I tried EVERY sleep expert's advice, here's what works | Hey Tablo Ep. 37
44m 45s
The speaker openly discusses a chronic insomnia issue that has plagued them since childhood, shaped by cultural values that glorified sleep deprivation as a sign of dedication. As a musician, they now realize that creative work—especially songwriting—directly disrupts their sleep, leading to only four hours of rest per night. Despite trying numerous remedies like melatonin, magnesium, cold rooms, and meditation, none provide lasting relief. They describe vivid, nightmare-like dreams and note that their brain activity is abnormally high, confirmed by medical testing. While they’ve managed to deliver strong performances on low sleep, they acknowledge this is unsustainable and dangerous. The core issue is not just physical, but psychological: their brain thrives on being functional even when sleep-deprived, reinforcing a cycle where creativity and exhaustion feed each other. They emphasize that sleeping pills are dangerous and ineffective, urging others to prioritize natural, human sleep habits. Ultimately, the key takeaway is that true well-being requires ending the habit of being "amazing" when sleep-deprived—because that performance is not sustainable or healthy. The speaker ends with a plea for listeners struggling with sleep to try simple, natural methods and to stop pushing through exhaustion.
I have a confession to make for the last month or so, Insomnia has returned. I've had terrible
sleep hygiene. I am, as we speak, I am so sleep deprived that it's insane. And I know why.
You know how we recently had a song battle between Epic High members, and we had to make new
songs. And I've realized that making music is bad for me. Hey, Tableau. I know some of our fans,
like Epic High fans. I know what I just said right before that jingle, probably alarmed you,
but I'm not totally kidding. Okay, so what I've realized is that, you know, if you know me,
you know that I've never had a good relationship with this sleep thing. Like, I've always had
problems sleeping. And this has been a, like, it's been a medical condition that doctors have,
like, literally, you know, you know, stamped. You got problems. And it's just something that,
I've been dealing with it since I was a little kid, to be honest. And I have a lot of different
people in places to blame. The first thing I blamed was the fact that when I was little,
the culture, I guess the academic culture, rewarded staying up all night. Like,
your parents were proud of you when you didn't get enough sleep because that meant you stayed
up late and you burned the candle on both ends and that you are like a good student. If you went
to school and you told your friends, "Oh, shall I only sleep three hours?" Immediately it turns
into a battle. I slept two. I slept one. Dude, I slept negative five. What? Huh? What? I woke
up back in time. What? But seriously, like, it was like kind of a flex to be sleep deprived,
which is crazy. Like, to be unhealthy. They, like, parents and teachers, like, literally gave
you props for being, for jeopardizing your health. Insane, right? But I kind of blame that because,
because I always thought to myself that, you know, it's like a sign of how hard I worked.
If I'm not tired during the day, it means that I didn't work hard enough yesterday.
And I was really hard on myself about that. And then I went to college and I was a writer.
And for some reason, like, I read a lot of books, like autobiographies and, you know,
anytime you read about a, like, a famous writer, all these fuckers are sleep deprived.
Like, there's just basically vampires. None of them are sleeping. And, and you can tell
when they, like, come to speak at your school or you, you see an interview, like a video interview
of them? They, yo, they look fucked up. Okay? Okay. Any, any famous writer, Google their picture.
If these guys have not slept well in, like, years. So, again, the whole idea of, like,
artists having trouble sleeping was sort of, like, you know, like, glamorized.
Right? So I blamed that as well. Anyways, this became a habit, obviously, because I, you know,
I had been, like, not sleeping well since I was a kid. So it became this thing. And also,
I'm like a very light sleeper. Like, if I hear somebody flip on the switch, like, far away,
like down the hallway, I'll wake up. I just, I just, I just have a terrible fucking relationship
with, with sleep. Like, and right now, as we speak, I am so sleep deprived because I realized
recently that I have another thing to blame. Anytime that I have to be creative, anytime that,
like, I really need to, like, create something, like a work of, of creative art or a song,
basically. Anytime I have to actually create a song or, and God forbid, if I have to create
an album right now, I realize that I never sleep. It never occurred to me before. I thought that
I always just, like, I just always had bad sleep hygiene and that, like, I just, you know,
wasn't the type that could ever sleep well and that I was an insomniac at times. And then I
happen to also be a musician. It never occurred to me that maybe the fact that I am a musician,
and that I am a creator, that I'm a writer, all these things, maybe that's the reason I can't sleep.
Like, I think I become hypersensitive, recently writing that new song. From, like, from,
from the moment two cuts was like, let's have a song battle. To now, I have not been able to sleep
properly. Like, I've slept maybe, maybe on average, maybe like four hours a day, which is ridiculous.
At my age, it's dangerous. And right now, I'm like, I have no fucking idea what I'm saying even.
I'm that tired right now. And I blame two cuts. The song battle, I think,
stressed me out way more than I thought. And I think also the reason is, I am more autobiographical
when I write music compared to Mithra and two cuts. What? Is that rain? Oh, this is great.
This is great. This is a gift from, from the heavens. Do you know why? Because on the topic of
sleep hygiene, one thing that I always tried is, you know, the sleep, the sleep rain noise thing on
YouTube that just plays rain noises for, like, for, like, two hours or five hours. I always try
that because I sleep better on rainy days. Oh, my God. And naturally, today,
instead of, what? You want me to sleep now on camera? Yo, yo, yo, yo. Yo, I can't. No, we can't,
we can't title episodes like that. Study. We can do, we can do get ready with me.
We cannot do come sleep with me. That's fucking insane.
May I briefly interrupt Hey Tableau for breaking news? Have you ever dreamed of being a guest here
on Hey Tableau? If you live in the US or Canada, this is your chance. EpiKai is embarking on a North
America tour starting September 30th. All through October, we're going to be in the US and Canada.
I want to do an episode of Hey Tableau where I have a combo with a fan in each of these cities
that we visit. Here's how it's going to work. If you have a VIP one or VIP two package, you'll get
entry into a VIP sound check. We'll choose one lucky fan at each of these sound checks and you and
I will have a short combo. You can ask me for life advice, relationship advice, and all of that
will be compiled into an episode of Hey Tableau. If you already have a VIP one or VIP two,
you're automatically entered. But if you don't have one, go get one now at epiKai.com and you can
have a chance to have a cameo on Hey Tableau. That's the podcast. Okay, but rain, for some reason,
on rainy days, I tend to sleep better, which might be the reason why a lot of epiKai songs,
a lot of my songs, have something to do with being sleepless and also rain. I have a lot of rain
songs. I even have an entire album called sleepless in whatever blank, right? And the whole album was
about not being able to sleep well because I was not able to sleep well when I was making that album.
We had just left YG. We were going independent again for the first time in a while. And like,
there was like a lot of pressure. Not to do well or not to like not because we wanted the album to
do well. The pressure was like, our future was kind of uncertain again. Like, we didn't have
a manager. Like, we didn't have people working with us. Like, we was just us three. And we rented,
you know, when we first left YG, we rented this really shitty studio, right? Because it was cheap.
And we used that space to create this album. And it was, it was, it was false advertisement.
Like, it was way more terrible than it looked in pictures. And we were there and we couldn't,
and I couldn't sleep. Like, I believe that when I'm in album mode or creative mode,
I can't sleep. Like, every two hours, I will open my eyes and I'll be like, "Oh, that line is not right. That line is not. "
You know, there's a line in my lyrics for that song "Anime" that we just put out.
Summer's over, feels like "End of Days." That summer's over part was something else, right?
You know how many times I changed that line there, because I didn't like it?
And all the changes happened at like two-thirty in the morning.
Four in the morning, I wake up and I'll be like, "That line is not right. That line is not right. It's got to be something else."
And then I'll write it down and I'll try to go back to sleep, right?
But I also have a problem with going back to sleep.
I was just like, "But I can't just quit music. I can't just quit everything I am because I want to sleep well."
But then if I don't sleep well, I will literally quit life, right?
So like, "I'm in trouble here. I'm in trouble here."
And while we're at it, we're going to go over tips for better sleep.
And let me just tell you, I've tried them all. I'm old. I've tried everything.
I tried everything. So let's look. Five tips for better sleep.
And this is an article from the Johns Hopkins site.
It should be legit, right? But look at this. Drink up. No, not alcohol, which can interfere with sleep.
Drink warm milk, chamomile, cherry juice. I've done all of these things.
Hot water. I did all of it. The hydration apparently creates terrible sleep hygiene.
I did it. I fucking did it. Does it work? You know why?
Because I have to wake up to go to the bathroom.
So I don't know if this is, I don't know, like some tips say don't drink right before you go to sleep
because you don't want to go to the bathroom, right? So it advises you not to drink.
But here, they're recommending you drink up. Like what are you supposed to do?
And what's hilarious is no not alcohol, right? Apparently alcohol.
You know how sometimes if you get drunk, you sleep better. You just pass out.
And honestly, I've done that a lot too. Like for me, what hits the spot is three cans of Guinness.
I just down three cans of Guinness and lay down and I'm dead, right?
But here's the thing. According to the doctors, that's a terrible thing to do because the good sleep you believe you're getting
or you feel like you're getting while you're drunk is actually terrible sleep.
But if I feel like I got good sleep, then isn't it good sleep?
I kid you not. I think the only times I actually got like seven hours of, seven to eight hours of sleep was on Guinness.
But I don't drink that much anymore. Like I try not to drink at all actually because it's bad for me.
So I don't sleep. So what do I do? What do I do?
Do I drink or not? It's like, I don't know what to do. Here's the next tip. Exercise. I exercise my ass off.
I exercise in the mornings. But before I, for a while, I exercise that night because my rationale was if I get super fucking tired right before bedtime, then I'll just pass out.
So I went to the gym at like nine p.m. When I was a gym, wait lifting and then I like, I like run. Pull ups, push ups. I'm like, I'm like dying.
I come home. I'm like, oh my god. On the way home, I'm like, oh, you know, when I get home, I'm just like, I'm really going to pass out.
But I can't just sleep after I work out. I got a shower. But I read somewhere in one of these tips.
If you do a warm shower or a hot shower, it'll make you sleep. So I'm like, okay, so I do a hot shower.
I like now a adrenaline is still going, right? So I can't sleep. So I'm like, okay, this is not working out.
I got to change back to morning, right? And I also read you need, you need sunlight, you need to see, you need to get a lot of sunlight during the, during mornings, right?
Okay, mind you, all the experiences I'm talking about today, they're all things you should try if you're, if you're having trouble sleeping. So like, all of this is actually good info.
So I'm like, okay, so I change back to morning and I'm like, sunlight, if I get a lot of sunlight during the day, it'll make me tired and then night I can sleep, right?
So I started walking everywhere, not just to the gym. After the gym, I walk up a hill to get to my house and then you know how I come to the studio and the office.
I always walk here, even though sometimes like, you know, my manager will offer to pick me up. I'm like, no, I was just walk.
The reason why is I need sunlight, right? So I get sunlight, I get natural sunlight. And I, and I do feel tired during the day, right? I'm like, okay, I feel like I'm going to get good sleep.
Am I tired because of the sun or because of the night before I didn't sleep well? I'm confused.
Anyways, the next tip here is use melatonin, melatonin, right? It doesn't work for me. This shit does not work for me.
I tried, I tried, because apparently melatonin is better than like sleeping pills, of course, right? Sleeping pills are dangerous, but melatonin is supposed to be kind of natural, right?
It's like a vitamin, vitamin, right? The reason why this doesn't work for me is it's like, it's a gamble every time.
If I take it and I actually fall asleep and sleep through the night, I'm fine, but sometimes I will take it fall asleep two hours later, I'll get up.
And then I'm totally fucked, right? Why? Because my brain is sleepy as hell, but I'm awake, right?
And I'm like, I feel tired, but I can't sleep. And it's just like, it's just, it's worse than not being able to sleep just naturally.
Don't even talk about my nightmares. So melatonin is supposed to make you like have really weird nightmares. You know what dream I had yesterday? In the dream, I was in Seoul.
Monsters in a video game popped out into the real world and ate by manager. I kid you down.
This is how my dream started, okay? Yesterday. I swear to God. That's why I'm so sleep deprived right now because I won't, let me just explain the dream. This is a fucking terrible dream.
This is not even the worst part, okay? Eat my manager, right? But somehow ate like just clean one bite, ate him. And as, as my manager was eaten, like I only knew that it was my manager that was eaten because his wallet fell and into my hand, I opened it and it was my manager.
And I was like, oh shit, my manager's dead. Got eaten by a video game monster that flew out of the screen, right?
Here's the crazy thing. So I'm like, I'm like, oh shit, what do I do? Right? What if the manager's still in the belly of that beast? I need to, I need to rescue my manager. What's the thought that I had in the stream?
There's three kids, three elementary school kids just hanging out on the side, sidewalk. And they're like, they're playing the video game where the monster came from, right?
And I look at them and they're like, you need our help, right? And they're masters of this game. So I'm like, in the in in dream logic, I'm like, okay, these, these kids can help me, right? I'm like, hey kids, fucking helping, right? And they're like, all right. And I'm like, first I need to go, I need to go and get stuff from my house.
I need to get like supplies to fight this monster. So I call my wife. My wife is apparently with Haru, but add a friend's house.
So we go to my wife's friends house. This is fucking humongous mansion. Okay, I don't even know who this friend is. Okay, but no friend like this exists in real life, but it's a huge fucking mansion. It's these two girls.
They're like, they're the stereotypical mean girls. Okay. So I show up with three kids. Yeah, because I have to get the get the supplies that I have to go with them to defeat the the monster.
So I show up, but immediate, okay, I get to this house. I've never been to this mansion and like they're on the terrace looking at me, right?
And the two mean girls, they're like Cinderella sisters, basically, right? Immediately, they're like, they're like, the fuck is he, why the fuck is he hanging out with like three elementary school kids?
Ew, weirdo, right? And my wife nods, right? So I'm like, what? So I'm like, I tell the kids.
"Yo, fucking way here, I'm gonna get my stuff
"and we're gonna go."
So I go in, I have to write an elevator.
Like that's how big this mansion was.
I get up there.
My wife is standing there with these two friends
that don't actually exist, but in this dream they do.
They're wearing like princess uniforms,
like princess dresses, right?
I'm like, what the fuck is this?
How does over there hanging out with,
I don't know, someone's kid.
And my wife's like, where have you been, right?
And I'm like, well, this is gonna sound crazy.
But a monster came out of a game and ate our manager.
And she knows the manager too, right?
And she's like, she's like, what, right?
And then the two mean girls, the two mean friends,
they're like, oh, he's lying, he's lying.
That makes no sense.
That makes no sense, what monster?
That makes no sense, out of a game.
That makes no sense.
He's like, he's lying to you, right?
And my wife believes them, okay?
And then the three of them collectively grabbed my shit.
That's there for some reason, my luggage.
Throw it out, like off the balcony, like off the terrace, right?
I'm like, what, and like, my wife is like,
I never wanna see you again.
And I'm like, I didn't do anything.
I was like, a monster came out of a game
and ate our manager.
I'm trying to rescue him.
And now you're kicking me out of someone else's mansion
because of these fucking evil people.
And they're like, they're like laughing at me.
Like, it's like terrible fairy tale stuff, right?
My last hope is Haru, right?
So I'm like, Haru, Haru.
Look what's happening to me, right?
And Haru sides with them.
I'm like, I'm like, oh my God,
I wish I was the one that was eaten by the monster.
I come out, okay?
All my shit's all over the fucking ground.
I'm trying to pick it up.
And the three kids aren't even helping me.
They're like playing their Nintendo Switch.
And then we go to rescue my manager from the monster.
We get to where the monster is.
And now I have to get my manager.
So I have to get eaten to go in and get the manager, right?
And then I woke up.
- Whoa.
- As soon as I was about to sacrifice myself
to save my manager, who I just lost my marriage over
for no reason.
Because this fucking guy got eaten by a monster.
Anyways, I wake up.
And you know how our call time today was like 11 or 12.
I woke up and it was 5 a.m.
And I had gone to sleep at two.
I had planned to sleep from two
to at least like nine or 10, right?
Seven, eight hours. And then I'd come here.
But I woke up at five.
And I couldn't go back to sleep no matter how much I tried.
That was a dream I had on no melaton.
And let me just tell you,
this is not an abnormal dream for me.
I quite often have these crazy dreams, right?
Where it doesn't even make sense,
but it's just a terrible feeling to wake up from.
Right?
And then my wife was in the living room.
She woke up a little early too, right?
So I go out there and I tell her what dream I had.
She's like, "Shut up, go back to sleep."
You know how I told you I was like studying Spanish?
You know why I stopped at this group, eh?
As you said, North American.
You know why I stopped there?
Because I've been getting such poor sleep recently
that I usually study my language stuff
before I go to workout.
Like I try to study in the morning.
But because my mind is so tired in the morning,
I've had to give it up.
And once the day starts, I'm so busy that I can't fit it in.
So I sort of got bad sleep just ruins everything.
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Hold on.
Just a question to all the haters out there listening.
Do I sound like I'm on Coke?
I'm like kind of nervous here, okay?
I'm not, I don't do that.
But if I sound like I'm on this Coke field rant,
it's because I'm seriously sleep the crap.
The app, the app, this song that took a lot of out of me.
Okay, I don't know.
Like seriously, I'm like dying here, okay?
What did you say?
What did you say to me?
What did you say?
Why are you so dressed right now?
I haven't slept well in like a month.
Holy shit.
Okay, let's look at more tips.
Keep cool, Johns Hopkins says, keep cool.
This, this I actually still do every day.
So here's my sleep hygiene routine.
Everyone's different, right?
My room has to be cool as hell, even during winter.
I have air conditioning on, right?
That's one rule.
And second, the reason also why I keep it really cool
is not just because I don't like it when it's like
when I get sweaty, it's because for viruses,
you need to keep sleeping spaces cold or cool, right?
Or viruses will like proliferate, right?
So I keep it very cool.
It's also imperative that my sheets feel dry as possible.
Like if it, if it feels even a little humid,
I am like my sleep is done that night, right?
So I keep, I, the first thing I do when I wake up
in the morning is I make my bed and like I keep my bed
as clean as, like, seriously like a psychopath's bed.
Okay, like it's that clean.
Another rule I have is I have to have something playing.
Like I put on air pods.
I know it's probably not good for you.
And then I have this, there's this podcast called
Sleepy History, Terribly Boring.
But that's, that's the point, right?
It's like this guy like today,
I'm gonna talk about how mattresses came to be.
And then he, like gives a history about like mattresses,
for example, right?
And then it's so boring that it's supposed
to put you to sleep, right?
Or I have air pods in with no sound.
Just so that I can block out, like I said,
if somebody like just flips on a switch, or even like,
you know, opens the fridge a little bit,
even if you're far away, it'll wake me up.
So I noise cancel.
And that's it.
That's my, that's my whole sleep routine.
Ah, it's not written here, but apparently magnesium
is really good, right?
Like it's like magnesium is actually for like your,
to, to ease up your muscles.
And it's just a, it's a good supplement
to take regardless of sleep or whatever, right?
But, you know, there's this whole thing online
about how like magnesium is like the miracle supplement
for going to sleep, right?
So you take magnesium, I think like an hour before
you want to go to sleep, right?
And I take magnesium, like, I'm addicted.
I'm a, like, I'm a fiend.
I'm a magnesium fiend.
Okay, I'm a, I'm a, Mag addict.
(laughs)
Okay?
I take it like religiously.
And I don't know if it's helping me,
but I am sleeping, like, I am falling asleep better.
My problem is staying asleep.
This is such a huge problem for me.
And it, 'cause if I wake up at any point in the night,
it's really hard for me to go back to sleep.
Okay, oh, go dark.
Since, I think like, since the first time I lived alone,
I've always had curtains that are come,
that completely black out a room.
Even in our house, like my, my wife,
and how do they don't like it?
They actually like something like coming in
when it's morning, right?
So in their rooms or in whatever space
they prefer to be in, we don't have that curtain,
but just in my study,
He Jong-in always gives me, like,
these big curtains that completely black out the room.
Like, you go in my room with the lights off.
you are definitely running into something.
Like you're gonna, you know, you're,
you're knee into something, because it's that dark.
You'd like, you cannot see in there, okay?
And that's how I like it.
Dark, cool, and basically I'm a mushroom.
I'm like a, I'm like, I'm basically a mushroom.
And it's written right here, like that's what,
that's what Johns Hopkins suggests you do.
And I did it, I do it, but I still keep waking up.
I don't know, I have no idea what to do.
Another thing I tried, and once I go here,
you will, you will know, like how bad this is for me.
And if you're listening right now,
if you're listening right now and you're asleep deprived,
and you have, you have a hard time getting good sleep,
like I really feel for us, like we are one here.
Like I've been dealing with this all my life.
And the people I envy the most, I don't really envy people.
I'm not even capable of feeling jealousy or envy,
but the only time I do, like I live with two people
who sleep super well.
Like my wife and my daughter, if they choose to sleep,
they can sleep for as long as, like, humanly possible.
Like they, if they could, they would sleep 24 hours.
If they could, okay.
And nothing wakes them up.
Nothing.
Literally nothing can wake them up.
And I am so envious.
I'm also envious of Mitra.
Every time we get on a plane, he's just sleeping.
He's like, just as soon as we get onto a plane,
he sits down and he's sleeping, right?
And then he pretends he didn't, I don't know why.
But we saw him, okay.
I think he still thinks that it's not cool to like sleep a lot,
but he does. He sleeps so well.
Anyways, so this one time, I went to a doctor
and this doctor put these things on my head,
like these, what are they called?
Like the lecture, you know, like these, I don't know.
You know the thing with the wires?
Anyways, what this doctor does is he puts these things
on your head, you lie down and you just close your eyes
and you try to sleep for about like 15 minutes, right?
Of course it's not gonna just instantly happen,
but it's like a really cool quiet room
and you go in there and then there's this device
that is keeping track of your brain waves, right?
To track like your condition, right?
So he can, he can, you know, suggest what to do.
Anyways, he puts these things on my head, I lay down.
I try my best to sleep, I don't.
I wake up, no, I mean, I get up.
And then he shows me, I go into his office
and he's like, okay, your results are out.
He shows me this graph on his screen
and he's like, this is a normal person
during like, you know, like motionless, like just lying down,
right?
And now here's your graph.
And he shows me my graph and I got goosebumps
just from looking at the graph, okay?
It looked like a mad man's painting, like he was like,
someone whose brain activity is like severe
is like, is like this, right?
He's like, and here's yours, and mine was like,
the sharp, like it literally grossed me out the graph.
And he showed me and I was like, oh,
isn't this really bad?
And he's like, yes, it's really bad, right?
And I'm like, what does this mean, sir?
And he's like, well, it means your brain activity
is just fucking crazy.
It's just insane, right?
And I was like, does that mean like I'm smart?
And he's like, he has nothing to do with your intelligence.
He's like, it just means your brain wave is like,
it's just your brain waves are like too fired up.
And I'm like, yeah, I guess that's why I'm not sleeping
while he's like, yeah, of course, right?
So he prescribed me some medication
to like basically calm my brain, right?
Before sleep.
I did it, and it worked for a while,
but I did kind of feel dull, like during the day.
And I didn't like that, right?
So there's always this trade off that I can't give up.
Here's some more tips from another like health magazine.
Okay, mindfulness, meditation.
Have you tried this too?
Meditation, okay, so I tried meditation.
I don't even know how to do meditation.
So I downloaded this meditation app, tried it.
I can't, it doesn't help me because I keep laughing.
Like the apps like now close here.
I'm like, I just start laughing.
So I can't do it.
Mantra repetition.
I guess that's sort of like counting sheep, right?
Heavy-try counting sheep.
I still do it sometimes when all else fails.
Or like one bottle of beer on the wall,
one bottle of beer, and then two bottles of beer,
you know that thing?
I do it, but it doesn't work.
I started imagining what the sheep look like.
I'm wondering why there are so many sheep.
Like I get to like 40 sheep, and I'm like,
why are there so many sheep here though?
And when, like, where are they coming from?
Like seriously?
And where are they going?
I'm at 43 already.
Where are they coming from?
Yeah, exercise, yoga, massage.
You know, a massage always puts me to sleep.
But unless the massage is happening for eight hours,
I'm gonna wake up.
And if I get an eight hour massage,
I'm not gonna be able to move like for a month.
So that's not gonna work.
Again, magnesium's here, lavender oil, melatonin.
I sort of got, I've tried all of this.
Like none of it works.
And I've listened to like a ton of podcasts,
seen a ton of YouTube videos on like sleep hygiene,
hygiene, education and stuff like that.
But like, I know, I know,
but it just doesn't, it's not working on me.
What do I do?
I mean, sleep is the most important.
It is seriously as important as exercise.
Probably more important, right?
Sleep is probably the most important thing.
I think the problem with me though,
is I'm kind of functional even when I'm sleep deprived.
I think that's the biggest problem.
If I was just drooling and unable to like see
and like just unable to read this,
and if I was like just talking nonsense,
then I would work harder to sleep.
But the problem is that I'm sort of semi-functional
and pretty functional actually,
even on no sleep.
So my brain's like, you can power through.
It's okay, don't go back to sleep.
You can power through this.
You might be even funnier.
You might be even wilder.
It might be better, right?
And I think my brain just confuses itself to like keep pushing.
And one of the last thing I wanna say today is like,
the most nightmarish period of my year
is before like a tour or like before a concert night,
like before the concert day, right, the night before.
I want, like my heart wants to perform
at 200, 300% my ability.
And in order for me to do so,
I have to be well rested, right?
But I know I have this problem.
I know that the chances of me sleeping seven to eight hours
is like maybe two percent, right?
So it's like an uphill battle.
So I do all of these things we just mentioned.
Like every one of these things, okay?
Now it's on in like magnesium, air conditioner on,
like dark, like everything.
I'm basically a mushroom, right?
Last year for our ear and concert, we had three shows.
And they were big shows.
So I had to have sleep.
First night, I was able to get seven hours of sleep
miraculously, right?
And I felt so happy, did a great show.
Second show, the night before the second show.
So after the first show, I came home.
And because of the adrenaline from the show,
I slept kind of late and I was really worried.
But I woke up once in the night,
but I was able to go back to sleep
and I slept around, I think around seven hours again, right?
And when I went to the second show,
I felt like I felt good.
So I was like, great.
Did the second show, it was awesome.
I went back home and now I have to do a third show, right?
It's the final show.
So I get home and now I have more adrenaline.
Because like, you know, I just had two good shows
and I'm happy.
Like, so I'm posting like pictures from the show,
like, and, you know, thinking about, like,
how great the night was.
And then I went to sleep.
And then I woke up and it was two AM.
So I slept maybe like an hour and a, like,
I opened my eyes, right?
I'm like, oh shit.
So I bust out the sleepy history thing.
I turn it on.
Go back to--
try to go back to sleep.
I wake up again, it's 2.30.
I'm waking up in increments of maybe 20, 30 minutes,
and I'm like, oh, I am fucked.
I have the last show tomorrow.
I'm totally fucked.
I try to go back to sleep, and I couldn't.
So I'm like, OK, I'm just going to wake up,
and maybe I'll get-- because it's only 2.33 a.m. in the morning,
I'll get so tired if I try to stay awake
that I'll fall asleep even if I don't want to.
So I get up for two hours, I can't sleep.
Like, I lay down, I can't, right?
So it's like 5 now, right?
And I'm like, OK, I need to sleep.
I need to sleep, right?
I keep trying.
I just couldn't, right?
And then, how do I-- how do I walk up?
And I'm like, I can hear noises outside.
I try to-- I tried everything, but I couldn't sleep.
So I'm like, oh, my God, the last show,
the finale is going to be fucking terrible, right?
So go to the living room.
And I'm like, y'all, I didn't sleep at all.
I slept maybe like, maybe 2, 3 hours.
I am so screwed.
Like, she's like, just try to go sleep.
And I'm like, I know, but now I'm hungry.
So like, I ate something.
I go back to bed.
I still couldn't sleep.
I kept giving up, right?
And so basically, I went to the third show
on like, maybe 3 hours of sleep.
And as I was leaving, I told my wife I was like,
I feel so sorry to my fans.
I feel terrible, right?
They're taking time out of their year
to come and see me this once.
And I can't give them my 100%.
And she's like, what can you do?
Like, just try to power through it.
I get to the show.
I'm fucking dead tired as I'm like getting my outfit on
and everything, getting rid of him, super fucking tired.
Get on stage.
I legit give the greatest fucking show the greatest performance
like all of the three nights.
OK, I was so fucking good.
Like, my life, my voice, like, my energy,
my banter, everything was so good.
It was as if I had slept like 24 hours or something, right?
Like, I was fucking amazing.
OK, objectively.
That's when I knew I will never be OK
because I can function this way.
I've got to stop being awesome when I'm tired.
The moral of the story, to wrap everything up,
in order for me to not be sleep deprived,
to get good sleep, I have to stop being amazing
when I'm sleep deprived.
I really sincerely hope that all of you,
if you're suffering from bad sleep hygiene,
I hope some of the things I mentioned.
I mean, I tried them all, but a lot of it
doesn't work on me.
But some of these things will definitely work for you.
But one thing I do, I beg that you do not take sleeping pills.
That is the one thing I will never do again.
I've been prescribed them before.
It's very dangerous.
And also, when you wake up, even if that allowed you to sleep
a lot, it doesn't really--
it's not the good feeling that you get from natural sleep.
So try as stay as natural, as humanly possible.
Get a better pillow, keep your room cool,
try to keep it dark.
And sometimes, hey, Tableau is pretty calm sometimes.
So maybe listen, play Hey Tableau on really low volume.
That might help.
Also, stop being so fucking awesome.
It's because you're so awesome, even when you're
sleep deprived.
You're such an awesome person.
That's why.
I'll see you next week.
Bye-bye.
[KNOCKING]
Hey Tableau.
[LAUGHTER]
Podcast Summary
Key Points:
The speaker has a long-standing struggle with insomnia, rooted in childhood cultural norms that praised sleep deprivation as a sign of hard work.
As a musician and creative person, the speaker believes creative processes—like songwriting—directly trigger sleeplessness, making it harder to fall or stay asleep.
The pressure of artistic creation, such as a recent song battle, has intensified their sleep issues, with average sleep duration dropping to just four hours per day.
Despite trying numerous sleep hygiene tips—including melatonin, magnesium, warm showers, and mindfulness—none effectively address the core problem of staying asleep.
The speaker describes vivid, disturbing dreams that reflect their sleep deprivation, often involving surreal and chaotic scenarios.
They contrast their own sleep struggles with the effortless sleep of their wife, daughter, and Mitra, highlighting the emotional envy and frustration.
Medical tests reveal abnormally high brain activity, confirming a neurological basis for their insomnia, though medication offers only short-term relief with daytime side effects.
A key realization is that their ability to function and perform despite sleep deprivation creates a dangerous cycle, leading to unsustainable performance and self-doubt.
Summary:
The speaker openly discusses a chronic insomnia issue that has plagued them since childhood, shaped by cultural values that glorified sleep deprivation as a sign of dedication. As a musician, they now realize that creative work—especially songwriting—directly disrupts their sleep, leading to only four hours of rest per night. Despite trying numerous remedies like melatonin, magnesium, cold rooms, and meditation, none provide lasting relief.
They describe vivid, nightmare-like dreams and note that their brain activity is abnormally high, confirmed by medical testing. While they’ve managed to deliver strong performances on low sleep, they acknowledge this is unsustainable and dangerous. The core issue is not just physical, but psychological: their brain thrives on being functional even when sleep-deprived, reinforcing a cycle where creativity and exhaustion feed each other.
They emphasize that sleeping pills are dangerous and ineffective, urging others to prioritize natural, human sleep habits. Ultimately, the key takeaway is that true well-being requires ending the habit of being "amazing" when sleep-deprived—because that performance is not sustainable or healthy. The speaker ends with a plea for listeners struggling with sleep to try simple, natural methods and to stop pushing through exhaustion.
FAQs
The artist has a long-standing issue with insomnia, rooted in childhood habits, academic culture, and a creative mindset. As a musician, they become hyper-alert during creative work, which makes it difficult to sleep. Their brain remains active, especially during songwriting, leading to frequent wake-ups and sleep deprivation.
The artist believes that creative work, especially songwriting, triggers a state of hyper-awareness. They often wake up multiple times during the night, revising lyrics or questioning ideas—like in the case of the song 'Anime'—which disrupts their sleep cycle and prevents rest.
The recent song battle intensified the artist's stress and creative pressures. This stress, combined with the need to produce content, has led to a significant drop in sleep quality, with the artist reporting only 4 hours of sleep per day.
Yes, the artist regularly takes magnesium, which they say helps them fall asleep more easily. They also use melatonin, though it sometimes causes them to wake up feeling tired or having vivid, disturbing dreams.
The artist keeps their room cool, dark, and quiet with blackout curtains and air conditioning. They use noise-canceling headphones and play boring podcasts like 'Sleepy History' to avoid disturbances and promote sleep.
Their brain activity is abnormally active, as shown by a doctor's EEG test, which revealed chaotic brain waves. This indicates a neurological condition that makes it hard to transition from wakefulness to sleep, even with proper routines.
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