Ghostings and betrayals: Starmer's cabinet prepares for an Andy Burnham coup

This week we bring you a particularly scoop-packed episode of the state of it ahead of the most consequential biomection in history. That's the Make-A-Feel Biomection on Thursday, which will bring Andy's Burnham potentially back to Westminster and possibly into number 10. I don't think there should be a contest. If there is a contest I intend to be in it, I'm going to fight it. Right. Lara, scoop number one. What could happen next? Well, there are cabinet ministers I'm told. Some who you might think of and some who you perhaps wouldn't think of who are prepared to move against the Prime Minister should he not set out a timeline and play ball. And I'm told one of those cabinet ministers has been ghosting Keir Starmer. Who to thought it? Welcome to the state of it, the political podcast from the Times and the Sunday Times. I'm Stephen Swinford, the political editor at the Times. I'm passionate with why chief political commentator for the Times. I'm Lara, spirit deputy political editor of the Sunday Times. And look, we come to you this week. It is an absolutely explosive week in British politics. The events of Thursday will have huge repercussions to Make-A-Feel Biomection and the Burnham is coming. And we've got a pretty scoop packed episode. We are going to reveal the potential for cabinet resignations in the wake of the Make-A-Feel Biomection to force Keir Starmer's hand. We're going to give you an insight into where Keir Starmer's headed at at the moment and how he really, really genuinely thinks he can fight on. And then we're going to talk more broadly about the possible idea that Ed Miliband may be ghosting the Prime Minister, which is coming from Patrick McGuire. But look, let's start with the obvious place. Last week was absolutely disastrous for Keir Starmer. John Healey, the defense secretary resigned. His authority is in tatters. And yet still talking to people, he thinks he can fight on. Now, I was having a conversation with someone and they were saying that his view is that what Andy Burnham is trying to do here is a coup. He is trying to do a takeover and it is fundamentally wrong as a point of principle and he will fight it. He will stay in the trenches and kind of go for it. I'm not sure if that's realistic, but you know, start off at 10 there. Can Starmer fight this thing? Well, he can. In a literal sense. Technically. He can. Yeah, technically he can. He still has the Prime Ministerial bully pulpit, the microphone and he has the constitutional right under the lower party rule book to be on the ballot if he so wishes. It's one of Jeremy Corbyn's curious legacies, that one. So, if he wants to, he can. And by all accounts, he does want to. He was badly shaken by John Healey's resignation last week. But I was having conversations with Keir Starmer's closest allies all week, ministers, people in number 10, personal friends and all of them said the same thing and all came down to what you just said, Steve, as one minister who's very, very close to Keir Starmer told me, he thinks his mandate was to do two things, change the country and he feels he's now changing the country. They said, don't see the social media ban and stuff like that as legacy building. It is him finally getting the system to deliver. And if you're only listening to that, I did semi sarcastic quotes around around that line. And the second thing is ending the Tory psychodrama. That's how he interpreted the second part of his mandate. Keir Starmer, in the words of one of his closest confidants, thinks that the credibility of the Labour Party and the legitimacy of the government is at stake. As you say, Steve, Andy Burnham, he thinks, doesn't have a mandate, hasn't set out his plan for the country. He thinks there's a massive contradiction as Andy Burnham's plan for the country. You know, is it continuity? Is it starmorism with a smile and a pulse myth t-shirt and a woolly back accent? Or is it ending 40 years in neoliberalism and ripping up the fact settlement? Right? It can't be both. And they think they can draw those out over the course of a leadership election. And speaking to people in the week, they are probably getting up for a leadership election. They're thinking about who is going to staff that campaign, stuff like that. So he is serious. He can't, I opened my column last week with he can't be serious, can he? But he is. What should I take on it then, Laura? Yeah, I think that is exactly where they are. And it sounds like he's conceded private leader, friends and allies, that there will be a leadership question at some point that he's not going to bury his head in the sounds and pretend that that is not a dynamic and is not something that a large number of people are calling for. But the kind of case is essentially that Andy isn't ready. And I think some of his allies in a way that I think does appear to be slightly facetious to those of us on the outside. But I think they do genuinely sort of believe it. They think, oh, it's generous to give Andy a bit more time to set out what exactly it is that he will want to do. And I don't actually think that that's generous. I think that's just an attempt to possibly buy for some time. And obviously the belief is, as Patrick has articulated that actually he will buckle under the weight of that scrutiny and to kind of close and look at exactly what it is that he would do in power. But it does sound like he's very serious. And it does sound like they feel that there are these pitfalls for Andy Burnham, which to Andy Burnham's team I think they think is just painly ridiculous. Well, let's talk with then about how realistic that is. Let's put that to the test. And I want to just rewind slightly to the events of last week, which were totally mad on one level. So John Healey obviously resigned. Number 10 was blindsided by that. And my colleague Oliver Wright did a fantastic read on it at the weekend. But the reason they weren't quite expecting him to go over the top is because they were much more worried about two other people. They were worried about Rachel Reeves, who was furious about this kind of extra spending on defense. She felt the whole issue was settled. They thought genuinely the Chancellor could quit. And they were particularly worried about Ed Miliband. Ed Miliband was being asked to find cuts to net zero budgets. And he was resisting the cuts. And he was resisting them. And he was deeply unhappy. In the end, he swallowed the 1% cuts like everyone else. But that was where Starmer's attention was. So John Healey, they never thought he'd go over the top. They didn't think he'd do it. He was a loyalist. But this is Patrick where we come to your delicious scoop, please, on Ed Miliband. It's very juvenile, but please. Ed Miliband has taken, you know, he's got a time share arrangement in every single Labour MP's head. And you know, he spends most of the year inside Kierstarmers at the moment. Kierstarm was trying to get in touch with Ed Miliband last week. And I was told that he just couldn't get through to him. Ed Miliband was ghosting the Prime Minister. This is the prime minister calling Ed Miliband. By all accounts, Ed Miliband was not picking up the prime minister's skulls. Look, maybe he was busy. You know, he's got a department to run. But that shows you how much the relationship, the extent to which that defining relationship, really close relationship, Ed Miliband stayed in the cabinet and the shadow cabinet for much longer than some of Kierstarmers closest advisors would have liked him to, long the morgomit sweetie would have liked him to because he and Kierstarmer had a bond that predated Kierstarmers time in politics. Kierstarmer felt he owed a lot to Ed and he thought to a certain extent they were friends. I'm not entirely sure that was ever reciprocated properly by Ed Miliband. But there we go. And here we are now. And Ed Miliband, by the way, is the crucial person in all of this in how not only how this weekend will unfold after Andy Burden wins in Make a Field, but how the government and Labour's chances of an ex-lection. But we'll get on to that a little bit later. Speaking to the minister last night, minister got on touch with me last night at the blue, not someone I speak to very often. And they were saying, we all know Ed Miliband is going to resign at some point. You know, Andy Burden needs to do something more than get Ed Miliband to resign. But Ed Miliband, as you and I wrote on the night of the local elections after the polls closing the local elections, Steve, Ed Miliband sold his shares in Kierstarmer a long, long time ago. He was the first to go over the top. He went to, told the prime minister, you know, mate, come on. You need to set out a timetable. You should think about setting out a timetable. Kierstarmer basically said, clear off. And everything that's happened since, I think we can probably trace back to that conversation. Yeah. So look, we should then talk about where Andy Burden is. So I went to see Andy Burnham. I went to the working man's public. Both of you have short cross. And I met most important me. I met Milo, who is Lou Higgs dog, who Laura was very taken with when you went up the other week. I've actually not met Milo. I've already had the great director of righting about Milo. He's lovely. He's the Morgan McSweeney of the Andy Burden project, the mysterious Spangali briefed about constantly, but seldom seen. Well, he's there. He's a great dog. But also I met Andy Burnham. And it's important to understand how Andy Burnham sees the Makerfield by election. So he sees this as a mandate for number 10. The words he used was he says, it is a cry for change from the people, people of Makerfield and the people of the nation more broadly. And he kept describing it as the first stage of changing the Labour Party. Well, I'm pretty sure I can guess what the second change is. You changed the Prime Minister in the process. He said that Makerfield is effectively a mega focus group. And they need described as there are hundreds of Makerfields out there. So he is clearly making a political logic here. If I win this, I have won the right to kind of end to number 10. Now there's an assumption of when you talk to people on Burnham of the political inevitability that if he wins this by significant enough margin, he will be prime minister and so he is done will have no choice but to back down. But as we've discussed, that is not necessarily a given and the animus between the two men because they really don't like it. They didn't like each other before right. And we've talked before on this show about how Starmer famously went to get Burnham support when he was running for Labour leader and Burnham wouldn't give it and they're bad blood between them over many years. But it's really bad blood now. So this assumption that surely Starmer will have to give away. He can't even govern his own cabinet. Surely that is, they are possibly an overestimate and that means someone's going to need to pull the trigger. That means someone's going to need to move and it could get very bloody and very ugly very quickly. Yeah, well indeed. And obviously only Burnham isn't at 4am on Friday going to launch a challenge to Keir Starmer. But I think there are people around Keir Starmer who would dearly want into because everybody needs a pretext. to do what they want to do in this. Andy Burnham needs a pretext. Andy Burnham needs a challenge from someone else or cabinet resignations or, you know, 200 members of the parliamentary Labour Party coming out and saying, it's over for Keir Starmer, send for Andy, you know, when Andy gets in on Monday, let's make him Prime Minister. Keir Starmer needs a provocation from Andy Burnham so he can make his case and declare he's going to, he's going to fight and fight on to win. It was put to me by one hour of Keir Starmer though. The best thing Keir Starmer could do, the most compounding thing Keir Starmer could do on Friday. He's nothing. You know, cursory, turskin graduations, Andy Burnham, then do and say nothing. Because at that point, the parliamentary Labour Party will be frothing at the mouth. Some of Andy Burnham is more excitable supporters and I say supporters, not the people who are with him in Stubbshaw Cross Labour Club every day will be bearing for blood. You know, for all of lots of pages to fill and lots of copy to write, you know, there will be a market for furious allies of Andy Burnham saying XYZ or, you know, allies of the Prime Minister saying he's bottled it. I can see my WhatsApp web page now and I can see the four or five people who will be peppering me with messages if we've got silence from both sides on Friday saying where is Andy and these bottled it, right? And everybody wants a provocation. Everybody needs a provocation. But if Keir Starmer says and does nothing and his allies are disciplined and say nothing, it's quite confounding for Andy Burnham in that point. Because what you do or say, it's like, you know, do launch challenge, do not launch challenge, it sort of becomes a sort of phony war stage until he gets down here on Monday. Which brings us to scoop number two from Laura, which is the question of pressure. So pressure kept will take two forms. They are actively getting that list of 81 MPs together. But like you say, we could end up with a couple of hundred MPs coming out and calling for Starmer to go, that is one form of pressure. The second form is from the Cabinet, Laura, and you've got some gear for us on that this week. Yeah, I mean, I think what Patrick says is really important, which is there is obviously a clear distinction between the people who are advising Andy Burnham and the people in Westminster who will want there to be a much quicker momentum. I mean, you know, I'm told Andy wants to get to London. He wants to meet some of the newer intake. This is not a case of like immediately trying to move. But that said, I think if it got, I mean, it's been put to me, you know, if it got to, if it was Starmer saying, Oh, you know, we might be able to have that conversation at comfort. That is way too long. I mean, this is not a long timeframe that they're looking at, but it is also as Patrick says, not an absolutely immediate one, but they have these different tools at their disposal, one of which I'm told is a number of people in the Cabinet who are willing to call for Kirsta and to go and to move against him, some obvious, and some not. Now, you probably some eyes that the obvious would include somebody like Ed Miller band. But clearly, there will be other people that have agreed to act on behalf to speed this off if it is necessary. And of course, there's a hope that Kirsta Summer of his own volition says, you know, I'm going to make this transition slightly easier. But we know that that's not what where Kirsta Amher's head is at all at the moment. And so they are having to look at these various different options. I think, I mean, the key thing when I talk to those trustees to me is they want Kirsta Summer, they say, to leave with some dignity. I mean, I think that's not necessarily a selfish position. I think as we know from looking at the polling, Labour members, the wider Labour coalition probably would feel more favourable towards Andy Burnham, where it was possible for them to engineer a situation where it was not like tracking Kirsta Amher out of number 10 in a really kind of horribly humiliating way for him at the same time. You know, they will say, look, Kirsta Summer's Premiership is dead. Like it's been dead for a number of times. It died again last week when John Healy resigned. And there is a fundamental inability to recognise that. And that's why I think it could get a tiny bit messy. But there is some self-interest, right? Because clearly Burnham has an interest in a bloodless coup. But, asking he wants, right, out there is a long summer with a long leadership contest, where streetings battle of ideas. No, exactly. And I mean, that's the key. Where's the battle of ideas, where streetings not going to be involved in, by the way, I think was you just put that on the record. Where's streetings is not going to be a candidate, certainly a successfully nominated candidate in a Labour leadership election, right? And sorry was for saying that so bluntly, but it's true. Lots of ways is allies, including, you know, there's sort of close people who are close to him who quit. I've woken up and smelled the coffee, right? Lots of these people are now thinking, how do we, how do we get behind Andy Burnham? How do I ensure I'm not completely unemployable when anally is midgly, chief whip or political secretary is looking down the long list of the 2024 intake in a month's time in two months time, thinking, oh God, who's going to be PPS to the Minister for flooding? You know, it's not going to be where streetings battle of ideas. It's going to be, you know, to use a slightly tasteless comparison someone made to me last week, it's going to be like the Waco siege, right? It's going to be like, here, hold up in number 10 with a massive stock pile of, you know, bombs and bullets and sort of daring the forces around him to come and get him out. And the whole Labour Party is going to die in the process. So the question is, does Burnham have the political courage to pull the trigger? There was one theory that someone put to me or the suggestion which isn't true, but I'll run you through it anyway because the reason it's not true are interesting. The suggestion was, Wes was going to go up to the make field this week, which he has done. He has seen Burnham and that they were going to cut a deal. And the deal would be that he would go over the top, he would take the numbers and trigger the leadership contest. So because people don't like being the first mover, right? So he would do that and then he would get rewarded, let's say, with the job of Foreign Secretary. That was the suggestion. Obviously, talked to a lot of people around that, that is our job. And it was roundly rejected. And I think that's right, by the way, because actually when you look at this speech that Wes is treating as given in the city today, it is a demolition, a lot of it, of Andy Burnham's economic vision. He says that it wasn't 40 years of neoliberalism that was a problem. We should not be squeamish about the markets. He says bond markets are not the bond villains. So it's a repudiation of a lot of what Burnham stands for. So whether he has the numbers to get there as you say, Patrick, it may be impossible for him to join the contest. But either way, everyone seems to be allergic to actually making the move other than possibly Edmila Bans. Well, totally. And as Andy Burnham said on question time, I believe I'm not going to do as a fellow war, that respect for, please do it. No, no, no, don't. When I did an impression of Edmila Bans, Edmila Bans, Spouts complained, so I'm not going to get off on the roll for a very good impression with a fellow war in Andy Burnham. He said, West Street has launched a leadership contest, so I'm going to join it. It's harder and it's a bigger provocation to Keir Starmer to arrive. Because that's what, you know, if your movement is really under the end of blow to Keir Starmer, you are saying, you know, when Andy says he's going to challenge, he's the script, right? You know, you don't have a mandate. It's really, you know, I've got, I'm meant to be going to the NATO summit in a fortnight's time, etc. It's such a big crisis. Yeah, exactly. But at the same time, and then you then going long, you know, it's McAuberism, right? You know, you're in number 10 waiting for something awful to turn up. You're waiting for the Manchester Bar election or you're waiting for, I don't know, Trump to break the ceasefire or something. So then you can go back on whatever deal you've made over an orderly transition. Right. Let's head to the interval. And when we come back from the interval, we are going to talk about one of the key men, obviously Edmila Bans and what will happen to him, will he be the next chancellor? Welcome back to the state of it, the political podcast from the times and the Sunday times. Now, for the second half of this podcast, we are going to be talking about Edmila Bans. Edmila Bans matters because he could well be the next chancellor or maybe not. Laura, do you want to kick us off on this? That there are very different theories around him. Yeah, I mean, I wrote about this at the weekend. There is something of an emerging split in the Andy Bans and Femme between Edmila Bans and perhaps Matt Fambula, former minister who recently resigned on one side and the kind of wider soft left on the other side. Now, the possibility of Edmila Bans as a chancellor, I think, is quite a good encapsulation of the reasons for that particular divide. And I was picking up quite a lot of unhappiness about that prospect at the weekend, which given many people have been speaking about an Edmila Bans chancellorship as if it was a done deal. I thought was really striking. There are a couple of reasons why there are some real concerns there. The first is a real sense and suspicion that they feel that Miliband has been telling others that he's in line for the job, that that's a done deal. They worry that there's been too much personality in this already and I think that's something that has graded some of them up the wrong way. And the second more interesting point, I think, is actually on position as a policy, particularly in a zero where a number of them think, actually, Andy needs to be in a position where he has some flexibility on this, that he can look at these things abstractly without any ideology and say, actually, I think, for example, yeah, we will need to grant new licenses in the North Sea. Perhaps, let's see. He says he's open to that. This is something that's all around him think he's he is open to and that he needs the latitude to be able to be open to. And part of this is not because I think it's really it's really key to say that it's not that we know that Edmila Bans is absolutely firmly completely forever against more drilling, quote unquote, but he is against new licenses, right? And I think one of the key things here is is not that there's necessarily this massive policy divergence there. It's a sense among some around Burnham that actually what you need is to be able to make these decisions without all the newspapers writing your chances on resignation watch. And they're being this whole psychodrama saying, where is Ed on this, where is Andy on this, is there a split? Who are the Ed supporters who think that actually this is a disaster and it's going back on all of the things that we've done on net zero and you cannot have that. And actually a separate part of that as somebody suggesting who was interesting was saying, look at the Scottish Labour MPs among whom Andy has not made as fantastic as inroads in as he has some other coalitions saying this would be a really important overture to them who are traditionally more in favour of moods like this and could be a smart thing. So there's some suspicion there, I think for that reason. And also separately, I reported that actually senior advisors to Burnham have been lobby hard, Shabbana Mahmoud to take the position of. Chancellor that she's wavering on this still. These conversations resumed in a big way because of what happened with John Helian the whole for a row around defense spending and the fact that this was clearly an indication of the really tough fiscal conversations that are ahead. Shabana still wants to stay at home, but you know, I think is is being worked on quite significantly. I think it's fair to say. You get to the nub of the entire issue for team Burnham here in terms of not just the sort of government they form but how smooth their path is right there linked a lot will depend on. The sort of government labor MPs think they are putting in office without without a contest right so a minister got in touch with me last night and they made this exact point. After saying I'm becoming more convinced that boss man, which they mean, Kirsta, I'm not the proprietor of a local corner shop might try and tough it out and actually take it to a contest and if that Andy doesn't actually have a clear pitch early next week. Then he can't actually press the button as too many MPs will be worried about what direction he'll go in some saying they want Andy, but don't want Shabana number 11. Others saying they want Andy, but don't want Ed in number 11, etc. Right. So, you know, if you're not moving Shabana mood out the home office, that sends a signal to the PLP if she's in number 11, that sends in the signal. If a miller band is anywhere near number 11, that sends another signal right so very quickly or making tradeoffs in terms of personnel that could alienate people and could make people have another look at Kirsta. Yeah, I mean, I think it's really like Shabana is key here in a way that people don't fully understand, I mean, I'm told there's no kind of big white board that they're working off in terms of cabinet positions, but I think, you know, I was talking to somebody earlier and was like, well, you know, if there is a big suspicion about Ed Miliband, but Shabana mood doesn't want to take it. What happens then? And there are a number of names in the hat of which perhaps John Helius one, which is quite interesting. But it's not the case that there's this kind of absolutely firm settled view and they know what's going to happen. Another name, by the way, we haven't spoken about who could be very important come Friday, come the weekend, come next week is about Cooper who has sort of kept her head down as obviously expressed her reservations about Kirsta, my two Kirsta has been very busy with the Iran deal. But she was named by the minister whose text I was coaching to you there as someone who not could resign as in they think she's going to resign, but that's the sort of person swinging behind Andy Burnham that will matter to your median labor MP who wants to be on the winning side knows Kirsta was a dud, but isn't entirely sure about the intended consequences. So that Cooper, you know, former President Minister knows Andy Burnham well could possibly be another outside pick for Chancellor or you know, I would have a strong case of Chancellor Shabana, but the mood doesn't want it. Although she does have a reputation being an indecisive among colleagues and as one minister joke to me when I asked them about the prospect of that being Chancellor, they said, well, in that case, the next budget will be in 2035. So there you go, cruel joke about that Cooper, I merely pass it on. I want to throw one other name into the discussion mostly so that Laura Spiritt can aggressively shoot me down which I'm looking forward to. Rachel Reeves thinks she could still be Chancellor. This is her view is that one she has the trust of the market and two she's going to be prepared to go there on net zero and make cuts that Edmila Band couldn't. And three she said when you look round, you have a conversation like the one we've had, it's not exactly clear so why not stick with what you've got. Now Laura, please. Okay, so I don't think that's going to happen. That's not where their heads are, I think in Burnham. You put that in place. Look, I think last week was quite an important instructive moment for this because they're particularly unhappy with the briefing about John Healey. Do you remember there was a Treasury official that said, let's clear what John is asking for here, cuts to schools and hospitals. And I think one of the key things that is in their minds when they're looking at this decision about Chancellor is the flexibility that any pick is going to give them with regards to the decision they make next. And one thing that we know about Rachel Reeves in the last week fortnight is that flexibility is not something that those who have had to be working with her over the defense investment plan would necessarily say that she has had. And I genuinely don't mean that as a criticism, but I do I'm saying that that is something that will be playing in the minds of those around Burnham. And it is simply not where they are right now. One of the things I just wanted to mention, we do need to mention this, this conversation is obviously predicated on Andy Burnham winning in Makefield. And it's important to stress this because the reason we are talking to you like this is because restore is a factor. And also we are having conversations with people in reform who think they're probably not going to win it. But there is a world in which reform do win this. And then all of this conversation is different. We will still likely end up in a very violent and difficult leadership contest. I think it could be far wilder than what comes next if Burnham does win it because there's no clear counter. It will be horrific. It will be key to our personal injury and versus Ed Miliband versus by streeting and you know, Alcans trying to counter five at the end of it. That's the difficulty. And by the way, I'm glad that's the first and only mention of Alcans and his leadership bid on this podcast forever. What I would say about that prospect Steve, we had a poll from Maureen Common, constituency poll from Maureen Common in Sustay's paper of Makefield. And the two stats that stood out and you have one as well, Laura, we both had restore keeping their deposits. What Maureen Common have found in our poll, yeah, okay, Andy Burnham is five points ahead, restore win 8% the vote, split vote on the right, hands it to Andy Burnham. Just as significant was that 13% of Makefield voters were still undecided and both campaigns, particularly Andy Burnham, who for the past couple of weeks has been trying to squeeze those undecided down, but every day going to knock on their doors personally. Reform was saying as well, we are focusing big time on decideds. Then I was in Makefield on Saturday and Sunday watching restore canvases of whom there were loads by the way. They had a thousand people there over the weekend. Everywhere you drove, amperem, oral, billage, Hindley, in fact that's not that bit in the office, you know, Winnersh. They were everywhere and they were playing particularly close attention to reform houses, these restore canvases. But yeah, that 13% undecideds could be very, very significant. Are they breaking for a store? Are they breaking for a form? Will they get into the ballot box and actually think, "Screw Andy Burnham" or will they be swept up in Burnham Mania like the rest of us? That is decisive. Or maybe the convergent poll is actually bang on the money and Andy Burnham is going to win by 12 points regardless. I mean, I think one of the interesting things about that poll as well that I wrote about in our politics newsletter was not just that it had a kind of striking lead for Andy Burnham. But I think it also spoke to one of the interesting conversations we could be having after this week if all goes well for Labour, which is, could reform have won this if they played the election differently? Was it always Andy Burnham would have won this? And was it perhaps, is there perhaps a concern about the candidates? And one of the things that convergent asked respondents was to basically raise issues that they'd heard spoken about during the campaign. And there was a really striking statistic which was among Labour voters, four in ten of those who didn't back Labour in the recent local elections, but say they will in this Thursday's by election, mention comments by Kenyan. So those are those past social media comments that have proved very. He's in the socialistic comments. The socialists can comment like self-professed at one point. Sexist, obviously, he has tried to clarify those comments, but he's not overtly, explicitly kind of disavowed them and apologised. But it's interesting that they raised that unprompted and they just wonder if it will create something of a conversation after the election about, was it something to do with the candidate or perhaps was this, was this simply that Andy Burnham just had such perfect momentum and a brilliant operation and it would never have been any other way? Well, look, the world's going to shift on its axis on Friday. We are going to do a special edition of the State of It live on Time to Radio on Ed Vesys' show, Laura and I'll be in the studio. I'll be in Make a Feel. I'll be banging on a door of Stubbshawcross Labour Club waiting for the bar to open or something. Yeah, waiting to meet Milo the dog. And I've been in the count overnight, so looking forward to that. So is it 10.15am on Friday morning and please listen then? And look, we are juicy bound to read out the full list of candidates in the Make a Feel by election. So here we go. They are Jake Austin of the Liberal Democrats, count bin face of the count bin face party, Andy Burnham of the Labour and Cooperative Party, Dan Clark of the Libertarian Party, John Dyer, who is independent, Ed Gimel of the Climate Party, Paul Goulds, who is an independent, howling Lord Hope, the official Monster Raving Looney Party, Rob Kenyon of Reform UK, Robert Poundel, who is an independent, Rebecca Shepard of Restore Britain, Sarah Wakefield of the Green Party, Peter Ward of Rejoin EU, Michael Wins Stanley, the Conservative and Union's Party.