Kenny Chesney

I went to a memorial service the other day for David Gurgen. David was a lovely human being. He was decent, kind, a gentleman on camera and off. He wasn't one of those people you see on cable news yelling, saying things they may not even believe. He was thoughtful. He'd served as an advisor to four presidents, Republicans and Democrats, and even though he had a lifetime of real experience, he listened to other people and always engaged with them respectfully. David died in July after a struggle with Louis body dementia. I miss him. His wife, Anne, flanked by their children, Catherine and Christopher, read a poem. She also had read at David's burial. It's called "Immertality" by Claire Harner. "Do not stand at my grave and weep. I am not there. I do not sleep. I am a thousand winds that blow. I am the diamond glints on snow. I am the sunlight on ripen grain. I am the gentle autumn rain. When you awaken in the morning's hush, I am the swift upflinging of quiet birds in circling flight. I am the soft star that shine at night. Do not stand at my grave and cry. I am not there. I did not die." I like that idea that our loved ones are not gone, that they are in all these things, that they're alive all around us. I certainly hope that's true. You may know that I've started a live stream show, which is a companion to this podcast called "All There Is Live." My guest on the latest episode is Marieca O'Mara, who sent me this voicemail back in 2024. My name is Marieca. I was diagnosed with metastatic breast cancer about two years ago. I lost my mom. I was 25 and she also died from metastatic breast cancer when my mom was on hospice care. At the end, she had a grief counselor, and she said one thing that has always stuck with me. We are grieving for the one person, and it can be a terrible grief. But the dying person, knowing that she's going to die, knows that she's going to lose everybody in her life, that she's ever loved. And I understand even more now, as I am facing the same thing, I know I won't get to see my granddaughter get married, like two grandsons, the littlest one is three. I know I won't be able to see him graduate high school. My husband, who I was lucky enough to find just seven years ago, it's devastating, looting and knowing in advance about it, and that's all there is for me. In the meantime, I'm going to do my very best to love them all as hard as I can. That is all we can do, isn't it? Love those around us as hard as we can. When Marieca joined me on all their lives, I was stunned to learn that her husband died unexpectedly in July. The Marieca is grieving him and facing the uncertainty about her own future. This is part of the conversation I had with her. Are you scared? No, I don't think that's the right word, maybe anticipating pain makes me a little scared. And I don't think I'm scared of dying. I believe that there's something more for us. I believe that I'll see Brianne Kinne and my mom and my dad and all those, I think, maybe we believe that so we aren't scared, but I'm going to believe it. Yeah, me too. Are you scared of dying? Yeah. I wasn't scared, sorry, I wasn't scared before I had children. I impact, I exposed myself to a lot of danger over the last, and since I was 23 going to wars and stuff, I tried to get as close as possible to that line because I wanted to witness it and understand it and bear witness to the suffering of others. But now that I have little kids, I'm very scared about not being there for them. We like to think we're in control of our lives that will have the time to do all the things that we delay doing, but there are no such guarantees are there. I'm grateful for Marika, for her honesty and her willingness to help all of us with her wisdom and her love. This is all there is. We'll be right back with Kenny Chesney. When they get in here, it goes from here to here. Welcome back. I first met Kenny Chesney nearly 20 years ago when I did a profile of him for CBS 60 minutes. Her paths have crossed a number of times since then. Kenny's written a memoir called Heart Life Music about his incredible journey in country music. I started our conversation showing him part of an interview I did in 2012 with Lynn and Chris McDonald. Just three days after their seven-year-old daughter Grace was murdered at Sandy Hook Elementary School in Newtown, Connecticut, along with 19 other children and six staff members. I'm a huge fan of yours and it goes well beyond the music. There is something that you did, which I don't think you've ever talked about. I've never talked about. When Sandy Hook happened, I interviewed the mother of Grace McDonald, who was a little girl killed at Sandy Hook, her name was Lynn. This is just part of the interview that I'd done with Lynn. The first time we had been able to be with her was last night and when we walked in the room and we saw that white casket, it just, you felt like the floor was falling out beneath you and your breath was taken away. But earlier in the morning, I decided because Grace loved art so much, we were packing sharpies in our pockets. And when we got in, after we did our big family hug with Grace, we sat down and we busted out the sharpies and we decided that we were, at first I had visioned maybe a little heart, but by the time we were done, there wasn't an inch of white. It was so covered with all the things that she loved. When we left the room, it was certainly so hard to leave her because that would be the last time that we would be able to be with her. We had to take great joy in knowing that when we walked in there, it was so white and our breath was taken away. But when we walked out of there, it was like we had joy again, it had so much color. And it was Grace. It was so Grace. You were able to give her things as well? Yes. We brought her her favorite pocketbook and we had seashells and flip flops and sunglasses and she loved to cook. We had a frying pan and she loved music. She has Taylor Swift Christmas song in there. She has her New York, she has her dad's New York Yankee Hat. Can you show us? She has a little Kenny Chastney in there. Notes from her friends. Notes from her friends, pictures of her family. So she had all the things that she loved with her. We took, we took, we had peace when we left last night. Wow. Before that interview, I was in their kitchen and I was talking to them and this was just days after their daughter was killed and there was a photo of you on the refrigerator and I said to Lynn, oh, do you like Kenny Chastney and her eyes lit up and she was like, oh, Grace loved Kenny Chastney and in fact, the morning she was killed. We were standing at the scopes. Excuse me. Yeah. We were standing at the school bus waiting for the bus and we were singing Kenny Chastney song and I texted you that night because I had your number from doing the 60 minutes piece and I wasn't suggesting you do anything. I just texted you to say, hey, I just want you to know you really touched this family's life and I'm sure you get that a lot because you touch a lot of people's lives but this family really loved you and this little girl who died really loved you. You texted me right back and you said you wanted to reach out to Lynn and I got in touch with Lynn, make sure it was okay. You call Lynn and you spoke for a long time. Yeah. And we have since then become really good friends. I can't tell you how many shows her and Chris have come to over the years and they actually brought me some piece of art that Grace painted and gave it to me and I had it framed and it was in my bus for years. You know it's crazy because I believe I'm a very spiritual person and I believe in people pushing people together. Do you know today as we are sitting here talking and I'm not sure when this is running but as I'm sitting here talking, today is November the 4th. The day my book comes out and I was going back and forth with Lynn on email just a couple weeks ago and she goes, I'm really excited to see that your book's out and that it's coming out and I said, well thank you. and she goes, I think. - I think you need to know, November 4th is Grace's birthday. She would have been 20 years old today. - Oh my God. - And here we are talking. You're the one that connected me with that incredible. Yeah, I know, I get chills thinking about it. - I know, but today's her birthday. She would have been 20 today. And I don't know, I just-- - I just texted her son Jack just to check up on him, see how he's doing. It says, I mean, looks, and I meet a lot of well-known people. There's not a lot of people who would, not only have reached out to her in the worst moment of her life, for a conversation that would be nothing but difficult and keep in touch with her. I mean, she's told me that she's gone to tell somebody that she's gone the numerous shows. And every time they go to Hawaii she brings me back a book, like this book on just all things Aloha. And I have that in my house still today. And it's, what do you say in real good friendship? - You, I mean, when you step into somebody's grief like that, what do you say? - You just try to be their form. I mean, there's not a lot to say. I can't imagine being a parent and that happening. She told me all these things about Grace that made me feel just incredible. I mean, and how much she loved the music and how much their family went to the beach and listened to it and how much I was a part of their household. And when Grace passed, I think her mother told me they had no shoes, no shirt, no problems written on the casket. - I just think it's unbelievable that we're having this conversation on what would have been her children. - That's incredible. - That it worked the timing of it all. - At the end of that horrible week, you actually came on CNN and you sang Amazing Grace. ♪ I'm raising Grace ♪ ♪ House with the sun ♪ ♪ That saved a wretch like me ♪ ♪ I once was lost ♪ ♪ But now I'm found ♪ ♪ Was blind ♪ ♪ But now I see ♪ ♪ And was Grace ♪ ♪ That taught my heart to feel ♪ ♪ And Grace ♪ ♪ My fear really did ♪ ♪ How precious did that grace ♪ ♪ It was up here ♪ ♪ The eye ♪ ♪ I first believed ♪ ♪ Amazing Grace ♪ ♪ House with the sun ♪ ♪ That saved a wretch like me ♪ ♪ I once was lost ♪ ♪ But now I'm found ♪ ♪ Was blind ♪ ♪ But now I see ♪ ♪ I once was blind ♪ ♪ But now I see ♪ - Wow, that's beautiful. I love that song. - Well, me too, watching that it's been a many years now. And the fact that we have this in our country, and I know this is probably a whole other interview, but watching that, it's stunning that we still have to deal with it, and that we still, I mean, I'm so sick of watching sporting events and having moments of silence. And it seems like there's been a lot. So, I don't know, it's. And to know that Grace would have been 20 years old today, is just a life cut short, but I do feel a connection with her and that family. I really do. - That's true, why? - And thanks to you. - You've sung about grief, you've sung about loss a couple times. - I think that the more you live, the more you experience loss. And I have, over the last several years, I have lost friends that I've written songs with, that I've collaborated with, I've lost heroes, I've lost island friends. And I don't think they're gone, they're here, they're here. In there, you feel the. - I feel it energetically, I feel them. - It's interesting, because I never used to, I would hear people talk about that. And it's only in the last couple of years that I actually feel the people again. - And I don't know that it's something that we ever get over. - Yeah, I don't think there's getting over, I think there's kind of turning toward living with. - Yeah, and I think, especially if you lose someone, if they're young, got lost a friend of mine on the islands, I mean, she was in her 30s, and when she passed, it was like, we were all frozen in that moment forever, and at that age. - There's another song you have who you'd be today, which sort of speaks to that. I wanna play a little bit of who you'd be today. - Okay. (upbeat music) ♪ God knows how I miss you ♪ ♪ All the hell that I've been through ♪ ♪ Just knowing no one can take your place ♪ Sometimes I wonder who you'd be today. Today, today, today, today, today, today, today, today, today, today, today, today, today, today, today. Today, today, today, today, today, today, today, today. I didn't write that song, but when I heard it, I specifically thought about there was a couple of guys that lived across the street for me as a child. And we didn't have anything. We didn't have devices. We didn't have the internet. We didn't have cable, nothing. So all we did was play sports out in the backyard. And his name was Lance Wilson, and he got killed in a car wreck at 17 in Jacksonville, Florida after they'd moved away. That was the first time I really experienced real loss. And I heard this song. I went, "Wow, that's exactly how I wonder about Lance." What he would have been like. Would he have had a family? Would he have what he would have done with his life? More of my conversation with Kenny Chesney in a moment. But first, if you want to listen or watch past episodes of the podcast, you can do that wherever you get your podcasts, or on our grief community page at cnn.com/allthereis. That's where you can also watch our new weekly companion show "All There Is Live." Thursday nights at 9.15 p.m. and catch past episodes of it as well. cnn.com/allthereis. I'll see you there. We'll be right back with more from Kenny Chesney. I'm Dr. Sanjay Gupta, host of the Chasing Life Podcast. We're going to talk about rethinking how we die. How we think about death in the first place greatly informs how we live. Our guest is Dr. Vijay Miller. He's a hospice and palliative care physician. We are aging as a people. This is a worldwide phenomenon that we are aging and therefore getting closer to the end of life on some level as a group. It's not at all surprising that you'll see a revving up of interest, services, and also sort of anxiety that pushes us away from the subject and makes us cling to life. Listen to Chasing Life, streaming now, wherever you get your podcasts. You had two bullet dogs who died. Poncho and Ruby. We call them the "Dapanch and a Rubeggarro." There's a song to Rubeggarro. Yes, I wrote a song called "A Rubeggarro" and I was one of those guys that really didn't have dogs in their life. I didn't even think about it. But my therapist, like two days before Christmas, came to me and she knocked on the door and opened the door and it's her and she has Poncho. And she goes, "Kinny, you have to learn to attach to something." That was like, "Next thing you know, Anderson, I'm in an anxiety pit of that smart." No one want to get. So I just got like two of everything. So and then when Mary and I got together she We had a pit bull rescue and so Ruby and Pancho never spent a day apart ever. So when Ruby passed, she was a little lower than Pancho. It was really difficult because we were a family. Also, it's a loss that we've done, we've had people on the podcast. It's a terrible loss because a lot of people don't view it the same way as, it's a connection as strong as any other for many people. I love animals and when Ruby passed, it was really, really difficult. It was as terrible as any friend I've ever had that has passed. I sure want to play a little of Derrubin. Okay, I didn't see this coming out, I love it. You'll see this was going to get me. It hurt, she needed you to hold to help fill a space, last a lot, last cage at the rescue was a love that no one could replace. It's great. I've never heard of it. I did a video on it and everything. Her best friend's name is Pancho and she loves him, oh my gosh, not frosty pose. She hates the mowers and the mirell, like she hates to get a wash, her hair doesn't grow and then doesn't curl, she's Derrubin, I love it, I love it, I love it, I love it. You never know what's going to inspire you. I love that. I love animals and I love pit bulls and Ruby taught me a really good lesson. I grew up in an environment where we were taught that pit bulls were dangerous and that pit bulls were mean and Ruby taught me a lesson. If you mistreat an animal enough, any breed will be that way and yeah they get a really bad rap, I mean she was very loyal, she was very strong and she got to sleep in the bed a lot because I let my dog sleep in the bed and miss that dog. I heard you say that when you found out she had cancer that rather than grieving while she was still alive, you wanted to fill her time with love. Mary and I took her everywhere, she went to Florida, she went to Malibu, she went to the Virgin Islands, we didn't want to sit in the house and just watch her deteriorate because she was going to anyway, there was no stopping it. So we just filled her, me and Mary and Pancho, we went everywhere and she loved to lay in the sun, she loved to listen to the waves crash and that's something that we had in common. You know, and so it was hard, I mean like losing an animal, like for a lot of years we were a unit, all of us. And so that was as difficult of a death and grieving that I've ever experienced honestly. Was there a time when you felt okay, I'm ready to bring another four-legged creature into my life? Not yet because Mary's still grieving it. I mean, she's not ready, it's been, while it'll be four years, next month. So she's not ready, and it really crushed her. I was one of those guys that didn't really have animals in my life until Pancho and Ruby, but I spent so much time with them. Now you know how you can go in a car and you can stop at a red light and there'll be a dog setting, you know, with his head out the window. Like now I can, I feel like anyway, that I can look at that dog and dissect his personality. You know, not that I'm a dog whisperer anything, but that's how much in tune I am now compared to before. Pancho and Ruby. Just listening to that song, I would remind you of something you said about songwriting and you wrote about in the book, you said, "The job is to take a slice of life, write all about it, slice it down to what matters, then cut that feeling wide open." I love that. Yeah, thank you. It is difficult that finding commonality with people through songs and in a short period of time is I have to scratch and claw for everything I get as a creative person. Yeah, but it's the part of my life that I truly love the most and being creative and having that gift is one of the most unbelievable gifts that you could have. I've lost someone recently, you know, someone that I created with for a very long time. My friend, Brett James, who was killed in a plane crash a couple of months ago and it's been hard because we were brothers and we were songwriting partners and we came from different places. But I mean, he wrote so many of my songs and those that he didn't write with me, I wrote with him his creative energy and his creative soul changed my life. There's a huge part of my show that is our creative energy and then all of a sudden that stops. Do you feel him when you sing songs that you guys wrote together or worked together? I had to go. So the first time I sang one of his songs after he passed was it "Farmade" with Willie Nelson in Minneapolis and all of a sudden it hit me. I was going to do a song called "When the Sun Goes Down" which he wrote by himself and it was the first time it was really the wound was really open. It was really fresh his passing and I had to go up there and sing that song and I haven't had to sing it since but I'm going to but I'm not going to let that stop stop me. It's almost like in a celebratory way now and I can't even believe that it's so fresh and new, the grief and everything in this passing that I can't believe I'm talking about it in those terms in the past tense. Yeah and like all of it I create everything in the past tense because I was just one of those guys that I mean I thought was always going to be around and it's been really really difficult and it was it was a moment that that really hit the whole town of Nashville really hard because he just didn't create for me. I mean he was a creative machine and a soul and a great, you know, and a great guy and a dear friend and we did went on a lot of riding trips together and we, I mean we had a ton of authentic life fun. I mean a lot. You've seen a lot of those places on the road and he would he would share the stage with me and I don't know he was just a brother and it was just he had a bad day in a plane, you know, and it sucks. Is there something you've learned in your grief or in the losses you've experienced that would be helpful for others who are going through it right now? Wow. It's different time does heal some. It won't erase. It changes. It changes. Yeah. Your grief will change over time. Can you chance me? Thank you so much. Thank you, Marrola. Next week on all there is comedian and cancer survivor Tig Notaro. It's a funny and moving conversation about loss. Tig's close friend, poet Andrea Gibson, recently died and Tig was at Andrea's bedside. I have to say it's really the first time I've experienced a death in the way that I have where I really feel Andrea and I don't know what that is but the grief leading up and the grief I feel, you know how tricky it is. You go about your day and you're doing all right and then all of a sudden a truck parks itself on your chest and you can't do anything because it's like it's so confusing that Andrea has gone. Join me on Thursdays at 9.15 p.m. for my new weekly companion show called All There Is Live. It will be live streamed on our grief community page at cnn.com/all there is every Thursday night at 9.15 p.m. We can come together there, talk grief and not be alone. You can also follow us on our new Instagram account, All There Is and send us video messages there. Just make sure that you either record them on your phone and upload them directly toward Instagram message board or if you record them directly in Instagram, make sure you click the Allow Replay prompt so that it reads Keep in Chat and that'll allow us to save your messages and possibly use them on the podcast. You can also leave us messages at our new voicemail box 404-827-1805. Wherever you are in your grief, I'm glad we're together. For Election Night, CNN is available to stream live now with an all-access subscription, plus get exclusive content and interactive Q&As with CNN's journalists. 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