Speaker 1I found myself driving in the area that I used to use and just driving around and there was no reason for me to be in that area. So looking back, it was like, did I want to see somebody that was using and then maybe join them? Or in my mind, I was like, Oh no, I want people to see that I'm doing really well, but I really wasn't doing well. Maybe on the outside, right? Manager at a sober house, you know, sponsoring all these women doing the 12 steps going to meetings, but I really wasn't doing the work internally. And I wasn't telling on myself. And I remember we had a gratitude meeting at my, at my group. It was just after Christmas. And I went to the meeting and then the person that I was dating at the time called me and told me he had relapsed. And my best thinking said, I'm going to go and save him. And I was in no place to do that. I should have asked maybe some of my guy friends to, to go and help him. And I started driving and you know, it talks about like the mental obsession, but also like a mental blank spot. I knew in that moment that I was going to, I was going to pick up that night. And I thought I was just going to do one, which is funny when you say it out loud, but I really did think that. And, and then I was off to the races from, from that moment on. Hi there, welcome back or
Speaker 2welcome to Recovering Out Loud podcast, the show where we get real about mental health and addiction. I'm so glad you're here. If you or someone you love is struggling with drugs or alcohol, please reach out for help. Send me a message on all social media platforms at recoveringoutloudpod or by email at recoveringoutloudpod at gmail.com. You are no longer alone. I went to a wedding last night and I'm just like really tired. I didn't, uh, yeah, it was good. It was, um, it was more, it was a high school reunion almost because it was like all these people I went to high school with. And, uh, so that can be kind of overwhelming sometimes. Yeah. But like it was most of my friends, which was nice. Um, it's interesting to see. So I'm in my thirties and most of the people there were in their mid thirties. So I'm in my thirties and most of the people there were in their mid thirties. So I'm in my thirties and most of the people there were in their mid thirties. So I'm in my thirties and most of the people there were in their mid thirties. So I'm in my mid thirties. I would say the amount of people that are still going like hard. And that's not to say that, see my, my assumption is when I see people like that, I'm like, Oh, they must be doing it all the time. Right. Because like, that's how, you know, I do it. I'm assuming that's how you did it too. And that's not the case, right? Like those people are probably not going to go for another month and they're going to be fine. Yeah. Um, and so I made a video about this this morning, but, uh, one thing that really helps me, cause I still get, and again, I'm early on again in recovery, but I still get those, those triggers, those thoughts of, um, what is it for me? It's like, uh, Oh, that looks fun. Right. That, that looks fun. Like fear of missing out. Yeah. That would be nice. Um, I remember when, and then like insert fun memory, right. Of, of doing like Coke, you know, I don't know. There's probably like a, I probably have like a four minute, you know, memories of when it was fun. Right. Those like four. Intervals. And then after that, it was just absolute hell. Uh, but one thing that really helps me is, excuse me. I just, I just don't use like that. Right. I don't drink like that. I'm still going today. If I, if I picked up last night and then Sunday morning, I'm still going and Monday morning I'm still going. Um, so that, that, that gives me comfort. Right. But, uh, a lot of the time, and that's why I was looking forward to this today too, because like, I have to talk about it. Right. Like I can do all these things. I can pray. I can, um, all these tools that I was taught in recovery, but like, if I keep it in my head, I can do all these things. I can pray. I can, if I keep it in here, that's how I go back every single time. Right. Absolutely. Um, so thanks for coming down, Alison. I appreciate it. Um, why don't you start with, tell us a little bit about
Speaker 1yourself, um, and what you do for work. Okay. So, um, I'm Alison. Um, I've been in recovery for going on seven years. Uh, I've worked at addiction rehab, Toronto, uh, going on five years. Uh, my life looks a lot different. Um, active use was a really long time. I'd say about 16 or 17 years. I was using hard drugs, uh, at the beginning. I mean, when I was 16, 17, it was fun. I can honestly say that. And then, you know, at about 18, 19 years old, it started to become problematic. Um, and, uh, and my life just went downhill. I wasn't employable. I, I couldn't keep a job. Uh, I would, I would go to multiple different schools and, and get different, different degrees for things and, and never be able to stick to anything. Um, and then in 2016, I went to my fifth treatment center by that time. And I was 34 years old. And, um, from there, I stayed there 75 days. And then from there, I went to a sober living and that's, that's kind of where my recovery kind of I actually started to, uh, have hope and, and, and know that, um, maybe I could do this, you know, before that I was always, uh, the type of person that would go to a treatment center. I would, I would get into trouble. Um, my family would either give me a choice. It was like court ordered treatment centers or, or go to jail essentially. And, um, so I, obviously I picked the nice treatment centers and, um, but after I would leave the treatment center, I would just, I wouldn't have a solution. And I, and I just, I didn't hear about the 12 steps too much and, um, meetings and that kind of stuff. So, so I just would go back to, to my old life, what I knew best. Um, I, I hung around some pretty dangerous people. I got myself into, uh, some pretty dangerous situations at a young age, uh, throughout my twenties. It was, um, you know, really hard drugs and, uh, it was terrible. Uh, 20, 28, I got pregnant and I had my daughter and I mean, I was sober, but it wasn't recovery. It was more dry. And, uh, and then when she was about three, I went back to, to that life and, uh, and you know, it was a long road to get here. And so when I went to that treatment center and then I went to, um, a sober living, it was a private sober living. And I stayed there for almost a year, a little bit over a year, I think. Um, and in that time, I, I really learned what recovery was. I got a sponsor. I worked 12 steps. I went to lots of meetings, start sponsoring women. And, uh, when it was time for me to move out on my own, I started to work at the, at the sober house. I just started off on the weekends and then, um, I moved to, to doing throughout the week and then I started to manage the house. Um, so at about two and a half years, I, uh, I, I, you know, the, they talk about unmanageability, right. When, when you're not, when you're not using and, uh, you know, it comes back into your life if you're, if you're not working a solid program. And that's kind of what happened to me. So, uh, I stopped going to meetings. I stopped working with women. Um, I was working way too many hours. Uh, I was helping my mother because she, she fell and she fractured her leg. And like, these are all excuses really. Um, and eventually I ended up picking up again at about just shy of three years. And it was really bad. It was about two and a half, three months, but it was, it was terrible. I, um, almost died a couple of times. Um, somebody saved my life. I was, I was, uh, passed out in a bathtub and, uh, and somebody saved my life. And so, uh, I went to a, back to a treatment, the same treatment center. My sister picked me up from a pretty dangerous area with a friend of mine, uh, that's in, in the program. And, uh, I went back to treatment and I stayed there for 45 days and I don't know, something shifted. Um, and I, I knew the things that I needed to do and I knew the things that I needed to not do. Um, and so, you know, the, the last six and a half, pretty much six and a half years, I've just been, you know, really focusing on my career, my recovery, my daughter, um, my relationships, my family. I have a really big family. Uh, I have three sisters. Uh, I have seven nieces and nephews, you know, Sunday lunches at my, at my family's house is, is loud and lots of kids running around. And, um, sometimes I have to pinch myself because the life that I was living, uh, on the streets, like I was, I was actually driving on the way down here. And, uh, it was like by all the different areas that, uh, I used to like, you could say I lived, but really it was just, you know, kind of being on the streets. Uh, and so, you know, then I, I went from, from the sober living, uh, working there. And then he called me back after I got sober again. And he asked me if I wanted my job back. And so I started working there for about six months and I just wanted something a little bit more. So, uh, during COVID I went back to school and I graduated with honors, which was, uh, pretty incredible for a person like me. And, uh, and I started doing my placement at addiction rehab, Toronto. And, uh, i would say that that's just kind of where i i kind of fell into the field because of my my lived experience i think that um it's uh it's such a special place to work i absolutely love everybody that i work with my bosses are are very supportive um you know i met you uh through through art and you know i get to wake up every day and i get to go to a job that i absolutely love uh sometimes it's a it can be a little bit overwhelming a little bit stressful but i think that today i'm able to to handle that stress um much better because of my recovery so uh now i do intake so i went from from working as a counselor i i also do counseling as well but my primary role is uh intake counselor and i absolutely love that role because i get to see them come into the doors and then i get to see them when they're leaving yeah
Speaker 2that's what i was gonna ask you is like you get to see this you know these shells of human beings come in and i remember every time i've i still i have a picture from one of my intakes that i i will never delete because uh it just i just it brings me back to that feeling of like utter defeat and you know my hair is all over the place and it looked like i hadn't showered in a long time but i'll never forget that that walking back like i've been to three and walking into every all three treatment centers like that's a memory burned into my brain and and you know for like when i'm at a wedding last night i i really pull up those memories right of like where does it lead me right back into that door where i can't even speak i don't even know who i am anymore i'm just not myself right completely um yeah so that's an interesting perspective that you have there i want to uh go back to the so at two and a half years when you went back out because i can relate to that i went back out after having years as well do you remember what sort of was going through your mind when that because in my experience real apps doesn't it doesn't just happen overnight right there's like a lot of planning a lot of thoughts a lot of guilt and shame about the thoughts do you remember like what what that
Speaker 1what that thought process was like before you pick up you know i i don't have the greatest memory and uh but i do remember uh the the moments leading up to it so i had a sponsor and she would tell me you know you're not you're not doing uh the inventories uh it's like you know like checking in at the end of the night um you're not coming to meetings i started it i i started a meeting in my area i wasn't going to the meetings i started to concentrate on my relationship at the time and uh and all these things and i was really drained and i was working too much and all this unmanageability without drugs and alcohol and i remember um you know i had a prayer meditation room in my condo i stopped praying stopped meditating uh i stopped talking about it and what's interesting is um i'm not much of a a drink like i i drink alcoholically but drinking is not really my thing um but i had a reservation about drinking and i didn't tell anybody about it i found myself uh i was telling my friend this story the other day i found myself driving in the area that i used to use um and just driving around and there was no reason for me to be in that area so looking back it was like did i want to see somebody that was using and then maybe join them or uh in my mind i was like oh no i want people to see that i'm doing really well but i really wasn't doing well maybe on the outside right manager at a sober house uh you know sponsoring all these women uh doing the 12 steps going to meetings but i really wasn't doing the work internally and i wasn't telling on myself and i remember the the we had a gratitude meeting at my at my group it was just after christmas and i went to the meeting and then the person that i was dating at the time uh called me and told me he had relapsed and my best thinking said i'm gonna go and save him and i was in no place to do that uh i should have asked maybe some of my guy friends to to go and help him but uh and i started driving and you know it talks about like the mental obsession but there's also like a mental blank spot i knew in that moment that i was gonna i was gonna pick up that night um and uh i thought i was just gonna do one which is funny when you say it out loud but i really did think that and uh and then i was off to the races from from
Speaker 2that moment on yeah that's interesting um it's it's almost like your brain starts to look for excuses to to jump back into that life and uh yeah you're like constantly scanning the area that's interesting that you drove around um and then yeah i can relate to like the for me it was the adhd medication it was like i had the the right thought in my mind in my mind and you mentioned telling on yourself that is like i try to preach that so often with guys that i work with and on this podcast as well um every time i relapse it was that yeah it was that it was like i have this idea i'm gonna hold it back here and it's just gonna keep getting bigger and bigger until eventually it leads to to action right um so i think that's a really good point yeah i think that's a really good point um so being an intake counselor at addiction rehab toronto um you see a lot of people come in what what would you say is like the number one people in your opinion that like don't i don't i never like saying fail because it's not a failure at all um but that don't kind of get the recovery thing like what do you think the biggest reason is when they leave treatment a lot of the
Speaker 1time it's the continuum of care uh you can come into treatment and you can be there 30 60 years 90 days which is great and it's a beginning but if you leave treatment and you just go back to exactly what you were doing before you're not going to be able to sustain recovery and so um i often say you know if if it's not 12 steps then maybe look into smart recovery or something something needs to change um you know some people need need a little bit of extra support and then sober living is is the next option i didn't go back to sober living and on my uh after my relapse but i do truly believe that if i didn't go to that sober living initially in 2016 i don't think that i would be sober today i really needed to learn how to live outside of treatment and having that extra support was was crucial yeah was absolutely crucial yeah
Speaker 2and and uh it's a good point too because um you know for a long time when i when i came back from my relapse there was these thoughts of like oh i lost it all right but that that's a prime example of tools that were built into your brain that you were able to later go back pick up on right and bring back out and use again um so you you don't you don't lose any of that time you don't lose those tools that you're taught in recovery um um and so yeah i did the sober living thing too um i found that for me the biggest help at any treatment center i've ever been to was like just just listening to what they told me to do right and when i work with people now that are getting into into treatment i always you know it's the mom's calling and it's the fifth again same thing fifth treatment center right what's going to be different this time and i ask them sometimes i'm like what do you think the missing piece is right like did you listen to every single thing the counselor said to do right yeah and uh it's funny that i'm saying this out loud because when in my last treatment center they recommended that i extend to 60 days and you know i had eight years of recovery and i was like i know what i'm doing you know what i mean and it's like that utter deflation of ego had to take place again and it wasn't until i said it out loud that i'm a defiant alcoholic and addict that something clicked for me where i was like i was able to accept the fact even though even still looking back on my brain will go yeah i know you probably could have got away with 30 right and it's like no dude like you needed to listen and it doesn't matter what it looked like it you needed to listen to what other people were saying right and then just
Speaker 1apply it in your life yeah yeah like taking direction and uh remaining teachable and being humble um i've worked with clients before where they're like i know i know i know i'm like no you don't that's a dangerous word yeah because i used to say it myself and i know i know that i i need to be able to to listen to somebody that came before me that knows what they're doing and i need to follow direction because my my thinking and my way of life was
Speaker 2not working yeah it's so true um you're you're a spiritual person right i know that from you um what does faith spirituality mean to you and why do you think it's important in recovery so um you
Speaker 1know in the big book it says self-will run riot so if i'm living on my self-will i'll get myself into trouble every time and so when i started the program i was a bit skeptical with with spirituality with the word god and and those kind of things and you know throughout the years of recovery i'm very spiritual and then sometimes i i fall off the beam a little bit and i have to get myself back to it i think that you know me driving the bus is not a good idea i'm not a good driver in this sense and so uh spirituality looks like you know turning my thoughts and my actions over to the care of god or whatever i believe in instead of my thoughts and actions so and it's not always just to do with drugs and alcohol it's to do with uh should i go to the hospital or should i go to this place or should i hang out with these people or you know do i go to this event like i i kind of like uh have something to talk to and and be good directed by because you know for such a long time my plans and ideas they get me into trouble and uh and get me into places where where i don't want to be and you know my life today is is so beautiful um it's it's a miracle because i couldn't go i couldn't go like you know 20 minutes without picking up um it was really bad i uh when i went into treatment in 2016 i was i was a little over 100 pounds and uh i was uh i was dying you know from the inside and out i needed spirituality i needed something um to help guide me and uh you know even just doing prayer and meditation i feel like when when i pray i'm i'm asking for direction and when i meditate i'm listening for the answers
Speaker 2what does meditation look like to you how do you how do you tell someone to meditate
Speaker 1i always struggled with with that one um yeah so my mind sometimes goes like a million miles a minute so i like guided meditations personally uh i'm not very uh very good with sitting still with with just quiet or maybe even a little bit of music in the background i like something that's like you use the calm map and and just ask for guided meditation on stress or guided meditation on faith or guided meditation on anxiety whatever the whatever i'm feeling in that moment and i just try and sit still in the morning before i get to work because i i like to be grounded and and kind of just feeling calm when i get to work and then also at nighttime after i do i write out my inventory i send it to my my sponsor uh she's fantastic i really love working with her and uh and then i just finish it off with a meditation and i usually
Speaker 2fall asleep so you do it at night then interesting yeah yeah i find that uh meditation is one of those things where it's like you can't there's no doing it right right it's just doing it or not doing it and uh you know that's that's the struggle for me is is just doing it right it's starting to do it building a routine around it and then yeah to your point um when i do it i'm i'm much more calm i'm i don't buy things on amazon as much right like i can kind of catch myself uh and have this self awareness when um for example last night these feelings are coming up of and you know we're we're reminiscing about old times and um you start getting some people as i'm sure you've had where you see old friends and they're they're telling you how good you're doing and this stuff and i don't know about you but i i really hate compliments like i really struggle and and i know that it's something to work on where it's like oh this person is they mean it and because that's my thing is like oh you're lying right or because i don't believe in myself right and so that it takes work and but i'm able to to stop in those moments and fuel my body reacting to whatever the situation is happening and then you know just relate it back to again i i don't drink like that i don't i don't use like that i'm gonna be okay and uh just and then you know you wake up this morning and you're every time every single time you wake up and you're like man you almost can't believe that you had those thoughts again because what like what was i thinking right and then but you just laugh at it too you don't beat yourself up about it and i'm an addict and that's that's it it's just more proof that i i don't need but i i get anyways right
Speaker 1and you know working at addiction rehab toronto seeing people come in um broken essentially uh it reminds me of of when i walked into treatment multiple times and just uh you know in the big book where it says incomprehensible demoralization like that's how i felt every single time um and you know the snowball of lies when when i was relapsing and you know lying to my boss and telling him i had laryngitis when when i was using and and that kind of stuff that that doesn't serve me today i don't need to i don't need to live that life today yeah um what are you seeing on
Speaker 2the intake side in terms of substances coming are you seeing a lot of gambling yet i keep thinking about this um because i'm getting i'm getting some phone calls about gambling uh you know now that it's legal in ontario and uh it's it's a really dangerous one right because a lot of people it doesn't um you know i had a friend in last year actually right before my last relapse i didn't realize how much of an impact this had he actually took his own life and uh you know we don't we don't know exactly why but um some people believe that there was a little bit of that going on and uh you know if you read about the stats i think uh one of the number one reasons and i'm going to mess this up but one of the number one reasons young males are committing suicide or taking their own lives is because of gambling debt and it's it's a serious problem that's that's gonna come right it's like an epidemic that's on the rise definitely in the states as well um so what are you seeing in terms of substances is it a lot of opiates is it like
Speaker 1what's what's the majority of people coming in with i would say primarily it's a lot of alcoholics um a lot of crack cocaine and opiates but there are some gambling gambling addicts and uh yeah it's i i have personal um experience with uh i was married to somebody that was a gambling addict uh he um you know it's it's it's really bad it it creates you know the depression the anxiety um and it it is if you look at stats it's it's a high suicide rate uh just because it's it's pretty much the same as substances except for gambling um you can't stop and it's it's really sad it's really sad and it's hard to detect because you know it's not necessarily something that's visual when when you're using you can kind of take it for granted tell when somebody's on drugs um but not so with the gambling addict so it's it's it's pretty sad it's uh and we've seen it we've seen it at at art um people coming in with gambling addictions
Speaker 2and is it the same kind of treatment approach that we take to that like i'm not really up to
Speaker 1date on how how do you treat yes yeah so there there are uh 12-step meetings that you can go to ga um and yeah they they they work the 12 steps um maybe not in treatment but yeah they've they've worked the 12 step steps in in different fellowships and uh it's the same sort of idea except for you know when we have the the mental obsession with drugs and alcohol they have a
Speaker 2mental obsession to to place a bet yeah and it's very similar to in because i have some personal experience with gambling uh in my addiction as well where it's like you're chasing that first win right and it's the same as you know i'm chasing that first high that first line that that the the dopamine brought me in it's never the same right and then you're constantly chasing it and you get in a bigger hole and then you need to use more and gamble more or whatever so it's there's a lot of similarities um what what is the best piece of advice or some of the best advice you got when you were coming into recovery or this time around from people so i it was it was interesting when i
Speaker 1went back to treatment um uh some people because a lot of the counselors knew me because i was there three years prior and um and some of the clients were asking me um you know about having three years and that kind of stuff and i and i just told them i don't i i'm just starting fresh just like you because uh obviously i got something wrong along the way i don't lose the the experience of having those three years and the people that i met but but i i wanted to remain humble and and teachable in in that moment um you know just just being back in recovery i think that the importance of uh really staying in the moment and working on you know having um having that inventory at night has been crucial for me i think because uh if i don't if i just kind of leave things resentments resentments and they build up and they build up uh eventually you know i'm gonna end up picking up as a result of it so i need to always stay current with with um some things that have been bothering me um and and just looking at you know how i treat people and my behaviors and that kind of stuff because if i start being short with people start going back to selfishness uh resentments and that kind of stuff i know that that's a telltale sign that
Speaker 2i'm going down the wrong path again yeah yeah it's interesting you bring that up because that's that's one of mine too where i start um getting short with people and it's this uh it's kind of like this grumpiness you know i actually woke up this morning um feeling that and something that's been helping me a lot i started doing these uh free writing journals every morning because i read about it somewhere so now you know no matter what and i don't want to do it a lot of the time but first thing i do when i wake up after i pray is i write three pages of just like whatever's on my mind and that's been extremely helpful i actually got it from a woman who is sober she wrote a book about the creative process and like writing and she's a writer and she's a writer and she's a writer and she's a writer and so i'm reading this book and she talks about morning pages it's called where every morning you write out three pages no matter what and i'm finding that it really helps me like i don't want to do it a lot of time but it's it's a form of prayer it's a form of meditation after i've already said my my typical prayers and um it's amazing like it honestly went away like within probably half an hour of when i woke up this morning i was writing about it out and then you know my wife actually she woke before me this morning which never happens uh and i'm like oh my god i'm like oh my god i'm like oh my god i'm like oh my god i'm like oh my god um but i i told her she's i was like i i feel grumpy i feel short um but i i told her she's i was like i i feel grumpy i feel short feel angry and within half an hour like you know we're having a conversation again and it's kind of gone right so i i can't stress enough to people how important it is to just get it out
Speaker 1whatever that looks like even even i think uh what's beneficial too is uh having a gratitude journal i feel like if i'm looking at what i'm grateful for today then it's really hard for me to be in a bad mood because there's so many things in my life to be grateful for um i have my family back i have a beautiful relationship with my daughter um i have uh i have a beautiful relationship uh with my partner and his daughter and uh my family you know they trust me again uh it's pretty sad but you know they stopped they stopped setting a place at the table for me because i just never showed up i missed so out on so many things in active addiction you and now it's just like normal for me to be sober like they they don't remember like i'm sure they remember but but it's been a while since they've seen me that way that it's just kind of second nature for for me to show up and you know take care of their kids and and that kind of stuff
Speaker 2right it's amazing you replace sort of you start to replace all the bad memories with with better ones right and it takes time um and i've i've come to realize too luckily i've had everyone in my life come back as well um it does take time and some people don't they're not coming back right some people you've you've we've really done some damage and we need to accept that everyone has their own healing journey and maybe their life is better without me right that's like another way to look at it too um what's something that you you're currently working on right now personally personally
Speaker 1that's that's a good question so um i've uh i've been you know trying to focus uh more on you know spending more time with my daughter i think that it's it's very important she's she's 16 and i and she really needs me and also i'm i'm quite busy at work too right so it's like i'm i'm a bit of a homebody so i you know during the week i just i go to meetings i go home um i just hang out at my house i do i do some therapy sessions at night time spend time with her and and just try and keep it simple i also uh love to travel and um some people ask me you know how do you travel and how do you go to these all-inclusive resorts and not drink or do anything else but my memories are pretty much all attached to recovery i i only traveled since i've been in recovery i think i've gone on two trips where i was in active use one when i was 19 18 or 19 and once uh with a family trip and i was drinking other than that i've i've traveled to so many different places but i've been in recovery doing that so i just absolutely love it um i uh i just i just got back from a mediterranean cruise that was absolutely beautiful uh i just i don't know it's just kind of my happy place to be around like an ocean and seeing the world and and different things because you know being confined to to a room and being in paranoia
Speaker 2is is not fun yeah so yeah it gets old pretty quick yeah yeah um yeah you just reminded me of i remember because there's a lot of firsts in recovery right and when people ask me that too or or they ask you uh i don't think they really understand that it's like you've done it a lot where it's like it at one point it wasn't easy right like it's it's gotten easier because you do it a lot more and so first wedding first all-inclusive that was a big one for me and you reminded me of a time when uh i went to jamaica and i was like oh my god i'm gonna go to jamaica for two weeks which was way too much time on a resort to be honest because we were like stuck in the uh first world problems anyways um so we were there and i remember being on the beach and there was like four or five people that were younger than me and they were like funneling on the beach and they i'll never forget this they brought it right up to my face and were like you know you got to do one you got to do one and uh that was one of the hardest moments i've i've ever been through in recovery right um where it's like you're in a place no one would know right you you can all these thoughts are going through your mind you can get back to recovery when you get home or but uh and so i remember vividly calling my sponsor while i was on that vacation after and uh telling him about it and you know i think that saved my life because in the moment um you kind of forget right you forget that you have to go and pick up the pieces after and you have to live with your addict self again right no one else is coming to save you after
Speaker 1i was just i was thinking when you were talking that um i remember uh i got out of treatment i was about uh four months sober i went to bahamas with my family and my daughter and then the fall that year i was about eight months sober and my my sponsor at the time nafisha we went to mexico together and uh and so i i just kind of got used to being uh in recovery and going on these trips and then you know traveling with my sister traveling with my daughter uh traveling with friends and then uh last year we went on a recovery trip to mexico so and we're going again yeah we're going again in march so i i feel like you know it's it's a good mixture of family and
Speaker 2then also recovery trips as well um yeah it's beautiful how uh so when life happens uh and you know things happen in recovery to you and how would you say that you navigate through those tough times when you know everything seems to be going wrong or or not in your favor how do
Speaker 1you navigate through that uh so so i think that having people the supportive people and and really talking about it is is so important uh i have some really fantastic friends in in recovery uh ranging from you know 25 26 years to you know a couple years and and they they know me well uh i have some friends that i've known that i lived with and so we're living that are still sober and we're on this journey together so uh they know me the best and i also have a couple normie friends that i can talk to about things but i find that reaching out and just just telling them how i'm feeling also staying connected to my sponsor and uh and my spirituality i think that that's kind of what helps me when i'm when i'm feeling those those uh certain low times yeah yeah i mean for me right
Speaker 2now um you know things are good it's everything is is working out as it should uh i have a problem with expectations that's that's my thing right now where it's like you know this this podcast uh used to be a lot more um i don't know i would say easy to get my head around doing right all the work around it and uh lately i've been kind of just thinking like it's starting to feel more like a job right and i've come to the realization that it's solely because and this is like a lot of things in my life i have an expectation attached to it it's like i'm at a point now where um i'm not the the expectation i'm not getting what i thought i wanted to get out of it right whether it's the amount of listeners or uh you know money from it or whatever and it all comes back to like yeah i have this expectation which is directly uh proportionate to my level of acceptance so my what does it say my serenity is directly uh proportional inversely proportional to my level of expectations right so the higher my expectations are the lower my serenity is in all scenarios and uh i have to remind myself i was like dude you did this to just stay sober and hopefully help one other person and you're achieving that right so shut up
Speaker 1yeah it's it's it's a beautiful thing that you're doing um i think that it it can help somebody that's that's watching it and and maybe they can relate to to somebody that's on here uh and uh we can't do this alone that's the main thing and i remember uh after i had my relapse um so many people reached out to me so many people showed up on my at my door uh friends in recovery that that didn't give up on me uh didn't turn their back on me uh you know when i was using they they wouldn't necessarily give me money but they would buy food for me and stuff like that and uh and i don't forget that and you know that's very important because
Speaker 2we can't we can't do this alone yeah yeah asking for money is uh that's a good one you know enabling right yeah um if you could go back i like asking this somebody asked me this question once and uh i hated it at first but now i really like it it's uh if you could go back and change your life to take like a life of a normal drinker instead of an addict or a normal user
Speaker 1instead of an addict would you take it so that's you know i used to think that i would um i used to think that if there was no consequences would i still continue that lifestyle and today i would say no i would i would rather um be you know have the lived experience i wouldn't have the career i have i wouldn't have the people in my life um i don't think that i would have the partner that i have in my life i don't think i would have any of these things because um you know i've met so many incredible people in recovery that we wouldn't have crossed their paths with each other right so i i love my life today and i'm grateful for for what i've been through because you know when i'm even when i'm doing intakes and somebody asks me like do you understand addiction? And I tell them a little bit, right? So, so it makes them feel more comfortable and, and they're like, oh wow. And I, and I tell them like a lot of our counselors have lived experience. They, they can understand what you, what you've gone through and they can empathize with you. Um, and I've also, I'm also a mother, so I can understand the parent side of things where, you know, what I put my family through and I see that the parents faces and just, um, you know, they just feel, they, they look lost and broken because of what we put them
Speaker 2through. Right. Yeah. Um, I know it's, it's like, I don't think I would have had, uh, the reason, I don't want to say access to the toolkit that I have today because it's available to anybody, but I wouldn't have had the reason, the reason to, to get the toolkit that I have. And yeah, things have happened in my life where I don't, I don't know if they would have happened, uh, if I hadn't, you know, hit, hit some sort of rock bottom. Right. And there's a lot of growth that comes after destruction, right? Uh, it breeds a lot of creation. I'm stealing that from a Red Hot Chili Peppers song, I think, um, you know, destruction leads to a very rough road, but it also breeds creation. Right. And, uh, I love that quote and it's the lead singer is also in recovery as well. So, um, it's a beautiful thing. You have to be able to learn from, from the experiences as
Speaker 1well. I think, uh, in the big book, it says it might be worth a bad case of jitters if you get a full knowledge of your condition. So as long as you can learn from, from the experiences, uh, and you can grow from them, I feel like anything that I've been through, if it's, it's been really challenging, that's where I've grown the most, uh, in recovery. You know, um, I, I got married in recovery. I got divorced in recovery. Um, I went through a pretty dark time, uh, through that relationship and, and I came out of it a stronger person as a result of it. Uh, and, you know, you know, looking back at my, at my life in active use, uh, there's some, there's some things that, that I went through and I feel like I, I kind of put myself in those dangerous situations. Right. So I think that I can, I can better be prepared to help someone.
Speaker 2Yeah. It's like this sort of unique gift, right. That we can offer to others. And as I'm sure you can attest addiction is not going anywhere, right. It's getting worse. And, uh, yeah, I, I found it, I find it interesting too, that there's with all the drugs that are out now. And, uh, you know, a lot of, a lot of, you see that the data that a lot less people are drinking now, right. That it's, uh, I, I still talk to a lot of alcoholics too, where it's like the drugs are not their problem at all. And I find that really interesting, right. That it's like, um, let me ask you this and maybe, I don't know if there's any science behind this or anything, and maybe you, uh, your opinion on what, what do you think makes somebody a stimulant? User versus an alcohol or depressant user? Like, what do you think the difference is? I've always been a stimulant guy. I never liked being depressed. What do you, what do you think
Speaker 1the difference is between the two? That's a, that's a, that's a good question. Um, for me, I was, I was both right. I, I, I use stimulants and then I use downers as well. Right. So, um, but I think that once you get comfortable with, with a certain substance and you like the effect produced by it, then it just becomes your, your failed solution. But, you think it's your solution at the time. So, uh, a lot of drinkers, I talked to, to a lot of alcoholics and they, they're under the impression that because it's legal, it's more acceptable and it's not so bad. Uh, sometimes I'll even say, is there any other substances when I'm doing an intake or, or if I say drugs and they're like, oh no, no, I don't do drugs, but alcohol is a drug. So, so it's, it's interesting to see that they, they kind of separate the two. Uh, and I think that it just becomes preference and what you're used to.
Speaker 2Yeah. And, and that's, I would assume that that's the same with weed now too, right? Where it's like, that's interesting. Yeah. It's like this, uh, sort of justification that you're not, you're okay. Right. You're just, you know, everyone else is doing it. Um, I don't think I was ever to make that justification because, uh, people are not socially using cocaine. Uh, actually maybe they are, but if you, if you, if you walk around and, uh, you know, I would say most people aren't, you think socially accepted use of cocaine or any drugs like that, but that's an interesting distinction. I never thought about that. Um, okay. Let's, let's wrap it up with this. If you could say something to your younger addicted self today, what would you say?
Speaker 1Very good question. Uh, I think that, uh, I would, uh, I would ask my younger self to listen and, uh, try and follow a little more direction in life. And, uh, you know, sometimes I look back, I try not to have regrets, but I look back and I say, you know, I wish maybe I was a little bit younger getting into recovery. Uh, there's some things that, you know, maybe because I'm a little bit older, I can't necessarily have or accomplish, maybe I would have had more kids or, and stuff like that. Right. So, uh, I think that, you know, maybe, maybe, you know, I would, I would say to my younger self, you know, try and get, get your stuff together at a, a little bit of a younger age.
Speaker 2Yeah. That, uh, going against that defiance, right. That's, I think that's the crux of it all really for, and like, even today, it's just to stay sober. It's going against that, you know, better judgment and quotations that I, I think I know what's best for me. And you said it perfectly. Um, uh, the, the best answer, like my worst, my biggest problem today is I'm right. Right. But it, it looks, it comes out in the form of, yeah, I know. And that's such a good way to put it. It's like, anytime I'm saying, yeah, I know that's red flag, huge red flag. Right. Um, thanks so much for coming down Alison. I appreciate it.
Speaker 1Thank you. Thank you for having me.
Speaker 3Thanks for listening. Please help us grow the channel and like share and subscribe for more content. The discussions and stories shared on this podcast are for informational and motivational purposes only. This content is not a substitute for professional medical advice, addiction treatment, or therapy. If you or someone you know is struggling with addiction, please consult a licensed physician, addiction specialist, or mental health professional. You are no longer alone. .
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