How To Be A World Class Communicator Feat. Rory Vaden

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He is the guy, if you see someone with a best selling book or you see somebody speaking on stage or you see somebody in the business or personal development space building a big brand. More than likely, Rory Vaden is their success whisperer. Including me. And so I'm bringing to you somebody who's really helped me in my career that I believe can help you in your career who's also a friend of mine and a wonderful man. Rory Vaden, welcome back. - Thank you brother. I'm just gonna change my bio to say Rory Vaden, Ed Mylet's success whisperer. - That should be, that should be, there's a lot of pressure on you today. So you can lean in here. Number one, we're gonna really talk about business and growing whatever your business is overall. Starting one, how to be better at doing business from someone who's been around about everybody killing it right now and has a big business himself. Secondly, we're gonna talk about building a brand because there's a lot of people that don't even think they should have a brand. What is a brand? Why should I have one? What's that even mean? Does it mean I have to have a big Instagram following or what's branding? And then third, presenting, which I think is the hidden skill that all people in any business, regardless of what they do, need to be better at. The key to my success, if I had to chalk it up to one thing, is my ability to present. And so I wanna talk about all three of those things today, which is gonna be a full hour between you and I. Let's start with the presentation part. We'll just gonna weave them all together as we go. When someone says, "Hey, you should get good at presenting." I think a lot of people think, "Well, why would I need to do that in my business?" So define what presenting means and why do people need to acquire that as a skill and get better at it? Let's talk about what presenting doesn't mean. Okay. People think that presenting means you're standing on a stage with like a slide back and a microphone. Right. The way that we define presenting is moving the audience emotionally. Okay. So I just watched you in an arena. Here we are backstage, right? And you just moved thousands of people emotionally. Now that happened to be on a stage. But if you are a leader, you are trying to get your team to do stuff. You have to move them emotionally. If you are a salesperson, you're trying to get someone to buy something. You need to move them emotionally. If you're a marketer, you have to write, copy, create, creative that moves people emotionally. If you are a parent trying to get your kid to do something different, you have to move people emotionally. So that is the art of presenting. And I think a lot of people don't realize there is so much science to it. But it applies to all of us and we all have to do it. And you know, you're a master and that's part of why you are who you are. I'm glad you defined what it is because it can even be one client walks in. You're presenting. That's an audience, right? If you, and one thing I should tell everybody, I normally don't do this on the show, but I'm going to do it because you've invited me to do it. Rory and I are going to do an event together. This has never been done before. I consider you kind of the mad scientist of presenting. And I think, you know, I'm pretty good at it. So, from an art standpoint, and I'm going to teach people what I know about presenting on stage, presenting one on one, presenting two-year kids, closing sales. But me, I'm going to do stage speaking too. We're going to do some of that boardroom talking, etc. How to do a better interview, how to hire people better, and how to be a better interview-e. And you are putting that event on. It's two days, it's you and I. We should at least let people know we're doing it and where to go to get info. So what's the site? Yeah, so you presentation mastery event.com/ed. Is where you go and we've never done this before. I've never done this before and we're doing it together. So it may be legit a once-in-a-lifetime opportunity. Probably will be once and here's what I will say. I don't really say this. This will be incredible, because you have the two people on the planet that are, you know, this is, we're not good at a lot of things, but these are things we're good at. Amen. So if you want to be a better, let's just call it communicator in any way, this would be the event for you. And I've never taught any of the things I'm going to teach at this event. It's the first time I've ever literally revealed any of the stuff that I do, including even how to do this. Yeah, also, and I know I want to do the interview, but just one thing to mention, because it's like, you know, you've done some stuff that is very expensive. The VIP for this is already sold out, right? There's affordable options for different people. So I just want to mention that to everybody. This is no tactic thing, I mean this sincerely. We have been up one seat of the VIP for this podcast. I'm being serious. This is not some tactic to get someone to be a VIP. I mean, if you want to, I'm working for you here. So it's your show. We're going to do this. So that if someone saw this right now and they jumped on it, they could still go to the VIP. Okay, okay. And by the way, guys, that's not a sale. We'll open one more. My audience knows me better than that. That's the authentic thing that just came up. Okay, let's get back into this. Yeah. When you look at somebody who is good at persuasion or presenting, or this isn't in the list of notes, but I want to ask you this. Is there some characteristic that you see in them? Their ability to move people emotionally? Is there a thing or two that the people that are good at it do, that the people that suffer from not being very good at it don't do? Yeah, well, here's, when I was in graduate school, I remember going and I was, we had like a senior project and we were studying, we went and interviewed the orchestra conductor. Okay. So like, you know, the guy that like stands up there does the symphony thing. And he taught this really important lesson. He said that basically he could change the way the audience was feeling by changing the intensity or the volume at which the symphony was performing and also varying the speed. So basically, everyone thinks that charisma is something you're born with or you're not. And I think we all look at someone like you and go, whoa, like this is, this man is extremely powerful and charismatic, which indeed you are and I do believe you're anointed and you have spiritual gift. But a lot of people don't realize that this whole thing can be learned. So for example, what the conductor was saying is that basically if he were to tell the orchestra to get louder and louder and then they were to make it faster and faster than all of a sudden you'd see people like inch forward in their seats and they start to perk up and they're like, you know, they're engaged and then if you slow the beat way down and you bring the intensity and the volume to a whisper, he would see people lean back in their chairs so much that you could see him fall asleep. And so what the lesson that I took from that was that what he was saying is that a mechanical change in your delivery can actually cause a physiological change in your audience. Audience of 20,000, audience of one. Either, yep. Either, right? I mean, hopefully my guess is there is somebody listening right now that just got goosebumps by going, and here's what's crazy. Like what you say is really important to be a thought leader and expert. You know, you and I have done other episodes on that. But when we talk about this particularly, like it doesn't even matter what I say. So I can be saying a bunch of gibberish, it doesn't matter what I'm saying. I can talk about anything insignificant, but if I change the way, if I increase my intensity and all of a sudden I get louder and louder and then all of a sudden I slow down. You feel something. So there's a lot we can do. I don't think most people realize that this is a skill. I think they think people are born. And by the way, there are a few that are born with it. And I certainly don't have a lot of skills, but one of them was a perclivity to be pretty good at this stuff. Yes. But I've also, through you, learned what I do well. And they become skills. So some of these talents turned out were skills. And you're like, do you know what you do? And I'm like, oh, I didn't realize that I did that. Thank you for pointing that out. You're right. I do do it. I want to say to everybody, because we're going to talk about branding and businesses we go. But this is, you know, a little bit from me. me to all of the audience today. Here's what's not told to you enough. You want to change your life significantly. One of the fastest and best quickest, most effective ways you could do it is be a better communicator. Be a better listener, be a better presenter, be a better talker, be somebody who will help you in your interpersonal relationships, in your marriage, in your family, in your church, in your persuasion, in your ability to learn and grow. It is the needle mover. In fact, well, my kids were, we were raising them. I want them to have their faith. I want them to cement that, that encompasses ethics and all these other things, their morals. I want them to have tremendous work ethic and I want them to be able to communicate. - Amen. - Those were the three things. And I think a lot of people leave their home or are walking around this world with so much more upside potential in their life if they were simply better at communicating their feelings and their thoughts. And that's why I think that what we're talking about here is so important. - Yeah, there's, there are people listening right now who the biggest thing holding them back in their career is not their expertise. It's, it's the fact that nobody knows who they are because they don't present well. So they are, they are the world's best kept secret, right? Like if I don't notice you, I can never know you. So I have to be able to notice you first whether that's getting a promotion or you know, whatever it is. But they, they, they don't present well. They think well. They are smart. They are brilliant. But they are the world's best kept secret or they get overlooked for jobs or they, they miss out on key relationships or, or invites because they don't, they don't articulate and present and communicate well. - I think I'll use a word that'll even frame it a little differently. They don't express themselves well. And so this inability to express how you feel and how you think is holding you back. And so even those of you that are single, even in dating, you know, there could have been a connection there with somebody but your inability to express your feelings or thoughts the way that you wanted to. This is such a huge life skill and it's deteriorated more and more over time because of the media, because of screens. - And AI is making it way worse. - Right point. AI is the compounding effect of making it worse. Your ability to express yourself is so huge in life. By the way, so are a whole bunch of other things. So we'll step out of presenting. We'll get back in there. We'll kind of weave in and out of, this is like a success podcast. I guess is what I would call it today. You have this thing in one of your books. Tell us the book 'cause I don't remember the name of this book, but I want you to, something about the escalators versus the stairs. What book is it and what do you mean by it? - Yeah, so that was from my first book take the stairs, which is part of how I broke through the wall. And it's a very simple, you know, metaphor that we all look for the escalator. We look for the easy thing, the short term thing, the convenient thing. We go, we live in a world of instant gratification. And yet, as I've studied the most successful people, I have nine clients of mine who are billionaires, now private clients. As I'm around them, as you know, we get to be on boards and see all this. You learn that there is no success story ever in any industry, in any geography, in any moment in history, where success is about taking the escalator. Every single successful person takes the stairs metaphorically. - Which means. - They do the things that other people aren't willing to do. They do the things that they don't wanna do. They do, they learn to do things even when they don't feel like doing them. And so, to take the stairs book, my first book, that's, that it's just a physical representation of this internal commitment to wake up and say, I'm going to do things that I know I should be doing even if I don't feel like doing them. And I'm going to do things that other people aren't willing to do. And thereby, you earn your way to success. You deserve it. I'll give you the mantra that I had. By the way, I completely agree. - Yeah, you talk a lot about it. - Talk a lot about it. And I chasing difficult things. Getting up every day and doing the things that you know no one's willing to do is gonna get you the things no one else is gonna get. And how do you get yourself to do it is the key thing. And so, I had this thing I repeated to myself forever, which I think is matters in doing hard things. This is not some bro culture, grind, hustle, culture thing. I'm not that guy. I don't believe in those things. I sold myself that I wouldn't have to do it forever. But if I were willing to do it short-term, I could get freedom in my life. And I used to repeat this to myself over and over, made a post about it the other day on Instagram, got like tons of engagement. Which I've said to myself over and over, do all the things you don't want to do as fast as you can. - Yeah. - So you can do all the things you want to do for as long as you can. - So good. - And I repeated this to myself. - So good. - I sold myself on this isn't forever. This is temporary, but I'm willing to do this in the short term that I don't want to do. So the rest of my life, I can do all the things I want to do. Do all the things you don't want to do as fast as you can. So you can do all the things you want to do for as long as you can. And I'm living proof that that's true. I pretty much with most of my days now, do what I would like to be doing, not everything, but for the most part, because earlier in life, I did a bunch of stuff I didn't want to do. That's the payoff. - Have I ever told you the Buffalo story? - No. - Okay, so this is the story that I built my career on, and it's in Take the Stairs, which I wrote, you know, years ago, but so I grew up in Colorado. And in Colorado, we're world famous for the Rocky Mountains. That's what most people think of, right? So we have the Rocky Mountains. But Colorado, as a state, is divided almost exactly in half. And so we have the Kansas Plains on the other half. Because of that unique topographical landscape, Colorado is one of the only places in the world that has both Buffalo and cows in such close proximity. And there's a great lesson about success to learn from the way that these two animals respond to storms. So when a storm comes, storms always like brew in the west, and then they roll out towards the east. And what cows do instinctively is they can sense that a storm is coming from the west. And so they will try to run away from the storm. So they'll run east. But the problem is, we all know that cows aren't fast. So the storm catches them rather quickly. And instead of out running the storm, they actually run with the storm, which maximizes the amount of pain and time and frustration they experience from the storm, which is so stupid. And yet humans do the exact same thing all the time. We spend so much of our lives trying to avoid difficult choices. And we try to run away from the hard things. And we chase the convenience, not realizing that procrastination is a creditor that charges you interest. So you always pay a price. We either pay the price now today, or you will pay it with interest. The easy life today makes the harder life later on. Now, Buffalo. So Buffalo are different. So what Buffalo do is Buffalo wait for the storm to like cross over the mountaintop. And Buffalo, instead of running east away from the storm, Buffalo run west and they charge into the storm. So they run at the storm. And by running at the storm, they run straight through it. So it's the same storm, but they experience it differently. The Buffalo minimizes the amount of time and pain they experience from that storm. Your life is a perfect example of that. And your philosophy that you're just saying is just the codification of that principle. To go, you figured out early on, somehow, that we call this the pain paradox. Easy short-term choices lead to difficult long-term consequences. Meanwhile, difficult short-term choices lead to easy long-term consequences. We all have problems, but I was raised by a single mom. I was born in a trailer. All I wanted was Air Jordan's. Like, we didn't get Air Jordan's. I had Air Jordan ash. I don't know if you remember, like, famous footwear. And so I have problems today, but they're much different than the ones my mom had. Yeah, by the way, I just, you know, for those of you that on audio, I don't know if you realize it's the right but right when you said trailer, your face changed. It's interesting. When you have any trauma or trauma in your life, it's on your face right now. You can go, it's right there all the time. I think people think, oh, no. I'm so far away from my past. It's right there all the time. It's very, it's right there on your face right now. Well, you said something when you were speaking today at the event and you were just like, you know, out of every pain comes the blessing. And you go, you just gotta be grateful for that. And you need to make sure you get the payoff that God wants to give you. Yeah, if you, you know, the enemy's putting you through the pain. God wants to give you the reward for it on the other side, the lesson, the new relationship, the one, whatever, the one new friendship, the one new insight. And the skill, you get a skill and a character out of it. Yeah, you uncover something about yourself. You didn't know it's revealed to you through that storm. And you're 100% right. By the way, the reason, because I think a lot of people feel this way, I concluded pretty early on. And this is not some false sense of humility. I concluded pretty early on that I was not gifted with tremendous intellect. I'm not dumb, but I don't have extraordinary intellect. I wasn't gifted with any tremendous abilities. Like, there's nothing that special about me. I know people who you immediately see them or you're with them and like, oh, they're special or they're charismatic or they're this. I didn't have any of those things. So my quick conclusion early in life was, I'm gonna have to outwork people. - There you go. - Because I mean that, and I think a lot of people that are listening to us are like me. They suffer with their confidence. They suffer with insecurity. To this day, you joke about four houses or all that. But I still live with me every day. And I still suffer with my insecurities and myself confidence. And like, today is one of the few speeches I've given it a long time. asked how I did, I didn't think was terrible. Like I thought it was actually pretty decent. - It was magical, it was magnetic. - Well, and I appreciate your feedback on that and I accept that you would feel that way. But I'm saying, it's through my insecurity, through my lack of confidence, that has caused me to, I had to choose a path, like look, if I do what everybody else is gonna do, I'm gonna lose, 'cause they're just people smarter and better than me. But what they're not gonna get me on his work, they're not gonna outwork me and they're not gonna out prepare. This episode is sponsored by Roe. A lot of people assume GLP1's cost of fortune and that assumption keeps them from even looking into treatment. Roe helps people find a more affordable path to FDA approved GLP1 treatment. Roe wants to help people lose weight. That's why they have more affordable GLP1 options, whether you're paying with insurance or cash. Roe's free insurance checker makes it easy to see if you're covered for GLP1 injections, just submit your insurance card and Roe handles the rest. No paperwork, no waiting on hold, no confusing phone calls. And if insurance doesn't cover treatment, there are still options. Roe offers the lowest cost, cash pay FDA approved GLP1's, such as daily pills and multi-dose pens. I use products by Roe and you should too. Go to roe.co/mylet to see if you qualify. That's roe.co/mylet to get started on Roe. For side effects of GLP1 medications, including boxed warning, go to roe.co/safety. roe.co/safety. So when I ended up buying the island, we had to do all of our outdoor decorating and I spent a fortune in the first half of the place and I'm like, I don't wanna do this anymore, but I want the best stuff. And that's where Wayfair came in. My wife wanted to get this new garden bed and Wayfair was the place that offered the perfect solution. Wayfair also helps you create a home that stands up to real life with quality products, great value and trusted reviews. Wayfair verified products are hand-vetted by product specialists that use a 10 point quality inspection system. Here's what I could tell you. The stuff is lasted over time. It looks great and I get compliments on it. Shop thousands of products across every style and budget, whether you're trying to refresh your space for fall or transform your space for Halloween. Use filters, custom photos, and reviews to find the right fit for your home. More than 20 million verified five star reviews, 20 million. So transform your space with the pieces that hold up to real life. Join Wayfair rewards today and get 5% back on every purchase. Head to Wayfair.com or shop the Wayfair app for all things home. That's w-a-y-f-a-i-r.com. - And you separate your emotions from those decisions. So let me tell you, so I was talking about my mom. - Yeah. - And by the way, my mom cannot wait to meet you. So I was like, mom, you can't come to the VIP dinner. She's like, I will work, I will serve. So she's gonna be the server at the VIP dinner at my house. 'Cause she's like-- - I have mixed emotions about you're making your mother do that. - I know, it's a little bit, we'll make it easy. But my mom, she put me in martial arts when I was young because she wanted me to learn discipline. And I remember, you know, fighting with her because it wasn't very good at it. And I don't have like a lot of physical ability. You know, like fighter. (laughing) - This is not a shock. - Yeah, yeah, this is, so, you know, I always joke that like, I literally, at 10 years old, I became the youngest black belt in Colorado to ever get beaten up by a girl. (laughing) - Because we're going, it's a true story. And I used to fight with my mom. And I'm like, mom, I hate this. I don't like this. Like, it's so humiliating and I don't enjoy this. And my mom used to say to me, she would say, that's okay, Rory. Enjoying it isn't a requirement of doing it. - Wow, mom. - Enjoying it isn't a requirement of doing it. And I think of, you know, we're talking about here with like speaking and presenting. Some people like, I don't like that, right? I don't want it, you know, I don't like that. And it's like, well, yeah. I didn't like going door to door either. I don't like, there's all sorts of skills that you don't like the first time you're doing it. But it's not, for successful people, the difference, like when you were saying, how do you get yourself to do things you don't want to do? Most people say, they include their emotions as part of the decision making. Do I enjoy this? Do I like this? That's what average people do. That's taking the escalator. What successful people do is they ask themselves, is this necessary? And it doesn't matter how they feel about it. - Very true. - And they separate their emotions. And it's like, well, if it's necessary, then it must be done. That's the take this tears mindset of an ultra performer. - Really good. By the way, I get to meet your mom. She doesn't get to meet me. Especially after hearing that. And I love her son so much. She's clearly a remarkable woman. - She is. - One thing about that, I don't like doing that. When it comes to, let's say speaking, or we're gonna talk about branding next. It's interesting. One time I was playing golf, and I'll never forget this with a group of people. One of the guys in my group was John L. And he's played everywhere. He's a member everywhere. He's won a bunch of club championships. And I said, what's your favorite place? And he goes, my favorite place is wherever I've played really well. If you play good, you like the golf course. - Yeah. - And it's true in life. - That's interesting. - So one of the things that you say, I don't really like doing this. You know what, if you get good at it, you'll like it. So the emotional part of making the decision, even if you don't wanna do it is true. But the other thing is, we genuinely in life like things we're good at. And if we can get you good at something, you'll enjoy doing it. Well, one of those things that, I think I would say that, I mean, the name of your company is Brand Builders. So let's just go there. The first time you were on the podcast, a lot of people did not know who you were. And they went crazy because of a little bit of this topic here, about branding. And I think some people think, I don't need to be a brand or I'm not a brand because I'm a schoolteacher or I'm a, I don't know, a realtor or whatever, which is crazy because in both those cases, what is a brand? And why should somebody listening or watching you and I right now be paying more attention and getting more intentional about it? - Man, this ties to AI, your question about why does it matter, but let's talk about first what it is. And actually, let's start with, again, what it is not. Everyone thinks a brand is, you have to have a social media following, you have to be a podcaster, you gotta write a book, you gotta be a speaker, you gotta be a TikToker, like whatever, that's not what branding is. It's not your logos, not your fonts, it's not your colors. The way that we define personal branding is simply the digitization of your reputation. So asking the question, do I need a brand or saying something like, I don't want to have a brand is completely off? That would be like saying, do I need a reputation? I don't want a reputation. No, no, no, you have one, whether or not, you want one. The question is, is it serving you? Is it the one you want to have? Or have you been intentional about it? And is it enabling you to make more income and more importantly, more impact in the world? Because I think it's kind of like, I heard somebody say recently, this was one of our brand other group clients, he was, he's a fitness coach. And he said, you know, your body, the way you look physically is like a resume. It's a resume that people read without ever talking to you. And so they look at your body and they can learn about you by the way that you look. And I was like, gosh, that's really powerful. Your brand, or when, I think it would be, people would be much better off instead of using the word brand, they should think of the word reputation. Because then they would do online social media better, they would do offline better, they would think about this whole thing better, and they would go, yeah, I better craft, I better be deliberate about my reputation. And you go, what do you have to do to have a great reputation? Everything, right? You have to have great personal character. Like, my pastor told me one time he said, your, our influence will never grow wider than our character runs deep. So your personal brand is not about your followers. It has more to do with your character. It has more to do with how you treat people. It has more to do with your self discipline, your personal respect. And so if you're a school teacher or a parent, a leader, again, a salesperson, or you happen to be a speaker, author, coach, or thought leader, which is like who we work with, that brand builders group, then obviously it matters, but it matters for everybody. - Digitization of your reputation, one of the all-time great quotes on the show, so was that quote earlier about procrastination. Okay, so I hear you, Rory, I have one whether I like it or not. So I might as well be intentional about grooming it, curating it. What should I do? Give me something today. I wanna take a step, I'm listening to this. I've really not gone deep on this idea. Where do I start? What do I do? - Yeah, so. - Some question. - Well, there's a lot of things you could do, right? But one of our other mantras, if you have eluded focus, you get diluted results, right? It's this distraction is a dangerously deceptive saboteur of our goals, like that's why most of us lose. So I wanna talk about brand and reputation at the same time, since we're making the connection. I think you could also think of it as reputation offline and brand online. But the true answer I really think you go, how do I build a reputation? It is so simple, be useful, be useful. You have to be useful to other people, right? I think, I can't believe that I know you. I go, how did I get this relationship? John Gordon is who introduced us, because you happen to be in a season where you needed something and I was like, how can I be useful? I have to, I just have to go be useful. What most of us are doing is going through life being fully self-centered. What do I need who can help me? The people who are winning in reputation and brand are going through life completely the opposite. it. They're going through service centered and how can I help you? How can I be a value to you, right? Like, I'm not going, how can Ed help me be famous? I'm going, how can I help Ed succeed? How can I create income for Ed? How can I reduce complexity? And somehow, I guess that has led to a relationship where, you know, there's value. And that's, I think, people get wrong. So if you're going on social media, you go, what is the strategy? Be useful. Be useful. So that means you can either be entertaining, you can be encouraging, or you can be educational. But it does not mean that the camera that you choose, or the microphone that you use, or the format that you use, I mean, you're, many of your most engaging videos, it's like you in the gym and it's just like just talking to the camera, no editing at all. You got to learn to talk though, which we're going to talk about in a second. You do, right? And people will say that, well, I'm not good on camera. We can teach you how to do that. It's not complicated at all. But before we go to that, one thing I did learn from you, by the time you met me, I was blessed that my brand had gone into like the millions of followers. Yeah. And by the way, you have tremendously helped me. And it is how we forge that relationship. Because by the way, what your usefulness, what it did, is it got me to pay attention to you. And once I paid attention to you, then I went, oh, this is a wonderful man. He loves AJ. He loves his children. He loves Jesus. He cares about me. He's a good person. He's also brilliant. But I would have never known any of that. You're right. If you weren't useful, because it got me to pay attention to you over millions of other people. You provided some value or, or yeah, usefulness to me. But one thing I did learn from you, and this is why I want everyone to lean in on this branding, this digitization of your reputation. Lean in here, everybody. You've proven it doesn't have to be a huge brand to be a useful and effective and profitable brand. Because there's something more important than the size of the brand, which is what? So talk to us about that. This is huge for all of you. Because you go, well, I don't, I'm not going to go from 200 followers to 400,000. Turns out you may not have to. Yeah. So I got to tell you this story happened since we were together last time. We had one of one of our clients said, you know, they were looking at our client roster, right? And it's, you know, Lewis House and Ed Milett and John Maxwell naming Porterfield and Eric Thomas and, you know, Cody Sanchez and Jim Quick and all these amazing people. And one of our, one of our members, one of our brandelters members and our membership said, I don't understand, Rory. Why do these people pay you money when they have so many more followers than you do? It's a great question. It's actually a really good question. And I said, well, one is, you know, we're, we're coaching on very specific things. But I said, it's interesting that which one would you be more impressed by someone who, who made a lot of money from a lot of followers or somebody who could make a lot of money from very few followers? And that's what we have done, right? We have now built two eight figure businesses. We're about to have our third eight figure business, a mission driven press, which is the publishing company we started a few years ago. And it's the way we do it is by serving a more narrow audience in a deeper way. Nailed it. That's right. Say that again. You, you, you, you serve a, a more narrow audience in a deeper way. So everyone is so concerned about the width of their reach. They overlook the depth of their impact. So good. So listen everyone. But we serve. So like if someone, you know, and again, this, this will, I might sound like a jerk here, but I just believe this is true. If someone is a speaker, author, coach or a thought leader, meaning they are an executive or an entrepreneur who wants to be a thought leader, we're going to serve that person better than anyone else in the world. Lots of people have a course on this, a random thing on that. But it's like, we will change your freaking life. We can help you write the book, publish the book, sell the book, hit the bestseller list. We can turn into a speaking career consultant coaching. We give you the funnels. We give you the scripts. We have all the AI bots because we serve a very narrow, very narrow audience in a deep way. And you don't have to be famous to, to, to do that. You also, so you don't need the millions of followers to make millions of dollars. This is the law of AJ, my wife. But you also don't need to, to impact millions of people to make a huge impact. That's right. So, so you know those pieces in your claws that you find yourself wearing like on repeat all the time. 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Now available in Canada and the UK too. That's q-u-i-n-c-e.com/ed. So you know I've been trying to take my health and my morning routine to the next level. IAM8 is the way to simplify your supplement routine finally. Once and for all, 16 supplements replaced 90 ingredients across nine major organ systems in one drink. Five free travel sachets plus 10% off your order. This product is not intended to diagnose, treat, cure, prevent any disease. This is the breakthrough for everybody. I think when we talk about building a brand they go, well, then I'm going to have to be famous and from where I am to fame is probably not happening. Almost some of us with the larger brands almost do a disservice because I've watched this through you and in my own career, I meet people all the time who have what I would consider a deep brand in roofing. Yeah. Or a deep brand in the plumbing business or a deep brand locally in real estate. So they don't have millions of followers, but they've got depth of brand where their content is repetitious. It's gone deep in their following. They are either entertaining, educational, valuable. They have done something to make themselves useful. I get asked pretty much every day for people to be introduced to you, going back to this be useful thing. Every day somebody is like, hey, can you introduce me to Ed? Can you get me on a show? Give me on Lewis's show, whoever the person is. And they say, how much do I have to pay you for you to introduce me to Ed? And I say, you cannot pay me to do that. And I say, I've got good news and bad news for you. The good news is you don't have to pay me. I will introduce you to Ed. I'll introduce you to John Maxwell. I'll introduce you to Eric Thomas. I'll introduce you to any of these people for free under one condition. You have to be able to add as much value to them as they can add to you. If someone can be that useful to you, it's got to be a bilateral exchange. That's part of where the trust happens. I was thinking about that when you talk about be useful to a small number of people, but in a really, really great way. No, I'm glad that you added that because you're really also one relationship away from changing your life. That's one person you're useful to. So someone who was useful to you, there can be an introduction to a broader reach of people by simply being useful to the right person. What I was going to talk about with you is this notion that people have been, what's communication and it's part of branding, but it's part of being a good dad, good mom, good leader, good whatever is the ability to tell a story. Oh, yes. Okay. So I think because this time speaker, presenter, communicator, let's take all that away. If you can tell a story, okay, you are more than likely going to be successful. By the way, if I play golf with you and we spend four and a half hours together and you can tell a couple great stories, we're more than likely going to become friends. I have friends all the time like, where did you meet this guy? I'm like, the golf course, he does, he has nothing to do with this dude cracks me up or he can tell me a story, right? So I want to talk about the ability to tell a story and I want to feed you something you said to me once and this is the type of stuff they would be learning if they went to our event frankly, but a lot of people can't afford can't go. So we're going to give them some of this here on the show. You said to me one time, the reason that you're a good storyteller is this is what you said to me, I don't know if you remember this and I've stolen this from you and repeated it many times. You said, at you tell, I'll mess this up, but it's the way I heard it. You tell me stories with you meanings, meaning I'll be telling a story about me on stage or in a room or one-on-one, but as I'm telling that story, it's got a U meaning. That's a very unique thing. I did it naturally and was unaware that I did it, but it is a skill somebody can learn because sometimes people tell stories like, it was dead or the joke wasn't funny or it didn't connect and they're wondering why it was because it was a me story with a me meaning. Yes. But when you tell a me story with a U meaning, that's very different. elaborate on that. Absolutely, and so actually, so speaking to coaching, I was coached by a gentleman named Craig Valentine, who was the 1999 World Champion of Public Speaking. And he told me, he's the one who taught me, you tell an eye-focused story with a you-focused message. And so that's where that originated from. And that is a huge part of storytelling. And storytelling right now is you better learn this skill because it's the one thing that AI can't do. AI can't tell your story. AI can't share your experiences. And if presenting is all about moving an audience emotionally, stories are the vehicle to do that, so you have to learn this skill. So I do think one tactical skill of telling a great story is asking yourself, so the story is what happened to you. And we can talk about why most stories suck and I'll give you a four-part sequence to tell a great story. But the audience is only really going to care about the story about what's in it for them. And so you have to ask yourself, what was the thing that I learned that is useful to the audience? So the story is my experience. I want to stay in here really quick. We're going to go back and forth. When he's saying audience, can we tell you what I'm thinking? People, oh, Ed's thinking of the 20,000 people on stage. I'm actually thinking of my dad when I was a young man telling me stories that had me meanings. And I've carried the meanings because the story resonated with me. So that my dad's audience, when he says audience, was me, one person. And that's why don't sluff this over. This doesn't apply to me. You bet it does. You've got an audience if you have one human being around you. Keep going. And on that note, if you're leading a team of people, if you teach them techniques, they're less likely to implement. Like they will forget it. But if you tell a story, they will remember the point forever. So you have to have a story and a point. What's the four-part thing to make a great story? I don't want to move off of it. Okay, I can't believe we're going to give this away for free, but let's do this because this is good. To it, please. Okay, most stories suck. And the reason they suck is because people think that a story is about the beginning and the end. But it is not, okay? There are four parts to a story. There is the scene, the struggle, the summit, and then the lesson. The scene, the struggle, the summit, and the lesson. So every story starts with a scene. Think about a movie, right? So the first thing that happens is it's a panning shot of like a city or a farm town or they're setting the scene because you learn more about the characters by knowing where they are and where they are and what choices they make than by describing who they are. So you describe the environment. So any good story starts with the scene. But most people skip from, oh, we went fishing and we caught a huge fish and they skip straight to the summit, which is like the pinnacle because that's what they think a story is. But the summit is not the story. The scene is not the story. The story is the struggle. The struggle is the story. So you know, at the event we'll show this map, but like it starts off emotionally invested low with the scene and then there is this climb of conflict. The climb of conflict is what is the story. It's the tension of two steps towards the goal and one step back. I wanted this to happen and then this happened. I won, you know, and then I, you know, in every romcom follows this. It's like, oh boy, boy spots girl. She's so pretty. But he can't, you know, talk to her. He's so nervous. Then boy spots girl. They have a conversation. She's so cute. But then he finds out she has a boyfriend, right? Oh boy spots girl. Now they broken up. He's got a chance. They go on a date. It's going good. And then his old girlfriend shows up. Right? So it's always two steps forward, one step back. The story, the struggle is the story. The story is in the struggle. And so you only include the elements that pertain to that. What is the objective I want and what are the things blocking me? But you have to, you have to sell, you have to sell or tell the things that are blocking you. And that's by the way, that's also how you sell in marketing. That's also how you sell on a stage. That's also how you, you know, you sell in copyrighting through, through well told stories. Almost wish we weren't doing the event so that I could just, so that it looked like I have no, because it's your event. But I, like I had no, um, dog in the fight because I just believe this is the quickest, best way to change your life. We keep on all these skills, your mindset, your vision, your this, you got to get better at expressing yourself, period, end of story. Like I, I just, it breaks my heart because have you ever had a situation where maybe you've seen this before, somebody didn't get smarter. They didn't get better at their business. They got better at presenting their ideas. And that's what grew their business, whether it be branding or in a boardroom or one-on-one. Have you, you've seen situations like this, right? That's, that's the situation. I see more often. Is it someone didn't get smarter or better what they do? They got better at presenting it. Yeah. And, and, and unfortunately the story, I see more often is I see a really amazing talented people who get overlooked because they can't communicate well. I agree. We're, this happened no kidding this week. So, uh, we are interviewing somebody for a position. She is super qualified, has experience and the whole thing. And I was asking our, our leader who was doing the interview, I said, well, what, what did you think of, of this woman? And, uh, the inner, the hiring managers also female. And she said, you know, she is amazing. She is so smart and so good. She said, my only problem is she cannot look you in the eye. She said the entire interview, her eyes are rolling around. And she said, I, we could hire her to do the job, but the problem is if she was ever talking to one of our clients, like an ed my let, like they would eat her alive because she, she looks like she has no confidence because she can't look you in the eye. And there's so many of these things, Ed, like some of the most simple, tactical things you can do to be a better presenter is don't look people in the eye, look them in the pupil. Like you look people in the pupil and just force yourself to like lock eyes and just, and just sit with them. That will help. The other really tangible, you know, technique that I think anyone can use is, uh, we call it the power pause. And people do not realize how, how that pauses are powerful. And it's, and I can even, I can demonstrate this, right? I can say, hey, Ed pauses are powerful. Or I can say to you, Ed pauses are powerful. Feel the difference? Tactical thing going back to the orchestra conductor. These are tactical things that are, they are skills. Yes, some people have more natural gifts in communicating and presenting, but there are so many tactical things that, you know, I went to the world championship of public speaking twice out of 25,000 contestants, you know, and I was in my early 20s. I had to learn these things and I noticed all of these patterns. There's patterns in how you tell jokes. Like people think that being fun. And this, this by the way was one of my biggest areas because like people are always amazed when they see me on stage because they, you know, they laugh a lot when I'm on stage. But then they meet me in real life and they're like, you are not funny. And I say, I know that's because when I go on stage, I have the time to architect a punch line. And there's, you know, there's four parts of a joke. There's the setup. There's the pause. There's the expectation of what you make people think you're going to say in the punch line. So like, you know, earlier we were talking about, you know, I became the youngest black belt in Colorado. Right? So what happened is I create a setup, which I get your mind moving in a direction. And it's like, Oh, Rory became the youngest black belt in Colorado. Then I pause and I allow your brain to fill in what it, what it's going to say, which is, Oh, that's amazing. Oh, that's so cool. That's so impressive. And then the punch line is the twist to the change in expectation, I say, to ever get beaten up by a girl. And so that is a, that's a formula. And there's just, there's how do they go to the event? Like someone's listening to this. Like, I'm just sitting here going, look, I don't care. I'm going to promote this. How do they go? Where do they go? What's the website for the event? Yeah. So presentation mastery event dot com slash Ed. Okay. Slash one more to presentation mastery event dot com presentation mastery event dot com slash Ed. Yep. And there's like a virtual. There's a virtual one too. Yeah. There's a virtual. I go, because you guys, I know a lot of you were listening to this and you're like, yeah, you know, you're going to be up against people who are good at this. And by the way, if you want to learn to speak on stage, you're going to learn all the things I know how to do to how to close in a boardroom. I've closed sales of companies. I've closed exits. You'll learn how to do all this. But I just want to express you even if you don't, please begin to pursue being better at expression. And that can be even as simple as like today, an example flying out to this event to speak. I, uh, everyone's teasing me, oh, you're flying commercial now again, you're, and of course, but I sat next to this woman today. And you know, like you just instantly sit next to me like, this is going to be a good conversation. I actually had headphones on and took them off. Oh, the universal signal for let's talk. And this woman, she's a Red Sox fan like me. She's coming out here to the game, but it wasn't just that. And you're like, what did you, she's a pharmacist. We don't have the same career in comments. She's not even an entrepreneur. But we, I just, she had the ability to have a conversation. I learned about her dad and her mom and how much she loves the Red Sox and that she just got picked up to do some guest spot on QVC as a call. client presented right, but like, but the point is is like, that was a pleasurable two hour long flight with a wonderful person. Whereas if she couldn't express herself adequately, I would have never known this was a beautiful soul. I would have never known her background. I would have known that she had lost her, you know, a family. I would have, I just, so many of you, I don't think people are getting the best of you. They don't know how amazing you are and how wonderful you are and, and because it's an expression issue. And so some of these things are very tactical, like, I told you, worries the scientist, but also with this event, you're going to get the art form of it for me. And what I think are like more conceptual things that I do that worry can tell you the science of, but I have learned that in my life, it's become a much more, okay, here's what it is. I've had a richer and deeper experience in my life because of my ability to express myself to others. And because I have an ability to express myself to others, I pull out expression from other people. Yes. Like what we're doing right now. And so you don't know what this is causing you forget the money part, forget the closing the deal. A lot of you are like, I want to learn to speak on stage, likely you might let. I'll teach you. Okay. I'm never caught. I'll just make your money back in and I won't talk. I'm 55. I've never taught it. But throwing all of that aside, it's your interpersonal life that there are, there's even, I will go as far as to say that your ability to receive and give love. Yeah. I mean, I think what you're saying is so, so important because there, there is a, there's a payoff here. It's like, imagine if you did feel confident, right? Like, imagine if you could feel confident to talk to people. And I do think with more AI, people are going to, the pendulum is swinging back to like, we want more human connection. We want more interaction. But the deeper part, which I think you're getting at where you said, people aren't getting the best of you, I think that's what this is really about because we're not really having just a physical experience here on earth. We're having a spiritual experience. And the spiritual experience comes from the ability for a soul to recognize the beauty and another soul. And to move, to move each other emotionally and to inspire each other along and to share companionship and to share heartbreak and hardship. But you go through this life with souls and that, bond happens through expression. I agree. I got to say to everybody, forget the event. Let's assume you can't go for a minute, okay? Because a lot of you can't. But I love you. And I love our audience and you know how much shall I get about this. I want your life to be better. And so if you can't get to this, hopefully the show today is helping you. But begin to invest in yourself and maybe it's getting a book or beginning to be more detailed and observing people that you think are good communicators at getting better at this self-expression. Because business is art and science. Life is art and science. But all of it, at the end of the day, you have this yearning to be the greatest expression of you you could be. That's really what you want out of your life. You want to be the greatest expression of you as a child of God, as a parent, as a business person, as a friend. And so your job, more than anything, is to learn to be the best expression of you. And part of that is your ability to express you. And so whether it's this event or you can't do it, just start to work on that part of your life. I regret that the last eight or nine years of doing this show, I haven't spent more time on this until today. Because it's the key to my life, other than my faith, of course. But yet I've really never talked about it. And I've never heard it said this way in any podcast before until today. So I feel so strongly about it. Okay. Last thing I want to ask you about, today's been great again. You always say three or four things on the show that no one's ever said before the people take away and remember and you've done it again today. I want to ask you this about you. Okay. Because you are sort of, you always hold everybody else up. One thing you and I have been because we're doing this event together. I have been, this is about success. Everybody still stay in here to the end. I have been around you more lately. And we've been on group texts more lately and communicating. And when you walked into the green room after I spoke, I said, "Dude, you're busy right now." And to get where you've gotten requires a lot of work. And you're a very busy person. In fact, when I met you, you were busy. But you're really busy right now. You're building a big company, multiple companies. I wonder if someone leaned in. You're born in a trailer, single mom. You worked a lot, Rory. Right. I'm wondering, an honest answer and give the good and the bad here, is it worth everything that has to be sacrificed? And do you wrestle with this in order to be where you are? Because most people, their picture is like, "I want to be on that seat some day on Ed's show." Or, "I want at least being the seat I belong in in my life." And it requires a lot of this work thing we're talking about here. More than most people, I'm on group texts with you, where you're getting back to people at, I'm being honest, like, 10, 30 at night and a weeknight. And I'm wondering if you are wrestling with that. And what you would say to somebody who's in the hunt right now, they're in that part of life where they are paying the price, but they're not getting the reward. Is it worth it? Yes, it absolutely is. But let me, it is now. There were some things that I messed up along the way. And I think, when I look at my life, because I came from little, my initial drive was ambition. I wanted success. I wanted the world championship trophy. I wanted to be a New York Times bestselling author. I wanted to have money to buy box cereal instead of the crappy, bagged, stale cereal that I grew up on. Right? And then I got some of those things. I worked really hard and I got some of those things. And then it was like, man, I sacrificed a lot for those things. And that was really great. And so then I think at some point, my motivation evolved from ambition to competition. And it was like, well, now I want to be number one. Now I'm going to be the best. Now I'm going to be better than anyone's ever seen. And I worked really, really hard for that. And that pushes for a while. And there's good things that also come out of that. But one of the things that AJ and I wrote in our recent book together, we co-authored a book, was that for us, peace is the new profit. And where we really had a turning point was when we separated from our former company, we had an exit. And we designed Brand Builders Group from the ground up to not be about ambition or competition, but about mission. And the reason that I respond and do things now is because I am genuinely driven by the mission of helping other people. I get so excited when one of my clients succeeds. I get so excited when my kids succeed. I get so excited when we're able to give a raise to one of our employees. There's nothing like the feeling you get when you help someone else succeed. And you know, you did a, you did a, a bit on a YouTube video long time ago. I don't know if you remember this, but you were talking about eating a steak. And you were saying that you could, you could eat a bite of steak and you could both be so satiated and happy as you're eating it, but also insatiably wanting more. Blissfully dissatisfied. And that, when I think when you give your life to mission, that's what happens. Ambition and competition can lead you to healthy places, but they can also lead you to unhealthy places along the way. But when you're just there to, to serve, and it's like, I won't serve someone at the expense of my family. So if I'm responding at 10, it's probably because I got the kids down. They're asleep and my wife is asleep. And now I have, that's exactly what you told me in the green room. That was because I finally got the kids down to sleep. Yeah, it was family first. So I won't, I won't compromise that, you know, but there are seasons where you, you do have to make some trade-offs, right? I mean, today is the Saturday, you know, it's, it's, this is, I'm missing out on a family day. And you, you make, you make some calculated decisions. But at the end of life, you go, you, you, you tell, sorry, when you talk about your dad or it's like, you're not taking your trophies, you're not taking your money and you're not earning your way into heaven. But you said something today on stage that I've never heard you say or not quite like you did. You said, you're not going to earn your way into heaven. But you sure are going to earn the line of people who are there waiting to greet you when you arrive. Thank you. And that really touched me. Good. And, and so, yeah, there's, there's, there's a great answer, Roy. There's sacrifices. But it's, is it worth it? Yeah, it's worth it, not because of what you get, but because of what you get to help create and other people. Yeah, you really do live that, by the way. And, and, by the way, even at this event, even being on the podcast, I said, hey, can you do it? You said I got to check with AJ. It's the first thing you said. That was a great, honest answer. This was a great honest podcast. I think you're coming back for a fourth time. All right. Let's do it. I think you made the, presentation mastery event.com/ed. Yes. Check it out. And if you can't get to it, just start to work and read a little bit more about your self expression, the ability to express yourself for that's a stage of 20,000. You want to learn that or sitting there on your first date with somebody or with your babies, your kids, Rory, you're awesome. Thank you for today. This was a 10 out of 10 again. I love you, brother. Love you. Guys, I don't think I have to ask you to share this one. I think I know you're going to. God bless you, backs out your life. This is the admiral charm. I didn't like what you said, Odin pauses, about the future. This is the love story of real hinged couple Odin and Edward, written and read by me Curtis Garner. Listen to the free audiobook now. When you shop Croger Delivery, you can expect the savings you love and fresh groceries delivered right to your door. Our refrigerated trucks keep your items fresh while our associates are committed to getting every detail right, carefully selecting and packing your order with care. Because bringing you fresh, quality groceries is what we do best. And right now, enjoy $20 off your first online order of $75 or more. Restrictions apply, see site for details. Croger, fresh for everyone.