EP 87: You Can’t Pour From an Empty Cup | Catriona Gray - The Bare It All Podcast

Catriona Gray's Film Debut and Podcast Welcome And so I came to the realization with a Pala home boundaries, especially with my family, especially with my loved ones. And what that looked like was that I I was very agreeable and I think I feared being disliked or rejected or unloved because I would set a boundary for myself. Speaker 2 Hey guys. Welcome to another episode of the Barrett All podcast. So joining me today is a global advocate, artist and creative force who continues to turn her platform into purpose. We have Miss Universe 2018, Catriona Gray. Welcome to Barrett All. Speaker 1 I'm so happy to be here. Speaker 2 So happy to have you here. Like you, I made that moment Snam and the last week that we had like you Echo, I was like shit, we made it guys, we made it. I'm so happy to have you here. Thank you. Thank you for your time. OK, so we have you today because you have a movie that's coming out. Actually, it's out now today. It's out today. Speaker 1 In cinemas nationwide. Everyone the loved one. Speaker 2 So this is your first film ever, So what made you say yes to this film? Speaker 1 Oh, it's a few different factors I have to say cuz I have been offered to take part in different films, Telus areas and projects before Pero Seguro as a combination of things like 1. I didn't wanna go in there feeling like I'm unprepared. I also wanna feel like I can do the role justice and I'm not just there as a token like beauty queen. Let's throw her in there for the buzz. So it just so happens that I already have a relationship with the director. The director, Irene, she's really wonderful and I really admire her as a creative and her craft. And when it was pitched to me, she sat me down and talked about just the concept of the Loved 1. And it wasn't even the script yet there. And when I heard about it, I was like, this is a really interesting take on a love story, something that I haven't really seen or heard before. And then so I was already open and then when I had read the script and I was offered the part of Nicole, so funny that the name of my character is also the name of my best friend. So I was like sis. Speaker 2 It's a sign. It's a sign and. Speaker 1 So when I read the script, I was like, this is really going to challenge me and Seguro, that's something that I wanted to open myself up to because I think in the work that I am blessed to be able to do now, like in terms of doing events and hosting etcetera, I feel very much inside my comfort zone. I feel comfortable with my capabilities in those areas. But in acting, I really don't have that same feeling. So she go wrong set up to feel in a challenge. I'm so really cool in a medium that I can also learn so much in because acting is not just portraying a character, but it's also like channelling your emotions through a lens of another person. So I'm like, that's so interesting. I've never done that before. And of course when I heard about the Cassie Jericho and I'm like wow, I'm so flattered to be considered, but also what incredible people to learn from in the process. Speaker 2 So how was the whole experience when you were shooting? What was the What is your feeling the first time you stepped on Set I? Speaker 1 Was so nervous. It's so like there was a mix up with the schedule of my makeup artist. So makeup for first taping day go and in the east of Kotalaga because I love doing my makeup. No lagging recording. I'm gonna get ready with me for my makeup. But. Speaker 2 I was really. Speaker 1 Like film, makeup, Superman. And so like, I've run into him just a few times at events, but we're not close or anything like that. So and I really admire him in his craft. So I was really nervous for my first ever seen. So yeah, just that feeling of being a newbie, stepping into like a set where people are so seasoned and know what they're doing, you know? So it's just that feeling of being a newcomer, I guess that really was a little bit intimidating for me. But I'm very thankful because Derek and Seda echo, they were very kind to me, like and patient with me. I felt very walked through the process. I didn't feel like I was just thrown in there and then told swim or drown up to you. Like I felt very guided and I'm very grateful for that because they didn't need to do that for me. But I just really appreciate that so much and when I was able to finally finish that first taping day, young team Coden was just like, Congrats Cat. And I was really feeling so fulfilled up by I was able to overcome something that I was very unsure about and able to prove to myself the. So that whole experience was really that kind of resonant messaging. Because I think many of us when we're faced with something new that's outside of our comfort zone and we don't have experience, it's so easy to say like, I won't be good at this. Like obviously I have no experience. But then you'll never know. Speaker 2 Yes. So is it the start? Are we going to see more of you and the big screen? Is it the start of something you another career? Speaker 1 I mean. Speaker 2 That adds to your roster of careers. Speaker 1 Pick one girl, but I'm I guess I'm very open naman, just as I was to this project. If I feel like I could play the role justice and I could, I'm resonate with the story, I'm definitely open. So if more opportunities come to be able. Speaker 2 To grab it. Yes, grab it. Exploring Reciprocity in Relationships: Lover or Loved One? OK, so the title of this film is called The Loved 1. So there's a question in this film, are you the lover or the loved one? Yeah. So what is your perspective on being the lover and the Loved 1? And I know Haddon. Speaker 1 Oh, I think it's really interesting because it kind of sets up a relationship and that there's a one way kind of giving and taking. But I honestly believe in a relationship people switch roles. Yeah, sometimes when 1 is like, well, your partner is doing well, maybe they'll give more and you'll like receive more. And then other times you'll step up and give when they need. So I feel like it's a role that's interchangeable. But in this cuento it's really kind of pushing a narrative. Nah Are you one or the either? But also in the movie that's also question 2. Which is why I really liked it when it was explained to me by direct cuz I was like yes that's interesting. It'll make people think if they want to. It's also just a beautiful story on its own. But it does pose those kind of questions. The lover or the loved 1. I feel like it mostly comes up perhaps in moments of trial, because there's been a saying that I've heard other people say that a relationship can survive as long as someone is fighting. Speaker 2 Yeah, I, I, I. Speaker 1 You've heard that right, 2 has to fight. Speaker 2 You're not just one departing Isalam. Speaker 1 So but there are some people who really believe that as long as one person's hanging on, then my hope, why do? Speaker 2 You think why do you think that they feel that their love is enough even if one is like I don't want anymore? Speaker 1 I don't know, maybe they're scared of what it looks like to have that relationship fall apart. Or maybe it's a time investment. You've put years into that person, into that marriage, into that family or yeah, things like family, children who are involved. Maybe you're in business together, You've built a life together. Maybe it's it's easier to hold on to something that's crumbling apart rather than facing what it looks like to not have that person. So Segura, we all have our own justifications of why people do things and don't do things. But I just think it's a very mature way to look at a love story, the loved one that is portrayed in this film, because it's not a first love. Let's just give it all for love. It doesn't matter about the consequences. Like this is a very mature take and perspective on like the different trials and things that come with a relationship that spans over 10 years. The relationship in this movie is 10 years long, so you're seeing each other grow together, grow apart, How that brings up different things. You reveal each other's different sides of your character. And maybe that wasn't there in the beginning, but now it's there now. And I think that's very realistic. Speaker 2 Yes, No, it's realistic because if you imagine in 10 years, a lot can happen in 10 years. You get for me in a relationship, career can be a factor and sometimes like 1 is doing well, the other one isn't so much and then or health or health also like there's a lot of things that go that happens in 10 years. And then I love what you said though, that people that when in relationship, they should switch roles that one should when one is able to give more than you give more. And one, I love that take because some people nowadays online, they just differentiate who the lover is and the loved one. I think we've come to accept that there's always just one one or the other while switching roles. I love that. So I asked this guy Echo, do you think nowadays is it really bad if you're the loved one? Speaker 1 Segura it depends on the mindset of being a loved one. Do I think it's bad to be able to receive love? No, because say there are people who may have low self esteem and be like, you know, I'm not worth loving. Don't be close to me. That can be stemming from a wounded. But if you're a loved one and you receive love, but then you're also able to reciprocate it, I think that's very healthy. But if you're a loved one, that's just like do all the like, I mean, which I think is also interesting because a lot of conversations online about feminine energy and how the women should just. Speaker 2 Be the loved one. Speaker 1 Just, you know, give me gifts. You do everything and I'll just be here in my feminine energy. Speaker 2 Yeah, it's called Princess treatment nowadays. Speaker 1 Yeah, but also that's really like pushed. But I think that if you're not able to support your partner in some facet, whether it be like, let me support you as you go after your career. Like how can I, you know, do you want to talk about at the end of the day or like how can we have time together that will fill up your cup? You know, there has to be some sort of reciprocal yeah, effort rather than just taking and taking and taking. Speaker 2 Yeah, I love that. Why Setting Boundaries is Crucial for Filipinos and Self-Care You know, you're gonna make a lot of people think with just, with just what you said, you're gonna make a lot of people think. OK, so you had a podcast and you were talking about boundaries. Speaker 1 Yes. Speaker 2 And this is so important nowadays, to know your boundaries and things, not only with love but life in general. Absolutely. So what is your opinion on people that having a, that they have a hard time setting boundaries, especially, let's say with work or their loved ones? Yeah. Or family, friends. Like sometimes when you love someone so much, you tend to blur that boundary. It's like, it's OK, I'll, I'll, I'll take it. But that's the thing. The boundary is what's supposed to keep the respect in both sides of relationships. Yeah. So what's your take on? What's your advice to those who need to learn how to set their boundaries? Speaker 1 You know, I think we need to give people grace for feeling uncomfortable in the setting of the boundary itself, because it is a hard thing to do. Maslalo Taiomangopinoy. It can feel like a very confrontational thing to do, or perhaps selfish or abrasive to be like no Hong Kong di talan, yes, especially when it comes to loved ones, when it comes to career. Because I think we're so normalized to not having boundaries modelled out to us. And when they're not modelled out to us, we don't have like a map of what it looks like. So like you said, boundaries are a way that we can kind of show up in a way that we we keep the respect of ourselves intact and then we allow people to respect us in turn. So for example, the both of us in a friendship. And if it was like, I'm having a really hard time at work and I just can't spend this much time after work hanging out because I have to go home and do extra stuff, that's expressing A boundary to you as a friend. But if you're like, no, second, no, no, let's go, let's stay out. Then you're giving me information of how you're not respecting my boundary, right? So it, it, I can allow that boundary to be crossed. But then perhaps, you know, I might have a seat of resentment there. Or I'm going to pay the consequence later. I'm going to be tired. I'm not going to meet deadlines. And so I'm still walking out the consequence of having that boundary and not being held in place. So it can look like a lot of different things around money. It's a really prominent thing here in our culture. Speaker 2 And it tends to get crossed a lot. Speaker 1 Absolutely. And like you said, like in the name of love, in the name of being a good daughter, a good spouse, a good family member, it it can feel like this is my duty as as. Speaker 2 A daughter as a son. Speaker 1 To provide, to give what I can even if I don't have enough. It can feel very honorable. It can feel like something that's even applauded in space is like grabbing. Yes, or if you don't do it like I'm grabbing, sell the fish. Speaker 2 Yes, but a little more. We had this topic before and I was really crucified online for having that opinion because I really said if you want to give, you're going to give it like it's it shouldn't be required. Like, yeah, for me, required because it's such a big word. Inisha, out of the goodness of your heart. Kayla, I'm going to go in. Kayla and Mushang go in. Hindi Dahel gusto. Mushang, go in. Speaker 1 Exactly. Speaker 2 Made difference. So I love that we're talking about boundaries, because then we can actually tell people that it's OK to have boundaries. Speaker 1 Yeah. Speaker 2 Filipinos are actually afraid of boundaries. Speaker 1 Very and especially I think it also interfolds with our tendency to be non confrontational and people pleasers. We're very passive. We're not very like vocal and abrasive. For example, when I lived in New York because I. Speaker 2 Was like wow, they. Speaker 1 Really just say how they feel. And as a Filipino, I'm just like, OK, so it really is something that I hope can be talked about more because even though we do applaud each other for so brong generous, But if you look deeper, the kind of burden that is carried by the people who over give not, not for a sense, like you said, out of the goodness of your heart, because they feel obligated or that they must, I honestly believe grows resentment or it grows angst against your loved ones. And I think that really harms the relationship where you create a relationship in your family that's not there, that's reciprocal and loving and relational. But it's more like I, I have to have an obligation to give. I just have to, I don't want to. It changes the position of your heart. Speaker 2 Yeah, and you kind of not, especially when you're working and you have to give and I enjoy because you know where the money is going or you know where the certain effort is going that OK, so this is what I'm doing right now. This is majority of it is going somewhere and not to you. So it tends to you there's resentment and you also feel like, what about me? Yes, there's always a question, when can I take care of myself? Divide. It's so important to also take care of yourself. That's what we always tell actually, whenever I have an episode. Don't forget yourself. Absolutely. It's OK to choose yourself sometimes and I love that you're here because. OK, so so why is it important to choose yourself too? Speaker 1 Because if you don't, you will not be able to give like from a genuine loving place. Like I always say, you cannot give from a cup that's empty. And again, there's that whole like an honoring of being a martyr, like giving and giving and giving. You'll even see it reflected in our productivity culture. Like we laud people like, Oh yeah, you slept 2 hours last night and worked 12. Oh my God, Uncle Lee. But no, why are we applauding that? Like that's not healthy. You know what I mean? But the way that it is reflected in society now, we really love this over giving, this overproductivity, this over giving of self. But then we have so many people who are burnt out, their mental health is suffering, people who are living lives that they're not happy about, you know? So I think we really have to take an inner look and to say like, OK, it may look selfish in the beginning because it's not the usual thing for us, but if you're able to give to yourself and then give out of the overflow of that, it's so much more joyous. The positioning your of your heart is in such a better place and your family, your relationships, your workplace, they will benefit from that positioning of your heart because you'll work with more joy. You'll be able to work with more passion. Speaker 2 And your relationship with that person's better? Absolutely. It's so different to have a relationship with someone that you have so many resentments with. And I think that's what's going on in society. Like since we give, give, give and give with no boundaries, well we just live our lives but we still give. Speaker 1 Or on the other side of that, we end up traversing our lives with so many relationships that are transactional in nature. And that's really sad, you know what I mean? We're always expecting something in return. We give to get and like, yeah, you know, where does that lead us? Speaker 2 I love that right now. Catriona's Journey: How Boundaries Became an Act of Kindness Oh, my God. OK, so you've mentioned before that setting boundaries can also be a form of kindness. Yeah. What do you mean by that? Because nowadays people don't really put those two together. No. Yeah. Like they feel that when you're setting a boundary, you're creating like a certain space that, like what you said, Kanina, it tends to sound aggressive for doing it. And mostly, if you set boundaries with people, especially families, they tend to say. So what do you mean by that? Like maybe you can explain to them why that can go hand in hand. Speaker 1 Yeah, I say this as a recovering non boundary person. No, because really I never had boundaries modeled out to me growing up. And I was really introduced to the concept in therapy cause I've been undergoing therapy for two years now, and I think therapy is so healthy. Yeah, 'cause it allowed me an insight into the workings of my mind, my history, why I am the way that I am, how I reason out things, how I feel certain things, how I express things. And so I came to the realization we have a lot of home boundaries, especially with my family, especially with my loved ones. And what that looked like was that I, I was very agreeable. And I think I feared being disliked or rejected or unloved because I would set a boundary for myself. And then people, the people who I care about, my core people would meet me with dislike or with rejection or distance. And so I would really traverse around that. The consequence of not having boundaries though is that I lost a sense of self respect because I would over give and I'd end up feeling empty or I'd feel resentful or I'd put out expectations with my giving that would never be reciprocated. But like in my mind it's like if if you gave this to me, I would give it to you. But because everyone's different, everyone reasons different so that wasn't the case. So boundaries, I honestly believe if you boil it down, is really the ability to communicate to where you can go. What is a no go zone for you, what you're comfortable with, It's really communication. And I don't think that you can have healthy relationships or a healthy relationship with yourself if you don't have communication. So the reason that it's a form of kindness is in a way, it's a kindness to yourself because if you're not able to have that self respect, you will really feel dragged. Yeah. Speaker 2 You'll hate yourself, yeah. Speaker 1 And it might not look so black and white like I will have self respect, like night and day. Like it can be the subtleties that just build up over time. Like for example, I, I was 31 years old or 30 years old when I realized that I don't have boundaries. Like I went through 30 years of my life not knowing how to practice healthy boundaries. And even now that I am aware of it, it's still like a practice that I'm trying to learn as I go. But I've realized that I'm able now that I'm aware to show up more authentically as myself because I have that boundary to say like, OK, this is how far I can I can show up for you. I want to know how far you can show up for me. If there needs to be a compromise, let's have a conversation about that. And it just gives me so much ease. I'm less anxious. I feel like I understand the other person better. And I feel like boundaries in that communication allow them to understand me better. And so I feel truly seen. And there's something so beautiful and healing about feeling seen by another person in your wholeness, not just these little tidbits of like what I'm projecting to you or what I think you want here, but you're really seeing me authentically. And so my relationships, my friendships, my relationships with my family, they have reached a level over the last two years in authenticity, in a level of genuineness that I don't think that I've experienced before. Speaker 2 So you said it took you 30 years to learn to set boundaries or to have boundaries. A Painful Breakup: The Catalyst for Setting Boundaries What was the turning point? What made you think that I need to set some boundaries? I don't have boundaries like. What made you actually want or realize that I need to do something about this? Speaker 1 Yeah, unfortunately for me, it was the fallout of a really painful breakup. And when I went into therapy one, it was because of the fallout of that, but also because I just felt very lost and empty as a person. Because I think I had been in this tendency of over giving all the time, like all aspects of myself that I forgot to reserve things for me. And so when I found myself single again, I think there was a lot of navigating of like, OK, so who am I? Speaker 2 You felt so drained. Speaker 1 I felt drained and I also felt the lines of where I was as an individual were kind of demolished. Yeah, cuz I had just not allowed spaces for myself, even with my friends or even with my own hobbies and my own interests. I'm the type of person what was before that when I'm in love like I will really give. And I always associated a sacrificial nature of love like you know, you you. Speaker 2 Do when you love someone? Speaker 1 Exactly. And you have a joy about that while you're in it, but then in the fallout of it. Speaker 2 You. Speaker 1 Think you're nanga. And so without those boundaries and in the fallout of it, I was like, I don't really know where to even start. Like I feel whiplash in a way that it's not even just the fallout from a relationship, but also the fallout of our relationship with myself that I did. Speaker 2 Not, but I didn't look. Speaker 1 After myself, in that process of being in the relationship, I didn't leave things for myself. So that was really the turning point for me. Speaker 2 You sometimes something really It's so sad that sometimes something really bad has to happen for you to. Speaker 1 Yeah. Speaker 2 These things, right? Like, why can't we just know these things? Why? Why do bad things have to happen for us to realize that this is what we have to do to be better people? Speaker 1 Yeah, I feel like sometimes also like I'm, I'm quite spiritual. So like I really feel like God will knock quietly first to get you to pay attention. And when you don't listen, he knocks a little louder. And then when you don't pay attention, he knocks even louder. So then it reaches the point like, OK, I'll listen now. Speaker 2 OK, fine, Lord, I'll, I'll listen to you. Or do they say that this when you ask for God's protection and all aspects of your life, like your heart, your mind, and everyone around you, you have to be prepared for what you're asking for. Because if you ask God, like Lord, remove everything that's not part of my growth and remove everything that's not going to make me a better person. You have to be prepared for that prayer because the people he might remove in your life will surprise you like you. You won't know who they are, but if when they do go away or when they do, like live your life, you'll be like really this person like. Speaker 1 Right. And that pruning season hits like that's a very powerful prayer to pray, but God always knows best, yes. And in our limited ability to see what's in front of us, it's not gonna make sense a lot of the time, but like eventually it will. But I think that's the walk of faith that you have to kind of put yourself through is just trust the process. But it can be really difficult. Speaker 2 For sure. Building Healthy Relationships: Beyond Completing Each Other So in terms of this movie, the loved one, what do you think in a relationship? You said this, the two main cast here was together for 10 years. So what you naman on your personal like let's say some advice more so let's say it happens to it happens to us. We've been we've been in many relationships in the long term. So when do you think you should know like, OK, this is this is my boundary in this relationship boundary or I'm only I'm choosing this person every day and I'm not choosing myself anymore. What do you think has to be done for something because it means turning point to save the relationship or to go your separate ways with this one? Well, because we haven't seen the film, I know. So what do you think you should have that conversation with your partner? Is that really a make or break conversation? And how prepared do you have to be to enter this conversation? Speaker 1 I think it looks different case to case basis, but like honestly, ideally even before you get into a relationship, I think you already need to have the mindset that this is not the person to complete me because it's always fantasized to us now and these love stories. This is the person make all my dreams come true. They complete me. I am incomplete without them. And that's just the wrong mindset to be in because a person will always disappoint you because they're human. I mean, no one is going to fit you perfectly or make up for your lack in certain things. Like you're 2 individuals And I've always thought the healthiest way to get into a relationship is you see yourself as having a full rich life as an individual. Your partner has a full rich life as an individual. And when you come together, you have things to share together. You're not looking to complete each other. And so I think that's would be really healthy. If you find yourself in a dynamic already that you feel like there's unequal give and take or it's not reciprocal or you're feeling built up resentment because you feel like you're giving, giving, giving and your partner's just unaware or taking it for granted, etcetera. I think the sooner that you can have the conversation, the better. If you're unable to make leeway on that conversation between the both of you, having a counselor or a therapist or a trusted friend or maybe a church mate that you trust to kind of moderate those conversations can be really helpful. Because sometimes someone looking from the outside in can give you insight that maybe you're not able to get from each other if you're just gonna tease it and like, try and just like, you know, we'll figure it out eventually. I think you're just prolonging the inevitable, you know, I think. Speaker 2 That's what makes a relationship really toxic, when you're really afraid to speak up about the things that you're already seeing or the patterns that you're already seeing in relationships and you don't call it out. Yeah. And then it becomes a big, big thing. And then instead of you having a conversation, relationship just ends and you have so much anger because you didn't get the voice it out. So I love that you said that you should have that conversation entering that relationship already. If we're on the same page, if this is where we think this is headed, we're not playing games. Speaker 1 Here, Yeah. Speaker 2 I love that that's a fresh perspective because I think love now is you just take that leap and then Bahala, now what? Speaker 1 Happens but I feel like that's a very first love like high emotion way but when you manga. Speaker 2 Trenta in a love story, huh? What are? Speaker 1 You doing? Speaker 2 And. Speaker 1 I think also just a tidbit also that has been really insightful in my own life, and I learned this through therapy. But like, if you're aware of the dynamic that you grew up with at home, for example, your parents or the people who modeled out what relationships look like to you, and if you can identify certain patterns or tendencies within that that you maybe model out yourself, it's great to have an awareness of that before you go into a relationship. Because I've found in my past relationships before going through therapy, I was happily sitting in these patterns that weren't necessarily healthy but just look very familiar to me because of the relationships that were modeled out to me as a child. So there's also grace to be given there for people who perhaps are within a dynamic that they're not even aware of because it looks familiar. Yeah. Speaker 2 So, well, you know that we had that topic the last episode. It's called the Burning House Theory. It's like your childhood becomes the blueprint of your entire life. Like whatever model or whatever example experience or whatever was taught to you when you were young. It's something that unconsciously when we grow up, we kinda, OK, that's love. That's the idea of love because this is what we're used to or this pattern my family used to, my parents used to do this. So maybe this is what I should get myself into and like, I think that I'm burning house. So OK, so can I ask you about that? Like so what's your take on this? So your entire life, you think that this is this is what I'm used to. This is what I grew up in. So this is supposed to be my life. So what's your take on the people that are stuck there because they fear that if they step out of that comfort zone, that's your comfort zone. That's what you're used to. That's where you grew up. Speaker 1 Absolutely. Speaker 2 So what's your advice to those who needs to take that step out of the comfort zone to actually see a better life, to have a better life? Overcoming Fear: Stepping Out of Familiarity for a Better Life Yeah, I think you shouldn't orientate your path on whatever is comfortable, because The funny thing is with our brains as human beings, what our brain associates as safe is not necessarily what's better, but more so what's familiar. So like you'll stay in patterns or in relationships or in places that feel familiar and that will equal safe to you. Yeah. Which seems that contradictive. No, better. That's really how our psychology works. Well, but I'm psychologist. Speaker 2 My source. Speaker 1 And so when I kind of understood that, it gave me a lot of grace for people because sometimes we see stories from the outside of people who stay in abusive relationships or stay in toxic households and we're like, just get out. Like, what are you waiting for? It's so. Speaker 2 Easy to say. Speaker 1 It's so easy to say, but I think when you're in the dynamic and perhaps they've had the life experiences that those people have had, it's just not that easy to do. And sometimes there are children involved and just other different things. But if we were to orientate ourselves on like whatever feels comfortable, I feel like that that's the wrong way to go. So I think the first step is like be able to talk to someone about it. It could be a trusted friend or a therapist, a church counselor, whoever feels comfortable and is available to you because sometimes we cannot have the eyes to see our situation for what it is. I think some of us have experienced being isolated in a dynamic or a relationship or a household where if not for someone just asking like, what kind of a doing or like is, how do you feel about that? That's not normal, or that's not. Speaker 2 OK, ask us that normally. Speaker 1 You na na. So without those questions or like someone to kind of probe gently, Yeah, you won't you won't think it or you won't see it. Yeah. So that's really important. And that's also, I guess, a message to those of us who are friends of people who you may think are not in healthy situations, like, we should check in on them, even if it's not an abrasive way of like, but more of like, how are you doing? Like, I noticed that your mood's a little bit off. Do you wanna talk about it? You could just be gently leading that person to see things from a perspective that perhaps they could not. And then also you really need support to make the move to get out of an environment like that. And it's really unfortunate to say, but a lot of people don't have support in in terms of like close family or friends or they're. Speaker 2 Scared to ask for help? Speaker 1 Yeah, or that as well. And it's a vulnerable place to put yourself in. So I would really just advise like try to try to find support where it's available, really pray about it, surround yourself with a community. And I just hope that you'll be able to find your way out of that dynamic, or at least to a place where you can then work with the other people within that dynamic to hopefully make it healthier. Speaker 2 Yeah, because there are a lot of people who send messages on the podcast that they don't have well one, the resources or they don't have the support to actually help them get through it. So they suffer in silence or they just keep it inside or they want to end it. It's so sad to read comments like that because you wish to help everybody, but then you really can't. Yeah, you know, it's, it's you wish to advise properly or come in. We always say surround your, surround yourself with the right people because when you surround yourself with the right people, you'll be advised properly or someone will listen to you. But then it's so easy for us to say it because we're not in the receiving end of things. So Parang, at this point what we can only do is just try to help them get through it by our platforms, which you have used beautifully. Advocacy, Introversion, and Defying Public Expectations Over the years. Speaker 2 Like I think you've been an advocate to so many things and that's the I think you went beyond being our Miss Universe. You went through advocating so many social issues. Like you're always front and center. Thank you. And as he didn't want to go in uni, but you always feel that responsibility. Speaker 1 Yeah, absolutely. Speaker 2 Is that really like, did you really grew up like that? The pattern Very outspoken. Cataloga Were you a shy girl going up? Speaker 1 Super shy. I'm actually an introvert. Really. Yes, I'm actually an introvert. When I was growing up I was very soft spoken and shy cuz we moved around a lot so I was always the New Girl in school and so I had a hard time making friends. I was very withdrawn. Yeah, I don't think it was until I was an adult that I felt comfortable in being more outspoken. But Even so, I think it more stems from I've always orientated myself that I need a bigger reason for why I do things. Different people are motivated by different means. But for me, like motivation for gain or for myself is not enough. Like I've always needed to feel like I'm contributing in a larger way. So Seguru, that's the overflow of like when I speak up, when I advocate, it's all stemming from that core value of mine. And I just think I'm very grateful to be surrounded by a team and people who share that same vision, which is why I really love the work that I do. Yeah. And I feel like I'm able to make a difference, even if it's just to a few people. It feels substantial. Speaker 2 And public speaking. So during your times that you're not working, you're you're really a homebody. Speaker 1 I'm really a homebody. I am such a Lola personified. Like I, my friends know this about me. Like I really enjoy just like simple things in life. Like I enjoy going out for good food. Yeah, drinking good coffee, being in nature. Like I'm just a really simple girl I love. Speaker 2 That though, because they expect you to be a lot of things because you're Miss Universe. And I love that Parang the normalize the humanize Ka. Big laugh. Does anybody see you in less like as an icon, like. And then when you hear this, it's like, oh, my God. She's just like the rest of us. She also likes to stay home at this age. Yeah. Yeah, I'm a party. I love that. I love to hear Paranga humanize Kasabe. I love it, but you see, but on the normalize and you're also just the rest of us in our 30s who are just so tired of of going out, you know? Speaker 1 Life has its simple pleasures, I feel. Speaker 2 OK, this one is actually nice. How important is it for people to explore other sites of life, especially when they feel boxed in by how others see them? Speaker 1 Oh, it's really important. I think that even more snow now than before. We have a lot of expectation placed on us by either the role that we have at work, especially as women, when we evolve past the different roles that we've been given, it can kind of be seen as like, oh, bucket gun. So like if you're a mom and then all of a sudden you want to pursue something for yourself, sometimes you can be met with certain presumptions like, well, you should be putting that time towards your family or like maybe you studied in this path and made a career and then you want to change. Like there would be people that be like I saw a young naman long time Mudun and Gastos. Yeah. But I think in all things in one's life, if you're not able to take ownership of what your trajectory looks like, then you will have lived your life for other people. And that's a disservice to self because again, you're not going to be able to be authentic and who you are, you will have that resentment. You will have that dream that you left on the black back burner. And maybe you, you might try and get your kids to to, you know, do it for you or be able to pursue their stuff. You'll live precariously through other people. But I feel like if you're able to express that and maybe you fail and maybe it's messy and maybe like people think, Oh, Saya Hanuman, but like you did it for you, at least you tried. Exactly. And the upside of that is maybe it works out. Speaker 2 Yeah, maybe, if it works out. Speaker 1 Exactly. Maybe it becomes even better than what you first perceived it could be. Maybe you can have it all in an even better way. So it's really just the tug and pull of like, where do you choose to create your path? Living your life for the expectations of other people? Or do you live for yourself? Speaker 2 Yeah. Navigating Judgment, Starting Anew, and the Film's Core Message Did you have that fear when you offered this film and you said OK, I'm gonna do this film? Did you have that fear that what would people say? Because they just you're Miss Universe to the whole the whole world, right. So it's like you're doing something new that they've never seen you do. Yeah. Did you have that fear also that all they might think that why am I doing this? Speaker 1 In a way, I think maybe the overarching feeling I had was I just want to do a really good job here. If I'm with this incredible cast and this incredible project with the story and then my character is kind of like cringe, you know, that's, I guess that was my fear about it. But I just was able to trust the director, trust that I was given this opportunity for a reason. Like they saw something in me trust that when I did the takes and then they were so we're good to move on like that. They were happy with what was delivered. So to Guru, as a creative, I can also understand the investment of self and vision that goes into a creative pursuit. So like the film. And so I also trust that these creatives who are all working together to create this will not just settle for. Speaker 2 Yes, after, yeah. Speaker 1 So there's that reciprocal trust. And so I think that's how I comforted my fears going through this. Speaker 2 Film. I love that. So what do you want? I asked this also to echo What do you want people to feel after seeing the film? What? What do you what do you want them to? I didn't take away Nella. I didn't take away Nella after watching The loved one. Speaker 1 Seguru for me it would be that loving someone requires a lot of adjusting but not sacrifice of self. That it's OK if you spend 10 years with someone and it doesn't work out. It doesn't mean that your youth was wasted or that it was all for nothing, but rather like your life was enriched by walking out that part of time with each other. And then if you then go your separate ways, then that's OK. It can still be looked back with love and respect for what it was and and yeah, you just have to take it for for what came with it. Speaker 2 Like what Olividine says, no love is wasted when it's shared. Speaker 1 Yeah, I. Speaker 2 Love that. Speaker 1 Queen Olivia Dean. Speaker 2 Olivia Dean. Like, I love that line. No love is wasted when it's shared. It's true. It's like some people consider. I think we use it as. But oh, my God, ten years. That's why people stay in relationships like this, even if they're so unhappy already. Yeah, because they have that thought always. I don't wanna start over. Speaker 1 Yeah, it's like a time investment, right? Or maybe it can even stem from a lack of self worth. If I can't make this work, who else is gonna have me at this age? I'm older, I'm more mature, maybe I have kids. It's all that kind of perception of self can also interplay there. Speaker 2 I don't know, my last question is this. What is your advice to those who are afraid to start over? Speaker 1 My advice to people afraid to start over is that it's scary because it's unknown, but there's a quote. I don't know who said it, but you can drive a far distance in the pitch of night with just a pair of headlights on. You only see a few feet in front of you, but it's enough illumination to get you the whole way. So like, as long as you just take those little steps at a time, it's OK if it feels scary and it's new and you feel unequipped, but you will find a way to make it work. And yeah, just taking ownership of why you want to do that, why you want to step out, why you want to make a change. If you can stick to that as like your core anchor. I honestly believe everything happens for a reason and agree. I, I, I encourage you that you will find yourself in a place that you'll be thankful that you took that leap in. Speaker 2 The first place, I love that. Thank you so much for your time. Thank you also. This is so much fun. This is such a meaningful conversation. I love it. Please invite everybody to watch the loved one. Speaker 1 Yes, so this episode is out on Feb 14th. Happy Valentine's some of the yearners out there. The Loved 1 is out nationwide in cinema, so bring your loved ones or the ones that you love but haven't told them yet. Shout out or among our friends no and then your family. And I hope you guys really enjoy this film. We had a lot of fun making it, so thank you so much for having me. Speaker 2 So much. It's an honour to have you here. Thank you. I hope you guys enjoyed this episode. Happy Valentine's Day. I'll see you guys next time. Bye.