How to create a property from the ground up with Morry (Kamara Cabins)

And welcome to Beyond the Properties. The podcast that brings amazing stories of the people within the vacation property space, no matter whether it's hosts, photographers, content creators, if they go a good story, they'll be on the podcast. Beyond the properties is brought to you by Direct Vacation Bookings. The solution allows you to take Direct Bookings quickly and easily. Not only will we create an amazing Direct Booking website for you, but also maintain it, so you can do what you do best, hosting. Sign up at Direct Vacation Bookings.com to find out more. And with that said, I'm your host, Jared Johnson, and let's get into another amazing episode. Hey guys, welcome to another episode of the podcast. And today I'm super excited to have Mori Kamara on from Kamara Cabins. Mori, how's it going? I don't know right now. Thank you for having me. No, no, the pleasure is mine. Like I said to you before we started recording is I originally came across you through the YouTube video on then, then cabins or then outdoors. And immediately I saw your story and I was like, I need to get this guy on. So I spoke to you and you agreed to come on. So no, it's amazing. For anyone who doesn't know, could you just give us a little quick introduction to you are? Well, quick introduction, as you mentioned earlier, my name is Mori. I'm living in Virginia, more than only from West Africa. And well, actually led you to come across the video is about two years ago, my wife and I decided that we wanted to get into the real estate space. But we decided to actually go into vacation rental. So we decided to build an a frame up in the Shannon Dorf Valley in Virginia. The design we decided to build was by Dan Adors. And in terms of the area which you picked, is that because you lived in the area or was it something where you'd been up to the area and you were like, okay, I like it here? It's because I've been there before and honestly, it was mostly business, like business revenue, as far as the location we chose, it's about an hour and a half out of DC, very soon and drive out there. There's a national park and there's a lot of attractions over there. My wife actually took me there a couple of times. And when we decided that we was going to go to build route, I was like, this is the perfect location for this. Yeah, nice. And I always wondered this because I love A frames, but I always wonder, what was it about picking an a frame compared to just, for example, picking a cap in? Honestly, it's the law of scarcity, right? A frames is like they're very striking when you see it, automatically, you get a response out of it, right? And they kind of invite people to see what's inside. So when we were looking, when we decided we was going to do the vacation into a route, we kind of checked the market to see what was available and really high in the a frame that's not a lot in the beginning. I knew there wasn't anything recently built to the quiet that we built it. So that's honestly that we saw an opportunity there to kind of build that something unique in the market. Oh, for sure. To be honest, so I, we spoke about this briefly. So my parents are from Africa, but I was born in London. And in Europe, we don't really have a lot of a frames. So whenever I see a frames now, because I tend to work with quite a lot of a frame owners, you're right. So I think it's about it that when you look at it immediately, this is something very striking about it. And we'll jump more into about your one, but like you did some really interesting stuff with the way you decorated it as well, like a mix of kind of African cultures and Scandinavian deco. So we'll jump into that. But I think it's like, yeah, definitely check out the video that you did where you broke down kind of you walk through the place and you broke down how much everything cost. Because I think firstly, it was really interesting to find out how much something like that cost, but also the way you decorated and everything was great for sure. Why, or how did you find outdoors? Was it one of those things where you were specifically looking for that? Or like, what was the reason to go with them rather than let's say create something completely from scratch? I was kind of looking online. I knew I kind of wanted to do something unique that that was always what we wanted to do because prior to deciding to build, we was actually looking in the market to see if we can buy something. And honestly, we couldn't find anything that we found that we liked was getting our benefit with cash buyers and everything was just like flying. So I was like, okay, why not build something? It can be exactly what we want. We can generate it exactly to our taste and everything, right? So there are a few companies that was going across one night, but this is very managed. And I didn't feel like it was a very open approach to it. And then I came across a video, there was a guy up in New York that was doing it, and then our doors built. I think his name is Charlie, it's called the Charlie House. I saw the video and then I went on the website and it just seemed like a very small process. You bought a plan. These plans are ready to go. And basically that's why I started it. Okay. Nice. To be honest, I'd like you to love to delve into. So you found the plans, what happens after that? So you find the plans, were you the GC or was there someone you got another, you got someone else in it, a general contractor? I wish I was the GC, but that was, we'll get into that later. So I found a local guy. He was my general contractor, but I was very hands on with everything. And thanks, like thanks to me being so involved, I kind of learned every all the steps of the process. And I'm actually getting ready to do another build, also designed by Dan Rdoers. And this one, I am going to be managing everything from. I would be purchasing the land to the permitting process. I'm going to be like ordering my own materials, everything. Okay. And to delve into why you would have gone as yourself as a general contractor rather than hiring someone, what was some of the reasons, reasons why? The truth is, cost. What I've learned is the building world is not very honest. And what I mean by that is like when, like I mentioned to you, I came across Dan Rdoers from watching the video when this guy was building similar cabs and same plans up in New York, right? And his overall price was like half a million dollars. I was looking at that. All right. I only home. My home was about 35 hundred square feet. And I was looking at the cost of my home. I was like, all right, he got some high end materials and whatnot. But surely you can't, you know, it would price. It didn't make sense to me, right? So when I was kind of getting bizzled and stuck, I got a wide range of bits. It's like some people would literally look at the designer of their house and they had a number in mind already. We said no, no basis in reality. Like I think the house thought I got, I think I ended up getting like eight. One was like four, 50. Okay. Okay. And it was just a wild range. Yes, it was a wild range of numbers and stuff. And as I went through the process, I started like coming to the realization, hey, that people just make a number of, so kind of dick, you know, making numbers of the kind of fit, whatever they, you know, how much they're willing to get paid for the job was, right? So when I bought the plants, what they're not doing, they actually send out a materials list. It's like take off. It's like a rough estimate of how many two by six, like, you know, some of the core materials you need and whatnot. And I started reaching out to some of the number of yards and you know, just trying to get a cost estimate of things and whatnot. And my material cost like ended up, you know, actually lower than what I thought it was going to be. All right. So that's what like if you know, like, I'm just going to put this out there, you probably, you know, this already. So I was able to build my cabin, honestly, from what the general country I was paid, I think was suit 11. And then with the decoration and a bunch of other stuff that kind of went with it over a price, it used to be right under 250, but I did some extra stuff. So right now I'm sitting at 272. Okay. Now, I think it's interesting because in my mind, when I looked at a frames, they always look like really like high quality and everything. And I was like, man, these must be super expensive to me. But then when I watched your video, I found that like, you couldn't have a place that looks super beautiful. And it doesn't need to be like extraordinary prices. And that's why I find it so interesting watching your video because you really go down and break down your like, the land costs this much. This how much it costs for the build. This how much cost for the plans. This how much we cost for like the appliances and all this stuff. So like, it was interesting for me as someone who wants to get into properties being like, okay, cool. It's more reasonable than I thought because your place looks like it could be like half a million more, like just how nice it is. So it's just interesting to know. And yeah, when I came across your videos, it was super interesting. What was the part of the process for you that you found was the most surprising where you were like in a good or a bad way that you were like, okay, cool. Maybe this was easier than I thought or actually, this is more difficult than I thought it would be. Um, the description cost like the whole process. Honestly, I believe I did think that I'd been done for a lot cheaper. My description cost was high. Yep. You know, just getting a lot of stuff. like that was the only real surprise to me about it because when I started diving into like how much material cost and there's a bunch of places once you get plans you can, it's called takeoffs you can kind of send your plans to I think it's 88 lumber I think the 84 lumber, even to your local lumberyard to actually get your frame and cause breakdown or take off for you some places they charge some places they'll just do for you for free. Yep and like I think I'm losing track where I was going with this. Can you give me a question again? Yeah we were talking about some of the stuff that surprised you. Oh yeah okay and the excavation cost was high but I said that I kind of had a good estimate of how much things would be like going into it because the infirm is unique but at the end of the day is the house. The house uses record materials and stuff the only thing I can feel by your tool came will be the framing cost because it's very difficult to get from face to my right. Yeah I think a little cost might be a little high on that but if you get somebody that skilled it's really not that difficult so once I realized it's just a regular house it looked nice but it used a basic material just like any other you know basic drywall metal roofs you know if you want to go down route but once I figured that out nothing was really a surprise for me and I started kind of looking at what was the average cost my framing what's the average cost for that and I had a rule if the national average was about five hours I would not be no more than two dollars extra for it. Okay so so I started the excavation cost I think my excavation cost was four dollars I think it ended up being like 40 grand after that was really hard that that kind of surprises but I said that you know it wasn't a lot of surprises going into the private. And what about what about the land like how did you because I always wondered this like how did you decide like this was the plot of land that you wanted to buy and what state was the land in when you got it because it sounds like you needed to do a bit of work to get it to a place where you could put the bayframe there. So the land we the I actually found a land by the complete look so I went up there to look at a three acre lot that was up on the mountain and as I started taking a drive off them like wow I'm not sure this is kind of the place I want to be. I went out there the road was not very developed so when I got up there I'm looking a lot it was there was a lot of heavy rocks I'm not good this is not a good deal it's gonna cost a lot of money just to get a lot of these rocks out here and on the drive down the mountain I saw like a for sale sign on a piece of land that was actually way more attractive than what I was looking at. The sign looked like I'd been through the fight with a deer was all scratched up and I asked my real time hey is that for sale she was though I actually know the guy that's listening it apparently the lot had been on self for like four years the process they never uploaded no pictures they just listed and moved down to Florida that that was it. Okay. So I called and made all of her right on the spot I was like I'll take a 10 gram cash okay and there's something like I think was like three hours later they got that to me it was fast nice and then so how long was the whole period to get it to a point where like okay cool we're ready to stop building the 8 frame because you said there's a lot of excavation stuff going on. Okay so my process of a lot longer than what an average person can expect right so I bought the land May 2021 that's when I bought the land right. But the land started going through after I purchased the land I purchased the plans right and then there was a think like a two to three months period no no it wasn't even that it was a two two and a half month period and I was just trying to get forth from people right the guy I actually ended up going with to build it I actually met him in middle of June was unique about him is when I met him he actually came out to the lot he didn't take no meeting come here talk to me you know let me give you some numbers here's let me come to the lot I live right close by he came to the lot he looked at it his concern was could he get his equipment up there okay so once we talked about that we got numbers and then the permit process was a bit lengthy you know but the longest part of the whole build on the whole process was probably going to the construction long process yeah the loan process is something getting a construction loan or something I don't wish on anybody because it was very very I feel like it was a very very invasive process and it took a lot it took it took time so I bought a lot in May and we didn't really strike ground until I thought like it bill went all the way until I can January is when we started because not my sub division the subdivision that kind of managed the road that's also one thing I kind of want to put out there if you want to do this right when you're buying land make sure you know the rules of your subdivision especially if you want to do business like look into that before you buy any land because you want to go into a subdivision that's not going to work against you and your business and stress so that kind of worked for me but I had to get them to kind of spend some money to improve the roads I didn't end up paying the roads for the roads myself because it was their responsibility they was kind of last because nobody lived in that second night at mountains so there wasn't maintenance in the roads so there was a two to three month process of me trying to get them to do the right thing which they did saved me a lot of money because I didn't have to work on the roads myself have you been looking to take the right bookings but don't know how or where to get started well look no further than direct vacation bookings your ultimate solution to hassle-free direct bookings we create beautiful direct booking websites that have all the features you need to make taking bookings quick and easy want to allow guests to check availability and book directly through you we got that want to be able to have automated calendar syncing so you don't have to worry about double bookings we got that as well want to be able to sell additional services at checkout so you can make more money and upsell your guests of course and the best thing about it is not only will we create the website for you but will help you maintain it too so you can do what you do best hosting to get a demo contact us at directvacationbookings.com all turnatively you can drop us a DM on Instagram @directvacationbookings and set up a demo today nice and then right so we got the we got ever the rocks out now next step was actually I guess getting all the materials up and starting to build the thing how long did that take in terms of like roughly okay like I said my timeline is not realistic so my builder the guy's like his older think his like close like his 60s one out list 50 to 60 actually you know retirement side he's heading toward retirement okay he told me he lives about 10 minutes away from alive he only took my job because it was close he said he didn't want to do any more big projects but he was willing to take this one on but it was a caveat I did not have in full time he had photo projects he was working on so really my timeline so I never realistic because I think my whole build took about 18 yeah 18 months okay okay but to his credit we never went over ran over budget okay so after the exhibition was done the material started so we started like I think mid-January there was a some snow whatever there was a little bit of a slowdown he he estimated a lot kind of great a little bit and then footers started going in I think around March you put footers in and then it was a part way he was working there was a I think 2 to 3 here where he was primarily full because I'm another project and then after that we the footers was in we did a black work all the way until he put your self the self-floor thing and then there was another three to four weeks like hey I'm not gonna be that much and then I think yeah I think after the self-floor got in I was waiting for a fight a bit and this is a part where sometimes I wish I was my own general time tracker I could I wouldn't got a crew of that to kind of frame the house real quick while he was doing other things and also when you're dealing with banks the bank releases the money and phases and they would not release money until this season's complete that actually ended up working against us because going to 2021 we had that wood prices with sky high and there was a big material they come in on happening so it was taking people longer to get their materials I think it took me five months to get my glass okay for the house and stuff so the issue was like going to like with the bank things like for example we knew it was gonna take a long time to get glass but they wouldn't release the money for us to order the glass ahead of time and since my builder he wasn't this deep pocket of bill he couldn't order those things ahead of time so we have to wait for the money to come so he can order I think that might be one of the benefits of actually going to bigger builder they might just order everything ahead of time and whatnot okay so that was one area for the bill that delayed the process and whatnot okay but honestly I feel like the bill could have been done in six months okay yeah I I think another thing I've been surprised about is how quickly you can kind of build these things I've spoken to other e-frame owners And they can be up, like you said, in six months. Like if you're doing it full time, it goes pretty quickly. So no for sure. And I guess for the next one, the plan is for you to be the general contractor and then to have it to speed up. I'm not sure. Managing everything, putting your teams together, making sure you put your schedules in. Like, there's a guy who's following, he's some of course now. I think he put a whole house up in, I think less than 90 days, I mean, from breaking ground to down. I mean, this is like a whole house. I think it was like 15 to 2000 square feet. So it's possible. The only thing is that if you have your permits and everything in order, and you have your each phase of the job schedule properly, it's very durable. OK, no. It is one of those things where I think there is a range of time that it can be. And I think for your one, it took a little bit longer. But it was interesting what you're talking about about the construction loans and stuff like that, because I guess a lot of people will go with that. They'll go with the construction loan side if they're going to create something completely from scratch. And that's what I was even looking into because I was kind of interested like, OK, cool. What's the ways of doing this? So yeah, no for sure. To talk about the next one, is it going to be in the same area if you bought a separate piece of land to put it on? Or right across the street? OK, OK. So I decided to purchase the most of the lands right around the area. So my goal is just to keep building. Right now, the plan is to build like three more. OK. Not in front, but in different design, different taste for different people. Nice. OK, so the plan is to really, really expand this out and really have it as a big thing is what you're saying. Yeah, I want to have my own little chief come right there on the mountain. And how did this start? So to roll back to the start because you said, you wanted to get into vacation properties. But was there something that kind of came along that you were like, OK, this is the reason I want to get into this space? Absolutely. So I just came back from a deployment. My wife and some friends, they kind of bought the cabin out to go to the Pokernos mountains. So we went out there. We still had this really nice cabin. It wasn't like anything super modern or not, but it was nice. We stayed there. And I was like, hey, guys, how much of this was causing? We was there for like three nights. Just oh, yeah, we kind of rented it for I think it was like 286. And I had 286 and I for this way. I thought it was nice, but all right. And then I always tend to do this things if when I know the address of a place, I would type it into one of the Zillow or Rilter. I want to see you one day, the last cell for how much. And I looked at the property and I sold for I think a couple of years prior for like 86 grand. I was like, wow, this is crazy. And that kind of got a wheel-surning. And we was like for the last day over the week, just talking about we need to get in on this, right? And we didn't talk about it for like a few months after. But then the same property came for cell. I think it was listed for 154. But then I was like, oh, man, we got to buy and then that's when I kind of started looking to the rules. I mean, into the rules of subdivision, the reason why they were selling it, the subdivision had changed their rules where there wasn't allow or install rentals anyway. And that's why the owner's out listed it. And I was like, all right, we got to get in on this. And we kept looking and it was rare when we found and property that we felt I would do well, as a short term rental. But and the rules kind of allowed it. And we didn't have to worry about going down the line like you buy and then a few months later they cancel it. We were looking for places that had other short term rentals in the area. So you know, your interest is going to be protected by your peers and whatnot. Yep, yep. So that's how I started. We switched. I think we made-- there was 11 properties. We kind of bit it all. We lost everyone. OK. And I was like, you know, it's like we kind of have some money to save the other thing we should build. We should build. We should build. And my wife just kind of has it into origin. And she was like, all right, once we lost the last base you're OK, let's go this route. And that's when I started digging into it. And it seems like you're happy with that note because I guess it's interesting. Because you can buy somewhere and it might not be exactly what you're looking for. But it might be a little bit easier to get up and running quick. But on the flip side for your situation, you get to decide how many rooms are, where the bathrooms are, all this stuff. And that you wouldn't do-- or it would be a lot more difficult if you had a property that already exists. All right. It's always in my mind, I don't think I'll ever buy a property straight again. Since, building this one, I got to learn a lot about the development process and whatnot. So for example, the average new home in America, is freshly built. When they list it, it's-- you're giving up 30%. There's about-- I think the last number I checked for Ryan Homes and some of the big builders. The average markup was around 33%. That's all equity. Like, boom. Yeah. You're giving up when you buy a new home, right? So that million dollar home that's being built, is probably cost around $6,000 to maybe $750 to build. OK. But as soon as it's built, that 30% equity is gone. Because basically, they took it and ran with it. And that's the value of your home on its list day. And that's even true when we build a cabin, right? The-- what you're going to call it. On the day, the appraisal prior to and after is the instant equity is like you're giving up right away. So for me, I will always choose to build, especially in a current market. It's most houses you're buying your upside down on them right away. So building-- building-- it might be more time consuming, but you can definitely, definitely save a lot of money. And as soon as you're done, sometimes the $100,000 they cost you to build a house. It might probably have a place for $130 to $150. And that's all yours. And if you want to refinance and pull money out, you don't have to do no financial gymnastics. Because you have all the security available already. So I would definitely, definitely recommend building yourself out going forward. OK. What that's interesting, because that's something I didn't know. Because I always thought the main reason people would do it is because you have complete flexibility about how you do it. But if you're also-- if there's money that you're gaining as well by doing it, it's kind of a win-win. I guess the only downside is that it takes a little bit longer. But like you said, you have the ability to get it done in six months if you want 90 days, if you're really quick with it. So it sounds like a good shout, no, for sure. And then so once the property was made, I want to dive a little bit into the way you decorate stuff. Because like I told you, obviously, my family is from West Africa. But like I immediately looked at it. And it kind of just-- it kind of drove me in. Was the plan always to kind of go with that kind of-- because obviously you're from West Africa to go with that kind of style. But it also matches up super well with the A-frame. And the way you described it was kind of African with like a Scandinavian deck up. So kind of-- Yes. --never been to that a little bit. So when we were starting looking at these high-end A-frame, and when you go on Instagram, you see a whole bunch of them, right? It's-- I feel like you ever been in a place where it's so nice you're afraid to touch anything. Yes, I did that feeling sometimes. And sometimes looking at it as like, it's I love this-- like the minimalism of the Scandinavian design, why not? But sometimes it feels like you don't even want to touch anything. Versus, you know, is like-- in Africa, it's like I grew up in a basically mud hut, right? It's carcass on the floor. That kind of thing is like, these-- I feel like it's out-- out approach to design. I feel like it's more-- also more homely, if you will. So even if you build this, like, if you get a chance to look at how kind of we got two big wooden pillars on the top floor, you know, I just-- the original idea was to kind of put some curtains there, but it's like we ended up going with some like some wood panels. It's like Moroccan. We put it up there. We just went in more wood there. We have like one room that's completely something you'll find in North African-- like, place where a lot of rocks, a lot of-- like, you know, pillars you can sit on, that kind of thing, lamps and stuff. I feel like, you know, it's-- if you're getting to this thing, like, the pigism run to space, right? One, uniqueness, self. You want to be unique, right? Because if you're unique, you're not really competing with the market. Because my regular trend is going to apply to you if you're unique. That's been true since we launched it, right? And also, the design is how far-- I noticed that everything was kind of cookie cutter and credit to my wife. She took-- she really did a design, not professor in the dream, but that lady can design, you know? So she was like, oh, yeah, I got this. So I was just like, you know, I won a lot of African flared. And she took it on real with it, you know? Because it's like some of the ideas that we incorporate is like some of the ideas that she has using out on home. So she actually recently did a living room, [BLANK_AUDIO] beautiful by the way. And basically that's that's what we want to work for is like I think we should kind of impart some of ourselves into our build and it's been very positive the receptionist's gotten from people. No 100% and I think you're right like a lot of places can end up looking very same same and kind of find in a way to differentiate your place from other places but also like you said like to put in parts of yourself so that people when people come to the place they actually get a feeling for who you guys are and yeah I'll definitely tag some pictures and the video which you explain everything on the podcast because I think when you kind of walk through the place and kind of see the pictures you really get more of a feel of what we're what we're talking about. When you got all of the decorations was this you bought in the US or you had to go to Africa and bring them over. My most asked me now because she kind of said hey I can send you some things honestly we thought about it and we decided against that for the sole purpose is it's a business. When you're doing a business everything you put in there like you can't get to attach to anything if it's a business. So we decided to kind of buy everything that we can find here. So let's see Amazon Amazon we got a lot of places there because it's kind of easier to replace things. So yeah we we decided against like going super unique or anything and just making sure things are available because things will break as a business things are going to break they're going to fall apart people are going to get overused you need to replace them so if you go super unique is harder to kind of replace that because your next guests are going to door-respect in a certain experience and you don't want to take away from that because another guest you know ruined something fall down. 100% and this is a good segue to the next part. So the house is done decorate it looks beautiful. What were the thoughts I'm assuming you always thought okay we're going to go Airbnb. How was that process in terms of putting on Airbnb, gang people in the guest experience stuff like that? I heard that the idea was definitely to put on Airbnb. I guess I also thought about you know creating my website and that's coming down the line but being new and getting to the space why not is the Airbnb platform has four more rich than I would ever have with my you know my own website and also it's like recently they kind of came out with like a lot of insurance policies and whatnot that for me of course a lot of money to kind of do that so once I kind of knew those wrath are Airbnb is probably the best place for me until at least you kind of establish yourself more and maybe when I get more properties you know the plan is to build three more you know look in that little area when that's done yeah I'll go my own website right but like from the get go when we kind of looking towards we always decide Airbnb what's the best way to go forward with it. Okay and once you when you put it up was it one of those things where you were getting a lot of people coming in quite early like how was that process because I guess yeah come on come don't mean that good I feel like there's stories here. I mean it was I was going away man um so once we listed it I always said we didn't do because we have an Instagram page we got a lot of people that follow we just plan on doing this all we're gonna start taking advance bookings honestly we had a cold lunch we listed it bone and I think within a month for the rest of the year we was over 90 percent occupied. Wow okay killing it. Like think from now to the end of the year I think there's maybe five nights of it. Okay okay and was there anything particularly that you were doing because you're right you do have an Instagram and that's originally how I I kind of found you guys connected with you in terms of um you know setting this up but um with the Instagram if you've been finding people coming through that or is it mainly being a hundred percent through Airbnb. Oh um it's my god said maybe I've gonna have one person come through Instagram. Okay and Instagram is not you don't do Instagram a lot of people think you do Instagram so you can get people to flow in from Instagram that's not why you do Instagram you do Instagram to get eyes on your property. The more people it's first of what you want eyes on your property all the time because we all know there's algorithms right Airbnb loves property that people are clikin and the more people do your thing the more you know elevator it is going to be. So Instagram is for me it's just so direct more eyes on to it. It's like do I really care if people like both me yeah but I know there's only one person that's actually booked a place that found it on it like Instagram. Okay. Okay. So I but it's holy book that one not but I do know Instagram does drive a lot of traffic to the landing page. Yep. Which I believe kind of bumped it up and put it high. Okay. High on down the list. Yeah. So I was kind of surprised like it's more than I clicked on I was on Airbnb website clicked on a frames and I think I was in the first page or the nation or whatnot. Yeah. I'm not sure that has something to do with where my traffic is coming from but like that was very pleasant to see and I think that's where Instagram really helps out. It kind of get more eyes on your property so the algorithm with you know elevator people are constantly seeing yours. Yeah. No for sure and I think well I think there's multiple reasons I think obviously there's only a certain amount of eight frames in the US but also it's to do with stuff like how many people are clicking on yours because you have really nice pictures how many people are clicking on your listing how many people are wish listing it stuff like that and also how popular is it. It's like like you said you have five days for the rest of the year. When did you guys officially open like when was the first the first month? I think that's what's happened July. Okay. So in fairness it's relatively new and you're saying immediately you kind of saw like a straight just you know. Yeah I think our list is like the first person to stay there was actually a coworker of mine. He had been following the process from the beginning. Yep. It's here. He was like hey man I need these dates. Okay. And the day she wanted considered when we wanted to go live and whatnot and he was a first question to say book it and then from there on it just it just kept coming. Okay nice and is there anything in particular because I always find this interesting and I think this is what people really kind of want to know as well. Is there anything in particular that you've been doing to kind of you know help with customer experience stuff like that like how has that process been because you're kind of you're in the hospitality space as well right. You're doing vacation rentals but like you know making sure people want to keep coming back making sure that you're getting good ratings stuff like that like how's that process been. Well the process been is honestly when I started this is like all right I wanted to be hands on so I do manage it myself put a really good team together as far as like people that clean and do my maintenance and stuff like that and it's like it's crazy it's one family. It's the wife is the cleaner and how daughter-in-law did you be cleaning the son does like mowing the lawn and whatnot and the husband is an electrician and plumber so he does all the other stuff that might come up and whatnot but when we built that like my goal was just to put it as many amenities in it as possible like for example it's some people all your nature don't put TV nope I put a 65 inch big 4K TV right there and in the other room I put in I think it's like it's a 42 inch I put a 42 inch in there one of the bedrooms and upstairs put like a fully functional computer in there and also put a PlayStation 5 in there there's a fireplace and the PlayStation 5 is loaded with 12 bunch of games that I pay you know just make sure when you get in there you can just play you don't have to think about anything make sure there's a massive deck there's a hot tub there's far there's about three functional fireplace there's a there's fireplace in the living room there's a solo stove out back if you want to start a fire back there and out front so it's on a mountain lot but a lot don't exactly fits down the mountain so I'll day this thing where the rocks that we excavated I had to build a kind of build up this big this area and then we put a plug right over there and I put some swinging chairs that look right down the mountain and it's beautiful it's life a couple some why not so I just wanted to put as much amenities there as possible like others and hammock and I'm still thinking about these because I want when people come is just like the more amenities they have it's just the better and I feel like it's an easy ask for whatever price you're actually if you feel like they're getting that value and I think that's about it I don't think I'm doing anything else that's like super unique I am very handsome I'm very responsive and I really like my approach to the thing like for the business is like I don't look at as a money making like I'm trying to make money off of people it's just a care of people and make their needs and that's a bend anybody that stayed on super responsive towards them I never want to my people to feel like oh you know it's about money or anything like that you know it's oh this is yeah this has been hit comes out this is not up to my oh this broke or this is not here you know it's like I've asked situations you know where the new house they've come up where you didn't even know yeah so like once time I had an issue, forgot what it was, why not? You know, she was like, oh my gosh, I think she was, she was gonna, she thought I was gonna say something, I forgot the final detail. Or the matter, hey, I'm sorry that this happened to you, you know what, half of it, why not? And I have somebody come in and it's okay with you to secure that situation with her in an hour. So, for the matter, she's like, oh my goodness, you know, like I just put people first and I think you'll be all right. And that's like, that's been my approach to it. And people have been responsive to it. Nice. And then finally, let's delve into quickly. So, next steps. So you're saying that the plan is to kind of expand out. Have you got timelines in terms of when you want to start the next one, kind of idea about what type of property is? Yeah, we know exactly the design, we have the plans already. We are also working, we're gonna keep working on dinner, they've been very supportive. Yep. Right? There's gonna be another dinner design. And if everything works out perfectly, I think I want to start a great ground around April and May, maybe later, but probably around spring, you know. Okay. Nice. And I guess for you in terms of next steps, the plan is to kind of increase the amount of properties that you have was, you kind of said that it was always the plan. Like, is the plan also to kind of potentially go to other places, because you've got this space, but it seems like you might have the bug for this and you're good at it. So, you know, it sounds like. Yeah. I mean, honestly, yeah, like, expansion going to other places, I mean, it's something I'm willing to do. But right now, it's like, I'm super busy. So I'm working for the online enforcement. Yeah. You know, I'm not gonna say like I work a lot of days, but the days I do work, I work. And my wife is a administrator. She work in the school system and she's way busier than me and whatnot, right? So I think it's a delicate balance and whatnot. If I don't want to like expand just what a single person is spending, I want to spend somewhere aware. I feel like I'm getting good value for what I'm doing, you know? And also, there's something like it's not a stretcher, because right now in Virginia, it's like I have people there, I can go over there and the market is still good for that. So I spend there. I'm not sure I'm gonna stay in the location, I'm going to space forever. Who knows? Maybe I'm going to develop my rounds, start doing more residential homes down the line, but we'll see. But right now, I think at least for the next four years, I'm fully dedicated to building, you know, this unique experience. It's a whole not very good until whatever you're down the line. We don't know. But, just gonna keep learning for now. Wait, it sounds like you're killing it. And honestly and truthfully, when you explain about all the amenities and stuff, I was like, damn, here's another, because I just moved to the States, so I kind of jump around to lock because of work. And I'm like, another place I'm gonna have to go visit. So be ready when you, you'll probably be next year at this point. But at some point, I'm definitely able to come through and see what's going on. I like the sound of the PS5 under. I think you got it on the wall, no? Oh, yeah, it's on the wall right there with a TV and like, so the thing with the A-frame, I want to say this. A-frame's another most practical houses. I would not live in one. Yes, yes, that's what you're talking about. It's just something weird about when you walk in, you can touch a roof. So I was like, okay, I got this massive TV. I got to hang it up up here. So I never find it like this cool remote. I mean, this remote control mount. So you put a TV on it and press a button and kind of flatten the TV. Wanted the war and bring it back out. I don't let my guests have access to that remote. It's probably for the bass. It sounded cool though. You showed it off and it kind of goes in like, yeah, it's cool. Yeah, but you know, that's that's just for me. I don't need no issue with that. Yeah, like, it's just something weird with the walls. You can't hang as many pictures up on one night, but there's nothing like it when you're looking out there though. You can just sit there and look at it. And when you're inside it, it's cool. Yeah, not the most practical house, but it is a cool house nonetheless. Yeah, no, they look stunning. I think it's because they are so unique. It's very rare that you'll see a frame that doesn't look. It looks different and because it looks different, it just looks appealing. So 100%. Well, yeah, I appreciate you coming on for people who want to find you. What is the best way to find you? What's the best way to keep up to date with kind of the builds and what's going on on your side? The best way to find me is like, if you look at our cabinets on Instagram, if you have any questions, I'm very open. I do wish wanted people one day. And if you want to come see out of the cabin, it's, you know, you can find it. Just look up Virginia or just the Shannon Doer anyway, like National Park, you can find it there. And if you want to do your own build, like when I was getting to this space, it's not, there was not a lot of people that was forthcoming with information. Like about basic questions you might have. So I like to be there for people or they'll put all the help information beyond a pay wall. And I understand, you know, like I want to be a consultant. I'm kind of not there right now. If you have any questions like general things and stuff that you're not sure about, you know, reach out to me. I'm more than happy to answer any question you might have about the process. No, I love that. And to be honest, I'll attach the video to the podcast as well. The video which you explained, you break it down accidentally and like really give a proper understanding of like how much stuff costs. What was your reasoning behind doing stuff? So no, really, really good video and yeah, I'm sure you'll get people, people in contact. You might have to start consulting with all the people are going to be running through to kind of, you know, get some information. Well, good. Nice. Well, hey, I really appreciate you coming on and yeah, it's been great. All right. Thank you so much. Thanks. I appreciate that.