Speaker 1Welcome back or welcome to Recovering Out Loud podcast, the show where we get real about mental health and addiction. If you or someone you love is struggling, please reach out to me on any social media platform. At Recovering Out Loud pod, you are no longer alone. Yeah, so that's, I want to hear about that because I haven't had any, you're the first person in here to talk gambling and I've been getting a lot of messages about it. I get a lot of people that are struggling with gambling. It's such a tough one, man, because it's a silent killer. It's a perfect way to put it. It's like, no one really knows that things are going south the way, you know, say, I don't know, smoking meth does, right? I'm not tweaking out in front of people when I'm doing it. I'm not tweaking out in front of people when I'm doing it.
Speaker 2My friend Louie would say, I have a, or sorry, Louis, he goes by. I have an episode coming up with him in February, but he, one thing he says is like, like he could be sitting here, like after snorting oxys and like drinking a bunch of vodka, right? And you're going to be saying like, like, what, are you okay? Like, what's wrong with you? Right. But if you're sitting here and you, you could have your life savings on the Yankees. No one's going to know. Right. And like he put that into really good words. So I just wanted to kind of quote him, but the way I think of it is like, like unless someone's seen your, your pay stub or sorry, your like, what's the thing? Credit card statement. Yes. Unless they're seeing your statements, like, or your bank history and stuff, like no one's going to know unless until it gets real bad. Right. Until it's like too late. And that's how it was for me. Right. I don't know if like, do you got to do an intro or anything? Are we good to just.
Speaker 1No, I mean, I'm going to, I've probably just, just tell us about yourself.
Speaker 2Okay. Yeah. So for those that don't know, I'm Logan. I'm from small town in Ontario. Just three hours from Toronto. I think you said it would be East from here, right? West. West from here. It's called Chatham-Kent. And yeah, I grew up playing travel sports. Had decent grades. Wasn't really that big into, you know, like I wasn't getting in trouble with the cops or like I was fairly good kid, but very ADHD. So, you know, what comes with that, you know, bouncing off the walls, often had a hard time following rules. But I always had good intentions, you know? And I, you know, drinking was always, I'm sure it is like in a lot of small towns in Ontario. It's just like, and especially as a hockey player, it's just the kind of the culture is the norm. You see all the parents doing it at tournaments growing up, whatnot. Right. So I was very, very much like excited, looking forward to that. I never saw it as like a, like this, like I had, I'd seen some family members struggle with it a little bit, but like, I didn't, I didn't really see it as that, like from the beginning, it was just like to have fun. Right. And yeah, alcohol kind of stripped everything from me. And then I got clean and sober from that. It was not easy, but, um, and then I started gambling. Did you go to rehab? Yeah. I went to, uh, I think it was 19 day ended up being 19 days. I think it was supposed to be 21, but I went in December, 2022. I don't know if you remember you're from Toronto, right? So do you remember how bad the weather was like a couple of years ago around Christmas? Yeah. Yeah. There was like
Speaker 120 or 30. Yes. I do remember because, um, we were coming home from Kingston where my in-laws are from and we counted 24 flipped car or abandoned cars on the 401. So it was supposed to be like
Speaker 221 days. But, uh, when I went, they let us out after 19 because like it was, I went in December first or something like that. So they let us out so that we would be able to go see our families for Christmas. Cause they were, they were scared. Like there's a big snow storm coming and they were scared that like our families wouldn't be able to come get us. Cause like some people were driving hours away. Right. And, uh, like the last day or two is you work at a rehab. So it's, it's typically just like, like commencing and kind of telling you it once they didn't let us leave without a set plan. But like the last day or two, they said was just going to be kind of like, you know, one-on-ones like it was not, we had already done most of the booklet or whatever, like all the curriculum. So they just let us out one or two days early. But, um, yeah, it took, there was a lot of resistance to go to rehab both times. I went for gambling as well. Um, but yeah, I did not, it was like the last thing I wanted to do both times. Cause I was like 17 years old. Um, I think at the time, I don't know, like, I don't quote me now, but at the time I had set the record for youngest person to go through there. And that place has been open for a long time. I went to a Westover treatment center in Thamesville. Um, it was a great program. Um, great counselors. Um, and like yourself, like I find I've always had, like, I don't know, I work in the blue collar industry. So like, it's never seemed realistic to me, but I've always kind of wanted to, you know, in the meantime, with my extra time working at rehab, if I can, because I enjoy helping people. And, uh, honestly, like since I got sober, my passion for always getting that next drink or bet it like, honestly, like, thank God it like, you know, how the obsession leaves you. It's like almost flipped. It didn't leave it like flipped to like now wanting to like help people learn more about it. And like, like, no, I'm not ashamed of this at all. I was in the hospital. Yeah. A little bit about that. But, um, yeah, it's kind of just a little rundown of
Speaker 1what happened. So you went to your first rehab at 17. Yeah. What was the moment where you finally waved the white flag? Cause I went at 23, my first day I was 23 and I remember how hard that was.
Speaker 2So for me, it was like, I was 17 years old. Right. And at this point I'm already like, my liver's like already like on its way to failure. I'm in the hospital every weekend. Um, you know, I'm, I had, I was a daily drinker for over a year straight. Like I couldn't remember the last time I was sober and it wasn't just beers. Like I was on hard liquor. I was past the beers. Like I didn't want to get bloated. Right. Like I didn't, I was a true alcoholic and, uh, you know, like I just kind of got tired of waking up and, and wondering where the bottle was hidden and, uh, who I had to apologize to what I did because I did not remember. Um, and you know, like when I tell people this, most people would think like, you know, like this would be the, that waving, that waving flag moment you're talking about. But, uh, October or no, so August 28th, 2022, I was leaving hockey trials and I was trying to offer the junior C team. Right. And, uh, things were pretty rocky at this time. I was like getting in, like I was, I'd already graduated or no, I hadn't graduated yet. So I was, I was kind of like, I was drinking a lot at this point and, uh, I was hiding it really well. I was like the kind of kid that like, like I said, you know, I had decent grades. Like I had mid seventies, eighties, like, but my sister was really high up there. So I was like, I always struggled with that, like saying that I didn't have good grades, but I don't know. I had like seventies, eighties. Um, like I said, I had two, three jobs at all times, like from 13 years old, I started like in the fields, like, um, and then I started at Canadian tire. And, uh, like you said, I've always had that spending issue. So I've always had like before alcohol and drugs, like I always kind of, I never could save any money. I've always had three jobs and, or two jobs at least. And, uh, never saved money. But, um, I remember like thinking like, okay, as long as everything looks good, like everybody thought everything was all right. Right. I had a girlfriend, I had, like, was driving the car to work, whatever, like everything was playing hockey, travel sports, school sports too. Um, and it was just like, on that day I was leaving hockey tryouts. Um, my car got broken into. And, uh, I remember being like all upset, right. Cause this necklace that my girlfriend gave me from her father that passed away a couple of years ago, um, I was wearing it and I never took it off. I was like, I'm not going to wear it. I'm not going to wear it. I'm not going to wear it. And, um, I just, out of respect, I didn't want it to break during tryouts. So I took it off and I put it in my cup holder. Right. And, uh, I come back and my, like my car's not even like the door's not even latched. It's just like, so I like already knew I opened the door, my wallet's gone, the necklace, like everything's gone. And I'm like still searching for it and thinking it might be there somewhere. And, uh, I go in and tell the guy, long story short, I was trying to figure it all out. And then, uh, what happened was this guy from the arena called me telling me, Oh, we see the guy on camera. Right. And, uh, I'm like already halfway home. So I call my dad and tell him, and he's like, Oh, well I'm, I'm with so-and-so like you should just come here and we'll help you figure it out. And he was at, uh, a buddy's house that was kind of a hick and like they're riding dirt bikes, shooting guns and drinking beers. And and First thing he says to me when I get there, you can't drink or, you know, you can't drink. Right. And I'm like, this is my answer. I say, I look at him and say, like, what do you think I'm stupid? Like I'm driving, like I'm not going to drink. And, uh, we start trying to figure out the, like the police report for my car and, uh, we get all that figured out and he says, again, he's going to leave. Right. And I'm hanging out with a couple of the guys and they're, they're all old enough. They're all like 25, whatever. So no one's going to tell them what to do. Right. And, uh, I remember he's leaving. He's like, all right, I'm, I'm heading home. Like, I'll be like, yeah, I'm right behind you. He's like, you know, you can't drink. Right. He said it again. And so at this point I'm drinking all the time. And, uh, I'm like, I was getting a little mad at him. I'm like, I said it snappy. I'm like, like, I'm not going to drink. Like I'm driving. Like, like seriously. When then he left and within 10 minutes I'd had two beers already. And, uh, that was supposed to be my last beer. Like that was just to cut the edge off. Right. Cause I'm at this point, like I said, a daily drinker and like that was supposed to be it. And, uh, I remember walking in to go to the bathroom and walk past a liquor cabinet and it was like one of those, just, it wasn't even a cabinet. It was just like an open bar kind of thing. And there was just like bottles, man. I was like, and I was a Jack Daniels guy. So there was like bottles and I'm telling you, I don't know what they call them. I wasn't, was it sixties? Yeah. Bigger ones. What's bigger than a two four.
Speaker 1One point something liters. Yeah.
Speaker 2So like there was a bunch of those and like, they're all like just barely open. Right. So I'm like, no one's going to know if I take a swig. Right. And I was a liquor guy. Right. So take a swig and you start feeling good. And like I said, that's supposed to be it. And you know how it is. Alcoholics, you get, you start feeling good. You don't want to feel better. Go back for more. And that's the last thing I remember. And, uh, the next thing I remember is trying to pull my arms apart and realizing like these cuffs are like not coming off. Like this is, why is this hurt? This is not a dream. Like, then I start hearing voices, the cops talking and I'm like, Oh my, like, this is real. Like, and I'm blackout again. Don't remember anything else. And, uh, so next day I wake up and it's like hearing everything. Right. Like I, I ended up leaving someone's house, getting, pulling into a gas station. Um, that was like two or three minutes away. It took me 45 minutes to get there and I ended up rolling the Jeep, kept driving. Then I pulled into the gas station, went into like, I fell out of the Jeep, went in to like order food or something. Like I didn't even pump gas and she like took my keys cause she knew I was drunk. So she like saved my life. Um, today I know that like God used her to save my life. Right. And, uh, like I'm like, oh my God. I'm thankful for that today. And like, I just know that like, I shouldn't even be alive right now. Like I blew three times the legal limit. Don't remember a second of it, roll the car, kept driving. Like there was gravel marks, like on top, I was on a gravel road and there was scratches all over the top of the car. Like, I don't, you would think you would remember if you roll the car. Right. And like the frames like bent and like, I'm like, I wake up and they're like asking me like, like, where did you go? Like, you must've, and I'm like lying, like I didn't drink, I didn't drink while I was there. I'm trying to tell them like some made up lie that like, oh, I was drinking before, like, cause I didn't want to admit that I had stolen this person's alcohol. Right. And, uh. That ego comes in. Right. I'm like, I'm like, I just rolled a car, got arrested and I'm worried
Speaker 1about telling them that I stole someone's liquor. Yeah, man.
Speaker 2Like, so forever. And like for the longest time, like it was the most complicated story. Right. And eventually like. So that happened in August and I, like, I kept drinking like after that. Um, and this is like in the middle of school week, like, um, I just go to school and I stay like, nothing happened. Right. My parents like forced me, like they're not letting me miss school. Right. And, uh, I gotta like put on that mask and pretend like everything's okay. Like I had been for the last two years and, but at this time it was like a lot harder and, uh, cause the girlfriend's like. Finally, like gonna leave this time. Cause like you really screwed up and, uh, like she was my person. Like I met her in grade eight and, uh, this was grade 10, I think close to grade 11. And, um, like, I remember just like everything that my parents said was going to happen, started happening. Like I lost my license, uh, and as a result of that, had to give up hockey and lacrosse because like I played out of town, how am I going to ask my dad to drive me all the time? Right. And, uh, and then, yeah, like I was already, I was driving to school every day, driving to hockey. So like I lost that privilege, lost the ability to go drive to my girlfriend's, which she lived like over 30 minutes away. So like every time we wanted to hang out, it was either girlfriends coming to pick you up or, you know, she's doing all the driving or having to ask my parents again at 17, 18 years old. And, uh. Um, but to go back to the drinking, it was just like, even that didn't stop me, man. Like I did that. And I remember I kept drinking like livers, like screaming at me. Like, I'm wondering why, like, what's the problem here? I'm going in for like, for CT scans, all this stuff, wondering, and I'm not telling them that I'm drinking this much. Right. So they're like looking at my appendix, trying to figure out what's wrong. Right. And, um, I just remember I kept drinking, kept drinking. And then the final thing that. That really got me was I woke up and my mom's like, you better apologize to your aunt. And I'm like, like, genuinely, I'm like, for what? Like, I had no clue, like not a single clue what I did. And I remember she told me, and it was my, it was somebody in my family's birthday. And like, I had showed up to the family gathering and I was sober when I got there and not sober when I left. And come to find out, like, that they had taken pictures of the liquor before I got there versus when, after I got there, like at 17, they're doing this kind of stuff. And I'm like, this all just like clicked in my head. I'm like, okay, like she, because she would always throw it in. Like my mom, like works in the mental health and addictions. Uh, so she would always throw in, like, do you want to, like, do you think it's time to go to detox? Like, do you, I think you should go. And I'm like, every time. I'm just like, no. And this time when she said it, I was just like, okay, like, because I was like, not remembering what I had to apologize for. That wasn't like a, like a irregular thing. Like that was normal. Like, there's like so many scars I have on my body that like, I don't even remember what they're from. And I had to like lie and like keep lying and lying and lying because my lies made no sense. Right. And, uh, I just kind of got tired of running, I guess you could say. And I, like, I guess I wasn't really set on quitting. I was just like, if this is going to get you to stop, like sobbing and telling me that I need to, then, then sure I'll go. And I just started like packing my stuff. Right.
Speaker 1And, uh, I think a lot of people, um, I shouldn't say a lot of people, myself, definitely, uh, I've been to rehab three times and all three times it was to get the heat off originally. Right. I think a lot of people start with external. I'm going to lose my marriage. I'm going to lose my, that was my case.
Speaker 2It wasn't for me in the beginning. Yeah.
Speaker 1And I think it's okay if that gets you in the door, but at some point I had to make that, this is for me now. Right. And so what was that moment for you?
Speaker 2So when I was sitting in detox, right. And I'm a Christian. So like, when I talk about this, I say, this is like when God like made it real to me, the first time I heard his voice, like I was coming inside from like a smoke break. Outside because I vape and, uh, that's like my last crutch. I'm trying to get off of it, but I was coming inside and like my high school was right across from the detox. Oh boy. Right. So, and they like, there was complaints about it because like other people had struggled with this where it's on a busy road. Right. And like, it's supposed to be, uh, confidential later, right. And, uh, I'm walking outside and I see. A group of my friends walking down the street to the pizza shop. And I'm like, I have to put my hood on and turn the other way. Right. And I'm like coming inside. I, then I go right to my room. Cause I'm all upset. Right. Thinking like all my buddies are doing this and I, here I am sitting in a detox. Like, so I'm looking out the window and I'm thinking like, like, I shouldn't be here. Like maybe I'm just like drinking wrong or like, like, like I can, I can figure this out. Like, you know, like I can have one or two, what are they talking about? And then like bang like that. Like this voice in my head is like, it just started like flooding my head with not only it was telling me like, cause I was also thinking a lot of like dark stuff too. I was thinking like, like, what have I done with my life? First of all, um, like my life's so far gone. Like I'm sitting in a pretty much a jail cell right now. Like, and I was thinking like this voice came in my head and it was like, like, I'm not too far gone. Like if I just give my life. to God, like anything is possible. That's exactly what I heard. and then i started to think like the opposite i was like okay wait like you don't end up in a detox at 17 for no reason um yeah think about that your friends are across the road going for pizza and you're in a detox like stop taking that as like you're the victim poor me and think that like maybe you're the problem right like maybe you need to maybe it is time and uh from that moment i have not picked up a drink and uh i was it's been three years a couple months and uh like but when i got out of detox i was like i'm fixed like they taught they they just introduced me to my problem and uh i was right when i got out of detox i started going to aa like two two times a day or once a day at least because i was in school still so i'd go to school and then i'd go to aa at night and uh i'm like the young man i'm like the young man i'm like the young man in there by far right but like i said i'm like i don't want to go to rehab like i don't i got school i got a job i got a girlfriend like what do you mean i gotta go for 20 days now like i just went for five days what do you mean and uh but then i like signed myself up just in case like i did the pre whatever it's called the pre uh application and um um when the spot got open i was like you know what like everything that i was learning at aa and all these like for me the opposite of addiction is connection and like as soon as i was you know kept connected with like-minded people other alcoholics and addicts in that detox i was like i felt not alone and i was like i didn't feel ashamed anymore because like before that point i felt like like why am i acting like this like there's something must be wrong with me and i'm like no one's gonna understand right and the second i went in there and there people started saying like why am i acting like this like there's like me too like or they would say something and i could relate to it and it's like wait a second like maybe there are people like me and it's not a bad thing you just i can't drink or i can't do drugs right and because like drugs wasn't really my issue but like i smoked weed here and there and like one didn't go without the other and you know what i mean and it's like i i don't know like once i went to rehab they that like i always used to think that saved my life but they would tell me like no like we gave you your choice back and you did the work to save your life and so every time i go there i always thank them for like giving me a safe place to get sober because i could not do it out there like as long as like alcohol was accessible to me like i was not going to be able to do it even when my parents like locked everything out of the house stayed home with me i still found a way to like do something right and like i moved mountains to get alcohol yeah and uh yeah when i went to rehab like i didn't want to do the work really but it was very like i just did it because i knew i had no other choice like i was like the whole car like the dui the the way i was feeling in my stomach like just and then my girlfriend was like finally gonna leave like she was like i was always able to like sweet talk her back into it yeah everybody like you know i always like to say it's like i had a bunch of dominoes or something and they were all scattered i would always line them up perfectly and get everything back in order and then as soon as like things started to go okay i would kick them all over again and uh this time she was like she had had enough so i was like trying to like you know show her that i could get better and uh like you said i wasn't really doing it for myself but in a way i was because in order to keep her i had to be a better man right and uh and then once i started thinking that and she started telling me you know like you have to do it for yourself like i can't be the reason then i started thinking you know what like without alcohol or drugs like what am i like what are my hobbies now like nothing like what do i like to do nothing like i was like that i don't like that about myself um so i had to re find myself like i had to re learn how to talk to people learn how to because before that everything was based off of like drugs or alcohol pretty much yeah and uh especially with covid like i'm not sure if you were using or drinking no i stayed sober through all of covid but during covid like that was typically like for high school kids and stuff like and like that was all we could really relate on because we weren't allowed to leave our house so like we were hanging out like we would have to do something exciting and fun which was get drunk or high interesting so i got to this point where like i i realized that i didn't go anywhere or hang out with anybody like without doing drinking or smoking weed and i was like when was the last time i like you know just went for a walk with my girlfriend or like did something like that i do today that i like brings me so much happiness that i like completely ignored for the first however long i was drinking and stuff right but um yeah and then the gambling like i don't know like i can touch a little bit more on the drinking i
Speaker 1don't know how much time we have yeah no i just i want to comment on i think you said i can relate a lot to what you said uh specifically with the moment of clarity right i think i think you know i've been in recovery for 10 years and uh i managed to get together eight years and i relapsed after every single rehab i went to all three of them it was a different experience in that it taught me something different about myself yeah and i like what you said about you know the rehab just gives us a choice back because yeah i absolutely 100 agree with that they give you the choice they also give you a set of tools that you can pick up or throw out the window that's the choice right and that's the choice exactly for me today i have a choice between i'm a spiritual person uh i don't consider myself a religious person but i call my higher power god i i have a choice to choose god or to choose not to choose god really that's kind of the two ways it's really simple for me today i like that um it took me a while to get there but my life is a lot easier when i live according to that principle yeah when you talked about your high school across the street i can really relate to my last bottom this time was i was surfing in hotels and airbnbs because i was my wife kicked me out of the house yeah i remember sitting in the lobby of that hotel and watching all the normal people check in and check out and i was getting kicked out because i couldn't afford to stay there anymore i had all my drugs scattered all over the hotel it was a mess but that was my moment where it was like i had i still had all my drugs i could have went probably for another week if i just found somewhere else to go but i had that incomprehensible pitiful demoralization the one that you can't like you just can't wrap your mind around the current situation you're like how did i get here how did this happen and i'm a piece of shit because look it's like i can really relate to that it's like you see life happening across the street and you're in your own reality over here it's like that's not what's happening for me right like i was
Speaker 2not you're not in reality i was not doing what other 17 year olds are doing not even and that's
Speaker 1that moment of clarity where it's like i think everybody has to get to and it's different for everyone it's yeah and that's why i believe it's a timing thing it's a spiritual thing it's for you it was a voice right um for me it was just like uh maybe it was a voice but it was also just a moment of okay like i'm i'm done i'm absolutely done i don't want to i don't want to manipulate plan lie cheat steal my way into the next high because that's what i was doing i was just like wiggling around trying to find ways to safely use without people judging me at the end that was really it and and where i could still have fun or be free or whatever um so that's interesting to me and i think that it's different for everyone it's a timing thing there's no you know you can flip a car and still not get sober you can kill 10 people and still get sober or you can i don't know go lose your job and get sober right like just from that and
Speaker 2it's different for everyone it's all subjective so and one thing like i'm sure you you said you work in a rehab so i'm sure you get this a lot but like people will ask like or they'll come to me and they'll tell me about somebody that's struggling that's close to them and they'll be like what can i do to help them and it's like unfortunately like you can support them you can be a light for them and maybe try and like offer like rehab or detox or stuff like that at their low points but that's about it there's not much you can do and you like that person needs to have that moment of clarity like you said in order like they have to say you know what i'm done like for me i was sick and tired of like being sick and tired of wondering where that bottle was you know and the same thing happened with gambling like i had to lose like literally almost everything and and more and uh like i still like like you said for most people when they go to rehab they're still not like fully accepting it like when i first went to rehab for gambling like the first three days i was there i fully planned to still gamble when i
Speaker 1left so yeah walk us through that how old are you so you're sober and as a lot of us do we look for other things to fill that hole right how does that happen
Speaker 2so i got sober and god i didn't get a sponsor till about like six six months seven and like i but I was very connected. Like I was going to lots of AA meetings. I probably did 120 meetings, 90 days. Like I did way more than what was suggested. Um, but I started, and that, that went on for a while, like in church, like I started going to church again, getting closer to God. And, um, you know, like that started or that, that, that went on for a while. Sorry. Um, probably till around the two year mark. And then I, uh, I got a job in the Carpenters union and, uh, moved out of my parents' house and like moved into London, which is an hour away from home. Um, and I started making better money than I had. I was working at a cabinet shop before that and I was making better money with the union. And, uh, like my 18th birthday passed and I didn't even like, I'm pretty sure that's the age you can buy a scratch ticket, right? Like I didn't even do that because. I just saw no point. Like I was like, I've liked everything I've tried so far. If I, if I, and I've said this out loud before I had ever gambled, I'd said, you know, like, I just don't, because if I win, you know, I'm probably going to get hooked. And I don't know, just one day after going, uh, to London for work and staying there, hanging out with some different friends and stopped going to AA because, you know, the meetings in London weren't like they were in Chatham. And I made an excuse. I think it was because I, you know, they say when you relapse, the meetings are usually the first thing to go. And it's because, or they say like it, like the second you think you got it, like that's when you slip. And, uh, like I didn't have this, this conscious thought that I got it, but like, I remember leaving that meeting in London and being like, okay, like I'm just not going to go like whatever. Like I'll go when I go home on the weekend and that never happened. Right. Cause I was seeing the girlfriend or doing this. And I eventually, it was just like, I don't know, like two, three months, one meeting probably. And like, that was not, like I said, I was doing when I could, I was doing two a day and like at least one every night or at least three out of the five nights, like I was doing a lot of meetings and then I just kind of cut it off and it didn't go to shit right away. But, uh, one night where after work, I'm already kind of given more money than I know what to do with because I'm in the union, I'm a carpenter, like it pays well. And I remember sitting there like having bills and stuff as well though. So like I'm getting good pay, but I'm also paying a lot of bills, not like a lot, but what I considered a lot, cause I had just moved out. And, uh, I remember my buddies were just like playing on their phone, online slots, like, and I had never even heard of it. Like seen it, I seen the sports betting, but I didn't know you could play slots on your phone. And, uh, these guys, like, I just tried it. Like there, it was like 20 bucks. And I was like, this is harmless. Like I still had a bunch of money. And I remember winning like a hundred bucks right away. And I was thinking like, damn, like, I like this. That's like my, my gas tank only costs 60 bucks to fill. So I'm like, sweet. Like this is like another source of income for me. And I remember like, I didn't notice right away, but looking back, my friends were like looking at me, like, why isn't he stopping? Cause I would just keep saying like one more, one more and I would lose. And I would just say one more. And like, not, like I said, not right away, but within a week or two, I was doing it all day. Um, blowing my whole paycheck if, and, uh, very early on, like, I remember, sorry, I should say this first very early on, like before I was doing it every day, I went to the actual casino once, and I just brought 20 bucks. Cause like I had, like I said, I didn't even really know how slots worked. Um, so I just walked up to a machine with one of my friends and we were just, I knew nothing about it. Just picked one and walked up to it, put my 20 in. And then someone said my name and I started like, I looked over and started talking. Cause I'm, like I said, ADHD. So I look over, start talking. And I went to go hit the lowest bet and I hit the, like the third or fourth like $3, 25 cents a spin. And it triggered like first time I hit, hit the button, it went off the bonus. And, uh, I won like 600 bucks. And like, I remember after that, I was like trying to go to Windsor every, every weekend and see my buddy to go to the casino. And, uh, I remember playing it on my phone. Like I said, now I'm like playing it all day, every day. Like first thing I'm going to wake up, I'm like, because I can turn my IO for rent. So I can turn 20 bucks into 300 in two seconds. Like I was playing sweet bonanza 1000. So, um, fast forward a little bit. I'm like I said, I'm blowing my full paycheck and I'm making, going to work in Oakville for four days, making 1500 bucks. And an hour after it's deposited into my account, it's either multiplied by like five or 10 or it's. Completely gone and more like max out my credit cards, um, applied for multiple credit cards so that I could gamble on them to hopefully win back. Um, but yeah, that started like, I'd say, uh, I don't know exactly when it started, but I got sober or I stopped doing that May, like I stopped gambling May this year. So it would have been, and I gambled for a total of about $1,000. Between 10 months in a year, blue, I think in between 110, 120 grand. Wow. Um, and like I said, I had maxed out every credit card I could get at my hands on, um, took out every loan I could get from a money mart or whatever they call them, the payday advances. Um, I got to the point where like, I was like, um, I, I struggle to say this out loud, but it's the truth. So, um, I would pretend that I was playing this game on my girlfriend's phone, but in reality I was sending myself money off her account. And like, I would, like, I would steal from Peter to pay John. Right. And I just borrowed and borrowed and borrowed. If you, if I knew you and like you had money, like I was asking you to borrow money and I would pay you back double one payday at work. Cause I knew I was going to hit. Right. And that happened quite a few times, but he would lend me 20, 30 bucks. And I'd turn 20, 30 bucks and it's five grand and I'd pay him back like that day double. And, uh, and then I'd be balling for a couple of days. Like near the end, it was like, it wasn't all like, yeah, it was all bad, but like, it was like, I would win a bunch of money, take it all out in cash because I knew that if it was in my bank account that I would just deposit it again. So I'd take it out in cash. So that way, if I wanted to play with it, I had to drive to the carter. But then near the end, I was like driving to the bank seven times a day. And, uh, I was like winning, like I said, five, six, $7,000. And I would take it all out in cash, be like living financially free for a few days, but I wouldn't pay off my credit cards. I wouldn't pay back any of the money I owed. I would just, you know, like I have money now I can relax. And, uh, and then like slowly, like two, three days by the end, it was like, same day, five grand would go right back in just as quick as I wanted. It was gone. And, uh, I remember like near the end, the breaking point for that was like, like I said, I owed every credit card I could get my hands on, um, stealing money from my parents, like any money that was left around me. It was, you couldn't even leave, you couldn't even leave like quarters on your table. Like, cause I would go to the bank with quarters, dimes, nickels, and like deposit enough just so I could get five bucks to spend. Right. Cause I could turn like one day. I didn't even have enough for, uh, like a big Mac in my account. Like, and like, if I wanted to, like, it was like negative, something was in my account. And all, like I said, all my credit cards are maxed. My mom's got me signed out of my online banking. So we went to the bank, got my like banking, like literally like locked out. So even if I tried to change the password, whatever, it wouldn't even let me in in order to get that back. I had to like go to the bank one day, sneak, sneak off to the bank. On break one time at work and, uh, had to, so the girl had to like call the office and we had to like do all this stuff to get my banking back up and then I could gamble away. Right. And, uh, yeah, my mom would like change my passwords, lock me out. I would give her all my cards. And then when she, as soon as like she went to sleep, I would like reset all my passwords. And I knew she was going to text me in the morning being like, like why? And, but I knew that like, all I wanted was a little bit of time to gamble. And like, I didn't care about the consequences at all. Like I knew I was going to get caught stealing money from whoever. And, uh, like I still did it. And like, like I said, the one day I didn't even have enough to go get a coffee if I wanted to. And I got these free spins from the app that I was on and they're offering me like, they're offering me trips and stuff because I'm losing so much money. Right. And I don't realize it, but like, it's kind of like the movies, like, you know, like they say, Oh, you can get your room comp or you can like all this stuff. But how am I going to, how am I going to go for a free week? to cabo like but i'm not gambling right like i have i can't pay rent but i just got a trip to mexico cool the apps offer that oh yeah yeah like i was i was like level a thousand on this one app and i was like once you get up to like those high levels it takes like like picture a video game like as you level up your character the higher the level the harder it is to level up so i'm like still level a thousand i got 980 it's like it takes like probably 20 grand to level up like in losing right like in buy-ins and uh yeah like i said i'm they're offering me all this stuff i'm getting all these this money back at the end of the week blah blah blah and i'm like looking at my wagered how much money i wagered for the first time ever like i didn't i didn't even know you could look at it on this app i had tried before but i couldn't find it and the one day i found it and i was like oh my god i'm like oh my god i'm like oh my god i'm looking at my wagered how much money i wagered for the first time ever like i didn't i didn't even know you could look at it on this app i had tried before but i couldn't find it and the one day i found it and it was like multiple million dollars i had moved around in like under four months because like i said i would ban myself or my mom would find out and i'd be like oh i'm not on those apps anymore but i'd find a new one and this one that i had found was like gives you free spins every week it offers you like all this stuff right and uh the one time the one day like every weekend it would give you free spins and typically i'd only win like a dollar two dollars whatever this time and i turned that seven dollars in like an hour or two into like 13 grand i think and like that was the most money like i had ever had in my hand at one time and i didn't even get to withdraw at all because like they have like limits on how much you can withdraw per day and stuff like that and um it only let me withdraw so much and i'm like knowing that if i keep this money in my bank or if i withdraw it sorry if i keep it in the account then i'm gonna have to deal with it right but i can't withdraw it because the bank was closed that day and i didn't want my mom to like see it in the account because she would just you know take it or use it for what it was actually needed for like to pay back my bills and stuff i wouldn't actually get that money that i won so i just like waited i was gonna wait till the bank opened in the morning and then withdraw it go take it all out in cash like i always do and uh i remember like having this thought that like okay well like i'm screwed because the bank's not open so i can't take this money out i can't control myself and like what am i gonna do and i text my friend i'm like hey man like i just want a bunch of money can you come hang out with me because like there's a really good chance if i'm by myself like it's not going to be here in the morning he's like yeah dude like how much did you win blah blah blah i told him and he's like okay just text me when you're done and i'll come over and then i like put my phone on dnd right after i went to my room with the intent on playing like one more hand and just like getting to 15 right and uh within 30 minutes it was back to zero back like i didn't even when i had that money i could have paid off my credit cards could have you know at least paid back one of the loans i took out or but no i blew that all right away and then kept going kept searching for instantly as soon as it was done i started looking for money like where else can i what can i sell pawn my xbox my guitar everything i had like everything my speakers like everything that i had nice like i went to the pawn shop sold it for like dirt cheap gamble that money away like that and then was like why did i do that like now i don't have an xbox now i don't have this now i
Speaker 1can't play my guitar but to your point it's like i'll deal with that later that's such a common uh thought that in addiction i found for me at least was like so we've been under the rug this is tomorrow anthony's problem right but today i'm going to deal with i'm going to get what i want right is there a difference between the thought process that goes through your mind when you lose a bunch and when you win a bunch like is there a difference because the outcome is the same every time yeah you don't stop right yeah so that's what i realized what's the thought process behind it i think it's like you had to put it into words um like you're trying to ask like what that
Speaker 2like what's the motivation how do you convince yourself to keep going okay um because
Speaker 1i know there's justification there's a whole monkey wheel going on back there right it's like
Speaker 2i just tell myself that like like next time it's gonna be different right like this next or i'm due right like i would always tell myself i had what they call uh cognitive distortion i'm sure you've heard of that but um what that is is where you like you can believe like you believe things that are like like proven to like not be true or like there's like absolutely no no proof that that is true or like the most ridiculous things i would come up with in my head to like keep me going i'm like like i got to the point where i was like driving and gambling like not even looking at it just just based off the sound right and i'm like um in my head i'm like you know like i've lost this much right so it's gonna hit this time right it has to um they have like these these numbers every time you play an online slot most regular slots there's numbers like there's percentages of like it's called rtp return to player um so most of these games i'm playing are like they're like supposedly 95 percent return to player so that means 95 percent of what like the time that you're playing you should be getting your money back which is like not accurate yeah but like i'm thinking like like i said every now and then i would hit like i would be on my very last like 20 bucks or my last my last buy-in like that i could do or afford and it would hit for big so i was like i had myself convinced that like i don't know that like for some reason this next one was going to be big and um like i said very early on i hit like this one but this one win for uh 20 i put in for 10 spins and it was like some multiplier thing and um like i won like six or seven grand and like like i said i i've never seen that kind of money in my life because i've always had that spending issue that we talked about um as fast as money comes in it seems to go out and uh at least today it's on not things that are negatively impacting my life um i definitely would love to save more money but i think in the time it was like if 20 hit for six grand what is 200 gonna hit for and i got to the point where i was doing two thousand dollar buy-ins like two thousand bucks for 10 spins and i get a hundred bucks back and i'd be like it's got a hit man and i'd do it again and then nothing and like i go through like 10 grand and like that minutes yeah and uh like once i realized how fast i was going through the money i was like this is like i'm gonna be homeless like tomorrow if i don't stop it's sort of it's
Speaker 1you know from this side of it when you're kind of clear and you're out of the uh illusion that we were in right it's the same with addiction it's the same thing you're in this illusion where you're just making up your own outcomes and your own uh circumstances and this is the way it is like you said but from this side now now that you sit on it you really start to realize at least from my perspective uh apps like instagram apps like tiktok apps like the ones you're mentioning they're they're developed programmed fine-tuned for us to stay on them right and so it's like once you because as i'm hearing you talk it's like yeah there's a room full of fucking engineers making this app up so that you don't stop that you don't give up you don't cash out perfect example i can't withdraw all my money let's keep them here another day because that's gonna right so even for the person that's not predisposed to addiction it's a recipe for success for them and failure for us right it's it's random but that's the funny thing is you see these commercials gambling is random that's kind of what keeps you going too though because if it's random that means i can win thirty thousand dollars in one hit and and like the one thing that like really got me was like
Speaker 2all these uh you see like i don't know you obviously i probably have a personal account other than your recovery account so like you can see like i barely go on that account now because the algorithm is like it's so bad like i'll see one thing that piques my interest and i'll press on this page he's sponsored by rain bet rain bet yeah and i'm like it's like for me that's what they were offering me was sponsored by rain bet and i'm like it's like for me that's what they really to go to mexico all i had to do is like all i do is stream or whatever right and you see
Speaker 1some of these streamers man it's dark right no right and i was like wrapped into this like i
Speaker 2wanted what this guy had that i was looking up to i'm not going to say his name i don't want to give him any attention but um i was like this guy would like he started out like just like a college kid right and very quickly he was like had a lot of money and he was like i don't know i don't know like he was like i would always watch his videos and uh like that was one thing that kept me coming back and then another thing was like like you said there's all these things that keep you like they're designed to keep you on it so like now that i'm thinking and i'm like looking back at it it's like there were days when like i wasn't even supposed to get free spins and they just like popped up in my account or like like i remember days where i was like i was like i'm i had no money and 40 bucks would just show up in my account or like not my bank account my my gambling account Like, um, like, and, uh, I had, I don't want to out myself. I want to say what, what app, but like I had found a way to like my, like I said, my credit cards, everything maxed out. Right. So, but if I deposited $1 at a time on this one, uh, website, it would work and I would go check my bank. Nothing would come out. Nothing bad ever came from it. But I remember like, I would, it would let you do it like 20, 30 times before it would like catch on and be like, you've done too many deposits today, blah, blah, blah. And every day I'd get like this free 20, 30 bucks. And that was like what kept me coming back because I knew I could get a free 20 bucks, right. Money that I didn't actually have in my account. If I wanted to, I could just hit withdrawal and take that. I could deposit $1 10 times or 20 times, whatever, and withdraw that 10 bucks and it would go into my bank account if I wanted to. But I would always just gamble it and hope to turn that 20, 30 that I got into enough to pay Joe and Jim. And Jeff back, right?
Speaker 1Once I get that, then, you know, once I did, once I pay this, then it'll be good.
Speaker 2And until it's like, like I said, I owed credit cards, money marts, um, parents, girlfriend, friends, like I had nowhere left to go parent, like every, everybody, I owed everybody. And, uh, like I'm getting notices from my insurance that like, they're going to terminate my insurance and yeah. And, uh, I'm like, sorry. I'm starting to miss payments. Right. And I'm like, okay, well, like I said, when I went to, like, they signed me up for like this, uh, this therapy that like specializes in gambling addiction and, uh, what's it called? Like CBT or something? Digital dependency too. Oh, okay. Yes. I've done CBT. So social media addiction. Yeah. So I've, but I special, or I went to this one therapist and, uh, she kept offering the residential thing. Yeah. And she would tell me that like. Yeah. A lot of people would like need to go to the in-person because like they're surrounded by, but I think what she was getting at was like, if I have my phone with me, like there's nothing going to stop me because like. You need to go to rehab motherfucker. Yeah. I'm 20. Right. So no one's going to tell me like, you know, you can't have your phone or like, but that was the only thing that was going to stop me was like taking it away from me and like doing the work. Like, because like, like you said, uh, I don't think it was the same thought process. But, um, like that, all the problems within that I thought I had dealt with when I went to rehab for alcoholism were like the same reasons when I went to, again, and it was like the second time I actually had to like look at them and do something about it. Cause like, I thought I was doing something about it before, but, um, the second I disconnected myself. I reached for something else. And, um, like for a long time, like I would say at least three months, I knew what I was doing was like leading me to a, like either jail cell or death, to be honest, because, um, there was many days I woke up and I like realized what I had done or like I'd snapped out of it. And I'm like, Holy shit. Like, and I wanted to like, I didn't want to kill myself, but I didn't want to live anymore the way I was living. I was like, if this is the way it's going to be like, what's the point? Like if you can't get it together, Logan, like what's, what's the point? Like you're, you're screwing everyone over and like, you're like, I genuinely was just making things worse for like literally everybody around me and myself. And then when I went to rehab, like I said, for the first three days, I was like, I was gambling the hour before I went in there and, uh, like, hold on, I'm peeing, like trying to win money for what? Like, what do you need money for? What the fuck are you going to rehab?
Speaker 1Yeah. So, sorry, just to cut in quickly, you didn't pick up a drink in this whole time? No, I never, never went back to drinking. Were you scared about that at all?
Speaker 2I was like a couple of times, like, like I never genuinely thought about it, but I was like a few times I, I had said like, when it got really bad, like a big fight with my girlfriend, like, she's like, Oh, like, like when she would say I'm going to leave or something like, I'd be like, well, you know where I'm going? Mm-hmm. Like, I would just hint at it. Right. I would never, but I never did. No. The closest I ever got to it was, uh, at prom. I accidentally picked up, me and my girlfriend both had Yetis. I accidentally picked up hers. And I, second, I like looked up, realized there's no ice. I like put it back down. I was like, kind of got upset. I was like, cause I don't know. Like, she's pretty, usually pretty good. She won't even leave her cup near mine because if they look the same, like, you know how it is, right? You would hate to accidentally drink your own cup. I've done it before. Yeah.
Speaker 1In the eight years that I had, I did it and I didn't think twice about it. I mean, it scared the shit out of me, but I was in recovery long enough where I had heard people tell me about stories and they're like, it's not a relapse if you accidentally drink. It's, it's what you do after. Yeah. And I remember I told somebody, so yeah, it's happened to me. Yeah.
Speaker 2It's scary though. It is. Um, like I said, like I picked it up and it like, it almost touched my lips. I realized there was no ice and I'm like, nope. Like, but, uh, yeah, no, never picked up a drink. Um, doesn't mean I haven't thought about it. Um, there's been nights where I've like, even after gambling, like after I got stopped gambling, like recovery's hard, man. Like there's been some days where I like, I leave the driveway fully intending on throwing it all away. And then right away, like 10 seconds, it only takes me 10, 15 seconds usually before I like play that tape forward. And I'm like, like, you know where this is going to lead you, right? Every single time. Like very quickly. Like, and I know like if I were to went and pick up a drink, like when I'm having a drink, heading there to throw it all away, I'm going to get a 40 or a 60. I'm not going to, not going to get a six pack. Like I'm going to throw everything away and I'm going to, like, I'm probably, if I drink that 60, like my plan would be pretty deadly. Right. Like, and I'm just very thankful for like the tools that I got in recovery, the ability to, you know, play that tape forward. And, um, I'm surrounded, like, I'm so grateful for the support system I have. I have like. Great parents that supported me through all that, like, especially the gambling addiction and my girlfriend as well. Like most people, you would look at them and be like, or sorry, most parents will look at their kid and be like, I don't care who you are. You're not going to treat me like that. You're not like family doesn't treat family like that. Right. And they had said that to me a couple of times. And that's what really clicked it in my head was like, you're right. Like.
Speaker 1Blessed. Exactly.
Speaker 2Like I have literally everything around me waiting for me to just take action. And I'm like throwing it all away because I want to either drown myself in this bottle or maybe hit a, maybe hit a jackpot. That's not even going to like when I hit near the end, like hit big for six, seven, eight. I'm like, sweet. Another hour, another hour. That's literally my thought.
Speaker 1You just bought yourself another. Yeah.
Speaker 2I was like, cool. Another, another day of people not asking me for money. Like, um, like I knew that like, I was not going to stop until I hit zero. Yeah. And then. And when I started, like I mentioned, like I had sticky fingers when I, like when I hit zero, I would start looking for money elsewhere. And that's what really scared me because I was like, eventually, like I'm going to screw the wrong person here and I'm either going to end up dead or in jail. And eventually I'm not going to hit that win that I'm going to be able to pay back before they notice or whatever. Right. Like I did a lot of like screwing people over and I like feel terrible, terrible about it. Today. But, um, what I've been taught in recovery is like, I've made my amends and, and I've repented for my sins and like, I've, these people forgive me. God forgives me. Why can't I forgive myself? Right. Um, I'm the last person that's like holding onto it. Like I look at my parents and like, sometimes I'll go up to my mom and I'll just like tear up and I'll look at her and I'll be like, cause I'll just look at her and remember some of the stuff I did while I was drinking. And I'm like, I'll just look at her. I'm sorry. Like, and she'll be like, sorry. For what? And I'm like, I'll tell her like what I'm thinking. And she'll be like, like, I haven't thought about that in years. Like, what do you mean? Like, one of the things that keeps me sober today is like, my mom came up to me a little while ago and was like, Logan, I could finally sleep at night. And like, I didn't realize, like I said, I thought it was like, it's my money. Like I'm not affecting anybody else until I was like taking money. But like in the beginning, it's my money. Like I'm not hurting anybody else. Don't worry about me. It's my money. It's my body. Like, if anything, I'm only hurting myself. Like blacking out and stuff. I never saw an issue with that. Like, that was a regular occurrence for me. Near the end, I'd have like a couple Bud Lights or a couple Bush Lights and I wouldn't even remember what I did that night. Like, it was bad. And like I said, also, I, near the end, I didn't even want to drink beer. It was like, I just wanted the Jack Daniels or whatever, whatever had the highest percent of alcohol in it, is what I wanted. And like, because I felt like if I didn't, you know, hit the floor or like run out of booze, I didn't hit my full potential. And, uh, like even today, if I were to go back, like I know, like I'm not having one, like I don't want one. I never wanted one, um, never had one, like from, from very early on, like, I don't think I've ever just had a couple and called it quits. Maybe I called it quits while the buddies were there. And as soon as they left, I figured something out 'cause I wasn't going to bed sober. um wasn't even gonna cut the grass over like I would figure something out I was slugging back five tall boys in like five minutes just to get a buzz so that I could cut the grass before dad got home and I'd be like running back in the house after like trying to not throw up everything I just drank and he's pulling in the driveway and I'm like coming in the door at the same time he is and then I like put on that mask again and like I was functioning alcoholic addict gambling addict I was functioning through all of it like I had the ability to like everything's fine while I'm around you but then like behind closed doors like I said I didn't even want to be alive or keep living the way I was living um but I've lost a lot of friends to suicide um through addiction like before I got sober before I came into the world of recovery I lost my great grandpa and a friend to cancer and that's it since I came into recovery like so many funerals man so many funerals and close people in my life that like I would have considered brothers um and like today I just realized that like when you kill yourself I don't know who said this like I don't want to steal anybody's quote but somebody said this um but I heard it is uh when you kill yourself you don't end the pain you transfer it um and that like I felt that um like if I were to just take the easy way out and I don't even know if I would have been going to have the balls to do any of that like jump in traffic or something like I don't even know like that stuff all scares me like um and to just imagine the pain that would inflict on my like the people that I love like it's just so selfish in my opinion like I'm not saying people that that do it are selfish I'm just saying for me to do it in the moment I would have just felt like that was the selfish thing to do and easy way out like I said yeah you can't quantify the
Speaker 1amount of pain that it causes for the amount of time it causes you just don't know what it looks like yeah I want to land the plane here with this um people that are struggling with gambling like what what helps you what how what did you learn in rehab to help you stay sober from gambling to and what helps you today like
Speaker 2how do you how do you not gamble today um so one thing that I had to realize that it was a hard pill to swallow but um that no matter how much money I won it was never gonna be enough um and like that that void that we have in our stomach that like once I realized that I like I had denied and denied and denied like I'm not cross-addicted like I'm not switching from one to another because you know I'm sober like I'm not putting anything into my body I'm not thinking different well I was thinking differently but you know like it's not like making me impaired the way alcohol would so I'm I'm not like but once I realized that like I'm just trying to fill that hole again and once I realized that it was the way I viewed money that was keeping me gambling um I don't know if you asked me what it was for me that kept me gambling and I should have said that but it was it was the money part of it like um once I once I realized how I viewed money was wrong and like I the way I viewed like materialistic things how did you view it like like I viewed it like growing up like hockey and everything like that like the more expensive the hockey stick the cooler you were right okay um the more expensive your shoes were the cooler you were so tying your identity to material things so I did that growing up until I went to rehab for gambling like all through sobriety I still did that and um when I went to rehab for gambling I uh I realized that like no matter what I get like whether it's the expensive car or whatever that money that I get is going to buy me it's not going to fill that void so like today when I gave my life to God um I'm getting baptized in January but um I'm a Christian a lot of people get Catholicism and Christianity mixed up but um I I realized that like the only thing I can do to fill that void from myself is God is to give my life to God and to to be a good person and like all these things that uh it took a while when I stopped gambling because the dopamine levels were so off but um to like enjoy natural things but like after I stopped gambling um I started to enjoy things that even when I got sober from alcohol I didn't even enjoy like things that you're supposed to enjoy like going for walks stuff like that like I didn't find any enjoyment in that because I was still looking for that you know that rush or that that to fill that void right gratification and uh like once that once I realized that like like I said no matter no matter what what what jackpot I hit or how much money I get or like it's never going to be enough for me to I'm always going to keep going
Speaker 1until I hit zero I heard someone say once in uh on the gambling side if I won all the money in the world every single dollar I would go to Mars and try to win all the money there yeah that that resonate with me it's the same thing with drugs and alcohol right yeah I heard somebody say that
Speaker 2also resonates with me is like if I could be like a normal drinker like I just sit around and drink all the time like
Speaker 1and that's me like if I could drink normally I would drink all the time and like like what you
Speaker 2said like if I had all the money in the world every dollar I feel like I would just go to the biggest casino there is and that's like I would just keep trying to win more yeah and uh yeah like to one thing I would encourage people that are struggling with a gambling addiction um is you don't have to like you don't have to ruin everything um like what because like before I before I really dug myself really deep I knew and I just thought I could I could you know one more win would pull me out of it and I could just you know like the debt started really low and uh like if I could just win like a couple thousand I could be done and I would never gamble again blah blah blah but like if you realize that you have a problem just know that like there are resources out there I had no idea I could go to rehab for gambling I didn't even know that um and like there's gamblers anonymous there's I have a sponsor for GA I have um I go to GA meetings online now because there's not one in my hometown but I used to go to one in Windsor um so I would drive an hour to go to it fellowship I I encourage people to reach out to those that you know like people like not trying to stay humble but like people like us that make it known that we have suffered with this um like don't be afraid to ask a question um because for someone like me or Anthony like answering your question is gonna not only help us but it might help you um and the biggest thing for me that kept me like coming back and what switched me from like I'm gonna keep gambling when I get out of here to like I'm done was like seeing everything around me like like I said I'm still pretty young I'm 20 years old so like going in there and seeing like people that were actually losing the house losing the wife losing the kids and all this stuff like I'm like if I can picture myself like losing everything like it's definitely gonna happen right and this is proof people around me these are people that are like living the same thing that I was living they're just five ten years more ahead yes exactly I have that same and uh people I'm sure you say it to people in recovery like if you haven't done something like you're like oh like like I don't really like to say it but I've been through a lot of things and I've numbers that much but I did today but um like because you might think oh I didn't do as much as that guy did or I didn't waste as much money as that guy did but like you know what I mean like if you haven't done that yet or sorry if you haven't done it yet it's just like you said yet it's like if you go back out you're gonna be that guy that you know is drinking for me I was like I'm not drinking hand sanitizer but if I go back out and it gets bad enough I'm sure enough probably will and I'm not gonna be that guy that's gonna be that guy that's gonna be that guy that's gonna be and or like I'm not robbing banks but like if I need to or stealing from grocery stores like I
Speaker 1probably would have if it gets bad enough I'm good enough at convincing myself that that is a good idea and that is the only idea yes so absolutely I know myself well enough that I can manipulate
Speaker 2myself justify it I can justify anything in my head absolutely when I was drinking or gambling I would justify absolutely anything yeah but okay Logan new generation sobriety where can we find
Speaker 1you where can we find the podcast it's on Instagram
Speaker 2Spotify YouTube I pretty much the goal is to just try and help the next young person and or anybody really but for me when I got sober especially from alcohol and gambling I was like I'm really into recovery based movies but I was really looking for a podcast or something where there is just like another young guy with a success story and I didn't really see too much of it there are younger guys but a lot of the guys I'm connecting with are like young guys and I'm like 10 years older than me ish or um which doesn't matter I realize age isn't a number or age is just a number um we're all going through the same thing but um dude it's it's important man
Speaker 1to the guy that's 19 20 that can't see my life that you know I'm married and this doesn't relate
Speaker 2the same way for me was like keep doing it was like I don't know how to relate to these people because like Anthony already has the car and the wife and the house I'm still trying to get all these things he's trying to not lose them right like For me, it's like, I want to try and help that person that like you said that can't relate to maybe somebody that's 10 years older because like just because I can kind of sometimes or I was able to you know I was really I found a couple solid guys and I and I hung around with them and they instilled a lot of knowledge into me but um like like you said for that for that 19 or 20 year old out there that feels like there's no one out there that can relate to them like I can relate and I've been there and I'm not no expert but I'm just trying to give my experience and what I've done throughout my sobriety that like could maybe help the next person and if I can help one person that's that's what I'm trying to do so love it
Speaker 1brother thanks so much I appreciate you buddy thanks for listening please help us grow the
Speaker 3channel and like share and subscribe for more content the discussions and stories shared on this podcast are for informational and motivational purposes only this content is not a substitute for professional medical advice addiction treatment or therapy if you or someone you know is struggling with addiction please consult a licensed physician addiction specialist or mental health professional you are no longer alone Thanks for watching!
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