From Indiana to Washington: Rep. Larry Buschon

[Music] Hello everyone and welcome to the inaugural episode of The Contender. I'm your host Congresswoman Erin Houchin and I'm thrilled to kick off this podcast by sitting down with a remarkable guest, someone who's been a true contender by very good friend Congressman Larry Bouchan. Thank you so much for joining us today. Good to be with you. Thanks for having Erin. Appreciate it. Well we are going to get into some meaning well conversation and before we get into the questions let's give our audience a little background on how you got here. Well before I was in Congress I was a cardiovascular and thoracic surgeon but I'd always been interested in politics and I really thought we needed more healthcare providers in the government and so back in 2009 when it looked like you know Congress was going to pass the Affordable Care Act something I didn't really favor. I thought it was time to run and I told my wife look it's I think this is my time to run and honestly Erin I thought I would probably lose I was running against an incumbent but here I am I'm in my 14th year so you know it's been an honor to privilege but I got into this because of personal interest in public policy and politics and I've used my career as a surgeon to help me on policy here in Washington. What I've loved about your service is your you serve on the Energy and Commerce Committee that does deal with a lot of healthcare issues and so you have been able to take your experiences as a surgeon and a doctor into the policy arena. Do you miss the practice of medicine? Is this like surgery sometimes in Congress? Well you know I miss surgery a lot and mostly what I miss about it is the patients and the families you know the daily interaction and you know surgery also you make an impact on people like immediately where here in Congress you know it may take you years to change policy. Actually being a surgeon is much more difficult than being in Congress. I can imagine so I my dad was a dentist he felt the same way that you do about his patients he didn't love the practice of dentistry but he did love serving the community in that way and helping people and I think that's what has influenced my decision into public policy. Yeah he did tell me I could be anything I wanted to be growing up but just please don't be a dentist. Yeah there you go. So I didn't do that. Well how how is how have things been going you've had been your 14 years could you talk just a little bit about we've known each other for for a long time before before I ever came to Congress in fact you were very influential in in helping me make this decision to engage in policy in this way could you talk just a little bit just about how we've known each other and some of the work that we've done together. Yeah I mean your state Senate seat overlap my congressional district and I think that's how we first met at a public event a Republican event you know in one of the counties that we have in common and then you know so we became friends through that and I started following your state house work particularly your work and the disability space you know with dyslexia and you know my daughter has dyslexia and so I've been working at the national level on that issue trying to bring awareness to it and so I think you know once we became friends from the on the political side then we I think kind of had a common policy goal as it relates to particularly dyslexia but other things you know I I really like the fact that you're willing to throw around a few sharp elbows to to make sure that you get the things done that you need to on behalf of your constituents right and that you're passionate about the issues and so you know as I said prior to your predecessor you know I really tried to help you get into Congress and I'm grateful for that well you're welcome but I think you're doing a great job here in Washington as you did in the state Senate you're you're willing to be passionate about the issues and and do what you have to do on behalf of your constituents so yeah we've been friends for that's been a long time over a decade a decade yeah hard to believe it's been a long time goes by doesn't it and I mean you much the same I mean I learned from the best right I learned from from watching your leadership and your service and you're not afraid to throw a sharp elbow when you need to and I remember we had conversations back then about how difficult what difficult it is to turn the barge of bureaucracy particularly in education and you know we've had long conversations with several leaders about things that need to change and we're finally starting to see the fruits of our efforts certainly back in Indiana yes the science of reading and improving literacy and etc. I want to talk just a little bit you know my sons dyslexic your daughters dyslexic it was through a conversation with you that I even found out that my son had dyslexia yeah we were at an event and you asked me how I was doing and for some reason that day I said you know I'm having a little bit of trouble with Graham he's he's having some struggles he was in the first grade at that point I think you asked me if he had trouble with fine motor skills and could he tie his shoes yeah I asked a few questions that would kind of narrow it down to possible dyslexia exactly right as it turns out he actually exhibited some of those challenges yes he did and then you made a great referral to Riley hospital where he had gotten an official diagnosis that their Ed's Ed Center and since that time he's made extreme amounts of progress and I know your daughter is doing great as well and for these kids and it's not just our kids I think every parent of a child with dyslexia I really feel like they share our story you know my story is very similar to yours as is other people that we've worked with and the challenges since the the heartache even in that is associated with it and just wanting to see your kids succeed and maybe looking back on some of the things that we did and wish we could have done it differently and but now they're they're doing really well so it is exciting to see the work that we've done together you know make such an impact in in the state of Indiana and you were the first member of congress to ever testify and only to ever testify from Capitol Hill via Skype to a live life via Skype for a hearing in the in the state legislature so and was your help that helped us champion that dyslexia legislation in Indiana I know you've been a huge champion on this issue here and continue to be yeah so moving on we could talk just a little bit about you know you've been here for 14 years I just got here you know I'm trying to find my sea legs still and and find the paths in which we can be the most have the most impact for constituents back home what advice would you have for new members of congress having been here as long and served as long as you have on just navigating that process to be as effective as we can be yeah I would say the biggest advice and I got some of this from former vice president Mike Pence when I came here is figure out who you are you know as as and what your goals are you know not everybody is going to be a person who's going to be in the media all the time for example Mike basically said you know if you plan to do that then you need to have that focus and develop that skill a lot of members focus on kind of behind the scenes legislating and that's kind of in my niche I've you know not that I don't have some appearances on in in the media particularly in my district but I've kind of a behind the scenes you know legislator and then you know and then there's some people that come here and well they don't do either of those and they they spend a lot of their time focusing more I would say in the district only you know on constituent services and things like that we all do all of those things but my advice is always and again Mike Pence gave me this advice find where your niche is and what you're passionate about and then narrow narrow down your focus and pick a couple two three things that really you want to accomplish in your career in Washington because you can't be everything to everybody and you'll you'll get to be known both in your district and nationally you know in those areas for me I'm widely considered a health care person in Washington right because I was a doctor but I also work on energy issues because my district has a lot of coal and natural gas so that's my biggest advice you know narrow down the focus find what your passion is and really work towards those goals one of the things I really respect about your service and just watching you is how much you've been a steady leader particularly for our delegation, right? You're the dean of our delegation. - Yeah, I am, it's crazy. - It's, I'll be the dean pretty soon. I mean, it's-- - It's coming. - It's coming. I'm, I'm, I'm the third most senior member after this term. - Yeah. - And at Rudy Yachim of Northern Indiana, I'm only behind him by about 60 days. - Yeah. - So, you know, it's gonna be changing here. Things change quickly. - Yes, they do. - But your leadership has been particularly steady. You know, you are a reliable, conservative, you have set yourself apart as a thoughtful person here. People trust you in this establishment and your healthcare views and part of the doc caucus, doctors caucus, - Yeah. - And really being a leader there too. So I hope that as you leave service here, and you're gonna be here with us till the end of the year. - Yeah. - But I hope as you, as you complete your service, I just want you to know how much I, in particular, appreciate you as a friend and a, and a leader for our delegation. But I hope that your constituents also respect what you have given in your service over the last 14 years. That's a long time to, to be in Congress. The average length of stay for members of Congress is six to eight years now. So then the fact that you've given, you've given so much to your country is, is commendable and we appreciate it. So in 14 years you've seen a lot of changes. How has Congress, how has the political landscape here, how has it evolved from the time you started until, until today when we're really seeing things in this Congress that we've never seen before? - Yeah, I think what's happened is, we've seen more divisiveness amongst the American people and Congress is a reflection of the American people. And I think that's, we gotta change that. We gotta get back to where, whenever the issues are, if we have disagreements with our colleagues, it's not personal, right? And we work towards common goals. We may have the same goal a lot of times, but we have a different pathway to get there. And so when I first came, my class was a wave, Republican wave class in 2010. And we had 84 freshmen Republican. Can you imagine 84 new freshmen? - We had 41, I think that was pretty nice. - Yeah, so we were basically a third of the Republican conference. And so we changed things up a little bit. You saw a lot of people who had never been in politics before, about a third of us were like me, they'd never been elected before. And so I think what happened is, is initially there is, Congress started, I think started looking more towards what the American people want, what your everyday citizen wants. And initially at least in my class, we had a strong focus on the districts that we represented. And kind of what I'll say, the will over the American people, and tried to work towards that. And I think that's really where kind of the more populist movement started in 2010 with my freshman class. And then obviously has changed towards where President Trump was on that front. We started to broaden, I think, the reach of the House Republicans to appeal not only to what I'll call the Chamber of Commerce type of Republicans, but also to even union workers and others. So I think that's been a big change on our side of the aisle, as you've seen since I first came, starting with my class really. And more gravitation towards more populist view versus what we are always considered, a Chamber of Commerce, so to speak, party, favoring business, and less so favoring what I'd say is the average everyday worker. And now we're, I think we have a broader tent now than we did. And our districts have changed. Yeah, and our districts have changed. Yeah. And I think that's what I've seen change. But along with that, I think probably because of social media, social media is a lot more prominent now than it was when I first started. It was there, but it's nothing like it is today. And I think with social media, I think it's driven a little bit of the divisiveness, and the parties have kind of gotten more in their own corners. And I think we're still trying to work that out, right? The media doesn't often tell the full picture. They don't. We've started trying to go beyond the headline, right? Yes. For instance, the media might report what we disagree about. And sometimes we immediately disagree with our counterparts on the other side of the aisle on certain issues. Sure. But we also pass many bills. I think we've passed more than 300 bills this Congress with 86% bipartisan support. Yeah. And that's a fact that I think would give some encouragement that Washington is dysfunctional as it can be does function. I always tell people, I haven't said it's functional, but it's not as dysfunctional as most people think it is. There are processes that are working and things that are getting done. I would definitely agree with that. I think that I said this. I did an interview with the New York Times yesterday, kind of an exit interview that they're doing for people who are leaving Congress. And they asked me if I could describe Congress in one word, what would it be? And I said misunderstood. And I didn't criticize the media them specifically. But I said that part of that is just what you just described. The good things we're doing, the bipartisan things we're doing, the blocking and tackling of government that we're doing, don't get reported. That's right. And if they do, it's a one-day story. But the divisive things stay in the media for a long time. And that makes it difficult for people like you and I to communicate to our constituents. I love that you talk about the blocking and tackling that we're doing because despite some criticism has been that we haven't accomplished much this Congress. But I think about how many things that we've stopped from happening. And I don't think that that can be understated. We should take the whole picture. It's not always about legislating. I mean, when I was in the General Assembly, it was not always about what bills you passed. But it's what bad things you keep from happening. And I think that certainly there are a number of those things that from our perspective, we have kept at bay over this last year in a positive way for our constituents in the country. Well, for example, when we didn't have the majority, last Congress, we had a couple of very big spending bills. The American Rescue Plan, the inflation reduction act, so to speak, that were passed by reconciliation with no Republican support and really not much support overall from the American people. And a huge amount of spending that in many of us has viewed led to the substantial inflation that we had that drove up prices for everyone. So to your point-- At least trying to keep that thing. With us in the majority in the House, at least, those type of off budget, so to speak, massive amounts of federal spending, we've been able to stop. And we've been able to try to rein that in and get back to where we need to fund the government properly and appropriately. So as we're wrapping up, and you're wrapping up your service, is there anything that you're most-- what are you most proud of? Or what is the most significant thing that you think that you personally accomplished while you've been here that means the most to you? It's health care-related stuff. I mean, there's a couple of big pieces of legislation. In 2015, we passed what was called the Medicare and Chippery Authorization Act, or MACRA. Prior to that, Medicare paid providers under a system called the Sustainable Growth Rate, the SGR, that was put in the budget back in the late '90s. There was resulting in annual pay cuts to all of our providers that we had to do so-called doctors' fix every year. So in 2015, we were able to repeal that and put in what's called the Medicare and Chippery Authorization Act, or MACRA. And I had a big hand in that. The doctors' caucus did. Honestly, on both sides of the aisle. So I'm really proud that we were able to, at that point, put in a different structure of how providers across the country are paid under the Medicare program. Now, it's not perfect because after five years, now you're starting to see, again, where we're facing payment cuts to providers. And what's that all about? People will say, well, doctors are pretty well paid. Well, that is true to a certain extent. But what we're seeing is doctors shortages in rural America and underserved urban America. And why is that? Well, because the reimbursement has dropped so dramatically, they can't afford to practice in those areas. So that means they're being underpaid. And they need to be paid for the value they provide to their communities. So I think it's about access and quality of care. And that's why you have to make sure that's appropriate. The other big thing we did is what's called the No Surprises Act. It's a surprise medical billing that I had a huge hand in that we did last Congress. And what that's all about is when people went to the hospital, occasionally, one of the doctors wasn't in their physician network for their insurance company. And months later, they would get a bill in the mail for thousands of dollars, unbeknownst to them. Well, we fixed that. We made it so there's a process where the provider and the insurance company now negotiate a fair price, even if they're out of network. And the patient and the families don't get these big bills. I'm really proud of that. That is a huge deal. Millions of Americans were getting these crazy bills months later. Sometimes for tens of thousands of dollars will-- Yeah. And as we're trying to figure out how we reduce health care costs, I think more transparency-- Big time. --as much information to the consumers as we can. That's right. --not letting the government between a doctor and the patient. That's right. We don't want to have rationing of health care. We want it to be accessible. Correct. All of these things that you have laid a great foundation for as we will continue to have those discussions moving forward. I hope that we can still rely on calling you from time to time just to say, hey, we're thinking about doing this policy. Let me get your two cents. Well, yeah. And if I hope that's the case, Aaron, because I'll probably be calling on you when I see that policy coming across-- That's right. --coming across all of your desks, right? I'm hoping to continue to have some influence on health care policy at the national level, just outside of Congress in some way. And I don't know what that way will be. But yeah, I plan to be engaged on that. I'm passionate about it. Those two things I describe, those two big bills, I think, I'm really proud of being a part of. But just smaller things day to day on health care and my influence on overall health care policy, I'm pretty proud of. And in the last couple of years on energy policy, as we see the changes being made by the current administration, that I think really hamper the Midwest potentially in the long run as it relates to energy. So yeah, I'll still be engaged. I'll maybe ring in you up and-- I was like, hey, Aaron, hey, what are you doing on this? We had a war on coal, right? And now we have a war on, I think, pretty much everything in Texas from this administration. Yeah, LNG is the most recent. LNG is the most recent. And then, of course, the border problem down here. And Texas wanting to defend their own border, some hindrance to that. So it'll be interesting as this conversation continues, particularly on health care and energy policy. Yeah. And I certainly will call on you. I appreciate that. At some point in the future, and feel free to call on me, as you see things that we're doing or not doing that you think would be things that we should do or should not-- I will. I know you will. So this is why I think that you certainly fit the profile of a contender, whether you are elected in this office or not. I know you care deeply about these policies. And you care deeply about your state and your country. And that has been evident in your service. But even as you step away from service, I know that you're still going to be engaged in these fights. And that gives me some hope too that we might be able to yet fix it. So I think we can. I got asked about that by, again, the New York Times people and the Washington Post people in these exit interviews. And I'm still very optimistic about the future. I think we always find a way. America always finds a way, right? And we'll need a new group of leaders like yourself in Congress to be stepping forward. And we'll make progress and probably do a lot of good things for the American people. I'm very optimistic. Thank you. Last question. Is there a contender who has influenced you in your life? Yeah. My parents, of course. I mean, I think everyone would answer that. Both of my parents-- I grew up in a small town, 1,500 people. My dad was a coal miner. My mom was a nurse. And their influence to encourage me to do well in school and get an education really changed my life. And I grew up in a community where in my high school class, we only had 50 people. And only six of us went to college. Oh, my word. Out of that group. So I would-- obviously, my parents had an influence promoting education, promoting hard work and success. I'd say that's the case. But then I think as another person in my training as a surgeon, I had the chairman of my department in cardiothoracic surgery where I did my residency. Said a really good example of what it is to be a leader. He was a leader in the operating room. And the way he carried himself, the way he worked with other people in the operating room and the way he really was dignified and professional. And so that's kind of what helped also, at that point, mold me into the type of leadership role that I'm in now. And I think-- so he had a lot of influence also. Well, incredible story, incredible journey. You've been a tremendous friend to me. I'm so grateful you're my first guest on this inaugural episode of our podcast. And our family motto is contend and work hard and have fun. Do it meaningfully. And so I'm trying to carry that on and spend some time with some contenders here while we're in Washington, D.C. to help tell that story and encourage others. So thank you for being part of it. Yeah, and I'm honored to be your first guest. The first, probably, a very large group of people who are going to want to be on your podcast. Thank you. I'm flattered. Thank you. If I can recruit anybody for your podcast, you let me know. I will. I will put you to that task. We will add you to the-- Yeah. --maybe you'll add you to the rotation. You can come back some. There you go. I do it. Well, thank you very much. Thank you. True friend, Larry Bouchon, representing the great state of Indiana with me in the southwestern part of the state. We are grateful for you. I want to encourage our listeners to stay tuned for more engaging conversations and discussions with some of our influential leaders and contenders who are shaping the future. Don't forget to subscribe and share the podcast. Together, we're going to explore the stories that inspire and empower us to make a positive impact in our communities. Thank you again for joining us on today's episode. I hope it inspires you to contend, work hard, and have fun.