Inside I.AM.GIA's Global Playbook: Dom Moretti on Running Two Fashion Brands With One Team | #635

(bell rings) The reengagement's ruined really well in like one about region. So that one definitely surprised me. 90% of our revenue comes from there. It's basically a free marketing channel. (upbeat music) - Here we go, episode number three of our three-part series from K-Sid. - I am very excited to bring you today's guest, Dominic Morady. She is the head of e-commerce and digital at A and S labels, the Melbourne company behind Tiger Mist and I am Gia. She started there, get this, as a graphic design intern, 12 years ago, she grew with the business which was found a lead at the time and she left for a stint at Calibar before coming back in a bigger role, looking after both brands from a digital and e-commerce perspective. She is also a Clavio champion for 2026, which is how she ended up sitting across from me at 8 AM before the doors even opened at Clavio's Sydney summit. This is the third of the three conversations that we recorded there. You heard from our Clavio Champions panel last week and then from the Clavio co-founder, Ed, the week before that and then this one just brings it home with a little bit more depth around how Clavio fits into the whole e-commerce ecosystem. Now a lot of you may already know Dom. She spoke at one of our e-commerce socials in Melbourne a couple of years back and the room just fell in love with her. People were stopping her on Chapel Street weeks after just recognizing her from the event and I get it because Dom cuts straight to what is and what's not working and is just genuinely trying to be helpful for others in e-commerce. The one thing that stayed with me and that was really mind-blowing going into this one is that IMG started in a lounge room in Melbourne's northern suburbs and right now 90% of their revenue is coming from the US. We get into how that happened, how Dom rebuilt the IMG or website from scratch in 12 weeks after making the massive call to scrap a project that had already moved into UAT. And then she talks about why they move from headless to Shopify native, how she's running CRM with open rates sitting at 50% to 60% and what it takes to perform on TikTok shop in the US. We're all watching that with baited breath. Now just quickly, before we get into today's conversation a massive, massive thank you to our partners @clavio and at Shopify for making ad-decade possible and if you haven't joined the ad-decade community yet, it's free and it's available at ad-decade.com.au. Go sign up and you get to be part of great conversations with everyone else who's listening. That's the fun of it. All right, let's get into this conversation with Dominic Moretti. Dom, welcome to Ad-decade. Thanks for having me. How fun is this for in person? This is actually so cool. At KCID, you are the eight o'clock session before the festivities of status. So we walk through the main foil of KCID and seeing everyone setting up. And I heard someone just say, this is like Clavio Christmas. (laughs) It definitely does look like that. Like the lounge, the bars, the gifting, there is so much. I was not expecting that. Yeah, I were really lucky to have Clavio supporting us and you support Clavio as a Clavio champion. Yes, my first year. What does it mean? So I think there's a cohort of like 84 of us and it's just a really good community where we get to like network with each other. We have little pods, we get to work through problems with each other. It's just a really good cohort of people across a wide range of brands. They're asking people agency side as well, but I believe this year within APAC is like the biggest cohort of hats. I think there's about 18 of us in Australia. We're like in APAC and last year, I believe there's only four people. So everyone's really-- That means you're in the top 18 of Clavio users in Australia. I guess. Is that a me? I guess so. We're gonna get all your secrets. I love it, but yeah, very exciting. We had our first champions day yesterday. So got to meet a lot of the APAC champions. I got to meet one of the co-founders of Clavio, which was really exciting. Yes, Ed. We've got to add on my podcast. Yeah, this was really good. Everyone was firing away questions. A lot about AI and what the roadmap and tech-- like the tech is looking like in the future, and what the next five to 10 years of Clavio might look like, what the interface might look like. So-- Did he tell you anything he won't tell us? I feel like he would probably tell everyone. Or no, I will hear from him. That group, that bigger group, I suppose, that's really important for you in your role. And I'm gonna be a real bogeon here. I am Gia or I am Gia. I am Gia. You get it all the time. I could imagine. So-- I am Gia and Tiger Mist. Because 90% of your sales, from what I understand, is actually in the US. So connecting with a global knowledge base must be really important as you're operating that market from here. Yeah, so the US for us is one of our fastest growing regions. I'm Gia. Ye is now about 90% of our revenue from the US. Tying this is probably around 70%. But both the brands started here in Melbourne, like from a local little suburb in the Northern suburb so it's wild to see how much the business has grown and especially over in the US. So I mean, focus issues like, honey down on the US. But yeah, expansion's growing really fast over there, which is really exciting. So having a cohort of people, that you can connect with all around the world and then speak to people from the US and whatnot, it's really handy to have those relationships. How do you compare the US people, US users to Australians? Are we all right? I think we're good. Yeah, I think we're good. There's just a lot bigger companies over there. Yeah, the numbers are on a much bigger scale. Yeah. Okay. Tell us a little bit about your journey before we jump into what you're doing at I'm Gia and Tying Meas because we've known each other for a long time. Yeah, we have. And we were lucky enough to have you on an ad to cart panel in Melbourne. Yes, that was a two years ago. Yeah, it's going so fast. That's so much good feedback on your panel. It was wild. After that event, I was like walking down Chapel Shree, getting lunch like on my lunch break and I was having people stopping me, and like, Dom and I'm like, hello, like, did I know who they were? And they're like, I saw you speak like last week. It was crazy and people from work were like, are you famous? I'm like, no. I'm just, I just have famous. Yeah, there was so much. Doesn't make me rich. It looked like there was a lot of people there on the day, but then there was so many more that I didn't even go into like, speak to, but then would say something like, in weeks after, or as I bumped into them in the streets. Oh, I saw other events. So yeah. I love it. Well, you were phenomenal on the panel. Thank you. And it was really practical. I think a lot of people turn up to events just expecting fluff and you're like, actually, no, we're going to cut the shit when you're going to get into it. Yeah, we're going to get into it. And we're going to get into that. So tell me about your story because your career from what I understand started a Tiger Mist. You recently did a stint elsewhere and you've come back into the business in a bigger, better role. Tell us about your transition, and how you've learnt everything that you've come to know around digital and ACOL. Yeah. So actually started with Tiger Mist, I've probably like 12 years ago now, as a graphic design intern. Wow. So it was kind of my second gig out of uni. The business are very much like startup vibes back then. Like it was very small. Head office. I'm just still involved every day. Yeah. Head office was there was me and like two other people. So it's very small team. Like that was across everything to do with online. Like the website uploading products, like email marketing. Like there was just three of us. So very, very small. And I kind of grew as the company grew. So within that role went from like your graphic design intern to then like graphic design on like water nadar then it was just like doubling in email marketing, picked up that picked up like SMS marketing. So yeah, I kind of grew as the business grew. Like if someone had asked me at uni, like what do you want to do? I probably didn't even know what e-commerce meant. And was that just a case of you just putting your hand up going? I'll give it a crack. I think when you're at a company that is small and like at that startup phase, the opportunities to just like double your hands in everything and learn and just like take on more responsibility is very easy. So very thankful for like having that opportunity to be able to do that. Yes, I kind of like grew with the company. Then like e-commerce managers did come in. So I had some good mentors over my time there. And I'd also say like networking and like the industry. Like the income industry is so big, but so small at the same time. But attending a lot of events and whatnot. It's like the conversations you have with people at the networking events. That's as well where I think you like learn a lot and even just building those relationships and then message someone linked in. Like how you spoke about this? Can I like pick your brain for a beer? You're really good at that because I think there is a trap that you can get in. Especially when you've been at one place for a while. And I talk about for a while in e-commerce being over two years. Yeah. It's very easy to get comfortable and go, well, this is what I do. I mean, this business, I need to know this business. But you've always no matter whether you've been in a business for two years, five years, ten years, it's like, I'm going to be out there. I'm going to be talking to people all the time. Yeah, because you don't know what you don't know. And that's my thing with anything where it's like project management or like the industry. You don't know what you don't know. So yeah, I was at the company for like nine years, then decided to leave. I thought it actually got to a point where I was like, I'd hired an e-commerce trading manager. So I was kind of in a bit of a rut where it was like trying to deal with the BAU of the business, like the run and then the project and like the future state. And trying to manage all of that becomes a lot on top of like email marketing, your marketing strategy, your income. Like there's so many different elements happening. So I'd finally hired an e-commerce trade manager. And I just remember having this moment, I was like sitting at my desk and like the teams all around me. And I was like, if I was to go somewhere else and just try something else, I feel like I'm leaving the company in really good hands right now. And I kind of felt at peace in that moment. So that was when I was at the moment, the trigger there. I think I was just like really confident, really proud of the team. And like they just knew how to do things. I didn't have to like pull them up on anything. They didn't really need training. on anything, they were just like in a really good place, that whole run part of it, or like, they've got this. Yeah, and I found it piece, and I was like, if I'm going to try another business, like now's the time. So from there, I moved to Calibur for just under two years, very different business. So I didn't realize how different was going to be until I got there. Well, so like, Thai News and I'm, G, is very like digital first, pure play company, women's fashion, going to Calibur, which is a business that's been around now for 35 years. Men's luxury wear, like the customers differ in itself, how men shop and how women shop, but they're different, but their business as well is very like Omni Channel, like bricks and mortar first, digital is kind of like a new channel for them. So the challenges I had in like a pure play business versus like a really Omni Channel. It would have been wild for you. So different. Yeah. You've got me curious, what's the biggest difference between how men shop and how women shop? So I feel like women just see something and they love it and they will buy it. They don't need a reason to buy it. There might be like an event on the weekend or it could just be a trend that's really hard and they've just gotten onto that. Whereas males, I feel like you would look outside the window and it would be raining and it's like the first cold day of the season. And you see people checking out with like two tops, two pants, two shoes, two jackets, two jumpers. And you just know they don't have a winter wardrobe. It's because when we find something, it's like, I'll have that in four different colors, thanks. And that too. They then, like you'd see them by like a chinos or a polo that they'd loved and then this second order might be buying the same thing, but in like five different colors. Men are a lot more predictable, I think, for their shopping behaviors. Like just a general. Yeah. Res mirroring is just like trends. If something's hard, you don't need a reason to shop. And we also like the weather does. That's right. You're in a fashion brand. Yeah. The weather doesn't influence us either. Like if something's hot, like we will go out without a jacket. Maybe more so in the younger years. Now I can't get away with that as much anymore. But yeah, that was even just learning that consumer behavior was so different as well. Yeah. Okay. So now you're back at Tiger Miss, Andrea. What brought you back because after nine years there, stepping on white, even if that was a great learning environment and it wasn't the right environment for you, that's still a big call to come back to a company where you've done your formative years to go there is still a challenge here. There's something really exciting about this business. Yeah. Just lots of projects and like knowing how digital first, tech first, focus they are, the company was always one to like adopt things really quickly. So I think in the time of like this agentic AI and like we'll rebuild in websites, launching apps, there'll just so many projects that I wanted to be a part of. Yeah. So I was kind of excited when they called up and said like what was on the road map and I kind of thrive in like environments where there's like projects, there's challenges, new tech, chaos. That's where I thrive. So what was the first project you stepped into? There was a couple or going at the same time. So we were launching our two apps and launching our AMG website. So kind of jumped into the AMG website first, kind of navigate that a little bit and change the plans there and then went into the apps, launch those and then relaunch the AMG website. What do you mean about changing the plans? Well, so they had already started the project when I'd come into the business and I am a sucker for like UAT and like anyone that knows me, I've got an Excel spreadsheet. It has like 20, 30 tubs on the bottom and like 800 tests. I am never launching anything if like that spreadsheet is not all in the green. Like if there are yellows and reds like we're not going live and being. So there's no risk except. No, I would rather like kill all the bugs beforehand to lay a project. Wow. Then go live and have like a really bad customer experience because that's not common in ACO. No, I think it depends on the project. Like some you definitely can launch a bit early and finish things later. But when it comes to like this was meant to be a new website going live before Black Friday. Okay. With how much we were investing in stock with the targets that we had. When I like after UAT was conducted, I was like there is no way we are launching this website before Black Friday. We've got a website right now that works. It's not broken. And we're going from something to Shopify. Yeah. So our current website was headless. Okay. So yeah, the reasoning was we wanted to move away from headless. I'd go back to Shopify. Just for more flexibility for the team, headless made sense at the time. Yeah. Probably not so much anymore. And I suppose Shopify has come so far with markets. So far. And everything like that to allow you to operate both back in the day when we like we'd moved to headless. It was kind of like you did it for like site speed. That was kind of something that Shopify was a little bit behind in. We had four websites. We had an in-house developer. So being on headless and having a developer like writer script or code and just deploy it across all four sites, it was a lot easier. But I think as time has like evolved, you've now got like your sidekick that can write you code and like so many changes you can make so quickly having a headless tech circuit. Well, so does still make sense for some businesses for us. It just didn't make sense anymore. So yeah, coming back in, tested the website. I was like, this is a huge risk if this was to go live for like Friday. So kind of held that project. It's like Friday still go well. Really well. Like our best year today. Really, really exciting. Yeah. Basically started the project from scratch. There were that many issues with it. It wasn't worth fixing. We did try to fix them. So you're in UAT. Yeah. With an agency. Yes. And you decide to scrap the website totally. Yeah. Yeah. Oh, that's a big call. Yeah. Change agencies started the full project again. We scoped it out. Like scoped out the website designed it. Redid UAT and launched it in 12 weeks. It was probably the fastest project I've ever worked on. But there was honesty, no hiccups. And it went so smooth. I'm not going to ask you to name the agency because that's not fair. But what was the phone call like when you call the agency and you go, Hey, I'm dumb. I'm back. And we're scrapping this website. That's in UAT. Well, fortunately, I was kind of in Europe. So I didn't know. It's for juniors. Yeah. So I feel like they probably weren't surprised. Yeah. Yeah. I found out afterwards we've hired a lot of people on our accounts now at different businesses that were all a part of the project. So I've like filled in a lot of gaps of like things that happened at the time. Yeah. That's hard from an agency perspective to when you've got staff turnover and people are in the bridge. It doesn't make it easy on either side of the project. So yeah, we ended up just like we're starting again 12 weeks. My favorite saying is like fail to plan plan to fail. Also, we had a very strict timeline. We had to stick to design meetings that like the attendees if you're on that call like you could not miss it. We were signing off on like deadlines. There was one instance where like some of the developments I took a little bit longer, but we'd added in buffer time for like the UAT and content population at the end. And did keep that buffer time hidden. I know I know I know it's about that buffer time built into the plan. No, like myself and the team we know about it. But it also trusts the team. Like we know like that 800 tests we knew from that first time we could get it done in three days. So I think we'd allowed like a week or an a week and a half for that. But we knew like we could do it in three days. So that was then time that we re-couped back from like some of these dev delays. So we pretty much stuck through the timeline. Awesome. Yeah. 12 weeks start to finish building a new website. And this is after Black Friday. After Black Friday. Yeah. So we ended up going live midfab. Okay. Midfab 2026. Yeah. Okay. That's exciting. Yeah. So then whilst the developers were in the build phase of the website. So that's where I said we kind of like pivoted with those very jacks because we started like the scoping out the designing and then while they were in the build, which we're basically hands off during that period, we were then building our tap cart for an apps. Okay. We launched those I think first or second week of January. And then when they were launched we then went back to like the content population UAT of the new website and then launched that. So it's like three projects in a very short window of time. On top of Black Friday, turning in sales. Yeah. And what's the thinking behind the apps? What role do they play in the customer journey? Yeah. It's just another you know what? Years ago when people were talking about apps in the business, I was not an app shopper. But over the years I've definitely become an app shopper. So the biggest thing for me is like the push notifications. It's basically like a free marketing channel to market to your customers. SMS is such an expensive channel. So the more customers you can get on your app to then leverage those push notifications, it's so much cheaper for the business. And only last week or the week before we've launched or they're like AI notifications. So I think there's about eights, maybe 10 flows now within tap cart. And what are they allowing you to do? You basically train the agent with like your tone of voice, what to say, what not to say, what emerges to use, how you want to discount or like write your CTAs. And basically within those customer journeys, it writes the subject lines, the messages. Wow. So a bit more hands off. The market is shifting. Costs are climbing and the pressure to do more with less is very real. But when resources are tight, you can rely on Shopify, the platform that's consistently first with new capabilities. Shopify invests significantly in R&D and drops more than 150 updates every year, evolving with you and absorbing complexity so that you can focus on what moves your business forward. From AI powered insights to the world's best converting checkout, Shopify is designed for the next year of commerce, helping you sell more, scale faster, and future proof your brand. Build for what is next with Shopify. Visit Shopify for enterprise to learn more. What does the apps allow to do in a in a customer journey. So if you don't. asked me a few years ago was definitely not an app shopper. I was more of like a browser shopper, but now I'm definitely, I've got a whole folder of all different shopping apps. And the thing that I love about the MesoPersonnel applications, it's basically a free marketing channel that you can contact your customers and SMS is such an expensive marketing channel too. So to be able to contact your customer on their phone with a very similar experience, but not cost to business anything, that's pretty much like, maybe S&S, like get as many customers on the apps as possible to leverage those push notifications more. And only last week or the week before they'd kind of, we had launched all of our AI notifications. So you basically train up the AI agent with like your tone of voice, what emojis you use as a brand, like what CTA's, like how to write them, how not to write them. And they basically just trigger so many different flows from like your welcome, your browser bandament, low-end stock, back-end stock price drops. So it's only been I think two or three weeks that we've gone live with them and the ROI is already insane. So I can only imagine as our database grows a lot more on the apps and we get more downloads, how effective this channel's gonna be for us. - Do you have to incentivize your customers to download the app or are they naturally going there because they're high-repeat purchase? - Yeah, we do have like a discount on the app for their first purchase, which we've got like 5% higher than what our email signup is on our website, but we're also doing like up exclusive promotions and products. So we're actually seeing we get like a spike of downloads. When we do do like a promotion that's only on the app and the customers can't get that anywhere else. - And the idea being that that promotion then offsets the costs that you would normally be marketing to them with SMS. - Yeah, the end game is not to spend as much SMS and get them all on the app. - Good, good. And tell me about the website and I'm keen to understand what was the biggest challenge for you when building the new website. Obviously you've got multiple markets, but did I read right that you've also got 15,000 skews or is that a bit of generous reporting somewhere? - Maybe if you can't variance in colors potentially. Like we've got for IMGR, our Blair set, it's like a track set, it comes with like a hoodie and a pants and that alone comes in like 40, 40 print colors. And that's like our biggest product at the moment. - Are you taking photography of all those colors? - Yeah. - Wow. - Yeah. - That's a huge job. - We'll go up with TikTok and TikTok Shop. And yeah, we just keep rolling out new colors and they keep loving all of them. So we've got like snake print, solid colors, polka dots, everything you can think of. We even do some collaboration. So we did a collaboration with Sexy Red at Coachella. - Yeah. - And she was wearing like custom J.R. and her backup dancers were wearing custom J.R. And now we have a sexy Blair set on the website as well. So we kind of tied into collaborations too. - You must have to move pretty fast with those kind of collaborations. - Yes and no, sexy red is like a big fan of I&GR. So she's constantly like in the product and promoting us which is really helpful. - That's cool. So then going back to the website, what was the biggest challenge? What was the thing you had to really get your head around? - Do you know what? Probably the biggest challenge is just making sure like everyone was aligned and sticking to all the dates and just making everyone aware like if we're missing anything like it will push out. - Yeah. - Project. That was probably the biggest thing. And then I think just coordinating like all of our partners. But the way that I like to work with partners is like they're an extension of your team. So like culture fit wise, they need to be the same as like who you would hire internally. So that also wasn't really difficult on the day. But it was just coordinating things from like an SEO perspective or like the timing of the actual day and especially going from headless to Shopify native. There's a few more things that you need to consider versus just launching a new Shopify site from a Shopify site. So it was just coordinating like our developers, our SEO agency, our developers from the headless site as well. Like what needs to be wound down from like AWS, the redirects with the domains like who's handling all of those steps. But then the fun stuff, all the fun stuff. Some of these a bit too technical for my knowledge but it's just about getting the right people in the room to have those discussions. Have everyone working from the same doc. So we kind of asked everyone individually what they would own and what the order of things that they feel should have happened on the day. Then we ended up getting like our developer that was running the new project to put it all in one doc together, assigning it to everyone. And then we jumped on a call prior to just be like, is everyone comfortable with this? Is anything forgotten? Is there anything that needs to be changed or swapped around? Like I said before, what you don't know, you don't know. But just getting everyone in the room together and having like different brains from different departments as well, there was no gaps. And then the day of go live, we had a kick off call with everyone just to go over like, okay, this is the game plan. This is what we're doing. This is a shit we're all referring to. This is a slouch channel if you have any questions. And everyone just basically worked through like step by step and then in the slouch channel, be like, okay, step four is done. You're good to start step five if they were then like assigning the next task. So it's just not waiting for tickets to log. It's like it's gonna be real time. It's just good. Yeah, real agile, real fluid. And just making sure like you obviously need exceptions. You can't be like raising tickets on the day, yeah. Cool. And so obviously we're here at KCED and you're the Clavier champion. I've said the Clavier champion. I'm the only one. And you've just said that SMS is too expensive and you're trying to avoid SMS. The team knows. Tell me, how are you approaching CRM differently? What do you think makes what you're doing? I'm Jaya and Tiger Mist different to how others are using CRM? In terms of going back to the cost of SMS, it's not so much, should we don't want to like use it at all? It's just been more strategic with how we use it, when we use it and just making sure you're on your those costs aren't like getting really out of control over time. Which is good from a cost perspective, but also from a customer perspective, right? Because it's the communication that you can't avoid. And it's the first thing that customers get pissed off about. So it's probably good on both both sides. Yeah, so with the SMS as well, like right now we are currently just testing. We're changing our thought process of how we handle SMS. So we're kind of looking at customers that are engaged versus non-engaged. So unengaged for SMS is someone that's like received SMS within the last 12 months, but have never purchased. And really looking at what is that ROI for each one we send and which ones have a positive ROI and which ones are negative. And then now we're currently building out the strategy like we'll base on that data we've seen for our unengaged customers with SMS. Unless you've got a really entire seeing message, it's kind of not profitable to message them with an SMS message every single time for every campaign. And again, it depends on regions too, because like the US SMS is cheap. And for like IMG, our 90% of our revenue comes from there. So SMS is a better channel. 90% of your revenue comes from SMS. I was sorry from the US. Sorry. Oh, it was a lot better. I wanted for the 90% in one channel. Because when you said 90% in the US and then 90% from SMS, I was like, holy shit. No, no, no, no, no. As in, because 90% is from the US, the US rights are a lot cheaper than Australia. It's a show like cost four times the end. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. So yeah, it's a lot easier for like IMG versus Tygium and then I switched to a website which was a brand that started in Australia and was huge in Australia for so long. A lot of our customers are based in Australia or like eight pack in regions that it cost a lot more. So yeah, we're just kind of working out now like what are the messages and being more strategic with how we target them through SMS. In terms of like CRM in total. So when I came back into the business, the team had done a migration to Clavio. I think it was around maybe like April May. So coming back into the business, I had learned Clavio at Calabar. Tygium is an IMGable with the masses. So coming back into the business, I really knew like the system, how it worked. But my number one thing, especially before Black Friday, so when my day was we needed to get flows in this system. ASAP. So I think we ended up launching about 13 or 14 flows right before Black Friday, because it was so much happening in the business were investing a lot in like paid marketing and SMS. It was like, we need to make sure if we're getting these customers to side we're then still constantly targeting them through other channels if they don't convert. So everything from like your welcome flows, your card abandonments, your browser abandonment, check out abandonment. Like all the flows you can think of, server side tracking flows, Clavio flows. - What's your most underrated flow? - Do you know what? We recently launched a re-engagement flow and for I think it's our Tiger Missed Raster World region, that's now our best performing flow. And all it is is we're looking at customers that haven't opened or quit an email in the last 90 days. And we just show them, hey, this is what you've missed. This is what's new, this is what's hot. And it's our best flow at the moment. - Really? Directly converting to sales or engagement. That's pretty amazing when you might have just lost some customers totally. - And there's no discount, but you literally just showing them what's new and what's hot. And that's all, I had to double check the numbers when I saw it. I was like, how is this meeting like our welcome flow? Like people come to site, they're engaged, they sign up to your welcome flow, use a welcome discount, but you know, they're re-engagement so we're really well in like one about region. - Do you know what kind of subject line that's got because I could imagine that's got to have some sort of really strong, or something like that. - I understand you can say something like this is what you've missed recently. - Yeah. - Something along those lines. It's hard to remember the morph of the puffing in my head. - I would not expect you to. - 200 or 300 emails across some all, but yeah, I think it's something like this is what you've been missing all that. This is what you've missed. - Yeah, okay. And how are you thinking about your customers? Obviously you've got two very different brands that have two very different personalities, all in fashion, but how are you then taking that down a level and segmenting customers you talked about engage versus disengaged? Are there any other key segments for you? - To be honest. - Not really. (laughing) - We're kind of still doing a bit of like - From a Clavio champion everyone. (laughing) - Kind of still doing a bit of like a fashion blast. You know what though, our open rates are still really good. I'm like even during like Friday, we're in a lot of different ways. work with some agencies and they were kind of telling us how a lot of brands in the US and not just sending one email anymore a day at least and like six or seven. I was a bit nervous to do that but some days we did do two or three and like in terms of unsubscribes like there wasn't really any changes there. Open rates were still high so I know we do talk about segmentation a lot but if your customers that engaged to open your content anyway I'm kind of okay with it. And what do you consider a good engagement rate in terms of open or? It's like 50 60%. That's huge. Yeah so like if I saw that dropping I'd be like all right we need to do more segmentation. Sometimes we will have like there might be a promo on a product or something's back in stock and we're like okay very strategically like these are customers that have shown interest in that or they've got that on their wish list. Yeah. That they've saved so like let's target them to be more direct but for the most party if you're talking about like new arrivals or a promotion. Yeah. Our customers are still eager to like open. And obviously I know you were provocative there saying that we just batch and blast but that's in amongst a whole bunch of flows as well so you're getting personalized email. Yeah and when I say batch and blast into as well I have like we've got engagement segments where we are looking at like people that are engaged or subscribed within like zero to 30 days 30 to 61 days 61 to 91 days so there's that kind of segmentation happening and we deliver ability as well like we do change that weekly if we're seeing like okay the segments not doing that well let's drop them out for a little bit and then we put them back in so it's not completely batch and blast a whole entire database. But don't get too pretty about it. Yeah. Like just some people over analyze it. Yeah. It is a volume game at the end of the day so the less people that are opening the less people clicking the less people are converting. Yeah less money making. Exactly. Tell me about the audiences is the togumist audience slightly older than the IMG audience? I would say younger. Really? Yeah yeah. This shows that I know enough of that fashion. I looked at both sites and I was like oh yeah this seems to be like the moment you're over. Tell me more. Yeah we actually as of last week in this week I've sent out like a customer survey to customers. I was also thinking the togumist customer was a bit older but just like scrolling through the data well obviously put it in consolidated or once the survey is over we'll run it over a certain number of weeks but I think that every J.J. was kind of seeing was like 23. Okay. The togumist. So she's definitely younger than I thought. Okay. Yeah. Is that a good thing? It's probably just the way you're thinking when it comes to marketing. Like for myself I've been with the brand for so long like I was a customer then like I still buy from us now like my top is IMG today. So you kind of think that the customers has grown older with the brand is like myself but I think because of acquisition and how much we are requiring. I mean that's a yes to me because you see a lot of brands either having to totally reposition as their customers transition with the brand or they just go become irrelevant because they've lost their audience because they've moved on to something else. Yeah. So do you see like the time this customer is like a bit younger? IMG is a little bit older but I think as well with IMG it's very different because like the clubs we do the celebs we work with like the viral products TikTok shop over in the US is huge. Yeah it's a very different playing field and like back in the day as well if you were to ask me I would have said that they were probably like the same customer I think it was more so like when we first launched like the suburb we were in and being in Melbourne like it was a bit more localized. Everyone kind of knew us here but then IMG are very quickly within like the first three months had like stylers reaching out and got worn by some really big celebrities. So I think the audience changed very quickly. Very cool. Well my reason for asking that question was does engagement rates are phenomenal and there's a lot of talk around the younger generations, the younger generations not engaging with email anymore and it you know being lost to social and SMS and Snapchat you're obviously getting huge engagement. Have you had to do anything different from an email perspective whether that be in the messaging, the design to really make sure that's engaging in terms of the way that younger consumers want to work with email. Yeah you know what I feel like this has been said so many times like over the years that I've heard and then there's like the opposite where it's like email is not dead. Yeah and like I don't think it is. I think it's just giving them the content that they know and love like we could send a campaign being like as seen on and it's got like an influencer's name and having that content that they've seen on Instagram is just making sure your content flows across all of your channels like if you're going to have only your e-commerce images in your campaigns within socials, very social driven lifestyle images that's probably not going to work. At the moment we're actually trialling putting like a TikTok feed within our emails and adding that into like our customer journeys as well so they can kind of see some snippets of videos of like say the abandoned a product or browser band is a product like showing that product then having like a TikTok feed of videos of that product and you're linking that out to TikTok. So when they click into that it goes into like a TikTok like kind of feed that they can then shock directly from there. What do you mean a kind of TikTok feed? Well we use Tolstoy. Okay cool. So it's basically like the TikTok feed that flows into Tolstoy can then be like embedded into email so it kind of emulates that TikTok experience but it doesn't direct them through the TikTok app. That's smart. So we're currently working through that at the moment. I love Tolstoy I think it's such a cool. So they're like deploying features every week and I can't give up. Obviously we're at KC and we're going to hear a lot of new features and developments. Where are you kind of pushing the boundaries as a Clavio champion like where are you really pushing it when it comes to CRM, SMS, even customer understanding what are the things that you're really latching on to? AI. Yeah. As much as we can. I currently trying to build like reports using Cored and this was a big discussion like yesterday at Champions Day which is like AI and where's AI going within the platform. Did you solve it? Is it all done? You kind of know the future 10 years out now? Fans working on things. I don't know. I'll let him talk to you about that if he wants to let you know on your podcast on his episode. But yeah, there was a lot around like AI but a lot of people in the room as well just speaking to like a lot of the champions are all trying to like get all the Clavio data into Cored to help like build strategies learn where like the optimizations are really quickly. Do you think that's a good thing? Is that you've got this platform Clavio, friend of the show and they've got all this data. I think they've got 200,000 customers now. So this huge pool of data and obviously you can have AI in the platform or you can connect it to other platforms so that you can analyze it and use the data however you want. So I've Cored's it and that's great. Are you spending most of your time now in Cored analyzing that data using an AI perspective or are you using in platform tools? Probably both at the moment until kind of get Cored exactly when we wanted to be but the aim would be kind of like every Monday it just like spits out a report. You don't even need to pump it anymore and it's saying like these are your opportunities but as well if you's in Cored and having like your whole ecosystem connected to that as well it has more of your whole business perspective versus just what's happening in Clavio because attribution as well like AI within Clavio is going to tell you what's just happening in Clavio but we all know attribution you've got like paid meta ads you've got so many other channels what things look like in one platform doesn't necessarily mean that's what's happening in the whole business. Using a system that is connected to everything else I think just gives you more of a holistic view and then it might also say like all this work from this channel and this channel so like maybe use that for this. So it might help drive decisions that you might not see holistically looking at Clavio always. Because I'm assuming you got Shopify data coming in there as well. You got Shopify data. IMG just had like a pop up over the weekend so posse is new for us as well. We've got TikTok shop which is quite a big channel for us as well. Then we've got like organic social channels, your page channels. Yeah there's main to Cored. A lot. Yeah. That's very cool. Only using the MCP? Yes. Yeah. Okay. Has there been anything interesting or insightful come through? What Cored has given you from connecting that data that you wouldn't have been able to get yourself? Probably not so much just yet but I think that's the whole thing of like learning the process tweaking it. It saves a lot of time. Yeah. So it's more focused on productivity and coming up the boring stuff in the general. Yeah. Rather than spending like a whole day Monday like trying to write your trademarks and find the insights you can get them a lot quicker and then the team's just focused on doing the actions versus trying to find the data to then understand what they need to do. So yeah more action focus versus reporting focus. Yes. Yeah. Booty prides itself on making some of the most comfortable underwear on the planet. Soft, breathable, no bothersome seams but behind the scenes they're marketing stack. Well it was a lot less comfortable. As Booty scaled across Australia, the UK and the US customer data was scattered across email tools, on-site forms and paid platforms. Getting clear insights, let alone taking action was slow, clunky and as pleasant as a wedge you on a hot summer's day. So they simplified everything and unified their channels in Clavio. With one view of the customer Booty could finally understand how people browse, abandon and buy and then trigger personalized messages across email, on-site, paid and SMS without adding more tools or manual work. The result and 87 times are our way from Clavio year to date, a 10% lift in retention year on year and a 34% increase in high intent customers in just 90 days. Turns out when your marketing platform is as comfortable as your product, growth feels a whole lot better. If your stack is causing friction head to clavio.com/au and see how brands like booty, a Skyling comfortable equipment. (upbeat music) - Clavio come out with a whole bunch of tools, including one that looks fairly interesting, but I haven't used myself called Composer, being able to generate emails, using those connections. Have you played around with that at all? - No, that was a big talk yesterday, though. Have not used it yet. - Can't see. - Can't hear from you. - Have it worked. - Yeah, I was kinda saying yesterday, like having all of your email flows, and like I mentioned before, we've got like two to three hundred different emails. And across like, we've probably got like 16, 17 flows now per account. We launch campaigns really frequently, so between like four to six weeks on average like a new campaign, so having to go into your flows to update the creative with new content every time, it's a lot of work. So potentially using something like Composer or potentially whatever the AI wherever it takes it in the future, being able to just upload all the imagery and it change all your flows without having to go into each and individual one. - How are you gonna manage that imagery? Because I've been working in businesses that have the opposite problem, that they're like, we've got all these tools that can generate all these images for us. We need Basin Madrid to work from the like, Basin Madrid kind of sucks. Like, we need to actually go out and do a whole bunch of photography and stuff to get the Basin Madrid right. I can imagine that's not a problem for you with all those products. - Content, go. - Yeah. How will you point the AI to kind of use the right images? - Yeah, feel like we just, we would then probably have to manage like a folder of like these are our selects, and it just uses from the selects. But we kind of do that anyway. Like when we go to a shoot, the social creative team will have like their favorite selects. So I guess, yeah, just if as long as it's got your brand guidelines in those your tone of voice and it's got your selects image, should be foolproof. - Should be fine. What could go wrong? - Obviously you need to like review things all the time, same with like the AI notifications with tap-cut. Like with the agent, you might like read a message and then you go back to the agent and be like, "Hey, I actually really don't like this. I'll do less of this." So it's about training the agents as well to then perfect it. Like you can't really set and forget. - No, how are you checking in on them? You're mystery shopping your agents? - It's just a matter of your like spot checking and constantly jumping in and checking just to make sure it's still on the right track. And previewing like you can preview everything that stands out. - You mentioned TikTok shop. Obviously huge for you in the US. - Yeah. - Australia. Is it ever gonna happen? - We've asked TikTok. The answer is one day, they don't have a date. - Been saying that since 2020, sorry. - I know, I know. - But what have you learned around using TikTok shop in the US that you think could be useful for Australian retailers if they're starting from a standing start with TikTok shop? Where would you just go? You've got to do these three things. - Yeah. I think in terms of product enrichment, super important. And even like your image selects, TikTok shop has a lot of rules around things. So if you've got a dress and you'd like the image that's on the front, say you've got a dress and it's like a really sexy back, but it's a maxi dress. But you want to highlight that. It won't allow that to be published online because you need to see the full dress and all the product enrichment as well. It asks for a lot of details. And that's the thing as well. When you work with marketplaces in different channels, product enrichment is so different across the board. So I think if you're not there yet or want to be prepared for when TikTok shop comes here, maybe just investigating like water or those product attributes and start building that into your website now. Again, with like a gentick AI and like, chat LGBT and co-pilot and all of that stuff anyway. That is so important to show up in all of those places anyway. So yeah, I think having your product enrichment right is probably the biggest thing. The other things as well, SLA is in terms of like shipping for film and dispatch for film and they've got very strict timelines there and like customer service. So making sure your teams and like all your SLAs are really tied and are like working to their standards. Are you using TikTok for film? No. No, that was a scary email that I was going to have. Yeah, that was full on. Yeah. So you're hanging on. Yeah, so they kind of sent out that email saying TikTok for film was kind of happening across the board. I think a lot of big brands kind of didn't like that. There also wasn't a lot of notice. I think it was like a week or eight week notice, which if anyone was going to move to a 3-pilot and pin up a warehouse, like that's months to like a year pro. Yeah. No one's doing that in that amount of time and then they kind of peddled a little bit and said it's only for the small brand. So I guess if you are a small brand that is something to consider, but it's not compulsory for all brands now. OK, cool. Thank God. Thank God. So product enrichment for film and SLAs, anything else that you think people need to be on the front floor for TikTok shops? Being present. I think we see when we're like consistent with lives, it constantly improves. As in weekly? Weekly? Weekly is good. I do know there are some brands that have at least like three a week or if they are doing one a week, like they're doing lives for three hours a pass, so just being prepared for that. And it's a skill isn't it to do a lot? Yeah, you need someone that's really confident and really can talk. But even if you are going for three hours, no one's going to sit there for three hours. No. Run the same script three times and just do like an hour. And then you've got that time. Do you use all your life, just as content then, that you can splice up and use elsewhere? I don't think we have at the moment. Yeah. It's been more so like if we've had a promotion, the girls will talk through the promotion. If there are new arrivals, they'll showcase the new arrivals. We often get people in the concert like, hey, can you put this on? Can you put that on? The girls kind of like go away. Come back. Like the fastest changes I've ever seen. Like wow, she dressed that quick. So they'll kind of like model the products in a live environment and they're very interactive to like answering the questions that the customers are asking, trying things on of what they want to see. Can I imagine you've got a lot to do a bit of fun there. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Don't take it too seriously. It's a fun environment. You come to too serious on TikTok shop. Yeah. Great. I've got a question and this is probably the most boring question I'm going to ask you. Everyone has a product enrichment because I was on your site before and obviously brand new sites. And I was looking at them. And your product descriptions are actually like you don't have long text. You've kind of got like five bullet points on the products that I looked at. And there's not a huge amount of detail on anything. It's really short shut up. So from an SEO perspective, oh, how does that work? And then I'm like, I'm interested in the thinking behind that because is it that your customers just want the visuals? And they want enough text just to go ticked. Show me what it looks like. Yeah, they are a very visual person. We always joke in the office that our customer doesn't read until she wants to. Yeah. Yeah, we have like our dot points. I think on one of our websites, we do have like a little paragraph. But the dot points as well with like a genetic AI. It's actually preferred. Yeah. OK. That way versus like a description and just once key details really easy to read, we do also have a lot of like metadata and metaphils in the background as well. So there's a lot of tagging happening. There's a lot of metadata. So in terms of like SEO and a genetic AI, there's a lot more information that it can read as well. Whereas the front website is just kind of like the key details they need to know about the product. Yeah, cool. I was looking at it. It's interesting. Why not the thinking? Do the genetic AI makes a lot of sense? Yeah. I feel like once you just grab the product, though, there's probably not too much to talk about. Like it doesn't really help having fluffy be like, where at day to night? And that's what we used to do back in the journey. But it would be the natural thing to do. Yeah. Is to create a whole bunch of fluff because consumers are used to saying text, paragraph, paragraph, dot points. Yeah. Technical details. Just get straight to the point. Love it. You know, we don't have a lot of attention, span time, to get attention. So just give them the key details. Love it. Tell me about you. How do you keep a balance? Because I could imagine that you've got a team here. And you've got a business that's running on US time, Australian time, constantly dropping new product, key shopping times, a probably late at night. How do you resemble some kind of balance in your life? Yeah. I would say anyone in the e-commerce marketing space, like we're attached to our screens and our laptops. Yeah. It's a really hard one to balance. But I feel like if you've got a good team that supports you, it's easier to switch off at night. So I do try and I'm a bit more aware now. I'm like, OK, work my work hours. Unless I'm wanting to work after hours, I am kind of switching off. I will still monitor things if there's an emergency. And my phone is always available for teams if anything goes wrong. Yeah. But yeah, a bit more focus to like, OK, these are my work hours. I'm not going to go to the gym, go walk my dog, go to a bathhouse, just having those things that you can switch off and also be away from technologies. We're so it's in our day to day. And that means things must be constant for you. So easy to keep them on. Yeah, there's so many times that like, even in the US, like you could be asleep and your friends going off at 4 AM because something's happened. So yeah, always being available, but not always having to be online and present. I think you're so important. And I'm always the one in the office as well. Like if someone is sitting at the desk eating their lunch, I will grab them and be like, go to the lunch. You need a break because the thing is as well, like if you don't switch off, you don't like go for a little walk, get some fresh air. If you're stressed, you kind of like your mental state, it becomes harder to manage. Or like you get home, you like, I'm mentally exhausted. I don't want to work out today, but then you kind of get in a rut and yes, feel like you're just, you're spiraling a bit easier. Like things that might not be that stressful could then feel more stressful. And I also feel like when you do switch off sometimes, that's when your best ideas come out. I see in like doing like day like pushing weights and then be like, oh my god, I just solve that. I just solve that problem. Oh, shit, the way to I'm talking about. So yeah, sometimes just getting away from that space, I even find there's been a lot of, like, a meteor and a lot of events these days and coming to these events, networking with people as well. Whilst you're asked for working, it doesn't always feel like work. And then you go back to the office and just feel so much more inspired. You've got so many more ideas. You know what I find? I find that with Claude especially, I have these moments, I have like Saturday morning for me and I usually wake up at five o'clock and the house isn't up yet. And I usually use that and I've got no clients or anything to do and I'm like, I usually use that as my Claude experimentation time. It's a fucking sad way to spend a Saturday morning. But it's like I get old school ready. creating the paper in the morning. - Yeah, exactly. - And then I go running the paper. That's the time I'm building stuff and I'm like experimenting and setting, just creating essentially. And you kind of got different projects and it's pinging you all the time and you got to get cool, allow these, do this, do this and I'll run it so hard until it expires and I'm on a pretty big plan but I'll run it so hard until it expires and it kicks me off. And then I'll go have a shower or something and I'll step away or I'll build my family and I'll go, "Actually, you're an idiot." There's a better way of doing that. Like, think about it from a different perspective. But I think without those limits, if I wasn't stepping away, I'd just be charging ahead because it's always doing stuff. It's producing, it's producing. - It's me with the fresh eyes. - Yeah. - Yeah, it's just the fresh eyes. Even like the way that I work sometimes is like, I will agree to speak to someone and I'm just like vocalizing what I'm trying to think. And I'm like, I know, I haven't got the answer quite yet but then just me like vocalizing it to someone was like, "Everybody, I don't just like walk out again. I like sold it myself just from speaking out." - You've been a great help, bye. - Yeah. I was like, "Sorry, I just needed you as a soundboard. I figured it out." But yeah, sometimes it's just getting out of that environment whether it's even then like working in a new space or just being away from your laptop and thinking about even like a pen and paper. Honestly, I sometimes think some of my best work is like, "On a plane, there's no Wi-Fi." - Yeah. - You're just there with your thoughts, with your laptop. There are no distractions, like just mentioned. - Except now I've been reconditioned because I was on the fly. Because now if I don't have Wi-Fi on a plane, now that I've introduced it, I get frustrated. But yesterday I was like flying here and I was like, "Quantus Wi-Fi is not working." This is so inconvenient, it is horrible. But then I did remember back to that point where you're like, "Actually, it's great. "Music in and I can chill and do nothing." - Yeah, it's still life. - There's something really nice about just being disconnected from the world. Going back to like old school thinking and you know, trying to solve a problem versus using AI. It's like, it's great. But yeah, so I'm like, "Oh, it's over one minute." - Just disconnect. - Cool. - Dom, next 12 months I can imagine you're not disconnecting in total. I could imagine there's a few things going on. - Yeah. - What's your priorities? - At the moment we're rebuilding the Tigermis website. - All the way through, not stopping at you and starting again. - No, right, just in the final stages of the design and then we'll go into build phase and then back into UAT. - Which triggers a total rebuild of the Tigermis website? 'Cause I was looking at what it was a good website. - Yeah, this one is maybe a little bit off brand what we would have liked for a new website just with a previous team working on it. The way that it was built as well there's a bit of tech to it in the background that we need to clean up. So using that opportunity to kind of give it a bit of a rebrand time is just the one to like an MVN's collection recently and it blew up. So I think just with that and seeing like what responded really well to customers we're doing like a customer survey now as well. It's just a good time for like a bit of a fresh fresh start, fresh phase. So that's in the works currently from there probably like an IMGL loyalty program. I did notice neither had loyalty programs. - I have a loyalty program. We come into like unofficial loyalty things. And whilst we don't have a loyalty program and then Tigermis would be next for a loyalty program. And then after that maybe like global expansion more so like UK Europe. So that's probably the next two years cut out for me. - And you probably have to launch everything in the European summer and be over there for it, right? - I'd say so. Yeah, yeah. - It makes a lot of it. - We do have like some wholesale over there. Like we've got ASOS over there now. So that's a good opportunity to see like what are they buying? How are they responding to the brands? Give us some learnings before like going in there and tipping our feed in. - Just having to be over there for six months on a working whole day kind of thing. - Dom, thank you. - So much for joining us today. - So how have you been? - Been here bright and early on the morning of KCIN. And I'm looking forward to what's coming out today. Great to hear your journey. And what are you doing, Tigermis? And I'm Gia. I just think it's phenomenal to have people like you in our backyard and our community who have so much experience that you're willing to share. Firstly, that you actually turn up to events and you share. And that you are taking on the world. So you're not content with what's happening just here in our local market. You are, like you said, part of those clavio champions that are part of a global community and 9% of yourselves in the US. And I think having you here with us today is just phenomenal to share with our community. So thank you so much. - Thanks for having me. It's been so nice. (upbeat music) There you go, Dom. What a way to bring home the third of our three episodes filmed and recorded at KCID. Dom, thank you so much. I always appreciate you being so open with our community. Here are three that I wanna share with you. Firstly, no, we're not to launch. This story actually gave me shivers. Dom walked into a project that was already underway and not just any project, a massive repartforming project. She ran UAT and she made a call that it wasn't going live before Black Friday. She scrapped it, changed agencies, rebuilt the whole thing in 12 weeks. That's a big call when you're coming back into a business. Most teams would have already shipped and dealt with the fallout later. She didn't, she held her standards, she got a great result. Secondly, build your re-engagement flow. We talked about this in Ed's episode, two episodes ago. You don't even need a discount. You don't even need urgency. Dom said that this is her biggest best flow and just showing customers who hadn't opened in 90 days, what they've missed, brought them back in and brought more revenue in. For one of their regions, it's now outperforming the welcome flow. If that's sitting on your list, if you've got customers that are just disengaged and you think about deleting them, don't delete them, go send them, go set up a flow to re-engage them, tell them what they've missed, bring them back in. Thirdly, Dom talked about apps, still kicking around apps as the long game on owned channels. Not sure what Clavio will be, overly impressed with me, sharing this, but push notifications, they're not free. And that was the reason for Dom and the team really pushing into the app space. SMS in Australia costs about four times what it does in the US. And Dom's strategy was really clear. Get customers into the app, use exclusive promotions to drive downloads and over time, shift the balance towards channels that you control, similar to what you're doing when you're trying to bring your social audience into email. That's effectively what Dom was trying to do, is bring your SMS customers into the app. When running the ROI map, you've got to think about what those promotions cost you, but then what you can save on SMS if you get those push notifications enabled within your owner. A big thank you to our partners at Shopify and Clavio for making ad to car possible. We appreciate your support. Special shout out to Clavio for making me feel so welcome and for giving us access to some of those most amazing talent over the last three weeks. Think Ed, think Locky, think Alice, think Harnie and Dom, amazing, amazing and smart Clavio people who are on the tools every day. You don't get access like that everywhere. Thank you to Clavio for supporting that. Until next time, we'll be back with regular programming on ad to car. (upbeat music)