was that dude and he broke his wrist um we going into the rivalry game against linwood we had a pep rally he he got hung and fell on his wrist and broke his wrist and coach was like yo you start so last five games of my high school career was 27 15 i was killing i i don't know what it was i love the game i love one to be around my brother i just couldn't do it i just couldn't do it i just couldn't do it i just couldn't do it i just couldn't do it i just couldn't do it i just couldn't do it i just couldn't do it i just couldn't do it i just couldn't do it but then you know my mom always said if if you work on something when it's ugly it'll get pretty eventually and then we crack the dough let god in and then all of a sudden he just blessed me and you know i was talking earlier about how long i asked jermaine die um baseball player when did he know pictures ain't got nothing on me like i can i can touch this ball and he told me it was about a six year period that he had to get over the fact that Our game is different. If we shoot three for 10, get your ass out the game. Right. That's Hall of Fame for them. If he hits three, yeah, that's Hall of Famer for him. And he had to understand that. And so I figured those first five games until about 98, I can, in my sleep, I can get 20 points. I don't care who guarded. And my tough opponents was Stacey Augman, obviously. Classic man. Scotty, you know what I'm saying? All them OG defenders, you know what I'm saying? And I can, and there's nothing that they could do. Do you think your game was like that because you had to wait until your senior year to play? So you was like, I'm just out here hooping. This shit low-key, kind of easy. There's no real expectations. I'm just out here hooping. I can get you 27 to 50. Yeah, yeah. I didn't have the confidence to know that I could do that until I, you know, started killing the Augmans and the Scotties and all that. But I was always grateful for, I ain't supposed to be here. You know what I'm saying? I went to the Orlando Classic and, you know, led that in scoring. I led the nation and tied with rebounding. And, you know, so I knew I had the ability, but it's still, you know what I'm saying? You still, you've been in the burner, on the back burner for so long, you're still like, man, something's going to happen and it's just not right. So even when I got in the league, we played Mike. I walked right up to Mike. How you doing, Mike? Introduce myself. And they're like, man, get out of here, man. You know, I went up to Magic. I went up to Bird. Bad Bird actually clowned me, but Dominique, all my heroes, I went all up to them and just kind of introduced myself because I just thought I was going to get a cup of coffee and get on out the league, have some jerseys to flash for the way. You know, I played for the, you know, little thing, put the thing on the mantelpiece. Some hole getters? Yeah, man. You know, snatch them up. But I just kept going, man. Just kept fighting, kept fighting and fighting. And then eventually, you know, my second year, I'm starting, starting in the playoff to Tom Jamer's spot. And I didn't look back, man. I was trying to go get it. We'll get back to basketball in a second, but you're kind of the same age range as Dre, Q, Warren G. Yeah. You know, you did some music with Warren G in the 90s, DJ being your passion. When did music come around? Did you have any run-ins with any of the three guys I had mentioned? Yeah. Ram was on my team at Dominguez. Okay. On my JV squad. We played together. And the address that I supposedly had in Compton was Easy E's block in Kelly Park. So I got to see Easy and All Limb and Dre would come DJ for opening day baseball in Kelly Park in a camper. So I was around that and it just, you know, hoopers want to rap. And it just kind of elevated from that. And then when you got the funds to do it and you get your first beat machine and then you go from there to start producing and then you kind of go from there. Like, I really wanted to get down. But, you know, David Stearns told A.I. to stop and I know I wasn't big as A.I. So I just was like, I'm going to get kicked out the league. I put this album out. You know what I mean? Not that my album was that raunchy or whatever, but I talk about the things that I do. You talk about some shit. And that's, you know, it's the kid's dream. You know, Biggie said it too. You know, wicked jump shot or you could rock rhymes. He gave me a call. He just, you know, he didn't really try to stop me. He just told me, like, be ready to deal with the flack that come from it. Yeah. I'm like, man, that ain't nothing. They didn't try to stop this, not hip-hop though. Wayne Metis did "Hour Forward." He got that jazz out. - He was jazzing though. - That was jazz though. - There wasn't no nigga shit in it. - Yeah. Terry Cummins had a couple albums too. - Did he really? - Yeah. - Rapping? - No, not a rapper. - Oh, jazz. - Oh, did he? Big old Terry Cummins, boy, huh? - Yeah. Grown man business. - Man, strong as an ox. - Grown man business. Like, you don't even have to talk. He just give you a look like, you know I'm your daddy, right? Like, okay. - Did you play in the Space Jam bubble when it was out in Burbank? - I did, I did. - What was that like? - It was dope, man. - Your rhymes? - And to any doubt that the trash was being talked, you know, all that stuff, man. Mike did a cool thing for everybody. 'Cause we played at UCLA, you know, obviously it was dope. But the fact that you might get two guys, you know, depending on what Adam's squad put together, you know what I'm saying? Lil' Adam will put you on the squad. You might get two cats that, you know, are kind of suspect on your squad. But the fact that Hall of Fame, Hall of Fame, Hall of Fame was going against each other, like, and just going at it. They get into the GOAT debates all the time. And I love, you know, Kobe's family and Bron is dope, which I think LeBron is the sickest basketball player I've ever seen in my life. But the fact that Mike would get up 3:00, 4:00 in the morning, be on set all day, come lift, come this, and bust ass, and then play cards all night till 3:00, 4:00 in the morning. I used to be like, how does this dude do it? Like even, even, even us again, when we played them in the finals, this is a game two, day game, Sunday, which we have to accommodate East Coast time, which is a 4:00 tip off. And Saturday night we go out, Jets and Sticks. At that time, Phoenix closed at one, so we could shut it down. We leave about 1:30. Me, him, Charles, and a couple other cats go to his hotel suite. They gamble and smoke. I left at 3:00. This dude gets up and walks 18 holes in June, in Arizona at 7:00 AM. - It's still hotter at 7:00 AM. - Crazy. - And he walked? - Gave us 50. - God, that's in the finals. - Think about it. You got to walk at 7:00 AM. So your round is done 12, one, the bus at two. The bus at two at the late, that's the late, late bus at two. And tip is at four, and you gave us 50? Come on, man. - After playing 18 holes, it's crazy. - He probably drank some beers out there too. Cigars. - Like I love Kobe, miss him so much. Bron, but they are technicians when it comes to that. - Preachers a habit. - They're technicians, they eat the best foods, they nutrition, they get the, you know, all that stuff. They get stretched, they get the, all that, man. And Mike just naturally just was a beast, man. So. - Bro, to walk 18 holes anywhere is crazy, but to walk 18 holes in June in Phoenix is unheard of. - And add to that, this is not a pre-season game. - This is the finals. - Finals, not the playoffs. Like. - You said he was bringing like Barkley out during the finals too? Like they were. - Yeah, they was, they was out the whole time. And I think, you know, Barkley always says, man, the reason we lost is because I was hurt, but Barkley just couldn't out party Mike. - He was hurt? - Yeah, I broke my foot. So I think that's the real truth. Mike out partied Charles and, you know what I'm saying? And I don't know if that was Mike's plan 'cause he did it every day. It wasn't like he just did it. - That was just Mike's lifestyle. - Yeah, that's just the way he was. He just, he just went hard and Charles went hard too. Playing with him. Matter of fact, I was mini security guard for the dude sometimes, but he, I just think Mike is just a different level when it comes to. - Yeah. - Hanging out and being able to get up and get it, get it like that. - Stories from the men's gym. Obviously Magic Cove, Shaq, fights, good pickup. - Yeah. - What are some of your, some of your favorite stories from the gym? - I remember, like I said, I always wanted to go to UCLA. You know, as a kid growing up, Kenny Fields lived down the street and I just was a big fan of the whole school and everything. They used to have a Mardi Gras at UCLA, which was ridiculous, you know. Years and years break dancing in Westwood, challenging pop lock and all that, whatever. - You had the baggy pants? - Oh man, all that, parachute and everything, man. So I used to be a fan of all the players that went there because of the prestige that you guys had. And it was always weird that you guys, when y'all came into play, y'all played together. I don't know if y'all had to or not. - Yeah. - And y'all was so quiet. Y'all never said nothing. Like, and I just found out it's 'cause y'all was exhausted. Y'all had 6:00 AM this and this, that, and the other. You had the weights and then you had the track. - Class. - And then, yeah, class. And then you come play with some pros. So that was the biggest thing. Like why don't UCLA guys are always so quiet. And then when Reggie would come in there, he was so loud. The competition was fierce. Adam and Magic kind of ran things. Obviously Magic, everybody called him a cheater. I don't think he cheats until it's point game. - Right. That's what they say. - It's all, you know, everything else. Like the fact that he would call fouls for other people. - Crazy. - Like, you know, you fouled him. Like, come on, man. Like, dog, you can't, he can, he a grown man. He can't call his own foul. Nah, nah, nah. Bring it back. Nah, you know you fouled him. You know you fouled him. - Magic OG in the runs, man. - Oh, man. Killing it, killing it. And then you get to a point, you be like, I'm just gonna walk off. And then you like, everybody looking at you like, nah, you can't do that. - Yeah. - And you just bring it on back. He gonna miss, he gonna miss. But even if he did miss, he gonna call a foul anyway. - That's what I'm saying. Missed shots or fouls. - Yes. - On point game with Magic. - Yes. - If he missed a shot, that's foul. - If the team misses the shot, it's a foul. - Yeah, yeah. You know what it is. You know what it is. - 'Cause if you lost, you had to go to the side court. And Magic was never going to the side court, bro. - Yeah, no. No, he stayed on the main court. Yeah. Buck room. - At some point, too, remember he was bringing his own five in there, too. He was bringing his old crew, his little tour team in there. - Yeah, man. - I swear. - Junior college route. Ventura College, then Cal State Fullerton. Juco produced some stars around that period. Larry Johnson, Grandma Ma, Latrell Sprewell, Sean Kemp, just to name a few. Any notable opponents or any key battles you remember from the junior college days? - Nah, nah. California is a little different. Those guys went to Texas, Indiana, Midwest. - Kansas. - Yeah, Kansas. California are not allowed to play those teams. Unless it's an exhibition, so to speak. So we didn't get a lot of, you know, we got Sean Jamerson. I think he went to Kansas. But we didn't get a lot of guys up to their caliber until we got into an exhibition type of game situation. So I didn't get to meet and play against those guys until I got to Fullerton. But junior college was dope, man. I didn't get recruited. I just happened to be in the right place at the right time. - Yeah. - You know? Working at Taco Bell and coach walked in and was like, "You're too tall to be working here." And I was like, "Yeah, no shit," you know? And he asked me if I played ball. I said, "Yeah, I played Dominguez." He was like, "Oh yeah, that Mexican dude, Sibelios, Sibalos." And I was like, "Sibalos?" He was like, "Yeah." I was like, "That's me." He was like, "Nah." I was like, "Yeah, that's me." He was like, "What you doing here?" I said, "I go to school over there." And I didn't know he was a coach. I just trying to take his order. And he's like, "I get you a job on campus. "You come play for me." I was an All-American. We won state that year. And it just kind of took off from there. Like just being in the right place at the right time. And I had two options. I could go to Elliott Harbor where everybody went and it was like a party. I would known everybody. Or I could go to Ventura, which is predominantly white town. - Out there too. - And learn a little bit of something. Learn a little bit of something. So I took a chance and it just worked out. - He said with your grade and your career, you were Mexican? - Man, he just heard the name. - So what's the, I was just about to ask you that. What's the origin of Ceballos? - Yeah, yeah, yeah. Pops is a Hawaiian. - Okay. - So then it goes back to Spaniard and all that. So that's where it comes from. - Okay, okay. - And which gets into a deeper thing with my pops, man. But it, that's where it comes from. And you know, I've been heckled and chopped my name up and screwed it up and all that, you know, my whole life. So it is what it is, you know. - Drafted in the second round by the Suns. I know what that feel like. The team was nice. This was pre-Barclay, Tom Chambers, Dan Marley, Xavier McDowell, you and Jeff Hornacek, Kevin Johnson, a lot of those guys. How was your intro and your experience to going in with the Suns? - Yeah, scary at first. - With that team already. - Yeah, scary at first, you know. 'Cause we, our first game was in, our first two games of the season was in Japan. So Cotton Fitzsimmons had us practicing at three, four in the morning. So I'm an LA Q. And we got daylight savings time, but Arizona don't have that. - Yeah. - So I walk in at 4:00 AM and they full sweat balling. And I'm like, what the fuck is going on? Get your ass in there rookie and get tape. And I'm talking to the trainer, like, what's going on? I thought we had practiced that. He's like, we don't have no daylight saving time, you idiot. I mean, it's just like, you know, it's going on. So that's my introduction. And then, you know, when you, the pro life is different. It ain't no instructions. - Yeah, no blueprint. - Yeah. - You just gotta get it. And at that time, I'm second round 48 pick, but we drafted Jason Williams, St. John. That was our first, he was our lottery pick. - At the Power Forward, Jason Williams? - Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. New Jersey Nets, I don't know. You probably know, you know what I'm talking about. Had the incident with them. Our press conference, I got drafted. Our next day at the press conference, Arizona has a record high, 122. And at that time, Jerry Colangelo's office is a little bitty office on Central, and we're staying at the Holiday Inn for the press conference, and they like, "You gonna send a car over?" And they're like, "Nope, it's less than a half a mile. "Just walk over." It's 122. Now, it's not a shocker to me. I'm a Cali kid, it's all good. Niguel Knight, Detroit, Dayton. - Let's start melting out there. - And Jason Williams, East Coast for life. That's where he grew up. We get to the press conference, just drenched. Soon as they introduce, Jerry Colangelo's like, "Yeah, but it's our first round pick, Mr. Jason Williams." He says, "Jerry's too fucking hot out here, man. "You gonna have to trade me "and there ain't no way in the world I'm paying for Feeny." And me and Niguel, eyes just blew up like, "You turning down this money? "Like, what's wrong with you?" So, that was a gift. - Didn't he sign for a hundred? - Huh? - Didn't he get a hundred? - Eventually, he did. - He did, yeah. - From Jersey, yeah. - Yeah, from Jersey, yeah. - He eventually did, but at that time, you just like, "Whoa," like, you know what I'm saying? So him not being there, and then I'm getting chewed out for being late, and then I step on the floor, and like I said, there's no blueprint to it. You gotta just pick up. So if they running three down or so-and-so across, whatever, they not telling you, "Hey, these are the plays." It's not like football where they give you a playbook. - Yeah. - You gotta pick that shit up. So I asked Tom Chambers, man, "What do you do on this?" He was like, "I'm supposed to tell you, rookie, "what the fuck to do?" And I was just like, "There's some professional shit going on here." - Did you come in at the two or the three? - I came in at three. - Okay. - Yeah, if I played the two, it was an accident. - Okay. - You know what I'm saying? I didn't have the outside game. Mine was always inside and running up and down. So I just kind of just, you know, just adjusted to that. And then first time going overseas, 17, 18 and 20 hour flight, you know, it was just mind blowing, man. We played Utah over there. That's when me and Carl started hanging out and Malone, and just kind of went from there, man. - What's Carl? - I was about to say, go ahead. - What's Carl like? - Same thing. - Carl's a country boy, man. - Straight up. - Yeah, man. We smoke sticks a lot. He's a fisher. He's a hunter. I'm not a hunter. I'm with him, but I ain't shooting nothing. I fish with him. I don't catch nothing. The wonderful thing about fishing is it's called fishing. It ain't called catching. - Catching, yeah. - Just having yourself a time. He owns a steel mill. I mean, a wood mill. You know, he's just a country kid, man. I just, you know. - Cool. - Cock strong and just, you know, massive, hard playing SOB, man. He just a cool dude to hang around with. - He laugh and talk shit? - Yeah. - Does he? - Yeah. - Never seen it. I like that. Tell me about Kevin Johnson and Dan Marley. - Dan was a gift, man, because he worked so hard not only on his body, but he worked so hard on and off the floor, man, with the community and also, you know, the way he worked out and took care of his body. So a young cat like me, he's just like, I'm all right, that's what I need to do. This is what the difference between high school and pro training is. This is the motto. Kevin was a blessing 'cause he always kept you humble. Like, man, they can take this away like this. You know? And Kevin at that time was a permanent all-star. - Yep. - And bless his mom, she just passed away. But, and we still hang out now. Like, I DJ at his restaurants and just them teaching. You know, I just wish the communication with funds and money between players was more prevalent. You know, 'cause like, I never understood how, like, I love Kareem and how Kareem throw through money troubles and magic. And just like with Mike, and then Scottie went through money troubles with Mike. Like, yo, that's your counter. That's your Batman and Robin. When you grab him, you're like, yo, check this out. I'm about to do this, that, and the other. And sometimes it's, you know, I just wish that we as a unit, we did that a little bit more. We do it now after we get out the game. - Yeah. - But when we in it, we should do more 'cause we can do a lot of things. - I mean, I just feel like financial literacy wasn't a conversation at that time. Especially when you, and it wasn't even in our time. I felt like I got out at 17. And I felt like those conversations were happening and had in the locker room around that time. So I know now it's a real conversation, but it wasn't a con. We was talking about women, jewelry, cars, rims, all the shit that don't matter. - And then the dollar amount. - Increased. - It's corporation money now. Instead of me taking, like, my money was cool to take care of me and moms and my kids. After that, you know what I'm saying? I'm like, hey, auntie, uncles, I can't, you know, I can't do it. But now you're talking three, 400 a year. With the soccer dude to do soccer, you make 200. Plus a year, man, it's crazy. And I think that's the difference in the play of the game too. Like I got criticized about Curry not being able to do what he did in my era, because you got Oakleys and Masons and Buck Williams that are making a hundred thousand and you making what you making and you shoot a 50 footer. You get touched up in the locker room. I know y'all have Max on here a lot. He talk about that. People getting into fights. People getting into fights with each other and Keem slapping the shit out of them and all that. Because it's the dollar amount. So if I'm making 60 to 80, shoot that shit step. I don't give a fuck. Like I'm making 60 to 80. I don't have to, I don't have to lose teeth to make what those guys was making. I don't have to go through that era. Obviously he has the skills to do it. He would have been a definitely prominent player in our league, but I just think that the dollar amount makes it a lot easier for somebody who's not playing. Like I thought NIL would fuck up college because if Matt is at UCLA making two million and I'm eating top ramen, I'm taking Matt out. I'm a college player. - Yeah. - I'm taking Matt out 'cause I'm starving. And this dude is in the Bentley and he gonna still get his two million, but now I get to play a little bit more and maybe I'm not starving no more. - But I think RJ, you know what I'm saying? This generation came up different 'cause man, we wasn't all friends coming up. We didn't know who each other was 'til we got in the gym. Like this generation, they know each other since grassroots and everybody's cool. But that's a good point. I didn't think about that side. Motherfucker make a bunch of money. - Yeah. - Fuck it. Got the bread. - Right. - And that's what I was talking about. I'm gonna cut you off, but that's the reason why we always talk about the competition level going down. The money's made. Even before now, even before you get to the NBA, they going to the NBA with four, five million from NIL. - Yeah. - Like the effort and just the passion to want to be great or to eat what you kill, you don't have the attitude no more. You're not at eight. - Yeah. - You're not at eight. Did you play against any of those UNLV teams in the '90s, in the Big West? - Yeah, yeah, man. We took them out once on the buzzer, Stacey and his squad. Me and Stacey grew up together. So Stacey took me out in the high school championship game. - He's a couple years older than you? - Same. - Same year? - Yeah, we're the same. As a matter of fact, our birthdays are days apart from each other. - Really? - Yeah, yeah. - We lost. - Huh? - Y'all gave them that only loss. That was on ESPN. - Yeah, yeah, yeah. - I watched that game. I remember that shit. - Yeah. - Yeah. - And then the game before that, Greg Anthony banked a half court in Vegas to beat us. So that was our ultimate game, you know what I mean? Us and being able to play in poly against UCLA. Those are our-- I'm telling my grandkids I played against UCLA. I'm telling my grandkids I played against UCLA. I'm telling my grandkids I played against LA and Las Vegas. You know, if I don't go anywhere else besides playing, you know, college basketball. So yeah. Yeah, I got-- I mean, Larry was-- I knew Larry from Texas 'cause I'm a part-time Texas kid. Mom's grew up in East Texas, so-- - Where at? - Kilgore-Longview. - Longview, okay. - Yeah, so I had to-- Two weeks before school's out, I'm shipped to make the family reunion, and I'm there the whole time. And that's where I fell in love with the three most hated teams in, you know, the Lakers. - Yeah, yeah, yeah. - Cowboys and the Yankees, you know, just because we had two, maybe three television stations, and you catch a baseball game on a Saturday, they had the Cubs, which was on CBS, which was foggy, and then you had the Yankees that played every Saturday. And obviously, LA kid growing up, being a Laker fan, but everything was cowboy, cowboy, cowboy. - Yup. - Everything was cowboys in Texas, man. - To this day. - And every kid played football. - Horrible. Horrible decision. - Come on, man. Come on. You're basic. You gotta be-- - I'm a Niner fan. - I give you, y'all five. Y'all can ride the ride. - Yeah. - Y'all can ride the ride. I don't allow nobody else to talk to us. Niners, and then the two teams that got us, Steelers and then New England. - That's it. - Everybody else, y'all can't say nothing. - Is this your guys' year this year? - No. - Every year. - I never say that. - Okay. - I never say that. - I say every year. - This is what it is. - You're a realist. You're a realist. - I said you every year. - I said that. - Every year. - You can't hate on us. - Every year. We ain't got one since '95, and we still-- - Man, it's been a minute. - The most expensive team. - Yeah. - The most followed team. When they play here in SoFi in LA, it's gonna be a home game. - That's a big crowd. - Yeah. - It's gonna be a home game. - When I saw that, I'm like, "That's crazy." They got more Cowboy fans in LA than they do Rams fans. - Yeah. That's the wonderful thing, and it's shocking when I got traded to LA for the Lakers, is we only got booed one place running out that tunnel, and that was Boston. That was the only place, and this was before Sacramento had the beef for Phil and the Cowbells and all that, so we play Sacramento. It's a home game. We play Golden State. It's a home game. We play Phoenix. We play any of. It's a home game for the Lakers, man. It's crazy. And that was me growing up. As a Laker, I think I lost to Boston one time my whole career. In Miami. In Miami when I played for Pat. Which is ironic 'cause I watched him the whole time. But only lost to Boston one time, man. And that's just a kid growing up as a Laker fan hating Boston. - What was your first year in the league? - '90. - So you caught a little bit of Larry Bird then? - Yeah. Like I was saying, when I checked in the game, I went to go greet the OGs. And he's standing in front of our bench. And he played, his rookie year was with Paul Westphal, our assistant at the time. So I check in the game. I'm not supposed to guard Larry, but I'm like, I'm in the garden. I'm speaking to fucking Larry fucking Bird. So I went up, "How you doing, man?" And he had his hand on his hip. And he turned to Paul Westphal and was like, "You gotta be fucking kidding me. I know you ain't got this motherfucker guarding me." And I was like, "Phew, so I'm gonna guard somebody else over here because," you know what I'm saying? And just the swag of him, man. Just the way he carried himself. And that's when he was coming down. So you can imagine when he was pure, pure Larry Magic, man. He just was, you know. - You handled that the right way. That would've been totally different for me. Fuck you, nigga. I wouldn't shake your mother again anyway. Let's talk about Barkley, bro. Hall of Famer. - Yeah. - Round Mounder, Rebound, they called him. Speak on y'all relationship, man. 'Cause a lot of people see Chuck on TV. They see all the work he's done, but nobody really hear him talk or really know him or hang out with him. I got a chance to hang out with him a couple times. He's super cool. But you got a great relationship with him. Can you talk about it? - Yeah, yeah. First, getting him to practice was pulling teeth. - Just getting him there. - To the way he plays and the fact that he never practiced. Three years we together. I'm like, how does he do it? Like, you know what I mean? And. - So just won't come or just won't practice? - No, he'd be there to practice. And then, you know, we'll stretch and he'll stretch and make jokes about this or that and the other. And then when it's time to get down, he's in the hot tub in the locker room or he's on the pedal bike or he's just having a conference. He's having his own press conference with the media. But it didn't stop him from killing. - Right. - Yeah. - You know? It was a point where he was that far from being the number one player in the league, like in the world, man. Like, he really had a run. When he got to us, Dream Team, I got to go to, he invited me to Barcelona. Went to Barcelona and kind of watched that whole thing. Shots out to Leah Wilcox. She got, just got in the Hall of Fame. She kind of hooked it up where I could be behind the scenes. - He led that team in scoring too, didn't he? - Man. - The Dream Team? - Man. - At like 17 points a game or something like that? - Balling. Then he, we went to the finals. And then, you know, all of that. And he just, just a good dude. And you surprising, you saying you hang out with him, you'd be surprised on the status of him. Obviously, I was shocked when I'm in the spot and I see him like, "What you doing here?" I'm like, "Madonna? You done brought Madonna to the hood club?" Like, you know? That type of thing is just wild, you know? And the fact that if you hang out with him, he never makes you feel small, you know? We in Chicago and obviously Mike and Singletary. Walter Payton and Amal Rashad. And I can go on and on with the Chicago greats. Hey, hey, y'all know my teammate Cesar Ballas or some such. I mean, he really makes you feel, you know, he takes over a room and he really makes you feel wanted. During the season, my mom and my brother called me. We got to go to a game and my pops pass away. And I didn't tell nobody. I was going to tell him, you know, I got to go home, take care of moms right after the game. But how he found out, I had no idea. And we won the game. And in the huddle, he said something. And I didn't really break down until he said something. And the fact I was just like, "Damn, man." Like, you Charles, man. You don't got no reason to be with the fuddy duddies like me. But the fact that I don't know how he found out, I never want to ask him. But the fact that he found out and said that to the team, man, was dope. And anytime you need him, really need him, he there for you. From borrowing a watch to giving you a ride somewhere or, you know, it's just a really good dude. And he deserves everything he got. He runs his mouth in a great way and sometimes bad, sometimes good. We all do. But he's all entertaining. You can't turn that dude off. You can't turn him off. I walked in the bar in Chicago in Big 3. And I think he was there for something. And I walked in the bar like, "What's up, Jack?" I'm like, "What's up, Walker? How you doing, man?" "Yeah, he's with me." I'm like, "What's up, Jack?" He just told the bar, "He's with me. I'm going to sit at the weigh-in. He's with me." Everybody coming in, "He's with me. I got him, too." He's just taking care of everybody in there, bro. That's love. '93 season, broken foot in game six in the Western Finals against the Sonics. How nice was that combination of GP and Kemp? And how do you feel about Kemp not being in the Hall of Fame? Yeah, let's start with GP, man. We grew up battling Skyline and all that as kids. Obviously, he was playing, I wasn't. But I was always amazed on how he could commentate, narrate, negotiate, help the popcorn man with his popcorn, and just that whole thing at the whole time, playing the point, and just running shit, man. He just was unbelievable. And so we was really tight and cool and knew each other. And I wish Seattle won. I wish Seattle never left the league. And Sean Kemp, man. And I don't know, man. It's a lot of people that should be ticked. Not Sean Marion, Sean Kemp. I mean, I can go on and on. The guys that should be in the Hall of Fame, Kevin Johnson. But Sean-- Kevin Johnson not in the Hall of Fame? Nah, nah. It's crazy, right? I didn't know that. Yeah, Dan Morley, they not in the Hall of Fame, man. Shouts out to the committee on whoever's involved in that. But you know. What's the criteria? Yeah. And it may be if you liked or not. Like, I know Barry Bonds going through it now. Like, you know, his number's supposed to-- whether they call it a scandal or not, you know. And it's tough, you know. It's supposed to be your whole career of basketball. There's sometimes the voters, man, it's like-- They don't like you. They don't like you. From high school on, now they're just making it your pro now. You're a certain way to the people who got a chance. And they go, ah, he didn't give me this interview, or this, that, and the other. They got feelings involved in people's careers. Yeah, a lot of feelings. I think the players should be the common denominator on any league. The players should be able to say, this cat should go or not. Yep. Right. You know. And that, you know. Well, yeah, Sean, man, being a young kid, an athletic Indiana kid, man, that's just athletic, can run. Him and Gary had that team, you know. And they had a team that could contend, but just couldn't get over the hump. You know. I saw him in the last-- in the last stand saying, you know, we could have did this. I mean, Mike was dangerous. But you really had to bring it when you're playing against those two. Whether they, you know, tired or sleepy or not, they going to play hard. And they going to give you some highlights, man. How well were you playing up to that point when you broke your foot? Because you said earlier, obviously, breaking your foot was a huge loss to your team against the Bulls. Yeah. So how well were you playing that season? Oh, I was killing, man. I was like the second or third leading scorer, second rebounder. Mm-hmm. You know, I was perfect because I didn't need no plays. You know, you get 20, 20, 40. And then, you know, we had times where Charles would be out or KJ would be out. And I'm in the 40s, easy, without no plays. Like, nobody saying run set with the curl or run this. I'm just out there just getting numbers. So and my numbers was really high against Scottie. You know, they was in the over 25 a game, easy, every time against Scottie. So you add that factor in. And like I said, I've never been on that stage. So it might have been some nervousness. You never know. But-- Yeah. And then again, it might be a breakout. It might have been a breakout, you know? Might have been more of the same. Why do you think you had such good success against Scottie? Scottie's an on-ball defender. You know, Mike, an on-ball defender. And I don't have the ball. You know, you saw what Scottie did. He changed the finals in '91 by guarding Magic, you know, taking them, making them, you know, that clock running down. After game one, Magic torched him. And he like, yo, Scottie, you get him. So now he twisting them. He got the ball. I don't-- I never had a ball more than catching a lay or catching a shot, you know? If I dribble the ball more than twice, call the police because I'm doing something wrong. You know? I didn't have all this shake and bake and handle and all that. I'm a finisher. You set it up, I'm going to finish it. And I think that's why I got off against Stacey's and Scottie Pippen's and guys like that because they couldn't, you know, off the ball. You can't guard. But you can't see. Right. Movement. How nice was Richard Dumas? Oh, man. Doom Boom was sick, man. It's unfortunate. You know, he played one year in the league. That was that one year. Boing-oings. One year. What did he have, like 18 a game or 19 a game? He came to us halfway through the season when he was 14 and 1. That was actually his second year, his rookie season. He failed a drug test. And Jerry pulled some strings where he can go hang out with Lucas and not record his rookie year. So then when we brought him back off of that son's song so-called suspension it was 15 games into it and he just added they put him right in the starting lineup um and i used to try to hang out with him and just like hell man stay off that powder stay off that wool and um it was just a tough struggle i'm it is an addiction i have no idea what he was going through because i've never been addicted to any drug or something like that and uh and it's a struggle it's a day-to-day struggle and some days he would have good days and some days he would have bad but but far as on the basketball court i saw him jump over my new bowl you know i'm saying i saw him do some crazy things i remember in the post i'm guarding him in the post and you know you throw the ball kind of high and you jump and then when you come down the spin move is worthy-ish and i'm still standing looking this way and he's you dunking the ball already like he had some skills man 17 shoes so he had boing he had huge hands he can maneuver the ball like jordan and dr j and connie hawkins uh but this is just a tough situation he's doing good now i see him all the time in phoenix that's good and uh coach is a girl's team and just satisfied with himself that's the big thing that's the big thing he has peace with himself and and uh that's what's most important that he's still with us and he's at peace with himself this football season is going to be a lot of fun and i'm going to see you next this football season is in full swing and we're partnering with this football season is in full swing and we're partnering with draftkings to share an amazing new draftkings to share an amazing new draftkings to share an amazing new offer with you drafting sports is now offer with you drafting sports is now offer with you drafting sports is now available in all 50 states going coast available in all 50 states going coast available in all 50 states going coast to coast from california to new york to coast from california to 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crown is yours as far as the finals go how tough was as far as the finals go how tough was as far as the finals go how tough was that sitting back and watching your team that sitting back and watching your team that sitting back and watching your team yeah it's mike and them yeah it was yeah it's mike and them yeah it was yeah it's mike and them yeah it was tough man especially because you know tough man especially because you know tough man especially because you know playing against michael and you knowing playing against michael and you knowing playing against michael and you knowing what i can do out there against scotty what i can do out there against scotty what i can do out there against scotty and uh and and and uh and and and uh and and uh you know uh you know uh you know y'all experience the finals man them y'all experience the finals man them y'all experience the finals man them lights is bright lights is bright lights is bright and everybody out there and doesn't like and everybody out there and doesn't like and everybody out there and doesn't like it you know tickets is in demand and it you know tickets is in demand and it you know tickets is in demand and family members is on you and all that family members is on you and all that family members is on you and all that and it's just you see all kind of and it's just you see all kind of and it's just you see all kind of celebrities and stars and and that's all celebrities and stars and and that's all celebrities and stars and and that's all they talking about you know when we they talking about you know when we they talking about you know when we played that year in phoenix played that year in phoenix played that year in phoenix uh when we played the town the state uh when we played the town the state uh when we played the town the state shut down shut down you can get free shut down shut down you can get free shut down shut down you can get free guys you can rob a bank and they'd be guys you can rob a bank and they'd be guys you can rob a bank and they'd be like the sun game was on i don't know like the sun game was on i don't know like the sun game was on i don't know who the guys was they you know they came who the guys was they you know they came who the guys was they you know they came in they took the money and they left um in they took the money and they left um in they took the money and they left um prime example we lost prime example we lost prime example we lost in the finals and we had 600 000 people I've never been back. Damn. You never, you think you, you know, that's my third year in the league, so you're like, I'm going to get back. I'm going to get another one. Never. And I had some great teams. I had some dope Laker teams that probably could have did it. I had a dope Miami team that might have done something. But trying to get back is, you know, even to this day, man, watching y'all pop champagne, I'm like, damn, what that shit tastes like. And then one of the guys who deserved, you know, after a long time, when KG won that shit, I'm fucking crying like a baby, man, for him. The Ray Allens and the Pauls and, you know, when Giannis won a couple years back and then KD got his. And, you know, because that's the wonderful thing about our fraternity. We know deep down inside, we may not talk about it, but we know the feeling of winning. You guys experience, obviously, on the highest level, but we know that feeling of winning and what it means to you and what you put into it and what it can bring. What winning can bring you. And I hadn't had that taste of championships since my first year in junior college, and I'm thirsting for it, you know, trying to get it back. Yeah. You get a chance to come back to L.A., come home, traded to the Lakers in 94. Fresh off the plane, you lead the team in scoring at nearly 22 a game. Yeah. 94-95 All-Star. That team, Vladi, Van Axel, Eddie Jones, how did you blend in, and what was it like playing for the Lakers? It was weird at first, because, you know, you're a Laker. Grew up being a Laker fan, and then I got my childhood friend, rest in peace, Elton Campbell, on the team. Y'all grew up together? Yeah, yeah, yeah. We grew up together, so let's back it up to draft day. Big smooth. Yeah, big smooth. And we, Jerry West was like, we got the last pick. We're going to pick you. If you don't get, if you're still on the board. You know, y'all went through it. If you're still on the board, we're going to pick you. And I'm thinking, okay, you know, ain't going to happen. And the last pick, and they, you know, Lakers select Elton Campbell. I'm crying, but I'm happy at the same time. Because I'm, you know, Elton grew up Englewood, Morningside High, right there. And so I walk out. I'm in Houston. I'm living in Houston at that time. So I walk out the house crying and shit. And, but I'm like, damn, Elton going home. Like, that's so dope. You know, and then my brother came out. He didn't really say nothing to me, but he knew how I felt being a Hooper too. And then mom's gangster. She just came out and was like, no, get your ass back in here. This is what you want to do. We manning, we manning up around here. Let's go. And so, you know, being, coming home to LA was dope, man. You know, even though I played in Phoenix, man, I lived in the hood. 46th and Western, I'm, I'm, I'm in the jungles. I'm, I'm, you know, I'm still like just NBA cat doing these places. He ain't supposed to be, but so it was fun for me, man. I had a blast. Nick was dope. Eddie was dope. Uh, uh, Vladi's communication. That's a young Vladi, right? He's fresh over. Yeah. He's young and he, and he, he was the only one, he was the oldest on the team, but he had a family, you know, he married with kids. So, you know, our little young crew was just perfect. Jerry did a great, great job on putting that team together. And obviously they had tanked and was terrible the year before when magic was coaching and, uh, Nick got dropped in the draft too. So he had a little chip on his shoulder too. Anthony Peeler wanted to prove himself. So we came out, man, and, and guns blazing, man. And, and, and shocked some people. Um, I, and you know, that's arguably my best year. I got an MVP vote. Yeah. So like second rounder, getting the MVP vote, man. I was on, you know what I'm saying? Come on, man. I mean, you're supposed to be here. They can't tell us nothing. You can't tell us nothing. And it's just the fact that I'm home doing it. Right. I'm home doing it. You know, the, the, the great thing about it, I can go anywhere in LA, man, and be more than welcome. And I watched magic do it. And I watched, uh, B Scott, my big bro do it. Uh, so I kind of was ready for it. I was ready for LA. You do a thing. You got a, uh, half a season with Shaq and Kobe that 96, 97 season before you got traded back to Phoenix. Uh, what was that like? Obviously Kobe, you know, Dale Harris, wasn't really a fan of rookies Shaq coming from Orlando with the big deal to the Lakers. What was that energy like around that team before you got off? Yeah. Before I got drafted, my, um, my agent was my cousin, uh, Tony Bryant. And he told, he told me like, yo, we got a cousin. That's dope. He oversees right now, but he, he gonna come home. And when he come home and he gonna take Philly by storm. And I, so I knew about Kobe and being in the family. Right. But then, uh, when we draft. them i was like oh so i go to the press conference and and the fact that how mature kobe was at 17 17 was bananas like it's like i'm i'm i'm an all-star i got mvp votes i've been in the league and i'm trying to teach young fella and he teaching me yeah just converse our first conversation is he teaching me and and he said something to me like you know i'm trying to make my own so let's just keep this bloodline where it is so i can make my own so you know salute to that i didn't really mention it or bring it up and uh i wouldn't say it was cocky it's just confidence man that he knew you know he had the ability to do some things in this league you got the cousins yeah yeah great great grandfather is is uh that's how we relate it so the fact that his people thought it was an arrogance but it was just a it's just him man uh shots and that he would do in practice obviously piss dell off like i saw him miss a 360 dunk on shack i heard about that he tried a 360 on yeah and i'm not talking fast break 360. i'm talking we we have court running sets so he comes across the middle he comes across the middle and tries it and shaq being shaq 300 gave him one of these that's why he you know ended up this but he would have got him if it if it was a skinnier thinner player yeah he would have got a 360 in half court offense you know what i'm saying and uh it shut down practice obviously dale got mad and eddie went running out and all this it was just like sheesh like this is crazy uh but you saw the work that i think you saw what he can do and i'm i'm talking to y'all that really get on kobe a lot man it's almost sacrilegious now to you excuse my language no please say we were just talking about it yesterday that jump on showboats back now that he's gone should we man the up you if you didn't like him say you didn't like him don't jump on because politically you got it because he passed away he passed and i i hear talking about him all the time man i'm like thinking you didn't like kobe didn't like you like why you and i get it but you wasn't talking to when he was here you weren't talking that when he was here and all that i've i had jack and all that you had these you saying y'all had y'all didn't win with so all that y'all just right he's just not here to to to yeah defend himself bro and it's sad but we're gonna do it because we know what was going on in real time all y'all was church monsters when cobra was out here and i don't even think he would take the time to defend himself he's that type of dude like yeah let them say what they want they know i got five yeah at the time i got i had a little mama so we spent a lot of time at disneyland and you would see him every time we went to disneyland him and vanessa being dead because they lived down the street and you know they just run to go get on the ride and then go back home and it's that and the other so uh off the floor he just was genuine i i mean you hear the stories about you and your little twins and how he treated y'all and didn't have to and and that's what pisses me off more because y'all y'all own this dude you don't really know and y'all don't really know you know and to this day i mean it's vanessa picked up where cope because cope started giving the boy shoes at like four or five years old just just two days ago vanessa texted me hey did the boys get the so-and-so pack i'm like nah he's oh i got shoes like you know it's still because she knew how much they like still to this day she's picking up but that's the one thing i take pride in and really hold close that i got to see the other side similar to you you got to see the other side you saw the the killer on the court but you got to see the man off the court and the dad and and just how cool he was and that's why me and him be sticking up for him so much because there's just there's so much going on yes and dumb going on because you wasn't saying none of this dumb weak jealous when he was here yeah now you want to say yeah yeah and and uh and he was a good dude yeah he was like he's a good misunderstood real good dude michico did kobe have to go through any rookie hazing no we was kind of off of that you know we we had a lake show had this thing would we shoot you know pre-game or or stuff like that where you had to grab a gatorade but it only if you only if you lost a shooting match so we was kind of all for that we didn't really have to haze him or nothing like that and he was a cool dude man like i said he was uh he's really mature um him and derrick fisher and travis knight was a great bunch to come in with each other they looked after each other they was on that third squad uh and you know you've been on third i don't know if you've ever been on the third squad before that's what we hung the third squad i was on the third squad in miami boy trying to eat that's probably where i made my biggest mistake as a player man i got in a fight with with bud man tim hardaway man just because i'm on the third squad and trying to get no burn and and you know what i'm saying and i love tim to death and we should have never came to blows but uh it just it's frustrating sometimes but with cobe travis and derek on that third squad they kind of united man it made it real dangerous like you know y'all better bring it because this third squad is a beast well that's what people don't understand i don't even think the dudes in the league understand anymore what practices used to be like like we used to get after it and fight there'll be fights in practice sometimes but like they would reel that first and second you know like you said the second unit didn't bring it that third unit got a chance like it's you most dudes are fighting for their lives second round picks free agents trying to make a team hard value in a heartbeat but the practice used to be tougher than the games yeah yeah uh without a doubt and i think the biggest thing if you had a player who would compete in practice like uh you know like mike you know mike would practice like like i told y'all before charles was gone so if you're on the third squad in phoenix you ain't got no shot at that four spot because one he's he's unbelievable but second you ain't got no chance to go at charles because he never in practice you know what i'm saying so you end up you know going at somebody else you know joe klein or somebody like that shaq do any nasty in the locker room you know what that has done a lot of nasty in locker rooms because every time somebody acts that's the reaction they got a situation big old kid him him shaquille and fetus man i don't know what the like he always want to play with you know what i mean he always want to play with people's shoes man he'd be in the bathroom and he'd wipe his ass he'd be like look look look like in the lock i'm like what the what's wrong with like but but uh good dude too just just a practical joker he want to be the life of the party and laugh and um and really put himself in a situation where he's lovable in his mind he's 6-1 yeah yeah you know what i'm saying he walk around like he's six and one yeah and and and we talked about how people talk that about kobe and stop talking about shaq shaq was the nicest if he was mean oh lord y'all lucky wasn't me y'all lucky he wasn't me like we we and i was in dallas rest in peace nelly uh and nelly you know he got kooky said you guarding you starting you're gonna guard yourself what the we end up winning the game but the fact of the matter is we win the game because shaq was nice to me you know what i'm saying i didn't hack a shack powerful i just don't tell me don't tell me don't tell me don't throw me across the street shack like that type of thing and we was boys so you know uh that's probably why we won the game but if shaq wanted to rip my head off what what are we gonna do even even the beast modes man david you see what he did all these you know what i'm saying like man if shaq got mean if shaq got mean think about his shack if shaq pops wasn't shaq pops and he had a chip on his a single mother chip on his shoulder if he was if he drank or smoked or don't get him don't get him on that brown liquor he's gonna have more kids and more fights don't get shack off the brown liquor now but that's a great point i mean he's always keeps everything light and then when the game comes he would turn it on but if he was just an mean dude it would have been scary for the whole world everybody yeah i'm gonna give you some names let me know how significant they were in your life wilt chamberlain oh the big dipper man me and my brother we always fight for the big dipper uh the fact that he has uh you know the ability to sprint and you know they some films are coming out now showing him around the floor and it's like man uh just phenomenal the way he carried himself um the day i got two two two scenes with wilt uh the day i got uh i shot my video at venice beach uh he was up there playing paddle ball and i saw him and i was like holy and i hadn't met him met him yet you know but i already got traded to lakers and i happen to have a basketball in my car so me and my little homeboy pookie wigginton we run to the car to go get the uh basketball and i stopped his game and the fact that he knew my name and all that man it just you know just praises he saw he never signs but he signed it it was dope and then when i had my incident man and i came back to the team with the lakers he was sitting in the uh locker room and and he just really guided me on how to handle it and um you don't have to you know don't throw moms under the bus don't throw nobody on the bus you you don't have to tell this press just you know you you you did it you up and your reasoning is good. He said, tell Dr. Buss and tell Jerry. And he said, it's up to you to tell your teammates. But everybody else, you don't really got to go into the details and stuff like that. And that was dope of Wilt, man, for him to say that to me. That's crazy. You know, Wilt Easy. Boy, you got some stories, bro. Yeah, man. Yeah, man. I played with a gang of Hall of Famers, too, man. Magic. Wilt Easy. Like, that's the people like that. Yeah, Magic, Barkley, Tim, Lonzo, Dirk, Nash. Shit. Dennis Rodman. What about Dennis? Dennis. When Dennis came to Dallas, man, I was like a little puppy following him around because I wanted to get back to a championship. And Nelly had me in this, we tanking right now. But I'm like, okay, Q-Bank. Q-Bank bought the team. He brought in Dennis. So I followed Dennis everywhere and tried to work out like he worked out and keep up because he championship status. He had won in Detroit. He won in Chicago. I was trying to figure out, you know, the missing piece. What do we need? Because we had Finley. We had Nash. We had Dirk. Gary Trent was on and off. He could have been that, but he wasn't. And Big Sean Bradley. So we had a capability of putting something together. Yeah. So I followed Dennis around to try to get some of that championship aura off of him. But he was gone, man. He was already in party mode. He was living with Cuban, too, wasn't he? Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, we interviewed Mark. He told us. Yeah, he was already a rock star, man. He would come in while we're in the meeting and take a shower and then be in the weight room, clink, clink, clink, clink, while we're going. And he would know everything. He would know everything we talked about and know the codes and the calls we're going to read. He would know all that stuff. He came to me one time during the game. We were sitting on the bench, man. He was like, you're a fucking genius. And he never spoke. He never really spoke. But he was like, you're a fucking genius. I was like, what you talking about? He's like, they don't run no fucking plays for you. They still get one. I was like, yeah, it is what it is. Like, you know, it is what it is. And he's like, that's crazy right there that you, you know, top 20 in scoring and you don't got no plays. Like, that's bananas. So he was weird. But he. I call him a genius because at his size to be able to maneuver and doing the things that he was doing on the court, man, he was, he was dope, man. And he was in the Jordan Dome, too. You know, he was in the Jordan Dome, too, giving people business. So Zeke Thomas rookie year. Don't know him from Jack. Obviously, I'm a fan of Zeke. And I didn't play that day in Detroit, my rookie year. But he pulled me aside. And, uh, young fella and just ran it down to me for about an hour. Really? Yeah. About money ran it down to me. We talked about that. He ran. He's like, if you pull up in the 300 bands, she ain't gonna care if it's a 600 bands. So don't go spend two, 300 on the 600 when you can go get. Cause at that time I'm making a buck 50. So, you know, I'm, I'm, I'm in Jeep Cherokee and Mustang. So, but he was just saying like, you know, he's like, I know you're going to go get some shine. Ain't nobody going to come up to you and don't want no diamond thing. And be like, is this diamond real? Like, so don't, don't, don't, don't, don't go do that. Young fella. Don't do that. Let the ones that's making millions and millions and millions to do that. You, you making 150,000. Half of it gone anyway. 75 is left. You got to take care of mama. He really broke financial stuff down to me, man. And he didn't have to, man. And he didn't have to. And I'm just, you know, it's tough. He got a bad rap right now with the whole thing that's going on with Jordan. And, you know, bird. And when he did with bird and Rodman said that about bird would just an average player if he was black. But, uh, but Zeke, man, he, he really care about the league and he care about his brother. We just seen him together playing golf. So that was beautiful to see. Jan Rose, what, um, Isaiah and Zeke together for a golf tournament. That's dope. Isaiah and, uh, Oakley, excuse me. Moses Malone. Big Mo. Uh, I get drafted and I get, uh. Yeah, I miss these dudes, man. He was, he was so solid. I'm living in Houston. I get drafted and I go to a press conference and I come back to Houston and they invite us to the Bahamas to play in the, like a little celebrity game. And I got to sit next to Moses Malone, uh, cause I saw him at the church. Uh, second Baptist, what it was. Second Baptist. Yeah. Second Baptist. That's where they used to rank the runs. Keem and everybody in Houston, Clyde and everybody. And, uh, 45 minutes into the flight, I had no clue. What he said, but I know he was talking to me, but I didn't just say, cause I do this and he's teaching me. And then they started playing cards and then I started getting, but, uh, he kind of did the same thing he did to Charles. Me, you got to work hard. This is professional and, uh, anything that you need. Uh, even when I was in Houston, he sent the car over like here, you can have this car while you're here in Houston training, this, that, and the other really good dude, uh, uh, came really close with his son cause we almost had. Just saying, man, he's about five years younger than me. And, uh, a little more junior man, which was, was dope, man. He just, we had a lot of great dudes, man. I know that I'm, I'm, I'm an outside looking in now at the young guys now, but, uh, we just had a lot of great dudes that would take guys that second rounders or guys like us, you know what I'm saying? Who not really supposed to be in the league and just, you know, take us under their wing, man. And be like, look here, you can do some things in this league, man. 2003. When I was playing with the Spurs. Before that, the year we won the championship that summer, uh, pop made me and Tim and I think Tony go down and David go down to play runs at Fundy. Moses was still running the runs, bro. Still picking the team, still playing. Yeah. He was still running shit, bro. And he was like five years retired then. He was still running the runs, but it doesn't, there's that respect he had. Everybody loved him, bro. Everybody loved him. I like, I had, I had some great conversation with him as a youngster. And people forget he was a high schooler too. Yeah. Him and Darryl, they, they forget about them that they, you know, obviously Cove and KG and all that. But these guys was high schoolers, man, you know, coming out, doing it. You know what it says about you though? When I, when I'm hearing though is the type of person you are because every star you came across show love and they didn't have to to you. Like you said, you were a second round pick. They could have just ignored you. Yeah. But it showed, I think the character and, and, and how hard you worked and who you were as a person. Yeah. Because they all tried to give you some gang. Yeah. I love our league, man. I love the brotherhood. I love everything about what we do, the way we carry each other, even the rivalries. I love it. Just, uh, it's a, it's a wonderful game. It's a game that you can work on by yourself. You don't need nobody. We got the best entertainment value because I can buy a ticket and sit next to Michael while he's doing his thing. You can't do that with Joe Montana. No. You can't do that with SCA. You can't do that with Tyson. You can't, you know what I'm saying? Baseball. You can't do that with Barry Bonds and Judge and all that. You got to be up in the stands. Like I can sit right here and be like, this thing got a tattoo. And he's sweating and he's arguing with Jack about how we're going to come off the screen. And you can't do that in no other sport, man. You got to, you got to be away. Tennis, golf. You might see Tiger for one hole, but you're not allowed to follow him. You're not allowed to follow him. You just get that one hole and then he tees off and he gone. AC Green. If you look like AC Green, bitch don't call him anymore. Junior. The Jerry girl. Junior. First NBA player I met. He was the first NBA player I met. It was the night Hank died. I saw the news. I sprinted to Hank's house in Loyola. Are you still in college at that time? I'm still in college at this time. I'm a senior. You know, senior year. So, uh, and me and bank was, was, was tight. You know, we played on the, uh, West LA team together in college program, whatever. How good was he? Hank? Oh man. He was a hard worker. I mean, he led the nation in scoring and rebounding. It's been two other dudes. Xavier McDaniels, I think did that as well, which people forget about the X-Men did that. And, um, he knew he had shot defense. He knew he had some deficiencies that he had to fix to get in the league, but he worked his ass out and, uh, so I'm sprinting to Hank's house to be like, what is going on and I stop at a seven 11 and I'm crying and, and AC green, they just finished the game cause they had a game that night over in Ladera and I'm stopping to, uh, by Loyola and AC's right now I'm like, oh shit, AC green and he saw me crying and he, I think he, I don't know. He knew me, but he knew why I was crying because of the height. And he's like, oh yeah, it's tough, man. We heard about that during the game by Hank and he slapped me five and I just like, oh shit, you know, AC green. I ended up being his teammate three times and, you know, with, uh, Phoenix, Dallas and Miami, uh, and just a good friend, man. You know, when I was going through my troubles, you know, AC was there on the phone, on the, on the plane coming, I'm coming, I'm on my way, you know, uh, we got a couple hours off. in the LA company. of hugs and conversation and he fired back the phoenix solid you know just just a good dude man just a good dude and i and i never even thought about until you just said it on how my characters that these individuals who are way up there you know bring it on down and to make sure that i'm i'm straight so volume that's solid michael jackson the cane uh i met michael at um magic's opening of them theaters okay magic johnson theaters and me uh big eldon and at that time vivica fox and eldon campbell was dating so we we just finished practice and um we starving and magic got food for everybody but it's not time you're not opening the food yet so we sneaking wings every now and then so us three are in the corner and mike come slivering his way through no security no bodyguards no fanfare or nothing magic is saying a speech and we start laughing because we thought it was impersonator because when you first see michael jackson you you like this do this you know what i'm saying you in your mind he's seven foot tall it's just like the lord you think the lord is you know this giant but you know this you go to jerusalem and this casket is this little bitty carpenter you know i'm saying so when i saw him i just thought it was a personator i was like why is he about to perform or this that another i just thought but when he jumped on stage and max was like yo you made it and me and vivica and eldon was like oh damn this i'm like a jackson so um they say their speeches and then they break off and uh again no bodyguards no nothing so i'm following them i'm i'm i'm gonna meet michael jackson some of that or you need some of that man i need a little bit just rub a little bit off of me so uh he go into a theater he don't everybody can watch for free he don't like this movie and he come out and i go yeah i'll try to play it off you know what i'm saying he comes into another one we end up watching uh right next to each other he watched sandlot together so you know baseball the dog and you know he asked me that i want popcorn and you know you know i want some popcorn yeah yeah and you know what's crazy too is uh we we got our our sound system done at the same spot howard becker uh electronic entertainment y'all probably remember that it was on olympic and on la cienega and um uh myself snoop and warren g were the first ones to get to suburban with the tvs and all that and they kept cutting off and i was doing research it's the reason why i was cutting off because our alternator over here factory was too small so you got to get a bigger alternator mike had the same thing in his van kept cutting off all the stuff he got in the cup he had a refrigerator and my all were cut cutting off he didn't tell him to change the alternator he ended up shutting down on his way to never never land and the first kid who accused him of doing something that's how they met his pops pulled over to help the van out so i i kid with howard all the time like you cost this man 40 million dollars because you ain't telling him to put the alternator that he's supposed to have to get him all the way back to neverland and playing his music and stuff so yeah mike is dope man i'm happy for his family and this this uh i got to meet little jakar who played little michael jackson he killed that because i'm the venice beach league commissioner so he came out for the celebrity game and that was dope uh this movie is unbelievable and i can't wait to michael to come back yeah you had a couple health scares over the years was it icu uh dealing with covid yeah how are you now and um how did you get through that stuff yeah that's tough man when you're looking at death and and the doctors tell your family like yo get his affairs and you hearing this like yeah that's what hooked up the ventilators and everything and man no i didn't get to the ventilators they were just giving me air and i was on my belly for like 20 25 days just on my stomach lost like 50 60 pounds what was wrong uh i had covid for like 20 days and i was on my stomach lost like 50 60 pounds what was wrong uh i had covid for like 20 days and i was on my stomach lost like 50 60 pounds what was wrong uh i had covid for like 20 days and i was on my stomach pounds what was wrong uh i had covid for like 20 days and i got rid of that but then pneumonia yeah pneumonia took over and then it was kicking my ass man and um lost 50 60 pounds they turned me out over after they you know i got they turned me over and like we're gonna have you walk and the nurse turned her back it's crazy the nurse turned her back and i'm thinking everything is good i've turned her back it's crazy the nurse turned her back and i'm thinking everything is good i've turned her back and i'm thinking everything is good i've turned her back and i'm thinking everything is good i'll tear the whole room up man falling because i don't got no muscle i don't got nothing man just tearing it up so i had to relearn the walk i had to relearn to do a whole lot of shit you know i'm saying like that's when you know family is dope man you know i'm saying it's a poor system yeah man that's how you know your family is dope when you when you don't got nothing but yourself man and then somebody comes and they don't have to do that right and uh you know yeah man that was tough and then i had i owned the aba team uh in phoenix and i was only playing on sundays and i had pink uniforms and pink shoes breast breast cancer awareness every minute every point every rebound every dollar would go to breast cancer awareness and i um i had three heart attacks in a row and just out there balling i was like something feel weird so i sat down on the other team's bench it was like all right i'm gonna wait till halftime i'll try it again and i got dizzy again and uh and i started thinking first thing i started thinking was hank like fuck i'm going out like i like i i i wish hank was still here with us but i love the way he went out doing what he loves and they get caught a lob and went home every hooper every hooper we don't know our destiny where we gonna go but if i can catch a lob and then go home like it's that's i can just hug a basketball and lay a half court and go i would that would be great that's what i'm saying so that's what i started thinking about you know when i was going through my third how old were you late 30s 40s yeah yeah about that yeah because when did you when did you we didn't play together did we yeah i was on the mic when you was in phoenix that's how i met you and the fam and um yeah yeah yeah so that's all about that about that lady about 30 40. so that's what i was thinking about and then you know fortunately it wasn't my time one time for me to go he didn't want you yet yeah it didn't want to go that was a good that was a good squad y'all had a good time well remember amari got poked in the eye yeah missed the whole season yeah well that wasn't that that wasn't the uh the year after that they went to the western finals against the lakers okay what about when joe so remember we had his head i wasn't there okay we had uh uh terry porter for half a season they fired him first time in nba history toxic crusader yo yo how gangster is that that you have the all-star weekend in phoenix and you fired the head coach at all-star break but he just got hired at the beginning of the year but he in training camp i knew it was over this mother was having us doing indian runs with the ball over our head and shaq's like i'm ain't doing this what is this high school and it was just a struggle i knew it was a rap when he was like no alumni in the locker room i was like damn like you know what i mean because i loved the fact that connie hawkins was around wilt was around magic would come around before he came back with us like we always had ogs that we can lean on and be like hey man what's going on with this that and the other he wasn't having it he did it and they wasn't having it they got his ass out of there quick was was uh grant on the squad yeah yeah jimmy that no jimmy was gone but it was big for me because grant was one of magic and grant my favorite player then i took grant's starting spot that year and it was like hard for me like it was just like this dude i looked up to my whole life and i'm taking the starting spot it was it was but i was a we had a rajah boris uh steve me yeah barbosa shaq shaq we had a good time he was tough right out the gates he was tough he was steve's backup i remember um because i had chapel uh when you guys would come in right before y'all run out the tunnel and grant will be the first one out there and he and grant hit me with the saying when you know it was time i said i was in minnesota we just finished playing indiana and i could i'm in my suit the whole night shoes on biscuits on and everything and i didn't move till it was time to go we had back to back we played indiana and minnesota and i went to the game with the same suit on because i could not move the back-to-backs just told me like i could not move and he's like yeah i'm getting to that point where back-to-backs really yeah you know really affect me like and we said like if you give me a day in between i'm good but the back-to-backs was like like kick your ass and yeah and i couldn't move i couldn't move i just wish then i the cannabis would have been but i i wish i would you know what i'm saying like i knew guys that got down right but i just thought it was partying i thought it was partying okay i could never go to sleep until five o'clock yeah after a game that's so hard that'll show you what i'm saying your adrenaline is so high yeah and you can't shut this body down like i would try cold hot uh hot tubs all that massage all that is you just can't bring it down that tree so yeah you know that would help that's what i love about adam too he's he's coming with it yeah he opened about that so yeah no choice at this point Quick hitters, first thing that come to mind and let us know, MJ, Kobe, Bron, rank them. Oh, man. It's like if you have assassins. LeBron going to have this big-ass gun with a super scope and this, and it's going to be three miles away, and he's going to take you out like a sniper. Kobe is going to have a razor blade in his mouth on the cell phone with the police slicing you up. Like, I'm killing him, y'all. I better come get the remains of this motherfucker. And Mike just going to do it, you know. Mike just going to kill. He just going to kill. Can't go wrong with any of them. Can't go wrong with none of them, but I got to go Mike and Cole for being loyal and then Bron. But like I said before, I've never seen a better basketball all-around player like LeBron. I mean, pass it, shoot it, dribble it, post. 6'8". Outside. 6'9". 6'9", 2'6". Elevate. Good job. Defend. High IQ. All that stuff, man. And carry himself flawless. Keep it clean, too. From day one. Keep it above board. The kid has been flawless without a pappy. I grew up without a pappy, so I, you know, there's some things I wish I could have, like Pops, what do I do? How do I do this? What do I do that? And for him to be that, what he is right now. And I don't know. I have never officially met LeBron. But every time. Every time he sees me, he beelines to me. Shows love. He's silent. And hugs me and asks me if I'm good. And I've never said, hey, I'm so-and-so. And I don't know where it comes from. Disrespect. And I'm around other veterans, too, when I'm there. But he beelines. And I'm like, this is just incredible. Greatest superstar we've ever seen. Yeah, I think so. Muhammad. I didn't see. I wasn't around. What? I mean, by the time I met him, I actually met him for the first time out there. You know, he used to come around a lot. But he wasn't really, you know, he was on his way out. Yeah. I love him. He's smart. Muhammad Ali, man. Rest in peace. Yeah. This is a good question for you. One album you can listen to on repeat. DJ said. On repeat? Off the Wall, Michael. But hip-hop? What the album? Redman. Yeah, Redman. What the album? Redman. He's in my top five. Okay. He's in my top five. I love me some Redman. Man, my top five, it's Tuff, Pac, and Big up there. And I pick Pac. Not because I'm a West Coast kid, but I just think Pac and Big are like Marvin Gaye and Rick James. You party with Rick James if you want to love with Marvin, if you want to go to war with Marvin, if you want to rebel with Marvin, if you want to be sensitive to women, if you want to disrespect women, all that, you can get that with Pac. You can get every emotion. You can cry with Pac. I'm not going to cry off a Biggie song. Yeah. Rakim. Snoop and Hov. That's my fives, man. Solid. So I'm putting Biggie and Pac the same, but the edge goes to Pac because all the emotion that he can have. I danced with Pac, never met him, and I saluted Biggie from across the room. People hear that and say dance with Pac, but in the clubs, you used to dance. Yeah, you used to dance. In the clubs, you used to dance. So we'd just sit there the whole time and turn around. What up, what up, what up? Find you something to dance with. Yeah. Top five L.A. Hoopers, in your opinion. Sheesh, that's hard. Marcus Johnson, UCLA. First Cripper, UCLA. Yeah, Marcus Johnson. I don't know why he won't come on out, bro. He's been in denial forever, dog. Marcus. I saw this man, and I asked my mom, why is that man out there with them kids? Why is that man out there with them kids? Because I'm a little dude. John Williams. Y'all call him Hot Plate, but that motherfucker can't play. His name was Hot Plate? He never changed, because he got so big. He never changed his demeanor. He was always calm and relaxed. He's not L.A., but his Cali kid, Reggie, another UCLA. Can't get away from you motherfuckers, man. Y'all just. Tracy was a beast, man. Tracy was cold. High school, Glendora. Another UCLA, man. Freeman Williams. Y'all might not remember him, but he used to get in the business. And another cat named Dwayne Poley. I never heard of him. Went to Pepperdine, Manual Arts, Pepperdine. I actually. I actually hired his son in Dallas, when I was in Dallas, to be on our practice squad. But yeah, man, Dwayne Poley was the truth. Watched Magicians and all that. And there's so many, man. I mean, I could go up to the Bay with GP and Kid. I can go down to Dago with Bill Walton and all that. But it's just. You know, those are L.A. And then you got honorable mentions like B.D., another UCLA cat. Russ, another UCLA cat. Jay Harden. You know, DeMar, Paul. You know, go up and down the spectrum, man, on hooping in L.A. Childhood crush. Sheesh, man. I don't know. Either Janet or Tootie. Oh, Tootie. Pick and choose. You know, you want to roll the skate or have control. Either one, man. I'm a control, bro. Yeah, you gonna go control? Yeah, I ain't mad at the Tootie shot. Yeah, Tootie. Kim Fields was dope. And I got to be on Living Single with her, which was cool. Yeah. And. Yeah, real down to earth. And, you know. Yeah, Tootie was mine, man. That was it. Kim Fields. The braces and the roller skates and the pigtails and everything, you know? Childhood. Yeah. One guest that you would like to see on All the Smoke. But you have to help us get your answer on the show. Who haven't been on, man? Mike. You guys sat down with 44. We ain't had Mike. We ain't had. Y'all sat with 44, right? He said he coming, though. MJ said he coming, but we ain't had him. Yeah, I got to sit with Obama a couple months ago. That was dope. Yeah, I got to go, which is ironic. You know, my last name got me into the White House on the. Barack had a Cinco de Mayo party and shit. So I was like, bring that Mexican in for the party. So I got to go in and hang out with a little dude, you know what I'm saying? Which was dope. I just love the fact that he hooped, man. Yeah. We had a president that could hoop, man. We got to hang out with Bill a little bit. Rest in peace, Big O, because he was an Arkansas dude. Yeah. And. Clinton came through and we was with the finals and everything. But, you know, obviously he on the sacks, but, you know, a president that hoops? Man, forget about it. He black. I get that. But he hoops, man. He really hoops, man. That's so dope, man. Loves it. Yeah. I mean, y'all hung around a little bit more as he. Super cool. Yeah. Super cool. He treats you like he done known you for 30 years. Word. Talks cool, down to earth. Very presidential. Yeah. Y'all mean Michelle? Y'all mean Michelle? We had Michelle before we had Brock. Wow. We had Kamala as well. Wow. So you guys had that. You say MJ's coming. Man, get Chuck, man. Love it. We had Chuck. You had Chuck? We had Chuck. Yeah. Wow. That was a good episode, too. Tyson? We need Tyson, yeah. Mike Tyson. Biggity Mike. Yeah. Dave was trying to help us get him. We need to lock Mike in. Seth, this has been dope, man. I appreciate it, man. Thank you for your time and just who you've been, how you carry yourself, and how you continue to be a good dude. Yeah. Congratulations on everything. I'm a follower. Yeah. Thank you, bro. Just keep it going, man. Keep it up in smoke. That's a wrap. Seth Sabalis. You can catch us on all the smoke YouTube and the DraftKings Network. See y'all next week. Bye. Bye. I'm out.