Fox News Controls Over Half of Cable News Viewership — Democrats Can't Afford to Ignore That

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By the way, Jess, as you know, we have enormous affection and a decent following in Canada, mostly because I shared that moving story about how I was conceived in Toronto, but my parents decided to move to San Diego, which I think makes me a dual citizen. Importantly, the latest news comes from the Michigan race with Republican Senate nominee Mike Rogers saying the trade war with Canada needs to end breaking with President Trump. It's a sharp term for a candidate who called the same tariff necessary just a few weeks ago. And it comes as Rogers trails Democrat Abdul Al-Sayed in a race that could decide to control the Senate. Here's his new clip. Drinking a little bath and watching the Red Wings manage just doesn't get any more Michigan than that. Here in Michigan, we know that Canada is not our enemy. We need to end this tariff war. Now, as Michigan Senator, I'll bring both parties together to lower your prices. That's job number one. In Avdoul, he wants to hit Michigan families with a $3,000 tax increase, the biggest in history. I'm Mike Rogers. And I approved this message because I'll actually put dollars back in your pocket. That's. He's lying. Oh, definitely desperate, but I get offended by lying. I guess I should probably find a new world to function in outside of politics, if it's something that really gets to me. And I'm not sure if this would actually work better, but the fact that politicians never may occult anything, they just decide to pivot and ignore their track records, like statements they made on the record, votes that they've taken, you know, they're out there now. Like, Mike Rogers and Ashley Hinson and Iowa, you know, the war in Iran, it's got to end right now. It's like, you're voting for all of this crap, right? And why should someone take you seriously under 30 days out from an election when we have a bevy of votes and statements to back up the idea that you don't really believe anything that's coming out of your mouth right now. And this $3,000 tax hike, which I've seen no indication, obviously, that is what's going to happen from Abdul's plans. He doesn't mention the fact that the big, beautiful bill was only a tax cut for very rich people. And that if you are going to end up paying more with a progressive in office, it's likely because they're doing things like trying to deliver health care for you. It's just, I don't like it. I will say though that this race is closer than, I think, maybe even Abdul's camp feels about it. There was this big stand-on piece about how confident he is and that he needs to continue to work to put together the coalition to get black voters, Jewish voters, traditional democratic voters, into his tent. And Alyssa Slocke and only won the race against microaggers by 22,000 votes in 2024. And that was a very red year in this show, by all expectations, be a very blue year. But microaggers is not a can-packed in. He is a much, much better candidate and would take it really seriously. But he's also lying. Yeah. First thing, he's definitely lying, saying there's nothing better than alabats and redwings. That's just not true. There's a cop and coke and destiny on the pole is way much better than alabats. And alabats and the redwings, there's nothing better. I mean, nothing screams credibility, like I got talking about the redwings who lives in Florida as the polls tighten. It was kind of when he was saying it was like, okay, sir, now blink. I mean, it definitely felt like a hostage video. I think this is going to be tighter than people think, too. He's not rogers is is is bad, but he's not as Trumpian crazy as some of the other Trump candidates. He's inoffensive. Yeah. He's. Go ahead. No. That's it. That was just, you know, I have that rhetorical flourish that happens after I say the thing that I meant to say. He's inoffensive. You know? Yeah. And the polls, but the polls have they'll say it up about five points. No. No, there are a bunch of very high quality polls that have it at one to one and a half points, which is a jump. All right. These are margin of error races and five points would be great. The New York Times, Santa poll had him up five, but Fox had him up one, Kwanis had him one and a half. You go about the same margin. It's going to be close. This is how these states work. Right. It's a purple state. Excellent. Benson is going to be a big help. She's at the top of the ticket running for governor and John James, who's running on the Republican side. I isn't a particularly fantastic candidate. I actually think my broadgers. Is much better than him. But this is going to be really tight. And I don't feel great about Maine. At this point, neither. So I know that Maine has a flip and Michigan has a hold, but those were when we were going into them in terms of originally, you know, Maine was all roots run through Maine. And now we're like all roots run through North Carolina and Texas, you know, as it's a different field. Oh God. Okay. I can't help but talk to us about Maine. What do you thoughts on man? I think Susan Collins is much stronger than people like to acknowledge. Yeah. Agreed. And she's actually up in a few polls versus 2020 when Sarah Gideon was leading her in all of the polls and then Susan Collins won by eight points. And, you know, it's six years later. There's the Brett Kavanaugh vote. She votes with Donald Trump 95% at the time. She definitely reads as older and more frail, but I'm not sure that Trey Jackson is particularly compelling to people, you know, Graham Platner had an enormous amount of problems, but connecting with people was not one of them with voters, you know, and people, he was that big booming voice and felt like the genuine article to people and Trey Jackson, you know, is a bit dorky by comparison. Agreed. Meanwhile, Pete Hexath, Secretary Hexath made a trip to San Diego this week to welcome home the USS Abraham Lincoln. The visit comes after Hexath, the Smiths reports of food shortages and crew fatigue during the war or during the deployment in the Iran war as completely misrepresented. He worked out with some Marines which produced this viral clip. I feel like that's me at Orange Theory, or when I said, "Oh, my girlfriends, that I'll go with them to these classes." The online chatter about how he should come to like a hardcore reformer Pilates class with a bunch of moms has been my favorite discourse since that's the demo that I'm in. But if you are up on stage last week going after the bureaus and the weirdos and the fatties and then you're behind everyone in the run and what is that? What is it? Crab what what is that called when you're doing what it the bear walk anyway very embarrassing looks ridiculous doing it He's definitely he's hitting that age where he's forgetting that he's aging and he's not as strong as he thinks he is and You know somewhere there's a there's a sailor just back from this deployment Who didn't have food for three weeks and then sees him during box jumps and things are okay problem solved I you know glad that's been cleared up definitely feels like that's kind of a wrong The wrong focus here Well, I think also, I mean the timing is funny that Trump is out there talking about how Iran should nuke San Diego and then The Secretary of Defense is out there Huffin and puffin With some folks that are training there, but I do think this Reporting from the Atlantic so far, and I'm sure it will become more widespread that The Trump administration is considering military action in Iran You know very soon as their October surprise to try to get us on War footing mode is a very big deal, and I certainly wouldn't put it past them you know the Price tag of gas is not fitting with the amount of oil that's actually getting out through the straight-of-formose now It's still hovering about 30 to 40 percent above where you would expect it to be and that is Because of how much it costs to actually get the oil out and I would imagine that Iran is about to get Very desperate in terms of maintaining an upper hand and that the Trump administration likewise is about to get very Desperate as they see writing on the wall for at the very least you know a good night for Democrats in the House But potentially you know even in the Senate You have been thinking a lot about you know, you always have to ask yourself What could go right and I've been asking myself what could go right in them in in this war? And I think there's a decent chance that something could go very right and be sort of an Real a true October surprise if you look at the amount of oil flowing through the straight-of-formose. I think it's almost back to pre-war levels The Iranian people now have purchasing power. It's gone from $320 a month the $80 a month I guess the the sanctions are really having a severe impact on the regime and the people of Iran It just feels as if it's like Assad Wasn't weak until he fell I feel as if there's I think we've taken for granted That things are going to continue to go poorly for US forces or for the US as it relates to the optics in Iran. I wonder if there's I'm wondering what could go right between now in the midterms And I think that it's that's more likely than people want to admit But anyways this stuff is is really hard to predict. Well, I would just say two things vis-à-vis what could go right? I mean we have made it clear that We're not going in full scale and that you know It's quote-unquote time for the Iranian people to rise up like well, they already tried that and we said help is on the way And then 50,000 of their people were slaughtered so This isn't just what we're doing. It also depends on Action from everyday Iranians who I think are rightly so concerned that they will have absolutely no backup from us because we don't have an appetite for it even if Marco Rubio and Hexath and Trump do for instance Americans are clearly not in the business of tolerating this and are going to Vote accordingly and Iran wants to run out the clock on it as much as they can the second thing to your point about the Oil levels and yes, we are around pre-war levels, but the cost of this is absolutely crippling You know what it takes to get one of these tankers in short and Iran had been playing coy and Iran had basically been holding their fire Letting ships go through and now the amount of attacks on tankers getting through is going up and up and up Not the ones going to Iraq not the ones going to allies But the ones that are going to actually help the Western world get their energy prices under control Maybe bring down the price of oil at the pump and I don't see that getting better and the lunatics Which is what we have on the other side are still holding a tremendous amount of cards for making this as difficult as possible And in the back of their mind, you know, they're so releasing those Lego videos and they've got their eye on November 3rd The same way all of us do here, you know, they know what the election means. Yeah, yeah, it's good all good points all fair points Here's the thing it's hard to even find Republicans on the campaign trail right now, and it's even harder to get them to talk about Donald Trump But there's at least one Republican right now who seems to be trying a different strategy To be in par with I think I love the energy in this room If you take this out in 44 days a day, we're gonna win this thing in a decisive victory Who's ready for that? All summer long, Ramaswamy has kept up an unusually ambitious calendar full of fairs rallies and town halls This week on America actually what is the GOP message for the midterms and how are Republicans dealing with the elephant in the room Trump's second term has flopped. I think the Republican Party is not look tally upon right now And I think that everyone knows it catch us every Saturday on YouTube or wherever you get your podcasts Support for the show comes from NPR Keeping up with the political news every day can feel like a lot Especially when you have to wait through all the outrage hot takes and noise just to figure out what actually happened Here's a cheat code the NPR politics podcast Every weekday the team breaks down the biggest political stories of the moment in 15 minutes or less Right now there can be a close eye on the midterms and the issues that affect your daily life such as the cost of housing and health care Ice and immigration America's role in the world and the growing national debt. 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Interested and what if we added that this magical substance can dramatically lower your cholesterol improve your mood and keep your weight Stable. No, it's not protein. It's actually fiber Billy sexy most overlooked nutrient of all, but what is fiber? How could one nutrient do all those amazing things and how can you get enough? Is a powder you start into some water going to do it for you all that plus the strange tail of the gorilla poop obsessed father of Corn Flakes in the latest episode of Gastropod find Gastropod and subscribe wherever you get your podcasts So back in the US, Iowa Democrat Rob Sand heads into the last stretch of the governor's race with a double digit lead a new Suffolk University Paul has them at 55% To Republican Zach Lane's 43 according to CalShi sand is 89% likely to win the race The two met in their first debate on Tuesday, and things quickly got personal. Here's a clip We're going to go when you voted in Kansas in 2018 and in 20 and in 22 You registered to vote in Iowa less than two years ago. It'll be coming up next month and Here's the thing This is not about why you're in Kansas. This is about the fact that you're not in Iowa There are 3.1 million people who live here and they need to have a full-time I own it's just not true It's just not sure you have no evidence of that and you cite things or words. You said you said Iowa as much as you Again, this is a great thing to build and I will have to do my living about my children If I was directly about my children any family that has a blended family knows that I'm talking about that that quote was directly about my children So we want hands on dads Right, like I I totally get that but the guy does not live in Iowa. And it's a pretty big job And I absolutely loved so the governor of Kansas, Laura Kelly is a Democrat and she released this ad just Horting him Imagine my surprise when I learned that one of my constituents is running for governor Not here at his home state of Kansas, but two stakes over in Iowa Now generally I support Kansas, but in the Iowa's governor's face. I'm supporting the Iowa Zack, there are no hard feelings But it is time to come back to Kansas Rob Sand is as Iowa as it comes and he has run this brilliant campaign where people can't even really figure out what party He belongs to which is exactly how you take on a red state. I mean putting aside the Calche and you know, betting market ads, um, this guy is up in some polls 10 plus points in Iowa. And it is helping Josh Turic as well, immensely, the Senate candidate who's phenomenal, um, but is not running the kind of race that Rob Sand is at the top of the ticket. Yeah. In my sense is when I look at, if, if calcium at 89%, this thing is basically a lock. So, let's talk about what it means for Iowa, if Sand wins and, and what it means for the country. I mean, the governor's race, it's, uh, there was, there's been a lot of reporting and swirl about how donors aren't paying as much attention to governor's races, like everyone's just obsessed with the Senate. Because, yeah, because Talleriko is this shiny toy, of course, and we have likewise been obsessed and that governor's race says that they have the potential to actually, in some ways, affect policy even more. And it was very exciting. I saw that on the Act Blue, you know, the top five donations or campaigns that money's going to that John Ossoff came out of that. And part of that is he has a ton of money and the GOP is even pulling out of Georgia and North Carolina because they need to triage Kansas. It's also a crazy story. Did you know that Mike Collins, who's running against John Ossoff in Georgia, he has like a white nationalist influencer, son-in-law. And now they're talking about like KKK ties. So, that's all, that's all well and good. So I think John Ossoff is going to be fine. But now, uh, Gina and Johosa, who's running for governor in Texas has moved into the top five in terms of Act Blue donations. And Rob Sand is also very popular with people giving. So I individually. So I think that's a good thing. And then the big donors should also be paying attention for this was they just don't have the kind of money that the Senate candidates have. I think Gina had something like $4 million on hand. Um, you know, I think it's a big line in the sand and a big shot across the Republicans bow if you have a Rob Sand win. And by that commanding, a level that the way that they have been governing is just unacceptable. And Talleriko said it, or the first time I heard him say it was when we were in Austin with him, and he has since said it many times. And I think it's a very potent talking point, which is not trying to turn Texas or Iowa blue, trying to turn it purple and just give people divided government, which is what the Constitution wanted for us. And the ability to see people actually working together across party lines to be able to do what's best for insert state Iowa, Texas, North Carolina, et cetera. Um, so I'm very excited about it. I think he's a, a made-in-a-lab quality candidate. I agree. He's fantastic. Um, so speaking of, I don't know how to do this segue here. Happy birthday, Jess. Fox News just turned 30 years old, and its ratings lead of arrivals hit a record in 2025. It average get this 1.7 million total daily viewers compared with 551,000 for MS now, and 432,000 for CNN. That's over 50% of the total cable news audience. Wow, that is just staggering. Jess, any thoughts on Fox turning 30? And it's, it's just incredible success. Well, we have been celebrating. We had a nice party yesterday or doing all these old packages. Um, on the five, we ran some of it on coast. We're making a lot of fun of me. 2014 was not my best look. I had not mastered, uh, the right, the right effects, I guess. I'm sure you look just fine. I look just fine, but they were saying like, I know why parliable single, I did have a boyfriend, which, uh, whatever, Jesse looked the worst out of everyone. And he admitted that it was a, uh, some blend of a at 9/11 hijacker and just like a greasy, frat boy. But, you know, I think that one of the more important takeaways from the size of the audience is how important it is for Democrats to be showing up here. And to be doing these interviews and Abdul, obviously, is the big name that's been doing it with Jesse Waters and then Martha McCallum earlier this week. And you even see the difference like Mike Rogers was on with Martha the day after. I think his interview was like about 10 minutes, Abdul, one 25 minutes, and he won 25 with Jesse as well. And the way that the clip economy works, you know, you slice and dice and that's how people are ingesting this and you have a little bit of this and a little bit of that, you know, someone wants to see him joking around about circumcision. You can do that, but also talking about universal healthcare and the impact of the war in the run with the trade wars, which I think is what the average voter is more concerned about. Um, so the lesson of this is that there are a lot more people that either are to the right, you know, bonafide conservatives through independence. And we also have a lot of Democrats watching too. And that this is an audience that should be engaged and obviously it's very core to what I do and how and how I think about it. But I hope that that message has heard loud and clear to people seeking office that this is a good place to show up and make your case. What do you think? Well, they talk about business school discovering a wide space and that is just an enormous opportunity in terms of positioning a brand or a value proposition where the space just isn't occupied. And I think Rubber Mardock arguably discovered one of the biggest white spaces in the history of media. And that is he said he looked at media and said these are all a bunch of liberal overeducated people from the same universities all center left or very left. And there's nothing for the right other than AM radio. And he put together, you know, Fox launch and said we're going to go hard right. We're going to be more entertainment than news. And it has, I mean, there's just no doubt about it. It's probably been the most successful media company or media offering of the last 30 or 40 years in terms of discovering and underrepresented audience. I mean, they now have over 50% of the entire cable news audience. And that's it's not even a ratings race anymore. It's a monopoly with competitors still showing up to the race out of habit. It's like when Facebook highlights Pinterest and Snap is competitors. I think they do that such that the FTC and they're never accused of antitrust. So it's not the question isn't should Democrats go on Fox? It's like saying should Democrats go on Joe Rogan? They kind of have to now. And also I think one of the big boxes you need to check to be taken seriously as a candidate is can you go behind enemy lines? Can you go on these shows and do well? And I personally think no one's better at this than Mayor Pete and Governor Newsom. I think they're very good at going on Fox. And then there's other people refuse to go on because they did you know, as they don't see going on Fox? No. I don't think that she is going to do that. In my view, she can't be taken seriously as a potential presidential candidate unless she can go on and hold her own. And I think she would actually be able to. So should we go on Fox? Is actually can you reach the median voter? You said something that's stuck with me and I still can't get over it that Fox has more centrist viewers now than CNN. Yeah. Well, I mean, some of it is just a sheer numbers game, right? Like if you have an audience that size. But yeah, I mean, for the five, we're 20% Democrats, 30% independence and then 50% Republican. But that's everything from MAGA to Romney Republicans. Where's the fucking bat should crazy people with an oxygen tank? What is that 40 of those 50%? I don't know. I mean, the average cable news viewer is 67 to 66. That good looking young fellow. I don't know what it makes me happy. Anyways, happy birthday, Jess. Happy birthday. I don't have the anniversary more than happy birthday. I had a very good experience. Let's bring this back to me. I had a very good experience at Fox. I went on every week with Stuart Varnie. Yeah. And and I've been on with Liz. I've been on the Tucker. I was really enjoyed it there. Oh, my favorite. Neil, I don't know where Neil is. I hope he's happy and getting like taking long walks on the beach with his wife and spending time with grandkids. I love that guy. Yeah. He's my he was my favorite of Fox. And then Rubber Murdoch did a multi-prong attack on Kara Swisher. We had the Wall Street Journal, the post, and Fox. Like go after her every day for some reason. She must have said something to piss them off. And I got all defensive and angry and said, I'm not going out Fox again. And I haven't been on since unless it's I'm there to horror book at which point I'd literally if the Taliban had a string network. I would go on. Yeah. I'll go on. I'll go on to the like Al Qaeda streaming network when I'm promoting like RT and be like, Oh, no problem. Is this Putin's network? What's happening? Do you know the young manner in crisis? You should send them to war to die. That's it. That's a give them purpose. Anyways, happy birthday, Fox News at 30. That is just it is it is really wild. I'm just sort of sort of blown away by how dominant they are. You know, I know that there are a lot of people get frustrated with partisan media. And I'm sure we're going to see it in the comments that we even like talked about the 30th anniversary or just, you know, what share of the market they have, etc. But there's something that I've been thinking about a lot, especially from going on book tour and and just talking about the media landscape a lot, and where the different cable networks fit in this and what about independent media. And I'm one of those people with a foot in both places. And I will just say that like in regular life, people want folks that they think are saying things that they truly believe. And I know that there's discussion, well, they can't really think this. And you know, there's all the politicians on the hill where you get those articles like, well, behind closed doors, they really hate Donald Trump or whatever it is. But in general, when you tune in for people that are on the opinion side and you know who they are, there is a comfort in that. And that people felt really jolted by the fact that there were folks that were part of what they considered to be mainstream news programs that once they flew the coop ended up being rabid left-wingers or rabid right-wingers, I just know of many instances of it happening on the left and that really erodes trust in media and makes you think like, oh, well, what was I actually consuming all along, right? Was there always a bent to this? And this isn't about defending anyone. It's just a frame of mind that I've been in lately, thinking that people feel so much safer and more trusting when they know who you are and they understand the relationships that you have, the way that you see the world in an authentic way. And I feel like too many people who are supposed to be delivering the news for you. I have a part as a bent to the way that they see the world. That's not being told to folks up front. And then it feels like this big betrayal and that's how you get such low trust in media and people going to, in some cases, really dangerous places to be able to get their quote-unquote news. - I have nothing to add to that. (laughs) - Okay, that makes sense. - I mean, it might not have been interesting but I just, I've been thinking about it a lot because now that everyone is out there and they have their own brand and they're a creator and they live off of the algorithm and the clicks and all of this, you're seeing some true colors in a different way than I think a lot of people expected. And it does feel jarring sometimes where you're like, oh no, I'm not saying it was like Walter Cronkite and necessarily, but, you know. - I yearn for a day, I think Ted Turner is a huge leader but I think, and a great man by all measures but I think going to 24 hour news was bad for America. I think if you had a magic wand, I can go back to, you know. From the hills to the valleys to the oceans of the Pacific, I'm Jerry Dumfee and I'm gonna give you 23 minutes of news and then three minutes of a Republican yelling at a Democrat, they used to call it Count Point Counterpoint or whatever. And then another 23 and a half hours per day of Partridge family and Bugs Bunny and, you know, Knight Rider, America was just, in my opinion, it was a less hostile place. I think that people have taken on news and politics as their identity. I think it's yet another reason that young people don't like each other. I was having a conversation with someone just a few days ago at LA and we were talking and she, like almost as a litmus test, she said, well, what do you think of Fauci? And I'm like, I, you know, clearly vain but I think it was a decent public servant and she was horrified and then she went, well, what do you think of Bill Gates? You know, he's killing millions of people and I'm like, yeah, I don't see it. I don't see his incentive for trying to kill millions of people and it created tension the entire rest. I was with a bunch of people, it created tension the entire rest of the dinner and that just didn't happen and I was with, I was with two other married couples and then three friends was a big dinner before we went to see David Byrne at the Greek theater, which was awesome. - Oh, he is the best. - The Hollywood ball, I'm sorry, it was a Hollywood ball. - So cool, I found a rock center. - Oh, cool. - That guy was talented. Anyways, and I thought, I just feel bad for young people because it's yet another reason that they don't connect. - Yeah. - I can tell you when I was in my 20s, I had no idea what my friends' political beliefs were. No more than I knew if they liked the rams or the raiders, it just didn't fucking matter. And so, and then these things get clipped for the most incendiary moments. The algorithms encourage these brands to be as extreme as possible and to try and call out their guests. They're guests not there to, they're not there to extract information or news from their guests or to learn that they're to try and play gotcha moments such that they can put it on YouTube or the candidate wants to have a viral moment, go viral to raise money. Just the algorithms in citizen United have created just such a divisive polarized media ecosystem. And Fox has probably been, Fox has taken the ball and really run with it. And before we sound too complimentary of Fox, I do think that, you know, spreading misinformation around voting machines, making America feel bad about institutions even when you know you are lying. You know, it's just not helpful. It's just not helpful. Finally, Jess, I'm not sure if you've noticed this trend, but there's yet another way of a tech CEO is getting the Hollywood treatment underway. The social reckoning comes up Friday. There's also an Elon documentary debuting at the Venice Film Festival, a Sam Altman biopic starring Andrew Garfield who was in the original 2010 social network. And of course, another Elizabeth Holmes documentary out soon, Jess, what do you think? Do you think there's anything to the timing of these movies rolling out now or is Hollywood just really not thinking of original ideas? - I think people are fascinated by these characters. Like it just makes sense, but I'm most excited for the Elizabeth Holmes one. I have heard there's, you know, Oscar buzz about it. It's three hours long. Did you watch the trailer? And I love Nathan Fielder on top of it. I can't believe he lived with her. - Yeah, this is, we'll hold on, let me do my impression. Jess, why would I deceive you? I've never been this real. - That wasn't very good. Anyways, she's an odd person. - She's an odd person? Yeah, I think it was putting it lightly. - I also think she got sold up to River. I think the difference between Adam Newman being in prison and her is ovaries in a Japanese board wanted to say a face by coming to a settlement. There's this false narrative around Elizabeth Holmes. And I know she's not a very sympathetic character that she heard people that was healthcare. There were never any test results that impacted a consumer's knowledge about their HIV status or anything. I mean, she lied to her board. My guess is, there's a lot of CEOs of lie to her board. It just struck me when it happened of all the tech founders of all the fraud that one of the few that actually ends up in jail is one of the two percent of female of tech CEOs that happen to be founders, that happen to be women. Is she a weirdo? They deserved the deserved punishment and was guilty of crime, yes. Or was she sold up to River because America and business hasn't, especially repellent reaction to a woman who commits fraud? I think the answer is yes. There's something about it that bothers me. The prison sentence that she received. Any thoughts? I mean, I was just really surprised like her husband's in it as well and that, you know, Nathan Wilder's asking him, like you never thought that she was lying to you about anything and he was like, well, why would you think that? It's like, well, it's just a pretty big liar even if he wanted to spew, because she lies a lot. Because she lies a lot. I also, so Jeremy Strong, who's playing Mark Zuckerberg, he was just a game. - Especially fantastic. Well, I mean, his method acting right where he just like lives as the person which he did all through succession and he was with David Remnick for New Yorker Radio Hour about it and talking about that he called Zuckerberg to tell him he was doing this and he was gonna be taking it really seriously and Zuckerberg had a bit of a muted response to the entire thing. But he's definitely, I feel like Facebook has been on a positive PR tear as much as they can be to try to make it not as bad when the social network actually comes out. But I remain most interested in the Elizabeth Holmes one. - Yeah, like Hollywood's really get a processing kind of present-day anxiety through past tense storytelling. You know, once the subject is safely, you know, legible is sort of a character, not a threat. And in this instance, it's sort of still a threat. It makes for great storytelling 'cause every text CEO follows the same journey or the same heroes journey. And that is they all start off as Anakin Skywalker. They're all adorable. Gayson, we wanted Sam Altman, incredible innovator, saving humanity, Elon Musk, a different type of tech executive who cares about the important discussion of gender equality at work, Cheryl Sandberg. And then we find out they're full of shit and we'll say anything to increase the value of their options on their shares. It's just, and I don't blame them. We live in a capitalist society where money means influence, selection set of mates, healthcare for your kids, people laughing your jokes, validation, and your environment. It is such a pressure cooker where the only thing that matters is winning. And they all start off. They're all very compelling attractive figures and we're fooled for about two, three sometimes. In the case of Cheryl Sandberg, we were fooled. for 10 years. And then all of a sudden, they put on a mask and a breathing apparatus. And we realized they're fucking Darth Vader. The guy that's halfway through his journey right now, it's already happened to Sam Altman. He was the gay son we all wanted. And then we found out, oh, he's full of shit. Now, Shell Sandberg, oh, yeah, you know, I care about women in the workplace. Meanwhile, I have invented and promoted and defended a business model of the results and teen girls all over the world cutting themselves. You know, Elon Musk, oh, wait, I don't, I'm going to cut $60 billion in funding for HIV positive mothers and potentially go down is, you know, the agent of the greatest manslaughter in the history of mankind causing totally unnecessary death disease and disability. Oh, I'm a senator. I'm very concerned about these issues. I don't have any stock. I'm just a good guy. No, you're not. You're going to make billions of dollars. And while you're worried about humanity, you're also on a road show with JP Morgan and Goldman and the latest, the latest superhero or the latest character that's about to join the dark side of the force force is Dario Amade. We all thought, you know, Dario with kind of that weird quirk was he was different. He seemed more concerned and he's the TA in the chemistry class that's sort of awkward, but a good guy, he's going down the same poly. Oh, 10% extinction event according to one of his employees. And then what does Dario say? Well, he may have a point. Okay, that's an expected death of 800 million people, but it hasn't stopped you from, again, being lining up your bankers for an IPO. It's okay. I might kill the world, but two trillion dollars please. They all go through the same journey and it's a fascinating journey from an original scripted or, you know, a maid for Hollywood biopic. I haven't seen the Elon Musk thing. I think they really screwed up making it four hours. Yeah. I mean, that's just okay. You know, I'm now, I'm now, I mean, haven't they read anything? Everything's going to four minutes, but it'll be it'll be interesting to see, which it's like when it was we crashed bad blood and the Uber, I figured that one was called, there was biopics that came out about Uber. We work and Theranos came out about the same time, supposedly the best one was the bad blood one. I think the we work one was was really outstanding drama because I was featured in it. Yeah, I watched a show about Uber. I feel like an HBO show or something like that, but I didn't like it particular. There you go. So the way and I enjoy the services. I got to admit it. Uber changed my life. I absolutely love Uber. It was crazy. You can travel anywhere with no anxiety when you walk out of the airport. It's amazing. How much did you use to think about that, especially traveling with family like what my, you know, my parents like had to think about, like, okay, and then we're going to be met by this person made to get a car rental place, etc. Now everyone's just like, I'll come straight to dinner. So big speaking of white spaces, Uber does a good job, but at that scale, it's very hard to maintain quality control. And there's a new concept against being a white space. It's called Wheelie that started in London and now it's in Dubai and in New York. I think they're in Miami. By the way, I'm not, I'm not a shareholder, nor they paid advertiser that they should be. I think Wheelie's everywhere. The guys are all, you know, they're all suited drivers. The cars are immaculate. What's the cost versus an Uber? I think it's about 20 or 30 percent more, but they'll wait for you. I'm consistently late in Uber's will cancel on you. The bottom line is just they realize there's room for a more premium service and ride hailing. And then the other one that is just going to be a juggernaut. I mean, Wheelie's going to be a nice niche sort of boutique of a net of brand. It's going to carve out a space. It's going to get, you know, good valuation, but it probably won't be a huge company. The one that is just disruptive. Have you been in a way, Mo? No, but I have stood on the seats of, on the streets of San Francisco staring at them alive. I got in a first time I took a WAMO was an LA and there was an accident and there was a cop waving people with, you know, those lights into the wrong side of traffic. And I thought there's no way this WAMO is going to be able to figure this shit out. And the WAMO had the sensors to go, okay, this is a licensed law enforcement official telling me to go on to the wrong side of the street to get around this accident. And it moved tentatively, but it figured it out. And then the thing I'd never registered what a value out it is is there are a lot of women who just do not want a driver in the car. They don't want to talk to them. They don't feel it's safe with a stranger in the car. And that never dawned on me. And now when I was in LA, I see them everywhere, everywhere. I think, you know, innovation or the adoption of innovation is like bankruptcy. It happened slowly then suddenly. I think we are on the verge of suddenly with autonomous ride hailing with WAMO. I think this thing is just going to, I see them testing now in London. I just think it's going to be hugely disruptive. The next, I believe the next trillion dollar company market cap is going to be WAMO who a Google or alphabet has already created a separate company and a separate internal tracking stock. Anyways, I'm fascinated by it. But to circling it back to Uber, Uber was a transformative technology. I just, I haven't owned a car in four years because of Uber. I think they just do an amazing job. And by the way, my, my funnest thing to do is to drive by, if I ever actually am in a car with my boys, I'll drive by a crowded, if I'm driving by a crowded hotspot at night with a lot of young people. I'll roll down a window and I'll go Uber and just to see how many people look and try and get in my car. And my kids in the back seat just freak out. That's good parenting, Jess. I'm honestly, I'm writing down tips for how I can do it. I do like also that you can request a female drivers. Because I know people say like women are worse drivers, not nice when they say that, but the women who are professional drivers are incredible drivers. And I've had the most of them actually in California, female drivers. I'm not going to touch that one. Let's leave it there, Jess. Bye. [Music]