Ep. 958: Craig Morgan, The Most Patriotic Man in America

This is an iHeart podcast, Guaranteed Human. The best part of a Whitetail sit is often the part you have to earn. The temperature drops, nothing's moving, and climbing down starts sounding pretty good. The difference between seeing it through and climbing down early is about heart, but it's also about heat. That's why first light built whispered down. With 900 fill power, muscovy down, box bathful construction, and quiet water resistant fabric, it delivers serious warmth without weighing you down. First light whispered down, pack light, stay longer. Check it out now at firstlight.com That's F-I-R-S-T-L-I-T-E. Hot damn man, we're joined today by Craig Morgan. This dude has two many things to name them all. Sold your hunter, and you got to explain what this means. I see this all the time, but I don't give it a means. A Grand Ole Opry member. Yeah. At some point. Just tell me right now. Well, the Grand Ole Opry is one of the most heritage and prestigious organization within the country, music industry. There have been more people climb Mount Everest than there have been made members of the Grand Ole Opry. It's an organization that recognizes not only current successes, but the potential for future and growth, longevity within our industry. Generally, people who are members of the Grand Ole Opry have very long careers, and there's a larger percentage of the people that have been made members of the Grand Ole Opry that become members of the country, music hall of fame, than there are any other organization or anything other groups. Got it. I see that. So how long have you been there? How long have you been a member of the Grand Ole Opry? I was made a member in 2008. Okay. So long time now. Long time, yeah. He's charting more than 25 billboard songs, hosting outdoor TV show, just named "USO Global Ambassador." Welcome. This is our Veterans Day episodes. You're the man we need to talk to here. When you were growing up, like all the things you do now and things you're known for, like, when you were little kid, what was the first thing that clicked with you, meaning like, were you little kid and you're like, man, I want to be a hunter or I want to be a soldier. I want to join the army or man, I want to be a musician. Like, what was the, do you know what was stirring around in your head at the earliest age you can remember, you know? I grew up in a very low-income family. We were poor in middle Tennessee. We hunted for food. Okay. When we went hunting, it wasn't for sport. Not that I didn't enjoy it, absolutely, but I grew up hunting and fishing because we did it for food. Got it. What'd your old man do for living? He was a cabinet maker and a musician. Oh, really? Yeah. Growing up, I didn't think that I wanted to be a musician because I always told myself, I didn't want to have a job that required me to have another job to be able to do that job. Because that makes any sense. Back up again. Oh. I didn't want to have a job that required me to have another job or a, per se, real job in order to do that job. Like the whole, like, passion day job. Yeah, exactly. And, you know, in the music industry, that's kind of the, especially in the beginning for me, it was the norm, you know, you, you had a real job until you were successful enough in the music that you didn't require that real job to pay bills. Got it. But your old man never made it there? No. I mean, he could have. They had an opportunity with a record deal and they were doing really well, but they all had families. He was one of six brothers and the band was four of those brothers. Oh. And they all had families. And so they opted to do other things in order to ensure, you know, I've just recently seen another artist. And he was talking about it when he came to Nashville, someone gave him the advice to have a backup plan. He said, you know, fuck that. I don't want a backup plan because if you have a backup plan, that means you're preparing for not being successful. Oh. I approached it completely differently. But I approached it from the perspective, and a lot of that was that military mindset. Have a backup plan. But my backup plan was not one that would afford me the opportunity to not do the music. I had a backup plan in order that I could continue to do the music in an attempt to achieve the success that I wanted. I didn't get in the music business to be famous. I didn't do the outdoor show to be famous. I did the outdoor show to that for other reasons. I did the music for other reasons. It wasn't just for fame. It was to be successful financially. Yeah. I mean, I'm just being honest. Yeah. So for me, I had a backup, I always had a backup plan. And then I'm not sure if I got away from the question. No, no, no, you didn't. I gave a, I gave a commencement address, not this last spring before that at University in Montana, and you know what, what my speech was about, never make a plan B, man. See, I know a lot of people, like no backup plan say a lot of people will have that philosophy, but I would argue you all day long, you would fail miserably in the military. You would fail miserably in combat if you don't have a backup plan because you have to be able to shoot, move and communicate. You have to be able to modify. And if you have a soul direction and you don't have a modification from that direction, I would tell you the same thing when you go hunting to say, I'm going to go right where that bull is and I'm going to shoot that bull, you're going to fail. Yeah. So why would you focus solely on that only because if it comes to being a musician, but see here, I'm talking to you, you became a musician, so sure, but my plan was never my backup plan. This is why I want to clarify. My plan was never one that would steer me away from the music. It steered me towards my ultimate goal. So you have to have a plan and then you should have multiple plans to achieve that goal. If this doesn't work, if that door is closed, what, you don't have a backup plan, you don't go to the next door. No, you go to the next door. You have a plan. Okay. Now I need to defend my position. I want to tell you what the gist of what I was trying to get at was what I was trying to get at. So excuse me, like I wanted to be a writer, okay, and what I would see, I would see all these talented writers like me mid 20s age mid 20s, I would see all these talented writers that would be, well, I want to be a writer, but if that don't work, I'll do this and then they have these little plans and at a point you get sick of being broke and you get sick of, you get sick of the uncertainty. And the next thing you know, you're just doing the backup plan. But you are a writer. Well, I know, because I never had a plan B, like my plan, are you the writer that you set out to be? Yeah. Well, yeah. When you move to those writer towns, what were you wanting to write? I wanted to be a, well, it's so different now because the internet, yeah. I wanted to, I wanted to be a magazine writer. I wanted to be a, I wanted to write outdoor stuff for, for big magazines, I wanted to get books, which is what I did. And the reason I did it is all my, I never had a seductive backup plan. Yeah, I think, I think it's the definition of the backup plan. Yeah. I think that's where I have issues sometime because I think people assume that by having a backup plan that it steers you away from your goal. And I think you should have plans to achieve your goal. And sometimes your initial plan doesn't work. So you need a backup plan in order to achieve that goal. And you had, you might not have known it, but what you initially set out to do by moving to that particular thing, might not have worked that way, but you achieved your goal by doing something different at some point. Yeah. I don't want to talk about it. I think you need to be, until you, until you accidentally or on purpose have a child, I think you need to be that I'm going to do what I want to do or I'll die. Right? Yes. All that goes out the window once you have a kid. Once you have a kid. Hey, man. Yeah. Once you have a kid. I couldn't agree with you more. You're done. You're not done, but all of a sudden you got a thing you need to be doing. But I can attest to the fact that, and I agree with you 100%. But again, you need to, you need to have multiple routes to that goal. And again, I equate it to a military mission and a Navy SEAL will tell you, no, we're going through the freaking door no matter what the hell. But it's not true. It's not true. There's always alternate routes. And we need to be able to shoot, move and communicate. We need to be able to modify to achieve the ultimate goal that or whatever our mission is. And for me, it was becoming successful in the music business. But what age was that on your mind? It wasn't until later in my years. I'll be honest with you. My initial dream or goal or whatever you want to call it. I thought that I would graduate from college, go to work in some small town as a work my way up to sheriff and retiring law enforcement. I loved that. And I joined the military as a way to expedite that process. I thought by going into the military, I would gain more experience quicker than I could in a small town. So that wasn't a backup plan. That was part of the plan. It was part of the initial plan. But then when I went into the military, I fell in love with it. And so I ended up staying in. And my plan changed. God had, you know, that's another thing. I'm a very spiritual guy. Not a good Christian. Don't claim to be a great Christian. But I do believe in God. And I believe that God has a plan for us. And sometimes we need to pay more attention to what God has intended for us. Because it might take us longer to get where he wants us based on our own desires. Okay. And I think I'm where God wanted me to be. I think I'd have been there a lot sooner. If I'd have been paying more attention to what God wanted me to do instead of focusing on what I thought I wanted to do. I do believe that as well. Before I want to follow up on that before we drift too far away from when you were a little little kid. Yeah. You mentioned you guys hunted, you guys hunted fish and you were hunting for the pan and the pot, right? Yeah. Like what kind of stuff would you guys do? Like what would be some of the things you you guys, you and your old man or whatever would go out and catch your hunt? White too. I mean, it was a big thing in middle Tennessee. And my first deer hunt was with my mother, not my dad. Was there right? That's a fact. Yeah. My mom hunted this wheel. And it was my mom knew how to, you know, clean skin, gut process. And I learned from her those things. My dad was working. But my dad did it as well. My dad did it more of, it was more of the, the buddy brother camp kind of thing. I'll never forget my dad and a couple of his brothers had an old bus, old school bus that they modified it. It had a wood stove, wood stove in it. Yeah, chimney coming out of the top of the bus. Yeah. But that, you know, they did it. That's where I learned that from my dad, I learned the camaraderie that takes place in a hunting camp. That's where I experienced that was through him and them and his buddies and his brothers and my cousins and family. But my mom is where I learned how to process the deer, how to cook it. You know, if your old man was, if your dad was, he was in this band. He had three siblings in that band. Correct. So you grew up, you grew up around a lot of family. A hundred percent. That was our friends were our family for the most part. You know, we went to, I was in public school. So I had friends at school. But my summer vacation or summer time off was spent with my cousins. We, you know, we went, we lived, we all lived in middle Tennessee together. And I would go stay a week with my cousin here and they would come and stay a week with us. My grandfather was on a big farm. We would go on Sundays. We went to my grandparents' house. And, you know, there were six kids who all had four kids. And I was one of those four. And that's what we did. You know, we spent our, our Sundays after church with family. Yeah. Every now and then we'd bring a friend from school, you know, and include them into the cult. Those are the whole big pack of cousins. Yeah. But you talk about being poor at what kind of poor man, like, you know, when I was a little, I thought, I don't know, man, I didn't, my perception of what we had is different than what we had because when you're a little kid, but I just knew if we wanted something cool, we could never have it. Do you know what I mean? If you wanted a certain kind of shooting, a certain kind of pants or like a certain thing in your lunch box, like you couldn't have some, my perception was we were, my perception is we were real broke. But then later looking at it from an adult perspective, I was like, no, we were, you know, we were like, like very middle class family in line with people around us. But I always thought, like, well, why did they all have, you know, why do they all have new bikes or why do they all have whatever? And I don't. And so I had this sense of things that wasn't really accurate. You follow me? Yeah. You guys have the same thing. I think I would, we were, what I would say, we were probably lower middle class. Christmas was always a big time in birthdays were a big time because that was when you got something. Yeah. Like if you wanted a bicycle. And, and usually the bike that I got was a refurbish that my dad, mom, you know, bought new hand grips for it, new chain and new tires. And they made me a new bike out of something that someone that they had bought a refurbish bike or whatever, you know. But you raised knowing what stuff costs, man. Yeah. I mean, 100%. But, but, but, but, but, but to that, I didn't really, I didn't think we were poor. I knew that I didn't have things that other people have. When I got into high school, I was driving a used car when a lot of, you know, my friends were driving brand new car. Yeah. But my, my used car was meant the same to me. And I think probably it gave me a greater sense of gratitude when I did get that very first new car. I remember it in a way that I see people now that I grew up with. I don't know that they truly understood it or appreciated the same. And I can't, I can't speak for everybody. But, but I didn't realize how poor we were until I got older. And even then it didn't matter. Because we had the thing. We had food on the table. Yeah. I had the bicycle. It wasn't the best. And it wasn't brand new. But I had one. And so the neighbors on down the street, you know, we were all equal, regardless of the newness of one thing or another. And it wasn't, there was no envy or jealousy or all of those things that I see in our society now. We didn't experience that. We didn't have that. You know, I remember my, I remember my old man, he was born, he was old when he had me. So he was a depression era born, you know, born in 1924. Um, I remember him making. He did this a couple of times. I remember him saying he had this sort of family, like a household guarantee where he would say, you'll never send that to dinner table. He said, you'll never leave this table hungry. He said, it might not be what you want, but you'll never leave this table hungry. It was sort of like a guarantee he was making to you. I love that. You know what I'm saying? Yeah. It's like, but again, it might not be what you want, man. What was the same at our house? And, you know, it was one of those, when I grew up as a kid, I always thought it was fascinating because I'd come in after school and look at the camera and go, shit, there's nothing neat. And my mom would come out home from work or when she went and she worked most of the time and she would come in and we'd have this meal and be like, no, where did this shit come from? You know, so it was kind of the same thing. But you ate what was put on the table. And if it wasn't your favorite, it didn't matter, you know. Did you, when did you start playing music? Like, when did you start playing instruments, even though you were going to be a be a cop and a soldier? I started playing an instrument in high school. I played the guitar and I wasn't really good. I'm still not great. But I did it because it was cool. And I knew that I had something that somehow certain people found that attractive or it got a little attention. Was it like, was music like rebellion or was it, was it conformity? Because your dad was a musician or was it, or was it rebellion? It was neither. I was neither rebelling. My dad was a musician and I can remember as a kid, when my dad would play in Tennessee, the place called the Django Jamboree. It was a big deal. And he would bring me up on stage as a kid to sing raindrops keep falling on my head. But you're performing a little, oh yeah. Little Jimmy Dickon said it best. You know, there's two things you can't beat. That's a little, that's a midget with a doll and kids. Do you know what talks about little Jimmy Dickens anymore? We have a boy named Jimmy. That's what we always call them, little Jimmy Dickens. I love it. He has any idea of what we're talking about. Jimmy was one of my favorite people in the whole world. I learned a couple great things from that man. As far as entertaining. Little Jimmy, another artist whose name I won't mention was we had a big dinner one night on a hunt. We do an annual hunt every year. Call it the opera duck hunt. We don't really have much duck. We do some deer hunting and some duck hunt, but it's really about the dinners that we have and the conversations. And I'll never get this particular artist, a younger artist, was complaining about doing a show and there was only so many people there. And I'll never forget it. Little Jimmy got up from the table and he walked around and everybody had future inks and he stood like this close and he was standing up and this guy was sitting down. He was still staring straight in his face. And he looked at him and he said, "Young man, we don't do shows for the people that ain't there. We do shows for the people that are." And I'll never forget that. And that's a good advice, man. It's great advice. And it's hung with me. And the second thing he said that I live with this day was he said, "If you have to ask the audience if they're having a good time then you're not doing their job. And I'll never forget that 'cause all artists we run out there and go, "You guys having a good time?" I can't hear you. Like that next show after Jimmy said that to me, I went out there and, "Are you guys ready for a party?" (laughing) You know, I refuse to say that anymore because he's right. Man, that first bit of advice is good advice, man, 'cause you get like, yeah, you're there for the people that are there. We're there for them, we're not there for us. This is Clay Nukem and I've got some exciting news about a book that I've been working on for the last three years. It's called "American Bear," and it's available for pre-order now. The book is part biology, part American history, part personal memoir, but 100% the big story of American conservation. You'll learn about Native American ceremonialism with bear, the bear grease oil trade, market hunting, and the reasons behind the unprecedented resurgence of the black bear in modern times. If you order American bear between November 9th and December 9th, you'll receive a signed by me American bear postcard that you could put under the Christmas tree if you wanted to give this book as a gift. American bear is now available for pre-order at Americanbearbook.com and ships on February the 9th. The postcard will ship right away. American bear at Americanbearbook.com. Thank you so much. I've been very fortunate because I started the music industry later in my years. A lot of people started, even though it was a part of my life when I was a kid, I didn't get into the music industry until after I'd been in the army for 10 years. I'd already had a life. So you were what? I'd already been in college. You were late 20s, early 30s. That was in my late 20s. What age were you when you wrote your first song? I'm sorry? How old would you been when you wrote your first song? I was 15, 16 years old. I did that. I was writing songs or thought I was writing songs early on in my life. And what was it like when you did that? I did it 'cause the girls thought it was cool. That's what I said earlier. It wasn't because it wasn't out of rebellion. I just didn't. What were you intending? Were you thinking in your head? In addition to all this other stuff I got going on? I'm gonna cut an album. I'm gonna make a little extra money. Were you just writing it just to just to get it just as an expression like as an artistic expression? I wish I could say it was an artistic expression as well, but I just did it. You didn't know what you're doing. I didn't even know what I was doing. I was just doing it 'cause it was fun. It was something that I felt like I was, I did it. I could do it. Even though looking back that first song especially wasn't great, but it was just something to do. In the same way that you might go outside and ride your bicycle. I was, I'm very ADD. I'm very ADHD. I'm very OCD. So I can't do a lot of anything at one point very long before I got to do something else, you know? I understand. Songwriting was just an outlet. It was just something to do again. And I started it very young. And it kind of went away for a while. It kind of got away from it because life happened. College wasn't real good at that, did that for a year and then joined the army. - You didn't want your college? - I did a year of college. And then once I got into the army, now I finished up college while I was in the army, but once I got into the army, I was really good at that shit. - You liked it. - I loved it. - Yeah, tell me about that. Like, when do you walk down to the cruder office or how did I go down? - I literally just, yeah, just one day said, I wanna be, I seen that commercial be all you can be. Like, that shit's for me. - Did you tell your parents you're gonna do it? - No. I was already, I was in college. So I was already kind of away from home. - Yeah. - And that was the time in my life and both of my, my parents were going through a separation. - Okay. - So like, it didn't matter. I don't know that it was super relevant that I went and talked to them and told them. - What would they, but would they've been, not would they've been, were they glad, disappointed? You know, they didn't have any say in it. And you didn't have any obligation to tell them. - Yeah, I'm sorry, I didn't mean to cut you out there. I think they were like proud, but at the same time, very nervous. My dad, I think he seen something in me musically that I did not see at the time. He knew something that I didn't. - He didn't want you to waste talent. - Yeah, and I think he felt that. But he was also proud. I think they were proud. - But he felt that it was gonna pull you away from this trajectory that he would have respected a lot because he liked music. - And he, I think he seen something in me musically that I didn't even see in myself, or care for. It wasn't an ambition for me at that time. - Yeah. - Being a musician was not a goal for me at the time. It was not anything that I even foreseen me doing in the future. And that was a point in your life. I mean, I'll be honest here, when you're 19, 20 years old, you don't really know what the hell you're doing. I don't care what anybody says. - No. - I don't care what they say. - No. - You can't even conceptualize a death when you're 19. - You know, so I was trying to figure that. And so going in the army was probably one of the greatest things that I ever did for me as a human being and as a person. - And tell me more about like your army experience in those early years. - 'Cause you did a lot of specialized training. - Yes. And it taught me things that I tell people all the time and there is no occupation in the world. There's no corporation. There is absolutely nothing that you can do in your life that will afford you the opportunity to excel in life like the military. Because not only are you receiving all of this education and not just education in the book sense, but you're receiving a life education. Like for example, I equate the life education to people who live in Alaska, who live off-grid. Their livelihood is living. - Yeah, understand. - You know what I'm talking about. The fact that you have to, your thinking process is completely different than someone who lives in a societal environment. Just because you're thinking about, you got to do just to stay alive. - Yeah, understand. - You know, the military is that same thing. You have a lot of those same philosophies that you're learning that prepare you in a way that there's no formal education that can prepare you for that. In fact, I think our formal education got so far away from that that it taught opposite. It taught you to become dependent. So I was learning that. I gained a lot of that. But I was also gaining a very special skill set that again cannot be attained under such constricted time restraints and that's leadership skill sets, communication skill sets that take place that as a young E4 or a young corporal, a young sergeant, four years into the ball game, you're doing stuff that corporate executives take 10, 12, 15 years to learn. - Yeah, I got you. You became a paratrooper. - Yeah, that was one of the first things. I went straight from basic training right into what they call, I was into the OSIT program. One station unit training into my advanced individual training, what we call AIT, that's your field of expertise, whether you're 11 Bravo, infantryman, 13 Fox, which is what I was for observer or a pat clerk or a nurse or whatever your occupation is going to be in the army, you gained that through your advanced individual training. I went under the OSIT program. So I was at four-cell Oklahoma for basic training and my advanced individual training. I finished that immediately went straight to airborne school, straight from airborne school to the Ranger and Dr. Nation program from the Ranger and Dr. Nation program straight into the Ranger battalion. So I was in school for a very long time, gaining a lot of education and skill sets again, that take years to gain otherwise. And then you were the Panama invasion, right? - Yes. - Yeah. - I was stationed in Panama in 1989 for the invasion for the outsting of Manuel Antonio Norega. - What all kind of walk me through those years or that, I guess those minutes or whatever. - Yeah, it was a year. It was more, I was very fortunate. I was stationed there. I wasn't like, I wasn't assigned to the 82nd airborne. I was on site when the koo attempt was happening. When the stuff that everybody can go back and watching the news and see, I was actually on site. I had just gotten in the country just prior to the koo attempt. I was actually at the reception station and a paternal sergeant at the time at the unit I was stationed in, our assigned to. Excuse me, I had not even made it to my unit. I was still at the reception station in this E7 shows up and says, Sergeant Greer, come with me. You're gonna be issued an issue. You're going to a mission right now. And this is your RTO, your radio telephone operator. This is your RTO, nice to meet you, Sedang. The two of you are gonna go on a aircraft. We're gonna drop you off at this particular location and you're gonna send sit wraps on everything that you're seeing out there. I hadn't been in country 72 hours yet. - Okay. - And I was already involved. him what was going on. And what did you do? I sat on the golf course and watched the Kool Attempt and the everything take place and sent situation reports up to higher headquarters. Like hiding on a golf course? I mean, you can call it hiding, but we weren't really hiding. We had a Panamanian kid bringing us, bringing us food and stuff every day. Did you, like, did you have a good, there's this, there's this great quote that Nate, Nate, look this quote up for me. It's a, it's like war is how Americans learn geography, you know. What's that, what's that quote? What was your awareness? You know, I'm saying, like, you're growing up Tennessee, you know, yeah, out hunting and whatnot. Yeah. Yeah, I think, what was your percent? Who quoted that? They, everything they say, there was like Shakespeare twain. It is a sign. He's a great observation, though, because outside of that, only those people who are avid outdoorsmen are ones that truly appreciate geography. Yeah. But what was your awareness of Panama? You know what I mean? I mean, I was 72 hours in country. Yeah. I knew nothing. When I first got orders for Panama, it was supposed to be in an company tour. I was stoked. I was going to be able to take my wife. We were going to a foreign country. We were going to experience this culture. And then like three or four weeks before I had already shipped my vehicle, even. So the one vehicle that my wife and I had, I shipped, it was on its way to Panama because we were going to be there together. So I don't understand. It would have been called a what and a company tour. So I would have been able to, my wife would have been able to accompany me on the tour. Yeah. Three weeks prior to us deploying and us leaving and going over there, they had something happen. They said, Oh, no more dependence. And so I'd already shipped my vehicle. I had to buy my wife a vehicle. So you were fixing to go down there like totally unrelated to like the ousting of Noriega 100%. And we were going on a tour as part of the American personnel that were stationed there. Yeah. I got it. Yeah. We were just someone would go to Germany or like someone would go to Fort Campbell. Yeah. We were happy. We happened to be stationed at Fort Campbell at the time. And so like, you know, I'm a young brand new E6, you know, staff sergeant. I don't make a lot of money. And I got to buy her a vehicle or come up with her car of some sort. And so, you know, I show up. And like I said, within 72 hours, I'm sitting on a golf course watching the coup attempt. Take place watching people, you know, and you reporting, give me an example. The report would be how many vehicles you've seen. Yeah. Fox, zero, six. This is Fox, about two, five. I have 17 personnel on a bus with small arms. I mean, that's literally what I did. And we would write this stuff down at that dislocation. And there's dudes like you scattered all over. We were in one spot telling them everything that we've seen from ourselves. But I mean, 10 miles away, it's a mile away as some other guy or all feeding information. Yes. Yeah. Correct. Yeah. And that was what your, that's what your training was as a Ford observer. Right. My, well, my job acts as a four observer was to call fire on them. Yeah. So any, as a Ford observer, we got and direct any weapon system that puts a bullet on the battlefield from something other than a direct fire weapon. So if you're shooting your weapon, I could gun from a shoulder. That's not a, that's a, that's a direct fire weapon system. If you're firing a mortar and you can see the target, it's considered direct fire. But if that mortar or artillery or close air support, 18 F 16 naval gunfire, the guys that shoot the thousand pound bullets, they don't know what they're shooting at. Somebody has to be on the ground to tell them where to shoot it. That's what we did. And it was the coolest job in the army in my opinion. How long does it do that for? Almost 17 years. Okay. 16 years. And what all countries did you want to open? I can't name them all. Some don't exist. Dozens? Yeah. I mean, yeah. I, I did that job in at least a dozen different countries. Got it. Huh. Now, not all of them were in combat environments. Yeah. You know, when that particular situation took place, we weren't in combat. We weren't considered. It wasn't considered conflict at that moment. It wasn't until we, till the official invasion took place that it was considered to combat environment. And that first time in the military, what year were you there through? In Panama. No, no, no, I'm saying how long like like from 1985 until 1996. Okay. As an active duty. Got it. And then. So you were out before all the chaos of no, then I was in the reserves until 2003. Okay. So did you get, did you get deployed around, did you get deployed around the war on tear? Yes. And where'd you get sent for that? But it was a completely different capacity for me then. Okay. I served all over the world. I mean, you know, we were in Iraq. We were in Afghanistan from 2000 until 2000 and whatever. When we just recently pulled out, you know, in that terrible fiasco. But yeah. And I wasn't a 13 fox in all of those capacities in all of those countries. Got it. But I did serve as a 13 fox in other countries as well. But not in conflict, not in combat. Got it. Got it. So explain them, explain how the music came back into all this. Cause I mean, you're like, heavy duty into the service, loved it. You know, and I'm assuming you're going periods of months, if not years, where you're not picking up an instrument months for sure. Yeah. And music was always a part of my life. Just like it's a part of everybody's life. That's what's fascinating. Regardless of the genre, the format. But in everyone's life in some way music creeps in, whether it be even, even if they don't list, I've heard people say I don't listen to any music at all. If you watch television, all of movies, then you're listening to music, travel without any music without music. Yeah. So it's there. And it has such an impactful social impact, even psychological impact music does. You know, I could, I can play a melody that can make you just, oh, man, it can, it makes you drown down. It makes your heart feel something. And then I can change that melody and make you smile and upbeat. That's what music does. Music was always a part of my life. Having grown up as a child, standing on a stage where my dad made me come up and sing, all the way to where now I'm entertaining. You know, in that time in my life, it was when I was not training when I was not working, either sitting in the barracks or at home with my family. And it changed throughout my military life, you know what I'm saying? When I was in Panama, after the war, we sat around the barracks and played guitar. I just recently found a VHS tape that I had filmed and sent to my wife, showing her the stuff in my barracks, the stuff that I had bought. It was so funny because I was like, Hey, here's the TV I bought. I know we didn't have much money. And I've only got two more payments than it's paid off. You're like buying TVs on payments. It just blew my mind. Now we buy a TV. They're disposable, you know, but I had that TV. And I want you to know I had that TV, that very exact same freaking TV until we moved into the house we live in now. Is there right? Yeah. But the thing is, I also sat down and played some songs on that tape. Really? Yeah. And I was listening to him going, this is shitty. It's terrible. But that was in 1990. Yeah. I was writing songs in 1990. Would you sit and play with other guys, other army guys? Yeah. One of which was in my platoon, one of my four observers or one of our forward observers. I was one of the senior guys in the platoon. And his name is Tim Paris. And to this day, he still talks about that. How we set down and play guitar together? Yeah. And what was you guys play? You guys have played stuff you knew from the radio? Yeah. I mean, I guess probably more covers, but I didn't do a lot of covers. That was another thing. I may be the only guy in my industry that didn't start his life playing cover songs in a bar. I never really played in a bar that much until I had a record deal. Really? Yeah. I mean, to this day, I'm not sure if you skipped that part, but you went around that part. Yeah. I mean, I'll listen to it. I grew up listening to guys like John Conley. I can sing most every song he ever sang. There was a guy who's songwriting and music was so impacting on me. It was songs that made me think about writing songs. And he never knew it. And we even tried to write together one time. What's the name? He since come back in. A guy named Skip Youing. Oh, man, I don't know those. Oh, my God. He's a great, great writer. I love his music. He has since. He disappeared for a long time. He kind of got away from the business. And now because of what we have through social media stuff, I see him. He's starting to write again. He's promoting his music. Great, writer. Great singer. In that video where I was driving around Panama, videotaping, showing my wife what had happened during the invasion. And we're videotaping the Balboa Dini Station. we took were videotape and uh uh sinkham heel all of these different things that we did during the invasion. I'm videotape and his his music was playing in the background. That's really. That's great. Impacting. Yeah. So then at some point though at some point you thought that you're gonna right at some point you thought long and like made for certain music. Yeah like a like I don't know if you probably didn't use the word business but you thought I'm gonna do it. Yeah. Yeah. That's when I went into the reserves. Okay. I left active duty uh in 1996 and went into the reserves. I went into the reserves because it's one weekend a month, two weeks a year. Okay. And so most people have a normal normal job and then they do the reserve thing. I did it so that I could maintain my my affiliation with the with the service. Yeah. Um I knew that the retirement would be different and it would change to some degree but but I still at some point I did see far enough down the road a glimpse of the idea that I would have a letter hanging on my wall that I said that said I retired from service to my nation. Okay. I wanted that. When you say that the retirement be a little different you mean if you got to be where you had your 20 years. Yeah. So if you stay active duty for 20 years when you retire you get your retirement. No. If you go in the reserves when you retire from the reserves you don't get to draw your retirement into your 60. It's different. Got it. Um so and and and again that age like what if you do 15 years active duty that age changes. It can it can change based on your active duty time and your so there's there's some kind of there's some kind of formula to there is a formula. In fact there's like I'm learning now there's like three formulas. They take the high three they take a lot of different things that they do that the army can do. So like combat. Yes. Yes. Okay. All right. Yeah. Um but that's when I made the decision to pursue the music. I I had recorded some demos that my dad had helped me with. Uh and I was literally offered a publishing deal while I was still in the army based off of what though off the demos off those demos that I had written. How did you get them in front of who you needed to get them in front of my dad had played them for a few people. Uh and and and and and I while serving active duty when I would go home for my leave I would go do writers nights or do something like that in place. Got it. Got it. I mean mind you I was a I was a hard charger. I mean I was a I I had the short hair. I had the I had the keel mentality. You know I didn't give a shit about anything but killing bad guys. That was my whole life. Um and so I would go play these songs and stuff and people come up. Man, I love that. You sing great. Whatever. I got cool. Whatever. Yeah. Yeah. And ain't no livin. It's called American Bear and it's available for pre-order now. The book is part biology, part American history, part personal memoir, but a hundred percent the big story of American conservation. You'll learn about Native American ceremonialism with bear the bear grease oil trade market hunting and the reasons behind the unprecedented resurgence of the black bear in modern times. If you order American bear between November 9th and December 9th you'll receive a sign by me American bear postcard that you could put under the Christmas tree if you wanted to give this book as a gift. American bear is now available for pre-order at American bearbook.com and ships on February the 9th. American bear at American bearbook.com. Thank you so much. But you went around and you didn't do like any kind of bar plan and bar hopping and all that. Didn't do it. I played in the bear. Were you drinking? I'm sorry. Are you like do you drink booze and stuff? I'm not. No, I'm not. Were you then? No. I mean, I I'm with the guys. I got drunk in career and woke up in America one time. Yeah. So I've been drunk. But you weren't like a you weren't like a part. You weren't like a part. I'm not a part. I'm not like I don't to this day. I praise God and thank him so much for people who like to go listen to music. I've steal to this day and fascinated when I do a show and I walk out and I still peek around the curtain go, God let it be let there be people here. 25 years later and I go holy shit. There's a shit done up here. And like a lot of those people are drinkers and they are. I'm not a big drinker. I don't drink beer. I don't drink whiskey. I do drink wine. Yeah. A lot. I love wine. Fancy guy. Yeah. But I'm not a I'm not a beer drinker. I'm not a boozer. So for me, the bar thing was never my thing. Then you weren't like a part of your. No, I mean, in the army. I always think like it's funny because I have a sort of a stereotype, right? Yeah. I have a stereotype of like aspiring musicians. You know, when I hear that, I'm like, oh, a big party guy. Yeah. Like my guitar, my guitar player acoustic player. When he left Canada to pursue music in in in the States, that's he talks about it. Like he said, they would stay drunk, coked up on whatever for days on the end, just so they could do the gigs. And you know, that wasn't me. I never, ever like I loved writing songs. When I first got in the business, it was all about being a writer because I knew that you could make money writing songs. Got it. And I had been told everybody told me that the part which is really difficult. It's difficult to make money as an artist. And I why would I give up, you know, an occupation that took care of my family for an occupation that I that wasn't going to provide for them. Yeah. I just wasn't going to do it. So I pursued the writing knowing that I could make money. Before I got out of the army, I had a publishing deal. And it wasn't much really literally. So you were like calculated. Oh, yeah. It's where music, business. Where were you at at that time? Like when you got this publishing deal, where were you at with with with your own family? I mean, then that why do I mean, how many of you had what going on? You had a wife? How do I have two kids? And what was her take on this whole deal? Don't leave the army. Are you kidding me? We got a great living. Oh, she didn't have you out of harm's way this way, though, man. That didn't matter. She didn't care. She was extremely supportive of our service members of the military still is to this day. When I come home and tell her, hey, I got a a USO tour that we're going to be doing in December and we're going to be in a hostile environment. She said, okay, well, we'll do Christmas early. Oh, really. She's so she's very supportive. If you die, it's where God wanted you to die. God, it's that simple. And I'm the same way. Look, we're all going to die. Yeah. Period. That doesn't mean that we don't do cut. We don't take calculated risk. That's one thing I learned in the military and working with teams and working in in that community. You have to calculate. That's why I said there's absolutely nothing wrong with having to plan B long as you accomplish the mission. I'm going to take whatever plan I got I take to accomplish that mission. I pursue my music, I pursue everything that I do today the same way. So those people who say they don't have a plan B they're losers, man. Yeah. Not that you're a loser, but you will not be successful. Yeah, this long time ago now I can have you got to have something for you to say I don't have a backup plan. I think is a is a farce because you don't you got to say that I don't have backup plan. Okay, they shut the door. Oh, I'm screwed. I'm done. No, I understand. No, of course, you're not done. Yeah. You're going to do something else to achieve that goal. Yeah. To have finished that mission. That's where I am. And that's where I think even people who say I heard this artist said just yesterday, I was watching you do this podcast. I love the God of death, young guy. And he's been super successful. He said, Blake told me that. Blake said, I came to town without a backup plan. Yeah. No, whatever. Well, I don't want to reopen the whole backup plan deal, but you're I'm not talking about a backup plan. I mean, in a band, you're talking about I have ways I'm going to get there. My idea of a backup plan is that you abandoned the concept of what it is you're trying to change your angle. Yes, meaning I'm going to make a living as a writer. Now I could do it as a magazine writer. I could do it writing critical TV. Whatever you don't say like like like doctrine, maybe like doctrine movie scripts and movies that have outdoor elements and I come in and I'm like a fixer. Yes. And doctor outdoor scenes to make them realistic. I would have been like, sure. I would tell you because you're a much better writer today. No, I would say you're a better writer today than you were then because because of the modifications that you've had to make. You are able to think about writing in a way that you did not maybe think about when you had when you were so singularly singularly focused. I don't want to we're here to talk about songwriters of the same way you interview me and I'll tell you why I don't think that's true, but I want to show you the science behind it. I can show you the science behind it. And two, experience. Yeah, but there's a focus issue that there's a focus issue. Something happens when you have we have three kids, right? You think you lost focus because of children? It just at a time when I was at the height of my powers. And I don't mean the height of my powers to influence things outside of my own life, but I mean like at the height of my powers as a writer, it was just it. It was just that was the only thing that was going to happen today. I mean, it was literally like-- - I understand. - It was the only thing-- - I understand. - Of note that I would do that job. - I love it. I love it. - And that's not my reality anymore, I understand. But what happened in your reality created a thought process that allows you to think differently than you did before. - Sure. - And you can write in a way now because of that influx of environment changes that you could not have done before. You can see it from a child's, from a parent's perspective. Now you couldn't do that before. - Yeah, I'll buy that, that's a good point. There's a great regret. - Songwriting is the same way. When you're writing a song, I want to write a song about a camera. I'm just looking at the camera, I'll say a camera. - Number two. - If I'm so focused on that camera and it's going to be a country song, if I go and now we have an app that can do this for you but where as a great songwriter did it before, I want this to be a rock song. So you look at it from a completely different perspective and you can do that. The same thing happens in anything that we do if you look at it from a different visual. Oh, I mean, gosh, think about hunting. When we go up, when you are in one observation position, looking at that animal, I have no shot. There's no way, but if I'm hunting from over here, I have the most perfect shot I've ever had in my life. A different perspective allows you and that goes back to that mission. That goes back to that goal. That goes back to that backup plan. From here, I cannot achieve my goal, but from here, I can, you can call that whatever you want but it's an additional plan. It's a different maneuver. It's a different mission, same outlook or same goal, but different perspective, different visual. I want to go back to the thing you said a minute ago and I hear guys from the military talk about this a little bit. I had a friend that was, he was an elite soldier and he was in a lot of dangerous places and he would use a term when I was spoke with him. He would use a term if I fall, okay? Which felt to me like a euphemism. Like, if I fall and he even explained to me one time that he went to his mother and he said, if I fall in combat, you can't go to an angry place. Like, you can't go to a place of anger toward the government. You can't go to a place of anger toward the Navy. It's like, this is my thing that I'm comfortable with and I know what I'm doing and I don't want, should that happen, I don't want you to, your idea about this country, this nation, this military to change. And you're saying that your wife is kind of like, if she got comfortable with it. She bears not the burden of my decision to help me understand that. She cannot bear the burden of the decisions that I make. Just like, you mean that's in her, that's where she's arrived. She has to be. - Okay. - She has to be. And I think when, and the way we are able to do this is through our relationship with God. I focus solely on my relationship with him. - Okay. - I'm worshiping and loving him. And through that, everything else around me and through me and with me and about me will happen the way it's supposed to. - I understand what you mean. - I cannot accept the response even right here right now. Like, we've never met, right? We meet, we talk. I walk out of here today, outside of the discussions that we've had, I cannot dictate your thoughts about me. - Yeah. - Outside of what I've had, you know. - I don't have enough of a positive thoughts about you. - Well, you know, we all, I used to say this a lot. Now I hear people say it. I don't care what people think about me. - Yeah. - I think that's, I don't believe that. People that say that are most likely to care. - They're the ones that work harder. And here's what I say. I do care about what people think about me. - Okay. - But I can only care to the degree in with which I can impact that. - Yeah. - And so that means if I show up today and I'm a narcissistic asshole to you, that's on me. But if I show up here and I show nothing but love and kindness and you think I'm a narcissistic asshole, then that's not on me. - Yeah, I understand. - So I don't bear the burden of your thoughts. I can only feel the impact of your thoughts to the degree that I can impact it. - Mm-hmm. - Understand so I can't dictate what you think and feel and act beyond what I can do to impact what you can think and feel and act. And I think if we do that with a positive energy with a good thought and a good heart, then and if in your head and heart know you're doing that, then you will live a much more comfortable. Lord talks about it in the Bible. He mentions don't worry more than anything else. And I think in when you're focusing on your religion, in the Bible, the thought and the terms worry not, don't worry. - Oh. - He says that more than anything else. He says that more than he says love. And he says that because he tells you don't worry, I've got you and when you're focusing on that and then you separate yourself from the people saying and thinking things about you that you can't control. - Yeah, I like that point you're making that it's an interesting perspective that you're saying. If you focus on, if you focus on serving God, that's the way you feel that you need to do that, that everything stacks underneath that. - 100%. - Like if you're doing that, that means you're serving your family. That means you're serving your fellow man. That means you're, right? - 100%. - Again, that's for me, I can't. - Everything's under that umbrella. It's a cool chance. - It's exactly like the umbrella. That's analogy that I heard a priest use. You know, you have the pinnacle of the umbrella. That's God. And then you have all of those little tentacles that come out. That's all the different parts of our life. And as long as they're rooted and anchored in that pinnacle, all of these will keep the water and they'll keep the bad stuff at bay. Now that doesn't mean that we're not going to experience hardship. In fact, he's made that very clear. In his name, we will experience hardship. But when you're focused on your relationship with him, the other things will happen the way that they're supposed to. And I accept that. I mean, if anybody can know his hardship, I know hardship. I lost a son who was 16 years old, and I've heard people say, "Oh, you know, parents, children aren't supposed to die before their parents." Like, show me where it says that. Show me. You're not going to find it. They're in a book. And it's nowhere in the Bible. In fact, in the Bible, numerous people, the Lord himself gave up his only. He gave up his son. He came to earth in the flesh. That's a hardship that only a parent losing a child can understand. But I don't believe for one second that that was God punishing me or my wife or my family or even my son. I don't believe that. What? So how many kids do you have total? Five. Okay. And the boy you lost was where was he in the order? He was in the middle. He was one of the middle children. What was his name? Jerry. You miss him? No. Yeah, like every day. Yeah. I can't picture the day I get out of your mind. No, it's every day. I see something here, something, sometimes smell something that generates an emotion. I had a very dear friend, a close friend who lost the child as well. And I told me one time, or actually, told me about three days after we were, we realized what was going on. And the new Jerry was gone. Three days after he passed, I asked him, I'm like, how do you do this? Yeah. I mean, I don't know what, I don't know how I'm on. How do I function? In my head, I can remember years past, sitting on my bus, and I had a friend who had a child who died. And I remember sitting on the bus thinking, if I lost one of my children, I would have to go back overseas because I would have so much anger that the only way that I felt that I could relieve that anger would be to hurt bad people. I don't want to just hurt anybody. But I do, I don't take pleasure in hurting people, but there is some comfort in knowing that a bad player no longer exists. Yeah. That'd be your outlet, your anger outlet. That would be my outlet. Yeah. Uh, the day my son died, I had a completely different revelation. I didn't, I didn't feel that. And I asked him how he did it and he said it's, he said, man, first thing you need to do is just breathe. Juan, you're asking him this before you lost the son? No. I'm sorry. Okay. I thought you were having a prior to that when my buddy, another friend lost a child, completely a different person. He had a child and I'm like, God, man, if that happened to me, I'd have to, I'd have to quit doing this for a while and go get that shit out of my system. Yeah. I'd have to go kill bad bad. Be killed by guys. But you, you were thinking that just or anything happened. Yeah. You were just pondering a thing that ended up happening to you. Because I was experiencing it through a plan. Yeah. I understand, I understand. Fast forward. I lose a child, I don't have a child die and I just don't, and that thought didn't come to my head immediately like I thought it thought you thought would happen what I thought years prior wasn't happening. I had this weird sense of not knowing what to do and so this other friend who had lost a child would actually met him through hunting. He owned property, he and his family, big, huge Catholic family, that I had known through another friend who hunted their land through an outfitter. And they basically quit using outfitter and they started doing it themselves, the family. And because I'd hunted with them, they'd call me and say, "Hey, if you ever want to hunt here, you can hunt." It's a family thing. And so I hunted with them. And in doing so found out they had lost a child, then my son dies. They came to my house that night. And the next day or two, I was talking to him and I said, "I don't know what to do. I feel like I'm in a weird phase. I don't even know what's going on." And he said, "You just need to breathe." He said, "Just breathe right now. You're going to catch yourself. You'll hold your breath." And it was true. You just sit there and you can't even breathe. And he said, "Then it's just, it's second by second, minute by minute, hour by hour, day by day, week by week, month by month, year by year. One day you're going to wake up and you will realize that day. The day prior, you missed that child who's no longer here, the same amount that you missed your children that are here. And I've lived with that. And I'm waiting for that day. For me that day hasn't come yet. I still miss him more than I miss my children who are here. And it doesn't mean that they're less important. It's just because he's not present. I have emotions, energies and thoughts and memories. More so than I do about my children who are here. And my son who is here, my boys who are, my daughters who are, they say the same thing. They think about him more than they think about their other sibling. Because he's not here. But there will come a time when that piece will grow that much stronger. Is your dad still alive? Yes. You should do an exit interview with him because mine's not. I wish I had, like, if I could compile a list of questions. We did it and send it to him. We've done it. Yeah. When you list your list. Yeah, you're old enough where your list would be good. But the thing I would ask on my list, my dad lost the son. And if man, he may be buried deep, but it's like, it's just. It's almost like a what? I don't want to say it wasn't a thing. My biggest awareness, my biggest awareness that he lost the son's, he lost the son on a motorcycle. Okay, his boy came here. I can't remember. I was so little. He'd gotten out of the, I think he's gotten out of the Navy. This is older half brother. My, he got out of the Navy. My dad helped him get a Harley Davidson. You got killed on that Harley Davidson by a drunk kid in a car. The, like, the biggest way I knew is I wasn't allowed to be on a motorcycle. Yeah, I could be on a three wheeler. It could be on a quad runner. Not a motorcycle. And one day I knew this kid, your boy's name, Jerry. This kid actually coincidentally was named Jerry. A friend of mine from high school named Jerry drove his dad's Harley over and pulled it into our driveway. And my old man made him move that Harley. That was sort of like, that was how I knew that this meant a thing. You follow me? Yeah, but it just wasn't like, it wasn't like, it didn't seem like what you're talking about. It's every day for us in our children. So we have a family funeral plot on our property. We're those people. So my son is buried within 200 yards of my house. Really? My wife can look out her kitchen window and see his tombstone. I built a big huge new barn and I had to put glass garage doors on it and these gigantic, extremely expensive glass doors, just so she could see through it. So that every morning when she got up and went to that kitchen thing, she could see her son's tombstone. Got it. Got it. So he's there. I want to return back to your dad statement. Oh, go ahead. I think that you're, I love that you said that. That's important. But when you lose a child, you have a completely different perspective on those things. Stuff that used to seem like you used to want to know, it don't matter. It don't matter. What do you mean by that? I mean, like, you know, I've heard a lot of people say, Oh, when you get to heaven, you'll find out, like, you'll learn why Jerry died. Oh, I understand. No. Well, you know why I want to get to heaven? It won't matter. Got it. I don't care. Got it. All I know is that he's not here. And I know that God must love me enough to know that I'm not going to, I'm not going to abandon my relationship with him because of that. Yeah. Like me and my dad, for me, the biggest thing is the past. Like I don't, because I've had so many head injuries. My memory. Like a lot of people can tell you stuff that happened to him when they were six years old and they have these great fine memories of you know, and they can talk about like multiple things that happen when they were six. I can't. I don't have all that. You think you got banged out of your head. Yeah. Yeah. And there was. I think because of my ADD, ADHD and and all of that. I do like a dump. Like even for me, I can even equate it to come way fast forward songs. Like I've gotten songs that I've written literally been sitting in songwriting, listening sessions when I'm doing a new project and someone's playing me songs and they play me a song. And that sounds familiar. And then, and then my producer would be sending me goes, we wrote that song. Me and you wrote that song. Really? Oh, yeah. That's why. Yeah. Completely gone. Yeah, man. Really? Yeah. Yeah. And I can that same thing can happen for me stuff five years ago. Is that right? I've got guys that are served with short of my whole platoon in Panama because of the impact of that that particular operation had. Outside of that, emissions going forward. Like I worked with the I worked with the agency. I couldn't tell you the name of the agent that I worked with in Iraq. Okay. I know I can remember a female agents. Her name when her real name. I knew her real name. I couldn't tell you what it is today. Got it. I barely remember her name fast. I did a mission with her in 1990. Fast forward to Iraq as I'm an entertainer going over doing a show. I put this in my book too. And I ran into that same agent. I had no idea who the woman was. Really? I couldn't remember what you would think you remember something that impact that she remember you because the context so different now. Okay. She came up to me. She called me by my rank and my name in the army. Not Craig Morgan. And I'm like, do I know you? She said, you should. We did an operation together in 1990. Really? And I'm like, wow. I know the operation. But I couldn't tell you 100% of the operation footnote for footnote. Oddly enough, I know my running password. I remember the running password that I had to remember when we went on that operation. Back then, we didn't have the technologies that we have now. We didn't have all this digital technology. We had to memorize our call signs, our frequencies and our passwords. And they changed every day. So I didn't remember seven days worth of that shit. How big would a password be? Like there were running passwords. Like a running password was if you're running from gunfire and you're coming back into a friendly, they would say something like shotgun and you had a spider. So, but you had to remember seven days worth of that frequencies. You know, three, six, zero, dot, two, one, oh, seven days worth of those. Got it. You could do that. I could do that then. So I can do it now. I can do it now. So if someone says you have to remember this, you got a pocket for it. But if it's like a nice to know thing, it may be slips. Well, no, it's just like you have to know it for that time after that time. It's gone. So I have the ability. I can like, I do, I do movies and and some TV shows and stuff, scripts and stuff. I don't study my scripts until about two or three days before. And I can go in and memorize my script a week later, ask me three words of that script. I can't tell you what it is. Got it. I understand. I dump it and I don't even know how I do it. I write song. I've got songs on my album. I've got a single out right now that it took me months and months to learn the lyric. Are you going to hear? Yeah. Are you one of those musicians and now and then has to have your lyrics up. I know. No. No. See what you're doing. Once, once I get it, I've got it. Yeah. But three years from now, if I'm not doing that song every day, I'll completely forget it. Yeah. That always surprised me down there when you see someone like, dude, you wrote the song. You need to have the lead. thousands of songs and I've recorded maybe 15 albums. 16 albums for the song. At least 10 each. So you think that's 150, 180 songs that you know somewhere from decades ago. Yeah, yeah. 25 years. And you know, the singles like almost home. It's a no-brander. We're doing it every night. We're going to do it every night for the rest of our career. But you know, other songs, I hate like, I hate the taste of whiskey. It was a big song when we did it. But I don't do it all the time anymore. It's not one of those ones that crowds again because if you don't do it. Yeah. If you order American bear between November 9th and December 9th, you'll receive a sign by me American bear postcard that you can put under the Christmas tree if you wanted to give this book as a gift. Thank you so much. Hey, I want to, I want to ask you a question about your about your wife is if also you get famous. What's her take on that? She could give two ships left about my fame. She still expects me to come home and do husband, dad, stuff. And she I think she even and she made disagree. She gets real upset when I say stuff to her like you don't understand. She would rather me say a lot of other things when I say you don't understand. I'm Oswell have said kiss my butt, you know. She gets so aggravated that but the reality is she feels like you're pulling rank on her or something. Yeah, or not even pulling rank as much as though she thinks that I might not appreciate the her understanding, but it's hard for her to grasp it. For example, when we go out to eat or something, she can get more frustrated quicker when people come up. Then I do. She does. She does. Because she doesn't understand how they can't respect us having our own time eating dinner. But I can't convey to her even though she knows where I'm at in my stature and who I am and those things. She still she doesn't do it. So she expects everyone else not to do it. Got it. Go. See what I'm saying? Yeah. I have a different I have a flipped dynamic on that. But for me, I completely understand it. I appreciate for them, it's the one time. It's the one moment that they have that opportunity to say, I love your music. I appreciate what you do. You know, whatever it is they say. And I'm humbled and grateful for that. And she is too. But she don't see me enough that when she does see me and we're in a a public environment, she feels like people should respect that. Got it. And it doesn't mean she's not grateful. She's also lost a son. I've had people come up to her. And she is one of the most effective. Oh, because they know this. They know this. She knows that. And if a woman comes up to her and says, I lost a daughter. And y'all the way y'all present yourself and carry yourself has been inspiring to me. Something like that. My wife will spend an hour with the woman. She'll pray for her. So she don't feel like invaded upon. No, a lot of it has to do with approach. You know, and I think, you know, yeah, for me, it's my life. It is my life. If I don't want to be around people, I make a choice to not be around people and I be in a place where I don't have to. Or I'm around people that I know don't care about who Craig Morgan is in the sand. How quick did all that hit? Like you did a publishing deal. Like, like, like, it was slow for me. Okay. There were people who knew my music. In fact, as an artist, and if you look at it from a management's perspective, publicist, and all of these things, I think they wished it would have been different because they would much rather me receive the notoriety over the success. I was the opposite. I don't understand what you mean. Notariety does not always come with success. I had songs that were number one songs on the radio. And I could walk to an airport and people didn't know who I was. Oh, okay. I grew up in a different society. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Like, you can be like a movie producer. You could be a movie producer and have tons of success, but you have you have limited notoriety. You can be an actor. Yeah. And not be recognized. If you're not the Tom Cruise, you know, I was not the George straight, but I was having number one songs on the radio. They knew the music. But they didn't know you, but they didn't know me. I didn't care. As long as they knew the music, you know why I didn't care. No. What did I say earlier? I'm going to go back to that very first comment. It's a music business. I got in there to make money and make a living for my family. Now, I also learned to appreciate that notoriety was a big part of that success. And it enhanced and extended the lively, the life of the business. Yeah. Yeah. But for me, it just happened slow. And it wasn't certain things would happen. And I attribute it to God. I give God all the glory because I think sometimes it happens too fast for people. It's a difficult thing. For me, I was very fortunate. I had already had a life, a career in the army. You had success in something. I had success to some degree in that arena. So I just translated it to this, but I needed them. I wanted to be financially stable. And to be able to do that without all the notoriety was kind of cool. I could go to the airport. I could walk through lows. You know, then things started happening. TV movies. I did a huge TV show. I'll never forget, you know, the one woman who was not as appreciative of the success. And by that, I mean, she wanted people to respect, you know, privacy to some degree, especially for kids with us. My wife was an anti-taking pictures of our kids people. She just didn't like that. So when I would do an interview with country weekly, or CMT, or anything like that, and they would come and film us, she was very hesitant. She did not like it because she knew that by doing that, people knew who our kids were. And she was super protective. And so that was what it was. But I'll never forget the same woman who felt that way when I was walking through an airport eight, 10 years ago, when it was like all of a sudden, the notoriety caught up with the success something. And I wish I knew what it was. I don't really know because I'd work with new artists now and try to help them. But it happened. And I remember walking through the airport and I looked at my wife and I'm like, freaking everybody's staring. And she goes, yeah, you're Craig Morgan, you idiot. You know, you're who you are. And it's like, that was the reality for me. It's like, oh, it is real. And that was just like eight years ago for me. I had all the success and didn't have to fill all the pressure. You know, you become hyper aware. You know, like you get where the camera's always on. You can't be having like a argument with your wife at the airport or something. No, no, no. But I will tell you, without sounding, I don't want to sound boastful or prideful. But I pride myself on not allowing my occupation interfere with who I am and what I, the way I live my life. It's like politics, everybody. But I don't think you can beat that kind of stuff out of people, man. What's that? Like, I think you're going to be, you're going to be kind of foundationally who you are. Like, let's say you're looking at a problem, like, you know, you're having a problem with something in your house or something, right? If you're the kind of person who's always kind of addressed that stuff and you deal with it. Hey, man, I think you're probably going to continue to look at that way. And you're not, and it's going to, then you might step outside of that and also be like, Hey, you know, I don't even need to do that. I'm going to call somebody to do that. Yeah. But like, like, your instinct is in you. I was reading this thing not long ago. It's interesting. It was like, there's some different ways that people measure social class. And there's these, there's these theories is like that, that you can't, that your social class, this, I shouldn't even got into this. I'm not here. I am. You're more, you're more a marker of your parents education level than you are of where you're at. I believe that, right? Like, you're a marker of your parents education. Like that's baked, that's baked into you. And it'll be like whatever goes on in your life, that, that, like your die is cast. Do you follow me? Yes. And I don't think it's universal. but I think there's something that happens there. - I think there is something too that happens there. - Something that equates, and you could generationally follow that too, even on that, like my children would be, play the same way towards me. Yes, I think there is something to that. I will say though, I think the stronger the individual, and for me I would equate it the stronger my relationship with God, the more ability I have to separate myself from those generational molds. You have the ability to create a thought process and to allow yourself to think, using the term, outside of the box, to move beyond what stigmatizes us. But I think one of the few ways to do that is through a relationship with God. That's just me, and I'm not, you know, I have a friend. He's a tour manager, grew up without a dad. He will never be the kind of dad that the daddy didn't have was. - Oh, yeah, yeah. - He forced himself to go beyond what that generational would have done. So he is one of these guys when people say, oh well, it's kind of, you know, it's where I grew up. Sorry, but not sorry. You have the ability and you can go beyond that, but it requires a lot. It requires work, energy, resources, and a lot of times what we find, and what I found through my experiences is people aren't willing to make those sacrifices that are necessary to separate themselves from those gaps. - Yeah, I think a lot of people never even occurs to them. - Yeah. - And some people that occurs to them, but they don't break it out. - Yeah. - Hey, what was the longest you ever gone in your life without going hunting? - Just as a recent, really. - Really? - Yeah. Yeah, I've never been so busy in my career, in my life as I am right now. - That was the guy. - Now is when you're, you, now is when you got stuck in a row slowing down. My music career has expanded in the last three years. It's, we've gotten busier than I wanna be. And I went back in the army. - Yeah. - So I re-enlisted back into the army reserves so I could finish my commitment. - But do you ever miss a fall? - I'm sorry. - Were you ever miss a whole fall, a hunt? - No. I won't miss a whole fall. - And do you ever miss a whole spring? Do you ever miss a whole spring of turkey hunting? - No. - No, that's one thing I won't miss. I won't miss turkey hunting. - Yeah, yeah, like I'm always, I'm always in the game, you know? - That's a great thing about turkey hunting. - I book shows during the spring to turkey hunt around the show. - That's got to frustrate people. And you're like, they're talking about like late April. You're like, well, all there's a little kind of a deal. - But I don't need to talk about it. - Let a manager come and go, hey, we've got a show and I'm trying to thank here in March in Maine. It's $150,000 show. I'm like, no, I'm doing that club in Florida so that I can turkey hunt, you know, open and weak down there. - Yeah, if something's like great show in November 5th. - Yeah. - So I do that. I used to do it a whole lot more. When I had all access outdoors on the outdoor channel. - Yeah. - That was a, that was great because I was obligated because of the show. I had a requirement that I needed to meet. - Yeah, you'd be like, I got to work thing that day. - Yeah, I got to, I would literally go hunt. Like I would go deer hunt in the morning and then come back, get back just in time to do a show and get up the next day, get off the bus and go do the same thing. I did that for years. And it just, it absolutely beat me to death. It did. So I loved it when I. - Yeah, I never thought about the legit. I remember, you know, I know, I remember you doing that. I can never thought about the logistics of it. - And we were doing 100 shows a year. - That the time slots are very hard to do because you're like, can we do this show in the middle of the day? - Yeah. - Yeah. I mean, I would have a four minute show time and run till 10, 11 midnight. Get up the next morning, four, go set a tree stand, come back, take a nap, do the same thing for days on end. - Yeah. - Yeah. - That's a grind, man. - But it was also a blessing. You know, it gave me, it gave me a great deal of appreciation of both lifestyles and everything that was going on. The people that I met, you know? I mean, I was a guy that during Turkey season, when we were touring, we'd be driving the bus and I'd see a turkey on the side of the road. Stop the bus and we would literally go knock on the door. Excuse me, is that y'all's field? And they would say, yeah, I got a show tonight. We're about an hour from here. Is it possible for us to hunt? - Yeah. - You can tell by the bus that this won't be a regular thing. - Yeah. And I would go on the bus, get my crap, change clothes and we would go hunt that turkey. Sometimes we would get lucky, sometimes we wouldn't. I mean, I did that a lot. - Yeah. - You know? - Tell me about going back into the, like, tell me about going back into the army. I know it was like totally different circumstance, but like, how did it even come up? - I had made a comment to, let me back up. After I got out, the way for me to maintain my relationship was through my music. - Yeah. - So I did-- - Relationship with what? - With the military. - Okay. - And so by doing that, I was one of the first guys to volunteer. I was the first guy that did a show in Afghanistan after we took Afghanistan. - Is that right? - I was the very first artist to go over there and do that. I was the first guy to play the US Embassy app. - 'Cause you knew enough, you probably knew enough where you could conceptualize like the safety and all that, right? - 100%. - You just, you understood what it meant. - And again, I didn't care. And I'm gonna tell you, and when I say I didn't care, make every safety precaution you can, but ultimately if I die, it's where God wants me to die. I still take that perspective at everything I do today. You know, if I'm gonna go jump, if I'm gonna make a parachute jump off of a cliff, I'm gonna make every safety precaution. I'm gonna go through all the process and do everything I can. I'm still gonna do the jump. - You know, if I'm gonna ride a motorcycle, I'm gonna wear a helmet, I'm gonna do the things when we're the pads, if I'm jumping jumps, I'm gonna conceptualize. - Yeah, you're not reckless. - I'm not reckless. I don't think I am. There are people in my business that think I'm absolutely-- - Yeah, you're gonna do things that are, you're gonna do things that people regard as dangerous, but you're not gonna do them foolishly. - Correct. I'm 62 years old. I still jump off of tailgate of a truck, but I don't do it without having work. I'm smart, and by smart, I mean, I try to do things. I take good care of myself. I stay in good shape. I still can pass the Army PT test, and I pass it at an age much younger than I am. And I do that intentionally, so that I'm not privileged in the sense that I get to do what I do, I do it because I can. I went back in because I had been doing a lot for the military, doing a lot of shows. I do a lot of benefits for various military organizations. - This is through USO, right? - USO and various other organizations at the time. But also, like I would do charitable shows. We do a lot for the various veterans organization. - Okay. - Yeah. - And not all were free. I'll be transparent. We got paid to do some of those shows. - Yeah. - But, and I still get paid. I don't make any money, but I got a company of people that have to get paid. So there's still some shows that we do where I might not make any money, but there's still paying some money to make the show. - Yeah, you know what I'm talking about? I just don't ever, I don't want people to think that we're out there doing this 100% free, 'cause that's not always the case. There are somewhere they are, moving on. I had a gentleman come up to me who worked for a center during, he said, man, you are always doing so much for the military. Is there anything that the military, I'm sorry, anything the military can do for you? I said, man, I had 17 years. I would love to finish out my three years so that I have that letter that says I'm tired. - You talked about this earlier. - Two weeks later, the guy comments, "Hey, did you mean what you said?" And I said, "What did I say?" And he told me our conversation. I said, "Absolutely." I mean, he said, "Well, would you like to go back in?" And I said, "Are you kidding me?" - Really? - He said, "If you can pass the physical. " - That's how that happened? - That's how it happened. He said, "If you can pass the physical and you can pass the PT test, there's someone who won't you to come back in." And I said, "I can do it." No questions asked. He said, "Go do a physical." I went and did the physical. - You're how old at this point? - 60, 59. He said, "You have to do it before you turn 60 or you can't do it." - Oh, they caught you red the right moment? - Yeah, they said they can get a waiver for your age, but they can't get a waiver after you're 60. I said, "Done." So I went and took the physical. I had to have a waiver, not only for my age, but I had to have a waiver for my hearing, but they do that every day anyway. They give waivers for everything. I mean, we have guys that have prosthetics that are back in the military, because they can do the job that they're asked to do with their prosthetics. So they get a waiver. And so I got a waiver, those two waivers, and everything else I passed, you know, doesn't mean that I'm not, you know, I got metal in me, and just like a lot of guys, but I can still do my job. - This is Clay Newcomme, and I've got some exciting news about a book that I've been working on for the last three years. The book is part biology, part American history, part person life. But a hundred percent the big story of American conservation. If you order American bear between November 9th and December 9th, you'll receive a sign by me American bear postcard that you could put under the Christmas tree if you wanted to give this book as a gift. American bear is now available for preorder at americanbearbook.com and ships on February the 9th. Thank you so much. And so what was your mandate, though, right? My mandate. It came back in. What is the official job description when you came back? That's it. So it's called an MOS military occupation skill set. Okay. So you're MOS. In mind you, I spent almost 17 years as a 13 fox and a combat MOS as a forward observer. So I assumed when I come back in because I did that for so long, that's what I would be doing. When I came back in, they said, "No, you're going to be a band leader. You're going to be in the army band." And I thought, "No, I'm not." So the general officer that had said, "You can come back in." Who was the force calm commander at the time? And I just assumed again because he's the force calm commander. I'll be working for force calm. He said, "No, you're going to come back in as a band guy and you're going to go through the Warn Officer program." Because Warn Officers are the experts in their field. And we, you're an expert musician. Let's just be honest. And I said, "You're born. That's what you want me to do. That's what I'll do." And I'll do it with honor and I'm proud to do it. What's really funny is the whole time this stuff was happening. All throughout my military career, I thought band guys were 13 foxes, 11 bravo's, 96 Yankees, whatever, MOS jobs. And they were good at being in the band. They put them in the band for a while. And then afterwards they went back and did their job. I didn't realize it was an actual MOS. It's an actual job. In fact, it's the only occupation in the army that you have to audition for. Most of the people who are in the army bands, these people are coming from the School of Juilliard. They have doctrines in music, masters. I mean, so they're experts. There's people coming out of Juilliard going into the army band program. That is a fact. And they get their rank quicker. They brought in as an E5. Whereas me going into 35 started as a private, worked my way up to E7. And then-- So when you went back in, what were you? I was a warm officer. I had to go back there. So then you went back in-- I went back in initially. The whole E thing goes away. No, I went back in as an E6, a staff sergeant. So they took one rank from me because of such a long time of extended between service times. So they took one rank from me. I went back as an E6 and immediately went into the warm officer candidate program. So then I became what we call a walk, warm officer candidate. So I wore this walk. It's like this, like you're like a, you know, abuse child. Went through the warm officer candidate school program. And then I received W1. And then a year later, I'm promoted to W2. But they're not telling you-- They're not telling you where to live or anything. They don't do that to anybody in the reserves. Yeah. So every, like you could be in the Army reserves and be assigned to a unit in Utah. But you have to get yourself to there. They don't pay for you to get to that unit. But are they writ? Are they still like enforcing the rules on you? Absolutely. I adhere to the same exact rules as every other reserve. And Anne Hack, the duty soldier for that matter. Okay. I have to, I have to pass the PT test just like they do. I have to meet the minimum height and weight standards. So even as much as you're like, like you said, like you're like Craig Morgan, dude. It means absolutely. If you weren't to pass that PT test, they would have said, never mind. It's a fact. They would have said, hey, we want to help you here. But you know, you got to do this. Really? Just like anybody else. But we're taking doctors, lawyers, people in professions and bringing them into the military. But if they can't pass the standard, they can't come in. And I love that. We'll say we've achieved that under this current guidance, like never before. Yeah, I've been reading about that all the time, man. You know, and that there's a reason our enlistment is higher than it's ever been since the armies. We've never met our quota for enlistment as early as we have right now, since the inception of the army. Really? Fact. Because as much as Secretary Hegg says talks about raising the, raising the standard recruitment is, that's helping recruitment. It's helping. Huh? It's helping. Really? Yeah. Because it's just, what is it in still in people is like a challenge? Like a challenge accepted company? Honor. The things that we should have and should carry. Look, man. When you have a guy standing there, I don't, I don't, this isn't like an area I read about, but that, I don't want to say shocks me. That surprises me. Yeah. Army enlistment, all enlistment across all branches. Because you think it spooked people off. Listen, when I joined the army three years ago, enlistment was lower than it had ever been since the inception of the army. Three years later, the army is higher than it's ever been since the inception of the army. Okay. We did not meet our quotas three years ago. We weren't meeting them. We couldn't. We couldn't get the right, we couldn't get enough people to join. Now we, we're turning them away. No kid. Fact. Yeah. It's an absolute fact. Really? Below is people's time. Tell me more about what do you, like tell me more about your attribution for that. Yeah. Because when a soldier comes in, they know that they're standards and that they have to meet them. Okay. And they want to meet them. And we're not accepting people who can't meet the standards. So the guy or gal who is busting their rump to be all they can be. And to meet the standard and even go as far as to exceed the standard, they know that that other person who before would be promoted with them. Even though they weren't meeting and exceeding the standard no longer exists. Got it. So their competition is the same. Yeah. And they, it's not this one shoe fits all thing. Look, man, this isn't, when I first went back in, I had to go through their media program because I was Craig Morgan. Yeah. And they were like, we're in all inclusive military. I'm like, no, we're not. How can you say that? There's no way a guy who can't run the two miles can be in 11 Bravo. He can't be an infantryman because he can't adhere to the standard. So we can't include him or her. Yeah. So you're like, it's like you're having like a definitional argument with the idea, which is why we say I don't care if there's a baked in maritime. There's a base. Yeah. And I don't care if you're a male or female. If you want to be an army ranger, you must be able to do this. And your standard is no different as a female than it is a male because we're all one. If you're an airborne pair trooper, you have to be whether you're male or female, you have to be able to do these things and has to be at this level. We're not going to say because you're a female, you don't have to carry as much weight. Yeah. No, you've got to carry the same weight. Yeah, I got it. As a standard. And that's where we're at. And we are meeting that standard. And they're meeting it with pride. You know, which blow, you know, not to get. That's good to hear. I hadn't thought about this, but I just would have guessed it. I would have guessed. I kind of half said this a minute ago, but I would have guessed. You would think that he's scaring people. Yeah, yeah. That's what I was saying. I was like, the people who spooked off, you know, they'd be like a shit man. That seems like. That seems hard now. It's the opposite. That's cool. That's good to hear. Yeah. Yeah. It's the opposite. And it's wonderful. I just got back. I went over to Jordan. To show you're so to enjoy. Yeah. And the mentality of these young men and women was so. For me. Heartwarming and they're heroic in their desire. Dude, I don't want to say that they. Like it's like the song that I just recorded American soldier, the Toby Keith song. Only second time I've ever covered a song in my career. That's right. Two times. Two times. And both of them were military oriented song. First one was soldier. Gavin DeGrasseung. I've never cut a. And I always used it. Just two. Just two in my entire career. And I covered American soldier. There's a line in there that says, I don't want to die for you. But if Diane's asked to me, I'll face that cross with honor. Cause freedom don't come free. Yeah. If I could see that lyric in the eyes of every soldier I met in Jordan. Like they don't want to die, but by God they're willing to run up there and take it. They want. They're. Yeah. They're in a heightened state of alarm right now too. Cause the drone strikes and it's happening every day. Yeah. My point is they know that. And they're ready and prepared and willing. With honor. Yeah. And they and they are held to a standard that gives me comfort. Cause I know that they're more physically, mentally, emotionally and spiritually. then we were two years ago, no questions asked, no questions. I know now it's a hard question to answer a little bit because these things, these two lives you have, I know you don't think of this way, but these two lives you have intersected. But if you had to choose-- That's easy, that's easy question. Okay, go ahead. They are me. Really? I've achieved more than 99% of the people in the music industry that get into this business to try to do it. And I'm humbled every day. When I said I pick around the curtain 25 years later, I still pick around the curtain to see if they're going to show up. God. And I'm grateful for it. I'm a member of the Grand Ole Opry. I've had number ones. In fact, I don't even know half the crap that's happened in my music career until I'm being introduced sometimes as a speaker when I'm speaking. When you hear someone say it all. And they're saying it all ago. And I literally go back and go, "Man, we've really had 2.5 billion streams." And they go, "Well, that was last year. We're up now." Yeah, well, you're numbers on Spotify are the kind of numbers where you got to look at it for a couple of minutes, not a couple of minutes, but you got to look at it to go home. What's that number? I still do. I still do. I still do, I can't believe it. When I come back to something that I want to talk about, which is a testament to that and to God, but the choice is without question because I've achieved everything and so much more than I ever thought that I could in that industry. I'm riding the wave right now. I'm in a wagon that I still get the steer, but it's running downhill. It's still, I'm not having to pull and work as hard anymore in that industry. In the army, there is but one goal, and that is to finish. Now, I will retire in a year or two, but even then, if they called me and said, "We need you and we want you to go here, I would go." Knowing that I might not come back with such pride and humility and grace and gratefulness because in my opinion, there is no greater honor whatsoever. They could tell me they want to put me in the country music hall of fame or I could leave tomorrow and get on a helicopter and probably die trying to do something for my country in another country. I would get on that aircraft every minute, every time. And I'm not saying it. I'm not saying it. You asked the question. It's not something that we advertise. I'm not waving a flag saying, "I want to be that guy." I'm just saying that I would and with pride. And I know that my family would be proud. I know my friends would be proud. Guys that might not have the opportunity, they would take pride in that. And I live my life every day in both occupations to the magnitude that I can because of those guys that don't get to. Yeah, you know. Guys, you want to ask one last question? Yeah. Hit me with some marriage advice, man. I had a great friend tell me one time, just say yes because you're going to in the end anyway. I'm a little more bullheaded than that. I've seen something on one of the socials a while back and it has stuck with me. And I reimagined. I've been married to the same woman for 38 years. That's why I'm here asking, man. If you had like five wives, I wouldn't be asking you for no marriage advice. I'm not married to the same woman now that I married 38 years ago. Be willing to grow. Be willing to allow them to grow. Yeah, experiment. And put God first and then second. And then family and friends on down the line. One day, do you mean you're like my wife? I want you to finish my children. Really? Because my children aren't there now. They were for a long time. One day your children are going to be gone. And she's going to be you and her again. I'm going to tell you something terrible. But we had this conversation in a joking way. Okay, I don't want you to get it wrong. It's conversation joking way. But basically it was like, me and my kids are all lined up on the cliff, you know? And someone's like, make no mistake. You're going. That's you all the same thing. Okay. No questions asked if my wife said it. It's her and my daughter or my girls. She's like, you don't have to make that choice. I'm making that choice. Yeah. And we're the same way. What I mean is I don't like my wife. We've never done it where my wife's on the cliff. No, children are there. As long as the children are there. It's both our life. But here's something. Your children. Well, you will have it in your relationship. How many kids you have? Three. Three kids. Your relationship with each one of those children is different. Yeah. Sure. One day you love this one here. You think this is going to be my favorite. Next day, this one's your favorite. But there's no real favorite. But there's favorites about each of them. Yeah. Understand. That is what you nurture and you rest on that. But no one. No one. Not even your children will understand those relationships better than your wife. Yeah. Because you're in that together. Yeah. And one day those children are going to be gone. So my wife and I talked about this the other night, man, where she was like. Because we've joke about that. We've joked about that cliff thing. Right. Just as a joke. Like a true joke. But she was. She was explaining the other night. She's like, we need to do better that. We need to do better that it's like that we're. Not sitting on either side of the kids. Like imagine a lineup. It's like me. Kid kid kid her. Right. It's like we bracket. This wasn't her words. But it's not that we bracket them. Well, you're making my argument for me. It's like we should be over like more. Have it more that we're glued together. Not that like you're. Hey man. You know, like you picture people like the devil in the angel line your shoulders, you know. But like, but it's it's it's coming at him from more unit. 100%. And not like giving them these like different sort of options. Have. Have multiple plans and believe you on that note. Have multiple plans with your children. Like that, you know, that cliff analogy has been used so many times and you'll see it. I see it on. In fact, it's probably going to pop up on our phone as soon as we walk out. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I don't see that as one image. I see multiple images. And it various times throughout your life. At some point, you're no longer holding your children. You're talking to your children to hold them for themselves. Yeah. Yeah. So that cliff, that image on that cliff changes throughout your relationship. But what doesn't change is your relationship with the woman on the other side or the woman between them. Yeah. Holding their hands, teaching them. And one day those children are going to climb up off the cliff and it's just you and her hanging there together. That's that relationship. Yeah. Yeah. That's a scary one. We're there now. It's awesome. It's a house naked. We can do all kinds of weird stuff that we couldn't do when they were there. But we worry about that now because now we can see it. How old are the children? Well, I mean, our youngest is 11, but you know, our oldest 16. It's possible to picture now. Yeah, possible to picture. Wait till they have kids. I have kids that have kids. And I love them. I love my children, but I tell people as much as I love my kids. I don't care about them anymore. It's the grandkids. And it ain't that like, you know, people say. So the cliff is like the grandkids are staying out of the cliff. Like, yeah, I don't even hold it. My kids are on their own. I'm making sure the grandkids are, you know. And it's not that I don't care about them. And everybody says, oh, it's, you know, because you grandkids. You can play with them, do whatever you want and then give them back. I don't, I didn't get that. It ain't that. I've already experienced all the hurt and hardship of trying to raise them. That's on them now. They're experienced. My job is to do nothing but create this wonderful human being with love. And without the hurt, it hurts on them. That's what they have to do. And I don't mean that in a negative kind of, kind of in a negative sense. Like, I don't want them to hurt. But they're the ones that have to deal with the discipline and feel bad about it. I don't have to feel bad about the discipline. And I do get the discipline my grandchildren. I don't feel bad about it now, though, because I already been through that feeling bad part, you know. Yeah, it's a wonderful thing. But to all of that, again, back to that relationship. If you're doing this and you're focused on him, I studied a program. I'm going to leave you a really real quick on this note. I did a program as a Protestant Christian called experiencing God. And it taught me more about my relationship with Christ than anything. And what it taught me was everybody is Christians. We all say, you know, we all are out there. there to do God's work. This program taught me that I can not. They're in a Christian walk in the face of this earth. Not one, even the disciples themselves could not do God's work. Only God can do God's work. When you focus on your relationship with him, he will do his work through you, whether you like it or not. God. And that's exactly what happens. When you're focused on him, your relationship with your spouse, your children, your friends, your occupation, your employers, your employees, everything will filter through that filter and it will be blessed. Craig Morgan, thanks for coming on the show. Thank you for having me, buddy. Appreciate it. I finally sat down with you. Yeah, thank you, man. Love what you're doing. Thank you, sir. Keep doing it. Appreciate it. The latest volume of meat eaters American history is out now, the Alaskans 1896-1941. It begins with the Klondike Gold Rush, which lured thousands of young men north with hopes of striking it rich. Most failed, but a few swapped their dreams of gold for a frontier lifestyle trapping in the Alaskan bush. As America partied through the roaring 20s and agonized through the Great Depression, these frontiersmen live more like Jim Bridger and Daniel Boone. Hunting and fishing for caribou and salmon, building their own boats and cabins, running trap lines for wolves and links on dog sled and often dying under strange and lonely circumstances, their story ended only when Alaska was dragged into the modern age by World War II. This is the story of our nation's final generation of frontiersmen and how they carved out a living in a landscape that continues to inspire the American outdoorsmen today. Meat eaters American history, the Alaskans, is available now on audible, apple books, Spotify, or wherever you get your audiobooks.