How to Scale Your Franchise Without Burnout w/ Paul Preston

So how do you lead a growing brand while still staying grounded? - Number one, you just can't take yourself so break in seriously. Okay, come on, be in a humble and just going, I don't know how to do that. When you look at the franchisees and they ask you question, like, hey, tell me much your marketing plan and you make up something, you know, and then they see through it. And you're like, you know what, our marketing is very average right now or whatever it is, but we're working on it and we're hiring people and then you just seem relatable and just stop pretending you have it all together 'cause none of us really do at the end of the day and people wanna be around real genuine, authentic leaders. They don't wanna be around people who, you know, pretend they do, 'cause you'll be found out eventually. - Welcome to the franchise leaders forum. I'm your host, Tracy Penace, and joining me is our co-host, Shannon Wilburn. Together we navigate the intricate world of franchising. This is your go-to resource for leadership insights, practical strategies and firsthand experiences from those who live and breathe franchising every day. Let's go, let's go, let's go. Hello everybody and welcome back to the franchise leaders forum. The podcast where we explore what it takes to lead, grow and thrive in the world of franchising. I'm Tracy Penace and as always, I'm joined by our co-host, Shannon Wilburn. Hi, Shannon. Hello, glad to be here. - Yeah, we are super excited because slight pun intended. Today's podcast is really going to make us splash. We are joined by Paul Preston, co-founder and president of Aquatot Swim School, the largest swim school in the franchise space. And what started as a single indoor pool in 2005 has now grown into 170 locations in 14 countries. But as you will learn today, Paul's story is a lot more about other things, other than growth, it's about purpose. And as I have kind of studied up and read and learned more about Paul, it's evident that he's passionate about building businesses where people can win without burning out. I read a story about how it's his goal that a franchise owner can coach a little league and lead a life of meaning. And so we are really excited to have you, Paul. Welcome to the podcast. - Yeah, thank you so much. You guys are the best. I look up to both of you and it's just really fun to be here. - I promise I'm not gonna have any more pun. So let's dive in. - Well, I'll put on a dad joke if you want. - Do you do puns? I'll do a dad joke. - Oh my gosh. - There you go. So it's always fun, I think, when we start our podcast with just like going back to the beginning and some of our listeners know the story of Shannon's humble beginnings starting in a 1700 square foot house. I love to show that picture to our franchise actually 1400 evens. - Oh, okay. So I say 1700. Now I know it's 1400. But let's start at the beginning with Aquatats. Did you ever imagine that you would go from one pool to 170 locations worldwide? - I'd love to say of course, but it wasn't even in the mind. So my best friend, my business partner, Ron, CRO, him and I partnered up 20 years ago. I was leaving a career in corporate golf management. He had been teaching swim lessons kind of as a side. So if you will, over the summer months and we both were working too much. We were unbalanced. We had toddlers for children, our own kids. And we just said, you know, I want to be home. I want to be a good husband. I want to be a good dad. And we had this bright idea that we would open a business and we would be co-GMs. And we would hardly work 25 hours a week. And we would have all the time in the world. We got close to that, but no, we opened one location. It was literally 20 years ago. This month we were in construction for our first Aquatats location here in Arizona. And the goal was to get that open and it was right in our community. So it was a mile from my house, a mile from Ron's house. It was in the community that grew up in. So we were just looking for this life that we could run a great business and be part of the community and be good husbands and dads. That was the goal. So 170, that was never the goal. And it's been 20 years this month? 20 years this month, yeah. The graduation. Yeah, thanks. It's been a ride. I mean, I know, as of 20 years ago, I'd never been out of the United States. And now we're in 14 countries. We always traveled so many more. And some of my favorite people in the world are in places like Kuwait and Ireland and Istanbul and Rio de Janeiro, Mexico. It's crazy. Who would have thought? That's awesome. Is there something specific that drew you to swim school? Were you a lifeguard? Or did you have any sort of experience with a child who wasn't able to swim? Tell us a little bit about that. You know, so Ron, my business partner, he started teaching swimming in high school. That was his thing. He was a lifeguard, a short story on Ron. He's lifeguarding one day at 16 or 17. The swim instructor in the pool at the public pool didn't show up. The moms were there, you know, with their kids. The swim instructor didn't show up. And the moms said, hey, you on the life's guard stand, get down here and teach the swim lesson. And Ron being the crazy Italian entrepreneur that he is. He's like, yeah, I'm in. So he went and grabbed some props, jumped in the pool, never taught a swim lesson. A swim lesson and then these moms were like, I don't want coach Tony anymore. I want coach Ron. That's where he started teaching swimming. And he's just a natural coach. And he's very inspirational, loves people. When him and I were friends and I was looking to start a business, I love franchising so much. I was looking to own a franchise. So I was looking at four to subs, tropical smoothie, cafe, and quiz and I was like, gosh, I'm so glad I didn't do these. I'm so excited. And he knew I wanted to leave a career and he said, Paul, why don't you partner with me? And let's take his curriculum he'd started and my business acumen and my background. I love coaching people, love leading. I love people number one. And I didn't even know what it was that he wanted. He's like, let's just do this together. We knew we wanted to do it together. And he had to explain to me what a swim school really was. Because 20 years ago, we had to explain to a mom what a swim school was. And today I love it. And there's some great competitors in our space that have made this industry what it is. And now a mom will ask another mom, hey, which swim school do you go to? And so it's become like, it's just a household thing to go to a swim school. And I'm a coach, I'm a teacher. I love coaching in kids. And it was a natural fit for Ron and I to partner and do this. So what was the moment that made you believe it could be more than just like a local business? I know you were looking into franchising, but when you looked at aquatots and like, what made you want to scale? You know, literally people just started to call it, Shannon. We were in the swim school, my and her own business, trying to do it with excellence. So we've always been about excellence and values. That's what defines me and my career and Ron and his life and career. And so we were just mine in our business, Mesa, Arizona, trying to do things with excellence, trying to love people, do it with values. And there are phones started to ring. And I don't know how people got our number or why they're calling us, but they said, hey, I heard you're franchising. And we're like, I don't know who is it. No, over-- do you want to sign up for some lessons? I'd love to sign up for some lessons. And so we started getting phone calls and phone calls. It was like maybe a dozen over a two-year period. And so finally, Ron and I are just like, hey, maybe we were talking to our wives. Like, should we franchise? And evidently, we were running something that looked like we were a franchise. Like, maybe I thought I loved our business. So it was thought out, professional. It looks good. It feels good. It smells good. Mom's still comfortable. Kids are having a great time. So I think that interested attracted people to it. And they said, hey, help me open my own swim school in my community. And so that's what started it. And we awarded one here in Phoenix, another one in Phoenix. And we're like, OK, someone calls from Atlanta. And we loved them. And let's go to Atlanta. And then after about four or five locations, I think we finally said, OK, hold on. We're going to do this. Let's really do it. And so that's when we started getting some more advisors, started going to conferences, iring some more talented people in the franchise space. How big were you at that point? Like when you started franchising-- Oh. Like when I started hiring people's channel? Or how-- When you started franchising, did you have several locations or were you just one location? We had one location. I mean, we were-- I mean, I know you're putting this out here, but I'm not afraid. We were broke. We mortgaged everything. Second, we were doing our homes, credit cards, bar on money, just to get one school open. And the goal was to open multiple around Phoenix. We hadn't gotten that far yet. My first location was an open maybe 12 or 18 months. And we were successful and profitable, but we didn't have the cash yet to scale. So we just had the one location. Yeah. Well, in your-- the swim school is not a cheap endeavor. Right. It's not like it just between friends where it's-- sometimes it's under 100,000. You've got to have bank to open a school. Yeah, cool. Yeah, there are a lot of parallels, though, despite the fact that the concepts are dramatically different, what you just shared, Paul, is very similar to what I've heard Shannon share, which is that one location in Tulsa, Oklahoma, and then all of a sudden people in California, Colorado, Texas, Florida were calling. Shannon and her co-founder Devon and saying, "Can you help us to do this?" And so that's really how our brand evolved as well. It wasn't intentional, but at some point, Shannon picked up a copy of franchising for dummies. - Does she know that about me, Paul? How did I tell you that? - No, I got to find my copy. I think it's right here, honestly. Ron came home from Barnes and Noble with franchise for dummies and a franchise Bible. - I'm really glad. - Okay, see you three days. - I have the franchise Bible now, but I did not have that. I did do franchising for dummies. So I need to meet Ron. I know you and I know each other, but. - He is a complete opposite of me. As I said, my best friend, I love him to death. Love each other and fight. I'm just like strategic, focused German, and he's this wild, crazy, awesome entrepreneurial Italian. So it's a match made to have it really is. And our wives complement us so well. It's really never would have asked or imagined such a rich, deep life we have together. - Let me ask that because you know you're talking about family, you're talking about friends, and I know that you're big on family because we're friends and balanced. - Number one, you just can't take yourself so freaking seriously. Like, okay, come on, like being humble and just going, I don't know how to do that. It's actually a franchise. When you're looking for franchisees and if they ask you a question, like, hey, tell me about your marketing plan and you make up something, you know, and then they see through it. And you're like, you know what? Our marketing is very average right now or whatever it is. - But we're working on it and we're hiring people and then you just seem relatable and just stop pretending you have it all together because none of us really do at the end of the day and people want to be around real, genuine, authentic leaders. They don't want to be around people who, you know, pretend they do because you'll be found out eventually. And for me personally, I'm not the brightest ball with the drawer. I can't live two different lives. So if we're doing this fun thing you guys do now, I'm the same way as I'm going to be, you know, this weekend with friends. It's easier that way. And so I think franchisees do see through that. Just be the same guy and honestly, you rest better when you're just that same person all the time. - Absolutely. And at the same time, Paul, I was watching a TikTok video that you were on and you said I didn't get up today to be average. - Oh my god. - Oh. - Oh. - Yeah. Well, did you say that? - Exactly. - I do, I say it all the time. - Yeah. - So I was on TikTok. - It was on TikTok, but I did not get up today to be average, which I absolutely loved. And I would love to hear from your perspective. Where does that mindset come from? - Yeah, it's a little scary, Tracy. You found me on TikTok, but yeah, I was an athlete as a young man. So I was a really accomplished golfer and played in high school and college and, you know, just striving for excellence all the time and it led into where when I was working as well. I just, I don't want to put my name on something. I don't want to put my head on my pillow at night knowing that it was just kind of average. You know, not perfect. Everybody gets stuck on being perfect. I'm like, I, you're not going to be perfect. Can you just get up and go after and give it your best? But at the end of the day, giving it your best doesn't always get the results that you want. It's kind of like life. But giving it your best and put your head on your pillow and go, you know what, I give my best. And the results are going to be successful or we're going to fail. It's really not up to me at the end of the day. You know, there's too many factors in life and business, you know. And so to me, it's been a very loose, like I'm just gripping that steering wheel very loose when I say excellence. And I want to surround myself with excellent people. To me, they kind of coldly up, like even as a young leader, I always wanted to be around people like two or four times have headed me in business or in sports or whatever. I want to hang around these people. And so, yeah, that kind of, that's kind of what drives me and drives our team is we want to be excellent. But also at the same time, this career, this business, it's like my fourth highest priority in my life. So, faith is number one for me. Other is number two. My kids are number three. And now I'm a grandpa, which is pretty awesome. So that's part of the equation. And then my calling and my work and my vocation, that's number four. And so, that's not something I keep internal as something I talk to my family about is something I talk to my good buddies about. So when I don't have that balance for a lot of, a lot of leaders like yourselves work becomes number one. And so, if something around you knows what your priorities are, then they'll be like, Hey, Tracy, that talked to you because you haven't been on vacation in seven years. And I think you should probably go away. And so, I don't that that answers your question, Tracy. But that's that's a little bit about the way I look at it. Yeah. Well, it sounds like, I mean, you take all of those four things seriously, but you don't take yourself too seriously. You know, and I think giving yourself permission to to model that type of behavior like I'm going to one vacation, I'm going to prioritize my family. I think that's difficult for a lot of people to do. Myself included is to to find that balance. So I think the fact that you were able to articulate it. So clearly without any thought is just like, obviously, that's how you live your life. Yeah, it's been interesting because we're all a doers and excellent at what we do. But to me, the mark of the leader is someone who leads an organization or a department and the organization runs just as well or better when they're not there. And now I talked a lot of leaders about that. And they're like, well, if I'm not here, what's my value? And I'm like, well, that's a deeper question. What's your value? But if you have to do it, and you have to be the one that has to do it every day, and then you can't even leave early or go coach little league or something, I don't think you're running a very good organization. You know, actually, I was my team. I just had a quarterly conversation, quarterly review with our CEO, who's another one of my best friends. And I hope he doesn't get mad when I share this with him. But I told him I said, Craig, we've had a lot of conversations. And this is about the 10th time I've told you direct orders from me and our owners is you need to take a two week vacation in a row. Like not take 10 days off. You need to take a two week vacation. And I don't care where you go. You don't have to go anywhere, but you're not coming here. What that does for a leader is it, if you know you're going to be gone for two weeks, well, you've got to, you got to lead your team. You got to prepare. You got to talk about contingencies. You got to talk about if this happens, do this. And so to me, taking time off has always led to better leadership. And that's just my experience. Well, I would 100% agree. But I think it's very difficult. A lot of our brands are emerging brands. So they are they've been in it for 20 years. They've been in it for 20 minutes. You know, and this conversation, it comes up a lot in my coaching role because they come to me. And when I talk to them about their outcomes about working with me, oftentimes it comes up. I would like to take a vacation. Can you help me figure out how to take a vacation? So, you know, I know for me, I worked every vacation until I think I had been franchising for 12 years, until I was going to go on a vacation with my spouse after he had been diagnosed with cancer. And I'm like, I want to honor him with my presence. Because before it was like working in the vacation around work. And this was, you know, even before Zoom and all of that, I was still figuring out a way to work on vacation versus figuring out a way to vacation on vacation. And so it took a really long time for me to learn that was there a time like, did you come into your franchise role? And that was just automatic or did it take some time for you to get there? And at what point did you get to that place where you could be gone and not have to worry about what was going on in the brand? I don't know. I've never gone and not worrying. So that's different than like, hey, you're not calling me. And I trust you to make this decision. Yeah. That's different. But as you're saying that, I was thinking about that dynamic that we build and have, I'm a big proponent of having a business partner. And, you know, a lot of people are, and that's ego. You got to deal with that. If you, you know, if you sink your, the gift to everything, then you can't help it. I've got a little ego in me. I'll be too depressed. I'm very, I'm an expert at it because I am an expert in myself. I'm a huge ego. But to have a partner, though, would gives me the opportunity to take time off. Yeah. And so, but I had one of my mentors tell me recently, you know, he's like, I like to say you're really, you're really busy, Paul. But I think the word is you're just very scheduled. And I'm like, yeah, I'm, you're right. I don't feel very busy. I just feel very scheduled. My schedule could be date night with my wife. It could be, you know, as coach in a lot of my son's baseball. It could be, you know, we're going on family vacation. But if I don't get the schedule down, I don't get to do those things, you know, and so for a leader, I think you need to be very scheduled because I just can't drop everything and go on vacation. But I need to plan for it. Okay, I've got a vacation in September. I mean, right now, my wife and I are working on a trip in October. I'm okay. We're taking a week off. And so I've got to get that planned. And what's going on? I've got our owner's conference. I've got franchise training. I got to work around these things. So, to me, it's just more about me is even we were. emerging young brand, it was just me, Ron, and a couple people. We took a vacation every year, and now we couldn't afford much. It was like camping. We went camping for a week, you know, slept on the ground. That was our vacation. I would like to say I took a vacation, but I really just worked somewhere else. You know, I was gone from the office, but I worked somewhere else. So I remember a lot of calls and, you know, on vacation, taking calls and, but that's what I've been striving for is that that place where I'm working on vacation. I'd like to say it's somewhere I visit. It's just not where I live. Like I might have to take a call, but I don't live in that zone. Or I'm going to do work from the beach. No, no, I'm going to the beach. I'm with my family. Please, please, please. I trust you. Makes these decisions. Yeah. And if I don't trust that person, I make that decision. That looks at my leadership, because I must not be leading very well, because I don't trust the people around me. In order to do that, Paul, like one of the fundamental pieces is that you have to build a team, right? And I always say that you can go faster by yourself, but you're always going to go further with a team. And so tell us a little bit about like what does that team look like for you? Perhaps even in the early days, because that Shannon said a lot of our listeners are in that emerging brand space. So it's like, what's that first hire? Like how did you kind of scale the business to where you are today? Yeah. A lot of it was looking into the future. So when we had one location, I was like, okay, let's act and behave like we have 10. Okay. And I'll talk to other, I mean, I was mentioned by a lot of franchise or when the emerging franchise or conference, I would ask someone, you're where I'm trying to get, what does that look like? What your org chart looked like? How many people do you have? Who's doing marketing? Do people do cross training and that kind of thing? So I was always looking ahead like that. And then just on a personal stamp for us, we just had to learn to live on not a lot of income. So we had to keep our personal expenses down so that I could afford to bring in somebody. You know, and I'm almost embarrassed. Like I almost look back and go, how in the world did we live on that meager little salary for 10 years? But I look back and go, if I wouldn't have done that, then I couldn't have afforded these people. Like we were making money, but if we were to spend them on this lifestyle, it would have stopped our growth. Because we couldn't have afforded to hire these brilliant people like April and Jackie and Craig and, you know, these types of people. So as an emerging franchise, or I tell you that you guys, you got to scale back your personal lifestyle for a while. So your sales is not a big difference. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I think that's what people don't see, right? Like you always see like where people are not where they came from. Thank you for bringing that up. Yeah. You know, I know Paul right before this, I was like, where did we meet? And now I remember. So we were on the emerging franchise or task force together. Oh, yeah. Yeah. That is where we met. And you were attending that emerging franchise or conference as a young emerging brand. And this past emerging franchise or conference, you were on the stage. Who were you on the stage with with Gordon? Uh, with Gordon Logan, yeah. From sports clips. From sports clips. Yeah. Like just a mentor of mine for sure. Right. But look where you are. I think, you know, they ask you to do that because you do mentor others and you do enjoy coaching others. And you are giving back with your time and your talent. And I know we were talking about the team and how you got to where you are. Can you talk to us a little bit about? I know because I know you. I know you are a fan of EOS. At what point did you guys start implementing EOS? And why did you choose EOS as a as a system of framework? You know, we had about 25 or 30 units open operational. We were at our owners meeting and I had one of my favorite franchise owners. Follow me aside in love. And he said, Hey, you guys need some help. Like we love you. We love what we do. You just need some help. And we needed more executive leadership. We're both like entrepreneurial, you know, your typical college dropouts, wing in a prayer, bigger this thing out, boots, trap grinders. That's Ron and I exactly need some guys who've led organizations and into the next level. And typical visionary entrepreneur founder were terrible at holding people accountable. Like we can never fire somebody like. And I remember one of our franchise owners is actually she worked for still does do some consulting for McDonald's. She's with McDonald's for 20 years and she tells the story. I don't know if it's true or not, but early in the McDonald's phase, when they were just starting to franchise instead of firing employees, they were like, Granima franchise. Like, Hey, where are you going to give you a franchise? I've heard that. I've heard that story too. I think that might be in the founder movie. Okay. That makes sense. Yeah. But that was us. We're like, okay. And so we need people to hold people accountable with love. So that started then. So we started to bring on some good executive leadership. The ones that we could afford. And it was about seven years ago where a friend, another franchise owner said, Hey, by the way, we have a consultant that helps us, you know, and it's a dynamic. When you're working with your best friend, our wives are best friends. Like we do life together. We vacation together. Yeah, my son gets married this week. Ron's two of his boys are in my son's wedding. Not because we told him to, but because those are his friends and his peers. And so we really, what it came to is we needed someone from the outside to come in and talk to us. Yeah, it's like we're two brothers. It's like when you're trying to help your friend and your brother get better. And he's trying to help me. You know, your first inclination isn't to go. Oh. Yeah, tell me, Ron, tell me what you think I should do differently. You're as a couple of guys, you're like, we want to fight and argue. And but now the third person is going to tell us what to do. It really made a difference. Having someone look at our business and our leadership from the outside. And so I spent about two years looking at different systems. And it got down to scaling up in EOS. And we found a great implementer here in Phoenix. And we're five, almost six years into it. And I will not be part of a company that doesn't run on EOS. And it's actually one of our big long term visions for our company is that we want every ownership group running on EOS principles. I don't mean they have to have a coach, but they're running on the principles and the cadence and the schedule and the meeting also. And so I'm a huge fan. I think people think I get paid by EOS. But if I see Gina Wickman someday, I'm going to give him a hug and kiss and pack a lumbar sandwich. I'm a huge fan. We are also huge fans. And we talk a lot about EOS and EOS for those who are not familiar. It stands for the entrepreneurial operating system. But essentially a framework so that you know, you can write people, write seeds and then just have at the cadence of meetings and all the things. So we also drink from the same cool aid. And I agree you can you can totally tell there's a difference between organizations that run on EOS and those who don't. I think how reactionary we lived for so many years. And when we started implementing EOS and it was it was a big expense for our budget. Oh my God. But I wish I would have done it 10 years earlier because the investment was absolutely worth the value. I mean, it has paid itself off in spades. And yeah, I wouldn't go back. And I think some of the downstream effect is I think organizations can attract better leaders when you have this system. I know it's very scary because I, you know, I had a unique background in my 20s. I worked for big huge private equity firms that owned an operating golf course and I worked for small entrepreneurs. And honestly, the small entrepreneur visionaries guys scared me to death because like me, they're all over the place. And so I think we had a hard time attracting really quality talent because we were just too volatile. And you know, the wind blew this way we went that way, the wind blew that way we did this. We're emotional decisions. And so now when you follow the system, you can't make those decisions like that. You can't be that reactionary. And I looked around our office today and I, man, I put our team up against anybody. I don't care who you are. These guys are some of the most talented and they're looking for that stability, that focus, that vision, that calm. And also they want to kick butt like we're, you know, again, you said earlier Tracy, I don't want to be average. These people around me don't want to be average. And I think when you have a great operating system, it attracts great talent to absolutely. So you are going back to the beginning. I think we said 170 locations and 14. And so, you know, Tracy and I have never franchised internationally. I take that back. We were in Canada for five years and it did not go well because I did not have the capital to put towards, you know, the strategy to make it go well. And but that's, we've never really done international franchising well. Can you kind of talk to us about what led you into that? Was that before you implemented EOS or was it after? Yeah, it was certainly before our, our tenth location in our whole system was in Kuwait city. And yeah, it wasn't on purpose. Like a lot of things we do in business. It wasn't like we have just planned and we wrote it up and we said, okay, let's find a franchisee in Kuwait city. But they called us again. like, hey, we want to bring this to our community. And so they flew out and met with this, they flew out and met with this again. And, you know, Ron and I, we love people. And so we love these people and their passion for business and building a business in their community. And we said, okay, all right, why not? And so that started us into Kuwait city, which then now that that franchisees our master developer. So she oversees all the golf regions. So we have locations down in Saudi, Oman, Doha, Qatar, Beirut, Istanbul, Dubai, Abu Dhabi, and she oversees all that. And I'm so glad we did it because my Arab friends are absolutely some of my favorite people in the world. They've just changed my life and changed my family's lives. And so our kids have been to the Middle East. We go, you know, probably every other year. We're actually hosting a franchise owner roundtable in Riyadh, Saudi Arabia and February. Wow. And we'll probably have 60 people there. Wow. Probably 40 of them from the US will meet there and will tour the desert and this beautiful city of Riyadh and other master franchise franchise. Yeah, we have a, we have a master franchise franchise or for Southeast Asia. She oversees high land, Vietnam, and moving into Singapore and Malaysia. And then we have a master developer for Latin America. So they oversee our operations in Mexico, Panama, and moving further south into Argentina, Brazil. I know you're super strategic, but this does not sound like it was strategic. Your initial international would you, you know, would you go back and do it like that? Or do you think it's been more difficult like having most of your locations in other countries versus having most of your locations in the US? Yeah, that's a, that's a tough one, Shannon. We were supposed to do that. And I love it, you know, for the people, the business, all of them are still in business. They're serving their communities, their building lives and, and wells. Maybe you're a differentiator, you know, when people are looking at your brand and I know you have a lot, because you and I've had a conversation around this, you have a lot of people who are buying their second location. And they're, you know, when you have that in a brand that says a lot about the brand, like they own one and they want to own another. And these are not low investments, right? And I think you even told me that some of your franchise franchises are approached by private equity themselves, which is a whole nother. We could have a whole nother podcast on that. So, and that does not really happen in our brand. Our franchise owners are not being approached by private equity, just because the yet. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. If anyone, it would be John Penace, right? Our number one franchise owner. He's also my husband. I love that. So, we've talked about team, we've talked about the framework of EOS. The last thing I want to touch on is culture. And so, one thing that really stood out to me as I was preparing for this conversation about aquatats is the way that you lead with heart. And so, on your website, it says whether moving through swim levels or building a business, we are committed to treating all people with the same intentional care and support that we offer to our swim school families and franchise owners. And I just think that's such a powerful statement. How does that show up in the way you lead Paul on a daily basis? Well, I kind of said really interesting. If you shake it, people will see through it. If you really care about people they'll know, it doesn't mean we agree. Those are different, right? And I've often said I prefer clarity over agreement. And, you know, to be clear with someone is being loving. I mean, clarity is kind of, so I think Brane Brown said that. Yeah. And so, what I said earlier too, is we want to do things with excellence and want to do it with values. And that's a little little hard in our culture. I think sometimes today to do things and win with and then also have values on the end of it. But I think holding our people accountable, clear, sustainable goals. And then look at yourself. I've always looked at it. If my team and my businesses and running the way I wanted to, there's no one else that I should talk to, but look in the mirror. And, you know, too many times I'm around leaders and you step in on toes. You're stepping on toes. Oh, man. I don't know if any franchise you will look at ever listen to this, but I was so determined one year to give out a tool at our franchise forum. The best leadership tool you're ever going to get. And I was going to hand them out. I don't know. I was going to do something like tape them under their chair or do something fun with it. But they're in a pull them all out. And that tool is a mirror. And, man, if you look at it and you say they and him and her as opposed to me. And that's to me, that's that's the true authentic leader. I love sports. So you're around some great coaches. And if you ever notice a great coach, when the team wins, what is he or she do? The team did it. The team, man, they did this whole thing. And when they lose, the coach says, yeah, that was me. We had a bad game. Yeah. And too many times I'm talking about leaders who well, that person and they didn't follow through. I'm like, yeah, I'm pretty good chance. They didn't have clear goals. They're guidelines. You weren't following up with them. You weren't holding them accountable. Every time I do that, the mirror comes right back up. But okay, I need to learn. And that's why we have a core value. We give grace to those who were teachable. And so, and I say this to potential franchise owners to all of our teams. That's really good. That's really good. We give grace to those who are teachable. Wow. So in now, if you're not teachable, guess what? You get no grace. You get no grace. No soup for you. You're out of here. And so for me, personally, you know, I want to be a lifelong learner. I want to still be reading business books, going to conferences, learning. Those are some of my mentors. Just why I got a chance to hang around Gordon loaded and he's going to conferences and doing his learning and talking to me. I ask him me questions about my business. And so I want to be around leaders that way. And that, so when you're learning and growing, I mean, you're teachable, you're humble. And so we think there should be grace for that if you're trying to get better. And again, now arrogance, let's say I don't read books. I've got it all figured out. No one can tell me what to do. Okay, you're out of here. Like you can't even be around it. Tracey, I want to say something about you, Tracey. So when when Tracey was a franchisee in our brand, she had a coach and she was our number one franchise owner and she had a coach and she was learning and she was teaching others what she was learning and she was teaching me to be a lifelong learner. And so, you know, Tracey, I don't even know if I've ever told you that that you were an inspiration. I'm kind of getting teary over this. You know, when you model good behavior, like that absolutely helps others know that it's okay for them to want to continue to learn and it shows people, you know, what's possible. Well, and I still have a coach. I think that's, you know, back to your example with being an athlete. I think the best athletes in the world have really strong solid coaches every single day helping them just those small little improvements. And we say that to our franchise owners all the time is our goal is to get 1% better every day. It's not that perfection and, you know, I just love how we started this conversation about like our goal is not to be average. And likewise, our goal is not to be perfect because we need to continue to grow. So you're definitely the type of leader that I would follow any day of the week. Paul, because your hungry humble and smart. And I think that that's really the key. You can't be a good leader if you don't have followers. So yeah, I could point. Yeah. Thank you so much. That's good. Yeah. I think the last thing I would say about that about, you know, when we started the franchise, we had a consultant. And just as much as we get forward, I think it was like, you know, $500 a day or something. I was like, Oh my gosh, how are we going to afford that? And they asked us, well, what are your core values? And we're like, I don't know. Like we were like dumb fatter. So you need core values and you need a mission statement. Okay. And now every business has a core values and mission statement. There's just so that's not the differentiator is if you have these things, what we're pursuing every day and I tell franchise owners this, I tell our staff this, is, hey, these are our values that we're going to live by. That means they're my values too. And that means I'm going to live by them. You can talk to me about when I violated the values. And I've had franchisees call me. It's amen. And we have a core value. We're in a praising public and correcting private. So they call me separately in private and say, I want to tell you about, you know, you didn't first seek to understand before being understood as one of our core values or, hey, you say you choose relationships over profits, but I didn't see that example. And so it's important as a leader that these aren't your values that you're like the value cop making sure everybody's obeying the values, but you're out there. I've been around a lot of leaders right there doing their own thing with their values, but they want you to be part of the values. And I just think it's easier to your values. I think you all get to be working on it at the same time and be accountable to them. And I've just been around a lot of leaders who don't don't do that. And I just, I'm gonna get up every day not to be perfect to your point. trace that we talked about, but just to be excellent. And I'm pursuing that. And when I stub my toe and skin my knee, I'm going to ask people to forgive me. And I'm going to ask them if we can move on, but not trying to be perfect. I love this so much. This whole conversation. And we could talk for probably another hour, but I know you have a hard stop. And I have a hard stop as well. But we want to absolutely get to our rapid fire questions that we do at the end of every podcast. And so are you ready for the rapid fire questions? I am ready. I have to proud because rapid fire is not my middleman. Rapid fire. What is one leadership book or podcast that you would recommend to other people in the franchising space? Yeah, the foundation of EOS is traction. So if you haven't been there, start there. Get your lead team to read it and dive in. I know you mentioned Gina Wickman earlier. So Gina Wickman is the author and one of the co-founders. I think with Don Tinney. And so absolutely a great book. I read it and then I listened to it on Audible and then I didn't do it for a really long time. But then we finally put it into practice. And I wish I would have done it way earlier. So really good recommendation. Okay. Number two, what's one piece of advice you'd give to a new franchise or? I would tell them, think long term. If you're thinking five years and sell the private equity, it's not going to happen. Eight, ten years, fifteen years. And then taking that, look at who you're awarding franchises to. Number one, award them a franchise. Don't sell them a franchise. Yes, good. And then you see yourself working with these people in ten years. And if you can't then just don't award them a franchise. Yeah, really, really good. Good advice. Okay. For the third and final question, this is a hard one. For franchise leaders who want to learn more about aquatots or connect with you, how can they reach out? Yeah, they can go to my space page. I'm on my space. You're a link to it. You're a link to it. You're a link to it. We just went out of business, right? Yes. Yeah, you can go to it and reach me on LinkedIn, Paul Preston. Okay. LinkedIn, Paul Preston with aquatots. Well Paul, this conversation has been anything but average. I think this has been an excellent conversation. I've enjoyed every single minute of it. You have built more than a brand. You have truly built a legacy and your intentionality when it comes to relationships and really that mirror modeling that behavior is such an outstanding example and really what our industry needs more of. So thank you so much for giving generously of your time today. It's been a pleasure being with you. Yeah, thank you. Thank you, Paul. It was such a fun conversation with today's guest, Paul Preston. It's obvious that he's built more than a brand. He has truly built a legacy at aquatots. And in reflecting on our conversation, there are really three things that struck me as to how that happened. Number one, he's been really, really intentional. Secondly, he's focused on building relationships both with franchisees as well as with partners and then third, he has committed to always putting people first. And that's come through in the core values of aquatots and just the really specific things that they've done over the years. So we are grateful to Paul for sharing his story and we're grateful to all of you for continuing to tune in to each and every episode of the franchise leaders forum. So until next time, keep leading, keep learning and let's go. Let's go.