Getting the most out of your university experience, with Phoebe Murray

Welcome to the ECU Alumni Podcast series, follow the leader. This special series has been created for you by talented teams of ECU students. In this podcast, you'll follow the career journeys of leading ECU alumni from a range of professions. You'll get an insight into their chosen profession, as well as tips from how to get your big break, to how to succeed in your career and more. We hope you enjoy this insight into the different journeys that our alumni take and that their fascinating stories give you some interesting food for thought. Hello everyone, welcome back to the ECU Alumni Podcast, where we dive into the stories of our talented alumni and shed light on their life and career so far. My name is Emily and for today's episode, we're very excited to have our special guest Phoebe Murray. She graduated from ECU in 2021 and is one of our excellent alumni who obtained a graduate diploma in broadcasting. She has wide experience with both active TV and radio stations both in Australia and America, and she is currently working as a reporter for Prime 7 News in New South Wales. Let's hear what she has to share. Phoebe, welcome to the podcast. Hi Emily, thanks for having me. No worries. Do you want to tell us a bit more about yourself? Sure, I started my education with ECU in my first year, and then my second semester ended up going on an exchange. I didn't really end up coming back for a while, but as most things happen with ECU kind of ended up coming back anyway, I finished up my undergrad, so I immediately did one year of studies at ECU for my undergrad, but then decided because all my experience was from states, because I wanted to work in Australia during COVID times, that I would go and get my postgraduate diploma through ECU WAPA, and that was just absolutely spectacular. It really set us up with the skills that we needed to jump straight into the industry, and I loved my time at ECU, like I got involved in sports and everything, so I know that you guys have a whole spiel, but yeah, no, university is such an amazing part of life, and anything that anyone can do to enjoy as best you can, it's more than just an education, so I'm more than happy to share. So your job is very much related to your major. Could you tell us why you chose this discipline? Yeah, no worries. I ended up in broadcasting unknowingly, and all honesty, I went to an open day for the university, and I always wanted you acting, but my parents to our door thought that I should pursue something that actually had a guaranteed job, and so I went to an open day and kind of liked the look of the radio station and producing things, and I thought, "Oh, that looks fun," so I enrolled in that, and just kind of fell in love with it instantaneously, and then I was really lucky in terms of broadcast journalism, sets you up for so many different parts, so you can go down, you can go down, the report, you can go down, the producer route, you can even go down, cinematography in terms of being a camera person, behind and in front of the camera, there are just so many roles, so we're really lucky that in our field, your education really sets you basically the walk straight onto the job, and that when it comes to a really hand-on course in terms of what was available in Australia, there really wasn't that much, and ECU was the pick to actually learn skills, opposed to go to a university, and understand the theory behind a camera, or why people speak like this, where at ECU and their affiliated universities, and that I spent most of my time at, it's 70, 30, you still have that theory knowledge, but the majority of your learning is from hands-on experience, as you would learn when you jump into a job, you don't know everything first, you still learn things, I'm still learning new things every day, but you learn those things before you're even out there, some of them, and I feel like that really helped at least my graduating class jump ahead of some other broadcast journalism graduates across the country. And you study subjects around broadcasting and journalism for five years or more? So what's so special about it that really attracted you, and has it always been your dream job? It's a dream job, not so much. I wanted to actually produce during my undergrad, I had no intentions of being on camera, I loved doing it for a little bit of fun, but it wasn't something I could see myself doing seriously, I really liked the creative control I had as a producer, or if I was going to be talent, I wanted to be on radio where I could have those fun chats with my audience, and it took me five years, my undergrad took me four years, because COVID kind of muddled us all up, and when I transferred to the United States, that added an extra semester that I kind of got back when I ended up transferring back to Oz. But a lot of undergrads take four years now, and I don't think that's anything to be ashamed of, taking three courses a semester is rather healthy, and I know it allowed me to find friends and fuel my passions, but then that extra really intense here with ECU WAPA was just like, I don't want to say the nail in the coffin, but it really like, just made sure that we were gun-ho ready, and it was just a really intense here that, you know, took a lot out of us, but we all got really close, and we came together, and you can understand why it's such a prestigious program. But it was in that year of the postgraduate when I was on Pracking June at the Channel 9 in Perth, that one of the reporters who I was out with me, who's also an ECU graduate, she went, "Oh no, no, no, you're out with the reporters today, you're going to go and do a piece to camera, and I could not have thought of anything worse, it was horrible, all I wanted to do was be back on station and learning from the frauds, and I did it, and it was like love at first sight. I just fell in love with it. The next night I was doing fake live crosses from the basketball, and then woke up at 3 a.m. to 2 a.m. the next morning to do the Today Show crosses, and that's when I knew I was like, "Okay, I really, I'm really lucky this, I'm late to the game, because everyone else in our class, they had already decided if they wanted to report or not, and I just, I gave it everything I've got, and I guess I must have done something right, and I was, ended up in a reporting producing role straight away with Channel 10, but now I'm reporting full time for Prime, which is actually now Channel 7. So now reporting for 7 years, and it's a little rough, you have some days, today was a little rough, you know, you have things that live TV, sometimes things go wrong, and today was one of those days, but the beauty of television is that something new every day, and you just got to shake it off and move on to the next one. I think that's something really important, that they taught us in that year, and that you just learn once you're out, and as long as you're a bit of a tough cookie, I guess you can get through it. That's very interesting. So why did you choose to study at ECU and WAPA? I jumped into ECU partly because it was one of the universities that had the strongest diversity support program. So I'm the Schlacksecker, I'm quite open about it, and in high school, they're very much bound by the state laws, and how they can support you. And then when it goes to your tertiary education, it's very much dependent on the university, and I felt, and so did my family, when we were doing our research, that ECU had the best student diversity support program that would help advocate for students to get you the support you needed if it was extra time and exams, or problematic with spelling and getting software installed on your laptops or personal advice glasses so that you can could get through those tough readings and different things. So that really played a major role. And the other thing was really if I wanted to do what I thought was what interested me, which was broadcasting, ECU is the only university that offers something like that. Curtain now offers something similar. They've expanded their broadcast, their journalism program, excuse me. But back when I was looking in 2016 as a DOID, the 12 student, it was ECU or it was Curtain. And Curtain was a very print program at that point. And I wanted to work for a newspaper. I didn't even know if I really wanted to do news. And I just felt that the best opportunity for creativity was for ECU because that's what the university seemed to stand for at all of their events. And I think that definitely shown through during my time with them, along with the opportunity that they gave me when I was able to take my ECU knowledge and apply that to one of their partner universities and it helps stay there for a while. But I think those are shared investments in students that they make, which are why they all partner together if that makes any sense. Yeah, that does make sense. Before commencing study at ECU, you spent some time studying makeup, got a certificate, and then used those skills in makeup artistry. What do you think about trying different things that aren't related to your major? So a little bit, kind of like what I was just saying, it all came back to creativity. I was a kid who liked to be a disease. So as soon as I finished high school, I jumped in to doing a certificate for makeup artistry because that was always a young girl. I was really interested in makeup. And I grew up with parents who took me to the makeup counter and went, OK, they're going to teach you how to do it properly so that you don't ruin your skin. And that always intrigued me. And I'm very grateful now that I actually do have that certificate and makeup artistry because my face is now on TV every night. And unfortunately, if you're not the easiest thing to always get it right. So the degree-- sorry, that's a certificate-- really came in handy there. I think it's really important to get some experience outside of your field. And I don't think that has to necessarily be in terms of education. I've had friends who were not often did, can teach here all years abroad, where it was like a gap year. And those extra elements of not being in a classroom, per se, really helped them grow. And I know with my-- if we're talking specifically about makeup artistry, that's helping me in folds now because I know exactly what to do with my eyes and my cheekbones and what looks best on camera. And it's something's being changed. Or the network wants us to go in a certain direction. I have the tools at my disposal to use that currently, where if I hadn't done that, I'd probably be like most others. And learning off YouTube tutorials or TikTok now. But I think that really helped me become more confident in the young person that I was. And then, of course, being a reporter, you have to be the one who goes knocks on the door and asks the sometimes pretty tough questions or what might seem like a silly question. And I guess having that extra layer of confidence in myself that makeup gave me back then has always just kind of stuck around. And that confidence is still there when you take it all off at the end of the day. But that confidence in yourself, I think I found when I looked into makeup. And as I said, it doesn't have to be something that's educational. It can be something that is, like you were saying, those outside experiences that really impact the rest of you because obviously, like I'm not working and makeup anymore. But when I was working for Napoleon Perdes, and that's retail as much as it is makeup artistry. And those are the life skills that most of us grow up in. I was just pretty lucky that my retail job involved doing ball makeup and not stacking boxes out the back. And that's something I can go forever be grateful for. But I think it definitely had an impact on me becoming confident enough to eventually step up and do that piece to camera that I did on my track and didn't just, you know, without until they went, oh, well, too late. Now let's move on. Because I definitely wouldn't be where I am now, you know, hadn't been pushed. So apart from academics, you had multiple experiences within our school clubs. How did you find those activities? So I was one of the three students who went to ECU from my high school. One, went into teaching. Another was doing one of the many theater courses-- I'm sorry, undergraduate courses at WAPA. And then there was me. So we were all in different different schools. And the teacher was at June the Luff. It was just Rebecca and myself at Mount Lawley. And I'd always known that the best way to meet people was to get involved in sports. And that's something that I can find now. And so I went to all the old days and the orientation weeks. And you go around to all the different stalls. You get numerous amounts of free pens and coffee cups. But I was looking for the sporting table and work out where I can join a netball team. And I hadn't played netball in a very long time. But I was like, it's OK. It'll be so sure. It'll be fun. There'll be someone else who's a little bit worse than me. So I'll work it out. And I grew up as a gymnast. And when I got to the-- they're the ECU Jets, which is an amazing organization on campus that cater to various different sports and all sporting abilities. And even if you don't like sports, you can still get involved in the club. And I went with full intentions of going to netball. And they ended up having a two leading team. I was like, oh my god. Like group gymnastics. How cool. And joined that. And similarly to a lot of my other university experiences, fell in love with two leading. I met my best friend who I forever loved and even living across the other side of the world. Now across the side of the country, we still talk pretty much every day. She's my rock. And without cheerleading and without ECU Jets, I never would have found her. Like we were both-- both new, both first day, went to tryouts and just clicked. And I ended up being captain of our team that year. I then was brought on as the social media manager for the club before I left the US. And then upon my return, I was actually nominated and ended up being on the board of directors for the club for my final year of university. And then when I got my employment at Channel 10, I couldn't return for another year because I just didn't have the time and dedication that that position really needed. But I was still involved in a social way. Like I still continued to play catch football on Monday and Thursdays for the club. And I met some of my closest friends and confidence and all of that through sport. And whenever people go, oh, I don't know if I should go to university. I'm not going to know anyone. My biggest thing is just go join a sports team. Doesn't matter if you know good or not, like, touch football. I don't play touch football. I run up and down the field in touch football. I get yelled out by everyone else who tells me what to do. It's a great time. But I took that with me. When I got here in Camelor, if I had no one, it's a fairly small regional town. And the thing that I've just been working so hard was to just find a team. And I guess that drive to go and find a network team in university finally came true because I'm now playing a network here. But I also did, like, uni sports. So ECU sport got involved that way too. So I was able to meet other students doing other things. And just for me, with sports, what was the easiest way to find things for other people? It's the women's independence group. Or they have some really amazing clubs at ECU. I've got the aviation group and those guys-- it's probably weird being to say, but they throw the best quiz nights. They were always a lot of fun. Even if you just want to join something social, like the parties and events club, like they always had things going on, it was just a way to meet people that were life-minded and not necessarily in your area. Like they got you to see other parts of the world and other parts that you maybe didn't understand. So like my best friend who I met through, she's a nurse and a midwife. I learned things from her all the time that just I wouldn't know in my everyday world. But because of our crosscards at university, now when something happens, I immediately think of something that she'll told me. Sorry, I think I've gone a little off topic for you, but at the end of the day, like I just feel like those experiences are invaluable. University shouldn't just be about going in and sitting in a classroom, listening to your lecturer and then going home. That's how some classes were and I am disappointed for me and for other students who let that be all that happened in that class. But if you're not getting what you need from your class, that's not academic. If you're not getting that social aspect, you need to put yourself out there, join a club. Even if it's just going to like the on campus cabin and just seeing who's around, there's always a bunch of clubs meeting there socially. It might just bump into the right person who is the right path for you. And that's I think what makes university different from high school is that you get to find life-minded people. And you're meant to be having fun. This isn't just, oh, I'm studying. You're meant to also, it's work life balance. It's what sets you up for the real world. If you can't not multitask but spread your time, I feel like that's something that really set me up well. And because of putting myself out there and getting involved in different clubs and sports and organisations, that's really helped me adjust here in Tamil. So speaking of spreading time, how do you find balancing work internships and study? Well, in all honesty, it's not very easy. Probably the hardest time came during the postgraduate year because that's a really intense course. That was, I don't know if it still is, but it was Tuesday to Friday. So basically 7am to 6pm, and you get a lunch break. And that's about it. It's a really intense program. And so for those of us who did need that financial support, which most of us did, our only available time for actual paid work was basically Friday night through Monday night because the rest of the time we were in classes or preparing shows or scheduling interviews and it was just, it was crazy. But I know for me, like I ran the local tavern at the Dune Club campus. So I would head straight down there on a Friday after classes and then I was there all day Monday setting up things for the rest of the week. And then when I got the opportunity at 10, I did the same thing. I worked on weekends and then worked all day Monday. And I think if it's a job that you're passionate about, whether it links to your field of study or not, I think you can always make it work. And especially I'm lucky I had the support that I didn't need to be pushing. And some colleagues who were working at bars and stuff who were going all day uni and then were working all night till like 3am because they were working in a nightclub and they really needed that, you know, keep the roof on. But it's rough sometimes, but you pretty much work out that there is a lot of time in the day that you're not properly utilising. And that's just, I guess, something that you'd learn as you go with the program that I did. Your internships were kind of built into your course. So instead of having class for those three weeks, during that time I was at an internship or I was on WorkX. That's what I experienced, sorry. So it didn't really the only part of study that you had to balance with WorkX. Experience was, you know, making sure that you still were giving ample time to assignments. But when they're things like radio shows and podcasts and various other aspects, you know, those are things that as you know, you can't have a lot of time. And so it's really bad to say, but you kind of learn not to sleep, which probably isn't a great advice. But you make it work and you kind of have to lay it all out in front of you and I'm a very visual person. And I just kind of looked and I'm like, okay, this is what I've got and this is what I need, how do I make this work? And sometimes it means, you know, missing out on Friday night breaks because you just want to go home and sleep. Or it means you know, asking for help, help is the best thing that you can ask for. It does suck sometimes, but if you're struggling, but you know that you really want something. Don't be afraid to ask the help because the majority of the time someone else is thinking it too. And that's just something that comes with everything like when you, you do venture out into the world. If you're going to need to ask for help for some moving furniture or just getting something sorted like you can't always do everything on your own as much as you might try. I've learned it the hard way, but that finding that work, study balance. If you're really struggling, talk to your professors, talk to your tutors, talk to the people who actually have power to do something to help you. Don't just talk to mum and dad and friends like, if this is something that's actually impacting on your studies, go talk to your professor and explain to them the situation. They're not going to think that you're just trying to get out of work. You say to them, "up front, look, I'm really struggling with this. Do you have advice? I'm not trying to get out of this. I just, I need some support. If you can't give it to me, can you point me in the right direction of where I can get that resource?" And if you just ask usually someone, if they don't know, they will find someone who does. And that's the best thing because professors would rather know what's going on in your head. And then if you get something that's maybe not as good as what they're used to expecting from you, there's that context and they go, "They call you up on it and they're like, "Hey, what was going on? This isn't you." But if they know that's what's going around, they can help you. It's not a handout. They want you to do well. They're not there to try and catch you out on something. It's not the same kind of, not that high school teachers do this, but it's not that, you know, everyone is held to the same thing. Only one piece fits at university. Like, elements can be molded, if that makes sense. And all you've got to do is ask for it because the worst thing that they can say is no. Like, if something, if an internship is really pushing you and you go, "Look, I'm giving everything into this internship because it's going to give me a real world opportunity." And if I can impress this guy, he might offer me a job because I've heard through the great find that, you know, there's a casual spot off opening up, and that could be my step, but I'm really struggling with this assignment. If you let them know, they're more than likely to give you, like, an extension. Or they're more than likely to help you get somewhere that maybe isn't an extension, but, you know, it's a bit of leeway. And it's all about just asking for that support. You're not asking them to go easy on you. You're just saying, "Hey, this is my situation. What do you recommend? Is there anything we can do?" Because the worst thing they can say is no, and then you're still in the same boat that you were. But if you had asked goodness knows what they could have said, and you could have been in a completely different spot. So just, you know, lay it all out and see what happens, I guess. Is there anything you wish you knew before commencing study at university? I mean, I kind of wish that I knew that I was going to love reporting more. Maybe I could have been a bit better before I finished on my studies, but not a fancy post-gradier. I guess I just wish that if you're something that you wish you knew before college, I feel that I was maybe a bit more excited about it. For someone who didn't exactly enjoy high school, you know, I was excited about university, but you know, the studying aspect got so much. And it's not say that the party was just like the whole, you know, the intense learning aspect. But then once I got there, like, that's not how I was going to be. was done and it wasn't how it was done to ECU anyway. It was all about nurturing the student opposed to pushing the information down the throat. I kind of wish that I'd known a little bit about more how the education system worked and how that would further impact on what grades because it's not as simple as an ABCD as such but I think those are the things you learn in your first and second year that really help you become a better student and a better like I guess member of the university community and I guess for anyone who like is looking something in comms like just just put yourself out which is you know easier to say but that's the beauty of this kind of a Bachelor of Media and Communications and I'm sure it's fairly similar and others is that if you maybe don't really like the broadcasting part of it you can just jump over to the journalist and because they're all shared units and you know you might really find a passion for print or you might go I really like creating something but I don't like being the person like creating something else so then you you fall into PR so I guess just what I would want to know is I would want to tell myself to be more open to the opportunities and I want to say that to someone else just say yes to everything because even if you take a class that doesn't exactly align with that one career it might actually help you build in something else that then doesn't come back and help you move forward. Did you feel or experience any peer pressure while you were at university regarding jobs, career choices and financial independence? I was I'm quite lucky I didn't really have the I don't know if financial financials were a big concern for me I knew that I had a family that if something happened they would be able to support me until I could get back on my feet which I am forever grateful for and I know that not everyone is that lucky or has that opportunity available to them but in terms of I guess peer pressure there is that kind of expectation that you know by graduation day you do have something lined up and I had already been working at 10 throughout the year casually so when I knew that I was getting close they offered me a full-time position which I was forever grateful for and I adored that job that broke my heart to leave but I don't think there was a really a push on career choice I think you just kind of make that you just you find that road when you get there but I know that in other industries they're definitely is that pressure but when it comes to journalism like we're all there's only so many paths you can take and you you pick those up pretty early so even though I wanted to produce I still had to have the the core skills of a reporter um which I didn't really appreciate at the beginning but I sure tell do now that I'm doing it full-time well thanks Phoebe that's it for part one see you after the break welcome back let's talk about life after uni now Phoebe I watched your 10 news first debut of reporting on this beach loving cow called George chilling in the ocean such an adorable story can you share with us more about that oh I love George um a part of my role for it 10 was to find things that would engage people on social media and we're in the middle of a heat stroke a heat stroke a heat wave sorry we're in the middle of a heat wave and someone posted a picture of this cow at the beach and I put it up being like oh what's the craziest thing you've seen this heat wave and all these people just went mad and they're like oh my god it's George and if I found George's own own George apparently frequents the beach quite often and it was such an amazing story to go down and I was able to convince my boss not to just make it a social story make it um for the news bulletin that night and I think George will always have a special place in my heart after that he's just he had such a great story and owner was just so beautiful and made the one half one half hour trip to come down to the beach to put it all together so it was it was pretty special and I guess it's another story that you'd see quite very often the a beach going off to the cow off to the um sorry a candle going off to the beach excuse me there I'm interested how you came across this story and packaged it to present to the public yeah as I was saying um I just randomly came across it on um a Facebook feed and because everything's kind of fake and on the internet and credited the photographer and put it up going what's the craziest thing you guys have seen this heat wave and thinking you know like you know I just seeing cows it's kind of kind of nuts and all of a sudden everyone's like this is George no George goes to the beach and it was just really cool that something that was just one post on Facebook and Twitter just blew up within a matter of minutes and I went oh my god there's a story here and then that story that I did up for the bulletin the next night um my debut debut fatelli that ended up being our top rated story for like six weeks which was a pretty big deal especially is like the war in Ukraine was starting through so like there was a lot of really amazing content being out there and this fun loving beach cow um still at the top of the chart so that was a really proud moment for me as a general and a definitely a story I'll take with me probably for the rest of my life well since you are already in the industry I'm sure our audience would like to know what traits or skills does one need to become a reporter I think the biggest thing that I would recommend is just to say yes to everything you know it's the basics that your parents tend to of you know be kind be courteous always you know need a good first impression but if you get the opportunity to do something or have chat to someone even if you know it might seem a little tedious in the moment um which it really does in all honesty because you find most interesting things out from the most bizarre conversations but just say yes because you don't know what that conversation is going to be about you don't know what that story might lead to it's like you really want to get out there is the only opportunity to get into the industry is to roll auto queue and it's unpaid or like when I was at 10 I was going in on Sundays and working for three just so that I could learn how to write more votes and packages and various other things I was learning how to use the stuff where so that when I eventually did get that opportunity to say do the story with George I knew what I was doing um and you know unfortunately this is this is a elaborate love where um you do have to do quite a bit of unpaid work to you know just get get your foot in the door but if you can if you can put yourself forward and take up those opportunities even if they are unpaid I'm not going to hurt but um it will just give you it will unfold in dividends at the end of the day and really like it all just comes back to one word to say yes what does a reporter's day look like long you know honesty um I usually start my day around half past six get up you know you do the whole press and panther you wash your hair every day which means you blow dry your hair every day full face of makeup you make sure that you know your pants and everything uh ironed and you're looking presentable because then the day you're representing your network so like when I go out and someone sees me they know that like I'm the seven girl um and so I'm not just representing myself as a journalist I'm representing my brand and my works brand so it doesn't mean you have to do big perfect it just means that you have to put a little bit of thought into it which means getting up in the morning sometimes takes a bit more time but no you go in and then you just go chase the stories and um you just you kind of roll with it and that's the beauty of news like something different happens every day and you do have those stories that you chase and they go on for a few weeks or a few days but in the reality of it the news is new and people don't really really care that would happen yesterday so if you make a mistake you're all good because you're moving on to the next one um and I think so far probably one of my favourite stories is definitely George but if we're we're talking about Camelurst um oh I don't know maybe something like um I've done some funky ones I think oh one of my top ones is one of our local boys laying pitman. He was on the voice and he made it through the semi-finals and we got to work hand in hand with him basically doing a story with him every night for the voice ad because we got the inside scoop and that was a pretty amazing experience and you know he's so young and so getting to do that with him that was just that was just a really awesome link to have to the voice and you know it's pretty exciting to think that you know you're creating content and same kind of people who are who are watching that show later on that night so it's a pretty special thing to have and when he gets to do those stories they stick with you. And along your career journey have you come across any challenges and if so how did you deal with them? I think we all have challenges. I think one of the biggest things probably is just getting out there to begin with. A lot of journals and I know even I did find it hard to get that first recording job because you've got to start in the regions because that's where you can learn the most and have sounds bad but you know you can make a few more mistakes and I've learnt since moving to town that the whole country has fatalities so true because they're so lovely here so when I do mess up you know the little thing is like they're so lovely about it and I'm just like oh thank goodness you think I feel terrible and you know they're just they're still so like loving of the news and they stick with you like the loyalty is beautiful but in terms of challenges I think every day comes with it's time to say the challenges but what something top someone told me on the report is it 10 before I made the move she said that your first two years they're going to be days or it's going to be really tough and you're going to cry and you're going to think why am I doing this I don't can't do this too hard she said that but they're the days where you go home you have some ice cream you snuggle up and you go to bed early because tomorrow's next day and sorry tomorrow's the new day and you start a clean slate and I think that's something that's really stuck with me these first six weeks because there have been challenges and I think the way that I deal with those is exactly what I've just told is you know you you accept it you acknowledge it then you go home you have a bit of ice cream and you put yourself to bed and tomorrow's the new day and you see what happens so what advice would you give to someone who wants to explore a career in this field? I would say do what you can to try and get a bit of work experience so that you can find for your passion lies and then also if you're really confident if you're really passionate about it you know just go for it if it means doing a bit more cream style for you know going in volunteering at your local radio station or you know setting up a podcast by yourself or going in calling the local waffle games go and do it because it's only going to help you get better for when someone goes oh yeah what have you done and you can actually show them like has have access to some of that work and even if it's just one thing that you've done you know it's a little TV package that you made on your phone like everyone really appreciates that that's that's still really cool so just let your passion lead you I guess this is what I would want someone to know and what I guess I would have liked to know thank you Phoebe we're onto another break now we'll be back shortly welcome back now it's time for the quick fire question round Phoebe are you ready sure am okay here we go on a scale of one to ten how would you rate your time at ECU seven if you could go back and change one thing what would you change um putting myself out there earlier in my field one word for graduates real one word for future graduates dream what is your hidden talent um make you don't think of her nothing and where do you see yourself in five years i want to be the next stand back that's it for this episode it has been such a pleasure to have you joining us today and giving us an insightful view an opinion on the industry Phoebe thank you so much for having me I'm very very appreciate it are there any last tips that you would like to share with graduating students in your field say yes to everything and if it's not exactly what you think you want that's okay it's just a foot in the door and you know take what you can get because you never know what it's going to lead to thanks again Phoebe and good luck in the future thanks guys thanks for having me and thank you for listening i'll see you all soon goodbye