Ep. #738: Ryan Holiday, Andrew Cuomo, Kristen Soltis Anderson

Welcome to an HBO podcast from the HBO Late Night series, Real Time with Bill Maher. Thank you, people. How are you? Appreciate it. Thank you very much. Thank you very much. Oh, thank you. Welcome to our show. Thank you. I appreciate that. And what can I tell you? It's the dog days of summer. I'm kind of glad. Finally, a slow news week. I could use a little break. Like, the biggest story this week is the guy who won the Powerball lottery for a billion dollars. Did you see that? In Quincy, Illinois, at a gas station, which is perfect because he plans to spend it on gas. But, you know, a billion sounds like a lot of money, but, you know, right away, the IRS takes a quarter of it. And then, depending on what state you live in, like if you live. If you live in this state, between federal and state, another half. That's, you know, terrible. How can you live? But this guy said he never realized how much he hated socialism. But, speaking of that, good news for the Democrats. The crazy lady in Wisconsin who hates Thanksgiving lost. By a whisper. Remember Francesca Hong up there? Yeah, she was ahead by 20 points, but then we found out about Thanksgiving. Doesn't like Thanksgiving. Also hates Halloween. Christmas, Valentine's Day, the 4th of July. It's actually a good thing she lost for everybody, considering how much she enjoys celebrating. She took it well. She said she just wants to spend more time with her husband, the Grinch. It's a silly story. But, you know what? Oh. Another progressive woman is in the news. AOC. Big announcement this week. You saw, yes, she's. We love it already. Look at this. I don't know why we love it or don't love it. I don't know. I don't know much about it. But what it is is she's free. She announced. She's, wow. I remember when she was like in the 20s, a new one, and now she's 36. She's freezing her eggs. Something career. Women do. I get it. You got shit to do. Put the kid on layaway. I get it. I mean, I'm all for it. But, you know, I must say, trying to teach kids these days about sex between the you might be in the wrong body and your brother's in the freezer. I tell you, explaining the birds and the bees is a lot more complicated than just, hmm, kids. Now, I don't know if this has anything to do with her decision, but she was engaged for quite a while, and the reports are this week that that's over, that the fiancé, yeah, they called it quits, although she says she hopes they can still remain comrades. I kid. Oh. Speaking of the eat the rich people, Luigi. Luigi. We have Luigi fans here. Luigi Mangione. The guy who was getting the runaround from the health care system about his bad back, so he murdered a health care executive randomly. That guy. He pleaded guilty in court. He said, I shot Mr. Thompson and I knew what I was doing and the Mangione Nistas, that's what they call the groupies outside the courthouse, they took it hard. One of them said, I don't think this is a concession. It's a concession or admission of guilt. Mitch, he just said he did it, okay? On the bright side, you'll always know where he is when you call. Now, how about the exciting news of the week, that Trump escaped? Did you see that? The secret. Oh, see, this hit a nerve. But the Secret Service got a credible threat that Iran was about to assassinate the president. They had a plan in place as he was coming out of Turkey. So they did that thing with Trump that the Beatles used to do where they go in one car and come out the next car. Except they did it with planes. There were three planes involved and they put him in the catering cart. And they pulled it all. He can pull this off, but he can't clean a pool. But. Now, the controversy with this is that Trump put all his friends on the decoy plane. Well, not all. You know who he took with him? Pete Hegseth. I'm not making that up. That is a fact. He took Pete Hegseth in the catering cart. And Pete was the perfect roommate. Because Trump was in with the snacks and Pete was in with the complimentary beer and wine. You know, it worked out perfectly. But yeah, ooh. Those Iranians, they ain't playing. Iran, they're a-filling themselves lately. You know? They said they. Well, look, they got the whip hand now. They said they won't reopen the Strait of Hormuz without compensation, without lifting the blockade, without ending sanctions, without. without releasing frozen assets or the right to charge ships. Or as Trump put it, they surrendered like dogs. Well, I tell you, our military situation. Did you read. I read this today. We have a carrier over there that's been there for nine months finally getting a break. Thank God. The USS Abraham Lincoln, the conditions on board this ship, like the. It sounds like a cruise ship. The toilets don't work. They ran out of hot water. The food. We're running out of food. A guy jumped overboard. And many others, they said, were thinking about it. I don't know about destroying Iran's Navy, but it looks like we're doing a hell of a job with ours. Our. And. And our situation in general, I'm thinking about the homeland, too, here, having used up so many of our munitions stockpiles is getting really desperate. The only thing that's left here that's explosive is diarrhea. I mean, last week. What? Last week, we learned about. There was a shortage of ballistic missiles. We have now. This week, we found out we only have a. We used up already a quarter of our drone fleet. The Army has a new slogan. War while supplies last. Okay. You're great. We got a great show. We got Governor Andrew Cuomo, former governor, and Kristen Soltis-Anderson. First up, interesting guy. Glad he's on. He's the host of the Daily Stoic podcast and the number one best-selling author of the Stoic Virtues series, now available as a box set, Ryan Holiday. Ryan? How are you, sir? Hi. How are you? Good to see you. Okay. Well, Ryan, I've been hearing a lot about you and your movement here. It's, of course, not a movement, a new movement. Stoicism is very, very ancient. But it seems like this is the first time I've ever recognized it to have a moment, can we say, right in the modern world. You're having a moment. I guess. Like Jimothy. Yes, like Jimothy. But more ancient. Yes. What? Things have a moment. And you seem to have learned how to monetize this and sell it to the common man. It's like a lifestyle, would you say? I mean, the Daily Stoic. We don't have time. You do it on a daily basis. If you only had 10 minutes, because you do only have 10 minutes. What's your elevator pitch for Stoicism? Yeah. It's certainly not what the word Stoic means to people, right? Stoic means has no emotions, has no feeling, has no joy. Stoicism as a philosophy, which has endured for thousands of years, is there to help us through the adversity and the difficulties of life. Because life is difficult. Life is painful. Things do go wrong. The Stoics do this. They live through the time of Nero. They live through plagues. They live through wars. They live through political unrest. They live through the decline of an empire. Some of this might sound familiar to you. It's always ongoing. Yeah. But way less now. Let's not kid ourselves that those things that you described in the modern world are an infinitesimally small percentage of what they were back then. Plagues. You know, the Black Plague wiped out like a third of Europe. The population didn't recover. to recover for 500 years. - Yes, yes. this is the greatest time to be alive in human history. Okay, thank you. Glad we said that. Which is. No, I mean, because we have to start from reality. Of course, of course. Reality. But so much of the fundamental elements of the human experience haven't changed. People are annoying. People are obnoxious. There's traffic. There's travel delays. You get sick. You get tired. You get hungry. You have urges. You have desires. All of the foibles of existence remain unchanged. And the Stoics were writing 2,500 years ago about how we deal with these things, how we persist in doing the things we should do and resist doing the things we should stop doing. Who was the first Stoic, and why was he so pissed off? What? Stoicism, I think, fittingly, comes from a disaster. There's a man named Zeno. He's a merchant traveling through the Mediterranean. He suffers this shipwreck, and he washes up penniless in Athens, and in rebuilding his life, he comes to discover this philosophy on the Stoapochyle in ancient Athens. So Stoicism comes from Sto. It just means porch. It's guys sitting around on a porch talking about life and how to deal with it. And for him, the core virtues of Stoicism, basically he's saying that the key ingredients to a good life are courage, self-mastery, justice, or ethics, and wisdom, and that these are the virtues we have to cultivate if we want to thrive as humans. So, do I have it wrong that there's this idea that the external can't hurt us? It's just how we react to it. Yes. You could define Stoicism as we don't control what happens, we control how we respond to what happens. We control the story we tell ourselves about it, we control what we do in response to it, we control our emotions in response to it. It's about the part of it that you do control. That's what Stoicism is. But some things we do control. Sure. And we should. Yes. I mean, you know the AA, the AA prayer, the one the drunks say? Yes. But. The serenity prayer. I think it's originally started with St. Francis. Lord, grant me the power to change what I can, the wisdom to. The courage to change the things I can. No, the serenity to accept what I can't, and the wisdom to know the difference. If I know that, what more are you adding? I'm just asking. It seems like the whole thing could be said in that sense. Well, the serenity prayer sounds like it's thousands of years old. It was written by Reinhold Niebuhr on a train in, like, the 1950s. Oh. It's a summary of Stoic wisdom. It is a summary. Epictetus, a slave in the Roman Empire, says that, you know, the chief task in life is knowing what is in our control and what's not in our control. And the problem is, most of the things people spend most of their time on are not in their control, and they neglect the things that are in their control. We spend all this time trying to fix other people, change other people, complaining about things. We spend a lot of time regretting what's happened in the past, and a lot of time worrying about what might happen in the future, and all the while we're neglecting the things that are up there. It sounds like more of an Eastern philosophy, and, of course, Greece was. Not that far. Not that far. And when the Roman Empire divided, it went East. I mean, it was the Eastern half, and it has many Eastern ideas, which is more about fatalism. Western man is much more about thinking you control, but I feel like that's who I am. I feel like, yes, you're right, of course, I can't control all my fate, but I always think life is not just about what you get. That isn't really what makes you happy a lot. It's what you avoid. See? Maybe I should have a podcast about this. No, but really, I mean, when you think about just the things you're getting involved in the criminal justice system, I mean, I know this from having just a DUI once. It's a nightmare. You know, debt. Feuds. Getting people pissed off. Making women angry. I could go on. Just taxes. You know, just what you avoid. And I feel like I, you know, I never, like, go across the street. If there's any chance a car is anywhere near me, because just the slightest thought I could get hit by the car, then I would be having pain. So, Epictetus said one of the signs you're making progress as a philosopher is, you might not like this, he says, proof is that you're getting in fewer arguments. That's great. Because it doesn't matter what other people think. It matters what you think. And we spend a lot of time trying to change people's minds, trying to reason people out of positions they didn't reason themselves into. And so, I do think it's important, because there are a lot of overlap between Eastern and Western philosophy. But I think the critical difference between Stoicism and, say, Buddhism, and why Stoicism is having this moment, is that the Stoics weren't retreating to a monastery. They didn't go on these long, silent retreats. They were in the arena, literally and figuratively. Marcus Aurelius is the emperor of Rome. There are Stoics who are playwrights and soldiers and entrepreneurs and builders and doers. So, we live in the West. We live in the world that the Romans made. Sure. And so, as a philosophy, I think you need, of course, serenity and peace and tranquility and all these things. But you also have to, like, the system doesn't work if people aren't involved doing things and contributing and trying to fix and grow and change. And so, the Stoics, were philosophers, but only part-time philosophers. They were full-time citizens and professionals and leaders. They were involved in public life. So, what do you think now, here, why are you having so much success with this? Why do you think this is the moment where it caught on? To me, you know, it does kind of make sense that people who, especially the younger generations, who think they're in so much pain. Yeah. We both laughed. Yeah, totally. But it fits. Yes. Look, I think one of the reasons Stoicism is working is because it has been tried and tested over 25 centuries. It's a merciless process of the crucible of human experience testing these ideas and refining them. But I think the reason it's having a moment, particularly today, is we are seeing a collapse in the other institutions and ideologies that used to shape and direct people. People aren't going to church as much. They see. There is a dearth of great leaders and moral examples. And so, we're looking backwards to people who, from a previous time, seem to have figured it out, wrote something down, have something to share and teach us. And it would be wonderful if these ideas were taught in school, but they're not. And so, people wake up and they go, especially, I think, young men, they wake up and they go, well, I know what I don't want to be, but who should I be? What should I do? And they're desperate for advice. And that is a void that if we don't, Phil, Andrew Tate fills. Eee. Wow. Come on. They can't be our only two choices. There has to be something else on the menu. What about overseas? Is this as big overseas? Are you big overseas? Or is this more of an American phenomenon? No, no. It's all over the world. Obviously, in Greece and Rome, Marx, Aurelius and the Stoics are their heroes. But I think. I think there are some cultures that are a little bit more naturally Stoic than the Americans. There's a, I think, a natural Stoicism in the Brits, in the Australians. You know, but it resonates all over the world. The books are in 40 languages. And you have a banned book library, don't you? I do. I think that's an awesome idea. Because they ban books on both sides. I mentioned it at my Mark Twain speech, the Huckleberry Finn. They don't want that in the schools, even though it's anti-racist. 1984 has been banned because, by the Constitution, it was banned by communists and by people who thought it was communists. Right. Right? So when people talk about banned books, they tend to think that it's, like, it's explicit or erotic or inappropriate. And most of the books that are on these lists, most often, are the books that you read in high school and you didn't think there was anything wrong with. Right. And people are trying to pull the ladder up behind them, I guess, and say, no more generations can read these classics. All right. Well, I hope that bookstore expands. Thank you very much for being here. Thanks for having us. Fascinating stuff. Appreciate your explanation. Thank you for inviting it to it. Thank you. All right. Ryan Holiday. Let's meet our panel. Hey. All right. There they are. He is the former Democratic governor of New York. My old job. Andrew Cuomo's here. Andrew. And she's a CNN contributor and a founding partner and pollster at Echelon Insights, Kristen Soltis Anderson, our returning champion. Okay. You know, I say this often on this show. I don't understand the American economy, but I thought this would be a good week to talk about it because something shed a little light on it this week. Have you heard about Burrito Gate? Has anyone heard about the burrito thing? This is a big thing. If you haven't heard what happened, somebody from Turning Point, USA, is that Charlie Kirk sold it? Okay. Okay. It's not really that important to the thing, but he tweeted out, because a student had commented on their platform, a burrito shouldn't cost $20. And this guy challenged that. And it turned out, we did some research on this, it shouldn't cost $20 because it doesn't. It costs $20 because this kid factored in somebody bringing it to him in an Uber. Yeah. So this is what I don't understand about the economy. Yes, people, are struggling, but they're also experiencing expectations are too high. Is that too much of a generalization about the economy? Well, I think, you know, this burrito gate has really exploded on the Republican side. And Kirsten knows about that more. But, you know, sometimes a burrito is just a burrito. Not this time. This is a fundamental problem for the Republicans. They know they have a problem with young people. They know that the young people believe they have a real affordability problem. And the debate is, well, are these young people just too entitled? They're taking Ubers, they're buying $7 coffees, and they're doing it to themselves, which is sort of one side of the argument. The other side is, no, there is a real affordability crisis, and the Republicans better step up and address it. And I think that's going to be fascinating to watch, Bill, because— Because it's going to be an internal debate for the Republican Party. Are they the traditional conservative Ronald Reagan, the private market is God, and whatever it does is right? Or are you going to see more like a J.D. Vance come in with an affirmative government should do something about the economy, housing subsidies, et cetera? I think that's what this is really getting at. OK, but just to be clear about the numbers here, you can get one for $2. And you can't buy it in the supermarket. And somebody said they feed a family of eight on $20 by buying ingredients like we used to do. Make your own burrito. That's what I'm saying. One of the things that makes people upset, though, is it's not even necessarily just the raw price of what you're paying, but it's how you feel you used to be able to live relative to now. And I think inherent to people's idea of the American dream, which lots of people define many different ways, is the idea that you can— You can always get ahead. You can always advance. You can always improve your quality of life. And if you, rightly or wrongly, think things used to be better, and now, when I'm growing up, I'm getting screwed, I understand why folks in Gen Z feel like they say they don't believe that the American dream is real. They say they don't believe the system works. I think it is true that there has probably never been a better time or place to be alive than the United States of America in 2026, regardless of—I understand there's plenty of things wrong, but I also get, for somebody who's Gen Z, when they look at maybe their parents' generation and they go, you know, it feels like they were able to buy a house when they were 24. It doesn't feel like I'm able to buy a house. You can see why, for many of them, they go—you know, they came of age in the COVID era. They've seen a lot. But that's not what the stats say. You guys are talking about feelings. I'm just going to stick to the numbers. Here are the numbers. Can I? Okay. This is from the Fed. Okay. Two-thirds of Americans consider groceries to be unaffordable. Maybe they are. But wages rose in the last decade, including the pandemic, 46%. Food prices rose 34%. So wages outpace them by the numbers. What we spend on food. At the beginning of the last century, it was 42% of the budget. And then you go through the years, you know, 1965, it was down to 15%. Now it's under 10% of the budget, including eating out more. Also, Gen Z, I never realized this until people started writing about it. As they reach their late 20s now, they're getting much richer than Gen X was. Millennials and Gen Z at age 30, their net worth is around $118,000. Gen X's was $53,000, like half of that. But Gen X never complains. You got to love those Gen Xers. They are the quietest fucking guys. And Gen Zers are living with that. It is also true that Gen Zers are like, I would argue, alarmingly high levels of people in Gen Z who are living with their parents well into their 20s. That's absolutely, that's another big issue. This is another stat I saw this week that blew my mind. The great wealth transfer. I've been reading about this. That's, I guess, our generation, that's the boomers, are set to transfer 104 trillion. Now, this is the high end. We don't know. This is over 20 years. But up to $124 trillion, trillion dollars, down through the younger generations. It's interesting. A lot of the kids want it now. They don't wait. It's like, look, why wait till you die, Grandpa? Yeah. I'm going to push back against this. Okay, well, first of all, you're right. Waiting for the baby boomers to die is not an economic strategy. But I don't think it's that, I don't, I would, I totally disagree that Gen Z and millennials are just waiting for the baby boomers to hand things over to them. I think for many of them, they feel like the deal that was available to the baby boomers is not a deal that is available to them today. Yeah. That's true, too. I'm sure it is. Yeah. You can make the case on the numbers, but it is not what they feel. Right. And that's part of what we're seeing on the Democratic side also. I think the Republicans are going to have a bigger problem because they start with a problem with younger people. But look at what we're going through right now. We have these young people who believe they have been screwed by life, right? And they are acting out. And they're upset about Trump's election. And they're upset about Israel. And they're upset about affordability. By the way, they're doing the exact opposite. Of what Ryan just talked about with stoicism, right? That's right. You should be smart, be controlled, show wisdom. They're just total rage and emotion and doing everything they can that is stupid and counterproductive. But that is the feeling. Well, I got to say, the first thing I thought of when I saw this stat about transferring $124 trillion, I thought, I wonder how much of that is white money. Because I bet it's most of it. And it turned out I was right. Because of all the racial issues we face, the big one, I mean, so many of the things these days, it's just performative. I mean, we've made a lot of progress. I know the far left hates to hear that. It's just true. The one place that's stuck is money, which makes sense because one race had a 300-year head start on making it. And that's what money gets transferred down through the generation. That's why the white people have 84% of total household wealth. That's what it is. So I would just say to the young people who think of themselves as progressives, you know, and you believe in allyship and reparations, and that's where the money is, kids. Well, look, I don't think that needing the wealth to transfer is a good strategy. I think finding ways to help wealth get created is good. And honestly, this is a, regardless of what you think about Donald Trump, this is a, you got to hand it to him. These Trump accounts for young kids. Have money set aside for you when you are very young. So explain it first, because I kind of, I know the story. It's been called a couple different things, baby bonds. But essentially, if you are born in the United States during Trump's presidency, you get, I believe it's $1,000 that can just go straight into an account. I think that, I think that, I believe Dell is also funding some of this, that there's, essentially, it just means that you have money that's going to set aside and can grow over the course of your lifetime. Compound interest is insane. Right. This is an incredible way to help kids get the next generation. Sorry for millennials and Gen Z, but for Gen Alpha and whoever comes after them, being able to have that money start early is enormously valuable. No, I remember, yeah. But they will say, yeah, they'll say that pays one-tenth of the interest on their college debt, you know, which many of these kids really are struggling with. And that is a problem. I remember George Bush wanted to put the money, that we, you, when you start paying into Social Security when you're 20 or 18 or whatever it is, into the stock market. And he went, oh, wow, what a terrible idea. Not a terrible idea. You're not going to be able to touch it until you're 65 anyway. Look at the chart of where the money in the stock market, it outpaces just putting in the bank by exponential number. Yes. So why didn't we do that? Well, because politics, I guess, it didn't seem like, this seems like it's the same thing. Well, this is, I think, a little different because people don't, I think, people don't know that. I think people are, I actually don't know what the investment rules are around it. But the idea that you're starting so early just gives it, I mean, time is just such an accelerant when it comes to being able to grow wealth and being able to start so young. Look, I'm hoping that that will help these younger generations, especially kids who are not coming from white families or families where they're going to be able to inherit that wealth. I think it's going to be hugely helpful. And Andrew, as someone who ran against Mandemi in New York for the mayorship, what do you think of his plan to help us with affordability? I mean, he's opening the city-run stores, grocery stores, I don't think they have one yet, but that's the plan, that would sell meat and bread and other items, I assume, for 30% below market rate. His quote was, the mayor said, I look forward to the competition. May the most affordable grocery store win. Well, it's not competition. If you're undercutting legitimate businessmen by 30%, I wonder who's going to win. But who's subsidizing that? Who's paying for that? I guess richer people, and that's the plan. But is it, you think it's workable? It never has before. Of course not. It's emblematic of this entire approach. right? It's all symbolic. They take a really serious issue, and food insecurity is a serious issue, and they offer this simplistic solution, bumper sticker solution, that's not going to make a damn bit of difference. His plan is, first, five grocery stores in New York City, okay, for the entire city. Jesus Christ, five loaves of bread, two fish, could only feed 5,000. You're not going to do eight million people with five grocery stores. The grocery stores are subsidized a hundred million dollars. That's how the 30% discount comes, because he's subsidizing them with tax dollars. All it's going to do is put the surrounding mom and pop stores out of business, and then it's anyone can go to the store. So it's not for poor people, lower income people, it's anyone. You can go. Shop and get the 30% discount. But I wouldn't, and neither would you. I know, but it's the- The rich people aren't going to go to that store. Yeah, but they want to make the point of socialism. This is socialism providing the goods. Nothing will make someone hate socialism more than trying to go to a government-run grocery store. In 1989, Boris Yeltsin comes over to the U.S. This is when the U.S. and the U.S.S.R. were starting to become, it was thawing. He comes over to visit Texas. He goes to NASA, he sees our technology there, and then he goes to a Texas grocery store. And Boris Yeltsin walked away. The Houston Chronicle said he was dazzled by the Jell-O pudding. Pops. And things that, seriously, in the store. And he went back to the Soviet Union and was like, guys, we've got it all wrong. And that was it. That was the end of the Cold War. We just had all the soccer tourists do the same thing. They lost their shit in the grocery aisles of the American supermarket. It turns out this is a solved problem. And look, I get it. So the affordability of groceries, right problem to tackle, wrong solution. We actually have solutions in that you have grocery stores like Aldi, like Little, that are aimed at sort of getting discount food. in people's hands. Create the economic conditions where an Aldi or a Little wants to open up shop in your town, rather than government deciding it's going to get into the grocery store running business. What we get on the state side is exactly what you said. Number one, provide an incentive for private stores to go into these communities because they don't want too many of them. And number two, for low-income people who can't afford food, subsidize their food bill. And in New York, $40,000, $50,000, up to $60,000, depending on your family condition, you can get a $1,000 credit per month for food. That's a smart way to do it, you know. But this is not about smart. This is about performative, as you said. Okay. Performative politics and performative government. That's not going to make a damn bit of difference. Speaking of money and who has it, there's a story I wanted to cover. Now, this show, we take our responsibility very seriously here to alert the audience to important new trends that are coming up. And there is an important one. It was in the Wall Street Journal this week. The headline was, this summer's hottest accessory is a private equity boyfriend. This is, what? You're laughing. But for successful women like yourself, I'm sure you're taken. But for successful women, you got to have a private equity boyfriend. Reese Witherspoon has one, Nicole Kidman, Olivia Rodrigo. It's the biggest thing. So we were curious. We were curious. What are the pickup lines that the private equity boyfriends are using? So we Googled it. Would you like to hear some of the private equity types? Are you from the Midwest? Because I'd like to ruin your downtown. I guess I'll have to offer your ass a buyout because I see it just won't quit. I'm not into anal, but I have had the Securities and Exchange Commission up my ass. I don't know if you're running a Ponzi scheme, but you've already made off with my heart. Thank you. Very proud of that one. I see us growing old together. Well, you growing old. I have access to Peter Thiel's blood gun. You look like a younger Charlize Theron, which is good because the real one put out a restraining order on me. Your place or mine? Actually, yours, because mine has been doxxed by Mandani. And come on my boat. I don't want to brag, but if it had any more coke on it, Pete Hegseth would blow it up. Okay. So now you're apprised on that trend. Okay. So you're our favorite pollster here on this show. You've got all the polls. You have all the facts. Nobody likes them anymore. Nobody ever liked them, but we need them. We need to get, and we need sometimes to like maybe get better stats because I don't know if people are answering the landline anymore or however they're getting their info. But I have to ask this question because I keep reading these statistics about how much the American public has gone independent. Like 45% of people now say they're independent. Yep. Happened when we were young. They were either Republican or Democrat. There was a few independents. The numbers that say they're dissatisfied with both parties. And yet why never the third party? And then I read last week, Tucker Carlson, he's going to be the third party guy. Now look, Republicans, I love them, but you know what? They always go lower. Like just when you, just when you think you hit the bottom of the barrel, there's more under the barrel. There's levels of, they, it's true. They just find new levels of crazy. I mean, Tucker Carlson, he's the third party. Why do they say, the American public, that they want this sensible middle, but then when it comes time to actually do it, they run right to the extremes? All right. Where do we start? So there are an awful lot of Americans who feel very politically homeless. They look at the Republican party, they look at the Democratic party, and maybe they agree with a little of column, a little comedy, but they're not in on, on all of one or the other. The problem is all of those people who are politically homeless do not agree on a whole lot. There are some who like Tucker Carlson. There are some who like Mike Bloomberg, like those people do not actually agree on much besides I don't really like the two political parties. That's what makes it so hard for a third party to take off. There are structural things built into our system about single member districts and what's, you know, the constitution. It is rigged. By both. Neither party like wants to get the third party on the ballot, right? That's the truth. That's the truth. And like, look, we've had, you had Ross Perot back in 92, get almost 20%, but it's hard to get more than that because it's hard to get a group of people who are independent, but also agree on enough stuff altogether to come together to form like a coherent political movement. That is so distinct from one of the two parties. And that's why usually it's like a Ralph Nader on the left or a Tucker on wherever he is. Isn't it more that we're all in bubbles and in our own media echo chambers. And so they got us cockfighting and it's so easy at the end of the day to get people just to go, oh, fuck them on that thing and go right back to the team, my team. I mean, I find it, my frustration in life is always trying to get people to a sensible middle. They just don't seem to want to do it at the end of the day. Yeah, I think it's both things. First of all, there is a real structural problem. The Democrats don't want it to happen and the Republicans don't want it to happen because it would diminish both parties. So it doesn't happen. Many contests, most contests, you can't vote as an independent. If you could vote as an independent in party primaries, that would make a dramatic difference in this country because there would be a moderating influence, but neither party really wants to do it. And then push comes to shove. As Kirsten said, people will say, yes, I'm not happy with either party, but at the end of the day, they go Democratic or Republican because they don't think the independent candidacy is really viable. But Tucker Carlson, I mean, he used to do this show and my old show with the bow tie, normal sort of Republican, conservative, and then he just went to crazy land and made $100 million. Here's the irony. If I was constructing the third party candidate who would have the best chance of succeeding, it would be somebody who says, I'm anti-establishment. I'm skeptical of us getting involved in foreign wars. I'm a little more socially conservative. I'm pretty law and order, but I'm more economically populist. I think the capitalist system sucks. That's like the pieces you could assemble to make a reasonably successful candidate. The problem is that Tucker Carlson's plus a lot of other stuff that makes him not, remotely palatable to the vast, vast, vast majority of Americans. And when I look at my polls and I see, you know, right now Republicans kind of split on whether they like Tucker Carlson or not. Many of the Republicans who like him, I think, are unaware of some pieces of this journey that he's gone on since bowtied guy who would come on real time or dancing with the stars and the very dark places that he has gone now. It does speak to the vulnerability of Trump. I mean, the fact that they smell blood in the water, the fact that the poll numbers are down, they don't like the war, they don't like what they conceive as inflation, which is the tariffs, the things that made people's lives more difficult. And so Tucker Carlson, I mean, he put out a like a 10 point plan. That's what people who are going to run for office do. It was bullshit, but he put it out. I think, yeah. Well, you have to have a 10 point plan for anything, right? I think. I think it's going to get worse after the midterms. I think they're sensing that the Republicans are going to have trouble in the midterms in November. And then you're going to really start to see the vulnerability of Trump because then they will all come. You must be happy that the crazy lady in Wisconsin lost as for the Democratic Party. The. It is so shocking to me how, uh, the Democratic Party has gotten itself into this situation where it is so counterproductive, right? Uh, we hate MAGA, we hate Trump. So we go out and nominate people who make it harder to win in November, you know? Uh, none of it makes any sense. I get the anger, I get the frustration, but it is all counterproductive. They're mad at Trump, they're mad at Israel, they're mad at the establishment, they're mad at the Democratic Party. So they do emotions, but they're intentionally the exact opposite, right? Uh, and it's just not going to work. They're pick. They are electing people who are going to make it harder to win. Yes. We've already seen a little bit of this, um, speaking of polls. There was a poll that came out this week that showed, uh, the Republican candidate up by, I believe, four points against Abdul El-Sayed in Michigan. Now, the polls in Michigan and the Democratic primary weren't particularly good, but that's a race that was not. Not necessarily the one that Republicans initially thought was going to be their best chance, but are now looking at it as a real opportunity that even in a very bad, what is likely to be a very bad election year for Republicans, could be a pickup. But Democrats have also been saved by their own base a couple of times this year so far. And I, I have long believed that Democrats are on a slow path toward having their own Tea Party movement kind of situation. I do think that if Democrats take the House, you are going to have a situation where a, let's say, Speaker of the House is going to have a situation where a, let's say, Speaker Hakeem Jeffries has to figure out, "How am I going to fund the government? How am I going to pass a funding bill that Donald Trump signs?" And that's when the real bloodbath begins within the Democratic Party. No, I, I couldn't agree more. Look, you have these moderates who are just afraid of the extreme left. They're just afraid. They are. And when they start with this, "Well, we're a big tent party." No. That is a lot of crap. Big tent party meant all races, color, creeds, we're open-minded. But they're not. They're not. But a tent is a finite ob, object. It didn't mean, "Nazi sympathizers, you're welcome. Anti-Semites, you're welcome. Abolish the police. Close prisons. Open borders. Do away with the Constitution." That's not the Democratic tent. It's just not. But they are afraid, Bill, of the extremists. And they are placating them. And that is going to make the Tea Party of the Democratic Party a big problem. And that will make us a fringe party. We will, we will defeat ourselves on this path. Okay. So, light, lightning round. So, uh, President Trump foiled the assassins again this week. He jumped on the plane that wasn't the plane, but he left everybody else on the other plane. If the Iranians were going to shoot down that plane, goodbye Marco Rubio and a lot of other people. No, I'm not judging him. I'm sure that's what the Secret Service told him. My question is, because I've heard it is the President's discretion if he could do that or not. Do you think any other President would have done it differently? Like, say, Jimmy Carter. He was like Mr. Christian Guy. Would he have left his friends on that other plane? What about Obama? What about Reagan? I feel like when you're Donald Trump, well, no, Donald Trump has had a number of credible threats on his life traced back to the Iranian government. Yeah. He's, he, he got his ear shot. I don't blame him. I mean, like, so, I kind of think if you're Donald Trump, you'd do what the Secret Service tells you to do. Yeah, I would. I think they all would. You think they all would. I think they would do what the Secret Service said to do. Yes, it's his decision, but, uh, you rarely go against what the Secret Service is advising. Right. All right. Thank you, panel. Time for New Rules! Okay. All right, New Rule. Now that AOC has decided to share with the world that she's freezing her eggs, uh, Mitch McConnell's wife has to tell us if Mitch has passed away. I mean, no disrespect, but we do need to set a bi-partisan baseline for too much information. I don't want to invade anybody's privacy, I just need to know what's in the freezer. Uh, New Rule, women hoping to put a little more lead in their man's pencil might want to consider getting him the herbal supplement horny. Horny goat weed. It's known as nature's Viagra, and even if it doesn't work, ladies, remember, goats, they'll eat anything. Uh, New Rule, the airport duty-free store has to come right out and say it, "You think we smell." What other explanation is there? Your store carries two things: cologne and liquor. Who buys cologne at the airport? Why not just come home wearing a sign that says, "Honey, I'm having an affair." And if I'm going to spend $50 on a bottle of something at the airport, it's going to be water. New Rule, if you're a South Korean company looking to do business in America, run your brand name by an English speaker first. I'm talking to you, come-ho tires. I'm just trying to help, because I see big problems, like some guy telling his girl, "Honey, we can't go out to dinner tonight. I just dropped 500 bucks on a couple of come-hos." New Rule, if you're a South Korean company looking to do business in America, run your brand name by an English speaker first. New Rule, now that Georgia's Jesse Davis is accused of trying to run over a woman in a parking lot just for saying good morning, someone has to ask him two questions. Why would you do that to a nice lady just out for a jog? And could you look any more like a Chucky dog? Dude, I don't know where all this pent-up animosity towards women is coming from, but have you tried horny goat weed? And finally, New Rule, if you want the American dream, you have to take the American values. There's no bigger issue in electoral politics these days than immigration, and there's no doubt, at least in my mind, that both sides went to extremes. Now, I'm on the page of America doing what it used to do so well, stealing hard-working, talented immigrants from around the world and making them Americans. Do you like Western civilization? Because that's what we are, and that's not negotiable. Let me ask our audience. Do you think gay rights is one of our values that's non-negotiable? Great, I'm going to hold you to it. A few weeks ago, a liberal Democrat named Melissa Chaudry, running for Congress in Seattle, was asked why, among the many progressive causes listed on her website, LGBT rights was conspicuously absent. Because, she said, a lot of Muslims do not feel that way, unfortunately. Now here's where liberal sphincters just tightened. Because they heard the word Muslim and have been brainwashed into thinking, oh, some Islamophobic bullshit is going on. No, just facts, and a little honesty to the people who see everything as oppressor versus oppressed, but can't see who actually does a lot of oppressing. So let me ask, is this the progressive policy now? Is Ms. Chaudry right? We throw gay people under the bus anytime it clashes with what makes Muslims uncomfortable? Last month, a gay cruise ship with 2,000 passengers that was sailing the Mediterranean had to turn around and change course because Muslim countries wouldn't let it dock. They tried to get into Turkey, and Turkey was like, no homo. They tried Egypt, nope, just straight denial. This poor gay cruise ship couldn't. They couldn't find a home. It was like the Grindr version of the Odyssey. But happy ending, they eventually sailed on to Greece, where the Greeks said, are you kidding? We invented that ship. But I got to say, you know, Egypt and Turkey, they have no problem saying, our culture, we just don't do that here. We need a little of that attitude here. How about homophobia? We just don't do that here. We will make you bake a wedding cake. But not everybody sees it this way. Linda Sarsour is a big progressive hero, and she says, our number one priority is our community. It is not to assimilate. Okay, but that's not really how immigration works. If I move to Japan, I don't get to say, okay, everybody, a couple of changes. First of all, shoes stay on in the house now. Also, no more tentacle porn. That's gone. Look, lots of people, not just Muslims, of course, do lots of fucked up shit. We don't have to go. We don't have to go on with it. A number of cultures still practice marriage by capture, where if you fancy a gal, you simply abduct her and claim her as your fiancé. You may recall Borat tried it on Pamela Anderson. It's a real thing, and it's always a touching scene when the groom gets down on one knee and to propose, and the bride says, I don't know, I don't know. And the bride still has the bag over her head. Okay, but we don't do that here. Linda Sarsour was forced into an arranged marriage at 17, but defends the practice, saying it made her, quote, become mature much earlier in life. I'll bet. But here, we think that's a little too close to Epstein stuff. Honor killings. Not letting women show their faces. Polygamy. Cousin fucking. Female genital mutilation. There's lots of stuff we don't do here, and it's not negotiable, and it's not white values. These are liberal values. People fought and died to establish them, and it's not racist to say, if you want to come here to help form a more perfect union, great. But some things are too fundamental to change. The separation of religion. And state, for example. And I would say the same thing to Christian nationalists. Democracy, not theocracy. Free speech, even about religion. Equal rights for women. LGBT. That's America. And none of it, none of this is available in Sharia law. Which a third of British Muslims want to see be the law in England. And you can't have both. You can't have England and Sharia law. And the left's reaction to Islamification is, the worst that could happen from it is it will get right-wingers elected. Maybe, or maybe the worst that could come from it is in 20 years the UK is turning away gay cruise ships. Now, you can, and I'm sure some of you are, screaming Islamophobia, but that's just a bullshit word to cow people into not talking about this. This has nothing to do with non-whites becoming the majority. I don't give a shit about that. I don't give a shit about colors. White people, they're white, they're not pandas. I care about liberal values being replaced by illiberal ones. Last month, more than 70,000 Moroccan migrants breached the border and poured into a part of Spain called Soweta. I feel for them, but I also understand why a lot of Europe freaked out about it. I sympathize with refugees, but when I see them interviewed, it's always, "There's nothing here for me. The economy sucks. I don't see a future." I sympathize, but what you need is not asylum. What you need is LinkedIn. Build something in the country you live in. You got a bad economy? You know that cruise ship that couldn't dock? Do you have any idea how much money 2,000 drunk gay men would have spent in their beach towns? All right. That's our show. I want to thank my guests, former Governor Andrew Cuomo, Kristen Soltis-Anderson, and Ryan Holiday. Club Random drops every Monday on YouTube, or listen wherever you get your podcasts. Now go watch Overtime on YouTube. Thank you very much, ladies and gentlemen. Thank you. We'll see you next time. Bye. Catch all new episodes of Real Time with Bill Maher every Friday night at 10:00, or 5:00 p.m. on HBO Max. You're watching Life, Larry and the Pursuit of Unhappiness: An Almost History of America. This is a declaration of common sense. Those who don't know history. You are the world's worst butter churner. Are doomed to watch Larry David repeat it. What the hell is going on here? Watch Life, Larry and the Pursuit of Unhappiness, now streaming on HBO Max. Subscription required. Visit hbomax.com for details.