Irish Employer Admits To Bullying His Staff - Live On Air

It's time for Ireland's only interactive podcast, the multi-award-winning Opinions matter with Adrian and Jeremy. You're very welcome to this latest Opinions matter podcast with Adrian and Jeremy recorded live in our studio, The White Sands Hotel, in Port Marnock, in North County Dublin. Before I let you know what we want to talk about on this latest episode of Opinions matter, have you joined the Opinions matter WhatsApp channel? Yes, well, if you haven't, let me tell you how the WhatsApp channel works. The WhatsApp channel is an opportunity for us to keep you in touch with everything that's going on on Opinions matter. So, every day we will send you a link to our latest podcast to save you the hassle. If you're not subscribed to Spotify or whatever, you'll get a notification from us every day that leads you directly to that day's podcast. We also keep you up to date with when the show is live on Facebook. We send you a link for that. Now, we won't spam you. We won't annoy you. We will send one maximum two messages a day all about Opinions matter. So, if you would like to subscribe to the Opinions matter podcast channel, you can either search for the Opinions matter podcast channel or you can send us a WhatsApp with the words add me. Add me and if you send us that to 0858252626, we will send you a reply that will have the link for the WhatsApp channel and you just subscribe from there. And as I said, it gives us the opportunity to keep in touch with you and let's you know everything that's going on on the podcast. So, once again, send the words add me to 0858252626. And we will send you a link back to our WhatsApp channel. Becca, got in touch with us by WhatsApp as it happens on 0858252626 and asked us to cover this one. Hopefully you have a listen to this interesting conversation now we want to help with you. So, this is Becca and she said, "If you do cover this on your podcast, leave my full name out please. I want to talk about workplace bullying. I'm on Doctors leave from my job right now because of bullying by my job manager." It's a well-known closed shop. Now, she actually did give us the name of her, she asked us not to name a name which obviously we're not going to do. He used to always shout at me if I didn't do things right or if the queue was too long of the tills. Last week, I damaged a jacket by mistake and he screamed at me in front of the whole shop. I had to go home crying. He's an absolute bully. But it went ahead of us and I've been told that this is not workplace bullying and he did nothing wrong. Can you talk about why it's not taken seriously because I'm having anxiety at the idea of going back in there and I can't afford to leave the job or find a new one because I'm trying to get a mortgage. Do you not think this is serious bullying? That is from a lady who just signed her name Beckett. Like I said, she has told us the name of the store. It's an extremely well-known store. It's a local branch of that particular store. You will know it by name, but I'm not going to name it because obviously in this case, I have one side of this story. I shopped there. I shopped. No, I do myself. I shopped in that actual branch. Well, I have shopped in that actual branch. I'm shocked. I'm a bit embarrassed by some of you who've been commenting this already. So it's up on her Facebook page. It's been up on her Facebook page for the last year and a half. Some people have sympathy for her, but then I want to get to the other comments. We're going to talk to some of these callers as well during the podcast. She needs to grow up. She needs to grow a pair, says another person. What did Jess say as well? Beckett needs to grow up. She's clearly shit at her job. I can't believe the amount of people. Oh, she's a snowflake. That's another one as well. These are not all true statements. Absolutely not. Sorry, when someone has been, the rest of you, you're also, what's the job of a manager to make you do your job right? You don't have to do it by shouting at someone. Sometimes you do because the staff are frustrating. No, no, no, my thing is sometimes the only way to get through to staff is to shout at them unfortunate. No, my thing has to be the way. No, no, my thing is if you have to shout at a member of staff to get the job done, you're not a very good manager. I'm sorry, you're not a very good manager. Okay, he, he, he, he shouts at me if I don't do things right or if the queue was too long of the tills. Last week, I damaged a jacket by mistake and he screamed at me in front of the whole chop. Here's my thing. But by the way, sorry, by the way, you need to grow with, he cannot take her skin. That was your daughter. That was Laura. Yeah. I'm sure Laura has been shouting at them work. If she's worked in retail for years, I'm sure she has been for not doing her job right, especially at the start. When you're brand new, you need to be told, no, that's not how you do it. Nobody, nobody should be shouted at in the workplace. Nobody. No matter what the, don't tell me you were never shouted at in the workplace. Oh, it was. That's how it was like. Time to do it for my training before I got into, you know, harm to this? Into this was in the restaurant business. The restaurant business was renowned for Jesus. There it is. Chefs. I used to have chef's troll food, that means stuff like that. Okay, but that's what it was. If you left the food on the, on the counter, then when called it literally fuck it at you. And get that fucking chicken out to that dinner, you're, you're lazy piece of shit, stuff like that. Didn't do it anyhow, though. You became an excellent waiter because I actually did. Yeah. You became an excellent waiter because there's no need. You had somebody telling you what to do. No, there's no need. There's no need for that. This girl is out on stress leave at the moment, and I'm disgusted with you all making light of it. Okay, I'm not making lights for it. All I'm saying is, I'm not making light of this. I think bullying is disgraceful. However, I don't think this is bullying. I think you have to expect that your superior in work is going to tell you what to do. And if you make a balls of it, sometimes they might shout out to you. No need to shout. There is no need for it. In a way, let me ask you, then what's wrong with you shouting at your kids that isn't right in the workplace. It's completely different. It's not. It's not. It's still shouting. Can I just tell you? Of course, Snowflake is off on stress leave because she was shouting at that. Actually, the more I'm thinking about it, the more I'm thinking whether she needs to get a job, we'll go work from home. Okay, first of all, Becca is going to come on the show. She's not able to at the moment because she's too stressed. By the way, this isn't going to run you, go ahead, you call her Snowflake. Secondly, all I'm saying is you have to expect in the workplace that a superior manager, whatever your line manager is going to tell you what to do. Becca is coming in. I just wanted to tell you all this and to have it on the record. So I'll tell you two things. First of all, the statistics that show the 20% of Irish workers have experienced workplace bullying, which has led to them taking leave from work due to stress against the eyes of your Becca would be one of those 20%. Now, we're going to be talking to Becca next week. She promised she'd come on with us next week, correct? Let's see because I want to, I want you all to hear Adrian on a future podcast telling Becca that she's a Snowflake, when when she's on here crying, all I said, Jeremy, all I said was, play this clip for all I said was you have to recall your superior in the workplace. You called her to give out to you. You called her Snowflake. That is not on Adrian. I'm sorry. Our number is 0858252626. If you would like to get involved in this conversation, do you think she's being a Snowflake? Dave. A story that's, you know, regardless of bullying, I think sometimes it kind of depends on what type of work and environment you're in. If there's somebody who's working on a building site or factory type job, kind of similar to what I'm doing or, you know, fast paced, high stress places, you could expect to be shouted at if you keep making a politics stuff. I'm not saying it's right, but you know, it kind of comes to its territory and it does teach you to kind of as I grow thicker skin. At the same time, though, bullying isn't acceptable anywhere. And I think it goes into the ram of bullying when it's targeted. It's sustained and it's malicious and you seem to be the one to single doubt. So if that is the crack for this girl, what I would recommend she do is make sure she has documentation, hair copies of emails, you know, any correspondence for the head office. If you can get CCTV out today in question, all the better again and go to the WRC because there's a lot of people whose balls go back up in the middle of summer when you hear those three letters or do write into a guy who bullied me for three years and just try to drive them out as a job. That's a way better for a retribution, I think. Amber, you're all an opinions matter. How are you, Amber? I'm good. How are you? A good thanks, Amber. Well, what do you want to say on this? I think it's great for the way some managers treat their stuff and I'm the one who I worked in. No, we wait. Let's be careful not to identify any store if you don't mind, please. Very large supermarket chain. Yes, I work there and I found that the manager was breathing as well. She asked if she drove me to use the shop to kind of get a new job all together and put on half of it anymore. And give me an idea of the way in which she treated you. So basically, we had like a strict uniform to wear. So I worked on the checkered. So I had to wear a blazer and like a black so like a proper suit you had to wear. And this is the height of winter now. So I was free and so my brother worked in this shop at the time. So he had a seat, like a branded seat for the job and I wore it and he managed to say, why are you wearing a month. And I said, I don't see like what are going to be the labels. The police it's for the job. It's you. Okay. So it had the company's logo on us. Yeah, it was the uniform But it was just for a man. But it was just a piece I was the same like I've only read like there was there was there was a no equivalent fleece for women No, it was literally I don't even know how it was a man's fleece in the issue of the fleece And she just said why are you wearing a month's fleece? And I was like fucking me and what I mean I think it's freezing out there as like I'm initially wearing the uniform It's I'm just not wearing the blazer and she was like I want you to go home now and get us to play around here And she laughs in my face. Okay. That's one example She seems very sexist of nothing else that there's no similar fleece for female members and staff But anyhow, um, go on keep going. What else happened? And so basically you get like a discounted card to spend in the shop and I was with someone in one day and they wanted the way Garden furniture and I paid my card and they accused me of giving back discounts to the person I was with Which didn't happen so she dragged me into it and dragged me she pulled me into a room and was like one myself now I should have had someone with me at the time so like prince or like and to someone to be there Would be and she was like how dare you give your discount to someone else and I was like what do you mean your discount? My discount to someone else like that's my card. I can do what I want to and she was like I'm seeing you with that person paying for that you should be doing that So she pulled me into a disciplinary meeting with the higher staff of that company and she was like if this happens again your own and I was like it was like it was so unfair so she got me and I just put it in form and she took my card off me But at the same time while I hung it over my card like everyone might know it's as well And she was like why are you using this and I think there's two exact reasons like And did you end up having to leave that job because of the way this manager was treating you? I was ready to go into the job. It was my first ever job and it was just the worst ever I could wait for it out of us. Yeah, I'm just waiting for Adrian to call you a snowflake No, no, no, no, why don't you call her snowflake? Let me ask the questions Firstly was your first job? Did you report this manager for the way she was treating you? Yeah, there was another manager in the shop because of all the different departments in the shop And I said to the manager and they were like you just have to do what she says So what she's saying is just so unnecessary and just dragging me down for no reason You see the one thing that I will say is That is the job. No, obviously her mannerism or her Her tone or whatever was bang out of order, but you have to expect being disciplined by a manager I know, but there's certain points like when I left that job I am in my job now and And my manager is the nicest man you would ever meet. There's a screw up in the job Everyone screws up in the job like everyone makes that's exactly the point that I was about to make Everybody does screw open the job somebody and somebody for the snowflake commentator. Why don't you call Amber? Shut up Jeremy. Everybody Screws open a job, but as a result though amber you have to expect a manager to get annoyed or perhaps shout In order to make sure that you do your job properly the next time What if you want your staff to do a proper job? You treat them with respect Someone speaks back to me. I'm just not asking. I'm just not going to be bothered You see this okay, but this is the snowflakey bits that I I feel With a lot of people that they're just not able or not even prepared to take any sort of discipline from a superior in the world Embers the snowflake. I think nothing able to deal with we got there. I think shut up Jeremy. Absolutely fool I think that a lot of People just aren't able for it and this is the snowflake generation we live in now. Yeah, that's exactly what I'm saying I know it's different to be told what to do and then being show what I think they're like they're the common way to say it You're meant to be professional in your job. They're just not being professional. Okay. Well, we're about to hear from a manager Say they're amber for sec we've a manager there mark Who's gonna school you Adrian how to you've obviously never been you you wouldn't you wouldn't be a good manager No, I never wanted to be a manager. I never wanted to be a manager. Shut up Mark Adrian you're wrong. I'd be a manager. You never showed it your staff. I've had to discipline staff Just bring this to the side. You have a word with them. You don't bully them Hey jar probably think about it because they're scared. She'll put a claim in against the company And they're most definitely behind the scenes looking for a way to discipline that manager Maybe even get rid of him. All right. Thank you, Mark So you can discipline but never shout again That's coming from a manager like I said I have been showed that in many many jobs over the years The last one the last one the fellow the the welds fellow the fellow the welds fellow The welds fellow you see him on the flag the welds flag. Oh, yeah him He did shout. He did shout. Yeah, and you where you you that day that that happens happy with the show No, but you said about it. Sorry. What happened that day that by the way? This is a story for a different company. We worked for where the this particular individual that we had a running Screamed at myself and a's voice of space coming out of his mouth And when we came out of the meeting the first thing that Adrian did he was shaken He picked up the phone his hands are shaking says I'm ringing to see or not to see yo I'm ringing the the group chairman the chairman of this company and I'm gonna get half that person But I didn't because I talked to you out of it. Yeah, but I didn't in the end. Oh, didn't in the end All right, let me go to line two and um Steve your unopinions matter. You've been listening to Amber's story Welcome to the program. That's right Adrian. How you doing? Yeah, listening with interest there Adrian to your previous caller Yeah, I think I think a lot of it is fantasy Adrian. A lot of it is fantasy. I mean, I'm an employer I've also been an employee over the years also. I was seeing both sides of the coin Adrian Uh, I mean, I'll give you an example that you many years ago and I was about over 30 years ago and I was about 17 years of age I did some work experience. All right And uh, it was a lot of bloke in here in the working world. I went to see a couple of lots of bloke's work in there And obviously gone late learning the ropes a bit we're a bit we're a bit we're behind the years One of the bloke sent me down to an office for a long wait, right You know, you probably came across a gay in the past yourself and uh, I went down to the manager's office in question I'm waiting outside I noticed a bloke come out and I said what you doing is I was told to come here for a long wait And the bloke said, oh, you got it in you so yeah, the joke was I was waiting outside the bloody office. I mean Adrian, I wasn't traumatized by that. I haven't had flashbacks Over the last 30 years. I haven't had sleepless nights over there That's slightly different Steve to on going There was a one-off piss take when you started a job, okay? No, no, no It was ongoing Adrian. This is ongoing. It was bad. It's a bit of fun People are taking things seriously now. It's a bit of ban I mean people just have no sense of humor anymore. You can't bloody, you know Look at someone the wrong way these days. You're getting accused of something. That's the way it's gone. It's bloody ridiculous And it wasn't it wasn't like I didn't see it as a campaign of hatred against me They were literally they were breaking the in these blows breaking the in you know If you can't take a bit of it, you know, it's slagging off of a work colleague and get out of it You know, you know, you're not a bloody in the playground. Yeah, I mean now let me go to line one and that is math Your own opinions math or math. How are you? I do and you don't have to thank you very much for For let me speak on you on there. Thank you very much. How much do you want to say? Well, I used to be a victim of the bullying and the workplace before And I'd like to only just say something here I'd like to warn all of these people who Starting the new jobs out there and they're put for that three-month period. For example, that work for the experience and you know You know to prove themselves You know, just you you are thrown into the company who already have the problems are basically morally bankrupt Very bad management already existing and there is a really bad so what what happened to you and I want you to be very careful They're not to identify the company involved here, but no, no, I won't I won't no, no, I won't I'm really far to To name the company doesn't that's fine. So what happened to me is that exactly what happened There was a job offered to me and I I knew the company I knew the manager. I knew actually owner as well So I decided to go ahead and decided to progress on it and get back to the employment you know when the jobs come back after Economic downturn the economy started doing well. You know, so I said that this is the time you know to move on and I after Christmas I just I received a phone call and I drove the CV to a company to be contacting me So I was told you know, you can start tomorrow. That's fine. Okay. I just come over. I show you know at work. You know, I am In the first day, I was told that that the job is actually The man who actually owned the only company the boss. He's actually on the holiday. So he didn't know I'm nothing about it So we put you over here for two or three months and you can prove yourself. He is a prospect, you know, for the opposition So that's okay. That's fine and that's not problem. You know That's not the big issue. So what happened was like, you know, the staff I was told actually I was working on between two floors You know, so I'll be basically coordinating a job and the office. So I did and you know constantly the job was I was preventing actually from doing my job, you know, by So called the best stuff And that was basically the kind of society because you know, that's what I want to mention In those those types of companies who are more morally bankrupt There is a group of people who are the bullying Can I ask you Matt, did you feel so uncomfortable in the job that you left or how did you deal with it? I feel very confident in an energy job, I don't know On two of us, you know, asked somebody else to sit over here to do the job and I have a very thick skin, you know, but to a certain level, it certainly extends. You know, I start actually breaking up, you know, and I had that pain in stomach, you know, and you know, I can see when I was going actually, you know, to work every morning, you know. Okay. So it really got to you. It really stressed you. It became extremely. Exciting. Yes. It used to suffer severe anxiety as a result of what you were going through. No. Steve, nobody should have to suffer extreme anxiety just to go to work. Well, as I said to you, Adrian, yeah, so what is your definition of bullying? That's what people need to explain to me. What is your definition of bullying? What you. What you. What you might call bullying, I might call it a bit of fun, or a bit of banter, so I mean, what is your definition of bullying? Well, listen, you know, the one who goes and questions me from definition of bullying, you know, just, you know, you can move to this radio as a some bloody authority now at the moment. Try to actually just find out my perceptions. So I answer every one thing, bullying is whatever actually happened to you physically, directly or indirectly as you play. That's in my all work awards like that. If you actually suffer a morning, and you're afraid to actually put your leg out, actually from your home, and you're afraid to blow to this people there and work and make you live in. That's what they do. You don't think I'm completely over the top, mate. You've been completely over the top. Yeah, of course. Yeah, yeah. I know, I know. It's a bit of fun. That's all it is. You want to be in a workplace where people take everything totally seriously and never have any fun. Is that what you want? No. You want to be in my work place. I want to have a bubbly, a bubbly friend, the atmosphere in my workplace. And I would not have any kill joys like you in my workplace. I wouldn't have them. What are you talking about? I'm not answering. How can you possibly say that somebody who's being bullied is any sort of a killjoy? Well, again, it comes back to your perspective of what bullying is, Adrian. I don't consider a lot of these things to be bullying. You don't let me answer it. Listen, maybe you've got an attitude problem anyway. I can tell from now on you're going on there, mate. Of course, I want to explore you, mate. You've got an attitude. Let him speak. Let him speak. Let him speak. You can't talk about you. Let him speak. There is your problem. Not about bullying. It's about you. I don't think so. I don't think so because. You're actually. Oh, really? I hear you a few times, actually, before on the radio. Yeah, well. You're working right here. I hope you're doing well in your little company, you know? Yeah, you're working right here. You're actually speaking to somebody before on the air. Yeah, I wouldn't want to talk about you. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. The fact of the matter is that this guy was suffering severe anxiety from the crappy to put up with in his own face. Yeah, yeah. In his own face. Yeah, blah, blah, blah, blah. I heard an old boy raging. He didn't see a thing. I can't get out of bed. All that crap. I heard all that crap. Yeah, he was just a punk. You know, after people. After people in this country are actually around disability, like a claiming they can't get out of bed in the morning because of bullying or some other bloody excuse. People need to get over themselves. People are taking things seriously. It's a bit of a work. You clearly have never been a victim of workplace bullying then. I told you my first come on the year. I was at the bottom of my colleagues' jokes when I was a work experience lad all the years ago. They went on for mum's age and the boys were playing pranks for me all the time. But I was just hit you. I'm not getting therapy 30 years later for that. I'm not having sleep this night. It's over it. I'm not traumatized. It was a bit of fun. They break you in. When you've got children, it can't lead to bloke. Especially if it's getting a bloke. They break you in. Let me see. The story that we're talking about today. 20% of the workforce has been bullied leading to stress and other mental health problems. You're hardly going to belittle that, are you? I think a lot of it is just people taking things seriously. That's my opinion on it. As an employer and also being an employee, you're different times during my life as well. If you can't have a bit of fun in the workplace, if you can't take a joke and get out of it, you're not a 10-year-old child. You're an adult. Surely you can take a bit of band area in there. I mean, surely people can take a band at these days or a bit of slap and tickle with women in the office. It's a bit of fun. I don't know if you're aware of everything that's been going on in the last few months. Slap and tickle is a thing of the past, Steve. I'm very aware of it. I'm going to say slap and tickle now. It's such an old fashioned expression. Seriously. Adrian, Adrian, I mean, you've got to play the game there because you're on the air and all that. You've got to walk on eggshells. I don't have to mate. I'm an employer. I run my business as I see fit. I'll get people into my workplace who will do the job properly. But also people who have a good attitude about life. Who are fun people, bubbly people. I don't want to kill your employees. If somebody came to you as an employer, and this is a genuine serious question, somebody comes to you as their employer and says, Steve, I'm being bullied by one of my colleagues. What are you going to do about it? I'll make an investigation, Adrian. I'll find out. First of all, I mean, if the person's working for a long time, I'll take you seriously. If I knew, if they had a previous in that kind of behavior, or previous in being, you know, being as you call it, it'd be a bit snowflakeish. Well, then I wouldn't think of it very seriously. But if there were somebody with me for a long time, I'd do an investigation. I'll make some inquiries. But ultimately, Adrian, you know, and this is very, very serious. I told him just to get on with it, or else get a new job. Simple as that. I think a lot of it is just nonsense. And a lot of people, you know, are walking on eggshells these days and looking out at a shoulder. I mean, you get into the point, all these people on the same place, celebrities, all these, they brush, they brush past someone 30 years ago. You know what I mean? Is that abuse? It's getting absolutely ridiculous. All right, stay there. Just stay there for a second. I'm sorry. I'm sorry for going across, can I imagine a couple of messages that are coming in. There's actually, we did this podcast every day, and we don't do to upset people. Nothing, you know, we don't, when we get in, we don't set out to upset people. We don't sit and go, "Okay, how can we make people cry today?" But they're now, Steve, there are two different people. By the way, one is male and one is female. And a message, you know what I'm saying? Can you see these messages on Facebook that are in tears listening to the shit that's going on because that's after triggering them, his behavior. That has to be illegal. Vanessa is one person who's absolutely disgusted, Steve, listening to you. Is that actually an absolute gobshite, trying to equivocate, having a laugh and a little prank with someone with actually a manager, screaming in someone's face in public? Is he actually trying to equivocate to two? The guy needs to get his head out of his arse, seriously. What happened to that woman who messaged you was that she was screamed at in public in front of customers, which is absolutely abusive behavior. And then he was backed up by head office. So what I would say to the girl is you need to document everything. Have a little work journal, bring it in with you. Document what's said, the times, the dates, who said what? Join a union, get some advice. So you're not feeling like you're on your own because I tell you what, if he's doing it to you, he's probably doing it to other people as well. Get some back up in your corner, find out what you're entitled to, the protections, the rights that you are afforded to you, regardless of what company you're with. And don't listen to arseholes like this, who tell you to grow a thicker skin, or it's only banter, it's abuse. It's the Opinions Matter Podcast, with Adrian Kennedy and Jeremy Dixon, a podcast from Ireland, with a difference. No, lean, you're on Opinions Matter. How are you, No, lean? I fit stronger stewarder. What about him? He is such a gobsite. I've never heard such shy coming out someone's mouth. How can he claim that it's only a bit of banter? He's basically saying people just need to grow a thicker skin, is really what I heard, and it's a bit of banter. But realize that that woman's mental health is effective. Like, I'm continuing her now, if that was my daughter and a manager, or daughter in public, it'd be the girl's technique call. And right here, it's our beautiful, but it doesn't matter. It doesn't matter. It doesn't matter. You're abusing someone. But the woman, it's terrified. I don't, unless you've gone to a stage where you are actually physically sick to your stomach, I haven't had no choice, but to go into a job. You can't understand exactly what it's like. And as for gobsites in, that's only a bit of banter. But then that state to him was exactly what used to happen years ago, where a carpenter sent an apprentice to a hardware store to get a glass armor. That's banter. But being sure that. No, even that sort of banter, and this is the point that Steve was making, he was sent in one of his first jobs for a long wait. And he. That's not bullying, though. That's not bullying. No, but there is a torrential. No, that's not bullying. There are some people. Bullying is physically and mentally. Bullying is physically and mentally, when it affects you. OK, no. And earlier on, Jeremy said, at the start of this podcast, that he frequently shouts at his children. What is the difference? I didn't say, I didn't say frequency. I do, from time to time. OK, from time to time. You've shouted your children. No, what is. No, no, no, no. I mean, only if I can't be heard, because the freedom in the room screaming at you is. What? Stop shouting, I'll say. I don't scream at them constantly. But the difference. I'm asking what the difference is. But you're a parent. You have no control over this person as a manager. Same dynamic. What, she has no. That employee has absolutely no reason to be rewarded. There is a way of doing things. If she is making a mistake every minute or the day, it's his job as a manager to take her aside and say, OK, listen, this is the way it shall be done. I understand you. What does. the way. Knuckle of bell and roar and shout in our Republic. Take her aside, say to her, this isn't the right way. We're going to have to get some sort that if I am sorry, you're not right for this employment. But don't roar, I have a person. Like, I'm 10 years now, if I was in that store and I heard him roar and roar. When I got to swim in a new dormant, I would say to him, and I have done it where where researchers have been abused by the managers. And I've said, that's not really right the way you speak to yourself. Now, I have witnessed staff being shouted at and it's not a pleasant thing to witness. Actually, I did pull somebody up once in a particular race course at a race day screaming at one of the lounge staff and he absolutely lifted her outfit. And I did pull him up over it because it was so over the top the way he shouted at her. The feeling of being so afraid to go into a job and being physically sick, and I know it's like, to wake up in the morning and go, oh, sweetly, please, no, I don't want to go in here. I don't, and it's not easy. But I do think I do think that some people just take it to personally. You have to expect a degree of discipline and a prison. Yeah, the agree desk would not be roar desk in front of people. Okay, stay there for a second. Let me go to Jess, you were on Opinions matter, are you Jess? There he is. Well, Jess, what do you want to say on this? Well, this is clearly starting the job. This is what I was getting to say, would I get better at your job or fucking go? And is that your reaction to it? She's obviously bad at her job because if you're also bad at your job, she wouldn't be shouting at all the time. Yeah, every job advice I'd say without, I say a lot, I may try to improve, but I've never got to shout it out again. Just do your job better and don't give your boss a reason to have a girl with you. What would you say to all that, Nolan, that she's obviously bad at her job, or she wouldn't be shouting at all the time? So that gives him the right to shout at all in front of people. If she was a worse employee in the world, that does not give him a right. It doesn't say in a contract that a manager has the right to bring terror to you in the middle of the public. Don't give a reason. It doesn't matter. It doesn't matter. Don't fucking matter. They're in the big cities. They have no rights. They have no rights. No, you don't. They have no rights to treat you like Jess. If they say Trump, you say how high? If they shout at you, you're clearly a shit worker, and you're doing something wrong. I think it's always something to do with something wrong, because she's not getting better. Because the boss is still screaming at her, so she looks at you. But hang on, Jess. That's the argument. That's the argument. If the argument is, if you're not good, you're not good. You're really good. It wouldn't be gone by now if I was him. But Jess, Jess, do you think it is acceptable for a manager to shout at staff members? Yes. Oh my god. And if they don't, and if they say you're wrong, then that's a man you're curious. No, but you need to run the fuck up. I did my job. Perfect. And I still go on the news. No, this is a manager meant to talk on mice and softly, because I've got to walk over. Nobody says that. Nobody says that. No, nobody says that. No, hang on. There's a way of doing things. Oh my god. We are hanging on a fucking second. No one is going to take you seriously. If you bend down, I'm like, no, but could you just make sure you do it this way? Please, and thank you. No, thank you, sir. Would you go away with that? Well, as somebody said in the comments a moment ago, Jess, that's why you'll never be a manager. What did you say to that? Well, because I walked over if I ever did before, I'm not going to talk on mice tonight. No, we did. Jess, just with the greatest. I did do the job right or something with it all. With the greatest respect. You don't write or don't do it at all. With the greatest respect, you couldn't be a manager because you have psychotic tendencies. You literally scream your head off. Nobody, you do, you. No, no, no, no, not meant before you scream your head off. No, no, no, no, no, you, you have a very bad temper and a very short fuse. And those two things together do not, but no, workers are not slaves, Jess. They're not just slaves. So they are there to do a job. They are. But you do what I fucking say. You see, even, even that leaving the language, you'll do what I fucking say. You can't speak to people like that, Jess, but he. Well, I think that lots of people are in a special way. I just feel what I say. I get it. And am I, am I, am I ignorant? I don't agree that you should be able to shout at your staff morning, noon, like, however, um, I say. I'm going to learn, Adrian. How are you going to learn? What about that point? Okay, what about that point? What about that point, Jess? This is, this is the equivalent to a child being put on the naughty step. Please do what you're told or you're going on the naughty step. And Jess is saying, no, that's not the way to, uh, get staff to do what you need them to do. It's called having respect for your staff. That's what it's called. So what are soldiers? Are they old? Are they all getting mentally abused? Because I guess you're what I. Is that wrong? Are you meant to say to. All right, Lath, can you please give me those 20-year-olds there? I can't say much. But, is it an end? There's a big difference. Why, what. There's a difference in a girl. There's a difference in. There's a difference in a girl being in a girl. The job you have to do is a beautiful job. Yeah, but you're doing have to be sure you like shite in a job. What should we do? You're doing have to be. You're doing have to have anxiety. What's the difference? There's no need for a person to have anxiety with the thoughts of going into work. Oh, you know what, Jess is arguing, Jess is arguing. Jess's argument and Steve's argument here was, if it doesn't suit you, if you're not good at it, if you're not able for it, we'll then move on. Well, hopefully somebody else will get further against that manager. I'm proof what a bully he is. Sorry, he's not bullying. He's just doing his job right. And is that what you. Have you ever been showed that in the workplace, Jess? Oh, the others showed it once or twice. And guess what? I made sure I never got showed it again. In other words, you did the job properly the next time. Yeah, I didn't do it right the first time, but just don't do it at all. And I bet you're now. I know, I don't know if you might be saying this, but one of the companies used to work for us in McDonald's. You definitely weren't shown that I'm McDonald's because McDonald's management are trained in American style management. And there is no way a manager in McDonald's would have shown you that, is that correct? Oh, no, I got showed it in the back. They didn't do it in front of everyone, but they did it at the back. There was one manager in particular who had an out for me, and she showed it in me, and I was like, "Look, I was like, you see what's wrong, so I'm not taking this." And did you get it? She was trying to make a point, because she had an out for me to say for the war. And what did you do? Did you leave? I did, there was like, "Great, well, I'm not coming in tomorrow. I'm expecting new ages, and fuck you." And that was the end of that. So your argument is, though, so did you not see that? You said she had it in for you. Did you not see that as bullying, no? No, I was just like, "Oh, she has a problem with me. She can fix me personally. She never did. She tried to make it without me working as wrong." So I was like, "You know what, I'm not dealing with this anymore. You can fix me face, fix me face." So I was like, "Great, I'm not dealing with this anymore, fuck you." And I was like, "I don't think I'll complain if anyone says it himself. I was like, "Great, fuck you." OK, stay there for a second, Jess. I want to bring in Emma. Completely agree with you, Jerry, around this one. If you're a good manager, you don't have to show the people. You can approach people and talk to them, be like, "Look, you need to do this better. You need to do that better." And I actually think stuff will probably respect you even more and do a better job for you if you're a nicer manager. I was in a shop in Blanche Town, probably a year ago. And there was a girl served me at the till, and the manager came along and started screaming in a show, not her saying she was so slow, and she'll never be on his tills again in front of me, like while serving me. And I asked for the store manager, and I wouldn't leave until she came down, and I went through her at the way him, and saying that he can't speak to people like that, especially from customers and stuff. And while I watched the wait, and she called me into the office after, you cannot speak to people like that. Humans deserve respect whether you're a manager, or you're saying that lesson, or whatever. Just have some respect, have a conversation with them, and identify if it doesn't improve, you can sit to have a verbal warning. You do not need to share the people, especially people under you on a job. I think it's a thing where you're too big for your boots, and they think they can do what they want. [music] >> Opinions matter. With Adrian Kennedy and Jeremy Dixon, a daily podcast from Ireland about opinions. >> Now Emma has been back on the game. We played Emma's voice no just a moment ago. She's been back on again, and she is angry this time with Jess. >> Jess, honest to God, you need fucking health. He's right, we are absolutely fucking psychotic. You'll never be a manager. Every, you'll still be on your little minimum wage job for fucking years because of your stupid attitude. There was a lady on the show what, months ago, and she called you fat lesbian, or something, and you fucking cry it. So how would you feel that every day, someone at you, someone at you, someone at you? You haven't a fucking nose. You need a serious way for color. I don't know who and God's name you think you're. >> Do you want to respond to that, Jess? >> Oh, now who's being the bully? You're going to be on a minimum wage job for the rest of your life. Like now who's being the vulcan bully? >> But do you not get the point she's trying to make, sad? >> No, I don't. Because clearly she's not another one of these ages who thinks that managers to be self-gender parents. Like, oh, can you please do this next time? But what they do is they keep fucking up like 20 times over because the budget's only pissed off. >> Jess, when you were screened out at the back of, and it's interesting that this was doing McDonald's, wasn't it, that they screamed at you? >> It was, yeah. >> And did you not feel threatened, did you not feel obsessed by the fact that this person- >> No, I just, no, I just, no, I just thought that I waited until she was seditioned and then when she divorced, I was like, are you done? And I got on him. >> But how, how loud was the screaming? How vicious was the screaming? >> I see, Jess, then when everybody sees that, And you still there and took that, I think that's, that's except. I suddenly office. I waited until she was finished. And I thought, yeah, yeah, yeah, I was like, right, I think I'm doing with this job. I'm not coming back in. I expect my wages. And fucking. Okay, let me go. Stay there for second, Jess. John, your own opinions matter. How are you, John? I don't know if you've heard, Jess, you heard Steve. They're basically saying this is part of the workplace. The idiots, two idiots, two idiots, two idiots, two idiots, two idiots, two idiots, two idiots. And I just want to give you a quick story. I'm going to fast forward this because no, he's don't have time. And my daughter is in college. And she started a job. Now we have force caught her there that actually was talking to us earlier on. And it's the same supermarket chain that she had that my daughter worked for. And I know what she's talking about. You got to get this kind of character. You know, you know, anyway, I was, you know, she was enjoying this job, you know, it was a bit of crack for her. And then it was a bit of money for a while. She was in college. And I was really much of it to, you know, to walk on the weekends and what happened, you know, I was, I was, I was wondering because it was four or six weekends in. And I said, I don't know. You know, when I knew it was something wrong, actually, you know, you know, you know, you know, your own kids, you know, and I said to where it's not so, no, no, you know, just, just not feeling great. I said, how are you? Okay. And I actually went and, you know, I'm just carried on for probably two weekends. And then, boom, you've got a phone call, just one, just one Saturday, I think it was one Sunday, because she was doing the weekends. And she was running and crying down the phone in the toilet. So that's my truck. Oh, dad, did he come and collect me? I said, what's up? What's up? Yeah, I'll just completely collect me. I said, really, okay, I'm again, I'm down two wheels of the car, I just gone down to the supermarket and went in, what's up? And she came out to the car, she was running and crying, you know, he had me see what someone's with me. And she told us what was going on. And I left that car, like a lunatic, went with my two sons. We went in and I tell you what, I was like a lunatic, seeking out this manager. And I got him. Now, when I say I got him, I grabbed him, I said, come here, you bastard. I said, who do you fucking think you were talking to? I said, my daughter's name is blah, blah, blah. I said, it was just in just talking to us. It'd be hard, minus us talking the Gary like that, because she is more like the Gary, even though she's not the Gary anymore. Well, she always will be. You see, Jess, I just finished off before I get to Jess. And I was told with a probation act anyway, I didn't have to pay two ones a year or one card for him to try to see a more choice, because he did send the guards to my house. And I was I had done quite a bit. You see, hang on, hang on, John. What do you did is worse than what the manager does? I'm a father. That's what I do. You look at it as you're wrong. I'm going to say it now. I was wrong. You know, I should have went down to WRC route where I should have gone this, I should have gone back to myself or walk for myself. I should have known better for myself. I did, I made a policy. I really did. I did. I'm going to be going to put my hands up. The fact that I'm at this CD is animals that are in the supermarket chain. They're on top of that. And I've been here now, but I've heard from that, um, um, can I mention it? Actually, no, you can't know, no, you can't for this, if it wouldn't know, that, that, that certain store in part from, but I knew the store enough. And I've been in them other stores, because I like that store, you know, I'd like to do that, that certain brand. And I've been in there. And I've seen the way you're a manager's talk to our employees. And I pulled them up. I did, I assume. I said, but you know, but you know, that's not you're not that you're not that you're not that you're not that you're not that you're not that picking people up. Everybody's short. The whole of the public of, you know, if you were to shop in center and you're seeing a manager screaming a shelon at anybody, now it doesn't matter. You know, you see John, here's the thing here's the thing. Here's the thing here's the thing. You said, you said yourself, you said yourself, I know I did, and I did pick up a guy at a particular race course. He spoke down to a young one like she was a dog, right? So, however, generally speaking, it is none of our business unless it's it is. They shouldn't be doing it. And you have just get on the phone. Oh, well, if you don't learn the force, you know, these are absolute bastards. They shouldn't be in the job. Well, yes, there are some people that shouldn't be in management positions because they're just not suited to it. Why? Because they're actually selling the staff members what to do. And they should know that. And they should know all our jobs. You have no job. And you should know better. You should know better. You have a job. You have a job. So you should be on moist soil, saying that, yes, she was an animal and she was screaming and she didn't want me out of the job. I pull him in his box, didn't I? Even caught and caught the guys and he was shit himself. It was a real animal, here's the real animal, the manager. You do not fucking speak to nobody like that. So that's my point today, Jess. And if you want to listen to the kind of you want. Oh, the matter. Hold on for the minute. The fact that the matter is a worker, a community tell you so you shit head, community tell you so all friends and all came forward and all friends were in the total hole on the group. All right, this and that we hear it. Yeah, the question I'm going to answer if you they came in on the group track and they even said that they're all called the complaint and against that schoonback that was down there because they had an awful. There we go. There you go. Not because he was a bastard to the people down there, Jess, his shoe book bitch. Listen to me when I'm fucking talking to you. You're the little virus hole as well. Why would you even back somebody who played that that actually ran you over fucking job? Are you fucking stupid or something? Are you seriously like you get your shit to get out of here? You're fucking idiot. Talk about common fucking sense here. You actually see this, are you not sure where you're out of the fucking job? And you're a big corporation, a big corporation like McDonald's, you wouldn't made fucking 20 20 tells now that if you're going to call us. No, guess what? I was waiting for you. It's finished what you was finished. I didn't go. I didn't go. I didn't go. I didn't go. I didn't go. I didn't go. I didn't go. I didn't go. I didn't go. You see where it got me. You see me. You see me. You're a folk. Are you? I enter open cart over it. And I hear I didn't even touch the bastard. So what imagine they blew you out of point. Shout out. What what I've done? I would again 12 months, but you go to build about it. You're a self-honored. You would have done it. Really a fucking idiot. You're a man. I tell you some. There's no fucking excuse. Yes. How long? Yes. There's no fucking excuse for anybody who treating. I need to show you the job because it's not a fucking excuse. They said there's no excuse for anybody. If you give anybody shit in a job these days, no fucking way of stuff. But that's the case. Get rid of them. Simple as that. Don't be given them shit. Simple as that. Agile. Simple as that. Agile. All you wouldn't give anybody years to think. I only keep people. Shit. Give me a shit. Oh, you have to be a do me dark and smoking head in the last couple of months. That's why the last. I want to improve myself. She wouldn't take too much of it. She was doing the fucking job like the best of them. Okay. So John, let me just confirm that. We're gonna say that. Yeah. Yeah. You're gonna come to the book off. Yes. Yeah. Do you? Let me confirm, John. You don't believe any manager should say. Shows at any staff member ever. No, I hope. Listen, come here and tell yourself, legend. That's the case. You shouldn't be the manager. That's screaming at show on the staff. They should bring them off into a quiet place. Listen, here's the thing. You're wonderful falling. You're not doing the job properly. Listen, you know, there's a warning for you. You know, that's it, agent. There's no need to be shown in public. Are given people grief and public. And that's exactly what was happening with moly dog. I know fans as well. And he was wrapped in a blanket as well. And moly dog. I didn't even get to say that. But he was wrapped in man that wrapped him under the fire. You know, there's no need for that. You know, Steve there and I'm just there. Oh, she'll grow up here. And this, that's it. Get the fuck out of here. You know, people out there that make people's and lawyers misery in jobs that fucking animals like them. And they shouldn't be in the position agent. As I said, okay, stay there for one second of you, can't please. Let me go to Jason, you're on opinions matter in Australia, I believe. Jason, how are you? Good not about the thanks Jason. What do you want to say on this? Oh, look, I think this day is just the kind of thing anyone anymore. I currently work in a mine site in Australia. We had a girl working for us. She wasn't doing her work. She was taking extra lunch breaks. Like maybe two hour lunch breaks during the day, finishing early, how to do her work. She lights your face. Eventually I'm our supervisor. Go angry, told her to her job. Then she went to management saying I was a billionaire. So it didn't go far. It doesn't look like what happened as a result of it. So it didn't go far. It didn't last too much longer in the job. And just, you can't say anything to people these days. And does that annoy you? I mean, the word snowflake has been used a lot on this podcast today. Is that what we have become snowflakes? It doesn't annoy me. I think there is genuine cases for overlooked genuine cases of people just taking the piss, trying to get into jobs, then just don't want to work at the end of the day. Do you think that? I mean, John, John was going on there a minute ago, saying that managers just shouldn't shout at staff. Those days are behind us. That's not the way we do things now. You should be able to correspond and discipline staff in a way that doesn't involve raising your voice. Yeah, that's true. But everyone has probably thought and does. I think that's the way it is and like with this girl I told her every day for about two weeks, every day to do her job and she's just like, "Oh, my Jesus, will you do your job properly?" Exactly. And don't have me having to get angry. But would you believe we've gone too far the other way that you literally can't say anything? I think that's the way it is and like with this girl I told her every day for about two weeks, every day to do her job and she just lies straight in my face. Yeah, yeah, yeah, I'm doing it. No, you're not doing it because I can't see you doing it. And then after about two weeks and I just said, "You doing it?" I'm doing it. I said, "No, and then that's for myself." I said, "No, you're fucking not." Right. And Jeremy, this is the point of it. That's the way it's done. Jeremy's just saying, "I'm being bullied, I'm being bullied." This is the argument that a manager has to have the right to say, "Oh, yeah, to get a noise." The way to say it in the same way as in that you went off like a little snowflake when your man, the dragon, used to call him when he shouted at you that time, you went off like a little. Yeah, but it didn't do as you went. I camped down. It was over. Yeah, but you knew the interiors like that. You were the right man. The next day was the grand. Your exact words when we came in and I met Mark, he had no fucking right to speak to me like that. Yeah, no, and he didn't. But I still didn't go to the workplace relations commission or anything at the time. I just talked to him. And he's not sharing eventually. Jason, great to talk to you and great to have you listening to Opinion's Matter in Australia. No problem. Thanks for your time. Subscribe to the podcast. Subscribe to the podcast, Jason. I listen to it every day when I work and I'm fine. Well, listen to it. And I'm happy to go on from the last 800 episodes in the last six months of the month. No, Jason. I'll fair pay to you. All right. Good night. Great to hear from you, Jason. Thanks very much. I know this is neither here nor there Jason when you're listening to our podcast in Australia, yeah, where you are. Do you hear Australian ads on the podcast or is it ads for like Castle Moin 4x and stuff like that? It's all Australian ad. Oh, that's really weird. Yeah, it's mad. Yeah, it's brilliant. It's amazing. Now, I do that on Spotify, but I do listen and I do hear your ad that you do promote as well. All right. Very good. Thank you very much indeed. I find it so weird. Yeah, no, it is. It's mad. Yeah. People listen to this podcast abroad, which lots do a lot of my family and friends in America. Listen to the podcast because it's great for they say you like my best maker. It's a taste of home. He says when he's listening to this, he's right back home, right back because there's nowhere to podcast like this. But they're hearing their local ads. Yeah. So if you listen to this podcast in America, it's going to be an outcome of the moment saying head down to Denny's for some pancakes and bacon. We have something like that. Something like that. Steven. Hi, that's Steve here. Love to show. Sorry, I can't come on. I can walk. But yeah, no, ask him. You should receive. Roar. And you will receive. No, no, you don't. Roar. You ask someone there. Look, dude, or whatever. Don't roar. Cheers. Love to show. All right. Thanks very much indeed, Robert. How are you guys? Great topic today. First of all, it's just like the state of majority of people are thinking. Just as an absolute fucking idiot. And if she ever got a manager position, I would love to work in that company because there will be lawsuits left right in center. And the company because of she never really wanted to she's the mornings of a fucking penal. As for a show. A little bit shown. There's no harm a little bit shown. Like if that woman, I know it was bad. But if you think a little bit of shouting the bad in the shop, you want to go into what the defense force was a few years ago. Or the fact that you're even on the building site, like I was in the army 17 and even on the building site 15 and 16. And you want to hear the language and the scream and the intimidation that you'd see even in the army as a. Didn't fucking. I didn't do any harm to me anyway. I got on with a good job now manager is also. No, any problem with thanks guys. All right, Robert. Thanks very much indeed. We'll squeeze in one final WhatsApp voice notes this time from grace managers are on the floor to delegate. And to make sure the things are going well and if they can't do that then they're failing at the manager. It's not about the staff. If you can't keep your staff in check and keep them in line, but I'd scream in a chat, nothing that's on you. And if there is anything seriously wrong that they need to take them up on, they need to bring them to hate or. But they need to have a conversation with each or they can't go around the floor shouting and screaming at staff. They're not allowed to do that. And it just shows their capability as a manager if they can't even articulate themselves well enough to delegate property to make sure that the job is done right. And that's that's too bad on them as a manager. All right, Grace. Thank you very much indeed for your message. And thank you all of you for your messages. It was an extremely busy podcast. I don't want to apologize as well for the people who did listen to this. And we're triggered by it or we're upset by it. It's our fault. We should have put a warning at the start was that if you have been in it. But what I want to say now, if you have been affected by workplace bullying, first of all, contact the HR company in the within the company. Although my experience of HR companies is they'll all decide with the company. They think they make you think they're on your side. But not really. Sure, how would they be? They work for the company. So get onto the WRC. The one thing that scares the shit out of companies are these three letters W or C. Because anything that goes to the WRC ends up in the news. And no company wants to be dragged across that. Sure they don't. Nope, they certainly don't. All right, thank you very much indeed for listening to this latest opinions matter podcast with Adrian and Jeremy. If you are listening to us on Spotify or Apple podcasts or wherever you get your podcast, please hit subscribe and click on the little bell icon if there's one and allow notifications. Because that way you will get a notification each and every time we upload a new episode, which by the way is six days a week in the afternoon. I'm Adrian, he's Jeremy. Thank you for listening and we'll catch you on the next opinions matter podcast.