Forgiving Yourself with Mary J. Blige

When you said weren't working, what do you mean? Like, if something didn't happen, you know, if a record didn't sell or this didn't happen or, you know, this didn't get that many, whatever. I would go crazy on people. Yeah. Cursing people to oblivion and all that stuff. So when my drama album came out, I was like, I don't want to release this album without apologizing to every single person at this label. Get everybody. Anybody that did anything for me. Line them up. I'm apologizing. I apologize to every single person. This episode is brought to you by Lilly. Hey. Hey, Craig. Welcome to IMO. It sure is nice to be here. I know. I haven't seen you in a second. I know. Yeah. We have a treat today. We've got. Oh, my gosh. One of my favorite people on the planet. Yeah. You guys have met before. See, this was my first time meeting Mary. I know. You're going to be in for a treat. I know. She's a real one. But this is the first time we've sat down for a conversation. We were talking about the one and only Mary J. Blige is here. But even though we've met and spent a little bit of time together, this is the first time we're going to really be able to talk it out. But I love her in all kinds of ways. Just like everybody on the planet loves Mary J. Blige. But let's do a proper introduction. Well, Mary J. Blige is a singer, songwriter, actress, producer, and entrepreneur. Killing it. She is best known as the queen of hip-hop soul with 15 studio albums, 9 Grammy Awards, 6 BET Awards, 12 NAACP Awards. I want to see her trophy. And one primetime Emmy. So she out here acting, too. She going to e-guide it up in a minute. She's a member of the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame, received a Lifetime Achievement Award from BET, and has a star on the Hollywood Walk of Fame. So after this, I'm going to have to go outside and find that John. So without further ado, Mary J. Blige. Mary. Mary. Hi, honey. It's good to see you. And you look so good. Thank you so much. So do you. So good. My big brother. Nice to meet you. Nice to meet you. Welcome to IMO, honey bunch. Thank you, beautiful. Thank you for being here. Thank you for having me. You got some stuff going on, don't you? I got a lot of stuff going on all the time. But you. What's. What brings you to L.A.? This. What brings me to the West Coast? Yeah, West Coast. I'm about to do my first ever residency. That's. Yay! Yeah. Yeah, it's pretty major. So which arena? I mean, which casino? The MGM. Okay, yeah. Oh, my gosh. This is going to be a blowout. How have you been thinking about this show? I mean, is it you? Is it you and other people? Is it going to be a bunch of surprises? It's me. It's all about me. It's called My Life, My Story. So we're kind of going to try to. Not making it to some theatrical, you know, because the Mary J. Blige show is a Mary J. Blige show. Yes. It's fun. Yeah, yeah. But, you know, we're going to try to, like, tell a story with, you know, pictures and, you know, just. I don't want to give it all away. Yeah, yeah. But the music is going to be up. The music is going to be up. And then we're going to have our. Our moments of I'm going down and all that stuff like that. What's. What are we doing with the fashion? How are we thinking about that? Oh, we're going to go crazy with the fashion. But we're going to go, like, elevated. Yeah. Not super ghetto fabulous. Are we talking. We're going fabulous. gowns? Are we talking. We're talking moments like. I don't want to give. I know. Because we're so close. Yeah, we're so close. It's going to be good. It's some moments that are going to. I can't. It's going to shock people. Oh, my God. I can't. I can't. I can't. I can't. Okay. And help me understand because. So, what's the difference between sort of a residency and doing a tour? The difference for me is. So, I've been touring for years. Yeah. And the only thing that's. The beauty about the residency, the gift about it is that you sit still in whatever mansion you're in, in Vegas, you know, whatever you decide to do, and you drive 20 minutes to the MGM theater, and you do your show. Yeah. And touring was about you get on the bus, you drive for 20 hours, you get on a plane. Yeah. So, I think the traveling is what created, you know, such a, you know, a bad taste on that. But other than that, the performance is what we do it for. But the traveling is the difference. So, the performance will be the same each night or similar each night or. It'll be the same. Okay. Okay. It'll probably be different guests. But the difference is the traveling versus just sitting still and enjoying, you know, walking into your living room full of fans. I mean, your music just transcends all kinds of stuff because it's so personal, you know? I mean, and it's reflective of what so many of us have gone through. But I like the fact that you say that you're going to run through your life, you know? Are you starting at the very beginning? Are you thinking about it in terms of. Of your life when you were a child? Are you talking about the beginning of your life in the industry? I mean, how do you think about telling that story? Well, I think I have to start from childhood because that's when I discovered that music was, you know, my first love. Singing was, you know, everything to me. It made me feel amazing as a child. And so, I have to start from childhood. Yeah. Music was the thing, you know? My mom, you know. Was a singer, but, you know, she couldn't pursue her singing dreams because, you know, she had us and she had a scholarship and. Y'all making me nervous. Oh, don't be nervous. You among friends. You making me. I'm talking to Michelle Obama. You making me. I'm a little nervous. Give me a second to get my words right. So, anyway, let me get that story correct. My mom. My mom had a scholarship for singing. And she had us, you know, at a young age. Right. And she couldn't pursue it because she had to take care of us. Right. So, my mom was a woman who sang around the house. Yeah. She was. I mean, she could sing anything, like anybody. Man. So, it all started there for me, just watching her be a singer. So, I discovered that I can sing, too. When did you remember finding your voice? I mean, like, Mary, if I could sing, I'd be singing all day. People would be so sick of me. Wait, hold up. She sings even though she can't sing. Well, of course, you know. All day. But, you know, when does somebody with the talent like yours. How old were you when you were like, Dag, I sound pretty good. I was seven. What? Seven. I was seven when I realized I could sound like anybody. Like, I could mimic anyone. I mean, like, really do it. And I remember. I did a talent show in school, and I sang Reunited by Peaches and Her. How old were you? I was seven years old. Seven years old singing Reunited. And I sang the guy. You know, that's a duet. Oh, yeah. You sang both parts? I killed it. Now, did you have. You know, were you comfortable? Were you shy? I mean, you could sing, but you had the performing thing in you then? I just always do. Like, when it came to singing, I didn't have any fear. Yeah. So, I just did it. It just was something that, you know, that was in me to do. And so, you go to the talent show, you sing it. Afterwards, tell us what you felt like as a seven-year-old walking off the stage. Okay, you just killed it, like you said. Reunited. Just reunited the auditorium up in here. I felt good because everybody was cheering. Yeah. And the word was, wow, I mean, I can sing. That's what I remember hearing in school. Did that give you a little cred? I mean, did you. Were you able to, you know. I was off and running after that. I was singing. I was singing in the house. Singing with brushes. Singing in the mirrors. It was on and popping after that. What about your brothers and sisters? You have one sister? I have two younger siblings. Two younger siblings. And my oldest sister. Okay. And she's just mad. Yeah, yeah. And so, when did you realize, oh, man, I can make a living doing this? As opposed to. To just, I'm good at it and I'm singing. I didn't realize I can make a living doing it. It was something I always wanted to do. But what happened was, in Yonkers, in Westchester, there was a mall when we were teenagers called Galleria Mall. And they built a karaoke machine in the Galleria Mall. And everybody was talking about it. One of my friends was like, Mary, you should go and record in the Galleria Mall. How old were you? I think I was probably 14. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. And I went and I recorded Anita Baker's quote and the Rapture and because that was one of my favorite songs and my mother's boyfriend at the time he worked at General Motors with this artist by the name of Jeff Ray Jeff Ray was already signed to Uptown Records remember you called and told me that oh yeah that's Jeff Ray okay so he was an artist that was already signed to Uptown Records with Andre Harrell and my stepfather gave it gave the tape to him yeah he gave the tape to Andre Harrell who was the CEO of Uptown Records Andre came to Yonkers to Slow Bomb and I sang the whole Rapture album for him the album the whole rap because that was my album the whole Rapture album where were you when you performed for him a whole album in my living room in the projects so he came to wow he came we heard the Caught Up in the Rapture tape that my stepfather gave him he came to the projects so you all are sitting around is everybody there your brothers and sisters is it like Christmas morning and Andre Harrell shows up at your house well these guys that were trying to like you know manage me at the time they were the reason why I was even able to you know get this tape so Reggie Johnson was someone that my stepfather that Jeff Red knew and they told Andre Harrell you know about you know I guess how to get to me and everything and they called my stepfather and they said well Andre's coming so I had to meet him downstairs and he pulled up in his BMW and he had was it just him it was just him by himself he from the Polo Grounds of course he's gonna come to Slow Pump he had a black and white polka dot shirt on and a sash and his glasses you know Andre and he came upstairs and I sang acapella man almost every song from the Rapture album and and the rest is so what was his reaction did he play it cool well he sat and listened to the third you know it must have been good by the time you got to the third record he was just he was just sitting there cause Andre was always like cool so he was just watching and I didn't know what that look was I guess that look was wow you know we got something here we got something yeah and my mom was just looking all proud you know we didn't know you know and I wasn't like excited because you know being famous was just really far fetched it was something that we didn't think could happen to us but it happened but I wasn't like oh yeah I'm gonna get a deal I just was like yeah this is what I do I sing this is what I do no big deal and you weren't nervous and nothing nope see that that's a skill to be able to be under that pressure that's a Capricorn oh here we go here we go under pressure that is not a game that would be a Capricorn that would be a Capricorn this episode is brought to you by Progressive Insurance a company committed to helping people move forward and live fully Mish thinking back to when you picked up your first home what was the biggest priority for you for me I was just laser focused on location I needed to make sure I was central and close to family yeah that was the same thing for us as well I think when when Barack and I bought our first home we really only looked in one neighborhood and that was Hyde Park on the south side of Chicago it was down the street from where you and Janice and the kids lived and that meant the world so we didn't even look in neighborhoods that weren't close to family where the girls would go to school where we were working so for us location was was key I'm curious if you were back in that position today do you think your priorities would stay the same or has your perspective shifted a bit that's a good question Barack and I talk about this a lot and we've come to learn that community and family support matters much more than I think we give it credit for you know sometimes you know we see young professionals they you know prioritize you know living close to their job or taking the promotion but as you grow your family we found that just having people around that you can count on is worth a lot more than you think it think it does so I think we probably would still prioritize location community over a lot of other things I agree I think young Craig would be very happy with the house I'm in now but he would be even happier to see all the ways my family have made it our home also the backyard he'd love that so oh my god you know I love my backyard you know when you do finally achieve that home owning goal it feels amazing but getting to that point that's where things tend to get complicated for a lot of people buying a home today is not easy with rising costs and a lack of clear guidance leaving many feeling unsure where to start that's why Progressive is here to help homebuyers get off the sidelines through their Open the House initiative right now Progressive is expanding its up payment program offering up to $13,500 each in down payment assistance to at least 200 eligible first time buyers that could be a game changer for homebuyers who need a little help to close that last gap they also offer practical tools educational resources and guidance to help people navigate the home buying process with more confidence learn more about the up payment program and Progressive's commitment to first time homebuyers at progressive.com slash open the house where homebuyers can access home buying resources and support to empower them in their housing journey what was home like? what was your family like? what was your mother like? my mother was beautiful she worked two jobs it was just me my mom and my sister so it was just before my two siblings came my mom raised us by herself and you know some you know the projects need I say more? no not a great environment but you know she was this little woman who had to be a man and a woman so we were raised like that my sister and I but she was also this kind woman that would take in the whole project because if she was a woman she needed to she was just she was a giver she helped you know and and she wasn't scary she just my mother was a thug like she she had to make sure her little girls was okay so that's what I the environment wasn't good but my mom was my mom was good home was a yeah a safe space yes yeah and then you know I know for us growing up now we didn't grow up in the projects but we grew up in a black neighborhood where you know you see a lot I mean Craig saw more than me because he was a basketball player playing at the courts and just there's just a way you gotta carry yourself just to get to and from just to you know just to be able to exist and survive and I was reading somewhere where you said you said something to the effect that you know you didn't smile a lot because you didn't you didn't feel like people people would take advantage of that smile like if you showed your vulnerability that that made you too much of a target I might be misphrasing that well the thing is this we didn't smile too much and we didn't brag too much because nobody had anything to smile about and nobody had anything to brag about but my mom worked so we had a little bit teeny bit more than what everybody else had so we would try not to brag about new sneakers and smile too much about you know anything because that's that was the environment you had to have a game facing order not to get hurt so you go to the store you get a bag of candy if you don't share you got to fight two girls that's right you know so you guys are from Chicago like Southside Chicago you know you just bringing back some memories telling us the same thing because our my dad worked and we had had it just a little bit nicer than our friends but sort of not you know but we didn't know it we didn't know it right but what our parents did exactly what your mom did you don't show when you got something nice you have to have you started learning at an early age how to code switch in your own environment home versus school versus the streets well it depends on it depends on where you the socioeconomic on where you live and stuff but I'm just I'm thinking back on how your mom was showing you humility but it was it was not out of courtesy it was out of survival yeah it was just something we learned too we really learned that because when you have to fight every other day even my mom brought me home from work she got to fight the you know the biggest chicken you know on the planet my mom is this big so we learned early like we got to chill like we can't you know even if someone said we was pretty we can't act like whatever it is we had to wipe that you know unless you wanted to be doing that - Yeah, yeah. - You know? early. And I think that helped me a lot with this music business. I was going to ask. Yeah, just not counting my chickens before they hatch and not sharing everything with people because everybody's not for you. Something came to me today, and I know you heard this before, favor is not fair. So everybody's not going to be happy. And that's the wisdom from how we was growing up. Well, a lot of people want to be like you. They want to be, but they also want to be famous. They want to be wealthy, or they think they want to be it. A lot of people want to go into the music industry. It's a tough business. Can you talk about, you know, so you go from your living room to signing? Yeah, so this is funny, but it's not. We signed a contract in the kitchen on the washing machine. My mom didn't know anything. She didn't know anything about reading a contract, nor did we care. We just, oh, we're getting out of here. That's what was on our mind. Whatever was on that contract was better than what you had. Which was not a lot of anything. And it was a way out. It was a safe way out. So my mom signed a contract, and this is what I would say. In the music business, I didn't finish high school. I didn't go to college. I would say this to anybody. Finish high school. Go to college. Take some kind of class. Because I mean, by the grace of God, I'm here. Because I didn't know anything about any contracts. I didn't know how much money I had. I didn't know when I was broke or whatever. I was just living. You know what I mean? And trusting people that ended up, you know, couldn't be trusted. Mm-hmm. Ended up not being able to be trusted. Yeah. So get your education. Yeah. Take some accounting classes, some business school. Do something. Yeah. You know, because it's, everyone doesn't get a chance to survive. Right. What I survived. And. And what was that first contract like? I mean, I mean, because I want people to understand what a bad first deal looks like. Well, you know, to be quite honest with you, Michelle, I don't know. Mm-hmm. Yeah. You know, the lawyers who ever had it at that point had it. And all I know was that everyone that was in my life and, you know, including the lawyers were people that were looking out for themselves. Yeah. You know, I don't want to start labeling things. But everybody was looking out for themselves. And, you know, they were benefiting off of the fact that I was unaware. Mm-hmm. And that happened for a long time. So when I woke up and realized, you know, Mary, you have to get educated. Mm-hmm. You have to stay on your business. Yeah. Because you're not going to go anywhere else if you keep this up. Mm-hmm. So I got blessed with some people that could help me to read contracts or read what I could read because contracts are this thick. They sure are. Who's doing that? I'm not. That's right. That's right. But if someone, I'm not afraid to say, I've never been afraid to say, I need help. And I've never been afraid to say, I don't know. Yeah. And I've been, you know, getting help. Mm-hmm. And whatever I can't read or understand, I get my lawyers to help me read it and understand it. And people really, who really have my best interest at heart, they'll explain everything, everything to me. And it's still, still now. Yeah. I still need help because it's, it's a lot now that I have a hold. Something to protect. Right. Yes. Mm-hmm. Now I need more help. Exactly. And more people I can trust and so on. What, what point of, in your career, what age did you start to say, oh man, I gotta get, I gotta figure this out on my own because I'm being taken advantage of? Oh, let me see. I want to say it was no more, around no more drama time. Mm-hmm. When I was like, I'm still here. Mm-hmm. But my life is a mess. Yeah. And I need, and for some reason, certain people was coming into my, coming into my life to help while certain people were still there that was trying to destroy. Mm-hmm. So, I had to keep those people in my life and take responsibility. My responsibility was I was ignorant to a lot of things and blaming it on everybody else. Yeah. So, I took full responsibility and I remember when we first put the No More Drama album out. I used to get upset and curse everybody out because my music, you know, things weren't working. Yeah. You know? And it wasn't their fault. It was my fault. Like, if something didn't happen or, you know, if a record didn't sell or this didn't happen or, you know, this didn't get that many, whatever. Yeah. Mm-hmm. So, when No More Drama album came out, I was like, I don't want to release this album without apologizing to every single person at this label. Get everybody, anybody that did anything to me. Line them up. I'm apologizing. Where did you get the wherewithal to do that? To say it was time. Like, it's time and here's what I have to do. I have to hold myself accountable. I mean, do you know there people who are 70 years old who haven't figured out that part of it yet? And you were doing it. You still must have been a kid then. I was, but it's the spiritual side of things. And I started listening to a lot of, like, TV pastors and people that had information. Mm-hmm. And pride and arrogance and all that stuff. A proud and haughty person won't go further than this, you know? So, it was a lot. I was getting a lot of information that caused me to pause and look at myself. You know? And so, I realized that I was being prideful and disrespectful to people and just different things that made me be, like, free. Just pump the brakes. I'm doing something wrong here. And I need to speak to people. I need to apologize to these people for my mistakes. So, that's I just got a good look at myself. I think I prayed the prayer, Lord, show me myself. You know? And I still pray that prayer. I got to see me. We don't want to see ourselves because that hard look at who you truly are, good, bad, ugly, you gotta be ready for that. Yeah. And I'm ready now. I look at myself all the time and be like, it's okay. Yeah. At least you can see yourself. I mean, your rise was beyond meteoric. I mean, you went from your living room, singing in the projects in front of your mother and the people that you love to dealing with a whole bunch of strangers and having your name being a household word. I mean, you have to be able to forgive yourself. The little bitty Mary J. who was trying to navigate all that. And didn't know much at the time. Yeah, I do. I forgive myself. That's why I'm, like, happy with myself now because I forgive myself for not knowing. Yeah. And whatever I don't know, I'm not ashamed. I'm not ashamed to say, I don't know. I don't know. Help me. So, I'm interested in understanding how with all of the stuff that you've been through and you're learning yourself, the one consistent thing was your music. You all, you kept pumping out hits and being good. How did you do that? Well, the music was my therapy. It was the only way I can get everything out of me. So, if you go back to the What's the 411 album, that was me breaking fresh out of the projects. My life album was when I spoke and said, I need help. I'm damaged. I'm messed up. I need, and everybody else said, so are we. Share My World was when I went and started doing my own thing and left some people behind. That was another chapter. You know, I'm speaking from there. Mary Alba, same thing. I'm speaking from there. No more drama. My life was I'm speaking from there. The Breakthrough album, that was a whole other level. I broke through. I'm here. And it keeps going, going, going, going, going. So, it was just a way for me to get it out and talk to the people and have them talk back to me. Did you know you were creating a whole new genre of music when you were doing it or were you just doing it? We had no idea. We didn't know. I was singing for my life. You know, hip-hop soul, singing over hip-hop loops and being this little, you know. We didn't know we were doing. We didn't know it was going to even explode the way it did. And to this day, everybody still wants to sing. You know, it's still doing it. It's still doing it. It's still doing it. Our colleagues wanted me to tell you that when I was No, he wanted to tell me. tell you. No, I was going to keep this to myself. I was going to keep this to myself, but I had a mixtape when I was in college. He used to DJ. I used to DJ. He was Craigie Craig. Yes. But I would make myself a tape for when I had company. What kind of company? Women. Craigie Craig. Women come over and we were just talking about your music. And I was like, yeah, I think I had a Mary song on every fifth song I got out. Yes. So he wants to thank you. Thank you. He wants to thank you. I wasn't going to say it, but then everybody said, oh, you should tell Mary that. And then I was all embarrassed. And now I'm glad I told you. Thank you. Thank you. That means a lot. The spins. Thanks for the spins. Thank you. It's from Craigie Craig. One of my favorite parts of traveling is seeing how locals actually live. You can hit all the famous touristy spots, but I always remember the little neighborhood coffee shops or restaurants or parks even more. That's the stuff that sticks with me long after you get home. I was back in one of my old neighborhoods. I was in a little neighborhood. I was able to take my family to some of my favorite spots. We went by a couple of restaurants I love and the bookstore I frequented. And that's why I want to tell you about listing your space on Airbnb. 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Taking Foundeo with an insulin or sulfonylurea may cause low blood sugar. Side effects include diarrhea, nausea, and vomiting, which can cause dehydration and may cause kidney problems. Once-daily Foundeo is available by prescription only and 0.8 milligram, 2.5 milligram, 5.5 milligram, 9 milligram, 14.5 milligram, and 17.2 milligram tablets. Learn more at foundeo.lily.com or call 1-800-LILY-RX. Now is perfect to talk to your doctor about Foundeo. You talk about love, you know, that, the ups and the downs, the highs, the lows. What have you learned through your, about life, through, through the loves that you've had or the, the missed, the, the mistakes that you made? The most important lesson I learned is that you're not going to be able to give away anything you don't have. So if I, I didn't love myself. I didn't know how to love myself in those relationships. So how could they ever love me? I didn't know how to love myself. I ever worked. Yeah. You know, so now that I have this love for myself, it's wonderful. This relationship with me is the relationship that I work on the most. And so this relationship brings in other good relationships. You know, it makes other people happy because I'm happy. But if I'm miserable in a relationship, the relationship is going to be miserable. That's what I learned. I don't, you can't give away what you don't have. Yeah. Self-love is really a key thing. And our, our parents were big on making sure that we loved ourselves, saying exactly what you did. You can't love anybody else until you love yourself. Well, there's just so much focus on, for, for women, finding a man, you know? Yeah. Females. Yeah. It's our dream, you know, to be a woman. Right. Or to be rescued. Or to be chosen. Yeah. To be, to be chosen. To be chosen. To be chosen. You know? And so we're always working on us, not for us, but to be chosen. And that's what we mess up at. So many years, you're working on yourself to be chosen by someone else. I'm working on myself to be chosen by me. Like, it's all about me right now. Yeah. And it's going to continue to be. And this is, this is work every single day. I got to make sure that I can sleep at night before I can, you know. Sleep with somebody. Exactly. You've talked openly about experiencing abuse and, you know, I mean, that's part of your story. It's sadly a part of too many girls' story. I mean, I heard you say, which I've said this time and time again, because I work on issues with girls, young girls around the world, girls' education, trying to make sure young girls have some level of self-esteem. Because you've said this and I've said this, this world just not a safe place for girls. I mean, it is, the entire world is not a safe space for girls. It is a shame. I say it out loud because I want the men in this world, the leaders in this world to understand that we've created a place where most girls are not safe. And I think that's what I'm trying to do. I'm trying to say that most girls are, they have to fear for their safety every day. A hundred percent. I mean, no, no little girl. And you know what? No little boy is safe either. It's true. It's true. It's true. It's children. You know, mostly women, we, you know, we've been through it. We've been through it, you know, five years old. Why? Why? What are you going to do? With a five-year-old. Yeah. So yeah, it's, but you know, we're here and with, you know, we've forgiven, we've moved past and it still hurts sometimes, you know, but it's a blessing in that, that lesson, you know, it strengthened, it strengthened me. How do you find that? I mean, and right now we're talking for other people who are listening who, who have experienced that level of abuse, but they haven't found a way through. I think the shame and the guilt is what has people in so much pain. Yeah. Yeah. I'm sorry. Yeah. Yeah. But the forgiveness, the self-forgiveness is where, when the guilt and shame starts to fade away. You know, you're still, you still see it. You still like, wow, why did I, why did that happen to me? What did I do? Nothing. Nothing. It's happening to everybody. Yeah. So forgive, forgive yourself because it's not your fault. No matter what you think, it's not your fault. Yeah. Forgive yourself and don't feel any guilt or condemnation about it. And that's in the word too. Right. But yeah, like if God says no guilt, no guilt, no guilt, no shame. No, I'm not going to forgive you. I'm not ashamed. I'm not going to let you, this world make me feel bad anymore about something I can't do anything about. Period. And so much of it is here, you know, it's here. I mean, I think we've come to a place in this world where we know better than to, to condemn the victim. Right. But it's like that the conversations that we have when we're alone in our own hearts and heads that are other place. It's coming from within. It's like the call is coming from within. the house right yes you know you gotta speak to the call you gotta know that's a lie no i mean you gotta talk to it like you talking to like we're talking no shut up stop no you're lying here you go again i'm hanging up i'm hanging up exactly like some people be cashing away who you talking to me i'm talking to me oh i've got a bunch bunch of people who are listening i'm like are you are you talking to me it's like no i'm talking to me but it's real talk it's real live talk and i think saying things out loud too i know it's like making the pain real and putting it on the table you know because if you keep that pain in here no you know all you are just carrying it you know other people need to see it and hold it and share and carry that pain i think your music does that for i mean i mean just watching any audience reaction um it is you putting your pain on the table and you watch the power of what happens when other people pick it up and they will you know you see it every time you perform yeah that's that's what happened when i released my life album everybody said wow mary too yeah wow we love her so we can speak freely too yes you can you don't have to carry the secrets that's gonna kill you why carry a secret that's gonna kill you talk to somebody about it anybody it doesn't have to be somebody you trust yeah you know that's how that's how you get it out that's that's how it's right you know um i'm just wondering how how do you think about alone time and loneliness do you have a time where you're ever alone do you ever feel lonely sometimes i'm lonely but i'm alone a lot like i'm in my home a lot but we have a good time though mary and mary together we are happy i make sure we have a good time we buy ourselves we eat i love to eat by the way i love i love snacking i love watching movies i love laughing i love talking to myself i'll be trying on clothes i'll be playing music you know i'll talk to you know some friends i'll be talking to my friends i'll be talking to my friends i'll be friends or something on the phone or my sister or somebody you know and it is what it is i accept it is what it is i'm not trying to have company and friends i'm just taking it as it is you know just picturing you on your couch talking to mary mary and mary girl what are we gonna eat next but mish talks about she talks a lot about having a core group of friends though that you can rely on so that when you are feeling whatever alone lonely or you need some feedback some true friend friend some true some truth yeah uh and i i always i listen to her because i have you know guys do have a cadre of friends but we don't some talk well no they they all do we just don't talk as much do you have a group like that where you're like oh i don't know i don't know i don't know like that to fall back on or are you falling back on mary all the times i have a small crew of fabulous women that are my friends i'm fabulous like this type of conversation yeah fabulous i mean beautiful they really have my best interest they're my family we actually all live in the same neighborhood you know we're not sitting at the table and wondering who's going to pay we're fighting over the check you know what i mean like it's not you know it's that yeah they don't want me to pay for anything they don't want me to do nothing and i'm trying to pay for everything right oh sit down sit down and if i need i use each one of them for different things because they're all built different but we all share what you know what we want to share but they're there for me when i need them yeah and we have we have fun and are these folks over time childhood have you picked up friends i you know these are my adult friendships i've known them for about 30 years though um i barely have any of my my childhood you know friends i have like two of them one of them passed away um so i have one left and um yeah we it's just that's i've known for 30 years they've been there and we still here yeah yeah good group of women you know in the research that i was doing i've i've found that you were very intentional on not having children of your own which i think is a pressure that a lot of women feel that they have we talk about pressure on women they feel like they have to have children can you talk about why you chose not to well i don't want to say i said a lot of i i saw a lot of people struggling i saw a lot of you know my family members needing babysitters and you know them not having a choice you know no freedom so when you're younger you that's the choice that's those are the words you make those are the choices you make i don't want any kids but then when you get older you start to see how valuable their teenagers are to them mm-hmm their kids are to them you know so now it's like um but at the same time it's like but i think you give i think i think more and more women who are um making choices for themselves period whatever those choices are you know um i i think i think more men need this young men need to have more options of what it means to be a woman and to be a man and to be a woman and to be a human you know i mean i i think the options for young boys are very narrowed what does it mean to be a man right i mean there are pressures it's like you got to be a competitor you got to be you you got to be a winner you have to have a certain kind of job right you have to not cry you have to be athletic you know it's like still a narrow definition even though i think more and more parents are raising kids young kids are raising kids young kids are raising kids young kids are raising kids young men to think broadly same is true for for for young girls i mean we've done more work in society today to help give girls more options of who they can be you can be a leader you can be a mommy you can be a wife you can be a you know you can be a professional you don't have to be a mother you know that that is that that doesn't make you whole um you know because just like with everything else if you're not a whole person a child will not do that for you it won't complete you you will just now be disappointed that this other human being didn't fulfill the holes that were in you yeah and now you've got a child that feels burdened by feeling filling your holes you know you gotta you gotta be a whole person you should want that even more than wanting to be a parent you should again want to figure yourself out you gotta get to that gotta get to that yeah and don't make yourself miserable trying to have what someone else has that's their life you have yours grammy emmy award-winning and oscar-nominated superstar mary j blige presents my life my story the las vegas residency mary j blige performing adobe live at park mgm from october 23rd to 31st at february 12th to 20th get tickets now at ticketmaster.com mary j blige bringing new york to las vegas this episode is brought to you by progressive insurance a company committed to helping people move forward and live fully when you move to your new place whether it was in new jersey or dc was there anything that you immediately did to make you feel settled or comfortable i think it's uh for me it's when routines are in place um kids are settled although our kids are grown now but when we were moving they were little you know when they felt settled in a new school and they started making friends um and life started to feel more routine that's when um it starts to feel like home going through the home buying process with no experience can be quite daunting but progressive is here to help make it all a bit more approachable as part of their open the house initiative progressive offers practical tools educational resources and guidance through their website to help people navigate the home buying process with more confidence what's more progressive is also offering up to $13,500 each in down payment assistance to at least 200 eligible first-time 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You can search for what matters to you, like insurance, specialty, identity, or availability, and get started in as little as two days. One thing I really like is that there are no subscriptions or long-term commitments. You simply pay per session, making it easier to find care that fits your life. If there's something in your life you'd like to change, Grow Therapy can help you start. The therapist you want takes your insurance on Grow. Grow accepts over 125 insurance plans. Sessions average $21 with insurance, and some pay as little as $0, depending on their plan. Visit GrowTherapy.com slash IMO today to get started. That's GrowTherapy.com slash IMO. GrowTherapy.com slash IMO. Availability and coverage vary by state and insurance plan. And see what Shopify can help you accomplish. Well, I want to, I want to shift to fashion. Okay. Who you loving? Who you, who, like, okay, you can't tell us what you're going to wear for the residency, which I understand. But are you working with any designers that you're excited about? Who are you loving? What kind, how would you describe your look these days? Me, I'm moving away from first lady dresses and A-lines to just kind of like, you know, just kind of like, whatever. But I know that this, this age, I feel like, let me, let me play with all facets of myself. You know, I'm not saying that who I was as first lady was not a part of me. I enjoy, I enjoy the dresses and the gowns and the this and the that. But I also enjoy, enjoy a nice pair of jeans, you know, a cute little top, you know, where, what, what are you into these days? Well, I can go from chains this big to chains this big. Yes. And, and, and dainty. So this is dainty. This is where Mary is right now. Mary is on some really soft, beautiful, you see how, you see my nails, they're not even long, but all kinds of, I'm just in this, wow. Yeah. Exploring this woman. This woman is soft and peaceful, but still, you know, she's got a little, she's got a little something, classy. Yes. It's comfortable. Mm-hmm. Comfortable. Ooh. That's the key word. Comfort, you know, just playing around with whatever I want to do. Now I've done, you know, rings on every finger, bracelets up to here, chains down, you know, and I can still go there. Mm-hmm. But I'm also her, which I've never really got into her. Yeah. This her, I like this her. Yeah. Like, she cute. She cute. She cute, girl. With your little dainty pink nail. I like that. Craig's like, I don't have anything to say about that. No, I, I was, I was going to say that I'm built, I dress for comfort today, but I wanted to look a little, a little fly for Mary. I wanted to look a little fly. This is him looking a little fly. This is me looking a little fly. This is for you. Oh, your jacket is nice. Thank you. Mary J. Thank you. Said, your jacket, my jacket is nice. That's because you're a nice boy. Well, what you're watching on TV? Are you a TV? Yeah. What you watching? I just finished the second season of Paradise. Oh, yes. That thing is so good. We had Sterling and his wife on. They are great people. Great people. But that second season's crazy. It's so good, man. I can't wait. So you like the drama types? You like the suspense kind of things? I like drama and horror. Oh, horror. Oh, I can't. I'm too scared of horror. I can't believe my fellow Capricorn. Really? That's all I do. That's all the Capricorns I know. We watch horror movies. I can't. I'm watching it like this. I'm, you know, and Barack, he's really, he just like, he has to warn me ahead of time. He's like, no, you're not going to like this. You know, I'm watching it looking down, but. It's probably gory. Like it's, it's bloody. I don't like gory. Okay. But I like horror, like ghosts and demons. I like the conjuring, you know, like stuff like that. Okay. Let me see. I can't do the conjuring. Yeah, that's spooky. How are you thinking about your acting? Are you producing more? You got parts coming up. You got projects that you're in that you're excited about or can talk about? Yes. Projects that are coming up. Projects that are coming, that are coming. And am I doing some more acting? I am. Yay. I am. How has that transition been like for you? I mean, do you feel about acting like you do about singing? Like, I know what I'm doing. I know what a good song sounds like. I know. But you're like, no. But you're so good. Yeah, but I'm still not sure. Okay. You're in that insecure phase of your acting. Okay. Yeah. I'm not Angela Bassett or Meryl Streep. Yes. Yeah. I'm Mary trying to figure it out. People are like, oh, you're so great. You're so good. In my mind, I'm like, not, not yet. Do you like watching yourself? No, I don't. Yeah. I don't like, I don't like looking at myself. But I do it because I have to. It's work. I don't. He's looking at me because I don't. Yeah. I still hate it, but I have to. When I see it, I'm cringing like, oh, man. I got to fix that. I have to fix this. I have to fix that. But I have to look at it. Yeah. Yeah. And then sometimes you'll look at it and be like, damn, it's not that bad. Right. That's right. I'm pretty good. Right. Yeah. You start to see what you need and what you don't need. Yeah. Michelle was like me when I was younger. I hated the sound of my voice. Did you? Oh, my God. I hated my speaking voice. Even your singing voice? Everything. I just, I just hated everything about me. Now I be listening to Mary J. Blige more than everybody else. I listen to my stuff. I'm like, wow. Oh, man. I'm really good. This is really good. It's like listening to another artist. Look what I missed out on. I miss it. Do you have a favorite album? Oh, man. My life album is one of my favorite. Yeah. Yeah. Well, that's a good, good. You have good taste. You got good taste in Mary. I do. Who else are you loving these days? Artists? So many people right now. I love her. Oh, yeah. I love her. And she's a sweetheart. Yes. She's beautiful. You have a show yet? No, no. I've just gotten. Yeah. We got to get. Okay, Gab. We got to get you. I'm going to work on. But she's a sweetheart. But she's shy, too. Yes. Yes. She's very, very, very, very quiet. Yeah. I love her. I love Alex Isley. Jasmine Sullivan. I was trying to get to her concert Missed that Missed that That's what I still love I love going to concerts Now I will Yeah Oh well see now I'm gonna be I'm just like you I was thinking yeah If I had to do Answer this question Who am I listening to Grand Fires I like Teddy Swims I'm liking Tims I love Tims Oh yeah Love Dolce Summer Walker I mean I just love raw talent Somebody that can You know With Without a band They can move you Like you Well thank you And thank you I was so honored To perform at the inauguration I was gonna I was gonna ask you That was like Wow It was so nice At the state dinner But the actual Inauguration You did right That's right That was Yeah Wow Yeah Yeah no That's how we felt too One of the greatest Moments in my Career And seeing you guys You know Before he goes up And Yeah You know That was Yeah That was big And thank you And I'm sitting here with you This is crazy I know It's good It's like the first time You know The time I remember Most Because the Inaugurations Are just You know And I'm nervous And I'm But at the state dinner When you performed With the French president Oh yeah You remember that I remember See there You like me It's like Oh yeah I did do that I did do that You performed We were sitting right there Right in the front Like right here Yeah It's like I was nervous I was like Go girl Go Did you feel me Cheering you on I saw you I saw both of y'all I was like Do you still get nervous I do But not like that Yeah You guys were the president First lady Y'all right here In my mind All I could think of Is what a train wreck I was No Well really What do you mean Train wreck Please don't make me Talk about it It's It's Okay If only you knew What my life was At that very moment Okay But just notice I'm here I'm better And I'm here again With you Yes you are In a better Mind frame In a better Everything is better Yes It's all better But see the thing is It's like in that mind frame You were still Amazing I mean and that's the thing Thank you That's the work Thank you Because It's like I've been rooting for you Forever You know And I Thank you I know through your story Through your songs What you've been through What you've been carrying And what you've been Trying to grow from But all the while You were always enough Thank you You were always More than enough It's like I'm just blessed That you were at the point Now And sometimes it takes Time It takes age To own this wisdom That I can see it That you can see What we all saw Yeah She knows what she's doing And you know that now And you were Offering that To so many people You know That insight That you know That That acceptance Yeah You know That growth And doing it through music Oh Just It stays with you You can carry it We can carry it With us Thank you Michelle Oh my goodness Thank you so much You're making me blush There we are We'll shift Because now We'll shift to somebody else Because we Like to take time On IMO To help some other people Okay And we Have a listener question From your neck of the woods In New York Maria from New York Right, Maria I have a good friend Who is recently Engaged to her boyfriend Who I unfortunately Cannot stand I feel like my friend Is a different person Around him And I worry Our relationship Won't survive If she stays with this guy He's so emotionally immature And every time I see her with him She's basically Having to appease All his moods He gets annoyed By practically everything As her friend Do you think I can say something to her And how Or do I have to let things Just take their course Maria from New York And she's in her mid-thirties Okay Does it sound like She's in any type Of danger? It doesn't sound like it I think she just Doesn't like this guy I think she should I think she should just chill Don't say anything Let Life take its course Because She can end up Without a friend Don't say anything Just Love her through it Be with her Walk with her Talk with her If she If she asks you something Then you should You speak to her about it Don't give you Two cents If she don't ask you I completely agree Completely No In thinking about this I think about I was thinking about it From a guy's standpoint Obviously And I've always felt like You have to be Really careful When you give people Advice About a loved one Because What happens is They will forgive The person Before You forgive the person And they will forgive The person Before they will forgive you And to your point You could lose A very good friend If you don't hold your tongue It's the truth If your friend Wanted your help She would ask you She didn't So just love her Through it I like what you asked First is Is she in danger Right Because that's An important Caveat You know I mean Because sometimes You know If this If this were A more urgent situation You know I don't I don't think we can I wouldn't want to see My friend in harm's way Right You know I think I would risk The friendship If It were a situation Where he just wasn't a jerk But he was a dangerous jerk Right You know Right But if he was just a jerk What would you do? I probably would not Unless asked I mean Please She would say something Why would I lie? Why would I lie? No I'm just saying I think you would say something Why would I lie right now? I'm not saying you're lying I just say You I think you would Say something I'm in situations like this All the time You know We're friends Tell us more I mean and I have to be I have to be I more importantly Have to be Careful About what I say About people Now if somebody Asked me Which people do What do you think Of blah blah People ask me All the time I don't know whether Maybe nobody's asking you What you think But people ask me What I think All the time Now if you ask me I will Say Tell Say The truth I'm not gonna I'm not gonna be like He's great You know If it's a serious question If they're showing Doubt And you know But no If somebody seems happy In their situation And I don't particularly Like them You know Yeah leave it alone They might see it Cause I'm not gonna be Around you You know They might get the hint You know I might I might limit My amount of time Being around that person Right Which might mean That I I'm limiting my time Being around my friend Because You know They're You know Your friend can make a choice And you can make a choice too You know I mean You can Love somebody from a distance You know If this person Is toxic To your space And she loves them Doesn't have to be toxic To my space Right Yeah Cause I also Have to protect My energy too You know It's like And you know Nine times Ten people do What they want to do When it comes to love You know You do learn that You know You can't talk People out of anything When it comes to How they feel People make Some Often times Make up their minds Their minds Are already made up And you can see it You know I mean If the If the guy is an obvious Jerk Nine times out of ten She knows it Yep She knows it It's like Unless she's blind You know It's like Well you see it You know So if you like it I love it You know If it's not hurting you But don't ask me Maria I hope that was helpful Oh yeah Yeah Say oh yeah There was a person Behind that question Sorry Maria Yeah That was for you Oh my goodness Well Thank you Babe Thank you for taking the time To be with us It is You know You are just You're a blessing You're a gift Thank you Michelle And Craig Craig Craig That's how you remember Craig Craig Craig Craig Craig Thank you both For having me This This is a blessing Thank you so much Yeah And you were gonna kill it On the residency I'm gonna do my best To get out there We'll get the dates To make sure we share The right dates With the listeners Okay But I know it's gonna be The bomb Yes it is Yes So it's like It's Jordan speaking Jordan going Yeah this is the Jordan Going out on the court But thanks for taking the time babe And we will We will see you next time See you out there Yeah For sure Break a leg No We're not breaking no legs. I thought that was what. Nah, we're not breaking legs. We just say the power words. Okay. No. Okay. All right. Don't break the legs. There you go. Kill it. We'll get back. Kill it. Yeah, we're going to kill it. That's what you do. Thank you, Mary J. Blige. Thank you, Miss. Love you, babe. Obama. Craig. This was great. I had fun. All right. Good, good. Thanks again to Lilly for sponsoring this episode. This episode of IMO is brought to you by Cologuard, a non-invasive colon cancer screening test. There are certain things in life you keep meaning to get around to. And for me, health screenings always ended up on that list. But I was surprised to learn that there are certain things in life you keep meaning to get around to. I learned that colon cancer is on the rise. It's now the number one cancer killer for people under 50 in the U.S. The good news is it's also one of the most preventable cancers, which is why getting screened matters. I've actually done the Cologuard test myself. 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