Jules Koostachin on Indigenous Storytelling

If you don't give up, just keep going and picking yourself up. Yeah, yeah. You'll finally get to that place, but it's a lot of work. It's not an easy journey. That's for sure, because it's so much rejection. It's your art. It's your-- it's like there's an art-- you're putting your stuff out there, and then people are turning you down. Like, it's the worst. And then it's a lot of rejection, but you have to be able to deal with it and think yourself back up. But yeah, I feel like those first films are just kind of what shaped my style and stuff and what kind of stories I want to be in everything. I'm not talking about indigenous communities, so I'm just part of my storytelling. Quain, Eveelle Lleese, 10-pometer, and I am the host of this show, The Warrior Life. I'm a lawyer-professor, author and activist from You River First Nation, and my motto has always been education for action, education for awareness, it doesn't really change anything. So we're all about action on this podcast. I feel like action is the only way to get indigenous rights, recognize and implemented, to really achieve social justice and to protect the planet. And on this podcast, you're going to get an education of a different kind. It's one that's enriched with the cultures, and insights, and experiences of indigenous activists, land defenders, and water protectors on the ground, as well as artists, lawyers, and authors and academics, and leaders of all kinds, who are on the front lines and blazing trails in all areas. And today's podcast is with one of my favorite film makers ever. She's just like one of my favorite people ever from Attawapescat First Nation. So stay tuned. You really don't want to miss this one. This one's going to be pretty awesome. [MUSIC PLAYING] Welcome back warriors. I am so glad you are joining us on the Warrior Life podcast, especially today. Today's guest, I'm just so excited. I chased her down and chased her and chased her. Till she finally agreed to come on this show, Dr. Jules Kastation is just one of the most amazing people as a community member and an activist, and this amazing Native woman blazing trails. But she's also an award-winning filmmaker, a writer, a performance artist, an academic, a public speaker, a business owner. I mean, you could just literally give, I don't know, 20 adjectives to what she's doing. And there seems to be a theme. It feels like every time I talk to an artist, they're not just doing one thing. They're doing 1,000 things. And on top of all of that, she is amazing educational background in theater, and media, and the arts, and documentaries, and methods, and all of these other things. And I think most people know her from her impressive list of shorts, documentaries, and films. But honestly, she just does so many things, and she's also this amazing mother. So without further ado, welcome to the podcast, Dr. Jules. - Thank you so much. - Thank you for having me. Wow, I feel so special and honored to be here. I was like, I use your podcast, or I used to when I was teaching in class all the time. So I'm like, yay, here. (laughing) - Yay, now you can use it, and you'll be on the podcast. (laughing) - Right, that's awesome. - Yeah, and thank you for doing this, 'cause I know this is like festival time, and all the people who are in your line of work, they're in festivals, we know imaginatives coming up, there's vifs and tiff, and all these other amazing places where filmmakers get to showcase their work. And I wanna talk to you about all of that. But I think for people, there might be like five people on the planet who don't know who you are. Just in case, I'm wondering if you could just introduce yourself, the way you'd like to, where you're from, and just a little bit about yourself. - So, watch it. - And remember about a Wapasca first nation, and I live here on the unceded ancestral lands of the Kosei Lich peoples, otherwise known as Vancouver. I've been here since 2015, when I started my PhD at UBC. And yeah, my focus was on indigenous documentary, protocols and process, methodologies, and how indigenous people approach our stories. Yeah, my mom, I got four sons, love in the West Coast, they love the mountains, I love the ocean, I just feel like it's just the place to be for me. What else can I tell you? (laughing) My mom, my mom here, she's a huge speaker. And we lost my brother before COVID, and she lost her partner, so I thought it was really an important time for her to be with us, so that we could take care of her. - Yeah, so the only son that I have that is not here is my middle son, Mehagan, who's in Toronto. - Okay, trying to get a nation talk, actually, so that's kind of cool. - What? Really? Oh, that's awesome. Yeah, I'm really proud of him, he's really happy there, he loves it, so. - Cool. Well, a lot of people like Toronto, not everybody's from Toronto, I'm not from Toronto, but when you come here, there's just so many opportunities and so many native people. I mean, I don't think other people really understand just how many native people there aren't Toronto. That's in like every walk of life, and it's so easy to connect with people, sometimes not like that in urban areas, but in Toronto, there's like what, 50 native organizations alone, let alone like the local First Nations, so. That's all good, and you know what? I think about moms, and you think, oh, you brought your mom to live with you, and you think about like taking care of her and supporting her, and then I'm thinking, okay, well, I know moms and grandmoms, and they're also doing the reverse, they're like cooking and cleaning and imparting their wise advice, whether you ask for it or not, and all the lessons in life, so that's good. Like everybody benefits all the way around from that. - Yeah, it's pretty having my mom here, so yeah. - Well, I'm sure we've had other terms that we spend too much time together, but it's okay. (laughs) 'Cause she's like, you know, when you hang out with your mom, they become like the mama bear, so they kind of take control of everything over everything, so it's all good. - It's all good. - It's all good. You know, pretty John's, but that being said, so when I bring people on this podcast, I'm just a curious, maybe it's 'cause I'm from the Maritimes or a Migma, but I'm just like so nosy about things, and I always want to know how people got started, and I don't mean like got started in, oh, how did you incorporate your business, but I mean like, you're a little girl, where you're like, I'm gonna be a police officer. No, I wanna be a teacher, no, I'm gonna be a film. I'm gonna be a filmmaker, and I'm just gonna do all of these award-winning films, or what was your, like, how did you come about this? - That's a great question. I think I, you know, I come from a family of storytellers, like everybody's telling stories, had all my aunties, my grandmother's sisters, and her siblings, and they'd all come together, and then they tell these like crazy wild stories, and everybody would be laughing and smiling. It was just part of my childhood, which I think I, you know, I hold very dear, just something that's, you know, natural, like a nature for me, I think is telling stories. And then I think, you know, I'm a child of the 70s. We didn't really see ourselves reflected on the screen too much, right? So I always felt that I had stories to tell, and I remember I was in grade four, and I produced a play called The Play, and it got out of hand, but it was so exciting. I was like, I got all the students together, and it was based on this little concept that I had, and just ever since then, I was like, I wanna be in front of the camera. I wanna be behind the camera. I don't know, I was just like this kid that was like, you know, shy at a hearing impairment, you know, I didn't do well at school, so I just felt like, I was just one of those kids that would be in the back of the class, and I would have my hair down like this, and I would make my little little bit of my hair, just be in the creative world imagination. And, you know, I think sometimes, you know, I don't know, I'm a kid of the 70s, so I know how hard it was being a native kid in school, and how racist it was, so, you know, you kind of keep your distance, and I think that's what I did, I escaped, and I used storytelling and my imagination to do so, so I think that was it, and then, I went to Concordia University, and it was one year after the Oka crisis. So that was like a huge shift for me, right? Like, I always knew I was native, like grandparents spoke Cree, then it's English, they're hunter trappers, but I didn't really understand the urban context of being an indigenous person. You know, when you live it, Grandpa's gone for six months, hunting, like you're living the culture, like you don't think about your identity so much, but going into a city center, urban center, it's a little bit different in terms of how people identify, and their fights are a little bit different, it seems. So, but after Oka and Goenemontriol was like, mind blowing, and then seeing Alonisa Bomzuens, 270 years of resistance, I was like, oh my God, like, (laughs) I was like, we got the voice of an indigenous woman that replaces the white man, the didactic voice in those old Oka and entries, right? I don't know, I just, that's just, but I started in theater, took me a while to get into documentary, but I've always been a dock nerd. I feel like my generation, they used to put on documentaries on rain days, right? And you'd have to watch your videos during boring long documentaries. (laughs) And I've become accustomed, so. I think I'm gonna have to go back to the old days, - You're holding it. - Like your kids are like, "You watching that's so boring." (laughing) - And I don't know, it's just something like our attention span is better. - I don't know. - Honestly, I'm a child of the 70s too. I love it when I get to talk to someone who is also a child of the 70s 'cause life was 100% different. And I went to law for serve. So it's like all white people. And I had the same experiences. But that I think about, yeah, like substitute teacher day, you get a documentary. Rain day, you get a documentary. Like the last week of school, you get documentaries. And you've just like so thankful it wasn't school that it's like, I love these documentaries. And then you become hooked on them. And it's like, okay, now I also like nature shows. - Yeah. - Guys, with a partnership, like it's, it becomes a thing. So I'm with you, sister. I am all about the documentaries and the whole grade four thing. And grade four, my brother gave me a tape recorder. - Oh, that's a lot of fun. - I'm gonna take all songs on the radio. But instead, I became the lead anchor, Pam from P-A-M News. - Wow. - It has my own P-A-M news show. And I would just thought I was the best. - It was not amazing, like how those child, like those experiences shape you. And it's just something inspiring and you're comfortable in that, you know, creative space. I just think that's so cool. Like, there you go. Hey, we're both doing what we were doing in grade four. (laughing) - Yes, yes, never mind what we did in between, right? Like all the like, university and like, I'm a lawyer and you're doing all these, yeah, you're doing the exact same thing. - Yeah, exactly. - Yeah. - I love it. I love it. Okay, well, so you were always a storyteller. You made a play called The Play. I think that's probably the best. It's almost as close as P-A-M news. I mean, A-M news and The Play. I think that's as close as you're gonna get. So, all right, you know you wanna be a storyteller. But there's this annoying thing called like K to 12 education that kind of intervenes. And then there's like the university track, which is great, like I'm a big fan of education, obviously. But how did you get into the whole educational track? Because that's not every filmmaker's experience, right? Like some filmmakers just went on to storytelling, but you have like this huge academic background. So, what made you decide to do that path? - Well, I think this might be pretty, a pretty sad bleak story, but I feel like, you know, when you've dealt with that kind of crap in the educational system, you feel less than, you don't feel as intelligent as the other classmates. And I just felt like, you know, being a kid, I didn't even think I was ever gonna go to university, you know, no one in my family had ever went. So, my mom was, she left residential school with a great four level education. So, she went to St. Anne's from age five to 16, and she never pushed us to get an education, 'cause it wasn't safe for her. So, and then also having, or being labeled with some with a learning disability, and also having an hearing impairment, I just felt like there was struggle after struggle or challenge after challenge. And I just never felt smart enough. I know it sounds sad, but that was, I think that's a reality for a lot of indigenous children in youth, is that we have such a traumatic experience in school and we internalize it. And in fact, we are quite intelligent. We have this lived experience, but we just don't fit in into that colonial world. It just like we're just completely erased from it. Like, I remember my mom talking my residential school as a kid and listening to her cry and all that stuff. And then nobody talked about it outside of our community. So, there was no affirmation. Not that you need it, but it's just like, okay, how come this is not in the curriculum, right? Anyway, so, this is kind of funny. So, I barely passed. I think every course was like 51 or something. I don't know, like I did so terribly in school. And then I, you know, barely finished high school. And then I applied to, it's kind of funny actually. I applied to Concordia University. And I got into the theater program, but I didn't get through admissions 'cause my marks were terrible. And I actually had a friend who helped me with the application 'cause otherwise I wouldn't have known what to do. And at that particular time, I got offered a lead in a play and a position in a tattoo salon. So, I would have been a tattoo artist. Anyway, it's just an interesting crossroads. But I got into the theater program at Concordia University. I didn't know what to do, but I got my rejection letter. And I picked up the phone and I called the guy who was on the bottom of the letter of a snail mail back then. So, I called the number and I said, who's your boss? Who's your boss? So, I got his boss's name and number and I called the boss. I don't remember what his name was. And I said, I totally lied and said, oh, this guy here that sent me this rejection letter told me to book an appointment with you. So, I could appeal totally lied. And then I ended up getting an appointment with him and I hitchhike from Ottawa to Montreal. And I remember going into this office and the campus was huge right here, like holy crap. This was so intimidating. I had no money. Hitchhike went into the office and I sat there and I was a theater actor, right? So, I started crying. I was like, you don't understand. Like I'm the first person in my family. If I don't go to school, I'm gonna be a tattoo artist. Like, we should have been cool anyways, but it was just like, sorry, and he just sat there. Like he didn't even move. Like he was like a zombie. He was just like whatever, you know? And then he goes, come back in 20 minutes. And I was like, okay, cool. So I went out, sat outside, came back in after 20 minutes and he was gone and there was nobody there, but there was a letter on the receptionist desk with my name on it and it was an acceptance letter. And that's how I got it. - Theater works. You lost. Everyone needs to be in theater. Nice. I love that story. And I was so excited. Like I called my mom, oh my God, I'm gonna be a beauty student. Like I didn't even know what that meant. I failed miserably at school. I couldn't even write an essay. So for me, I was like, I didn't know what I was in for, but what this friggin' guy did is he added two extra years and put me in an ESL class. So I was the only English speaker. (laughs) ESL class. Oh, my marks were atrocious. Like if you, I couldn't even put anything together. Like I slipped through the cracks. Like I didn't have any support during school. But and then when I graduated later with two kids, you know, I was in the top percentile. So I just needed to figure out the way that it worked. I didn't know how colonial mindsets worked. I had no idea. So anyway, that's what happened. (laughs) - I love it. Like this is the whole like, you know, when you're a kid in the 70s and how you had to get into school in the old days, it's kind of like in my high school. There was like high school. And then if you wanted to get into university, there was like college prep. That's what they called it. So you had to take like the top math, the top English, all those things and I didn't do good either. So when I first applied to mine, I didn't get in. So I contacted them as well. And I said, "Hey, I need to get in." Same story as you, my family never went to university. - Absolutely. - Well, you're gonna have to prove yourself, you know? Like you're gonna go and have to take like grade 12 math and calculus and all these things before you get in. I was like, "Okay, how's this for a deal? What if I take those things while I'm in university?" And my graduation is conditional on that. You know, you just will do anything to get in. And I'm like, "Oh, man, I don't know "am I going to university full-time." But now I'm taking all these night classes and have to pass all these courses that I don't want. But you know what, as native kids, like we do that, right? Once you know what you wanna do, it's like, you know, none of these barriers are gonna let us go. I'm so glad. Like I just, I love that story. I feel like our stories are very similar, even though from a very different first nation. So you do that, you get into university, you obviously succeeded there. - And what makes you turn my-- - I'll turn my-- (laughing) - Yes, I had my two boys during university too. But you know what, I told my friends who were like, "Oh, it must be so hard." And I'm like, "You know what? Not out partying." I have to see them with my kids. So it's like, "What else are you gonna do?" But study, it actually was kind of an asset. We're all my other friends. We're like, "Couldn't get up the next day. "Couldn't go to class." I'm like, "Tuxed to be you." But I got kids, so it works for me. - I think so too. We come from such strong people that have endured so much. It's like in our DNA, right? Like that challenge, what is that? That's nothing. Like we'd rather deal with school stuff than not the other things I have to deal with. Like homelessness or whatever else I was faced with at that time. So it's just an interesting, it's interesting. And all about perspective. (laughs) - And think about native people. We've been fighting wars with kids on our hips. - So like, why, why don't we do university with kids? Like, come on, we can do anything with kids. And now you have like so many kids. That's just, okay, so you survive this, like with kids. And all of your like struggles in the whole system, which is that's another whole podcast. What made you decide to go on? Were you just like, oh, I'm now into the rhythm. I wanna do this or was it very specific to the area that you were gonna study that you really thought you wanted to go on? - Well, I think, you know, being a single mom with the two boys, my second passion was the social services sector. So I ended up working sadly. Like I feel like I put, this is kind of sad too. Oh my God, I'm all full of sad stories. But, you know, being a mom and not really, you know, having. a lot of support and stuff. I had my mom and my grandparents there, but they were kind of living with me at sometimes and leaving and stuff. But I just felt like I needed to work nine to five. So I went back to school and took some college courses and then I ended up being the acting CEO of Andean and I oversaw like the crisis center and I oversaw like the shelter and the daycare. So and then I worked at Elizabeth Fry too. So I ended up working in the social service sector for a long time because it paid the bills. But I always had my one foot in the arts world, which I think is what kept me sane because I think, you know, kudos to those who are working in the social service sector because it's sometimes a thankless work, you know, and you get burnt out and it's just really hard work, especially when you're working in the Indigenous community because you care so much, right? You can't just go home and shut it off. But um and then I think when I got, uh, when was it? Oh, I was pregnant with the twins. So I didn't expect that to. So it's just one, but I got twins. Right? And then I just said, okay, I need to get out of the social service sector. I've done everything I needed to do. I feel like I paid my dues. I worked with my community. I feel good about the work that I've done, but I need to honor my spirit and go back into the arts full time. And then I applied to do my masters at TMU now. It's called, I guess, trauma. Yeah. And I got in and then just left. I didn't really go back to social work and been in kind of academia ever since and lived in Sudbury for a few years and applied for my PhD because I always wanted to move to Vancouver. And education seems to be the only way that we're free as you get funding and look. So I did it. Now I'm here. I just feel like you have to make a choice. I don't know in everybody's life you're faced with choices, right? That you have to make. And I don't know how to explain it, but it's like, it's only happened a few times where I've made like that ultimate choice that's changed the trajectory of my life. Do you know what I'm saying? Like, you can either just wear that way. And then it's like when you put it out in the universe, it's like things kind of fall into place. Yeah. So that was it. I just decided to leave and go back into the arts and used education as a way to do so just because it worked for me. I was able to do it that way because I found doing my masters was amazing. It was so I did in documentary media. It was like so much fun. Right. It was just like, oh my god. Like wow, this isn't even work. Man, why didn't I do that? I could have my own pan news show right now. Oh darn it. What do you do? I guess I could just rename it. That's awesome. Okay. So I need to know. So you want to be like you're already a storyteller. We come from storytellers. You wrote the play. You go and you do, you know, education in this area. When did you actually start producing stuff? Was it like when you were in your undergrad or was it at the master's level, where you kind of practice rounds, I'm going to do a couple documentaries or shorts. Like did that come about at the same time as your education or was it after? Well, I started in a theater. So I did a lot of theater because my degrees in theater, my undergrad. So I did a lot of stage stuff and behind the scenes and on stage performance. And then I think and then I did a lot of background stuff too and I was always auditioning. So it was always auditioning for stuff, you know. And then I think when I did my masters, was it before that? I did like the intensive film program, the Chang Center or something at TME. I don't know if it's still there. This is back 2008, possibly I think. Anyway, so I did that. And that was like a 12 week intensive and I had my twins. And then we made little short films. And then I did a night course. I was like, okay, I'm going to go all in and I also did a night course, which was you see your own short film. At the time was like the best movie in the world, but looking back it's. But I'm having something. I did it with like four kids at home. And then doing my masters, I did, I produced a feature called remembering in any moment about remembering our indigenous languages and like going and I went back to Ottawa Pscutt and I filmed up there and did some, I finished my first NFB feature documentary, WAPAK. So that's going to be premiering at VIF and I did another feature dot called Shubby Crea about that little boy Noah who could sing. I don't know if you've ever got these beautiful things. And then I did, I'm in post with my second scripted feature. It just kind of happens, right? Like I feel like if you don't give up, just keep going and picking yourself up. That's for sure because it's so much rejection. It's your art. It's your, it's like as an artist, you're putting your stuff out there and then people are turning you down. Like it's the worst. But then it's a lot of rejection, but you have to be able to deal with it and pick yourself back up. But yeah, I feel like those first films are just kind of what shaped my style and stuff and what kind of stories I want to do and everything. It's about in DigiN 80s. So it's just part of my storytelling. And honestly, you have to practice at everything, right? I look back at my first few YouTube videos and I was like, oh my god. I'm so awful and cheesy. And just like, but then you learn from it. But at the time, I was like, you know what? I'm looking pretty awesome on that. I'm not looking pretty awesome. That should be an exercise and now not to do YouTube videos. But it's like, you do it, right? And it's like, that's how you learn. It's how you grow it. Everything. And I just love, though, that you literally have like 200 things. Your filmography is not like three things. It's like this long, long list of things and varied. So it's like short. It's like 45 minutes. You've got featured dogs. You've got like a whole combination. All like this awesome, beautiful, Indigenous theme, of course, but different aspects of it. You know, so it could be language, but it could also be one of our heroes of the century. I think Shannon Kustachin. And for people who don't know who she is, she too was from AdoWapisGat. And she was this champion also working on YouTube videos about, you know, education, the importance of it in her community. So can you just talk a little bit about that? Because I like, I want to get to what you're doing right now. But Shannon is just such a special person. So maybe you can give a little background about her for people who don't know who she is. Yeah. So Shannon Kustachin, I shall just backtrack a little bit when I was shooting, remembering Ine-Ni-Mo-In, when I was up in AdoWapisGat, I went and interviewed her dad Andrew. And he's a relation, like my mom's related to his mom, like the cause, I don't know, you know how it is when you go up there? Everybody's all related. So he's my relation and I interviewed him. And I remember back, this was in 2007, I believe. It was in 2007. When she passed, I think she passed in 2008, right? Right? Yes, when I graduated, I believe so. Or no, 2010. Anyway, so while I was filming, I went up there, spent some time with Andrew, and he kept saying, you got to talk to my daughter. And I'm like, yes, I want to talk to your daughter, and it just never happened. And he was talking about all the good work that she was doing. She was this like firecracker. She had this, she wanted to be a lawyer, you know? She was just like, she had this, this fire in her soul, like to fight for what's right and equitable access to education. But unfortunately, I never got to meet her. I was so close, but she was down south going to school with her sister. So, anyway, so I decided to later, I approached after Shannon passed away suddenly, which was devastating to the whole community, obviously, because it was her fight that got us on the map in terms of looking at, you know, what was happening in fly-in communities and how we were being treated in terms of the educational system. Because kids were still going to school in portables at that particular time. And actually, we do have a school now in Ottawa, Pscut, which is kind of cool, yay. But I think what happened with that particular film is I was like sitting at work. I was at Elizabeth Fry. I was still living in Toronto. And I just love Andrew Stachan and his wife, Jenny. And I just love the big family. And, you know, I just felt like, I don't know, like something came over me where it's like, I was like, oh, we need to do something for Shannon. Like, we need to have some sort of memorial. Because where she passed away was on the highway. I believe it's highway 11, right? Like, so I haven't lived out East in a while. So and then the kids in the community would pull over on the side of this really dangerous highway. And they had flowers and stuff for her. And school buses would go and pay their respect where she passed away, right? Anyway, so I had this idea and oh my god, sometimes I have to think things through because I didn't realize how big it was. But I call Andrew Andrew. It's jewels. I think I want to make a monument for Shannon. And he's like, he starts crying. He's like, yeah, yeah, that's good thing, right? And then but at that time, after I hung up, I was like, how the hell do you make a monument? How do I find the money? What do I, like, I didn't realize at the time what I had promised to do? And me being who I am, I felt like I had to follow through, like I could not, I could not let that go. And we started shooting as well. well, because I thought it was important to shoot the process of getting that monument made, because now the monument is in New Liskard, by the water. Her favorite place to kind of go, that's where she, we put the monument up. And when we were filming, Andrew and I went to the accident site and we had some medicine with us. And I don't know if we have it in the film or not, I can't remember, because it's an older film, but we lit the sage and the sage just like the whole thing went up in flames. It was just like, we were like, she's here. She's giving us her blessing. Like she wants this to happen, right? Anyway, so that's basically what the film is about, like me going on this journey with Serena, her sister and Andrew. And we get the monument made. We have it up there in New Liskard. The whole family came down south. We did a blessing on the ancestral lands up there. And you know, there was eagles flying. Like, you know, and then it was just such a long process. And I remember being scared because we did this fundraiser too, because I didn't even have any money at the particular time. And I just remember the community coming together and people donating art for me to raise money. And I just remember waking up going like panic attacks, like I have to do this, but I don't know how I'm going to do it. Like I'm sorry, Shannon. And I used to always think about Shannon walking with me or talking to me or you know, so just I could find that inspiration because that was a huge thing to promise, especially a family that was grieving, right? But we did it and we made the film. And that's what the film is about is just like this beautiful, strong spirit, who's forever in our memory that still needs to be on. And I think it's one of the first monuments in Canada of an indigenous woman. I believe. I believe. You know, I think that's the case. I think so. And you know, it's so weird. And I don't know why I did that. I did not put my name on the plaque. Like I just everybody put their names on the plaque like that contributed in a big way. And I just didn't feel it was appropriate. But then again, someone told me, well, Jules, you are that monument. You're driving. You don't need to sign it. You don't need to have your name on it. Yeah. Yeah. It wasn't about ego either for me. Like I went, oh, Jules, Kustach and like I just felt that it was more for the family, right? Anyway, it was, that was a hard journey. That's where you're like, yeah, even the film. So just like, anyway, but it's just one of those things. It's a testament. I think that film is statement and a testament to her. And it was something that I could give to the family as well. And to have it forever, you know how in the past, none of our accounts were ever in history books. And our voices weren't represented anywhere. And it's like, this is a legacy. It's her legacy. It's your legacy. It's her parents. It's out of wapas cats legacy. It's like, look at this warrior girl who was inspired, other youth to stand up and not have to wait. You know how they always say, oh, you're the leaders of the future. Oh, it's such a pet peeve of mine. Shannon Kustach was the leader of the then. You know, you don't have to be a magical age or have a magical credential. She did so much. I mean, she really helped spark the whole item no more movement out of wapas cat as well. I mean, I feel like you just come from this really amazing community. People see stuff in the media and be like, oh, but they don't understand the beauty and the love and the specialness that comes from who we are as people despite the struggles and with the struggles and, you know, all of that stuff. So I just think it's a beautiful thing you did. And that's why I wanted to ask you about it because I know it's dated like it's 2017. I think that came out, but it's just really special and she's special. You're special at a wapas cat special and just thought, you know, now maybe people will, you know, try to find it somewhere or learn more about Shannon or find a way to support Shannon's dream, all of these like things, right? Because this is all about like action. Go support Shannon's dream. That's what people can do. She was like 15. She was just a baby, right? And you think about it just, it's your heart. That's a baby. That's younger than my twins. And I'm like, wow, and that spark she had was incredible. Like so articulate. And she was fearless. All right. I went to, with this, you tell off the prime minister at the time. Yeah. Truth to power going in. And it's like, well, your office looks pretty tough. We don't even get an education. It's like straight up on his day. I was like, oh, I love this woman. Yeah. Yeah, that, I mean, that's so awesome. I just love it. So make sure everybody who's listening, you go find out about Shannon if you don't already. And what I like about your work is, OK, so there's storytelling. You know, there's documentary filmmaking. But it's also the journey. It's your journey. It was her journey. It's the journey about a WAPA scan. It's the journey of like, we can all find ourselves in that journey. And I really appreciate the journey aspect of your documentaries, you know, like learning how to speak Cree. That's a journey. If you weren't in a fluent family, and you were speaking it fluently, like I wasn't in a fluent family, speaking it fluently. And it's like, so all of these things are journeys, not our faults, right? Not our faults that our language was ripped away from us. And so those journeys are so important, and they're inspiring. And I know that it's hard for people to hear them sometimes. But it's also reassuring. I like to know, you know, as a young person, I wish I knew that you didn't have to be perfect and rich and connected and follow everything to a T to be, to do important things in the world. And what I like about your documentaries and your stories is like, yeah, we have issues. We have trauma. We've had legacies. We have struggles. But here's how you can do it in our beautifully imperfect way, right? Because none of us are perfect. But there's this weird ideal that you can only be something if you're perfect. You've never made any mistakes. Are you never having difficulties? And it's like, your story shows that that's not the case. I mean, two kids, but then twins. I just feel like a struggle now. You know, I was like, OK, I was with you when it was like two kids. Because I have two kids. Then you're like, twin. Pretty big hill there. That's a pretty big hill just as a mom. I can't imagine trying to do your education or trying to engage in films or trying to contribute to the community. Because that's what I really, really like about you is that you're very connected to us. You're not just, you know, off somewhere and have forgotten who, you know, all the rest of us are that you're just so connected. And so that's why I wanted to talk to you about your current filmography, which get this everyone. So usually if I talk to someone who happens to be a documentary film maker or something, it's like, here's my documentary that I have been working on for 10 years. And now that it's won, you want to celebrate it and promote it. It's like, OK, what does Jules have in 2023? Oh, wait, one, two, you got three things in 2023. And then I was, you know, you watch the social media and social media. He's like, oh, yeah, she's at film festivals and all the sudden stuff's like, hey, Jules, can I talk to you about your, you know, your film at 10th. And you're like, it's, it's this. And so for people who don't know, like nerd lawyers like me, tiff is the Toronto International Film Festival. I thought I was so proud that I knew that. But there's apparently a vift, the Vancouver International Film Festival. Yeah. Yeah, yeah. OK, so let's hear about that because it's. Wapake. Now, Wapake, but it's now. I'm the first. I'm the first is the premier. Yeah, at this. OK, so we actually, your people who are just like so awesome said that we could actually play the trailer. And although the people who are listening in the podcast, you're going to hear it. It's also very auditory. And then if you want to watch it or read it with the closed captions for those with hearing challenges on YouTube, it's like all of those versions are there. But I just thought, let's, let's take a listen to this. And then I want to ask you a whole bunch about it because I've already watched it like 10 times, but that's pretend I'm watching it for the first time. These children didn't get much love, affection, compassion. They never had a chance to mature, and that's why they probably faltered as parents. They're children having children. It's time for the children of residential school survivors to share their truth. It was an alcoholic by the age of 19, a drug addict by the age of 26. It was a real challenge being raised by my mom. I remember her crying at night that became her caretaker to young. And to generational trauma, it's trauma that's carried down from one generation to the next. If nobody breaks that cycle, it will continue. I really want the next generation to know what had happened in our past, but also I want them to be free of this burden. What it means tomorrow means hope. I love that. What a beautiful message. And just in that trailer, because I'm no film critic or anything, but you know, you've got the juxtaposition of residential schools and I think most people now know what happened in Indian residential schools and the trauma that you carry and Then you see these young people, you know and at these like Everything in the world is just perfect in that moment big smiles on their faces And it's like I instantly thought of how need people no matter what's happened Just have this crazy humor and we laugh and make fun of each other and it's like those youth in the and just in that Little fleeting moment. It's like oh That just makes me so happy in the subject that we know is going to be very difficult So you gotta tell me the background to this how did this one come about because I feel like this is going to be an Emotional roller coaster again a legacy documentary, but one that's like just tells your story Thank you. I'll need some Kleenex It is pre-intensive not gonna lie so I interview my mom and then asked if I kiss my oldest son and Those two in there are my twins, you know my other son is in there for a little bit But I also interviewed a woman who is the child of a survivor and who specializes in working Therapeutically with indigenous folks who are survivors and their children and then Joseph Danderan who is an incredible writer Who is also the child of a survivor? So it's just all these stories kind of weave together It's just still very emotional because it's like a hard film and I haven't really shown it publicly yet So I'm a little bit worried because I'm kind of speaking to our experience being raised by survivors Because I think it's necessary. We haven't really gone there yet as a community and You know, I'm in my 50s now So I feel like there's a whole bunch of us that need to kind of share what has happened to us and our own lived experience It started in academia where I wanted to do a collection And I was trying to get submissions from people who were like direct children of survivors And it was really hard people you know submitted stuff But then no one really followed through and I think it was because it was challenging and people really didn't Articulate their experience yet. So it kind of fell through sadly um and Then I pitched it to national film board and they were like yeah, let's do it And I was like great and then I didn't realize how emotionally draining and challenging it would be Because it's hard. It's still so raw like I'm talking about being raised by a survivor my mom, right? And I don't want to revictimize my mom, but I also have to speak my own truth, right? I feel like you know, you know, I've grown up with her stories and You know, they were not easy stories to listen to when you're a little girl like other people are Parents are reading them fairy tales and stuff and here I am listening to these horrid stories and then internalizing them and stuff so I just feel like we're at a place right now where you know, we're getting older and we need to share what our experience was being raised by these Survivors because it's been Challenging for the most part, right? Like because we're living with their trauma their trauma has become our trauma And then I post the question like who are who am I without my mother's trauma? I have no idea like what would it be like if I didn't have to carry this huge weight? So it's if you have a chance, I know you'll cry. It's really it's not like super head. Well, maybe it is I don't know like I don't know what the audience response is gonna be I don't know if my mom's response is gonna be as you feel mad at me and like I mean, I love my mom and we're close now, but it wasn't always like that like you had time and you know She like she was a survivor through and through like we were up at a particular time or beds were made a certain way like We are bet, you know like everything was so What's the word I'm looking for like strict like it we just didn't have a lot of freedom and then I had my grandmother who never went to Residential school and I'm like how is this your mom mom like yeah? It's so different like She my mom was just not affectionate. She wasn't she didn't Ever get my sister kiss us or hold us like it was just our upbringing and you know and understand that is about when your kid, right? Like she just didn't have the capacity or didn't know how like she went to school like five to 16 That's day schools and three different residential schools and then all others and sisters had passed away So my mom's just so like that's a lot of heaviness right so This film is talking about Wapake tomorrow like Am I have I passed on this trauma to my kids like and I like that you saw that they look so light and you know Because that's yeah, that's how it should be they're children should be soaring. That's how we were before You know all the systemic crap that we're dealing with so I don't know. It's definitely a statement film That's for sure and You know it's gonna be hard like I just don't know what the how the community is gonna respond I don't know how survivors are gonna spawn We go heavy into the trauma which I don't think we need to I feel like You know, we've already been there so I just feel like I kind of gave more space to children of survivors to speak their truth Even though my mom's story is weave throughout but I Know I'm excited to you know hear the good stuff not the bad stuff You just block and delete all the bad stuff Comments are awful. You always forget the damn comments all the races come out Oh my gosh, I know and you know what like what you're doing is is also very brave because I think at this point in time Most Canadians know Indian residential schools have the kids not every kid survived those that did Often suffered horrible horrible things But it is true. We don't really talk too much about okay How does trauma get passed on and at what ways and it doesn't Can be very very ugly and it can be like horribly It's a different kind of trauma for the kids even if you never went to residential school yourself and so We just have this natural tendency. We you know, you don't want to hurt anybody You don't want to say anything bad. Oh, but at the same time we owe it to ourselves and our kids and future generations to say This too was also part of it and we had experiences and then maybe our kids had experiences that I just Although it's it's yucky. I think that we need to talk about it or you're only getting a part of the story Right right. So where can people watch this and and okay bring your clean x's but where can people watch this and when So it'll be available on the NFB site after it does the festival run So right now it's just been entered into a bunch of festivals. It will be premiering at VIF October 1st And then the Vancouver International Film Festival and then it's going to imagine native intranos So I hope to see all the Toronto folks and if you have classes bring your class. Please like I don't know what date That is I got to remember but it's I think it's the 22nd or something on a Sunday At tiff light box so you can come out and support the film that would be great um and Yeah, I believe it's been Acquired I'm not sure by which broadcasters yet, but I feel like it'll be available soon enough and I'm sure people will use it in the classroom for Discussion I do know that I scratch the surface. I do know that I kind of open Pandora's box But that's what I do. I feel like You know you know when there's a void you know when you're not seeing these stories and you know that are important to you And I don't like I said I want to revictimize my mom, but it was hard. It was hard It was not being raised by her and I love her with all my heart and I support her 100% It's just I have to you create space. I think for other people who've gone through I've gone through In a good way, you know everything's done respectfully and a lot of my work to you mentioned methodology and a lot of my work is following protocol Making sure that everyone's okay with the story and that you know before moving forward and I just feel like that is so part of all of the work that we do because we're so held accountable like we are so obligated Community because if we do something wrong our whole community is going to call us out So the way to strong and the stakes you know the stakes are high for us like because everybody's looking at us to do the right thing So it's not like oh someone from outside of the community comes in they're non-native and they do story but residential school They don't have the same kind of consequences. You know, it's huge right? It's like So that's why I think I'm kind of nervous is because I'm speaking to something that's my truth But is it the right time because right when we were about to shoot that's when 215 happened So it was just like you know here I thought okay things have calmed now it's time and then the 215 happened and it just like Hit me in the heart, you know like I think I hit a lot of us in the heart and We just kept going with the production and made a part of our story because it shifted everything like Because there's a time like do we have to wait tell where elder lead to tell our story? I don't know like I know when the right time just but I also know that I matter Yeah Exactly exactly every child matters and we all have that child inside of us that went through all of these things and for people who are listening and Might not know what the 215 are we're talking about When it first came out not for us like we know that there's children who never made it home from Indian residential schools We know that there's family members that are missing But it's this unmarked graves that there's a whole chapter on the unmarked graves in the truth and reconciliation report on Indian residential schools But it was kind of like the chapter that got skipped over that there wasn't a lot of talk about until Cam loops the you know they started looking outside the old cam loops Indian resident and they thought, well, you know what, it looks like there might be 215 grades. And then it was like all these other first nations who were engaged in the exact same searches for their kids. But sometimes we just don't want to see these things. We don't want to cause upset. Then all of a sudden it's like, okay, another first nation. Well, I've got 80 and another first nation. Well, I've got 300 and so it just, the number just grew so fast. But you know what, jewels and like, who am I? All I know is that like our stories matter to, we matter to. And I don't think waiting is good. Like we waited, like Canada waited too long to learn about what happened. You know, and many of our elders have passed away and never got acknowledged and never, you know, realized that it wasn't their fault. It's like, okay, well, what about all these kids who've grown up, who've suffered? Or maybe, you know, hurt other people too because of the trauma they suffered because of their parents. And all of it matters, all of us matters. And I know, you know, there's cultural protocols. Don't upset people and stuff, but everyone's truth matters. And I think this is like a really important, I think there's no better time to do it in fact. You know, I mean, what are you gonna wait until you're passed on and then you can't make the film? Or your kids are like, hey, what did mom go through and they never get to hear it? So I think it's really, really important. So make sure people you watch it and ziff and imaginative. I will be it imaginative. So I'm going to try to come to this and like cheer for you in the background, like have extra makeup to just reply my makeup. So I don't look like a weirdo. But that being said, you know, I've done that for a long time. Waterproof. So like, what's that with you? Oh, nothing. (laughing) Oh my gosh, well, I mean, like good on you. Like that's why you're my warrior hero. And I know you have other things from 2023. So are these things like same time? Like you have another one called Broken Angel that says 2023 FeatureDoc. Is this something that did the early circuit or is this also at the same time? So Broken Angel was inspired by my time when I ran the woman shelter actually because at that particular time everybody was telling me no, there's no audience for this. But I had access to the shelter because I worked in a shelter. I knew that world. So I wrote this script and it took me like 15 years, I think, to get it finally produced. And I made it under 800,000 and 12 days was the quickest shoot ever had in my life and made my first feature film. And the film is kind of like just has its own life. It's been on APTN. I'm sure it's gonna be on APTN again. And it's about an indigenous woman who is faced to either fight or flee for her life. And she ends up fighting. And it was just based on all these incredible women that I worked with when I worked in the social service sector. It was strong, for good native women that just, I don't even know how they just, they woke up every day and did what they had to do, right? And that's what we all do, I think. But, you know, so that's Broken Angel. That was released in 2022. And then I'm just in post with, 'cause there's a trilogy, Broken Angel, Angela Shadow. And the third one is kind of wastesan. It is beautiful that I'm writing right now. And we're in post production for Angela Shadow. All of these stories have ghosts because I think that's so part of our day to day. Like, how do we not talk about ghosts in the native community? (laughing) - Yes. - It's just like, what? What, you don't have a ghost, what? Anyway, but yeah, that's what I did. And I just, we're doing a community screening for Chubby Creas, well, that one is an Edmonton that's for Tellus Original. That'll be on Tellus Soon. And that's that little boy Noah, who has medicine in his voice. I don't know if you've ever heard Noah sing. He was gonna be on the Ellen show before COVID. But check out Chuck. His voice is, I've never heard a kid sing like that. Like, and we did a short talk about his, you know, his journey with his grandmother. He sings with his grandmother. Like, how much more traditional can you get with like the film is so beautiful, right? So that'll be in October, I believe it's October 13th. But yeah, we're doing a community screening and then it goes on long online, but it's also been submitted to a few other festivals as well. So yeah, just wow. I have also a film, I think for women called Kaya Metta about indigenous women going through Menopause. This is so good. It's like this is women from the 70s, probably that's a really relevant, but it was friggin' released right before COVID. So it kinda got lost, but like I became the Menopause queen for a while 'cause it was, it's online, but if you could check it out, it just put CBC gem Jules Kastachin and Kaya Metta is such a great, funny film. It's all these Native women coming together talking about Menopause. So that's phenomenal. Like again, things that we don't talk about, right? Like you might see people on Oprah talking about Menopause or whatever with doctors, but like, what about us? And our experiences and, you know, we just get crankier and it can be a whole thing. So, I'll make sure to post links too, so that people can easily reference it. I mean, I've got your website up there, juleskastachin.com, pretty easy, but where you can actually get it and see it, yeah. Yeah, for sure. Well, I know, like we're almost at the end, but I don't wanna let you go without talking to you about your company because guess what everybody? In addition to all of the amazing things she is, I'm still really hung up on twins, but she's also got her own production company. Can you just tell us a little bit about that? How did that get started and what do you do? It's just me. (laughing) It's okay. So of course it is, it's just you. (laughing) I was part of a TV series called Asky Boys, which I kind of, I pitched what I was in my masters at T.M.U. Back in the day, it was called Ryerson University, and I remember my prof just kind of laughed at me and said, "There's no audience for a show called Asky Boys." And then I pitched it to APTN and I got approved, and I created my production company back in 2010, and Asky Boys is still available. I think your APTN are online, so and it's a show about these kids that reconnect with their community, their urban boys, and they're my older sons, Asks Back in Mehegan. And yeah, so I've just been producing stuff through my company, and it's just me right now. Hopefully, one day I'll create an enterprise, and build capacity, but it's really hard when it's just yourself, but that's why I hire others to kind of do business affairs and stuff. - Yeah, as a big grief. - We just don't have the money, right? Native people, we just don't got those assets and money, so it's like we just gotta do a day by day and find people that support our work, and I found an amazing executive producer named Paddy, who's just like my angel. She helps me with my productions. She is such an ally. Like people use ally, loosely, ally is actually verb, you know, when people actually something to create change. They shoulder the burden. Like, you know, shoulder the burden instead of just getting us to do everything. Now, I have to have you too. It's still the name of it. Some people might say it's like visuals. - Because I had, is that like a play on your name, Jewels, and it's visual together? - I had a Jamaican friend who could never say jewels. And she would call me for the cross-campus, "Jewels!" So then like, so then I was with my partner, Jake and he's like, "Visuals!" That's a cool name. And I was like, "Yeah, you're right, visuals!" That's where it comes from. Really fun Jamaican friend who could never say my freaking name. I love it! But he got to be cool! I love it! I love it! You got to say with a really like thick accent too. - Jewels! - I love you! - I love you! (laughing) - So funny. - Anyway, that's that's what-- - Oh my gosh! - It comes from-- (laughing) - Jewels, I could literally-- (laughing) Yeah, yeah. So Jewels, you know, I could literally talk to you for hours and hours and hours. You just make me happy and sad all at the same time. It's just kind of the way we are. But that being said, the fact that you're from the '70s and similar experiences, that just feels good when you can see yourself and someone else, even though we do different things, I just, I love it. I love the work that you do. And I love that you're out there on the front lines. And I know not everyone's nice about things and sometimes people think they're professional critics. So they're just mean for no good reason or just racist, we'd see worse. But you just keep doing it. You keep doing it. You keep telling our stories. The stories that haven't been told, the stories that need to be told, but you've got this awesome balance, you know, with like the youth in there and kids smiling. And so just keep doing what you're doing. No, I am your number one fan, not in a misery kind of way. You know, like I'm like a capture or anything, but like a big fan fan kind of way. And I support all your work. And if there's ever anything I can do for legit to promote your work, whether it's this podcast or anything else, sign me up because I just love everything you do and I feel like there's going to be a billion more things come from you. Thank you. She made good sure of. Thank you. Yes. And thank you to all the listeners for listening. If you're listening to the podcast, thanks to the viewers. If you're watching on YouTube, thanks for those who are reading closed captions for listening and learning. And the best way to support Indigenous creatives is to actually support Indigenous creatives. So share all of their work, support them if they're, you know, bead artists, by their bead, work if they're filmmakers show up to their films by their films by tickets like whatever it is do it and then for this podcast you can share that you can use it in your classrooms like Jules does and now she has a new one to use and like share comment trigger the good algorithm you know all the haters have their own algorithm and they get all the attention well let's just trigger the good algorithm let's just have a reconciliation algorithm and just share all the things we do and all of that stuff you can support us so thank you so much Jules thank you so much to all the listeners till next time keep living a warrior life well alia if you enjoyed this episode please consider supporting my podcast your donations help me keep the warrior life podcast open access to everyone and free from those annoying ads and it's super simple just click on the link below to sign up for a patreon monthly or yearly subscription or click the links for the bimia coffee app or the kofi app to make one-time contributions and if you belong to an awesome community group business or organization that's committed to indigenous reconciliation consider sponsoring an episode or two hers many as you like thank you for helping me lift the voices of indigenous warriors doing phenomenal things to help make our world a better place