Jumping Into the Open Era with the ‘Survivor 51’ Premiere!

have you ever wondered how movements start i'm ashley c ford host of into the mix a ben and jerry's podcast about joy and justice this season we're talking to unexpected progressive heroes who found purpose in unexpected places people like marley diaz making sure every kid sees themselves in books kyle mesteth a native skateboarder building a movement for kids nationwide joy a lot of coon whose music moves from protests to daily commute find out how they started something bigger than themselves and listen wherever you get your podcast plan b is a backup birth control option that's there for you when things don't go according to plan it specifically works after unprotected sex and before pregnancy occurs by temporarily delaying ovulation plan b is available nationwide at all major retailers and through delivery apps like doordash no id prescription or age requirement it's the number one ob-gyn recommended brand of emergency contraception and it won't impact your future fertility that's freedom to be used as directed all right we're back we're really back do we all want to say it together three two one we're back it's impossible to say something in sync on uh the internet call yeah if we all had equally slow starlink internet we could do it but i think you two have faster internet than i do right now um 51 we saw a lot of people on the internet and we saw a lot of people a lot of discourse about the premiere lots of positive things on the internet about the people who saw the premiere last week we were invited to it didn't make it out to new jersey to see it um did it meet those expectations did you like i saw people being mean again i saw old school survivor references uh i saw a lot of that stuff did it meet those expectations yeah i i feel like i'm excited for the future of the internet i'm excited for the future of the internet i'm excited for this open era you know it's kind of like classically cheesy in in jeff fashion that we've come to expect but there was so much here so like it starts with the voiceover from jeff which is very reminiscent of borneo and i don't know when he exactly stopped doing that but it's been a while since he's been like these 21 strangers are gonna find themselves in a remote part of you know whatever whatever and i was like oh this is cool like i'm getting some really old school flashbacks and then we get uh we even get him saying you know 26 days 21 people one survivor he hasn't done that in a really long time i write that down as a joke because you wrote that only one survivor is the only commonality between the seasons that he said that for 26 days that's different 21 players that's different one survivor is the same but then he said it and i was like well i guess they're owning it yeah he had been doing for the new era which is now the old new era uh he'd been doing like you know welcome to survivor 49 or whatever and this is like i'm like this is how you begin a season of survivor you have like i i i like him saying that stuff and then we get you know the classic marooning of them jumping off a boat which i actually looked it up because so brady is like you gotta go back to the single digits i was like you definitely do not have to go all the way back to single digits for them to be jumping off the boat it's been a while but it's not been this single digit uh it was edge of extinction in february 2019 was the last time they did it so it's been six and a half or sorry seven and a half years since we've seen that too so all this was actually getting me really amped up uh and i'm pretty here for the open era i feel like this did meet my expectations there were a lot of feelings like i was like okay yeah um and then throughout jeff was like i get a lot of grief from a lot of people but also they went back to old school a lot they did we'll talk about that direct to you i did see you had a tweet about uh after the we'll we'll get into that as we cross that bridge um marooning i loved it i loved uh you know jeff walking around and a lot of people have talked about like jeff retiring and oh who's going to be the next uh the the next host of survivor so once in a while i get tagged in those things uh lots of people talk former contestant former whoever i think if jeff truly wants to turn the game over to the people uh he should do voiceover from home and after the season is cut up and he can still be jeff he can be in the comfort of his own home no no no he's got he has to be there listen the traders have you seen a trader's round table they're so good and all alan does is go in and be like okay guys one of you's gone make it not you you got 30 minutes alan adds a lot to that show just he does but that tribal council he doesn't do the the round tables he doesn't do anything he just opens it opens the forum and i think that i feel like yeah i feel like as much as we kind of like poke fun at jeff i do feel like he adds a ton to the challenges specifically and being out there you can't replace that with with just straight voiceover like he that's some of it is out there i know some of it is voiceover but a lot of it is him right there like he's sometimes like egging people on or like negging them basically yeah but sometimes that is in post sometimes that's in post like they're like oh there's a funny joke for jeff to say blurb that over voiceover but sometimes it adds up to it sometimes someone is like whatever you know bigger on some apparatus getting like stretched out in agony and they're like shut up jeff and you're like this is you have to have this on the okay well there's a happy medium there uh ashley you're also here we've uh right leah's gone on so long we don't want to forget ashley our producer our co-host um what did you think ashley did you like that did that give you some tingles um i i liked it a lot i didn't get the tingles yet either but i yeah i feel like i feel like we're missing something but maybe it's just because we're still like figuring out what this open era really is like it feels like it's more of just i don't know maybe open era is another way for them to say nostalgic era because it feels like they're just bringing back everything which i love i'm really happy for but it doesn't feel like anything new is happening so i'm i'm just i'm i was sitting there in the very beginning kind of confused on what we're we're gonna see like are we is it like 50 where we're going to get like the nostalgic feelings and everything or is it like something completely new and it's it's open so i think that's kind of like almost like a cop-out to being like it's anything it's everything it's everything it's but also it was always everything like that was if you saw something on the show you fully planned to expect that twist to reinsert itself somewhere so i i don't fully understand that also the permanent uncertainty that i'm the most amped up and defensive of survivor right now no i'm fine i like the show i thought the premiere was great but i'm saying like we're promised permanent uncertainty that was also always the main thing of survivor was you never know what to expect like i do i do feel like so i'm i'm taking the open area era seriously but not literally in that yes it's like i was never under the impression that there were things that like could not come back or whatever like of course it's all on the table but i did think that the 40s got a little repetitive and i think that by the end of it we saw players playing into some of what they expected it's like you knew you were going to hit the beach you know you were going to hit the beach and so you would have players i feel like just racing to get into a four like they knew before they even got out there it's like i need to find three people that i connect with and then i'm good for the first tribal council yeah and you had like if i go and i get the you know these beware advantages i kind of have an expectation that almost every single time whatever you were losing was going to be well worth whatever you could gain and you were going to be able to get it and all like there wasn't that much uncertainty like people kind of knew what to expect even if like the exact like oh the journeys will change a little bit the beware advantages will change what you do a little bit you still have like an idea of like this will be worth this this will be worth that or whatever now i'm like they are more on their toes and just things can happen a little bit differently and even as simple as like two tribes of 10 is like that is a dynamic we have not seen on survivor in a really long time now they yeah flipped out they flipped out they flipped out which is crazy it's like because i'm sure they all had in their head like oh i'm gonna be on a tribe of six and i have to get three other people and then i'll be in a four and now it's like whoa wait a second now i have to get five other people and that survivor's new play is just like let's take hidden immunity idols out for 10 seasons and then when we reinsert them everybody will go bonkers i think it's like we took it it's like a gift you take it away and then you give it back to them later like and they're like oh my god thank you so much for Thank you so much for that. Yeah. Yes. yes well played the auction i guess they took it away for like a decade we all lost our minds so that's what's happening and uh people love it so i guess it's all a cycle uh yeah so people jumped off the boat and we got uh we got some nose pluggers we got a few people i saw only one nose plugger yeah i saw rob's the nose plugger which is fine uh and then we have uh kilby grabbed a life preserver or a life ring or whatever and then i think ori also grabbed a life jacket i think so i saw somebody in a life jacket but i can't actually remember who it was yeah so uh yeah jelly on the other hand 10 out of 10 jump from the boat that was awesome that first jump where she's just like yes full send awesome uh that's something she'll be able to like eric can look guys too oh yeah eric was fine i watched for the best jump i still i still think jelly had the best jump yeah okay like when you go on survivor as a contestant it's not a thing you think about but this slow-mo shot off the boat has to look fucking sick like because you're only getting one shot and it's a thing that people are going to remember you for and it's something you can look back on like jelly can now has that have that as like a gif on her phone uh whatever like i think it's awesome so uh good job jelly uh i mean i don't think she planned it she just looked cool doing it uh and then the slow motion shot under the water was awesome i love when they do the slow-mo shots on this show like it's always it looks so good every single time i think and we get a standout character like here so fast devin the star of the show like such a great narrator i was very shocked by him and the episode was mostly his does he have a chance at winning or is he like out in front way too early i think he's out of front too early definitely yeah i mean i wouldn't completely say oh yeah zero chance but i am definitely muted on out in front way early and then all of the stuff where he's like i'm voting for jenna you know 100 i'm gonna i'm rigid completely honest this is my game or whatever is like oh boy so um i did like that i liked how it came yeah i liked how it came down to that and they're like nope nope i'm doing this i'm doing this so i'm not budging i'm not budging either we are friends but we disagree brady and uh and devin i like that i i but i i think throughout the whole episode like devin was just like the standout uh character for me like absolutely i loved when they had him talking his confessionals were all amazing because reed's not always perfect i mean with jenna which she was i i don't understand why she doesn't have a shot list for like i would have been very suspicious too if i was like oh what what kind of shots do you do you know for like photography she's like i don't know whatever go with the flow i was like i've been to a lot of weddings the photographer has got to be like on top of it and so then she went through to prove it to us in a confessional it's like i don't need to know that you're one you need to say that to other people and also she opened up about her divorce in a confessional do that at tribal council do that at camp like you you gotta you gotta wear that stuff yeah yeah that's where you have to especially when you know your back's against the wall that's where you wear that stuff and be like hey guys here's why i've been closed up here's i'm really a photographer isn't it so funny that like there's lawyers lying about their professions there's all this and she's like i'm a wedding photographer they're like we have to get her she's not really that like you know it's wild i don't think devin told them that he was an actor either so like yeah he's lying about his profession and she's not and he's accusing her and everybody's just like yeah she probably is um yeah uh everyone on shore the road rhode island bros coming together rob and eric and uh pantless pat did she end up getting her pants back i don't know you know i don't know we never solved that we never got any resolution to that it's just a loose thread dangling yeah that's i have to watch next episode to see if she got her pants back i feel like if she lost her pants right there day one even if they blew away there was a moment i know when coach lost his shirt a helicopter came in and it blew his shirt into the river and it got washed down they brought him a new shirt like a few days into the season so i think that they have spare pants for pat um okay i'm assuming if we didn't see or find them maybe they just hooked her up with uh with the spare pair so don't have to be pantless pat forever i like how she introduced us to that nickname and i was like i hope nobody calls me that that's why i'm trying to say it as often as i can on this podcast um and then we get uh this moment that we have shiranda who's initially drawn to jelly then to ori and then alia and devins devin not devins devin devin devin all the black people come together immediately yes beautiful beautiful is that is that the play like i don't uh like i don't think it's the right play because i feel like a lot of people are going to suspect it and i was like when i first saw it i was really really excited because i was like oh yeah do it and then like don't tell anybody but then i just guessed it and so i feel like a lot of people are going to guess it everyone's connecting off of little tiny things rhode island you know uh and then i'm like oh my god i'm like oh my god i'm like oh my god voice acting acting maybe they'll connect on that yeah and i feel like people are going to guess the alliance even if they like split up so i don't know if it's the right choice um unless they're really really secretive about it like no one can find out that they're all connected right i agree it's you on the beach you have almost nothing to go off of so whatever common ground you have that's what you latch on to initially you have to latch on to it you have to latch on to just like the thinnest thread of of commonality um and then you also have to target choose your target and then choose a reason that they are not in that common space with you as the reason you have to target them so like you choose somebody you're like well they don't have kids we're all parents let's make sense like they're coming for the parents why wouldn't they be coming for the parents they're single like so i do believe that like you have to just like gravitate to whatever thing is bringing you together and whatever thing you can sell the other person on the reason for the alliance so but the helicopter alliance was i don't know if it was as obvious to uh the people on the beach as it was to the viewers but there was a moment where they all walked down to the beach the beach together with the helicopter above them or in in some moments like that uh so we'll see if it materializes i kind of feel like survivors one of those things and i've experienced it in a way where you do find that those common grounds but then you eventually build deeper bonds with different people and realize that the people on day one are too different or have different ideas uh and you have to part ways and find new groups so um yeah i thought it was interesting though and it did continue throughout the episode with when they got split up they're like oh thank god there's three of the helicopter alliance here we own the whole uh we own the whole tribe but guess what in a tribe of 10 three is not a majority right right which is is crazy uh 10 that's got to be overwhelming for everybody after watching was it overwhelming as a viewer to watch 10 people was it too much no i didn't find it i liked it i like it a lot more than the six than the sixth tribe because it's just if there's more alliances to have more lies i like it a lot so much is happening yeah i think you get a probably a little bit more story from both tribes because you're not sharing with three tribes and so like historically the winning tribe of the three that keeps winning pretty much gets left out of the plot tell the merch because you don't know you don't get to see them at tribal council you don't get to see that's right lines and so like there's always this forgotten tribe if there's a powerhouse tribe and then you don't have a real connection with the players until the merge happens so i do like the two tribe thing uh 10 you know we didn't get to meet everybody really this episode but we we got a blurb from everybody yeah it creates i feel like the larger tribes create more interesting dynamics too like when we're on these smaller tribes you know jeff would always sell them as like there's nowhere to hide but actually it's like people were more certain about where the votes all you need is four then all you need is three then all you need is three then all you need is two and then yeah so yeah and now it's like there's a lot more scrambling and i think it made the um you know post-challenge scramble in this episode more interesting because there was so so much more wrangling it had to be done yeah right yeah i think so more wrangling more opportunity for people to open their mouths and uh spill the beans and then which creates chaos which is what we like right we like chaos and we're also family friendly we like chaos and we like to be family friendly uh we're for families now uh right are these things at odds chaos is family friendly but my family has is chaos so it's mostly chaos families are based on chaos well as the dad of a soon-to-be two-year-old yeah my experience has been family and chaos are like the same thing that's true but you and i riley as parents could be aligned against the singles well so this is the thing with like the the helicopter but you're not single you just don't have kids so then we could be the couples against the singles like there's always a line we can choose together yeah oh speaking of couples traumatized poor jenna if she finds out the singles are on the outs jelly and aura oh yeah jelly and ori jelly and ori that's a new showman that's developing maybe i think it's one-sided is ori is into her lasagna and she is into ori i don't i don't know that was like a code word for her and she was excited and he was just like yeah i love lasagna yeah i'm hungry right now i wish they were on the same tribe like knowing that they should have flipped them i also thought uh like i i questioned so they were all marooned together and then somebody had to go to exile which was lewis he just okay lewis that tyson energy is there like take that chaotic moment to be like yeah i'm out uh don't hate it and then uh the buffs are dropped so they must have been waiting to see and then they who goes yeah do you think they had 21 different scenarios or do you think they had a few that they knew would not choose do they know the people so well they know who's hiding from that first uh or did they all just know it was going to be lewis so they were like we only we already know it's lewis lewis is the only one that's going to choose this it's actually i would love to hear from a producer how they actually did that i i would assume that they had like an idea of where they wanted the tribes with like a few floaters and some different ways like you know some ideas of like okay here's how we can balance like strength and strength and like you know all the different like kind of diversity stuff and whatever else that they want to get aligned um yeah but then they still had to do a lot of it on the fly i don't think you make 21 different that's that's just a crazy amount of work i mean but it's all mostly the same it's just i just wait until yeah just wait until like okay and then we can they have like 600 people on their crew you don't think they can put one person to be like and we need every tribe scenario with one of these guys going to uh exile and then that way we're barely make more than like three or four challenges a season yeah yeah so you're saying three or four new challenges a season they're usually all the same challenges are they not three or four is an elevated number i think but it's also like 25 years to be like there's so many episodes it gets hard and also there's the signature survivor challenge vibes that you also have to maintain so it's all just a combination or some new mix or combination of stuff they've already done like yeah yeah like can you make better music when all the best music has already been made right they tried for winners of war jeff tried yeah he did try um i something that tanan said right when everybody kind of uh oh yeah i highlighted this too yes yeah we wanted some kind of direction and it shows you how much society needs regulation to fill in control and that's in a nutshell what i've been trying to describe survivor to when people are like well why don't you just build a shelter and then just do this and it's like everybody wants someone else to lead but then we also want everyone to help and then the second somebody doesn't help it's just like nobody wants to help but everybody at home watching it is like i would love just anarchy i would love to just live in an anarchy society it's like nothing gets done because nobody's willing to work if one person isn't willing to work um yeah but you do also need that one person to step in and be like here's what we're gonna do so uh yeah is that the thing you had highlighted riley and uh did you have more insight no i i think it's just it's one of the few places i feel where survivor is still like i don't know i don't know i don't know i don't the social experiment they got to create a society from scratch and it is like true across 51 seasons that if you drop a bunch of people on a beach and they have like a loose idea of like hey you probably should make a shelter like you know get something going here almost instantly there is some sort of hierarchy created there's almost instantly somebody that becomes the leader whether they're like elected to that position or stepping up to that position or just naturally falling into it or not that is you know actually a lot of people are like oh i don't know i don't actually i i still find really compelling even 26 years later so um i thought tn nailed it with that 10 on sorry 10 on yeah 10 on 10 on 10 on we'll get it we'll get it um let's go to uh tribes are split the bag is dropped from the helicopter everybody's flipping out they made the thing and then this is also a new i think negotiation you have to have a representative to negotiate for what supplies you get and there is fire machete and pot there's building supplies tools right there's shelter supplies and there's fishing gear and you each get two of those bundles um i thought kristin was a good choice i think she's a good choice i think she's a good choice i think she's a good choice for this yeah like i like would you volunteer to do this or would you kind of like same as lewis with the journey be like let's try listen i love a good negotiation you want to do it i think i would try to get three of the four are you good at thumb war i wouldn't do thumb war oh i i'd just be like okay you can choose first and then they'd choose they'd be like oh yeah i got him and they'd choose first and i'd say okay i get this one and then they'd choose the next one the other three and they'd be like no no no no no and then you'd be like well you can choose first yeah that's it that's all you do yeah you choose first which one of these is the most valuable because they didn't even agree on that yeah they both walked away feeling like winners even though kilby lost the thumb war and a lot of kilby's tribe didn't have a lot of faith in him compared to kristin everybody was like yeah she's stern enough i think kristin is someone that i think i would be drawn to on the island because she seems stern and serious and even kill like a crisis manager is that what she is yeah yeah so you would immediately be like okay you're a rock when everybody else's head is spinning uh let's go i trust you to to be level-headed even in times of uncertainty um so i thought that was a good choice kilby he looks a little more scattered i would have been yeah i and mike also negotiating a trillion dollar deals for the new york yankees decides not to uh step up to the plate here look at that baseball talk i'm so confused on his job he's an ass i don't understand his job oh yeah he's nasty there we go assistant uh director i was like what he's doing what for the baseball right i thought he was uh i don't know i i just have no clue what he does i don't get it he does help negotiate he does help negotiations and communications with the players um so he probably delivers a lot of bad news to guys on the team yeah if you watch money ball i think that's uh oh my god okay that's helpful he should have just said that i don't even i don't even think he's at jonah hill's level actually in my ball i think he's like below that ah okay yeah so so he's there but i thought it was interesting that they both walked away feeling like guys i did it i can't believe i'm the better negotiator which is probably not what the show really wanted they wanted somebody to walk away feeling like they got got but both of them were just like we did it and also kilby even though he might have been uncertain about um whether or not he got the right stuff. When he came back, he was like, guys, we got the tools and the shelter. And everybody's like, yay. So I think it should have been, yeah, the mystery box. They should have had a mystery box in there. Oh, yeah. Oh, then they could have done that. That would have been really good. See, now that's a good one. So like what I noticed, you know, and this is where kind of like the permanent uncertainty, I think can be good, is that so after Tribal Council, shoot, what's the name of the yellow tribe? Toca. Toca. Toca got, Jeff was like, all right, waiting for you back at camp is going to be your machete and Flint and pot. And so I was like, okay, well now Toca actually super won this negotiation because they've now got three of the four things, basically. So, you know, future negotiation, people are probably going to pick up on that. If this were to happen again, they would be like, well, I don't want the Flint machete and pot because I'll just get that at Tribal Council. Yeah. But that's where you would probably shake it up for 50, maybe not for 52 because they won't have seen 51, but 53 and beyond, it's going to be like a mystery item or actually like we're not going to give you the Flint machete and pot after Tribal Council or whatever. So, yeah. But yeah. Survivor, when I was on Survivor the first time, they used to tell you like, don't be out on Thursday night. That's when it aired. Don't be around. People think it's live. We want people to maintain that like belief that it's like happening in real time as they're watching it on TV. And I do think that rather than have Survivor or Jeff have to explain the second season of every cycle as being like, and remember these guys didn't see 51. They just need to switch it up so that the viewers don't have to like be told that every season. Like don't tell us, because it's, yeah, it's easier to just switch it up. That's neither here nor there, but it would, but to your point, yeah. Like if they switch it every time, then it is expecting the unexpected, which is not a catchphrase Survivor uses. They use, what's the phrase? Permanent uncertainty. Lewis on the Island of Excitement, feels like an idiot. Everyone's bonding. A day feels like a month out there. I did love this exile Island though. Yeah. The well bones, the rocks. We have like, I didn't know that there was a beach left in Fiji that we hadn't seen before. I don't think we've seen that. That's on, oh, maybe not on TV, but it's a wraparound to one of the other. Yeah. I mean, it's on the other side somewhere. It's rocky. It looks sad. Gross. Price smells. So those well bones, you know. Not the well bones, but the shallow tide with the seaweed and gunk probably is, gives a little stench to it. Maybe not. But let's, let's just go to the exile. We can go to exile right now. We'll go back to the tribes after that. Exile Island, day two. Jeff shows up, walks in. Do you like that? Do you like him showing up? I did. Expect permanent uncertainty. Sure. Yeah. Always love to see him just show up in random places. I really like it. I think he should do it more often. Just surprise them. I do like it. It was always exciting when he'd show up to camp. Like, but you'd always know somebody was probably hurt. Like if you showed up to camp, somebody was probably going home. Yeah. So to have him show up more places is fun. I like that he shows up on this one-on-one with Louis and tells him he won't be, I'll go. Go ahead. Well, I think I like Jeff showing up better than if it had been like, here's an envelope, you know, that you have to read or whatever. Yeah. Agreed. Which they do a lot. Yeah. And he won't be the first, he won't be at the first challenge, which is a bummer, but he also won't be at the first tribal council. And Louis was like, yes, I won't be a first out. That's one of my goals. So he's mission accomplished. And he's, he's got an opportunity to get an idol. How much do you think Jeff loved it when Louis said, I have to dig deep, but I don't know where to dig. Yes. Jeff is perfect. Love it. What a great line. Yeah. He's been planning that. Like Louis, come on. You've been planning that line for a while. Every day on exile is a month. He had a lot of time to think. That's true. He had a month to plan that thing in. Yeah. And yeah, he's like, I don't know where to dig. And Jeff's like, well, I'm going to show you. And earlier in this episode, we got Jeff telling the, the entire cast that the game would be turned over to them, play however they want, do whatever they want in whatever manner they want. And they just watch and document it all. And then goes in to some very detailed rules about how to get the idol off of the post. You can't shake it. You can't touch it. You can't tip it over. You can't nudge it. You can't move it in any way. You must and can only chop it with this ax in unison. Under this time frame. Yep. Yep. But I actually kind of like this. I like that it was hard. It looks really hard. I like that it was really hard. Yeah. And I, what I think is going to happen is they're going to exile somebody, maybe not next episode, but shortly here. And there's going to be this post that's like a half shot. Yeah. And then it's going to be like, all right, can you get through it in this time? That's what I think is going to happen. So are they going to give less time each time? Maybe. I think it'd be, I think it'll be interesting if it becomes a sort of, I mean, it looks like it was almost more than half chopped through. So I'd expect if it passes on to the next person that they'd be able to get through it. But it'd be interesting if the post was like even thicker than this. And it's kind of like, to what extent are you just doing work for somebody else? And you know you are. Or you're like, I need to make sure I'm getting sent back to exile because like I'm close to getting this thing off the post. Or like, I don't want people to know about it. Oh my gosh. Yeah. Wow. There's something kind of interesting happening here for sure. But it would be more interesting with a bigger tree. Thicker tree, yeah. Yes, because I want it to be like at least like it'll take like three or four visits. Yeah. I agree. I like that, Riley. So then you're weighing like how much do I get this started versus how much am I just doing someone else's work for them? Like maybe I should do nothing. Like, you know. How hard am I fighting to get back to exile island? I can actually do the whole thing at once. You know, but you can't because, you know, whatever it is. Yeah. I think that's a good idea. I hope that's how they're what's going to happen. Or it will just be just a random poll that's half chopped down. We just never see it again. Well, he didn't get it. We took the poll down. Yeah, we took it down through the idle away. Ashley. Yes. Would I have been able to chop through that post in that a lot of time? Yeah. You know, weirdly enough, I think I could do it myself. Like, I don't know something about it. I was like, I think I could, I could dig in and I could do that. And I don't know why. So you're the better, cooler version of Lewis. Yes. Okay. Riley. Could you do it? Yeah, he could do it too. I don't think so. I saw it like once they did the shot of his hands. Of his hands. Yeah, well, he should have took off his shirt and wrapped it around the handle. Yes. Help yourself a little bit. Yeah. Just like, I don't know. I feel like he could, he could have done it. Like there has to be like a way to do it. I know there is. Could I do it, Riley? Well, yeah, I guess so. You're the, you know, the cooler, better, potentially younger version of Lewis. Not the younger version of Lewis. Potentially younger. Unless I do that reverse aging stuff that everybody's talking about. Yeah. Seeing his hands. Yeah. I was like, my hands are also soft and delicate. And that would be, as soon as he started chopping, I was like, his hands are going to take a beating. Yeah. Everyone's hands are, unless you're a lumberjack. Yeah. This kind of added some evidence to my theory that Lewis is like not actually a farmer. That his hands like, the moment he starts doing some manual labor, his hands just immediately get torn to bits. Yeah. Like I think if you were like a real farmer, you'd be able to at least, maybe not get through the pole, but at least your hands would still be okay. Because they're all calloused and stuff. Instead, it's like just carnage. Yeah. Yeah. He was exhausted too. He took a lot of breaks, but like understandably so. Kudos to him for even going after his hands were all blistered. He even puked. Totally. Oh yeah, I forgot he puked. Poor guy. Yeah. He puked. Sits down defeated. Knife in the heart is what he says. But, you know, we're going to harass Lewis on this podcast through however long he lasts. On Survivor. But it's all out of love. Only because we think he can take it. Yeah, only because we think he can take it. It's out of love. And I have respect for him. Even after looking at his hands and sitting there defeated, he still got back up and kept chopping. And hopefully he can get back there and get that thing all the way done. But he's going to go back to his tribe. He's got blisters all over his hands. This is the thing with Survivor. He's like, where are those from? What are they for? Like you can't. Like it's just like, Island is brutal. I won't say signs. Yeah. there's signs that something's happening. And the second you see the blisters on his hands, you're like, he got an idol. Like you just have to assume. Yeah. I mean, even if he didn't have blisters on his hands, you have to assume he's got something. Yeah. He's got something. Yeah. Yeah. So, uh, I, I like the, yeah. Exile Island. Happy. It's back. Oh yeah. What if they had exile Island redemption Island and edge of extinction, edge of extinction and a playback in opportunity like they did on Pearl Islands. Uh, Oh yeah. The like ghosts or whatever. Yeah. Yeah. All five of them together. There's just like six things going on every episode. This, uh, yeah. This season of survivor will be like 35 episodes. Aaliyah is on her way to edge of extinction right now. Um, yeah, they need that. So yeah. You, you happy with, uh, with exile Island, Ashley. Oh yeah. Very, very happy with it. I actually really liked the whole, everything about it because it made me enjoy Lewis more. I feel like if we had Lewis go straight into the, to the Island, we would see like what we're seeing on Tik TOK and everything with him being just like, Oh, I'm meeting all these people. I'm Irish. I'm Irish. Instead we got to really see Lewis. And so we got like a stripped down version of them really, really early. So I really, really enjoyed that. We were able to do that and it was great. Pick Lewis. She did it. You did your thing, dude. Yeah. He initially said he was just trying to get someone else to bid against him to go, but then nobody else volunteered. That's the problem with bluffing. That's just such a, such a like total misunderstanding of like what you want to do in the opening hours of the survivor season. I loved it. Yeah. There's probably an advantage. If he would have been like, there's probably an advantage there. I'll go like, do you think he would have, then gotten more pushback? That'd be like almost even worse. If nobody, if nobody raised their hand then at that point, but yeah. Yeah. I agree. Actually, we got to see him broken, which is all we've wanted since we found out he was going to be on the cast and yeah, so far so good. Let's go to the tribes. I didn't write everybody's name down. I don't think we need to. We'll learn where everybody's at as it all works its way out. But we got Toka. I've got everybody's name written down who said something this episode worth mentioning Riley. It's not like a, it's not going to run through 10 names and then half of them we don't even talk about right there. Incredible prep work. Oh, we didn't even write down the tribes. I wrote down the tribe names. I wrote, I wrote down the tribes. I wrote down the players on each tribe as well, in case we need to refer back to. We got Toka in yellow. Let's spend some time with them. Um, I think we've got, first off we've got Brady and Devin just connecting right off the bat. If there's one thing Devin loves, it's a big dumb boy. Is that what he said? A big dumb boy. A big dumb boy with a heart of gold. And we get these moments with Jenna where the mistrust is sown because she's feeling overwhelmed. Everyone looks cool except for her. Jen, I think you look cool. She doesn't look uncool. Does Jenna look uncool? No. She's feels herself turtling into her skin, which is bad. If you feel that others are feeling that. They're seeing it. Yeah. Yeah. So, I thought Jenna on this episode was so interesting because I remember way, way back on this podcast, we had Kim Spradlin on and for One World they cast her because she had just gone through a divorce and they expected, you know, that One World cast is like a bunch of, a bunch of like total characters and whatever. And I expect Kim to kind of like be another one of these. It's sort of like this shaky woman like coming off this incredibly, you know, big change in her life. And instead, Kim just like locked in and owned that season beginning to end, right? Took an immunity idol home with her that she didn't even need to play. Right. And here I'm like, oh, here we're getting what Survivor expected Kim to be in Jenna, which is like, you know, all of this, just the shaky ground that she's on. Yeah. She's like, I don't know if she's going to recover, but, uh, uh, it was, you know, tough opening episode for her. Yeah. Can she recover enough to win the whole thing? Hmm. I think so. I don't know. Yeah. I think I also, and like we've seen, we've seen it all. We've seen people that are on the chopping block day one to then just like run it all the way to the end. I think we have classic examples of that in Aubrey early, her first season, uh, lot of people go through that panic phase before they settle into the season. After the game. Yeah. So, and then they end up being, you know, being legendary players. So, uh, anything's possible with Jenna. Um, also Devin teaching everybody acro grip to climb each other, which was pretty impressive. Just got somebody to walk right up, standing on his shoulders. I didn't know he was a big acro guy. Is he a stunt guy as well as an actor? Uh, I didn't see that in his, his IMDB. Yeah. So, he's a stunt guy. He's a stunt guy. He's a stunt guy. Okay. We didn't get a lot from to non, but we did get a few little jams. We got the jam we mentioned earlier. And then we get the, her saying that at home, they call guys like Devin, a weeb. Is that, was that what I heard? Yeah. That was so funny. That's correct. Yup. And is that something I have, you heard that before? Has anybody, Ashley? Yeah. You know, you've never heard of, yeah, I've, I know what it is. I've heard dweeb with a D, but I've never heard weeb. Oh, wow. That's like a, yeah, weeb is. Yeah, you're dating yourself a little bit, Tyson. This is a. Yeah, no, I'm 47 years old. What? I thought you were much younger. No. Than Lewis. Than Ashley. But yeah, weeb is just like, it's usually made for people who are really into Japanese cartoons and everything and Japanese culture. Oh, yes. We have not seen that yet from Devin. So, I'm not really sure what exactly he said to her that made him give off that vibe that he's really into Japanese culture. Maybe it's just that he's a little nerdy and maybe she's referring to that, but I guess he's really into anime. Yeah, she said he reminded her of. It's not, it's not a compliment though. It's like a derogatory. Yeah, usually it's, it's kind of, it's kind of rude now to say to somebody. And then she also said that he's hiding his game under his smile type of energy, which is also accurate. I think that's a good read, much more solid read than Devin. Thinking that Jenna's not a wedding photographer. So, yeah. And it's crazy that everybody just agreed. Everybody was so suspicious of, of Jenna. Like it was not a hard sell. It was the easiest sell that anybody's ever sold. Why? I don't know. Cause she was too nonchalant and didn't tell us what it was. I don't understand. What her shot list was going to look like at a wedding. Okay. Like, I'm just so confused by it. Cause like, I just ask her like a horror story from a wedding or something. I don't know. I just feel like there's a different question to ask. If people ask me smart guy questions about my job, I don't know anything. I feel like I say just silly terms for my own job. So, I don't know. I don't know anything either. Like everybody has a different thing. Like, okay, he asked for the shot list. She didn't have that, but she also could have like read into it and been like, but here's the cameras I like to use and here's why. Yeah. Or, or he could have asked like what kind of camera she had or whatever. Like there could have been some type. It's gotta be somebody else on that beach that knows like a little bit of something about photography that you can kind of like talk about those things. Right. Where she's like, oh, this is like the types of cameras I like to shoot. Yeah, exactly. And I feel like maybe he can keep using that against her. He could just like keep saying things that are from his industry that she probably wouldn't know because she's on the other side of the same industry and then keep making her look like she has no clue what she's saying. He could keep going, but I just think it's so funny that the girl who is not lying about her profession is accused of lying by all the people who are, are lying about their profession. And it also, Riley, I reworked your idea about all the lawyers, but then giving a list of professions. So here's my thoughts. We do a season of all lawyers, but we give them before the game a list of all the people's professions. So there's 21 people's professions listed. Only one lawyer on the list, even though they're all lawyers. And then you do like a goat farmer, a cow milker. Like you do like a bunch of different stuff. So they look and they're going to be like, okay, there's four acrobats. I'm going to lie about being one of the acrobats. Like you do it so that they're like overlap, otherwise you can't lie. Yeah. So there's some overlap. So you have like, yeah, so you have overlap with a bunch of stuff and they're just going to be like, okay, there's six people that all have like a similar job. I'm going to just lie and say that that's my job. And then, uh, I think it's going to be awesome. And then everybody's trying to sniff out the lawyers. Everybody's trying to sniff out the lawyer, but everybody's a lawyer, but that's what you think is happening. I think there's a way to work this where we can really embarrass a bunch of lawyers on TV. which is all we've ever wanted. That's so cool. Yeah. Sounds great. Yeah, let us know in the chat if you can rework that a little cleaner or better than what we did, but that's what we've got so far. Let's go to Savu, the purple tribe. I think Anna showing off her voice skills and also going through the archetypes of stories is pretty entertaining. Yeah. We've got Ori as Prince Charming, Muscle Guy as Rob, Christian knows his stuff, Carter's the valiant sidekick, Alexis is the fairy, and Kristen is the informational sage, which I didn't know was an archetype, the informational sage. I didn't know that one either. You lost us there, but the rest were great. What about the role of the friendly vampire that Eric has put upon himself? Yes, the friendly vampire. Yeah, he's going around. What was his reasoning for friendly vampire? I don't know. He's just building relations and sucking the whatever. Sucking the life out of everybody? I guess. That's the thing you don't want to be known for, right? Well, let's go to it. So he goes to Carter, who's from Iowa, and says that's Slipknot country. He's a big band. Because if you would say Slipknot country to me, I would have no idea what you're talking about. And also, if you're telling me that you know the band Slipknot is from Iowa, that's a certain personality. That's a red flag. That's a red flag. We get all these blurbs of Eric, and they're just all misplaced. And I'm like, okay, I don't know what you're talking about. do you listen to pop music and christian's like no it was that christian that he said that to yep yeah yeah and uh he's going so hard jumping into every conversation and he's being this character and he's I have no doubt he's being exactly who he is in real life and so I thought it was really funny and I'm glad I didn't pick him for my winner pick because I think he will be too grating for most everyone yeah you almost picked him yeah I almost picked him but I picked Carter so he goes out fishing and And again, more band references. It's so punk rock. It's, who did he say? He didn't say the Sex Pistols. Did he say the Sex Pistols? He did say the Sex Pistols. Yeah, he said something about Sex Pistols. Yeah. Yeah. And he's out there fishing. And Rob wants to paint a target on him. Do you like this move from Rob? I don't love it either. I think Rob's playing too hard. Yeah, Rob's playing too hard, but not as hard as, yeah, maybe he is playing. He's playing too hard in that everybody just saw Eric get out of the water. And they're like, oh, he was actually fishing. And Rob's like, I guess I didn't see him. He didn't play it off, I guess, and be like, oh, I couldn't see him anymore. I'm sure that's what he said. Like, I thought he was wherever. People are going to catch on. Because if he keeps that up, man. Yeah. So I think so, too. Rob does have this group with Carter and Anna. So they're building something. And everyone's looking for Eric and he gets a fish. Yes. He's so proud. It's the smallest fish. Like it's smaller than the points on the spear almost. We've had some real small fish on Survivor. This one might be the smallest I can remember. We've got one big fish. Do you know what I did with this fish? I would get it. I would take it with my hand. I would crunch it up and then use it as bait for bigger fish. So then you sprinkle it around in the water and bigger fish come in to eat and then you get the bigger fish. That's smart. Totally. I mean, nobody's accused me of being dumb. People have. People have before. That's not nice people. Yeah. So Christian can't help but laugh at him. I love Christian's laugh is good. I think he's laughing at the right things that I also would laugh at. So, you know, he's good at choosing when to laugh. And then we get to see another side of Eric where they talk about how he proposed. Oh, yeah. Yeah. They start crying. He immediately starts crying about Gina. And then he goes to confessional and continues crying about getting a fish. yeah he's emotional I like it you know a man that can show his emotion but he is the odd man out as Alexis says and I do think like what is Eric's future here on this tribe will he be the first to go from Savu I don't think so I think it's kind of similar with Jenna where I'm like they've telegraphed it so much that now I don't believe he will be but you'd have to have a real turnaround to go deep in the game I think he can go I think he's fine if he's loyal because I think you get into a few days here like not going to the first tribal buys him some time if he's loyal to a group even though he's grating and annoying to some people and overkill or too much or whatever they're going to keep him around if he's loyal versus seeing someone else you know lie so I think if that happens and we saw it happened on on uh what's the tova toka we saw it on the toka tribe is that you know um who was it that told jenna pat told jenna that they were that she was the target yeah pat yeah patless pat patless pat so patless pat told jenna that she was the target like that's going to happen to eric if he's loyal to people and he is the still the target somebody's going to tell him to you know tone it down to play it cool and he will be able to i think counter whatever's coming for him um the next morning still at savu um rob runs out looking for an idol and immediately finds it is that like the quickest and easiest idol grab we've ever seen again we don't know how long it took. We don't know any of that but it seemed like it was pretty quick and it's a free idol not not a trick not a beware, nothing. Yeah. Old school idol. Old school idol and he told us he's not going to tell anybody until the end of the game. He's going to hold it all the way to the end of the game and not tell anyone. Riley what's that face? I think he's going to blab to somebody but he's going to get too excited. He seems like the type Who would get too excited? And I mean, I don't know. We always make fun of people for blabbing about everything, but there is some value in using an idol to like, hey, I actually have the only real currency in this game, which is information. And so if you share something that is rock solid, you can actually show them the idol and the parchment and whatever. That's going to earn you trust in a way that nothing else you do can. Just about making sure you share the exact right person. Yeah. Yes. yeah you use it for leverage in a moment when you need that um and i agree yeah i definitely wouldn't tell you know if i found an idol on day three i would not be telling someone on day three you know i feel like you need a good stretch of time before you're like okay this is a person that i can actually trust with this information to not go and blow it now everybody knows i have an idol that has my back and you almost have to wait till post merge to divulge that information because if you tell somebody pre-merge and then the tribe swap, somebody else uses that information as currency on their new tribe. Oh, interesting. Yeah. Yeah. It always happens. Always happens. You share and then you get to a tribe and then they say, and then the tribe swap again and that person pass it on to somebody and then that person's like, yeah, I already knew. And then everybody is already in the know and you're like, well, I got this secret idol that only one person knows about so yeah Rob do not tell anybody until at least past the merge think he'll take our advice no you should text him so that he knows okay yeah I'll text him right now and be like hey heads up you're not going to want to tell anybody about the idol yeah tell at least after the merge have you ever wondered how movements start i'm ashley c ford host of into the mix a ben and jerry's podcast about joy and justice this season we're talking to unexpected progressive heroes who found purpose in unexpected places people like marley diaz making sure every kid sees themselves in books kyle mesteth a native skateboarder building a movement for kids nationwide joy Aladakun, whose music moves from protests to daily commutes. Find out how they started something bigger than themselves and listen wherever you get your podcasts. Plan B is a backup birth control option that's there for you when things don't go according to plan. It specifically works after unprotected sex and before pregnancy occurs by temporarily delaying ovulation. Plan B is available nationwide at all major retailers and through delivery apps like DoorDash. No ID, prescription, or age requirement. It's the number one OBGYN recommended brand of emergency contraception, and it won't impact your future fertility. That's freedom to be. Use as directed. Thank you for watching. Ideas are gone because it's the new era and anything that's ever happened before could be in play, which means that historically anything that was there could now also be, which is also how it's always been. Yeah, there's a little bit of tension in the way he introduces this. But he does say permanent uncertainty again. And that's the maybe the theme of. Of the open era, whereas the new era, the theme was like harder than any survivor ever possible. This is now permanent uncertainty. Permanent uncertainty is I can get behind permanent uncertainty. It's much better than like drop the five, keep the one or something like that. Yeah. Okay. So we got a permanent uncertainty. One thing you said that was really interesting, I thought, was what happens at one time. tribes camp may not happen in another tribes camp which as far as i remember it's always always been the case that there's like a parallel you know like okay so like rhode island rob finds an idol that means there's going to be an idol with no strings attached to it hidden at the other camp or whatever now it's like well that actually may not be the case could be something completely different it could be another it could be like a beware advantage or it could be nothing or it could like that is that's like a real change where i think that's something that's never i mean correct me if i'm wrong in the comments but i can't remember any season where there was like unless it was like beware advantages that just were like a little bit different between camps or whatever but when it's like the idea that could just be completely different um that's like something truly new yeah i actually really like that idea too do you think we're gonna see it i think we will see it i like it too also especially if they do a swap or something where you know you can't have the same information it was like oh now i know now i know to go to the water well and look for like whatever because that's where it wasn't my old trap not even that but like rob going and telling someone he has the idol and then getting to the merge and being like who has the idol on the other beach and him just assuming that it's the same and then like selling it as the same it could exactly so i think i think the more differences let's lean into that i hope that they lean into that this season because then the misinformation will reoccur and then the misinformation will reoccur and then the misinformation will run rampant uh at the merge and at every tribe swap yep yeah totally yeah and even if exile is different every time too like okay lewis had a chance for an idol but maybe the next time it's still the tree but it's not an idol up there it's a steal a vote or something different so then the person comes back they're like i gotta steal a vote and lewis is like no it was an idol that was there you're a liar it was an idol that was there you're a liar it was an idol that was there it'd be interesting if it was like oh you know maybe it's a different um advantage too but it's not the tree it's like you gotta dig all this stuff or whatever so you come back you you also have blisters on your hands you're like lewis is lying he said it was a post he had to chop down but it was not it was you have to dig in the sand like a mile or whatever yes um so something's going on here yeah gosh yeah i love it so many possibilities with the open era right now like the open era has opened our minds dude finally on survivor anything yeah jeez this is what i'm saying at the top of the pot i'm into the open era okay they sold me yeah if they keep leaning into it yeah they need different things to happen on the different tribes that create mistrust and ever-changing in a way that also creates mistrust and uh and then we're good i don't think we need a bunch of all the other stuff but uh creating mistrust amongst people is what i i mean it's fun to watch on tv um jeff also then takes it to a vote about final four fire making yeah and they choose to keep it which as a player i think you do want fire making it's an insurance policy as a viewer i am more interested in watching somebody be devastatedly blindsided yeah and you're not hitting the same blindside itch or scratch with the fire making i think you're also well i mean if you're good at fire you want fire making in there well yeah yeah if you're good if you're good at fire you want fire making i guess for sure listeners of this pod will know that i hate the fire making challenge i'm like the biggest curmudgeon ever about this but uh as a counterpoint to as a player you might want it you know it's not like because jeff said that too it was like oh i want i want a shot at being able to stay but you're already the challenge yeah you're already thinking about failure it's like i want the shot to get me out of this i want the shot to get me out of this i want the shot to get out the person i need to get out to win the game yes not just have to put them in fire but actually just be like we can like cut the head off the snake here at four and you know so so it goes both ways i mean it's like you're you're also potentially hurting your game too yeah i think they they should ask them again like maybe two more times uh throughout the game just i just feel like it was just like maybe too soon for them to think think through it i think they need at the end see how they feel like during like like right before the merge or something where people are like desperate to get on the merge it would be interesting to do it like at final four before the challenge to be like what do you four want do you want this to be for all the marbles this challenge and let's say they haven't seen it yet they're like you know they they're right they don't know what they're competing in or they write it on parchment at camp yeah it's a blind okay man we're we're just like full of ideas today and you did have a tweet about uh netflix or perhaps peacock picking up a survival style show where you just maroon a bunch of people and then they oh yeah i had a grumpy i had a grumpy tweet last night when i saw the news that jeff also drops here that they're going to keep the the coin flip going i just you know i don't love the idea of anybody going home on a coin flip versus an actual vote out whatever and i think that there's an opening for i mean it'd be a smaller show than survivor this would be more niche i have to like concede at this point that like us like old school purists are a minority of viewers okay um but i do think there's a lane for like one of these shows to basically do an old school survivor season and they just have to change up you know of course the names of everything to avoid the trademarks or whatever but to do a more like hey this is truly going to be about social strategy and not much else um and it'd be fun i would watch it we could we could do a little podcast about it i think they kind of already do with like outlast i think they've been trying to transition it into more of a survivor flavored uh do they vote do they vote people out on outlast i haven't watched it they do they vote you out and then you get to go to the other tribes and see if they'll take you yeah and then you have like a couple hours uh yeah for them to make the decision and if they don't they'll take you yeah and then you have like a couple hours if you don't uh get onto the other tribe within like 24 hours you're if no tribe is willing to by majority have you on their tribe you're out um so it's interesting so i think we could rework it and make it that really cool but to argue riley with you a little bit i'm not trying to argue with you but if you know if you know the flip is coming up then you're convincing someone else to flip it not yourself which is yeah in a sense social strategy yeah yeah i guess so it's a good point because you're not flipping it yourself you're not going to take that chance but you would love someone else to double the prize money for you I wonder if it's going to be like it was for 50 where if nobody volunteers and it had to be unanimous too then they all draw rocks for somebody like it's a forced flip or if it's going to be more of a volunteer thing I think it's going to be I think they want that coin flip every season they want the coin flip every season but could you also go and vote someone out and then the person who's voted out they're like actually that person is flipping the coin this time but there'll be no stakes they're already out what if they get to stay but they don't get to choose now they're forced to flip it because it's oh no I see I don't know I don't know I mean if somebody's volunteering you that's you need someone to volunteer yeah maybe yeah yeah can I be honest I do not like that Mr. Beast has changed Survivor in any sort of way I don't like it yeah he's already ruined our lives like stop he's ruined your life he hasn't ruined my life I mean it kind of I find him a little annoying but I my life is ruined listen the misinformation spread on YouTube which is the only medium my kids want to ingest any form of media is partly because probably of him a Mr. Beast to YouTube yes he's changed everything I don't allow my kids to watch YouTube without me sitting there because there's so many times where you're like that's not actually accurate yeah or you get like a weird little video or like the AI yeah something weird comes up yeah right into it is it going to be the Mr. Beast coin every time or is it going to have a new name is it going to be like maybe it's not attached to Mr. Beast at all I hope it has a has the whale on it because I really enjoy the little whale that we're seeing on everything such a beautiful whale so if it's there's a whale on that I'd buy like a collectible of it we made fun of the dinosaurs I actually the immunity the immunity statue I was like that would look so sick on my back here behind me yeah yeah I like the whale yeah pretty sick think I can get the whale yes do you think Matt Van Wagnon would give me the whale maybe now I'm thinking about it you can probably get I mean I've got a bunch of trinkets back here from Etsy and I know that there were some immunity idols that you could get like you know reproductions oh and they remake them so I have yeah so people like look and they kind of do things I'm going to use my knife right here okay real quick to show this is my this is I'm pointing with it so I this is my fidget spinner I just play with my pocket knife while I'm talking but right where I'm pointing right there is the fake idol made on Edge of Extinction during Winners at War that Ethan made and they were going to pass off to whoever won their way back in the game wow and they tried to pass it to me cooler than mine cool they tried to pass it to me and they Jeff wouldn't allow it because back then the the players didn't write the rules of the game there was actual rules of the game unlike the open era so Jeff was like nope you can't pass that to him right now so that is there so I do have trinkets but the whale statue is extra cool yes and I want the original one I'm not going to buy an Etsy knockoff dude okay yeah well you know not all of us have access to this stuff that's originally from the island okay this is a fan made cool stuff from on Etsy there's some creators doing some cool things this is a fan made knit of statue of myself wow in Winners at War that's really sick yeah and I they posted it and I asked if I could have it and it was sent to me so that was pretty cool but I do want the whale the whale is awesome and the flip coin if it's progressive enough after like six seasons it might be enough to get Boston Rob back on the island or Parv back out on the island or some of these big hitters that have kind of said you know we're done playing is it enough for me? I don't know it's a lot of money it's awesome it's hard to win Survivor but how big is this gonna get? are we gonna is the flip gonna double this year? I mean it's 50% chance every time it has to for TV purposes it has to like send someone home yeah or no it cannot hit it has to send someone home because it's hit last time it's gotta fail this time so that it rolls to the next season and so it's even a bigger woo it can't hit this time and is connecting the seasons like this good or bad or it doesn't? I don't know it doesn't matter I don't think it's too bad I feel like it's still easy for people to get into like any season without it like having to reference to the last season or anything so I think it's still good and then maybe it might help people to be into like re-watching or watching the last season it might encourage them a little bit I think it's a good idea just to connect everything I don't mind the rollover yeah Riley I think it's nice if you were on Survivor would you rather win one million dollars or six million dollars? boy let me take my time thinking about this one and finally we get to the immunity challenge yes ideas from here Carter diving through the opening in the fence gap was amazing what Bruce tried to do on his initial season yeah it's a risky move it's a risky move dude that's all of his body weight on his face through the opening awesome move that was so cool yeah we thought that I thought Devin was gonna come in because he did that whole acro hold and everything that he was gonna be the guy but Carter dang he gets through everybody else is like clunking their heads together like probably they could have done a bunch of coconut sound over all the yes they're all trying to get through um and then uh the challenge itself is it more old school than it has been or is that just people saying it where are the sandbags I didn't see one sandbag and I feel like sandbags are like part of our thing now so what the heck there were no sandbags there was the balls that thing was heavy the huge steps were heavy I've done that that's brutal uh Brady did get intense did you see them drop uh who was on the shoulders someone there I think it was the yellow team okay when they finally tipped their thing over they dropped that girl without like any care yeah I think they dropped her so hard I was like oh my god I watched it a couple times not didn't even try yeah no pants dropping really hard man poor Pat yeah she seems okay though but yeah there was uh there was that and uh I like the challenge it was physical I like those ones where everybody's kind of got to work together but I did also note a lot of people were standing around a lot of times when other people were working like they get through the net and then they just like stand up it's like can't you circle back around and push another I think you could yeah there's more to do but uh yeah uh and then Savu wins purple yellow goes to tribal council Brady our Brody it's losing more than he loves winning and gee Jenna's the easy out you're skipping past the part of this challenge that I thought was completely insane which is that Savu purple wins and then they have to pull a lever and the lever oh yes it's yellow sorry for you sorry for you I was like that's wild is that being mean is that trying to be mean because we did see tweets about how Survivor was mean again I didn't notice any meanness on this episode from players no not not really not the players yeah well and Jeff wasn't extra sassy he wasn't leaning into sassiness more but there was this one flag yeah that I think the flag would have made me so mad it's so wild to have it have it built into the challenge though sorry for you I hope they keep that I want it for like every challenge yeah instead of just triggering the their flag that says you're safe it triggers the other flag that says you're not it's the same it's the same would you feel extra bad with that if it were a three if it were a three tribe season where you've pulled the lever and it's like two banners come down it's like sorry for both of you no but that would only happen during a double tribal council I guess so yeah okay that makes sense yeah so both of them would drop halfway but not say anything and then the other person finished it off and then drops the whole way yeah sorry for you so yeah that was a little bit wild I did have that in my notes but I don't think for the players they felt any sort of way about it I think it's losing is losing and winning is winning go back to the scramble tribe Toka and Brady's self-aware enough to know that he was very intense was he? I mean he apologized immediately he came back to camp and was like I'm sorry for being intense and yelling a bunch at the, at the, challenge well okay oh yeah yeah okay yes so he apologizes first yes and the tribe's like no it's all good you know it's the challenge whatever but then later when he hears um that alia had said oh he was kind of intense or whatever he's like what i'm not intense yeah you're all intense have you ever competed that was intense i mean and then he's like in a confession he's like that lit a fire under me i was like hey i kind of think this guy's down a little bit intense is this guy intense or is he it's hard to tell he's not he's saying he's not intense but i'm getting a kind of intense yeah yeah um yeah he was intense and uh then he's like then he's like to prove how not intense he is he's like if my mom came to football practice i'd lay her out you're right yeah it's just competition it's not being intense yeah it's just you know that's competition i guess for a million dollars i mean so now we need to get a go fund me going for a million dollars to see brady lay out his mom lay his mom out at football practice okay okay okay we're all in agreement start to go fund me okay uh yeah somebody else start it but we will definitely advertise it here on the pod is spoken um so jenna is on the block everybody pretty much is like yes it's jenna and then jelly is actually the one who said she doesn't want a girl to go first she wants a man to exit first and so she's the one that really set into motion to target brady a little bit but then alia got the blowback for it is that an incorrect read is that yeah it seemed like all the girls that were maybe not all the girls on the tribe there were at least four or five of them maybe all of them were there um we're sitting around and thinking or talking about brady's intensity and then alia is the one that got tattled on by pat that's a great point because i feel like maybe i think this makes jenna's uh move to tell brady about what alia said even more opponent because i feel like yeah she could have said jelly's name but i don't think it would have hit as hard because jelly wasn't the person who was having struggles during the challenge and so she definitely just picked who would be just the easier person for everyone to go against so yeah that's really interesting that she did that that just shows she has better gameplay than we was it on purpose or was it on accident i think it was on purpose okay yeah so uh yeah because pat told jenna that she was a target but she didn't necessarily say you know anything after that so it was up to jenna to go and spread that information which did save her from what we saw her doing that did save her and keep her in the game and uh she i thought it was interesting that brady was not the target at all for how intense he was i would have a hard time not voting him out like i was like i don't want that intensity to backfire and come at me let's just get rid of it before it's a problem for some for for me specifically but for anybody i don't want to have to deal with that every time it seemed like they felt like they needed the muscle the muscle yeah pretty classic survivor early game reasoning yeah exactly so that will be helpful in the future since the open era is like full of twists i'm assuming they're gonna have a bunch of bribe swaps they're gonna do a bunch of weird stuff do you think it was the right decision to keep brady on even though they probably won't be able to use his muscle for a lot of the challenges i think that if you're returning season he's gone maybe not necessarily right now but they're not unless you have a bunch of muscly people that are all like oh yeah we don't want to be the targets we'll just sell it as keeping muscle around right now um i think you don't take that into consideration whatsoever so they're keeping muscle but they also lost the first challenge so like yeah is keeping the muscle to play because they got out muscled that first time so that's yeah and it's going to be a swap there's going to be a swap probably at 17 well yeah at 17 you think at 18 i mean at 18 yeah uh the other thing i saw was that the genders now in the future are not going to be equal all the time is a thing open era yeah open era i like that i think that it's 50 men 50 women only works until you add non-binary and transgender and all of that so constructs so now let's just base the tribes on strength and equal opportunity as best we can and i think that's going to be a big challenge for us we can everywhere across the board yeah but that's always kind of like yeah i think that's uh i think now that they said it it's i guess i don't know i think they didn't need to ever necessarily advertise that or say that but let's do it that's what it should have been for the new era but now we're going to do it for the open era um i i feel too like so i kind of when we saw that the cast was 21 and kind of i think some people said oh yeah we're going to do it for the open era and we're going to do it for the open era and i think that's what we're going to do for the open era and i think that's what we're going to do for the open era and i think that's what we're going to do for the open era and i think that's what we're going to do for the open era and i think that's what we're going to do for the open era and i think that's what we're going to do for the open era and i think that's what we're going to do for the open era and i think that's what we're going to do for the open era and i think that's what we're going to do for the open era we sort of knew that going into this episode um you know my immediate thought was okay when they get to 18 i bet they do split into three tribes of six and now i'm not so sure because of how much they sold the open era and the uncertainty and whatever i gotta think that everybody on that beach is thinking the same thing because it's like it's going to be three tribes of six with an exile oh so they'll do it at 17 or at uh at 19 yeah yeah anything can happen they'll send somebody to exile and then they'll be like tribe swap and then they'll put it into three tribes and then somebody gets voted out and that person from exile comes to that tribe what a terrible thing to come back to a new tribe of a smaller new smaller tribe what happened yeah who are you people man yeah so that could be uh but it's all speculation which we did get accused of speculating on how the cast would do for the our cast analysis which is the whole point of that fucking episode reckless speculation reckless speculation sorry we have 30 seconds of information on each player all it is is speculation it's 100 speculation we've never been trying to hide that um and actually now we're just like open about it like our cast analysis is purely speculation yes yep uh-huh okay didn't think i was ever in doubt yep i didn't think i had to say it out loud here for our listeners but there's one person out there who uh is very upset that we speculated sorry dude yeah we're so sorry about the speculation uh tribal council brady and devon cannot see eye to eye but they still love each other which is can they come back together fully at this point i'm like i don't know like they they are open about being against each other which i guess is some amount of trust given but it seems like it's a rift you know it's the open era just like even more fluid than the new era which is even more fluid than the later uh old school eras like voting clusters and voting blocks and now like i don't know i feel like both of them are open to coming back together and not having a real issue but they're both unwilling to not target their target i think that it's a great dynamic for them right now but when lewis comes in who is a very he loves chaos he will he probably won't be as open and honest about it as they are about their different sides i feel like he's gonna mess up their their little thing that they have right now because i feel like it is a dynamic that they could get used to and they're 100 honest with each other i'm voting for her oh well i'm voting for him okay but when lewis comes in it's just gonna change the dynamic that they're already setting up in this little in the tribe so i think it's just not gonna work out as long as this tribe is like put together a sower of chaos lewis will be yes yes hopefully he better do it i hope so too i mean he threatened so uh yeah put your money where your mouth is lewis um who's right and who's wrong here with brady and devon i kind of feel like devon is wrong i think yeah somebody is targeting brady your ally If that ally comes to you, it's like, this person's targeting me. Yeah. Jenna's not targeting any, either of them. So he can, like, Devin, like, putting his foot down, I get it. He feels good about Aaliyah. He wants Aaliyah there. Aaliyah's with him. But at a certain point, if you want to show Brady that you're also with him and you need to protect him. Like, I feel like this was a good spot for Devin to be like, okay, no, you're feeling threatened. Like, I get that. Like, we want to protect each other. I'm with you. That's a hole in the helicopter alliance already. Yeah. It's a hole in the helicopter alliance, but at the same time, like, can you, should you die with the ship? Like, if the ship is sinking, like, Devin probably had enough information to understand the ship was sinking. He could have switched his vote, but then maybe he pisses jelly off. So I don't know, but I do believe that this was an opportunity for Devin to lock Brady in tighter. And he didn't do it. And I think that if you're Brady, this is going to be a red flag moving forward. Absolutely. I agree. Because Brady is fighting for his life. Devin isn't. And Devin's unwilling to help save Brady for what Brady believes is important. Yep. Yep. So we get, I don't know, just more about Jenna struggling to open up. And, uh, and everybody kind of agreeing, but also, you know, like what, and then Devin being like, uh, I'm voting Jenna no matter what. And then Pat, was, was, was Aaliyah going the whole time? Or did it only happen after the live tribal when Pat named Aaliyah as the other target? I think it was Pat. Pat definitely helped that. Cause it was like, I don't know. I felt like everyone was looking at Jenna. That's easy. That was the easy vote. Everyone mentioned it 5 million times. And the minute that Pat said, well, you're, you're on the chopping block too. Suddenly people were getting up. Suddenly people were whispering. She, she set the motion. I, I'm really, does she have more power or like more influence in this tribe than we see from just like already? Cause they, yeah. Cause they were just immediately like, yeah. Oh, Pat. Okay. I think maybe she does. But I also feel like. Okay. Okay. I feel like she's just kind of like shared information that then started a fire. Awesome. Yeah, it is awesome. It was perfect. Like she shared the information with Jenna. Jenna then like went around and like got it all, got everyone riled up. And then here at tribal council, everyone's kind of just like talking about how Jenna's the odd man out. And then she's like, well, Aaliyah's a target too. And then Aaliyah's like, wait, what? Who knew? And the tribal turns live. It's, it's like unclear. It's unclear to me if Pat actually wanted Aaliyah out or just wanted to save Jenna. Cause we get the, like, you know, obviously she's the one who tells Jenna about, you know, your name's floating out there, but then we never get Pat being like, and I want this person to go. I think she wanted to save Jenna. I feel like that's the vibe is she likes Jenna. She feels bad for Jenna. And so she like was trying to help Jenna without sticking her neck out too much. But I also feel like pressed for information. She's one of the ones that. Uh, is not a lifelong survivor fan. And so here she's when pressed for information, she gave it up to Jeff immediately. Yeah. And both working moves, I feel like at a tribal council, but great for us watching at home. So yeah, I support, I support casting these types of people. And also like Aaliyah exited. So it's, is it that bad for Pat? Because Pat did name Aaliyah, but Aaliyah ended up leaving. So now like there's, she's fine. She's free and clear maybe with Devin only, but I don't think he's can hold that against anybody. I don't think they're even going to look at her sideways about it either because of the way Devin spoke up so much during the tribal, like it's Devin and Jenna and Brody. They're all like the front of everyone's minds right now. So she just right. Got right through it. I did like how everyone was live tribaling. And then Jeff was having a conversation with Devin and then was like, oh, Brady, you want to say something too? And yeah, they were both like, Devin was like, I'm still voting. I'm still voting Jenna, no matter what. And Brady was just like, everything he says is valid. I can't tell a person how to feel like so good. Kind of very nice. I like, I like their dynamic a lot of just being like, yeah, this is what I'm doing. Is it too honest for survivor? Maybe. But I like it. I like, I like watching it. I like seeing that they're, they're not getting along, but they're getting along. It's, it's so refreshing. But it also, to me, it shows that especially Devin. Yeah. Because he's not, his name isn't being thrown out there is unwilling to compromise for a supposed ally. Yeah. Definitely bad for his game. I mean, I think he said in his pre-season press that he wanted to play like Joe, right? And that's kind of like that uncompromising people have to play around him type. Yeah. I mean, he's intense enough that I could see that people getting scared to, to cross him in any capacity. And then the, until you're certain that he's exiting that night, you don't want to cross him at all. Right. Is he there yet though? Because I feel like Joe was able to create that environment around him where he had the numbers, he had the people who were actually listening to him on everything. And Devin is coming into it with barely any numbers. He's already lost. He's not getting along with an alliance member. He's not getting along with a potential alliance member. Does he have the power to be a Joe in, in this game right now? Um, I don't know. Cause Joe, the thing about him too, was at a certain point, people were like, he can't win in the end. We also need to ride with him. Like he's, and so I like that we'll have to cross that bridge a little later when we can understand how people are feeling about Joe. Um, but yeah, I think, uh, I guess like maybe it's good for sticking around if you're this loyal and this honest and upfront about the thing you're doing, but I think it's bad for your end game. I think so too. I agree. Yeah. So, um, okay. Well, Aaliyah and Jenna both play their shot in the dark. Neither one of them hit. Could both of them have hit? I think so. Right. It's a pick of six and another pick of six. Only one can hit. I think I'm pretty sure it's only one can hit. Okay. It was how I believe it worked was that it's like, they don't replace the scrolls between that's why they do scrolls instead of dice rolls. I believe if I, if I recall this correctly was so that multiple basically can't hit. Okay. Okay. Wow. Well, we might get clear. Someone will correct me and tell me I'm wrong. Clarity on that somewhere. I could text right now, but I'll hold off. Uh, so. Okay. I'll be completely wrong about that and it'll be, uh, it'll be embarrassing, but no, I'm pretty, I, that's, I believe that's why they do scrolls instead of like actually rolling a dice. Cause they want. No, but the thing is, is that whoever draws first has a one in six and then whoever draws second has a one in five. No. Cause they replace the scroll. No, they, it's not that they replace the scroll. It's that you, you have no information about what the first scroll that they picked was. So it could be one in five or it could be zero in five. Right. You're still, you're still getting one of six scrolls that you don't know any more information about. Okay. Regardless of what, where you pick them in. Math. Yeah. I don't like math anymore. Okay. That's a valid point, Riley. I concede. Um, I just wanted to see both of them hit and then be like, we have to revote and it's not either of these guys. That'd be awesome. That would be awesome. I don't know how they would do it. Like if it's one in six, but there are 10 people on a tribe, I actually don't, that where I'm unclear is like, what if like eight people play their shots in the dark or seven or whatever? Like then do they not have enough scrolls? Why didn't we vote on shot in the darks at the beginning of the challenge? Yeah. We have to revisit those votes, Mr. Jeff. Come on, man. Yeah. Would they have voted to keep it? Probably. Yeah. Um, but yeah. So you're saying Riley, you think six people are going to at one point all draw a shot in the dark? No, I don't, I don't know. Cause you have to be like pretty sure you're on the outs to, to play it. Right. Well, what if there's like a tribe of eight and you're like, and six people are all like, it's me tonight. I'm going to give up my vote and do shot in the dark. You convince everybody to just all like get rid of their shot in the dark. But then you don't play yours and you keep a couple people back and then you control the vote completely with a minority. I guess that would be like a pretty epic move. If you're like, Hey, if we all play our shots in the dark, then there'll be no vote. There'll be no vote. It will all be safe and get to go home. They'll have to send us home because we'll all, none of us will have any votes. So we'll all be safe. We can get out of here. This is like, I've found the loophole in the system to make it so that we can skip this tribal council. Except the problem is, is that you're then in the dark. And in a situation where If you don't, everyone will be so tempted to be the one person that doesn't play the shot in the dark because then they just vote out whoever they want. How can you trust that everyone will do the right thing? But if you get into one of those super small, which is like, oh, it's only three of us going to travel constant night. It's all three. If all three of us play shot in the dark, they have to send us home and we're safe. Yeah, okay. What they'd actually probably do is say, okay, you all three played shot in the dark and now you're going to have a real vote. Anybody who didn't win, the one person that's safe is safe and everybody has to revote after that. Something like that. Yeah, or if they're all, if they're all, yeah, if they're all like not safe or something. Yeah, I don't know. Anyways. Yeah, well, hopefully we can have it play out. Two things. If you get something to try. Yeah, yeah. Two things before we get to Riley's Reads. We have the over-under that someone's going to go on a reward challenge by themselves this season. Is that happening? Do we have enough of a fan base in our Survivor contestants now? We, there were, there were three, as we said on the preview pod, there were three people who followed our Instagram handle before and then, but then there was also a fourth, Pat, who she wasn't following us, but she messaged after to say she listened to our pod on our way out to Fiji. So there's at least four contestants that were listening to this pod before they went to play. And so they may know about our, our desire to see this, this epic. I think it's going to be Pat. Yeah. I would never do it. I don't think. I think that it'd be, it'd be shocking coming from her. Come on, Pat. Come on, Pat. You can change that nickname. Yes. Change that nickname. Okay. So that's not happening. Riley says that's not happening. Ashley, you think we're going to see it? I think it's going to happen. I think, why wouldn't it be Pat? She's the one who's been listening to our stuff right before she was starting to play the game. She's probably in the, she's in the Tyson mindset. She's going to, she's going to do a little some something that's going to, that's going to be fun. And yeah, it's got to happen. I believe anything could happen in the open era. I think Lewis is also, more educated on Survivor than we initially gave him credit for. So I'm hoping he also. With that deep line. I mean, it's like, okay, he's got some knowledge here. I also. Is he ever going to go back on a, on a journey ever again after this? Because it feels like he's been tortured a little bit. Yeah, he will. He'll try to get. He'll try to do it again. No, he knows there's an idol there. Or he believes there'll be an idol there. So I think he'll try to get back. Okay. And secondly, still on Lewis, premiere episode of Lewis's Survivor career, better and cooler than Tyson's premiere episode on Token Chains. Was that? I didn't get naked. That's exactly right. Did you do the naked dance on your premiere episode? That was that episode? Yeah. Yeah. There was no nakedness. He just threw up. That's different. That's not cool enough. It's different. Yeah, I don't think he threw up on yours, huh? Yeah. I mean, we have my, the famous line from the opening scene where Erin says she wants to work with me. So maybe that 15 second blurb by itself was more powerful. But Lewis, you're doing a good job. We'll give you some flowers. Yes. Riley, what do we have? Well, one thing I want to, before we actually fully get to Riley's reads is, you know, there were two votes for Jenna at this tribal council. Devin. Obviously. And then Jelly is the other one. So that's sort of not a position you want to be in after the first tribal council was having put a vote on somebody that you now have to go back to camp with. Did they both know that they were going to be on the outs there or did you think they believed that Jenna was the target? Because that's also another thing is everybody was telling them, yes, we're voting Jenna and then didn't. That is a true rift. I think Devin, I don't know if it was just Devin, I would be like, okay, Devin is basically like my word is my bond. And I said, I was voting for her 100%. So I have to. And then I'll just deal with the fallout. But like Jelly voting too was like, did she have any, maybe, maybe she was like, I just can't write Aaliyah's name down even after three days. I don't know. Yeah. Yeah. I think that's what it was. It's definitely an alliance thing that they totally messed up. They, yeah. They just were like, I don't know. I think they're going a little too hard for the alliance already. And they haven't like set up the, the spy, the secret part of this whole alliance. No one's supposed to know, but now everybody knows. And there's also 10 people. So you need six there. Yeah. So, yeah. I do. I think that's, I think it's bad. It depends. It's definitely, Jenna's not going to be excited about either of them. Right. Right. And that's probably the, the bulk of it is Jenna. You're creating an enemy in Jenna. So, yeah. I think it's early enough. It's going to, you know, the other tribe might lose next. There's going to be a lot of time. Although, I say that we have 21 people in 26 days. So there's still a tribal council happening more than every other day. Mm-hmm. So, yeah. Yes. Yeah. We're going to have to have some double eliminations. Yeah. Or a tribal two nights in a row, multiple times, like stuff like that's going to happen. So. Yeah. So it is going to be fast. So you have a day, maybe two days to correct instead of three or four. Next week, looks like we have rain. That's old school. Yes. I don't think we've seen much torrential downpours in the new era. Yes. We have some big falls and we have a lot of blood. All of that is old school stuff. Yeah. So. Frody. Yeah. Brody Brady. Dude. Dude, bro, man. Okay, Riley, what do you got? All right. Let's do our categories. Who advanced their game the most this episode? I mean, Jenna, obviously, staying alive was a big advancement. Staying alive, but I mean, was her, do you feel like her game is in good, in good shape, actually? I don't think it's in terrible shape. I don't think she's going to be the next to go now. I think she's gotten out of it. And I think she's learned she needs to be more vulnerable and open. I think she's aligned well enough with Pat if Pat's willing to give her information. So I think she's sitting fine. I think, yeah, I think, I'm going to say Jenna. Okay. Um, I'm going to say Kilby. He was able to do the negotiations really well. Yeah. Um, he surprised everybody with what he brought back, was able to spin it. And like, this is the best thing that I could have got, guys. They're very happy. He did the puzzle. Nobody even looked at him twice, even though I'm pretty sure they, the puzzle people were like neck and neck with the other people. They could have totally won it if they were a little bit faster. But Kilby was able to stay in this little pocket of the middle, middle players where no one's really, really noticing him. And I think it was all from the Haggling at the very beginning. His Haggling came back with like positive results. And I think that's the best you can do for a fun dude like Kilby because I think people were underestimating him like immediately from the get when he started talking. So I'm glad that he is able to, to help his, his entire persona in front of them. Yeah. It does seem like he's kind of laid low. He's not as, you know, as, as, it seemed like he might've been a little nervous early on and that could have not been great had he taken some missteps, but he seems like he's, yeah, just kind of settled in and under the radar. Okay. Riley? I'll say Ori. Just, he connected with everybody, including had like, you know, one contestant basically ready to marry him after an hour of talking. Yeah. And he did give a great locker room speech before the challenge. He did. He gave a great locker room speech. Yeah. It's not, it doesn't seem to be rubbing anybody the wrong way or anything. And yeah, I feel like he could be in a good position. You know, we'll get a little more of that tribe hopefully going forward. And, but I have the sense that he's in a good position. Yes. All right. Opposite question is who damaged their game the most? I think Devin. I think Devin, like unwilling to bend for Brady when Brady's name was floating and, and Devin wasn't is a hard spot to be in. Like how can you as Brady not look at that as a red flag? Yeah. The other, my runner up, I won't say my runner up and tell you to say in case you chose that person. I have one here. Ashley. I was going to say Brody. Brody is my runner up for, he, I think he went a little too hard in some cases and he seems to be a little vindictive when it comes to his game. So that might be a little hard for people to want to work with him or even like, I don't know, just like if they say one bad thing about Brody, suddenly they're, they're his number one, like enemy. That's not fun. He's intense. Yeah. Yeah. He's intense. Riley. I agree that both of those two damaged their game, but I also have another person to kind of shout out negatively here, which is Lewis. I just think going to, I think we'll see the aftermath of this, but it's like the volunteering to go on the, the journey or the exile. Island, like not reading the room, seeing it in nobody else wanted to do it and so now you're away for three full days the first bonding opportunity you're gonna come back with the suspicious blisters all over your hands uh everyone's gonna assume you got an idol no matter what i mean it's just like instant threat like instantly sort of not that he can't get his way out of it but it's like that that is just like instant target on your back um so you know yeah jack bark he survives the first tribal council like he wanted to but it's like the long-term game the medium-term game all in jeopardy yeah okay i agree with tyson was that your runner-up or no but i'll i'll use my runner-up for something else they're oh okay they're the next to go is that what we're doing now uh no well let's do winners first and then we'll do okay so we said on the on the preview pod that we could because normally we pick and stick yeah yeah like like the open area there's no rules we make we make our own you don't have to pick and stick but we usually do but you specifically were like we can shift around um this time yeah yeah because the preview we had little to go off of it i almost chose eric who is my next to go he's next to go um but he might not uh we'll talk about that in a second my winner pick and i'm gonna keep them for the long haul oh kristin oh really okay okay how come um i just think that people respect her i think her energy is like that of like a leader without her like um i think that people respect her i think her energy is like that of like a leader without her like inserting herself into the leader position so i think people will take her advice her word her leadership but she won't necessarily be the leader uh interesting i got kind of like an opposite read on her you think she's gonna go soon you think she's gonna step into the leadership role too much yes exactly i kind of even with the negotiation felt that she was a little too like i'm gonna get in here and like dominate this guy and like win this negotiation and meanwhile you had kilby that was like the important thing is that i form a connection with someone on the other tribe yeah kind of was like that is actually the smarter approach okay there and so i don't know i feel like she's a little it was like a little too competitive in a way that anyways i don't know i just got okay fine i'll choose differently right i'm not saying no you have to stay i have to stay now i can't switch it now okay but next episode we can change it next episode we'll see if we'll see if she becomes the dictator or if she's able to lay back and let somebody else be an alpha while she uh is not right i like that that's what it'll be on her what i like that we have different reads on her that will be dependent though it really is dependent on where she slots herself in because if she does then just rise to the top as the top of the totem pole leader of the group then she's doesn't stand a chance right right ashley who's your winner pick i like jelly this episode i really enjoyed jelly's vibe very cool person um i think it all depends on next episode though if everyone places the blame on all the votes on jenna onto devon only and not really think too much about jelly and she continues to like form a bond with the girls and everything i think she can get through that little blunder of like an alliance like exposure but yeah i think i really like her i like i like her and i want to know what makes her lasagna so good yeah and is lasagna an underrated sleeper like is that uh yeah it's like that not enough people celebrate i you know what maybe it is i want to know more about this like what is going on in that kitchen what else is she cooking is it just lasagna many questions i like her okay i gotta write this down for when we do exit press uh because who knows how often lasagna is going to come up or when she's going to go home but we got to remember to ask for what what's the secret um whenever that is who the heck knows could be weeks months from now um she might win she might win lasagna on her if she does we'll go to her house yes please okay riley who's your who's your winner pick yeah uh i'm sticking with my my pre-season pick of sharanda sharanda i got yeah i got everything i wanted i got everything that i wanted out of her this episode um laying low forming connections you know like the helicopter lines yes but actually like the first connection she formed was with kristin yeah so she's got all these different um you know relationships brewing and she was one of the people that raised her hand to eliminate fire making so i got you yeah i think uh it will be how will the merge happen for her if she comes back with devon and jelly i think them voting to keep alia is kind of good for sharanda too because she can see that they are loyal to that group they set up yeah yeah that's that's true it's a good point that is like the counter argument to you know being on the outside of vote is that there was an alliance that included alia yeah yeah so okay uh what's next all right who's going home next week you already had one you already had eric yeah i think it's eric but also like it's so obvious that it's probably not eric um so first of all we have to look at what tribes lose uh problem maybe uh probably yellow loses again like i like that's not on her list i think it's probably not on her list i think it's probably not on her list heard of and if yellow does lose again is it brody might be brady brody brady brody i think i think yellow is gonna lose i think at the challenge they're gonna be behind and brady is gonna lose his mind and that's gonna be enough for everybody to get rid of him okay plus he's already kind of button heads with him with devin and jelly in the voting uh this week yeah yeah so i'm changing it eric while grading to his tribe he does have a soft spot and i think that did endear people to him a little bit uh so yeah brady ash ashley who you got i think uh brady is definitely getting like medevac next episode whatever he did with his hand looked really bad okay um and but if he doesn't i would say i you know what i think that they would go for um jenna again i think they might go for jenna again if she doesn't talk about her photography stuff if she does not open up i think they're gonna just be like that's an easy vote we could try to get her out last time she didn't get out last time let's just get her out this time that'll be easy peasy i think with how brody and devin are just like capitalizing on this group and i think that's gonna be an easy vote and like so vocal i think they no one wants to like be as vocal as them no one wants to be a target so they're gonna just do whatever they want for like just a couple more episodes till the big twist and they start switching tribes and stuff so i think jenna might be in trouble if she doesn't talk she's gotta share what her favorite like focal length is or she's toast we've never seen this on survivor before this is a first the new era where sharing a focal length is what keeps you in the game what lenses are you using if you don't answer correctly you're toast riley who you got uh yeah tyson you and i have similar reads i i have brady going home i think if if yell loses again because they kind of called it out this episode too where they were it was like oh we need his muscle but like actually you only pushed like one crate so like what you know and then as we see he looks like he cuts his hand up pretty bad and so then if you're like oh now he's injured anyways so is the strength even a thing he's really you know obviously he's like not intense at all but maybe he's a little bit intense and uh you know i uh yeah i see it he's just a little too much and so okay i have brady and last thing is lewis gonna barf again because it seemed like he might barf over the blood he might he should just do it every episode just barf every episode yeah that is better than what i did barf once either he has you beat or you have him beat there depending on how we feel about barfing on tv yeah it's all in the eye of the beholder um all right that'll do it here at the pod has spoken thank you all so much for tuning in ashley and riley thank you for being here for your time and energy and valuable insight we created art this episode i do believe and if channel, follow us wherever you get your podcasts, subscribe, all of that helps us. 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