Episode 127: The Creator Roadmap: What to Focus on at Every Follower Stage

You're listening to the Creator Passport Podcast. Today, we're going to be talking about the Creator Roadmap and what to focus on from 0 to 1K, 1K to 10K and 10K to 50,000 followers. I think most creators are not falling behind because they are necessarily doing the wrong things or are untalented. They're struggling because they're working on the strategies that do not match the current stage that they're at. A creator with 400 followers should not operate like a creator with 40,000 followers. At the same time, a creator with 40,000 followers cannot keep treating their account like a hobby that they are just experimenting with. So with that, let's go ahead and dive into the episode. Hi, we're just on Stephen and in just over five years, we have grown our business to over 1.8 million followers across platforms and over in seven figures as content creators and digital entrepreneurs. This is a podcast that shows you success isn't just about algorithms and trends, but how strategy, creativity and mindset will help you grow and scale your own personal brand beyond your wildest dreams. This is the Creator Passport Podcast. Welcome back you guys. It's been a second since we've done a little solo episode, but we just got back from our TCP in-person retreat and we're on a high, a little sleepy. We got back at 3am last night. But it was so worth it. It was so much fun. We did a full-on hotel mastermind at Sandals, St Vincent for what, five days, six days? Such a good time. It was so hands-on. We got to have a group of about 30 of us just doing content creation, doing room tours and just learning everything about the industry, lots of mindset and yeah, it was just so much fun. I can't wait to host more live events in the future because that was just such an awesome time. Yeah, but today, one thing that we saw happen a ton during this past trip is we had people from all different levels. So we thought that this would be the perfect topic to talk about today because and we get this DM all the time when people look at the leverage passport and what we're doing on that page and they're like, well, you did this. So I should do that too. Really? No, no, no, no. Just because you think you know what's going on in a creator's business who has more followers than you or even less followers than you trying to copy their strategy from the outside when you're in a completely different stage of business is a recipe for disaster because you probably don't have the same system set up yet. You probably don't have the same team. You probably don't have the same experience yet or branding established yet to basically jump to the next level. It's like if you're starting off playing a game and you're competing against someone who's really advanced and you just copy what they do but you don't even know the rules yet. You know? Exactly. So how do you know if you're playing right? I think and I think that's another thing to talk about is like why do most creators work on the wrong things? I think it's very easy to obviously consume a ton of advice from people that are maybe six months or even a few years ahead of you as well as you listen almost to too many people and one this is one thing that our mentor told us is if you constantly are finding new people to listen to their strategy and I see happen to business owners all the time where they try and do one thing and then listen to one business owner and as soon as that doesn't work for them in a month they're like okay that thing doesn't work let me jump to the next one and then they try the new person's strategy for a month and they're like oh good to go to go to go. Exactly. Rather than just like you know I always say go to them find the person that you want to be the most similar to look at their lifestyle look at what they're doing look at how they create their content and go and figure out what they are doing that's going to be the easiest way for you to find success with this. But yeah I did think it's funny because I will scroll on the creator passport sometimes like our Instagram just to see what's up what's popping up on that feed versus my personal page versus our travel page and I'm going to call you out my my students who are all commenting on like all of the other coaches many chats and stuff because I see the people doing this and it's usually the people that have all the strategies already but there's usually some sort of mindset block or hurdle that they have not fully tackled yet and so they're going in search for more information instead of just doing the things that they need to do instead of sitting with the the inner work that they need to do before they jump to the next level and honestly we'll probably talk about a little bit about you know starting off versus the middle tier versus the 50k plus and what each of those levels does require from a mindset perspective to because we just focused a lot we had our mindset coach Brad come in to talk to all of our students who came to our in-person retreat this last weekend is just a good reminder that you know you can learn from anyone but if you're not doing the inner work on yourself then strategies only one half of the equation so you're never going to get to that next level if you're completely ignoring that too yeah I think a lot of people especially in the beginning they almost avoid a lot of the foundational work that maybe it's a little bit harder or a little bit more uncomfortable because the more advanced things they just seem sexier more fun like no one wants to hear oh well you need to post more consistently like that doesn't necessarily feel like a ground breaking thing but if you don't do that at the zero to one thousand follower stage then you're never going to make it to those more advanced things they're maybe more fun or more interesting to talk about at like the 50k follower range and just understanding like what is your audience enjoy how can I communicate my message to them are you actually pulling your analytics and looking at how you can improve your hooks like there's so many things at the beginning stages that I think a lot of people don't don't necessarily want to do because they're just they're not super exciting so well I think it's also a lot of people if you're less than 10,000 followers even just a thousand followers you want to be perfect so you just like don't even do the things you know you need to do because you're stuck in this perfectionism where you get too afraid to start because you're not giving yourself permission to be bad at something even though you're a beginner yeah exactly and I think it's hard especially when you're an adult like you never want to be bad at anything right I literally I think I might have talked about this on the podcast before but I started trying to like knit right all the cute Icelandic and Norwegian girls who can knit I'm so jealous of you but every time I try to start knitting I like go back to the basics right I'm watching the YouTube tutorials on exactly how to do a knit stitch how to do a purl stitch and I have the strategy and I get so frustrated when I mess up I am like wow I just wasted all this time and I learned this and I've been doing this and I messed up a couple stitches and now my whole pattern is going to be wrong and then I just stop and then I don't continue going and I'm feeling a lot of people are like that in content creation too yeah so over over the course of this episode we really are going to be diving into what should be your primary goal at each stage so we're going to try and break it up into like the stages we see after coaching a ton of people and then what skills do you really need to develop like a ton of people at our last mastermind event we're like oh my gosh how do you edit so fast like how do I get to that level and it's like that's just a skill that needs to be developed at a certain stage it's like one of the gym and this is a hard one I want you to be able to identify what should be ignored at the stage like at the zero to one k what are things you should not be worrying about at that 10 to 50 k what are things you should not be worried about at all and then how should you approach monetization at that stage because I think a lot of people get started and all they want to do is obviously make a ton of money from content creation right because they see people post like the look at how much I made it as a content creator or look how much I made as a u gc creator when in reality most of the people that you see do that are just because they have one good month and then they sell a course and they start making crazy amounts of money unless you are a content creator with like over a million followers most people will not be able to make over a hundred thousand dollars a month unless you are selling some type of crazy course right so I always say anytime you see any of those just be very cautious of what they're what they're trying to say but let's go ahead and start with stage one this is going to be if you are starting out or listening to this podcast and you have zero followers all the way up until you hit your first a thousand followers and this is the hardest stage in my opinion because it is like it took us so many months to go from zero to one k and this is pre-reels pre-tick talk but it's still equally as much of a grind it was either like seven or eight months to get there and it can be really daunting when you're posting every day your first or you're not even posting every day but you're posting you're putting yourself out there for the first time you might start getting some judgment from your friends or family of like who do you think you are to be posting like an influencer and it can be a lot all at once and to throw it all in there too your content might not be great yet like you genuinely might have terrible content when you first and you know what, it's a right of passage because we've all been there. If you were to go back, I don't even know if they're still there. I think I archived them all a couple of years ago. But our first post from 2020, we're so god-awful, you guys, the edits that I did on some of our photos were just garbage. So bad. I look back at some of the photos we sent for some of our first UGC deals in 2020. My cow did they pay for this? This was so bad. But you gotta start from somewhere. Exactly. So I think the first thing that I want you to be able to ask yourself or try and figure out at this stage is number one, can I consistently create content about a particular topic? And I think this is something that you have to really start thinking in the future, right? And three years from now, if I'm getting into fashion, will I still care about clothes? Maybe, probably. If you're just getting into travel content creation in three years, are you still gonna be traveling? Absolutely. If you're trying to create a page, let's say, all off of sourdough bread and gluten-free stuff, is that something that is going to be a lifestyle that you want to stick with? I would not create content necessarily if you're like, I'm gonna go vegan for 30 days and then just become a vegan account. You're not gonna be able to do that forever. So we're thinking long-term sustainability. Exactly. But you can always, I do want to caveat that with, like, yes, right now, you might think you want to do travel content, for example, for the next three years. If you do eventually want to change, that's also, okay, pivoting can work. Like, our friends Ian and Anna, who we've had a podcast, episode with maybe a couple of years ago, love them there. They pivoted from travel content to lifestyle and now, cooking content. So it is possible down the line, but I think when you're first starting, you're honing in, it's very important to think, can I talk about this thing with passion and energy for the next couple of years and not get tired of it? Like, most of the time. Sometimes you will get a little bit tired of it, but in a general sense, you should be excited about whatever you're posting, 95% of the time. Yeah, and I think that's kind of the second question is, like, can you make strangers care about it? Like, are you so excited about what you're gonna be talking about that you'll make someone else be like, you know what, this is freaking cool. I wanna follow along. And I think that when we were first starting out, we talked nonstop about travel and hiking and backpacking and we loved going on road trips. And people would ask, like, what type of shoes do you wear? Like, where do you recommend going? And we could get other people, just like our local friends very invested in wanting to learn more about it. So we're like, you know what, I feel like we could get other people and inspire other people to do the exact same thing. So as long as you know, you can post about it for a decent amount of time, and you think you can make other people care about what you're doing, I think that's like, you just wanna get clear on what the initial goal is. Like, I sat down with a couple creators at our last event and was like, okay, what do you wanna do? Who do you wanna help? And they were like, I don't know. And that's exactly why they weren't above that like 1,000 followers threshold. As soon as you can understand and have like a clear account promise, it's just gonna help so much in the long run. Well, it's also going to help you come up with your target audience, because if you don't know who you're trying to help or who you're trying to inspire, it's gonna be really difficult for you to create tailored content for that person. So think about if you're creating travel content, right? That's like step one. Next, who do you wanna inspire when Stephen and I first started? It was other couples who were working nine to five. And so we would speak to that person, 'cause if you're speaking to everyone, you're speaking to no one, very popular marketing saying where you do have to get a little more specific for your message to resonate with your core audience. And so get really specific. Are you helping other solo moms get outside? I'm using travel examples, but this obviously applies to any niche. Are you helping other 60 plus travelers get outside and travel and show them that their life isn't over when they retire or when they're older, right? Like there are so many different ways that you can come up with a creative angle to figure out who your target audience is and then create your photos and videos and stories from a lens that will appeal to that person and then therefore inspire them to do something. - Exactly, I think like in this first stage, a super useful test is just thinking, if someone found your page a complete stranger, could they describe your account after looking at your last three posts? And I mean, you could do this yourself. Like go to your page, scroll three times and see what are the last three things you posted and ask yourself, does this really show who my content is for, what I want to talk about and do I give them a reason to wanna follow along? Like is the viewer gaining something? Are they getting value or entertainment or like what is the reason that they're gonna follow you? - And that should be in your bio. Like if it's not in your bio, I did a lot of profile audits this last week. If it's not in your bio or in your about me or a pinned post, it's gonna be very difficult for someone to make that quick follow decision when they land on your page for the first time. So it should be very abundantly clear. Like if you're looking at the lover's passport page, you were gonna get some bucket list travel in the bow, whether that's tours, hotels, airbnb, whatever. Very, very clear. If you're looking at like the creator passports, pretty dang clear, you're trying to get social media help and advice so you can grow and monetize a page. So think about that for you. Come up with the one sentence elevator pitch of what you are trying to basically give value to your audience for. - And if you don't know how to do that, we have a completely free resource. It's literally called start from scratch. I'll go ahead and link it down below, but it teaches you how to set up your account, what should be in your bio, exactly what your pin post should be, how to start to niche down. So if you're in the zero to 1000 follower stage and you're like the stuff that you're saying is just going right over my head, I would definitely go watch the start from scratch. It's like I basically made it like a course for someone under 1000 followers and it's completely free. But the next point, kind of that we wanna explain at this zero to 1000 followers is you need to understand you're gonna need repetition and a certain amount of volume in order to just start to understand what is working on your page. And I think that so many people try posting about one topic for seven days and they're like, oh my gosh, my page is a failure. No, I have no idea what's working. And it's just because you haven't done it enough in the beginning, kind of treat it like you're just collecting data and say, okay, I'm gonna give myself the grace for the next 90 days to test out a whole bunch of different hooks, different storytelling formats. I'm gonna-- - Connection style. - Exactly, play around with editing on edits and CapCut, maybe DaVinci Resolve or Premiere or Final Cut. Play around with everything and see which topics resonate the most with your audience, but also feel the best for you. Like someone, someone he's a land on your page and understand what you're about, but if you've only posted about a subject for three days, like you're not gonna have any data and they're not gonna have anything either. You need to probably post for a good 30 days about a subject before you understand whether it's gonna work or whether you need to rebrand to something else. - And we actually approach it from a quarterly perspective. So we look at our data for three month intervals, essentially. So you can kind of get the whole picture because a lot of people in the zero to one K stage will get really hyper obsessed with their analytics and almost, you know, just focus on the wrong things. I think it's very important that you zoom out and take a look at the data set as a whole versus a day-by-day play of, oh, my audience didn't like this or my audience loved this, but you're only looking at it one day out of 90 days versus when you have the full 90 day data set, you can make really informed decisions. - And then after that 90 days, you almost get like the, what your count, like almost like themes for your account. For instance, if you were like in travel, what type of travel do you do? Do you do budget travel? Do you do road trips? Do you do just safari content? Do you do only luxury? So being able to look back at the last 90 days or even last 30 days if you wanna get quicker data and say, oh, every time I post about this one thing, it really works. And we go way, way deeper into this in other podcasts episodes. So I'm not gonna spend too much time on it, but I definitely would recommend just getting and putting the volume out so that way you start to understand what is working. - And fine patterns. I think pattern recognition is the biggest thing in this stage. - Definitely. And thinking about like skills and things that you really need to start to play around with is getting so good at trying to improve your hooks. Just really focusing on how can I come up with a three to five different hooks to put out to see what's gonna work better. And we've talked about trial rules before on the podcast too. It's never been easier to like just test out different hooks in different storytelling frameworks. I would highly recommend if you're not posting trial rules trying to get them out as quick as possible. And if you guys are looking for, I don't even know how to come up with a semi-strong hook. We actually are getting ready to add a hook generator into the viral content vault for people that have heard of it. about that and same thing if you're in TCP, we're working on adding that in the back end. So we're alumni. Woo-hoo. Yeah. So that should be super helpful, but that's like a skill that takes some time to put together in the beginning, but it's so important. And I also think another skill that you should focus on in this early stage is coming up with and just brainstorming ideas. I think it's so easy for people to just rely on chat GBT and say, I'm a fashion creator. Can you give me 25 different ideas to post? Like, no, in the beginning, you need to use your brain. Get better. No, I think you always need to use your brain. I think this is an aside. We could do a whole episode on this. We obviously talk about how much we love AI for our workflow and our systems on the back end, but the real bread and butter of your account should be coming from your real authentic noggin. Okay. Like, that's how you're really going to separate yourself out from other people, not by starting off your account with a ton of chat GBT ideas. Like yes, you can give chat GBT your data from 90 days to help identify patterns and what strong and what's not and what you should cut and stuff. I think that's totally fine. But when it comes to creative and like coming up with your two to three repeatable content formats that are going to work for you and the hooks that are going to work for you, I really strongly recommend trying to like do that from scratch from your brain. So that way you're not just because remember, AI is like scraping other people's stuff. So if you are in content, if you are relying on that, then it's very likely that the content you're going to be putting out is probably already done before and it's not going to be very unique and people are not going to follow you from the zero to one case phase because they're seeing that kind of content on other people's pages that are bigger. So yeah, I think that in the beginning, it's so, so important to just figure out your voice. You should have some opinions in life, you know, or some opinions about what you're posting about. And if you don't know where to start, I think a really good spot is just to ask yourself, like what would I have wanted to know or what did I enjoy about this subject a couple years ago and just pretend like you're creating for yourself three or four years ago. And I think you'd be really surprised at how many different ideas you could come up with from just doing that. So now let's talk about like what does not really matter at that 1000 follower spot that I think a lot of people try and have a figured out and you do not need to come up with a full brand identity. You don't need to go find like a designer to give you a logo or a huge brand. Or a huge brand. And like figure out your exact, we didn't figure that stuff out till I don't weigh. And we rebranded later on. Like I don't think I talk about this inside of TCP to but a lot of people get so excited about the visual aesthetics of your brand. And while I do think it's important in the beginning to choose like a consistent and I say one consistent font that is readable and you can use over and over and over again and maybe one accent font. And then what no, that's basically it. Those would be the two things that I would be worried about because that's what's going on your reels and your carousels outside of that. That will take one day. Do not be constantly changing fonts every single day and worried about like all of these minute design decisions because that is not really going to be the differentiator on why people follow you or not. Like we literally use the most basic Instagram font white and black classic font to grow to over a million followers. While it's not super aesthetic. Is it effective? Yes. Is it readable? Yes. And then what's going on in the end of the day is trying to worry about our fonts. Instead we were working about our or worrying about our storytelling about our hooks like and other things that actually move the needle. Your fonts may or may not obviously like summer some help with recognizing your visual identity online. But it's not going to be like the thing that makes you go viral in my opinion. Yeah. I totally agree. Just to even go over like a quick list of things that we see so like we get we look at every single one of your DMs that comes in. So we see the questions that pop up and you don't need to think about post like should I post a long form and write a blog and do a TikTok and YouTube and a Facebook should I do all of this the first week like please don't just focus on one platform like you can reserve your user names on those sure but that's it. One one short form out of time. There's like a 10 of other people also recommend doing like 90 day sprints where you focus on one thing for that quarter. And I think if you're in the zero to one K range Instagram is your one thing you will burden yourself out with the amount of stuff that it takes to do to run a successful Instagram business and also starting a YouTube channel and a blog all at the same time learning from personal experience here because we did all five at once. I wish we didn't because we just had a hundred thousand subscribers on YouTube. We would have done it way faster if we weren't posting me. I like we were spread ourselves or we spread ourselves to thin if we're being honest in the beginning because we wanted to do it all. Instead I would have focused on just Instagram in the beginning gone all the way up you guys have heard us talk about the bridge analogy in a couple of podcasts episodes like built the Instagram bridge get more resources once that's in place to build a TikTok bridge and then once you build a TikTok bridge and you go over to YouTube don't do it all at once. Yeah and I think that another thing people freak out about is like oh I need the perfect camera and this new DJI drone came out and the pocket came out and I I need new lenses. What's the best focal length like dude hold your horses just use your phone and the name use your phone until you start making money like it's not unless you're like you have a ton of money and you're really excited to buy a fancy camera for like an African safari then maybe my answer might be different rent it or buy it off Facebook marketplace but yeah it's not a yes equipment can enhance things but in the beginning you're not there yet that's not what you need to be focused on to take your your content from this level to the next level like that's for a later phase right when you want to start branching out into other income streams but we've had so many students have such great success with literally only their phone because phone cameras have come a long long way. Yeah and like another thing is you don't I wouldn't even worry about hiring or thinking about virtual assistants or coming up with a crazy website and spending money on logos like getting an S Corp and all this stuff like we have all this information available for people in our program but it's just there for when you need that later on in the beginning we didn't like establish a corporation until we made what like $10,000 or $20,000 something like that because you don't need it yet and then same thing like there's just so many other business business e things that you might get all caught up in but just stay the course. I think that what one thing that you can think about with all these things if you heard one of these and you're like oh man well I'm kind of doing that is it almost they might feel good to you right to like finish your website and finish a media kit and all these other things but it's kind of like productive procrastination because are any of those things really going to move the needle and not really well maybe down the line when you more followers but in the zero to one case stage no if no one's even seeing your website then why did you spend all that time looking at it you're designing it you know it's the same thing I say with YouTube it's like you could put out the best YouTube video in the world but if nobody clicks on it then what's the whole point yeah and I think that kind of goes into like monetizing at this point too a lot of people ask like if I have under a thousand followers how should I worry about making money it's like why are you so quick to make money if you don't have a job and you need and you're trying to get into content creation then yeah obviously you want to make money but I would be willing to bet 95% of people listening to the podcast probably have some type of other job we're probably have a full time job or a part time job and you're trying to do this in addition to it and if you are I would not make monetizing necessarily the first thing you do is it capable are you able to do it at this stage yes absolutely like we have someone that's going to be speaking at our creator passport success summit next week and she's done a phenomenal job she was making like $10,000 a month from doing UGC with UGC you don't need a big audience at all yeah she had 300 followers when she was doing this and she was able to scale and that's one reason we're gonna have her come and speak to our students as a guest expert but I that was one thing that she did is she didn't try and do it necessarily in the first like three weeks or four weeks or two months it took her some time like she was doing it for six to eight months before she started to have those crazy months well and she wasn't trying to grow her Instagram at the same time I think that's the biggest thing and like what Stephen was saying you absolutely can like we started monetizing with 2000 followers but you have to remember I did have a leg up in the industry because I worked on the brand side of social media marketing so I already had a lot of systems and stuff in place but I think if I were to restart in 2026 and I know we have a whole episode talking about this as well I would really push for growth the first 90 days that you are starting a new account or you're in this stage because you're ROI for the amount of time you're spending pitching and reaching out and trying to work with brands with 1000 followers if you were to just take that same energy and really focus on just growth and then let's say maybe you get to 10,000 followers over the 90 days and and then start pitching the next quarter, that time is going to give you higher dividends and better investment for yourself and your business down the line, then if you were trying to grow and pitch at the same time and monetize at the same time. So yeah, I would say, I personally, and you guys don't have to agree, but I personally would say really push for growth and then once you hit 5,000, 10,000 followers, that's when we start adding in more of the monetization aspect. - Yeah, and one thing I do always say is it's kind of like a teeter totter here, is does the creator that just spends the first six months only on UGC monetization make more income in those six months than the creator that focused on only growth for the first six months? Absolutely, but if you start thinking about content creation in years-- - And compounding interest, basically. - Exactly, and if you start putting it in long term, if you look at the creator that focused on growing their platforms in three years compared to the creator that only worked on UGC for three years, the potential for revenue is way, way higher and someone who grew their account and understood what makes something go viral compared to someone that just keeps doing lower paying UGC deals. Now, that might not be the solution for everyone, but I would say almost every creator we talk to makes much more income from having a larger audience rather than doing just UGC work. - Mm-hmm. - So just really quick before you go into the next stage, last couple of mistakes in case you didn't hear a couple of our rants so far in this episode is please don't change your niche before you're posting enough. You need to post frequently enough to learn what is working if you're under that 1,000 follower stage. And if you're just gonna copy viral videos at this point, please spend more time just creating content than just copying. You need to understand why a video went viral if you were gonna do it 'cause it could even bring in the wrong audience for you. - Well, we never advocate for copying, right? But like we study the formats, the hooks, and the things that are already working for people across all niches and then you wanna figure out, okay, how can I make this my own? And how can I take a format and maybe make it from a recipe video into something related to travel, right? Because if you just blatantly copy anyone's work, then one, that's not cool. Two, you're gonna be compared to this person who's been doing this for so much longer. And it's really not gonna do anything beneficial for your account whatsoever. Then maybe give you a little dopamine boost. So there really is not a benefit to maybe just like, I'm gonna take that back. There really is not a benefit to just, you know, doing the viral trends over and over and over again. And I'm willing to bet almost 85% of the audits I do for people under a thousand followers, they're stuck there because they're only doing trends. That is it. So like how would people, or why would people wanna follow you if you're only doing trends because you offer no original value? That's a little harsh, but like it's true. You need to spend a little bit more time like creating rather than consuming, I think at this point. And also just don't, I highly recommend not ever comparing yourself to other people that have been doing this for a long time. If you're looking at someone that has a hundred thousand followers and they did a trend, and then you do the same trend and you're like, well, their video performed better than mine, why did that happen? It's because they've been doing it for a while. I like, don't compare yourself, don't delete any like really post just 'cause they underperformed. Your whole focus right now should just be on niching down, making sure that you serve your audience, and that you are picking up the skills that make a good content creator. So with that, let's go ahead and make our way to stage number two. If you hit a thousand followers, let's go. So what should you be working on between now and 10,000 followers? I think the goal here is really to build a repeatable growth system. So if you've got to a thousand followers, it means you probably semi-know what works. You probably had a couple videos hit 50 to 100,000 views 'cause in order to hit a thousand followers in our eyes out of all the metrics we've seen, that typically means one million views is equal to a thousand followers. So you've got a couple things to pop off, right? You have proof that people care about what you're actually talking about. So now you need to figure out a way on how to make that growth more predictable. So I want you to be asking yourself, what is already working and how can I turn it into a repeatable system? Anyone that's inside the creator, passport, knows, GNI are all about systems. Everything with thing that we do has some type of a system that we have put into Asana and that we can do over and over and over again. That's the only way we've been able to post for almost five years every single day now. So what actually matters, what should you really be focusing on? Number one is, like I said, you need to double down on the things that are working. We always like to tell this story of where we are now, right? We're posting luxury travel, we're going to five-star resorts, we're doing a lot more like bucket list activities all around the world. That is not at all what we started off doing. We started off doing budget backpacking tips, hiking in the eastern Sierra out here in California. And the reason that we've pivoted to more of the style of content we're doing now is because we have double down on the top performing pieces of content. So if you've made it to 1,000 followers, or even maybe you're at 5K and you want to get to 10K, you need to look back at your past 90 days and look at what are the proven formats and proven topics that are generating you the most amount of views. So for example, when I'm doing this for, let's say, lovers' passport carousels, right? I can go look back at our last 90 days of carousels in my professional dashboard and see, okay, which one's got the most views, which one's got the most follows, and which one's got the most engagement. And then I can see, oh, like earlier this year, I posted a carousel that said, like, unfortunately, this hotel ruined all other hotels in California for us. That was our most engaged carousel. And I was like, okay, awesome. I'm gonna try and figure out why this did so well. And I think there were two things. One was the format where we posted like a selfie of us with that text hook. And then the reveal was this beautiful drone shot and photos of this property. And the second one was the text hook itself. Like it was a trending one. And it just worked really well for us. So then what, a week or two ago, I posted a tour one. So I took what worked really well for hotels. And I applied it to my other content pillar of bucket list tours. And I said, unfortunately, this tour has ruined all other tours in Greece for us. Different location. It's not a hotel, it's a tour. And once again, did the same format of like just like an iPhone photo of me and Steven in the first one and then the rest were all professional photos. And it crushed. It got over a thousand comments. And that was tied to a many chat with an affiliate link for that tour. And that has already generated quite a few affiliate bookings for us for a couple hundred dollar tour. So that's awesome. So that's like what we mean by really doubling down on what's working. Look at your analytics for all of your content, not just like carousels, but also reels and stories. And see, OK, why did this work so well? Is it the hook? Is it the topic? Is it the actual structure of the content? Like I was talking about this with a photo or iPhone photo plus drone photos. Like what about it? Can you kind of make an educated guess on where you can replicate that over and over again, regardless of where you are or what you're posting it out? And that is exactly what I think helps people get from that 1,000 to 10,000 followers mark so fast. And I feel like another thing here is you need to start developing your own. I feel like your own type of either signature series or signature content style. By this stage, you should hopefully have a carousel format that you know works-- Or two to three formats. A text style that you're used to using, maybe like a music genre or a type of song that you would usually use, just so your audience starts to understand what you're all about. And we have a whole bunch of content on how to create a signature series, whether you check out our YouTube channel, which I will link down below or other podcast episodes. So I won't go too deep into it. But just understand that the quickest and fastest growing pieces of-- or creators that we see these days are the ones doing signature series. We just had a student actually hit a million followers. And the reason they were able to grow from 500,000 to a million so fast is because of signature series content. It was like literally a month or two. Where they went from 500,000,000 because every single episode of this series did so, so well for them. So yeah, don't underestimate it. It's really good. Steven and I have been plotting our new ones that we've done because unfortunately, we're at the point where all of our signature series have now been trendedized. I don't know what to-- They've just been copied so fast. They've been copied so many times without now, like nobody has seen it. that nobody has the idea that we were the original people. So now we got to come up with new things, and this happens a lot, you guys, where you might come up with an idea that does really well for you. It becomes a trend, and now everyone's like, you were the original creator of that, I had no idea. So it's constantly have to be innovating. - And I think that takes us to the third one here, which is you need to really start focusing on the numbers a little bit more in depth, and trying to understand what improves your conversions. And that, like I said, the number that we always try and look for with students is, did you get a million views? And if you did, did that convert to a thousand followers? And if it did not, you need to be asking yourself, how can I give my audience, or other people out there on Instagram, a bigger reason to actually follow. Like, is your account promise there? Do they understand what they will get? And do you provide enough call to actions? Is there enough value on your page to make someone look and say, okay, well, this person, I want to follow along with and see what comes next. I think that a lot of people are able to generate tons of views, right? Let's say you do a trend, or let's say you do. - Do you do an entertaining post? - Exactly, and you have a video that gets 10 million views, and you're all stoked, and I'm like, awesome, and then you reach out, and you're like, I just got 10 million views, and I'm like, amazing, are you at 10,000 followers yet? And you're like, well, I actually only gain 200 followers from that, and in my eyes, it's not necessarily a failure, but it's definitely. - It's not a failure. - It's not a failure, but those views don't really mean anything, right? You need those views to convert an audience, otherwise it's just like a wasted idea, 'cause your whole goal at this stage is really to start building a community. Back when we had 10,000 followers, I think we were getting like 300 or 400 comments per post. - Yeah, we were super engaged. - So we had a ridiculous engagement rate, because we really focused on building that community. Every single comment we responded to. Every single DM we were sending voice memos to or responding back to. We were asking questions, we were talking in our stories all the time, because at this stage, if you just continue to grow, and no one knows you, no one really interacts with you, then you're gonna burn out. If there's no community on Instagram, and that's why I don't love TikTok or Facebook, it doesn't feel like there's a tight-knit community there. We're over on Instagram, you can find your people, and everyone is a lot more engaged on there. So I highly recommend just making that a top priority. Obviously, continue posting your content, but post content that's gonna connect you with your audience. So that way they come back wanting to see the next part of your series, or wanting to see the next part of your content. And then I think obviously at this stage, you should have a very, very basic system for everything. How do you capture content? How do you script your content? How do you film, edit, post, everything, just because to get to a thousand followers, you're probably gonna have to post for a couple of months, to get to 10,000 followers, is it gonna take you 10 times as long? One way that you can speed that up is just by increasing the frequency. So rather than posting maybe two or three times a week, to get to a thousand followers, can you start posting four to six times per week? 'Cause it's gonna help you get to that 10,000 follower work way, way faster. - Well, I think also too, if you have these processes that you've now established over and over again, if you start documenting those, and writing them down somewhere like in Asana, or loom videos where you're actually standardizing your process, now it's gonna be very helpful for you when you jump into that next phase of content creator growth to eventually start hiring help. But you're not doing that at this stage yet, but if you can start documenting all of your processes now, your future you will thank you. (laughing) 'Cause we did not do that. - So let's start talking about what does not matter at this stage, 'cause there's gonna be a whole lot, you're gonna be like, oh my God, I remember when we had 10,000 followers, I thought we were celebrities. - I thought, well, when we had a thousand followers, even was like, we made it, we did it. - It's over, like this is-- - We did it, Joe. (laughing) - Which is, I wish we like recorded that, 'cause it would be so funny seeing where we're at now. - Well, no, I think there's old, on your personal Instagram page, you shared like, we hit a, or Merry Christmas everyone, we hit 10,000 followers. (laughing) And I'm sure you're gonna take that out, this is pretty funny. But, like things that don't matter that you don't need to be worried about, 'cause it's gonna feel like you have a lot more opportunities. You don't need to start just trying to hire people, you don't need to launch a ton of different products. Be like, I have this audience, I must sell to everyone. Like, you don't need to be like, I can't do any more trends, I can't do, I have to, everything must be original now, I can't have every idea, I can't repurpose things. Like, and I think a lot of people at this stage too, get almost like, partnership happy, so they just, they'll be like, I'll work with any brand, I'll do any type of exchange partnership, just give me all the products, 'cause you start to get more of those offers, right? And, you don't wanna, I feel like you can get caught up in the Joneses a lot with that stuff. Don't worry about that stuff, your main priority is just gonna be focusing on, how can I make this repeatable, so I can keep the momentum going, and not add any extra like complex things to your to-do list. 'Cause once again, it's all just gonna lead to more procrastination and more distractions at this stage. I think the main thing, main way that you can start generating income at this stage, is probably brand partnerships. Do you feel like that's when we started to make pretty good money from them? - We did a mix of UGC and brand partnerships at this phase, I would say. But, our UGC deals were decently paying, 'cause we never did one-off UGCs really. We did multiple asset UGC deals, and what I mean by that is, instead of just saying, "We'll make one video for a brand." We were doing like three to five videos for a brand, and so all of those deals were like, typically over $1,000 for the most part. So it was a very easy way to start getting monetized, because we knew how to negotiate and upsell and do packages, which is the secret sauce to making money when you're smaller is doing more deliverables, especially if you're already taking the same time out of office to film them. So yeah, we did a nice mix of them, but I will say definitely once we had that 10,000 follower mark, we did a lot more sponsorships than UGC. - And I will say that this is a good opportunity to remind you, don't just go and pitch Coca-Cola and Apple. (laughs) You should be working with smaller brands. - And? - Local businesses, I think that we always say fight at your weight class. - Yeah, well, yeah, that's a good point, but I would also say, when you first start out, you think you're the shit, right? When you hit 10,000 followers, but like I said in the beginning of the episode, I look back at some of the content we did for some of these smaller brands, I'm like, oh my god, if we reached out to Coca-Cola and tried to any them bad, like they were just laughing our faces, right? We did not have the skill set yet to work with these huge brands, and so working with small, mom and pop brands, one, it was able to, we were able to work with them their budget because we were smaller, two, we were able to get experience and get the skills to make our content better. And three, down the line, we still have great relationships with those people, and then we had a nice portfolio to be able to pitch some of these bigger brands. I'm not saying don't shoot your shot, but like if your brands think new and you grew really quick, and now you're trying to reach out to all these big honas, just keep in mind, like there are pretty high standards for content quality, so like make sure you're there already. - Yeah, I think that at this stage, you're not necessarily gonna, like I don't recommend trying to charge a brand out the ass, you know, like you should really focus on building strong case studies. This is the people, I don't know how many there are, but there's definitely still partners and agencies and people in high positions now that we started working with when we had under 10,000 followers and they've seen us grow, and they've also been able to grow in their own careers. So being able to keep those relationships and build testimonials and give them good results in the beginning, I think is super important. Don't be like, oh well, I have 10,000 followers now, so I'm gonna charge $5,000 for one video, like, - Okay, everyone on threads that complains that they don't get brand deals, they're like how dare this person try and only give me a couple thousand dollars on, and when I have like 5,000 followers, I'm like, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa. I think there's a lot of people getting lost in the sauce on threads when it comes to pricing yourself and we teach all this inside of our program, but like, on the one hand, absolutely get your bag, you need to be charging, you guys know that we are not for free work, but also charge like meta or, I don't know what's my big brand, like Coca-Cola weigh higher rates than you would like a local coffee shop down the street, right? Like, be flexible with your rates when you're setting them and be realistic with what you can charge, 'cause there's some people are so stubborn when they're like in the 10,000 follower range, and they think that they should only. only get $10,000 deals or more, and you're shooting yourself in the foot because that's not the way the world works always. You can absolutely get a couple of $10,000 deals with 10,000 followers, but don't think that's like the expectation, I guess? Yeah. Don't, I always say, make sure you talk to some established creators. Don't go and find some creator that has 10,000 followers and sells a UGC course listening to the BS. It's just, for example, we have very good relationships with our brand contacts, and I remember on one collaboration we did a couple of years ago, they were like, your friend blah, blah, blah, blah chart or tried quoting me $40,000 for Instagram stories for a week long tourism collaboration. And my, Steven and I were like, huh? Like they, I think they had like a hundred thousand followers and they wanted $40,000 for it. I was like, I feel like people get crazy. That's an insane quote. So anyway, I don't, but brand partnerships are a way you can obviously make, start making more money with UGC. I think another one you can start potentially introducing if you feel like an expert in an area is a low ticket product. For instance, this is where we released our digital photography ebook, which still makes us a good amount of income and was how we made our first $10,000 from digital product. So it is a good spot to start to do that, but. Or travel guides. That's another one we made. Like I think our first travel guide made us around like 16,000 in the first couple months that we had it. So another thing to work on there. All right. And let's go over the biggest mistakes now from that we typically see creators make between one and 10,000 followers. Number one is people abandon the successful topics so fast. Like if something is working for you, you don't need to broaden your niche. All we did was talk about California travel until we hit like 200,000 followers. So you don't need to expand and become super broad, too quick. Keep it nice and small. The more niche you are, the more dangerous you can be when it comes to fast growth, as well as having really strong partnerships because it makes it the more, um, the more niche we were in California and the more USA audience, the higher we could charge brands in the more people that reached out to us specifically chart, specifically looking for California partnership. So I think that's huge. I think another thing here is please start posting more stories if you're under, if you're at that one to 10,000 followers range. Start priming people to click on your stories to share links. Yeah. Or sorry, share links so that people can start getting primed to take your recommendations from the get go. Because I think it's really weird if you don't post anything about yourself or any links to your favorites or whatever in the beginning and then all of a sudden you start getting brand deals and now you're just sharing links and it's kind of out of the blue. So you need to train your audience to come along for the journey with you from the beginning. I think another big one here is avoiding lower, like just trying to only do it. Like you get so happy. I feel like at this point. As you start getting inbound, you don't want to be the person that just starts accepting a ton of unpaid work and says yes to every opportunity. Like it's okay to say notice some things if they don't, if you don't feel like they're authentic to you or if they're not going to pay you in budge on that. And then I feel like another thing here is I see happen where creators get super stoked that they start to grow fast. So they take a couple days off and you take your foot off the gas pedal and a leads to a little bit more of a plateau. So to keep doing I always say if it's continuing to work like why would you change anything? Just keep your foot on the gas so that you can hit that 10 to 50,000 follower range as quickly as possible. All right. Do you think we have enough time for a 10 to 50,000 follower should we save this for another episode? What do you think? I think we can bust through it. Let's do it. All right. G's feeling, G's feeling ambitious. So if you guys are still listening and you are in that 10 to 50,000 follower range, your goal here is really to turn these millions of views into a business. How can you start really generating good income? And this is where I think for us we started to hit that like six figure mark. As we hit 50,000 started moving towards 100,000, you grow rapidly. And if you don't set up things with the intention that you're running a business at this point, things go break exactly things blow up very, very quickly. I think one of the quotes that we've mentioned from our mentors, you can only grow to the level of problems that you're willing to handle in your business. And so you will start noticing going from 10,000, 50,000, there's a lot more things that you're going to have to worry about. Yeah. You need to stop asking yourself just how do I get more followers and start asking yourself how do I build a business that allows me to turn views into actual opportunities, different ways to make money and long term, you want to build a long term business. Don't be the creator that starts one year and the next year stops and gets burnt out. We've been doing this now for six years. And the reason that we've been able to make multiple millions of dollars from the lovers passport is because we set up these systems that we can just rinse and repeat every single year. So I think first thing, what matters at the 10 to 50k range? I think the first thing here is really having a strong niche by this point. I would say strong personal brand, honestly. Yeah. Like a strong positioning in your niche, not just a strong niche, but you're standing out in your niche. Yeah, you should be known for something. Like for instance, when we were coming up, like I said, all we did was talk about California until we were at 200,000 followers. So we started to be known as the California creators. And the red and yellow jacket couple. Like there is this other person called TK California. And he was like the Tik Toker known for California. And everyone was tagging him in our comments because it was like us and him were the biggest like advocates for California, his whole catchphrase. And he could really quickly, I wonder what happened to him. But he, he would start off every video or end it every video. He was like California ever or California forever and goodbye. And he would just do wet people and tell them why they're wrong about California and why California is so much better than their state. It was pretty funny. Like I enjoyed his content, but he grew really, really quickly from literally just doing that concept. Yeah. And it's because he had a very clear perspective. He had opinions. His audience trusted him because they knew it. And same thing as us, like they trusted our opinions on where to go that in California and the best road trips because we helped solve their problems. They knew what to expect from us. And they understood like that. They also, we really nailed down our photography at that stage. So people came to us for like couples photography tips. We would meet people out doing wedding photography and engagement photos. And they said they would use our photos for inspiration. And for their like adventure, elopement. Exactly. So like that was the level of that was the level that we reached to. And we were only at like 50,000 followers right around then. So if you're at that stage, like really thinking positioning becomes way, way more important. Yeah. And I mean, I would say if you can summarize your position in one sentence similar to when you're first starting out, like we became the go to for couples in California working in nine to five, that wanted something more on the weekends because everyone knew we, we were still working full time jobs. We wanted to get out on adventure. We're willing to prioritize it. And then we would share exactly how we did it. And I think that another thing once you get there is understanding the type of content that you should be posting by now, you have generated between 10 and 50 million views most likely on Instagram. So you need to start thinking like, if I'm going to post something, what is the purpose of this? You're obviously going to continue posting content that get you tons of views, tons of reach and that, but you also need to be posting content that builds trust with your audience. So voiceover is a more signature series, more of your face on camera, more storytelling content. Exactly. And then at the same time, you also need to be posting content that is going to help you make money. So get a, especially start establishing you in a good point to negotiate with brands. Yeah, like some of your content should almost feel like an ad, but it's not like that. Like an organic, like organic brand highlights. And I talk about a lot of this with students because you'll be pitching at this stage and you're like, why am I not getting partnerships? And I'll take a look at the page. And I'm like, well, you've never posted about a product on your page before or you've never posted a hotel or a combination or a recipe or about a dog product, whatever your niche is. If you've never organically done it, the brands that are potentially going to hire you are not going to see themselves in your content. And therefore not hire you. So you need to have some organic examples of if a brand is looking at your page, you have a higher following count. So that already qualifies you a little bit more. If they land on it, will they see some sort of social proof or example of what you can do for them? Yeah. And I think at this stage, you really need to start under like having a clue. clear monetization strategy. 'Cause if you don't, I think that you're almost leaving money on the table. So, you don't need to do every single type of monetization, but start thinking like, okay, am I gonna start pitching a bunch of brands and working with them? Am I gonna become the go-to LTK and Amazon affiliate person? Am I gonna release some type of digital product that I'm just known for? Are you going to start just having incredibly high-quality images and videos where you license a ton of stuff to other brands and double down on UGC? - Or are you gonna do consulting? Like, I know a ton of people in the points and miles travel space that do some high-paying consulting to help people use their points and miles for vacation. Like, there's so many different routes you can go. - Yeah, so it's really just coming up with a strategy and almost like a business plan of saying, okay, I want to lean into this and this is how I'm going to make my first 100K from content creation. And I think that kind of leans into the next part, which is if you have brand partnerships, you need to really start stepping up your game in terms of them, because if a company works with you with between one and 10,000 followers, they're probably paying you what? Under $1,000, maybe under $5,000. When you get to this 10 to 50,000 follower range, you can start landing big deals. And I think that this is where we landed, maybe our first $20,000 deal. And when we were doing it, it would be a multi-month partnership. So you need to really start taking these things professionally, understanding how to read contracts and all the different terms in it, making sure you have a strong media kit, because at this stage, you're not just like a local business anymore, yeah, you're trying to work with companies that are more on a nationwide, which means there's going to be way higher competition that you're going to have to push past. You're going to get a lot more nose of this stage because you're more expensive and there's more competition. So that's why I think it's also really important that you have case studies at this stage, where whether you're having past brand collaborations you can leverage or these kind of organic brand style things that you can leverage. And then you're also collecting data from your affiliate links that you can say, "Hey, brand, I drive this much organic traffic to you." So it makes a lot of sense that you can pay me my rates for a partnership because I'm already bringing you in thousands of dollars a month organically. So just things like that, where you really start having a portfolio case studies, media kit you have, all of the essentials that'll give you the full range of opportunities for working with brands. - Totally. And I think one thing, we didn't mention it too much in the last stage, but you should definitely start your email list at the 1000 to 10,000 follower range, but at 10 to 50,000 you should start not 100% leaning on it, but you should lean on it heavily. Write a newsletter, make sure you're sending out what you're doing and it gives a whole different way that you can start to monetize. - Well, I think at this point, you can start coming up with a freebie, where in the one at 10K stage, you can start an email list, but you're not necessarily doing too much with it yet. This stage, you are coming out with something to attract people to get on your list. So when we first started ours, it was in this stage, and I think we had a backpacking checklist, like a packing list. Now I would advise against downloadable freebies, just personal opinion right now because Chatchubt and AI and Claude can give anyone a packing list and I don't think they're as strong of a freebie. That being said, they still do work, but you just gotta come up with a creative angle for it, where you're providing a lot of value that AI wouldn't necessarily replicate. Totally. And I think at this stage, it could start to become an option to start delegating tasks out and potentially even hiring an assistant if you are a solo creator. I think if you're in a couple. - I think you can wait a little longer. - Yeah, you don't necessarily need to. I think it's more of just having a conversation with your partner on if they want to be involved in this new business or not. But if you guys are at that stage, hopefully by now you have systems so it makes delegating things way easier. Another thing that I just wanna be aware of or that you should be aware of at this stage is with money in content creation comes great responsibility. You need to start protecting what you show your audience. Like you having more of a PR brain when you're understanding which brands should I say yes to? - How often should I do brand deals? - Yeah, like if you're the creator that every single post is a brand deal like yay, in the next three months you might make some money. - But you're gonna lose a lot of your following. - Exactly. - Or not even lose it, but like you're gonna turn off your people from doing an ad every single day. - I think that that's one of the biggest downfalls that I see happen to a lot of creators. And anytime you do a brand deal, you have to just remember there's a certain amount of your audience that it's gonna turn off. No matter how cool the brand is. The next thing to think about here is what are all the things that don't really matter anymore? That or that you should not be thinking about at this stage. Number one is you should 100% like I said, have more of a content posting style. Don't just throw out random experiments anymore. Like you should 100% have a good system in place for when to post, how often you're posting, what style of content you're posting. And I think the more in tune with that you have, the better it'll be. I think another thing that you should pay attention to is please don't just take low ball rates just to work with big brands. 'Cause you're gonna have to, you'll probably have a couple big brands start reaching out to you at this point. I think it's really important to still protect your audience and protect your authenticity there. - Can I make a bold statement here? - Oh boy. The quote, "But I want it for my portfolio." Pizzes me off so much. And here's why, no brand ever looks at what other brands are working with. Like I've asked several marketing contacts, they literally do not care. The most important thing that they're looking at is your last 30 to 90 days of content. If it is aligned with their target audience, if it's good quality content, if it matches their brand, they're not looking if you've worked with X, Y and Z. So taking a free deal for it to look good on your portfolio, like no, don't do it. Like I think it's just such an excuse that we take ourselves and it's almost like, it's self sabotaging. It's literally saying, you know, I'm not good enough to get paid for this brand. So I'm just going to do this instead. And it's almost like a reflection of what you think your worth is in your content. And so I really, I hate that excuse when people are like, oh well, I really wanted to work with this brand. So I'm going to do it for my portfolio, but like realistically, I'm asking you, Stephen, when was the last time a brand asked us, who else we've worked with? - I think the only time would be is if they was like, for some exclusivity, where if we were like, have you worked with any cruise lines in the past three months 'cause if you have, we don't want to partner with you. - Yeah, and that almost bites you in the ass actually. - It is like, if you put that portfolio free exchange saying you worked with Virgin Voyages, right, on one of their creator's sailings, now you're going to go pitch Norwegian and they're going to be like, well, we don't want to work with you because you worked with Virgin. Now that's a bold example. Like I know a lot of people work with multiple cruise lines including us, but it definitely happens where like, oh, we saw you working with Ford. So we don't want to work with you on Toyota. So you got to be careful with that kind of stuff too. But that's just my hot take. I know not everyone agrees with that, but I just think it's the same thing with my beef with repost accounts. Like the actual ROI you get from collaborating with someone who doesn't pay you and they get more followers and more views from your content that you worked so hard on. They didn't do jack. It pisses me off. So that's my rant. - Wow, that would, you know what? We'll end on that for the 10 to 50 thousand dollar things not to do because we want you to hear that. - Well, I'm trying to work on my people pleasing. So there's me stating a bold opinion. There you go. - So as we close this episode, just overall, in case you missed a couple of pieces that are maybe you were driving or cooking while you're listening, the big thing I want you to understand is you do not need to do everything to become a successful content creator at the same time. You just need to understand what the right things to do are at your specific stage. So like for just a recap from zero to a thousand followers, really work on building your skills and finding clarity. I want you to understand where, what the direction is you're going. From a thousand to 10,000 followers, really turn what works into a repeatable growth system. You want to find something that's going to continue to keep that momentum on. And then from 10 to 50,000 followers, you're really focusing on building systems for revenue streams that transform all of these views that you're getting into a real business. So with that, we are going to be wrapping up this episode. If you guys want to see all of the other things that we are putting out, YouTube is with a new thing that we have for the creator passport. I'll go ahead and link that down below. If you want more tips on all of the things to do in order to start from scratch and get growing, like your bio, your niche, and how do you even set up your account, Make sure to check out our start from scratch guide. It's complete. completely free and I'll go ahead and link that down below. And we are getting closer and closer to when we will open doors for the creator passport. That is our signature coaching program. We are so excited about it. So if you guys are interested in Giselle and I being your coach and helping take your content creation to the next level, make sure to head down below and join our TCP waitlist. So you will be the first to know when we open up the next cohort. With that, we're going to be wrapping up this episode and we'll see you next week for another episode of the creator passport podcast. If you enjoyed this episode of the creator passport podcast, make sure to leave us a five star review on Spotify or Apple podcasts. And if you want to be the first to know when we open doors to our next cohort for our full signature coaching program, the creator passport, make sure to head down below and join our VIP priority waitlist. As soon as you join our waitlist, you will get to completely free lessons from our free coaching program. So head down below to join the VIP waitlist. And with that, we will see you next Friday with another episode of the creator passport podcast.