How Sport Uniforms Impact Girls’ Confidence—Professor Clare Hanlon Explains

[Music] Hello and welcome to the Transcending Sports Show with me, Chris Stafford. This is the show where we look at the work of women around the world who are impacting the lives of girls and women in sport. And my guest on this episode is Professor Claire Hanlon from the Institute for Health and Sport at Victoria University in Melbourne, Australia. Claire recently led a research team that completed a study focused on sport uniforms for girls. And after the release of those findings, what girls want for sport uniforms, Cadbury and women's sport Australia provided $150,000 Australian grant for clubs to change their sport uniforms for girls, using the infographic as a stimulant for clubs. Since that time, Claire has received numerous emails from associations, clubs and schools where these insights provided the evidence they needed to change uniform policies and regulations. A workshop will be presented at the upcoming International Women's Group conference in New Zealand. And this research has become a promotional feature for the active live scheme of the conference. And the follow-up research is expected to soon be launched by the state minister based on how girls feel who recently changed their sport uniform to one of choice and comfort. Claire, welcome to the programme. Thank you for joining me all the way from Melbourne, Victoria, Australia. Well, lovely to be here, Chris. What a mouthful. How are things down under? Look, we're with the fantastic daylight savings, which means it's still lighter later. So it's great to be outdoors after work and go for a walk or a bike ride. I think it looks everyone's spirit, which is great. Yeah, and I know you're a big sports fan too. Enjoy the sport and it encourages many people around me to do the same thing. So I think that's the just the mental, social and physical health that's so important to get outdoors, whether it's from a sport or a physical activity perspective, regardless of age, from a big advocate. I love that. I love it. And you're in the best country in the world for sport. And I, and I, unashamingly, always say that Sydney, the Sydney Olympics was the best Olympic Games we've ever had. And I will stand by that. I've done a few and that I will stand by that. Did you go? I didn't go, but hey, bring on the Brisbane. That'll be great. The Olympics are turning out. Yeah, I think that's going to be really, we're already hotting up with employment up north and wanting to leave legacies. So I think it's going to be really exciting. Yeah, it will. It will be and of course people will compare it to Sydney inevitably. So good luck to Brisbane. Well, let's get down to what we really need to talk about. Claire, and that's the work that you've been doing. Are you led? A study focused on sports uniforms for girls? Because we all know that girls, certainly in a middle school years, they leave sport for a number of reasons, but this can be one of them, can't it? Tell us why you felt the need to run the study. Well, there's a range of barriers similar to what you said, Chris, in the context of girls and women leaving sport. And so what we did was bite down those barriers and thought, well, even if we can just help one and one of those barriers is sport uniforms. And that's both wearing sport uniforms in school, playing sport as well as outside of school. It was we've broke the study down into two stages because we wanted to know, well, let's see what girls want. Look, do they want out of sport uniforms? And then the next study we focused on, well, let's see what's out there and what other effects if policies for uniform policy changes. Yeah, and you know, confidence is everything and body awareness and body confidence is everything too because they have cold kinds of peer pressure. You know, a lot of social pressures these days that really put girls off. And it's what it's even more important that they are comfortable in their own skin and in the clothes that they use, and they're wearing for sport. So tell us a little bit more how you came about this, the study and you had funding for it too. Indeed, first of all, it was so important to acknowledge that girls, particularly the 12-14-year-old age group research, continue to show that that's where their confidence is low, where they tend to lack the confidence in what they're wearing. And it's a matter of having a look and think, well, how can we address it? How can we stop fulfilling embarrassed as to what they wear? And this is where we put a case forward with the Victorian government and they provided funding for Victoria for us to put a survey out to girls for identify, well, what do they want? And it was quite interesting in relation to the responses that we received because what we found was that these girls, and they were aged 12 to 18 years. And we identified that these girls actually, they didn't want to wear skirts, they wanted to wear shorts, they preferred t-shirts, they would prefer to have dark coloured pants, and that might be skirts or shorts. There was a whole range of things, they didn't want to feel overexposed, it was really interesting because these surveys, we had, we allowed some open-ended questions as well, and the amount of feedback received by girls that show how passionate they were about the sport uniforms. And they really had an opinion as to what they wanted to feel comfortable in, and we're quite overwhelmed with the response and the strong opinions that they had. This related to girls, IE girls, that were younger in the 12 to 14, 12 to 15 age group, they were more self-conscious where they wanted to do looser outfits, compared to girls who felt more confident in their bodies and maybe have been more physically active, they were happy to wear more so what was required or tired of fitting outfits. We had girls that from various backgrounds, intersectional backgrounds who preferred to wear looser fitting clothes. What it's saying there is a strong message that we need to allow choice, we need to enable girls to feel empowered, what they wear before they even walk onto the court, for them to feel ready, for them to feel comfortable, and that was a really key finding, Chris. Yeah, and I'm sure that you looked across different sports too, and not least of all you know in Australia you've got populace sports like tennis, like netball, field hockey, those three of course traditionally have had skirts, haven't they? That's been the traditional clothing. It was, and that's where when we released our findings, we translated, and that's one thing my research team, we really focused on these translating our findings into infographics or resources to help the industry, and we translated our research into an infographic, put it out there. We were so overwhelmed by media and responses from schools and sports, and a prime example was one sport who reached out, who predominantly wear skirts and for them to say hey, we're changing ours to enable the choice for the team. To wear either shorts or skirts. So that's really important, and I think this isn't rocket sign, something we've all had experiences about hearing sport uniform when we were younger and not feeling comfortable, but here's the evidence, and let's get it out there to help the resources for people to say, "Oh actually, this does make sense." And one of the things you mentioned that they preferred darker clothes too. Now, one of the things we know they get very self-conscious about is when they're having their period during that time, they're very, very body-conscious and very self-conscious about the clothing that they wear too. Was this something that was a pattern across all sports, then, Claire, in your research? Yeah, look, it really was, and so many girls responded by saying, "I don't turn up to sport when I have my period," and we have white pants, and we have a parent's ringing in, I was on a number of radio interviews after this release, and the amount of parents at Rang-Emen said, "My daughter doesn't want to play sport just a little while, it is incredible, but at the same time, we had a number of guys ringing in saying, "What's the problem?" And it was just a matter of right in the middle of the year. of saying, "The girls when they have their dear, their self-conscious, they leak." And you've got to be able to cater and change your colour of clothes and it was just a matter of educating and hopefully once they are educated, you may understand a very clear message, that they will enable that choice to happen too. Yes, it's very interesting, isn't it? Now, where did you get the most feedback then, in response to your research, Claire? In relation to this first stage, it was mainly in relation to adult colours, with important shorts, more important, but the main thing was choice. And because some girls wanted to stick to the uniforms that they were happy with, other students and what it shows is not one size fitful, not one style fitful, and I think that's the important aspect that we're talking about here. And it's interesting because after this initial funding that we will see for a state-based survey, the male parents from other states that contacted me and said, "Hey, what about our state?" And so a company, a brand company, a trend, then said, "Hey, we'll fund you to go nationally." And we went nationally to see, "Well, does that use this funding throughout Australia?" "Is this the same perception?" And very similar findings. What we found, which was, again, not rocket science, but the girls that lived in the warmer climate, they were very, very conscious of the type of material. They wanted breathable material that hides which they wanted, they were keen for singlets. Compared to girls in the cooler climates that weren't as particular with the type of material that was required. But this infographic then went viral, which was wonderful globally. And I had a daily football team that were women reached out to me. And they were having terrible problems. They admitted that they were having women leave because the only reason was because of the sport uniform. And they said, "We have white shops, shorts, and a tight red top." And that's what our club has. And they were from Ireland. And they said, "Can we please have your infographic? We want to present it to our association." Two weeks later, got a really exciting note. It's changed. We have dark blue shorts. We have loose red tops. And our women who have been threatening to go because of our sport uniforms are staying. So I think that's just another great example of providing some resources to assist clubs understand and for players to justify why change needs to happen. Yes, it just shows how powerful it can be, doesn't it, when the girls do the talking. That's a wonderful reaction and obviously a great result. When you talk about taking this nationwide, Claire, we're still talking about schools, are we, but also talking about clubs. And how do we then change the regulations with national governing bodies and international federations? Yeah, good point. Chris, what has happened in Australia is swimming Australia has changed their uniform policy to enable girls with three quarter links, swimmers when they're competing or traditional swimwear. And that's great. We have a little Victoria that have changed. And as I think I mentioned before, they now enable shorts or skirts for their team, cricket Victoria with their associations. And that's nationally as well. It's up to the associations, but they have now changed from the traditional white to coloured pants. It is starting to create a trickle effect. Gymnastics Australia are now creating a diverse and inclusive uniform, a competitive uniform as well, but a naval choice. So it's starting to branch out, you know, and athletes themselves are making the call. It's like with gymnast, from Germany, that turned up with the Olympic Games and with the full links with the Leotards. And I think it's so important. It's making a statement. And the beach handball with another example. Yeah, the Norwegian handball team was what actually made headlines, didn't it? Because of their uniform. Absolutely. And getting fine and good on and getting up and saying, I'll pay for it. So I think it's more and more cool and players and good on girls and women from making a stand now and saying, we need to feel comfortable. If you want us to perform in sport, we need to feel comfortable. And that's so important. And it just reinforces the importance of sport uniforms and the barriers that they have been playing. And how important they are to meet women and girls feel comfortable. And that probably leads Chris onto our second stage where after this came about with this study and the infographic, the Victorian government, who reached out to them and I said, okay, we know that change is starting to happen based on these sport uniforms. Let's reach out to the clubs and the associations. Let's get some case studies and we only got three of recent ones from competitive perspective that have changed their sport uniforms. Let's survey the girls and women this time as well as the women to see how they felt before compared to now that changes happened. And so this thing started to show the effects of sport uniform policy and the changes to girls and women. Now of the girls that we surveyed, girls and women, I should say there were equal numbers of girls and women that were surveyed. 48% agreed that the change in the sport uniform has encouraged them to stay in the sport. Wow. I think that in itself is a pretty strong story. And the same percentage agreed that it removed one barrier associated with them in joint sport. So I think that's really important. They had specific feelings now that the uniform had changed. They felt more confident. They felt happier and they felt less self conscious when they were playing sport. Yeah. That's fantastic. I mean, we all knew that this could be an issue, right? That from our own experiences that it's all about the comfort level and confidence level. So how it you clave for turning things around and affecting such a sea change already. Now of course the question is where next. What are you going to do with this next? Look, I am talking at the moment initial discussions with a brand company to for globally. Let's put this out with this survey because let's look at it globally and let's see are there any differences amongst countries. Let's see how we can get the voice even stronger. So people may not say, hey, this is only an Australian study. Well, let's go international and let's have the voice of girls and women to say this is what we want. And this is the power of sport uniforms and the role that they play. We want sport uniforms that are designed for women. We don't want uniforms designed. All we want choice so we can wear uniforms so we can wear women's uniform or boys uniform. Just give us a choice. And so it's a matter of identifying what does that choice mean? What does the clothing mean that fits them well? What does it mean when they feel ready for sport and the uniforms that they wear? So, um, um, I'm really, we can see the change that this survey and these findings have made in Australia. I'm really impassioned based on the queries internationally that have received in relation to we want this out further. Well, let's do it and let's embrace it. And I welcome anyone to reach out to me so we can get this out further globally because just something small, it's a sport uniform, it does make a difference. It clearly does. Now, tell us about the workshop that you're going to be presenting this to Claire that you mentioned to me. It's a fantastic international women's group. It's held every four years. This time it's going to be November in New Zealand. We're amazing groups of women. Alves come together. This time it'll either be online or face-to-face and it's a hybrid model and where their workshops are conducted. So they're not academic presentations. They're actually workshop and all these work workshops are focusing on is creating change. And so the workshop that I'm presenting with the director of Women in Sport from the Victorian Government, she's coming over as well. Sarah Stiles and we're going to be presenting about sport uniforms, presenting it in the context of role, how can we roll it out as a group? What can you do when you go back and we'll be providing resources and strategies? And will we be talking about challenges and how we're going to dress them amongst countries? And so that hopefully we can empower more people that attend, for example, this stage of the session of the conference for them to then go away and to hopefully roll it out themselves in countries. And I think that's the beauty of this international women's group, our conference or convention. I think they refer to it. It's to create change and it's to stimulate and help motivate people that are interested in embracing girls and women in sport and physical activity and removing barriers. And that goes from leadership through to physical activity. How can we help each other join forces and roll out strategies to create change? This is terrific work. And as I said, what a change you've already created there and there's a momentum, hopefully, now, that you can, as you say, take worldwide, Claire. So I hope that we can help a little bit by promoting this through the podcast and on our website as well. So will you keep us surprised as to how this is expanding and any infographics that we can use on social media and on the website as well? Because I think this is great work that you're doing. And I'm really impacted by that over 40% really that you found were impacted by what they were wearing and that they would stay in sport if they were when close that they were comfortable with. Absolutely. Look, I can forward you the two infographics and the two different stages. And if it can help anyone, fantastic. Presented as a parent, as a player, as a committee member or a director, presented to the committee discuss it. It's so important. Yes. And is there a way that people can reach you, Claire, if they want to, if they want to with this and get more information from you and contribute to this? Yeah, that would be fantastic. They can refer to the Victoria University Women in Sports website. And there's a whole range of information regarding what we do at Victoria University for women and girls and our research and careers you name it. But there's also contact details there. They can, even if they Google Professor Claire Hanlon, you can have a look at my contact details come up and that being the email can go from there. All right. Wonderful. Is there anything else you'd like to share, Claire? No. Just the contact, how exciting it is, but ask to be a fix of the policy when we promoted. And that just came out on Tuesday this week for three days ago. And already I had two CEOs from the case studies that we had looked at for policy changes reach out to me and say we've further amended our policies to advance sport uniforms. So we've got a TV series that's reached out, a producer that reached out, and we're filming next Tuesday about the changes. So this is being embraced by the community. And I hope that people wherever they are globally it can also be embraced just as formally. Fantastic. Well, great work, Claire. Talking about school uniforms, you know, I've become a cyclist in my latter life, so to speak. And I've found that, you know, what you wear when you're cycling is so important to be comfortable, it empowers you. It really is a sense of empowerment and, you know, a feeling of athleticism. I think the point in relation to cycling is that you can choose what you wear. Competitively, not necessarily, but it's so important. Chris, I know for you, I believe you're going on a big bike ride soon, and you need to wear something that you feel comfortable and ready to act as cycling and to, for you to choose what to wear, I think is really important. So on this cycling, can you just go through and remind me what's it about? Well, a friend of mine, and to the service, decided to do a bike ride because I, you know, I used to ride when I was a kid. And then I went riding horses as a career. And then in late July, I've picked up the bicycle again and really, really enjoying it. And I, last year I did a longer ride and I felt so empowered and so good after doing it. I thought, I'm going to do more of these long rides because they are so satisfying, so fulfilling to do this, especially as you get older, if you find a sport where you really can, you know, maximize your ability and your ambition as well. So, you know, it's never too late to try something new. So my friend, Marcy and I, we're going to set off to do the Potomac Heritage Trail, which is a 375 mile ride and it starts on the eastern Atlantic coast at, at point, a lookout state park. And it goes northwest through Washington, DC, all the way up to Pennsylvania, to Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania. So, 375 miles. And given the times that we're in Claire, we thought, this would be a wonderful opportunity to raise money for the Ukrainian refugees. So we've chosen World Central Kitchen and I know you know World Central Kitchen, a global organisation. And they are feeding hot meals to these Ukrainian refugees in the neighbouring countries. So I thought what better organisation to raise money for them as well. But to set myself at the challenge, my bike partner is a good deal younger than me. So I will draft, let me say, as much as I possibly can. Well, how impressive is that? Traveling, riding, for those managers, what was it, 380 kilometres? Well, 375 miles. So I don't know how many kilometers that would be. But let's think to 375 miles, because that's very impressive. And to raise funds, I think that is just so important to know that it will help people over in Ukraine, particularly in relation to their meals. It's incredible what's happening over there and what you're doing, Chris, is to be commended. So I'm sure, do you have a donation area or can people ring in? Yes, we've set up a just giving page, so just giving.com and then look for riding for Ukraine. And there you can donate to our charity of choice, which is the World Central Kitchen, who are feeding the thousands of refugees. So yeah, it's all there, just giving.com and then look for riding for Ukraine. That's great. Well, good luck. And I'm sure your listeners are all wishing you the best, too. So that's great. Yeah, thanks Claire. This is definitely the longest bike ride I've ever done, so really excited about it and for such a great cause. And I just did the conversion that's going to be 603 kilometers. There you go. 603, gosh. That's impressive. I. Well, thank you very much for your support. And thanks for taking time to come on the show. Absolutely, Chris. Can I say, "Cape up the great work with your voice and the reach that you have for rewarding?" And it's great to hear what you're doing. And you as well, Claire. Thanks again. Great. A pleasure. And you can find the links and references from this episode on our show notes at wispsports.com. Just look for Transcending Sport under the Listen tab and click on this episode. And there you'll also find the social media links, too, to Claire's University. And of course, we're at Wispsports. We're also available on any podcast app at Wispsports or Transcending Sport. And if you have a moment, please do drop us a review or a rating because that always helps others find the show. So until the next time, thanks again to my guest, Professor Claire Hanlon. Thank you for listening. Goodbye for now. [Music]