From Pirro to Zero

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For both major parties, the path to winning America runs through the South. But to win it, you have to understand it. And that's where Long Play comes in. Across six southern states, Long Play examines the issues driving voters and the assumptions that no longer hold in a region that could shape the future of our politics and our country. You can binge the whole series right now by subscribing to Long Play series on YouTube, Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you get your podcasts. Welcome to Pod Save America. I'm Jon Favreau. I'm Jon Lovett. I'm Tommy Vittorio. On today's show, Todd Blanche is getting confirmed as Attorney General after killing Trump's January 6th slush fund. But is it really dead? We'll talk about that and whether Blanche's U.S. Attorney for D.C., Jeanine Pirro, is about to be fired for telling the truth about the reflecting pool, that Trump still says was vandalized. We'll also cover the disturbing case of House Republican Max Miller, what it means for our efforts to flip the House, and what you can do to help flip the House as well. We got more news about cursed DNC Chair Ken Martin, a Michigan primary that's finally ending. And later, I talked to Wisconsin gubernatorial candidate Francesca Hong about her momentum in a huge race that's just seven days from the finish line. But first, it was another eventful weekend where the Commander-in-Chief threatened Iran where the Commander-in-Chief threatened Iran with what he's calling the biggest attack since World War II, only to once again pull back at the very last moment because of alleged talks about an alleged deal that no one can confirm. Iran says it's bullshit. U.S. officials told CBS no new talks have been planned. And by Monday afternoon, Trump put to rest any lingering confusion with his usual clarity. This is at least the fifth time you've turned off airstrikes against Iran since April to negotiate. What is your message? What is your message to the American people who are wondering what has changed this time? Why should it be any different? Well, you don't know. I don't know. I think we're going to maybe get something. But I want to give them every last chance before decapitation. This is the last chance for them to sign a good document. I'm very proud of the fact that I will give people a chance. This is a big move. Iran knew it. They knew what was coming. It was going to come last night. And it would have gone on for a long time. And there'd be -- Essentially, very little left. There'd be nothing left. Okay. Seems like he's about to wrap this thing up, huh? A little time before the decapitation. Queen of farts over here. I was thinking Marie Antoinette. Why do you think Trump called off planned strikes for the 500th time? I think it was a combination of things. I think the Saudis got to him and other Gulf autocrats who pay him bribes. They do not want to see -- Give him planes and stuff. Yeah, give him planes. God knows. What else? They don't want to see a resumption of full-scale combat because, for them, that means the oil and gas industry gets all screwed up. They can't get their exports out. And also the Iranians fire a bunch of missiles and drones at them. So that sucks if you're sitting in Saudi Arabia or Bahrain or Kuwait or whatever. I think MBS, Mohammed bin Salman in particular, was persuasive. There's also this ongoing issue about they don't have enough interceptor missiles to defend from all these Iranian ballistic missile responses. I think Trump also knows it's going to jack up oil and gas prices pretty close to the midterms and probably not materially impact the situation. You're not going to win the war in a weekend. I mean, I think you and I talked about this on Friday. Some of the reports were like, "Trump's got the biggest airstrike barrage since World War II planned. That'll be done by Monday." It's like, "You're not going to win the war." So he's bluffing and he's trying to see if he can use it as leverage. The thing that's driving me crazy, just for a quick aside, you guys remember the whole Syria red line thing? Mm-hmm. That was a fight about Syria policy kind of. Yeah. It was kind of, but the thing everyone in Washington said is presidents don't bluff, right? You can't threaten to do something and then not implement it. And Trump has now done that five times, and all the Republicans who blame the Syria red line for Putin invading Crimea or everything China does are just silent on this now. Yeah, and at this point, I'm sure that the Iranians here are the biggest, most devastating attack since World War II, and they probably just start laughing. They're like, "We just beat you in a previous war." Well, it's also like, how many times? How many cycles? Can we go through? We're going to obliterate your society. We're going to send you back to the Stone Age. Yeah, sure you are. And then it's called off by the time the markets open on Monday over and over again. The thing that's scary to me is, at some point, he's going to have to follow through. There's only so many times we can do this cycle, especially because the Iranians are not being cooperative with what Trump wants, which is to pretend there's negotiations. Because, you know, go along with what I'm saying. Why are you being so difficult in not confirming my ridiculous vacillations in the story? I'm telling about how my threat of terrible violence brought you back to the table. Remember a couple weeks ago when you said they had killed off all the hardliners, and now the remaining people were more practical? Did you guys see the CNN story with the headline, "U.S. Military Asks Troops for Creative and Unconventional Ideas to Punish Iran"? Yeah. War crimes brainstorm. It's time. Everybody, we're doing a mood board. Everybody, everybody into the conference room. We're doing a mood board. Guys, guys, all bad ideas in a brainstorm. I mean, that tells you something, that maybe they're sort of out of, clearly they're out of ideas. The bluffing is getting trickier to pull off. It really does feel like a writer's room, not a war plan. Fucking goobers. So Trump did get much closer to having a full-fledged attorney general after Todd Blanch finally did what the president has refused to do. He posted a letter showing that he'd formally rescinded the order creating the general. He said, "I'm not going to do it." He said, "I'm going to do it." He said, "I'm going to do it." He said, "I'm going to do it." most. Trump had their fucking number. They were as weak and craven and pathetic as he thought. And he has been proven right. And these pieces of paper aren't worth a fucking thing. Yeah. Trump said the slush fund was a gift, Todd, and I'm taking it with me. I don't believe for a second this is dead. You can you can move him off of bad policies, but you can't really move him off of something he wants personally. And this is money in his pocket. If he can avoid IRS audits forever or have a slush fund, then he can divvy out for political power. Trump is not remotely embarrassed about this fund. It is quite clear that he thinks this is something that he is owed by us, the taxpayers. So I this I have zero I put zero stock in this terrible idea of being dead. This is this is Michael Myers. This will keep coming back and coming back and coming back. And I think he will fight for it until he gets what he wants. The only thing that might kill it is Democrats winning the House. Yeah. Our friend Skye Perryman, a lawyer who's been suing the Trump administration for Democracy Forward, she made the point to The New York Times that, you know, if the Justice Department truly intended to end the fund, they would submit the sworn declaration that the court has requested on this, which would be more binding than a fingers crossed promise from Todd Blanch that does not include the signature, as you so love it, of Donald Trump. So I would imagine this goes the way of everything else, like, you know, I don't know. I don't know if this is a good thing. The ICE detentions that have now ramped back up as soon as the news cycle moves on. And Todd Blanch is attorney general. They will quietly start paying out individual January 6th convicts and other people that they like. And, you know, we'll get some report months from now that, oh, someone discovered that people are getting payouts from the Trump administration and someone will ask him about it. And he'll be like, well, I said it was unfair, but I don't know anything about that. And then that'll be that. This is also the whole thing is so ridiculous because what are we negotiating over here? We have. Well, we've got a lot of people here. We've got a lot of people here. We'll get to it. But we have the president threatening to fire prosecutors simply for telling the truth about the prosecution of someone who didn't deserve to be prosecuted. We have Todd Blanch in front of Congress saying that DOJ is not independent. We have so many reports about the politicization of the Justice Department under Pam Bondi and now Todd Blanch. And their final act is to stop what is like the fund is so it is so far beyond anything anyone could have ever seen from a president, a slush fund for fucking insurrectionists. And this is what they're going to pat themselves on the back about this is as they have no political fights left to fight as Trump has like made enemies of them. Can you imagine the reverse of Trump being like, I'm going to, you know, like as a senator being like, even though you humiliated me, I'm going to I'm going to do the right thing for your cabinet nominee. It's ridiculous. It's ridiculous. Good to run on in the midterms. Anyone who look, a lot of these people are going to vote to confirm Todd Blanch. And if I'm interested to see what Susan Collins and Dan Sullivan and John Husted do, because if you voted to confirm Blanch, you basically voted for the slush fund. So any ad about that is completely fair. No, no, no doubt. So Blanch is in. But Trump's U.S. attorney for the District of Columbia may be out on Friday afternoon. Former and now maybe future Fox News host Janine Pirro announced in a court filing that the Justice Department would be dropping its case against former Olympian David Hearn, who had been facing a felony charge for allegedly vandalizing the reflecting pool. But Pirro and the DOJ now admit, according to the court filing, that the damages to the pool were the result of a quote, hasty and botched installation, not vandalism. No shit. The Department of Justice went on to accuse the Department of the Interior of knowing it wasn't vandalism and misleading prosecutors about what really happened. Take that, Doug Burgum. Trump, surprise, surprise, is furious. Have you spoken to Janine Pirro about her decision to drop? No, Janine Pirro made a mistake. It was vandalism. We have photographs or tapes like moving cameras, right? We have them where people are on the side for sure, cutting it with a box knife. Now, I'm not saying I was 100% thrilled with the contractor, but the contractor was rushing. We wanted to get it open for July 4th and we got it done. It looked beautiful. And then they cut it. The judge was extremely unfriendly. And frankly, I think she choked. And I was disappointed with Janine Pirro, really disappointed with Janine Pirro. She folded like an umbrella. That was the closest he's come to sounding like he did in The Celebrity Apprentice. It's like the boardroom and he's about to fire someone. Yeah, it's like meatloaf. You didn't make the taco restaurant operate at a profit, yet over at the Bubblers were too loud on the Memorial. Janine Pirro, you're fired. That's the best part, saying they had to turn off the deflecting pool Bubblers because it would have interfered with the UFC fight. A gurgling fountain would have distracted 5,000 people cheering, someone's face getting bashed in. The roar of the pool pump. Apparently, Pirro and Burgum were seen after that walking into the Oval Office and then Burgum was seen walking out, but Pirro is still in there. Now, by the time you're listening to this, probably by the time we finish recording this, she could already be done. So long, Janine, it sounds like. What a fucking mess this was. Hopefully. What a fucking mess. Yeah. Also, before people go saying, clearly, it seems like this was written in anger, clearly annoyed at whatever they were getting from the Interior Department. But regardless, the idea that the Department of Justice, even after doing the right thing here, in between fucking getting an indictment for this guy and letting him go, your entire story was reversed. What kind of evidence did you get? What kind of evidence were you basing this on when you brought the charges in the first place? Why did you have to learn so much after you decided to try to ruin a man's life that you would eventually decide to drop it? I guess because you thought it wouldn't hold up in court. Yeah. I mean, the only reason they had to come clean is because if you knowingly submit false evidence in court, you can be charged with perjury and you can go to jail and you can be punished by state bar associations and deal with all their problems. So Doug Burgum is just like, oh, I'll just lie in the court of public opinion, like no skin off my ass. But Judge Janine, it doesn't matter how many chardonnays you have. You cannot lie before the judge. I mean, there's always a spot on the five for her. Oh, yeah, that's they'll make it the six. I know this one seems small and silly and it's kind of fun because it's, you know, Trump's renovations and it's the reflecting pool and it's so obviously a lie. But like this guy was charged with a felony. It's crazy. Had to get lawyer was like facing jail time. And it was all because of an obvious lie that everyone knew was an obvious lie. And they all I mean, there's all you can look for them anywhere. These clips all over the place of Caroline Leavitt, Donald Trump, Janine Pirro being like it's it's evidence. We have evidence that we're going to present in court and we know it. And it was the box cutter. And just a lie the entire time. But one of them one of the more brazen lies they've ever told. Yeah, there's one there's some interview with with where someone's questioning Janine Pirro about this. And you realize, like, she doesn't totally know the facts. Like, well, did he have a knife? Like, no, no, no. He did it with his hands. He's like, I'm sorry, what are you saying? This this this could this 67 year old canoeist is like, well, like swimming through the pool, ripping up Wolverine. What are we talking about? It's crazy. Right. Like, it's crazy. Do this. Yeah, no, this is it's a good look. Yeah, I'm with you. This story, like, didn't seize me when it came out in the same way. The East Wing kind of story didn't like really. It wasn't the thing I care the most about. But what I think I've come to realize over time is how much symbols matter and how much it's made this corruption stories breakthrough. We can talk about, you know, day trading from the Oval Office and the amount of money Trump is making. But like stats and stats and figures are not going to break through as much as a simple narrative like this, where you have Trump's, you know, selfishness and ego leading a innocent man to be fucking prosecuted or, you know, tearing down the East Wing or whatever. These symbols really matter. They make these stories breakthrough. I think it's like impacted him politically. Also, it's coming on a day when. The attorney general nomination is about to be carried through like there are two Republicans just decided to give their votes to like give their imprimatur to how this Department of Justice is being run in any other era at any other time. This would be like you. Of course, we need to bring Todd Blanch before the Senate again to find out what does he think about this? Was he aware of this prosecution? Does he think Jean-Pierre was in the wrong? Does he think now he's got an out because if Trump fires or he'll be like, absolutely good. The president did the right thing. This was bad. This is not how we're going to run the Justice Department. All right. All right. All right. All right. All right. Justice Department. Well, let's see what happens now. He of course, he wouldn't have said that if Trump didn't fire. And also, what were you aware of these charges? Do you believe Doug Burgum misled the Department of Justice? Right. Like, let's there needs to be some resolution of of these facts, because now we have Trump and the Interior Department head saying that it was still a crime and that this person should still be prosecuted. The it's not over either, because David Hearn's lawyer has basically said that I think he told CNN that all options are on the table. And among those options, according to CNN, he's going with the Iran attack. Except options are referring the prosecutors involved to a bar disciplinary authority, filing lawsuits, seeking more of the grand jury recording, documenting the prosecutor's presentation of the indictment, because they did get an indictment, asking the judge to dismiss the case. So it can't be brought again, because Pura's office only dismissed it without prejudice, meaning that. Prosecutors wouldn't be barred from attempting to revive the case later. So they need to go further and make sure that they can never bring it again. Tough case to bring again when you have the prosecutor. saying that they were misled by the Department of. Tough, but not unprecedented for this guy. Sure, sure. These assholes. I would say, my question would be, are we suing these? Let's get this guy some cash. Sue the shit out of him. Get some cash for this guy. Get some more documents released. Pod Save America is brought to you by Article. 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Speaking of Trump cabinet kooks, RFK Jr., he made an appearance on CNN's State of the Union with Dana Bash on Sunday morning for a thoughtful conversation about the nation's health. Let's take a listen. I will literally eat anything because I don't have I don't have I don't have a gag reflex. Let me put it like that. That's what Lindsey Graham said in heaven. Wow. Wow. I just wanted to play that for you guys. That was not that was not the Dana Bash conversation but that is what the Health and Human Service Secretary is up to. It's such a weird way to describe why you'll eat anything. It's not like I have a adventurous palate. I enjoy all kinds of food. It's like nothing makes me puke. I don't have a gag reflex. Okay. Good to know. Write it down. All right. Let's check out the actual conversation with Dana Bash. Do you think the COVID vaccine protected children? I think that what I have talked to scientists and doctors about You've talked to scientists. Can you look can you show me one study? Yes. Let me finish. You are saying nonsense. You are saying something that you cannot show me. A single study I am not saying nonsense. You are talking what somebody told you. Excuse me. And you cite me the study. What study? No. What studies are you talking about? You're talking about studies that actually don't exist. And I really want to move on. But you are saying you are part of the problem. No. I wasn't part of the problem. There was absolute press malpractice. Okay. Are you going to you want to sit here and attack me? Or do you want to have conversations about public health? I'm not attacking you. I'm asking questions about how to prevent the next And let me ask the question and I'll tell you. That's what I'm trying to do. But Dana, you probably don't understand this because you're not a scientist but genes don't cause it. Well, you're not either. So, what did you guys think of that uncomfortable and somewhat infuriating interview? So, it is so hard. 20 minutes that went by. 20 minutes. And it's a brutal 20 minutes. And it is very difficult to in real time fact check someone who is all over the fucking place mischaracterizing studies asking you to prove the negative in the next sentence grabbing for all kinds of things. The Mennonites aren't vaccinated. Actually, Lyme disease is from gain-of-function research and you're all over the place. And this is where it's like, you know what? I think Dana trying to call upon the history of recalling expertise and things you've imbibed and this is where I think what makes it so difficult is that RFK his whole life his whole thesis, right? Is that like this is all pretty nefarious, right? He says like, oh, the ICUs were actually empty. They were lying about basically how full all the ICUs were because they were trying to scare people and control people. You're being misled by all the experts and I'm the one here to tell the truth and you're just going to recite the experts that I have the real facts about. But he doesn't. Like RSV is not from gain-of-function research. That's a lie. Lyme disease is not Lyme disease is not from gain-of-function research. They found the Lyme disease bacteria in a 5,000-year-old prehistoric fossil. COVID, COVID multiple studies have shown that COVID protects show me one study that COVID vaccines protect kids. Tons of studies show that COVID protects kids. There was one that found that the only kids in the ICU from inflammation due to COVID were unvaccinated kids just over and over and over again. These like, you can't show me this and you can't show me that. Well, maybe not while sitting there kind of being peppered with bullshit from RFK Jr. with sort of misogynistic you're not a scientist shit. But of course, he's just like, you know, dissembling and misleading and lying about what the evidence is. Yeah, I mean, I think she did a good job at some time at some points less good at the other like the very top. He says the US had the highest death rate from COVID. That's just not even close to true. Peru had the highest death rate per capita. We had the highest death toll, but that's largely a function of having the third highest population in the world. Yeah, we're down to like 18 for something something the teens for. Yeah, and also they get into this weird place where like a bunch of countries with, you know, less stable governments don't have the resources to collect all the data. So we don't really know all this stuff. She asked the question about she asked him about gain of function research and then he came back with this lie saying RSV and Lyme disease were created by gain of function research, which is just unequivocally not true. And I think you do have to be prepared on that one to be like that is absolutely not true. The question phrasing itself was kind of strange was sort of like in defense of gain of function research. I'm not sure that was the most valuable question. And then she kept pushing to move on, which is complicated because then you kind of sound slippery. I think it got better and more constructive in the measles section because she really just wanted to pin him down and get him to say, yes, like get your kid the MMR vaccine. There's a horrible measles outbreak is deadly for kids. But then RFK says I never questioned the efficacy of the MMR vaccine. Yes, he did. He said it wanes. He called it leaky. That's a lie. It's like 90% effective. It has lifelong protection. 90% of measles cases are unvaccinated people or of an unknown status. Now I had to research all of that. Right. To like kind of fact check this guy. It is why he's already so slippery and condescending. But like when you interview that guy, that's the job. Yeah, I think this is how conspiracy theorists, especially with science and medicine, this is how they work. Right. Which is scientific judgment is not like every single scientist and every single study for all of time agrees on the same thing. It's the preponderance of evidence points one direction. Maybe there's one study that says something else. And then the conspiracy theorist latches on to the one study and is like, well, why maybe that's the study. Maybe that's the study that actually tells the truth and all the other experts are wrong. And every time she could cite a study, he could cite a study back. The best way to get him is tell me what you just said, which is if he claims that he said something, you can be like, no, this is actually what you said, you know, and you can put it up. Yeah, put it up. But or just say study these nuts. It's also a safe and effective way to reply. But when you're going when you're going study by study and science by science, this is this is like, you know, it was a microcosm of how we all fucked up the pandemic so badly, right? Is that it's just a bunch of now everyone can go find their own research and can go find some study or some scientist or some asshole on Twitter who debunks scientific evidence that is overwhelming. Like that is that's the whole story of how we how we went through the pandemic. Yeah, it's like now the guy's fucking health and human services. Right. And he's like also just to brought more broadly, right, deeply mischaracterizes the body of research on autism from, uh, vaccines to Tylenol in part because if you're doing tons and tons of studies, one study may show a correlation and then some more research is done and they say, you know what? Actually, we took that correlation research and we ran another analysis across a much bigger sample to see what would happen between siblings. Right. And actually turns out that that correlation doesn't produce causation when you look at it another way. And this is a much deeper bit of research. And so, you know, while nothing is ever known for certain, we believe this is just sort of something that you can say there is no evidence for. That's not acceptable. But this is why I come back to the ICU thing. Like, why? what is like this is where i think you have to go like so you're saying all of these scientists are lying or misleading because what they they want kids to get sick they want kids to get all the newsrooms are lying to newsrooms were saying that new york city ers were full and they were making it up what on earth are you donald trump was president if that were happening he would have gotten to the bottom of it that's his hometown and it's fucking insane and what's the motivation that they just they wanted everyone to stay home they wanted to scare people they wanted to scare people by mail eventually that to have everyone stay home and then i guess they all probably had you know uh business connections to the pharmaceutical companies and that's big yeah well to try to get the the vaccine that's why they're all pushing the vaccine well this was also like there were people running around with video cameras trying to prove that the icu's in their town or their place were empty and i was like well that's not the covid ward and by the way yeah like they're worried there's about to be a huge influx of patients etc etc and like it's all this idea that they're going to get the vaccine and they're going to get the vaccine and they're like you can't trust anybody you can't trust the experts you can't trust the science like do do these did fauci and all do they like uh you know there was plenty of ways in which they were trying to be i think you know too declarative afraid of giving people nuance because they they weren't able to they weren't sure what they could trust the public with in part because there were so much so much misinformation but these were people desperately trying to figure out what to do in the middle of an emergency and he sits there like kind of leaning back being like it was all a lie they were all lying and it's so fucking disgusting but this is the whole i mean this all came from the the fauci hearings last week which we didn't really talk about on the pod but um basically they decided that because uh they found that in fauci's you know private journal he was like it's so cool to be me and meet celebrities i'm like the most famous person in the world they're like that shows that he killed everyone fauci's like butt dialed barbara streisand again what a voice and they're like exactly like sir that proves it that proves that you did everything wrong like yeah god forbid we have an egomaniac in charge is is it great for uh medical research in the scientific community to have the clips out there of fauci pleading the fifth however many times in front of this hearing terrible obviously is terrible do i understand why he did it from a legal perspective kind of i read half an article on this because i'm not obsessed with like i do think i am there is like i'm just kidding like it was just sort of an asymmetric story where republicans are obsessed with this and democrats are like i want to think of anything but the pandemic it was the worst couple years of my life none of us want to go back yeah but um yeah it is just i don't know bobby kennedy man that's who's in charge all right it's primary day in michigan uh and we got some midterm news to talk about including a big announcement of our own today vote save america is launching what we're calling the crooked dozen uh 12 of the most vulnerable house republicans who we can put out of a job this november but we need your help dear listener uh if you go to vote save america.com right now and sign up uh you will get practical concrete steps that you can take to help flip this seats and lots of others up and down the ballot you're going to get information on where to donate where to volunteer how to make sure your friends and family are getting the best information about the races lots more information it literally takes two seconds to sign up at vote save america.com um and if you're already signed up grab a couple friends have them sign up too we're trying to get as many people as possible we did this back with the crooked seven back in 2018 worked pretty damn well then did yeah i think we got them got almost all of them um and uh yeah so we're trying to we're trying to uh raise money for the democratic candidates who are going to take these folks on and also uh just get some volunteers going um as an added incentive uh we do have some news about one of the crooked dozen uh max miller the republican representing ohio's seventh district south of cleveland uh you may already be following this incredibly disturbing story in 2024 miller and his wife emily moreno who's the daughter of republican senator bernie moreno got divorced and the custody battle for their two-year-old daughter ended up in court as part of that court fight emily moreno said that miller repeatedly abused her scalding her with hot water holding a gun to her head and breaking their daughter's collarbone the allegations which miller denies started getting more attention over the last week or so when uh senator moreno refused to comment or call for his ex-son-in-law to resign and to quit his campaign miller then delivered a 20-minute live stream statement on sunday morning where he did not drop out uh but accused emily moreno of being a stalker and saying things like this if i had assaulted her would she had offered to cook me dinner six days later would she have invited me to spend an afternoon at the playground with her and our daughter would she have written that we were in a friendlier place no she wouldn't have ladies and gentlemen the boiling water story the media has run with that story is about an incident in june of 2024 while we were still in the water and here's the truth and this is the absolute truth it was horseplay in our kitchen if these accusations were true i would be in jail that is just um he also posted and then deleted a dropbox folder of audio he'd recorded of her uh some of which contradicted his own claims so then he took it down um after that disgusting display bernie moreno the senator his former uh father-in-law finally spoke out posted a long statement uh that said among other things that the two years since the divorce have been pure hell that he holds his breath every time miller has custody of his granddaughter and that quote if there are any basic standards of character required to hold elected office max miller fails them he should not serve in the house of representatives miller then immediately called him a liar um so i assume there's been a groundswell of republicans now calling for miller to step aside right i uh trump was in in the oval office asked about that um and said uh well he's a good person good person terrible situation you know i guess the family will have to decide the family will have to decide what do you guys make of the whole situation i mean max miller should be in prison not congress period um he is lying abusive scum this is not the only instance of him being accused of abuse he was accused of beating his ex-girlfriend stephanie grisham who worked in the trump white house she said he threw her up against a wall and slapped her politico reported that miller pushed a female high school classmate down a flight of stairs and she was able to get out of the car she was able to get out of the car upstairs because she refused his sexual advances uh there's another alleged incident of miller abusing a woman in college we don't really know the details there but it's been mentioned in court transcripts uh he had a bunch of violent fights and incidents in high school or in his early 20s so this guy is uh clearly has a pattern of alleged abuse um and i think that should be enough for him to be thrown out of congress but republicans have not most republicans either just duck the question or you know want to preserve their majority now like there's a lot of focus has been put on bernie moreno um and his response he's the ohio senator his daughter is the one making these allegations i think my my gut reaction when i read his when he wouldn't respond was like that he had failed his basic job as a father and was a coward and um to really condemn him more than others the more i thought about it the more i was like i don't know i you don't know what's happening inside a family you don't know what his conversations with his daughter are like you don't know the fear that he could have about his granddaughter who had joint custody so i don't know i feel like i need to dial it back his wife emily's mother yeah it's complicated and so like she was really upset and so i think he didn't i mean but like whatever he got it done but like jim jordan was on uh congressman jim jordan was on tv um and was asked about this i think it was cnn or maybe his ms now um and just absolutely will not drop it moral line in the sand for this man who's clearly a fucking scumbag well jim jordan is sort of a history of this refusing to do that yeah the the like the the statement from bernie moreno makes clear that he felt like he was trying to avoid speaking out about it on his daughter's behalf trump uh is refusing uh to condemn him which is leading to no one else being willing to call on him to resign if he doesn't step back by wednesday i believe he'll be on the ballots uh so uh he's hanging on now if max miller seems to have this history he's obviously there are these allegations in this marriage there's allegations in previous relationships allegations of other violence in the past whatever bit has been said publicly that means that there are that that like stephanie grisham was close to donald trump that means that there are people it that like the senators are aware of this other members of the house are aware of this the white house is aware of this that this guy is fucking violent piece of shit and they have all just been what silent about it ignoring about it keeping their heads down trump called him a good person he's basically a character witness should say too that um what broke this whole thing open was abby vasoulas of mother jones party there like she broke the story on july 18th where she just went through all the court documents that were out there and all the filings and it is i mean it's it's a tough read but like a child protection specialist reviewed the incident characterized the bruising near the fracture as resembling a handprint now miller's story is that the daughter it was a seat belt that like the car stopped short whatever the emily moreno doesn't believe this of course and then the child protection specialist said it's a handprint and um apparently the the daughter said daddy's house is scary uh to her mother and also he contradicted himself in the court filings because first he said he didn't pour hot water on her neck and then he said in the next sentence well the water incident i never thought that that hurt you there's no horseplay with boiling water no which is basically admitting that it was uh that he actually did it so he's a liar he's had a violent past he obviously should not be believed and it is crazy that republicans are not immediately immediately calling for this guy to to drop out of congress drop out of the race let alone congress yeah i it's disgusting every i mean like doing that to a two-year-old makes you want to drive over to his house with a baseball bat and solve it that way right i mean that that's the part that's like the whole story is absolutely sickening this is an evil person i hope they indict him and lock him up and i hope every single republican is forced to have to answer the questions about this and like and just stammers into the fucking camera because you know none of them can cross trump because trump didn't tell him to drop out it's not just him i mean there's a guy named cory mills who's another republican from florida who is accused of uh some sort of physical abuse of a woman he was also accused of like sextortion uh and uh the threatening to release nude images of her um and republicans again they just pretend this is not happening i mean he's under investigation by the house ethics committee for like some sorts of violations but no one's calling for his expulsion and it's like with miller too he's like well i'm not going to drop out for uh people who want to try this in the court of public opinion it's like no no it's not being tried in the court of public opinion we have actual court court documents that's where it is like we have we have filings from court we have we have testimony this is not just uh hearsay that people are talking about there's actual documents about this fucking pot tape america is brought to you by ag1 summer means enjoying yourself and taking it easy maybe some of your wellness goals took a back seat in the process but that's okay now that you're getting back on track make ag1 the non-negotiable part of your routine one scoop eight ounces of cold water every morning before the chaos starts ag1 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messages or anything else from the last few days of uh of campaigning you know we're got a little heated you did get a little heated there's this one number that jumped out at me which is just sort of as a preview of coming attractions because we we don't know what's going to happen tomorrow but uh that in i think is the emerson poll that under 50 uh abdul is leading hayley stevens 67 to 25 over 60 stevens is leading 53 to 39 and like that is like remarkable that is a crazy gap and it just like whatever happens in this race whether or not hayley stevens and you know whatever 30 to 60 million whatever number from apac in ads plus concerns that abdul will lose to micro whatever it is if whatever eking out a victory that is possible tomorrow like this tells you the direction that the party is going and if people want an alternative to left candidates or if they think the left candidates don't represent their point of view like i think we've seen over and over again that that unless there is a center left that can or center that can offer something more exciting persuasive optimistic uh something for people to like grab onto uh i think though like the the establishment will keep being surprised by um when given the choice between our candidate or else like people keep choosing or else yeah i think so much of the conversation about this race is focused on the meta stakes and what it means for the party and also the uh the exchanging of barbs you know the attacks and the money sure a lot of trading apac and stuff but i was um i was reading this new rush with uh the healthcare industry in this country and how fun it can be and i was reminded why i'm so excited about his candidacy like he is a uh fundamentally optimistic hopeful guy who brings real expertise as a doctor and a health professional to the job not rk junior level no he is like an incredibly talented speaker he's a good human being we're lucky enough to know him um and i'm just it just reminded me to be excited about him and the fact that he's could potentially be a u.s senator um and you know there was this graph in the story that really just jumped out at me that i wanted to read about because he he talks about how his story and his parents story is only possible in america this sort of like fundamentally patriotic optimistic story and then he couches you're like why he is hopeful about fixing the broken u.s healthcare system in his optimism about america as well he says the thing about america is that we don't do things like other people we do them better i love that about our country and that's obviously very like obama 08 coded and part of why i like it and i think there's a risk of um just cut and not cut and pasting but like you know that rhetoric from that era it was a different time the world is the electorate now is in a darker place economic equality is worse younger people uh feel even more hopeless about the system about the economy about their prospects in life so you don't want to just kind of like repeat you know the obama era optimism but i do think um because it could sound naive but i do think that what abdul is getting at is talking about problems and systemic challenges but then giving people some hope that he actually can fix it or that we have the capacity to fix them as a nation and i think that has been missing in a lot of the political debate that is either just about trump or about how you know cooked we are because of capitalism yeah the national discourse has sort of lumped in all the left candidates together is like you know they're all socialists and they all believe the same thing and it's all you know that none of them are able to win and you know for some have pretty extreme positions and we've talked about them before and you know i've been even critical of some of uh you know the way abdul has said some things too over the in this race but i thought that was the i thought this was the best interview that he has given and if you are uh open-minded and still unsure about abdul like i would absolutely read this with david remnick and then in the new yorker i thought it was really really great um it's good to be here and it's great to be here and it's great to be here and it's great to be here and it is going to be a difficult general election and you know the the gold standard poll in michigan came out over the weekend and has him uh down a few to mike rogers and hayley stevens performed better in that poll um i don't think that means he can't win by any means but i think that um what he's going to have to do to be victorious is exactly what he did i think in that interview and talk like he did in that interview and um because it shows a lot of country it's like a liberal patriotism he talks about how he's a capitalist he talks about he's criticized he's criticized obama in the past as we know he was very complimentary and he just he seems extremely thoughtful like he just didn't get into this race because he wanted to like throw out slogans and all this kind of stuff like it seems like he has fought all this stuff through especially health care yeah he's just a really really smart guy who is like hands-on experience tackling these problems and will be really good at the job and it's exciting to think about not what they'd be like in the job and i think post post primary assuming of dual wins we don't know but a lot of the polls suggest he will he will have to do a lot of work to kind of get back hayley stevens supporters um i think he's done a really good job in recent weeks of kind of tamping down supporters who cross the line who like make fun of hayley stevens in ways that are just sexist or inappropriate or just mean um there's going to have to be more of that you know like after burn when it looked like bernie was winning in 2020 a lot of his supporters were telling other people to bend the knee and shit like that and it's just like such a toxic terrible way to consolidate an um and then it'll be incumbent on everyone no matter how bruised their feelings are to just remember that this is about, you know, winning the Senate seat and denying Mike Rogers this election and making it a referendum on Trump. Like a vote for Rogers is a vote for Trump. And Rogers is trying to kind of avoid all hard questions. Like I don't know if you guys saw. Is he a semaphore thing? Yeah. He won't talk about the weaponization fund. He wouldn't comment on Iran. How would he, so Nicholas Wood did this interview with him. How would he vote on the multiple Senate approved measures to condemn president Donald Trump's tariffs? I don't know. Where does he stand on Trump's anti-weaponization fund? Quote, I'm not talking about any of that stuff. I don't care. I mean, I care. As for the Iran war, he said he'd heard, quote, hardly anything from constituents on the trail about it. This guy has been living in Florida. Florida. Yeah. So he retired, bought a house in Florida, tried to run in 2024, lost to Slotkin. And now he's trying to revive himself again. So like, yes, he definitely should tie him to Trump and with good reason. But like Mike Rogers just is a character on his own. He is just looking to be defined right out of the gate. And I think that like, if I, that's like number one on Abdul's list or if Haley wins her list. As part of the corruption story of Trump, like Trump, like this guy was in government, lost, left, and went and made a bunch of money, you know, like helping out the industries he used to regulate. Yeah. This whole idea that he is maybe more moderate or more old school Republican establishment than some of these guys. Like, I think that the, the corruption and the tie to Trump and just sort of the like out of touch. Sort of vibes he gives off from having been in Florida for a while and not really caring about all these issues is, is a real weakness for him, but it's gotta be exploited. Yeah. Like this is where sometimes there's just, we're going to do politics. It may be, maybe Abdul starts a little bit further behind than Haley Stevens would. Okay. Do you believe in politics? Do you believe in the ability to persuade? Do you think Abdul will be a better Senator than Mike Rogers? I do. Do you think it's more important to have a democratic Senate than any criticism or concern you might have about Abdul's being further left than you? I do. So maybe other people can be persuaded. I think we can be persuaded of that as well. As long as everybody kind of after this primary is over, figures out how to come together. Like there've been moments in this, look, there, there's the left is a big fractious group of people. There've been moments in a lot of these primaries where it is clear that some people who are part of these problems, primaries care more about winning factional fights against Democrats than they do about actually beating Republicans. There have been bad moments in interviews where I think Abdul has reflected that aspect of the movement, but when he is at his best, when he is speaking about what governing can actually do, a kind of broad and optimistic, uh, vision for the country. I think, yes, that is somebody that has absolutely can kind of build support in Michigan, especially with someone who's supposed to be like the toughest one to beat Mike Rogers. Like, come on, like, I think that I think like everybody needs to like, kind of figure out how to come together and then, and then make that argument. Uh, last thing before we get to my conversation with Francesca Hong, I promise you, we do not enjoy talking about Ken Martin and the drama at the DNC, but unfortunately the news keeps on coming. Uh, the latest is a story from the New York times in which Paul Rivera, the personal friend to whom Martin assigned. The fabled autopsy, uh, claims that when Martin did finally release the report, he omitted a chapter that Rivera wrote titled what happened in 2024. It seems like something you'd want in a report about what happened in 2024, just a minor detail. The chapter criticized Biden's decision to run for reelection as perhaps quote the single point of failure for 2024. It also criticized senior democratic strategists for being too rich to understand the struggles of most Americans. Uh, Rivera gave the times, the full text, of the allegedly missing chapter. Martin denies ever seeing or knowing about it at all. Despite Rivera saying he handed him a binder, a three ring binder with the chapter in it. Um, so this pits, uh, two incompetent people against each other who have also been, um, well, at least in Ken Martin's case, uh, deceptive in the past. So even if Ken Martin is telling the truth, this is part of the reason that you don't lie to people because it is hard to believe you when you haven't been honest about everything in the past. Uh, I just want to read the first line in this supposedly, um, sort of uh, uh, this secret and, uh, and damning chapter. American politics is a study in inflection points. It sure is. Boy. It sure is. A land of contradictions, I find. Uh, what'd you guys make of the whole thing? I am sure that to Ken Martin, this all feels very unfair from this original sin of putting this guy in charge of the autopsy, getting something back that was sort of incompetent and that would create a bunch of controversy. But not actually address our problems, deciding to not release it. Like I see how at each step it's one mistake and it leads to others and others and others. Tangled web. And, and then, and so there's that, that sort of that cascade of mistakes. And then there's the sort of the cascade of the money going out to places where they don't elect senators or house members, because you promised to kind of invest all over the place, including in the territories, people having questions about your fundraising and all of this sort of building on itself. And that now, uh, even though there are parts of your, your program that you think makes sense and are good, uh, it's unfair because there's no way for you to gain purchase. You can't, the fundraising is anemic because people don't trust you. You need to have more money on the books. Otherwise people keep reporting how much more money the RNC has. This guy comes out with a stupid fucking chapter. Maybe you saw it, maybe you didn't, but it only proves that you were right. That his work wasn't worthy of release in the first place, even though people are mad at you thinking it's some sort of conspiracy that all may be frustrating too fucking bad. Uh, we need the money. We need a DNC chair. People can trust you are not that whether it happens now or after the elections in November, it doesn't really matter. But the idea that this guy is going to be in charge of the democratic national committee as we head into the presidential is ridiculous. Yeah. The original sin was asking your buddy, Paul Rivera to do this report. Cause he's just not in any way credentialed to do. I think the last presidential campaign he worked on was in 2004 for Al Gore, John Kerry. Oh, sorry. John Kerry. Yeah. Al Gore's I remember. Uh, yeah. Um, and then Rivera worked for this New York state Senate leader who was, uh, convicted of federal fraud and people who worked around Rivera in that era in New York state Senate said, first of all, it was a horrible period of politics for the democratic parties, this corrupt, awful, you know, uh, state Senate group. Um, and then that Rivera personally was just sort of a weird behind the scenes guy who didn't, they didn't know what he did ever. He was in no way the right person to do this report. Um, so picking that guy was the original sin. And then there was, as always, the coverup was worse than the crime and spiking the report and then lying about the report. And now Rivera said is now Rivera says, Ken is lying about the release of this chapter. I don't trust either messenger here. I'm inclined. I'm inclined to believe that if this guy wrote this chapter, he would have given it to Ken Martin personally, because w why w like, why would you lie about this? Um, I don't think there was some strategic brilliance in this chapter, right. Or anything really worth covering up. But I think what this does is once again, raise questions about whether Ken Martin is an honest, honest, honest, honest, honest person. And I don't think he is. And I think if you are stepping on rakes all the time, and if you are lying all the time, you should not be leading the democratic party on top of all the fundraising failures. Uh, so yeah, it's just, this is a real, um, fun weekend for anyone who wants to close the book on the 2024 election. When we also have Hunter Biden saying his dad's debate performance was bad because he had cancer, but also still lashing out at anyone who said that that bad debate performance meant that he should have dropped out of the race. It's a wild thing to say. One would think that, um, if the cancer was so bad and problematic that it would lead you to not be able to debate, it would mean you can't be president for the next four years. And it didn't just, it's not just the type of cancer that manifests on stage in a national debate. It's crazy relief that it wasn't a stroke, which his wife thought it was. Yeah. Um, apparently there was a scoop today from notice that, um, uh, Martin told DNC members on a members only call that he's convening a special finance committee to help with fundraising. So who knows? I don't know who's in that committee, but hopefully it works. If you're a state, maybe George Clooney. Yeah. If you're, if you're a state party and you are hanging on to Ken Martin, because you get a check every month at some point, you have to realize that that check's going to stop coming when there's no money. Yeah. It's like two things can be true. It could be great that Ken Martin sent you a check and that you've been able to hire more staffers. Like that is important to invest in state parties, but also like you do need the money to do that, right? Like that's, you have to fire them to raise the money. You can't, there's no money. Right. Exactly. Um, which seems like a problem. Did you guys see that? Um, uh, there, you know, there's a lot, it's a lot of rapid response coming out of the DNC to try to defend their work they're doing because you'll look at a lot of people. There's a fantastic people at the DNC working really hard. This cannot be easy for them. Um, but one staffer put out a video where he's petting his cat and telling people that everything's, everything's good at the DNC. There's some background music. It was deleted. It was deleted before I had a chance to see it. To be honest, I never, I never actually got, I saw the still of it, but I never actually got to see the video itself. Sadly for me. Undelete the cat video. I liked it. It got attention. Yeah. Great. Yeah. No bad press. No bad press. Yeah. He was like stroking it. Like it looks like it wasn't authorized. It was, I'm pretty sure it was unauthorized. It did have a, uh, I think an unintentional Dr. Evil kind of connotation. So when I was a kid inspector gadget, the opening credits, there's a moment where you're, you're never see Dr. Clyde's always petting a cat with one hand. And then there's a moment at which he runs up to a, the chair in front of a fireplace, spins it around and there's the arm, but it's attached to a spring and then the chair blows up. And I thought as a kid that the villain was a chair with a spring attached to it, and that he was trying to kill inspector gadget. And I re yes, a lot of these things could have been diagnosed earlier. I think, uh, but, uh, I thought the never ending story was named that because the credits were so long. Oh, what a song. Um, it's funny that petting a cat is evil coated and petting a puppy is like the way you soften your image. Yeah. Well, yeah. Mike Vrabel at press conferences being like, what infidelity? Yeah. That's right. Anyway, more cats from the DNC. Yeah. All right. When we come back, Wisconsin gubernatorial candidate Francesca Holmes. Hey, Dan Taberski here. I'm a podcast host, a journalist, and now with my newest project, the author of my own manifesto. Well, it's a manifesto about manifestos. My search for inspiration in a world that feels more infuriating, more out of its freaking mind with each passing hour. Manifestos are a call to action, an artful scream. They capture our anger and they try to do something with it. This is my attempt to take the manifesto back from mass shooters and nihilists and return it to its rightful place with the warriors, the visionaries, the regular folks with just the right amount of crazy. I compare notes with radicals, secessionists, internet trolls out for a laugh, and punk singers screaming their guts out, all trying to turn their anger into the world they want to see. Listen to Manifesto wherever you get your podcasts. Audible subscribers can binge all episodes of Manifesto. Show early and ad-free right now. Join Audible in the Audible app or by subscribing on Apple Podcasts. My name is Erin Haines. My name is Jennifer Palmieri, and we're hosting a new series from Left, Right, and Crooked Media called Long Play. Across six southern states. Long Play examines the issues driving voters and the assumptions that no longer hold in a region that could shape the future of our politics and our country. Francesca Hong, welcome to Pod Save America. Happy to be here. Thanks for having me. I know this has to be a busy week for you. So, uh, thanks for doing this. Um, and just to start off, you know, I think it is incredibly important for Wisconsin to have a Democratic governor because we can't have an election denier like Tom Tiffany in a position to certify or not certify the 2028 election. Um, but since Republicans will spend an ungodly amount of money, um, to defeat you if you're the nominee, to try to defeat you, I just want to make sure you have the best possible answers to what's coming. Um, so I want to start with your, your 2020 posts. Um, supporting defunding the police, quote, as a first step towards abolishing the police, uh, which in a separate post you said, quote, exists to uphold white supremacy. Now, I know you've said you're not running to defund the police. It's not something you can do as governor and that people's views can evolve. I'm wondering how your views on policing have evolved since 2020. My views have only become stronger in that I'm serious about publicizing. I'm serious about public safety and I will not abolish the police. My views are that people are struggling right now and need basic needs met and I want to focus on stopping violent crime and giving law enforcement the resources and the training that they need, but ensure that we are also holding accountable law enforcement that does not follow the law. Do you still believe that police exist to uphold white supremacy? No. When did that change for you? And like, what is, what has changed in your? Thinking since you, you posted, uh, that in 2020. No, I think that when you talk to people who are most justice impacted, um, a mother who lost a child to, uh, to police violence, um, people who have contended with injustices in historically marginalized communities. But justice also looks like making sure that we are implementing solutions and helping to change the material conditions of people's lives. So. I've been a legislator over the last six years. I've had more conversations with people who are more directly connected to the problems and have learned that, uh, it is most important for a public servant like myself to make sure we're looking at sensible, practical solutions that will help keep communities safe. You said during this campaign back in May, um, that there, there has to be accountability for people who commit crimes. And if you're a governor and people commit crimes that quote, incarceration. And in law enforcement are the systems in place right now. You also said your long-term vision is a world without prisons. How does that work? What I know is attainable and the policies that actually meet the urgency of the moment and understanding the realities of it means that we have to ensure that we're funding our local governments, that we're bringing justice to victims. And what may have been more aspirational is not primary. What we need to do is make sure that. All people all across Wisconsin have access to great public schools, out of school programs, mental health resources, and that we hold law enforcement accountable, but also provide them with the training that they need to help prevent crime and stop crime. One place this could come up, I think, in the general election. And of course, if you become governor, you know, commutations are yours alone. No legislature, no courts. Would you commute sentences for people convicted of murder? You know, the last governor before. Tony Evers to serve commutations was Republican Tommy Thompson. And I believe that commutations moving forward, the system has to be designed by the folks who are also most impacted right now. And so I at this time, I would not extend a commutation to somebody who has murdered somebody else. If you're governor, you'll have something of a high class problem and that one of the first things you'll have to figure out is what to do with a two point five billion dollar surplus projected. Governor Evers and Republican leaders in the legislature reached a deal in May that would have given people three hundred dollar rebate checks, property tax relief, special education reimbursement and no tax on tips and overtime. Passed the assembly. You voted no. And then it died in the Senate. Eighty percent of voters, including 82 percent of Democrats, said it should have passed, according to the Marquette poll. Why do you think the voters were wrong? We have to make sure that the people who are struggling the most have. We have to make sure that the people who are struggling the most have durable solutions. And what that bill would have done is not given a rebate to those who are on fixed incomes, to folks who are making under fifty thousand dollars an hour. That's over a million Wisconsinites. Those are people who absolutely deserve relief. And we were seeing these six hundred and three hundred dollar rebates go to millionaires and billionaires. And I'm focused on making sure that everyday working class people are not only able to get real relief through. Cutting property taxes, which we can do when we fund our schools, but also that folks are able to have access to good jobs, fair, affordable child care and free paid leave for all. And so for us, it's irresponsible if we don't think about some of the folks who need the the funding the most. Tom Tiffany said he wants to return the entire two point five billion dollar surplus to taxpayers. What specifically do you want to do with it? Would taxpayers get any refunds? Or like, what's your priority list if, you know, you're fortunate enough to be governor and have a Democratic legislature? I want to cut property taxes, which we can do by almost forty four percent when we add in a millionaire and billionaire tax. I want to make sure that we're investing in free child care for folks across our state, while also providing bridge payments so that our child care centers can stay open. We need to invest in public education, but also have funds available to attack education. And to make sure that we are extending health care. I mean, Americans and Wisconsinites are risking losing their health care because of a bill that Tom Tiffany voted for. So health care, education and ensuring that we're lowering taxes is what I'll be focusing on with that surplus. You're the only Democrat backing a one year moratorium on data centers. You argue that the tax exemptions will cost the state more than two billion dollars. Tom Tiffany says he wouldn't back a moratorium, but that he'd also. And those subsidies and that people shouldn't have to absorb the higher utility rates. So why is the moratorium the better policy? And and what's that contrast going to be like between the two of you if you're the nominee? The moratorium is what hundreds and thousands of voters across the state, regardless of political ideology, have been demanding because the scale and speed in which these data centers continue to grow, waiting for legislation in order for them to be able to be held accountable or wouldn't be held accountable. So I think that's a really important point. I think that's a really important point. Actually, we hold the folks who are going to be responsible in thinking about what the public good is instead of people who may be taking money from the utility companies appointed to those positions. I think it's important that we establish local control, but that there are statewide guidelines in having no tax exemptions and ensuring that data centers actually have to pay their own way and up front if they're going to build in Wisconsin. The last primary debate was pretty friendly with you and your primary opponents. And for people who are going to vote soon and they're wondering if they're trying to decide between you and David Crowley, who's your leading opponent in the primary right now, what's one place where the two of you disagree? We disagree on the moratorium on data centers. We disagree on ending the voucher program. I believe that public dollars should stay in public schools. We disagree on how much to tax. Millionaires and billionaires to ensure that we have enough revenue to invest in the things that Wisconsinites care about, like child care, like paid leave, like public schools. And we disagree in how much we should be spending on removing or how much of the tax exemptions and corporate loopholes that we should be eliminating. Fortunately, Crowley has not been clear on which ones, which policies that he supports. So I hear you on the voucher program, like taking money away from public education. This happens all across. You know, there is a program now. There are about 30,000 kids in Milwaukee who are in that program. Their families are income capped. What does winding the program down mean for them? And what happens to those kids? What year does it end? Right now, it's important to establish accountability and transparency and educating folks about where their property taxes go. We have a bill that's ready that would include a property tax report. How much of those tax dollars are actually going to private schools? With the Milwaukee schools voucher program, that would be the last voucher program that we would phase out. And I believe it's important for folks to know that families actually can receive a tax credit for private school tuition. But right now, administration of that voucher program is costing our state over $1.2 billion. And so sunsetting that program for Milwaukee, for us, we're looking at at least the next second or third session. So that would be around 2030. But again, we want to make sure MPS is a partner with us and that the families who are in the program, that the education is not disrupted. And even when we put the caps on it, that doesn't mean that any of the students who are enrolled in vouchers now would have learning disruptions. So you're running as a Democratic Socialist. A couple of people have pointed that out. A few weeks ago, Marquette asked Wisconsin voters how they felt about that label. Fifty-four percent of Democrats. Democrats have a favorable view, especially younger ones. But when it comes to independents, only 13 percent have a favorable view. Fifty-two percent have an unfavorable view of Democratic Socialists. What is your plan for those voters who you will obviously need to win? Do you want to persuade them to change their mind about Democratic Socialism? Or do you want to persuade them that the label doesn't matter? I want to tell them what other Wisconsinites have told me. That it is about the solutions and not just the labels. That it is about the solutions that we are presenting that actually meet the moment to solve the problem. That the system is rigged against working-class people. And I will always put working-class people first. That fighting to fully fund our public schools, have free child care, affordable housing, and fair, cheaper health care looks like having someone who also understands the struggle right now. I'm the only wage worker, only single mom. I'm a renter, and I've worked in the legislature for the last six years. But I'm a public servant first. And I learned that from. opening a business and running a restaurant, as well as being a wage worker right now. And so I think this is a lot about listening to voters and letting them know more about our solutions and ensuring them that I'm not here to expand a brand. I'm here to make sure that Wisconsinites get what they deserve. What is the best case for your candidacy that has nothing to do with any of what we just discussed? What other pitch would you like to make? Since we've launched our campaign, we've learned that Wisconsinites, all across our state, regardless of generation, race, faith, ethnicity, are tired, and they're stressed, and they're frustrated. And when we talk about building a movement and transformative change, that we can have a state that invests in our communities, that raises wages and ensures that we're caring and protecting one another, we have now grown our movement to over 7,000 people who have volunteered for our campaign, hit over 110,000 doors, that this is a multigenerational, multigenerational coalition. And what's most excited is the support that's coming from younger voters, first-time voters, or people who have not voted in elections for the last six, seven years. I think people deserve to have a candidate that they believe in and that they know is not only just fighting for them, but fighting alongside them. Francesca Hong, thank you so much for joining Pod Save America, and good luck in this last week. Thank you so much. Take care. Take care. That's our show for today. Thanks to Francesca Hong for coming on. We'll be back with a new episode on Friday. Pod Save America is a Crooked Media production. Our show is produced by Austin Fisher, Saul Rubin, McKenna Roberts, and Farrah Safari, with Reed Cherlin, Elijah Cohn, and Adrienne Hill. Our team includes Matt DeGroat, Ben Hethcote, Jordan Cantor, Charlotte Landis, Kiril Pelleviv, David Tolles, Mia Kelman, Ryan Young, and Naomi Single. Our staff is proudly unionized with the Writers Guild of America East. This is Keon Miller from OK Storytime. So, I have a furry friend named Mia. She's literally a bundle of joy and love who can never get enough pets, cuddles, and attention. 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