EP. 69 | Graeme Holm (PART 4) Australia's Leading Mortgage Broker & Author

All righty welcome back ladies and gentlemen. This is the episode everyone's been waiting for episode 69 of the Graham home series. This is where we're going to talk all things business money finance and success There's been a lot of hype and heat leading up to this session G the big thing that everyone's talking about is you've shared about how we can fuck the banks with our lending and Looking investing in property, but one common theme in question is how do we start earning an income to start investing? In buying properties and buying the asset so one main topic of conversation today is how do we go and build an income or a business? We'd love to talk all things about progression there with yourself and then we've got a lot of viewer questions as well, which will group into so boys welcome back really excited to rip in Yes, I was I thanks for I've seen you published 68 myself so we had like 60 67 68 was to go with something like yeah, or 65 60 and then you've published 70 and 71 but there's no 69 That's you had hundreds of messages 100 thanks for holding episode 69 boys We said the numbers a bit prematurely in a bit early so 69 will be launched in a couple of days ladies in general and it yeah Absolutely, Hammond so but look the people want what the people want so people so thanks boys good to good to be back To ride right right it's right the fourth one now. Yeah It's been fucking wild mate my first question is I think it's it's a it's something where I think a lot of people want to know but they never really ask is How do you actually build your social following like your social following doubled in recent months? But even before then you were sitting at 40 K now you sitting at what nearly 80 K and I think yeah Instagram is like I don't know 20,000 mid late last year. It's like 17 hour Wow tick tock. I barely used I just post stuff and tend to find there's a lot of interesting people on tiktok everyone's got an opinion like a backside you should just sit on it but Yeah, tiktok had like 1500 people. I didn't really just put content on it and then it's like 1819,000 now but That's mostly credits you guys in the podcast, but I mean Facebook I was always pretty sizable on I only really used Facebook. I tend to find a lot of my clients are young families mum and dad's older mum and dad's and families Excuse me. So yeah social is a big thing then like I don't I don't spend money on advertising or print media or any of that sort of gimmick and branding like I Can communicate with everyone in the country of the planet on socials. So what's so if you were to sit down if someone to sit was to sit down with you and say Oh gee, I want to grow my social media following what would be your best piece of advice? Definitely Gary go follow Gary V for all I've done a few tours with Gary. How many swears more than me? So some people won't like that But go for us follow someone like Gary V I have a look at some of his strategies, but it's just it's content, but it's consistent content We talked about this in one of the other episodes Just me you're fucking authentic self as well like I catch Like what's funny? I'll go back a step ways Every podcast we've done is just been here look we can slip it in here I've been in a t-shirt and a hat if you're in my office any day. I'm wearing this I'm in a t-shirt and a hat and a pair of jeans Her arm with boots or some high-tops if I'm feeling funky and not fat and When I was in a way of the last couple of weeks for some family stuff and in some meetings as well I went down a Sydney. I went to walk out of the elevator at the Crescus. Your grandma And I went yeah, did we go to school together? See for the podcast with the bosser. He goes rock, right? And when we're going with this is social media, right and Consistency I wear the same thing every day because when we talk about business and dinner I don't like decision fatigue Mm-hmm or a black hat a black shirt and a pair of jeans and I've got in my wardrobe on one side of my wardrobe Is black hats black shirts and jeans and boots? I don't have to think about what I'm gonna wear each day because I've got a lot of Decisions to make every day and then I went down to Woolingong sadly for family stuff. Sorry, yeah, thanks boys and And went down to the local fishing chip shop where I grew up and Literally ordering lunch and I was actually watching some stuff some social stuff on my phone with the headphones in my wife Elbow is me because the guy served us the owner's stories Like and I guess it oh sorry, I took the air buds out and he's like oh just the hat the shirt the face to be it on my Hey, go to school to get to school together where I grew up. He said no, no, no, see the unsusual media so there's something to be said for Less Wang factor and just be your authentic self like I don't need to impress somebody comment on one of our things I you'd be so much more credible if you didn't use so much language Well, I'm one of the credible to you, but I am to everyone else that made it the number one podcast by an Australian entity You know what I mean like don't change yourself for anybody Especially on socials because people see through that shit now There's plenty of gurus out there that will comment on shit and they've got their opinion and you never met a hater doing better than you They're too busy succeeding right or actually saying well done. Thanks for putting some content out So be your authentic self, but there is no better way there's no excuse for anyone anymore to not have a crack But also if I look at the first video's I ever produced oh man actually just thinking about it is so cringe and The first videos actually I'm gonna we're gonna insert a steal into the edit here The first videos I've got with this corny little microphone on the desk that I don't even think it was real I think it was a display microphone And I probably had a lapel on and I'm probably in the suit and tie with my white shirt in the office and it's like so fucking staged You know what I mean like for me to talk about insurance or alone or something It's not me And people can fucking smell that shit a mile away It's like a fucking line in the wild smelling fear or something like people can tell they're like that's fake as fuck So for all the list of other questions you're getting Socials is an astronomical way to express yourself But we've done this very well from all the feedback. I think we can buy all agree Give value and don't give value for a sale So I get thousands of people Every Tuesday night on a free webinar when I have time. I try to do them every week or two on a Tuesday night And I tell the people in the comments last night that I don't respond I had a late last night for free Oh, what a later crap and I wrote back and went yep I do a number the number one in category and investing last year He's a podcast. I do with Dr. Andrew Wilson a leading economist every week It was number one and investing. It's usually top ten in Australia That's free. He's my Spotify. He's my podcast. He's my socials and yes I'm going to give you 45 to 60 minutes of free content on Tuesday where they can ring the bank get a better rate do the All free but I tell you in the first minute of it Here's the agenda after 45 55 minutes I'm going to tell you you can log off with everything for free because I'm an honest transparent human being And then I'm going to give you a sales pitch if you want to pay me to do it and then I'm going to do a free Q&A Do you know how many people log off when I tell them I'm going to do a sales pitch? How many? I'm going to have 2,000 people on the you know how many log off not many 100 Wow, you know why because I told the truth yeah, and now they want to know what the sales pitch yeah So that comes back to the socials if you're not transparent and you're only going on socials to make money and stroke your ego and Chate let's be clear being famous on social media is like winning monopoly like grow up That's meaningless right yeah, and once you go into socials you've got to be prepared For it to consume your life and for every like in Australia. I mean finance and real estate you guys are in Australia And how's your fucking property expert You got a loan you're a morgue jacksbird at the barbecue. It's called the barbecue mafia Nothing better than toothless Timmy on the tinnies flipping the snags on the weekend With these vb hand grenade telling you that you should have a particular loan or buy in a particular suburb right we've all met them All the offset again all the offset count yeah So Socials is critical like it's I would go to somebody's social media page Before I would go to their website you know why The website's curated The website is a perception Perception is reality to most people That's fake is fuck that's curated. That's what you want to present yourself. I'm interviewing staff my team Straight to their social media. Oh, they like to go on a bender on the sad day nights. Do they? They're calling in sick on Monday so authentic And give value unconditionally like market updates for you know like Give give give Without expectation We do this first podcast. There was no expectation except hey, we like what each other does You've had some amazing guests on them like yeah the guys are doing something really good They're getting the best of the best happy to do it. I don't usually do port as we know I don't really do podcasts. That's what's blowing up so much right? I keep Pretty under the radar with some of the best results in the industry and Then I still get attacked for it. So it's a little mic drop where actually what we're doing at the moment for the people that usually attack this E-wire actually auditing Like 20 of my clients who paid their loan off in under 10 years And I've got some big stuff about to come out media wise about it once the audits complete To validate it so the next person that carries on like a pork chop. I'm just going to refer them to those articles Then I'll go from E-wire to PWC KPMG and then go to every industry that's got a problem with it because here's the other thing about socials. If you have a look right now, I could pull them up my phone. There's about 50 brokers in Australia right now copying my ads, word for word, script for script. One gentleman changed pay you mortgage off in seven to ten years to six to nine years, but every other word is exactly the same. Now, imitation is the finest form of flattery. You do you, Boo. I looked at the data of the ad, it's had 538 hits. Mine's had three and a half million just on one. So different budgets, whatever, but if you've got people copying you, you're doing something's right. If you've got people hating on you, I mean, you've seen so. I reckon if I asked you, hate versus love, actually I ask you, hate versus love from our socials and our pot. What's the percentage for every, have you ever had more than a hundred love messages like, yeah, G did this. I did that. I did this. I'm telling you how many do you love that? I don't like the following. I can cut. I can't follow. How many water fuck with what a dickhead. This is bullshit message. What's the percentage split? Chalk and cheese. Why? Yeah, chalk and cheese, man. 50, 50, 90, 10. 90, 10. 90, 10. 90, 10. So 90% of people are good. I'd like to believe 10% are just idiots or upset or jealous or whatever. So for your listeners, if you are not operating a social media presence across pick your platforms or across all, with tech these days, it's so easy. I don't do it. My team would, but you can go and put it across multiple platforms at the click of a button. You can pre do it. Content becomes a full-time job. It really does. I struggle with it. Like, I don't have time. But content is a full-time job. And you don't necessarily want to be too curated. Just let people know who you are, what you're good at. Give them value. Whether it's, you could be reviewing make up for free if you're in the beauty industry. Just give authentic, genuine reviews of how it is on your skin and how long it lasts and what's it made from? And is it friendly, environmentally friendly? Is it tested? Do you know what I mean? Like, it doesn't matter. So just for the people who talk about that, be yourself. Yeah. Be yourself. Don't over curate it because people will see through that shit. But be prepared to be hated. How do you deal with the hate? I don't. How did you deal with it at the start? Because now you might be used to it. Because you've been dealing with it for a bit. You never used to it. Like I had brokers on, they're going, "Hey, you're an idiot. This is that the other one of my junior credit guys could find some." So I offer a meeting. I'm like, "Yeah, let's jump on a Zoom." There's people at the copying my ads that haven't been doing what I'm doing for 10 years. And don't have a client that paid their loan off in 10 years. Well, as far as I'm concerned, that's illegal. That's false advertising. Show me how you don't say you can. I have customers who have social proof, right? Evidence. And for me, and so the industry people that have a crack, small percentage, they don't have people that genuinely follow their advice and held their hand for five or 10 years to pay off a loan. They just sell them a product. And they think they're really smart and they wear fancy suits and whatever. So I don't really have to deal with it. I hate it because I'm respectful. I'll engage with people. Sometimes you have a bad day or passing family member and you spray someone and go, "Fuck it on me, human being, too. Fuck you, you're a wanker, whatever." Sometimes you have a bad day. "Oh, no need to be aggressive, will you, man?" You fucking started it. If you don't want to throw it, they'll want to rob it. You don't throw it back. But most of the time, guys, like you see some of my comments on your videos. I'm like, "Who hurt you, bro?" You know, or do you need some help, bro? Like, "Who hurt you? What's so bad in your life? That you've got to go attack somebody, I don't like what you're saying. Or I don't like how it's being put to 60 second real. Fuck and grow up." You guys edit your podcast, not me. And he's do some good editing to get thought-provoking content for people to listen to the podcast. Now, there is no monetary benefit to a fucking podcast. You guys are doing society and Australia a service. You're getting the best of the best. All the most interesting. All the most kind. Whatever you're picking, right? And you're getting each side of the argument. And you don't just have one, like I'm a broker in a real, you don't get one. You've had other amazing fucking guests on your show. You're not biased. Yet people will always find a reason to be upset. So for your people that want to go on and get present in social media to build a business, you have to be able to have a thick skin. If you don't have a thick skin, it's going to be very hard in today's digital world to become successful in business. It's not easy. It's not at all. And something you touched on, which I want to unpacked a bit further, was the idea of having some social proof before you start advertising versus advertising? Well, there's content. And then there's paid advertising. So I advertise for when I do my webinars. People go, "Why would you spend money on ads for free?" Well, one, you get to use Meta Facebook Instagram for free because I pay. They don't even like even the arrogance. It's not a free platform. It's one of the world's biggest advertising platforms. So it's like, "Why is it free?" And I'm like, "Well, it is, but there is an agenda. I tell everything for free. I give unconditionally. Then I tell you how if you want to log off now and don't hear a sales pitch, log off. Most people would appreciate that when you tell them in the first two minutes now. I didn't tell you that. And I sat you there for an hour and didn't give you enough information and then told you to pay. I would be pissed off. That would be unethical. That would be immoral. And then I would have an agenda. But I genuinely want to FTB and fuck up the industry because people don't get this level of financial literacy at home, school, growing up. Now, a bit different if you double pay, double pay, or to rack your, you know, you're in the affluence suburb up the eastern coast of Australia. Sure. You might think, you know, boats, that's awesome. We might own a boat if you live there. But not everyone knows this shit. And what I do is basic, yes, I call it the not-so-secret secret, but it's empowering. And you guys get the hundreds, thousands of messages, right? It is empowering for the everyday person in our country. Yeah, 100%. So where should people start if they're working pair-wagy or they're starting out in business? What would you recommend somebody do in terms of coming up with a content strategy, how to market themselves, how to start generating an income so they can start servicing to buy that property, they can buy their investment property. How do people start and succeed? Well, I say job stands for just overbroke, right? And I built a career in banking initially because I didn't treat my job as a job. Fair days work, hard days pay, as my grandfathers say. But I worked Monday to Friday and then I stopped my sporting career because I also worked every Saturday shift that the bank would offer. And they only did that in Shopping Centre branches. That's right, banks used to open on Saturdays. Whoa! I can show them my age, right? And so I used to travel around. It didn't matter which end of the yellow wire or all that. I would go down to Kauramall, I'd go to, like, I would make sure I could work a Saturday trade because I wanted the extra income because I wanted to buy my first home at 21. I know I'm just going to own a home in my family. So, I think job, it can be just overbroke or you can be somebody who just goes to work and you get there in clock on at 9am and you're a clock off at 459. That's not really correct. I know since COVID, I know this is going to be topical here. I know since COVID people have suffered a lot of mental health issues and emotional feelings and distress and people think that they can work from home in their pajamas. But right now for those of you, and some people are really struggling, I get upset because I know people that have severe mental health issues. I find it insulting when someone says they need a mental health day just because they're tired because I get tired too. No, I work too from 8 in the morning until one of your guys was on my masterclass on the weekend. I think I clocked off at 10 past 1 in the morning and I started at 8am. And the people paid for me to teach them from 9 to 5. I went from 8 to 10 past 1 in the morning and I was back at 8.30 the next morning. Because I care and I fucking love it. Now, you want to build, you know, in a job even, you want to build to a position to have an income stream because it's tough to get property. You're going to have to overcome some personal physical, tired days. You're going to have to overcome if you're silly enough to go and get on the piece and have a hangover and you're really tired and sleep deprived. You're going to have to overcome some personal physical things. And you're going to have to overcome some mental barriers and belief systems, right? Because you can't just go through life doing the minimum expect. It'll be like saying, I'm going to go through school and I'm going to get into university but I'm never going to do homework and I'm going to do zero study. What do you reckon the chances are I'm getting a good score to go to uni? I'm going to play in the NRL and win the grand final this year but I'm not going to go to training at all. You reckon you coach and put you on the squad? No matter how good you are. Enjoy that in the dreams. Enjoy that in your dreams, mate. You guys have heard of the All Blacks? They've got their policies, the No Dickheads policy, sweep the Sheds. Great book called Legacy by James Curif, anyone hasn't read it. And some of the best rugby players in the world have never put on an All Blacks jersey because they're shit people. That's a shit people like they don't represent the principles and the passion of the All Blacks through one of the best sporting teams in the world ever. So one, they're going to need to go above and beyond. They're not going to have, they shouldn't be clocking on and clocking off. And if they're in a job, let's pick here. Now give me an industry. You want to talk? Electrician. Electrician. If you're in electrician right now and you're on wagers or in apprentice, Thank you very much. I want to do some content and I want to help build my career. That's going to build my boss's brand. Maybe I get a pay rise. Maybe I'll win them some work. You don't have the risk of being an employer, PI cover, insurance if someone gets a lecture. You've got zero risk. You just rock up to work and get paid, right? Imagine if you're in electrician right now in Australia and you decide to go balls deep on social media content. You ask your boss's permission and say no expectation here. When I start recording a lot of the work we do, can we explain good work versus bad work? What do you think might happen eventually if you stick to your guns? You're going to be known as the people. People would reach out for quiet. You'd be any of the electrician or fuck it. You'll get people are going to start to go, "Ah!" And if anybody who's got an interest in electrical and need an electrical or wants all of a sudden, you could have YouTube videos up that are just examples but they could be short little reels on TikTok or Facebook or Instagram and that could lead people to a YouTube channel on how to install a cast area yourself. How to do this. Now I don't suggest anyone. Please, no one goes stuffing around with electricity at home that isn't licensed right. But very easily as an electrician, you could value add to society giving basic tips and tricks, energy saving, soul, all sorts of stuff that eventually your boss will start getting quotes or people will reach out to you, "Hey, I'm in your area in the hills. How do I get a quote from you? I mean, how many messages do you guys and I get now about, "Hey, how do we work with J?" "Mental." "Hey, fuck it." "Mental." "Mental." "Right?" "And I'm at a point, fortunately, from the social media, I don't take individual customers for every listening. I've understanding the message. Don't send the messages. I appreciate it. Come to my free educational webinars at the end. I sell something. Yes. Go to teacher for free and I want you to do it yourself. Go back to your broker. I'm a Pissie broker off. Go back to them. They did the work. Take the information I teach you. Go to them and execute it. If they tell you that I'm a dickhead and it doesn't work, execute it yourself and I bet you in 90 days you take more of your principal than you did all year with them. It's a statistic I have. Hey, it costs you nothing to change your structure. Then we'll see who the idiot is. So, electrician, go deep, get your boss's permission. Think about what content might be available. Energy saving tips will be great right now. Electricity's gone through the roof, yeah? Okay, you were leaving. Like, "But make it fun." So the one thing I do really well to, who's really going to sit and listen to some fat little fuck like Matt. From 8 or 9 a.m. to 10 past 1 in the morning talking about money. Think about it. There's about 800 people like partners, so it's 350, 400 people in the weekend. That's like 800 people with partners if they're all couples. Except from 8 a.m. 9 a.m. to 1 a.m. Must be doing something entertaining or it must be really good shit. Yeah. So you've got to understand what people don't know or want to know or struggling to understand themselves. It would be my voice. But what happens on the days where you don't want to get out of bed though? Like you fucking like today. So today, so today, a bit of message to me and he said he goes like, "Come in." He goes on the way to mind. And it was like 4.30 in the morning or whatever it was. And I walked my alarm went off and I'm like, "Yeah, sweet." And then he called me as he's been waiting us for five minutes. He goes, "You up and like fuck a fell back asleep." What happens on those days where you just-- Is it feel flattered? He can't fucking do that. Well, let's leave, try to come to VG. But I get it, right? Like you guys come from Sydney to the Gold Coast today. You have big night, listings, client appointments, phones blowing up. It's all urgent, right? So for me, when do I have those days? How often people go? I probably never had it this morning. Yeah. I barely got my voice right now because I went to 1 o'clock the other night. Had it yesterday because it was a Monday. Had it on the weekend when I had some really fucking hideous questions from people that I did 127 live coachings at night and they were the same thing over and over and over. And it was just your numbers instead of your numbers because people were fucking listening. And I lost my shit and yelled at everyone on the week and they're, "Sorry, we're sorry, we get it." Right, human brains are weird things. So I didn't want to get out of bed on Sunday after finishing at 1. I got like four and a half hours sleep and I had to get up and be back here. That's every day. Now-- It still happens in your head. Well, go and fuck it up. Yeah. So you have to have a really fucking really deep-seated why. And when I talk about why, I get people, "Why are you here?" They go, "Fonential freedom." And then all I think when I hear that is fucking brave heart, the arrow in the arm. That's the end of you guys too young. I don't see him very fucking. Freedom. Freedom. You know, like Australians are really bad at motherhood statements. Anyone that lives in Australia, it's like, "I drive a high lux because they're unbreakable." No, it's a fucking TV. Yeah, it was a prank walker from National Tiles. Like, "We all only get our tiles from there. All we all only drive." You know, like, "We hear these jingles and shit like dollar mites to death." So CBA, school banking, yeah. Start with dollar mites. So you bank with them till death. Very hard to get you to go somewhere else. So for me, I know that my why is super, super, super rooted for my wife and I that if we want to raise a family soon, maybe touch wood in the near future, that I would love to be super present through all of that. I.e. not be grinding to jobs. It's a full time job, a part time job. Not be struggling to get out of bed. So, and also my purpose, like I'm very purpose driven that I believe my industry's wrong. It's glorified salespeople. I'm sorry to people that get the shits with that. But you're just selling a product with offset, without offset. You think that you're really smart because that's what you've sold. But yet I go and get the client statements and I actually do my job and look at their offset account they already had for the last year and see they spend everything that should have been in it. They're not offsetting shit. So you're now selling them something that is not in their best interests, which you're getting paid. And they believe that they have this amazing benefit that they will not actually benefit from. So you see, I'm going way deeper instead of just selling alone. It's like, you've got to go deep. How did you go deep, was it going to Tony Robbins, was it reading a book, getting a mentor? For me, person, it was all of the above. I very happily openly say I used to be a shit bloke. And I'm happy to say that. When you say shit bloke, what do you mean shit bloke? Six million dollar house on the water, for raries, fucking out of you, fancy cars, fancy clothes, wanky wines at dinner. Like when I say shit bloke, I define that as coming from nothing because of housing commission kid, I wanted everything. Why? I didn't get everything from doing the wrong thing. I just worked seven days. I didn't go to birthdays. I didn't go to weddings. I sacrificed. But then I also was very open in that, hey, I'm doing really well. Look at me. Look at me. If that makes sense, it's all ego guys. And that's why I've preferred living in Queensland and the Gold Coast. The sun comes up early, mad, exercising, not lately, but most of the time most of the people here are. And they're in bad early Sydney. I'll work till 10, 11 o'clock at night. Then you have the late night dinners in the city. The drinks come out. Everyone's in their flash suits compared to up like, it's different strokes for different folks, right? And different times of their career. There's a really key point in here. Who you are as a human being and where you are as a human being is directly correlated. Right? Who you are tracked right now and what you're going through good or bad, it's all you. So the people that I attracted when I was that version of myself are a direct reflection of me, not them. Now, a lot of the people that were in my life then almost all are not in my life today. That's powerful. That makes sense. Yeah, big time. And everything that went wrong in my life, I now, not then, I now acknowledge that was me. So I testified in an assic case and got attacked online with fake bullshit. That's a reflection of someone I chose to work with who did the wrong thing and I attracted someone who had done the wrong thing. That's a reflection on myself. So yes, I've done some Tony Robbins. First few times I went, I'm like, fuck, Tony Robbins, what's this fucking guy going to teach to get you in it? You know, like, I was a fuck knuckle pump. I was an absolute nugget. And one time I went and I was like, fuck, I'm built for feed, not for speed. And next minute I'm fucking asked to the grass, he's in the air like I just don't care. And I'm having a good time and I'm shaking my shit and it was not pretty. But I'm having a great old time and then next thing you know, we're in, it's pitch black in Sydney and when shoes are off and we've been taught to walk on fire. Yes. Yes. I looked at my wife and went, yeah, making me look at my wife and this is some cult like yeah, yes, yes, it's an off-way outside and I'll never, actually never ever, ever forget right. It's a good one too because it's a real example. Walked on fire and as I turned around, there's like 8,000 people there, right? You're not expecting them to know someone's straightaway. And by all, out of the stadium, there's fucking 10 rows of fire out there to walk on and I've walked on further and I turned around and looked and here is this tiny beautiful little woman, Mary Cedarados. Mary paid her loan off in one and a half years. She's a client of mine. I got tickets for her to go to this event. And Mary happens to be there and she's, "I'm in Mary! Look at me!" And she just fucking looked up, she was freaking out. And she fucking powered across that fire going over the biggest hug ever with back my wife. She was just fucking meant to. I got it on my Instagram, one of my highlights on Tony Robbins years ago. So everything that you have going on right now, that I have going on right now, is a direct reflection of us, nobody else. There is no fucking sad story that I was a victim of domestic violence when I grew up and I was a housing commission kid, cry me a fucking river. All right, you can have two kids at a identical twins. One is an alcoholic and a drug addict and one will never drink and touch drugs. One will tell you 'cause dad was an alcoholic and a drug addict and the other one will tell you they don't touch it because of the same reason. It's all us guys, always and girls listening, it's all us. So everything that's going on is a reflection of who we are, who you attract, who you associate with. - So we've received a lot of DMs and to be honest, with you G, there's a lot of DMs from a lot of people that are struggling, big time. - Financial. - Financially. - Yeah. - Emotionally, a relationship wise, it's actually crazy the level of detail, some people have actually given into their lives. And the stories I get of people struggling, happy, sad, it's pretty raw to be honest. - It is, it's fucking raw man. And my question for you is what would be your advice to those people in that stage of their life where they don't really see a way out? Like their repayments are fucking high, they're going through breakups, divorces and all that sort of shit. What do you say to those people at those hard points? - Yeah, and looking up in there, I've been married and divorced and all sorts of stuff, lots of debt and only bankrupt. Been there myself like genuinely. And we come back to the Y thing later, like those days you can't get out of bed because this correlates to that. - Coralates. - But the dark moment. - Yeah, yeah, and I've been there, and I've been there, absolutely. Your Y has to be bigger than Y not. Yeah. 'Cause these people are, now their Y is still there, they still get out of bed every day, they're breathing, they're above ground, it's a good day. You open your eyes, you can see here, your dry, your warm, you got running water out of a tap, you're in the top couple of percent in the world, really. So, why not? But they're, and obviously they're still going, they're reaching out in there, a lot of what we do, and I'm not blaming people here, but I now acknowledge when I got into debt, or when I was in bad relationship, all of these things were partly or wholly. Some people are not going to want to hear this, but if they want help, it's up to them, or wholly or partly, it's attributed to me. Now the day, the very first day that I acknowledged, many, many years ago, and I'm talking maybe, what do we, 2024? Maybe 2017, 18 maybe, really, when I got into 2017 maybe, when I acknowledged it was all me, and I had to own my shit, that's when I started to be able to work on me. Because we're all broken, right? But there are people out there that, you know, truly have done nothing wrong, they're good human beings, that they get up, they go to work, they're a good partner, they're a good parent, good friend, and their partners done something wrong, and now they can't pay them all gauge, and they've got debts in credit card liabilities, or their partners become a gambler. To those people, there's the why and why not. And you have to know clearly where you're going, right? Like I very clearly know where I'm going. What if you don't know where you're going? You need some help to find it. How? Different, I say my course is money, money mentor, not money magician, also not marriage mentor. I've gone through some crazy shit for people from my life experience, right, I could do a Netflix documentary on it, it's a saga, it's great, it's bad. I'm not equipped with those skills to help people, but sometimes I have, just out of trying to be a good human being, or feeling their pain, et cetera. I think it's really, really important that they seek help. So whether it be a relationship that needs some couples therapy or counseling, whether it be financially, they need some financial counseling or guidance, not from friends or family, but I think it's important they seek help. And there's plenty of help out there these days. There's plenty of free phone numbers you can call, you know, kids help, lie, and you've got 1,800 respect. There's a gizoo and a thing, lifeline, like there's so many things that you can at least call and reach out to someone just to help work through it, because the old saying, "You're in your head, you're dead." It's like buying a new home, you're over-analysed at right, good one, bad one, all sorts of disasters and stuff. So if you're in your head, you're dead. It's really, really important that they get help, they reach out to somebody and they work through it. Do you still get in your head in these days? Yeah, a little bit, a little bit, but not as much as I did back in the day. I mean, as you scale any business or anything in life, bigger problems, bigger rewards, bigger rewards, like it varies. So when you were when I was working at the bank and I was a bank manager or a lending manager, my problems consisted of the bank's problems and the budget, but once I went home, no problems, I called off, right? But I didn't, I still take my work phone home to respond to emails and messages and calls. And that's where not saying everyone's got to take their work home, like you've recently been talking about passing laws that you can't, you know, business owners and managers shouldn't contact staff outside of hours and stuff. Wow. I'm like, wow, that's interesting to me because I know that I was a lot better than my peers when I was banking or broken because they would clock off at five o'clock and I would go to an appointment at six o'clock and eight o'clock at someone's home. Yeah. So I would rather deal with the person that can help me when he's tired than the person who just clocks off and has a job. You don't have a life too, but I'm not wired that way. I'm really not wired that way. So, G, in terms of competition, you say you don't see your competition, but. I always say competitions for the weak mind. Yeah, you can compete yourself to people. So I like to collaborate, like some of the best brokers in Australia and agents and stuff. Some people, I don't know when your podcast have reached out to me that were other guests and likewise I've done stuff with because people that are really good at what they do don't necessarily deem people in their industry as competition. Right? People copy my ads word for word. I don't see them as competition. They're literally six to seven years behind me. They're copying today what I've been doing, but I'm already seven years ahead of them and have all this other stuff I'm working on that's about to publish. They're using my old shit thinking it's going to be a game changer and I'm like giggling away in the corner and I'm like oh, how cute. So I'm more collaborative, right? It's good to compete as far as like this whole fucking kids get a participation ribbon and all this sort of like if you're not first you last, let's be very good. So what about Kevin Sonario? He works in a patch, Kellyville. There's only X amount of properties that sell a year and he's competing against other agents. He's now number one for that suburb but when he was starting out, what's your perspective on people where it's like competing to get number one? I measure, yeah. So like literally the trophy over there last week I got the number one mortgage broker in Australia from rate my agent, which for real estate agents, a big deal, right? Like you are the best in your area or you're not based on independent, genuine, verified RP data reviews. They do that for brokers. I'm three from three, baby. Right, three years in a row and guess what? Now I'm retired. I don't write loans anymore after this year. I've gone the triple I'm done. So it's good to measure, yeah. And like I was competitive previously, top 100 broker, I was 13, I was 16, I was third, I was said, but let's be clear, like a top 100 broker in Australia is based on volume. And most businesses can just put through the deals as the one person, which is what most of the top 100 are and we have huge teams underneath this that do the admin. So perceptions, reality, competition, it's important but it depends on how you're wired. I am quite competitive by nature, if that makes sense. Like I like to win, I like to be the best at what I do. If I don't think I'm gonna be the best at it, I won't do it. Like for me, like you give you a good example. I say I'm gonna get fit and healthy, I'm doing 75 hard. I'm gonna maybe go in an amateur body building competition. I'm gonna get, you know what I mean? Like, or I'm not doing it at all. Like I have, I personally have to be the best. But I do think that people can take competition too far and ego becomes more important to us than competition as opposed to collaborating. And you guys have seen that with messages of people in the industry, everyone thinks they know better. That's purely ego. Like we can all take a distaste to what each other does or how we do it or how we say it. But at the end of the day, my market segment and what my purpose and passion is, is completely different to some of the people I upset. So is there any competition between us at all? Is it zero? So what is the purpose of us competing with each other? Because if they think they're competing with me, I find that it moderately entertaining because I'm over here doing basic stuff for the everyday family. I'm not selling, like I wanna educate and empower for free. Then if you like that, and you got value from it and literally made money or saved money, from my free content back to the socials thing, then of course you're going to want to pay me for more information. And if I can do that risk-free with the money back guarantee, who am I competing with? No one, myself. What about if you're. What about if you've just. There's a few questions that have come through, just started our business, whatever it may be, and they're trying to get ahead of their competition. Do you believe you have to put in the extra hours or artwork on the. To gain that market? Get out, smart them. Get out, smart them, end out, work them. Okay. Like, do you do open homes only on Saturdays? On Sundays as well. Who else does open homes on Sundays? Nobody else. Exactly. And you know how I know that? Why I ask that? I've seen it on your socials. Yeah. And I've seen hundreds of pairs of shoes at the door or four pairs of shoes at the door like, hey, and get me. Baby, where do you want opens on a Sunday when the other agents are not? Now, to me, it makes sense. A lot of people go shopping on a Saturday. They might only be able to get to a certain amount of open homes. If you have other homes or homes again open on a Sunday, you give the opportunity for that prospective purchaser to view their new home. And that's doing right by your vendor as well, right? You have a niche. Same as if you're a property manager. I don't understand property managers work Monday to Friday. If I'm a tenant and I rent and I'm a. However, typically tenants will probably work Monday to Friday, won't they? In any job. Whatever it may be. It makes fucking zero sense to me that property managers only do inspections Monday to Friday. Think about it. If you're a property manager and you're listening to this and you did open homes or inspections on Sundays and Sundays, fuck and hell, you would change the game. Change the game. Or outside of business hours. Whether there is credit or merit to working or out working a period. Now, how long do you think you have to out work or put in those extra hours before you can have some level of balance or freedom of some sort? They're just wearing it me. Balance. Fuck, wrong person, the interview, bro. Look, I think that once you start to out work, outperform, succeed, win, whatever you want to call it, you'll become addicted. Yeah. You know, any good real estate agent, finance, broker, teacher, professor, anyone that's out working out a cheat, I don't know when it went, all right, I'm number one. I'm going to stop now. I'm going to be number nine. Yeah. They're not one. They didn't get to number one. Yeah. It's like when people say, "Get a lot of classes. I just want to be able to retire." Young rich and free. I'm like, "What is this a fucking rap song?" You know what I mean? Like, "Fire, financial independence, retire early fucking grow up." I don't know anybody that's successful that outworked, outsmarted, out delivered, out content, out, you know what I mean? Like, out energy. Got out of bed on the shit days when there was no reason to because they could have stayed in bed. I don't know anyone who's done that for a length and period of time and then just stopped. That's their broken burnt out, something drastic happened. Because once you do that, it's ingrained in you. Yeah. It's hard to go back. How could you? Well, that's what I'm dealing with. This is actually one of the things I'm dealing with the coach right now is he goes like, "You've pushed so hard, but you're mentally in this space where you just continue least, continuously cycling." But dear love it. Yeah, do. Is it worth it? That space? I don't know. It wouldn't be sitting here if it isn't. The different strokes for different folks, right? You could say, "Now I'm going to do X amount this year and I'm into my health and fitness and I'm going to go do meditation and you know all these things that I cannot do, right?" I've got mainly just got to a point now when you're home gym where I can sit in my sauna every night and put some meditate like sauna music on and try to have no phone in there because it gets too hot and usually read 10, 20 pages of a book until I start to sweat and the pages will get soggy and I throw it out the door and then, "Okay, cool, I'm in." And I try to listen to the birds chirping and the rain falls raining, "Fuck and hell, I'm like, it's really hard, right?" That's a new thing for me because it's a weakness. Now the reason I'm focused on weakness is because I'm strong in a lot of other aspects. So if you think of a wheeler life or a pizza right, there's all the different slices to try to even them out and where do you rate yourself, like for everyone. If you went family relationships, money, wealth, health, my health, not as good so I'm about to go to America to do all these health tests right in a couple of weeks. So I'm prioritising it but at different times I'm prioritising different things. I'd love to think I could be a ten in every aspect of my life but yet, or give another example, it was my wedding anniversary on Saturday and Beck helped fund the business, she's the brains. We booked that master class for hundreds of people on our wedding anniversary for getting it was our wedding anniversary months ago. That's so funny. It's crazy right? So I didn't get home until 145 AM on my wedding anniversary. I'm a lovely wife, stayed awake to talk to me when I finished that night. Hey babe, I'm exhausted, I'm going to go to bed blah blah blah. I'm like well I'll sleep in the spare room because I'm going to get home at 145 and I'm going to get up at 536 o'clock and I don't want to interrupt you, you need some sleep. Thanks so much. But we're going away this weekend. So the day is the day, right? But that doesn't mean there's a successful entrepreneurial, dedicated, passionate couple. It doesn't mean we didn't have a wedding anniversary. We're celebrating it this weekend. It's about us. It's not about anyone else or the date or anything like that if that makes sense. So yeah, look competition can be healthy, it can be unhealthy. Has it been unhealthy in your life? Yeah, it's me so, I definitely say so. And I think of some of the feedback I get from other people now, I think it's unhealthy for them because when you get to the top of any tree, everybody likes to compare themselves to you and hunt you down. Whereas I'm like cool, like three from three, broker of the year, had it from the finance brokers association of Australia, had it from the Australian broker. You're like, "We'll go and rate my agents for real estate agents, not for brokers." Well cool, but go get me a thousand, nine hundred, a thousand, genuine reviews over a couple of years linked to a transaction on RP data that the customer tells the story and then bitch to me, it doesn't matter where it is, it's there, right? Whether it's Google reviews, whatever it is. So I actually said differently now because I'm at a different end of the spectrum. I used to actually, as a young finance guy, look and respect and look up to and go, "Well, I want to get to where those guys and girls are. There's some phenomenal people in my industry and I would hunt that down and I aspired to be there and I got there." But then I never picked on those people. I never attacked them, I never picked on them, I aspired to be like. And I chased and I compared and I competed and that was healthy for me. But I think it's unhealthy for some people. I think you've got to be really careful with it. One of the questions that's reoccurring from an Instagram story from yesterday is advice for young people, whether it be young woman or young guy, looking to say for their first investment property, best way to do it. Bank of mum and dad. Yeah, I get this one so much. I talked about parental guarantees and one of the other podcasts we did together. What if that's not a. You know that's not like you're working the more. Go look in the mind. Yeah, look. Here's the big one. They all keep asking me some sort of help. Do what I did, do what our parents and grandparents did. Share accommodation, live with family or friends. I'm talking like basic bitch furniture. I'm not bendy-roggically like I'm saying. Like I'm very simple. You don't need to go out and get a brand new Harvey Norman interest free store card and get Nick Scali lounger. Go to the fucking. No, go to some Vincent's to Paul. Yeah. I'm not a fucking seriously. You don't need to go and get flash fucking Chesterfield, Herringbone. Go and get some basic shit. When I slept on a mattress on the floor, I didn't have a bed frame when I was like 18, 19 out of home for a while. You don't have it like you have to go without the problem we have in society right now is everybody believes they deserve. You look at the political spin we say the Greens and that's always about votes. We're in a political year, right? Everything you hear about policy this year is just to win votes. It's not to actually change and make any effect. It's to win votes in the media. It's all it is. So for these young people and I do get it it's hard in their store if there's no bank or mum and dad. If there's no family that you can move in with, then you probably need to look at share accommodation. I know heaps of young couples that have come to me for help that actually go and rent a room with another couple. They have a room and a bathroom for $253 a week. Instead of renting for 800 a week. Now why? They can bank $500 a week. Also, they don't need a protect for leap or roll legs. They don't need a new tag or a Mont Blanc, like a brand. They don't need these fucking Gucci belts or Louis Vuitton belts. They don't need to go to Calabar to get a suit for work. They can go to the basic fucking suit store, like a suit. They don't have to go get RM with them. They can go and get a pair of boots from Kmart and polish them and kill them. And this is the biggest problem, one of the biggest problems is society. Every young person that's reached out to me, you would have got hundreds or thousands, I get hundreds of them every week. And I tell them these things about seven out of ten respond. Right? In the 70%, 30% just ignore me completely because I told them some hard home truths about sacrifice and delayed gratification. They're like, "Oh, but I've got this many kids and I've got this guy." Like, they're giving me all the why not. Remember I said the why and the why not? The why has to be big here. Why not? Well, it's just easy to just keep winging and renting. Rent is so fucking dear now guys, like so dear, it's not funny. Yeah. Cooked. Like, median rental price I think last week in Sydney was about 780 units, about 750. For all of the end of last year units and houses, median rent in Sydney was 750 for both. Units cheaper to buy but you pay the same rent as a house. Absolutely insanity, it's fucking hard, right? Very hard. It's on my YouTube with Dr. Wilson every week. If anyone wants to know about rents, values, check out the money mental podcast after you both sides. But they need to sacrifice. There is no beating around the bush. And if there is no banker mum and dad, there is no parental guarantor. But you can buy now with co-ownership with the government. You can buy with as little as 2% deposit as a single parent and 5% deposit as a young or old or any first home by now. My take on this having to do it all myself, no parental guarantors, no nothing. If you can't save 2% to 5%, then you did not, you were not prepared to make sacrifice to own a home. That's the truth. I'm sorry, that's the truth, right? Anyone doesn't want to hear that, then you're not ready. When you come back and listen to this in a year, two years, three years, and you go, I'm going to go and save, I'm going to go and rent with my friends, girlfriends, from mates, whatever. Go and rent a room in share housing. Split the bills in share housing. Don't have the brand new iPhone on $129 a month plan times you and your partner. Go get a second hand phone that's a couple of iPhones ago or whatever that does the same job from bloody the second hand store and put it on prepaid. And spend $40 bucks a month, I'm down shit right. You can't save your way to success, but unless we want to sit here and talk about how to earn more money, well that's easy, easy said, then done. And how would you earn more money? A big question that came through was, do we buy a property or start the business, which one first? Property first always. And why? Look, everybody wants to be an entrepreneur, everyone wants to be an influencer, nobody wants to do the apprenticeship anymore. We can't get trades in Australia, people change jobs, I look at fucking resumes every day. People change jobs more than their undies. A boss raised their voice, they want to meet a work until 5.25, not 5pm to fuck and grow up. Seriously, right? It's changed so much since COVID that everybody wants to do as little as possible and get as much as possible. That's not how the world works. That's a participation ribbon. Not how the world works, that's where competition can be healthy. So unless you can just go earn more money or you're prepared to work overtime or get a second job, all that sort of stuff, then you're going to have to make sacrifice where you live, what you eat, like meal prep. You can actually meal prep really healthy when I do it and get meals down to 4 to 5 bucks. Don't believe me how to meal prep companies sell them for $7 because they make them at 4 to 5 bucks. And so why property first over the business? So, and okay, if you look at the percentages of businesses that actually fail within the first 12 months, then 24 months, then 36 months. It's so catastrophically bad, like tiny amount of businesses succeed. And in Australia, we have a problem. Taxes are a success fee. The only people telling you they're not paying any tax or broke people. You know why until you become Kerry Packer and you've got the resources to spend hundreds of thousands or millions of dollars on tax planning and advice and internationally, you're paying fucking heaps of tax. I pay fucking heaps of tax. And anyone out there is like, oh, I don't pay any tax, you're fucking broke. You know why? Everything you want. You spent and claimed as a deduction. That's it. You didn't use some fucking wizardry or some special tax planning program. Your account isn't better than anyone else. You fucking spend everything you earn. That's it. True story. It's fucking true. You spend everything you earn. My suits are deductible, even though they may not be a logo on them. Oh, my dry cleaning is deductible. Oh, my coffee is deductible. You spent everything you earn. You're a plumber and your wife drives a ranger over and the ranger over is in the business. Don't know what plumbing your wife does in the ranger over for the plumbing company, but you claim in it, right? So we have this massive misconception in Australia that you can just live out of your business and not declare anything profitable. Now, if you start the business first, right? And they go, "Okay, I'm going to go to a business." Well, how many businesses lose money for the first two financial years? Most. On paper. Accounting was most. Yeah, on paper. Now, banks like typically prefer for a good deal. Two years tax returns. So if you're going to start a business and go two years at a loss and not be able to show any financials, so it's going to take year three and four to show four years to show two years profit and taxable income. What do you think the Australian residential property market will do value-wise in four years time from today? A lot. A lot, right? 10-20% easily. It's average over the last 36 years for capital cities has been 6.8% per annum. Year on year on year. If a property grows 7% per annum, year on year on year for 10 years, it will double in value. So why do I say property first? If you can get into property with 2%, 5%, as little as possible, as long as you make the payment, no one can take it off you. So if you can get into property, property will build the little unit, a little house, what are that property will build the foundation for you to leverage to borrow. I know people where you can't just go get a business loan now with no security. You can buy McDonald's and not own the land. You need property as security. You can borrow some money unsecured against the business, but fuck all since the day. You need property. Look at most of the world's billionaires. McDonald's is it a food business, a toy company, or is it a real estate developer? A real estate. Come on. So business is a great tool. Like I make money in my business, but my real wealth is made in property, and that's my balancing act. Now there are people out there that start a business and say it's the most amazing tool in the world and blah, blah, blah, blah. It is if managed correctly and successful, but I don't know many businesses that make money in the first two years, and if that don't fail. I get hundreds of people, thousands of them are choosing their night webinars, and these people are all showing nothing on their tax returns. I just want to buy property because they know that's how they can make money. We'll start paying some fucking tax and stop spending. Like is the best one? Do you use zero in your business or my or my book and they're like, "Yeah, yeah." And then do you pay us the guy we take money and I said, "What software do you use to manage your personal finances?" They go, "We don't." They go, "What budget do you have? Oh, we don't." So you're telling me, you have all this risk in business, they're getting paid or not, all this exposure, big win, big reward, sure. You use software to manage that, but then when you give the money to yourself, you just tap tap a room and live in a zoo. It doesn't make any sense. So it's really easy to fuck up a business. It's very hard to fuck up a property once you got it. That's my, you know, it's very hard to run business so to people. Most people are better suited to having a job. It's not like it is. It's a lot harder than what it looks. That's for sure. I open my phone, I'll have a fucking 300 messages on Instagram, 50 on TikTok. It's full on. You get, if you're good at what you do, you get peppered from every angle. And you also can be bad at what you do and get peppered from every angle. So I think for people, yeah, for me, I would say steady job, property once you're into property, maybe explore the business, but understand that banks are not going to let you refinance into your show profits and tax. You know, I mean, yeah, there's low-doc or lie-doc lending and you can get your accounts to sign off on certain things we serve. But they're really expensive. You got to know what you're doing. Like, yeah. Not many people know low-doc like Doc. Look, I hear all the time and people listening to this, please be aware, I hear all the time the new gimmick that's floating around again through some buyer's agents and brokers is buying properties in a trust because there's no serviceability. Well, the fuck, if you can't afford it in your personal name, why should you buy it in a different structure? Think about it. You can't even answer, hey, Graham, can I buy this house and I go, you can't afford it. But you can buy it in a trust structure. The bank won't look at your income. Is that not the definition of fucking dumb? And then whose faults it going to be if they lose the property because they can't afford it? There's. Well, they're going to blame the broker and the agent, but they knew they couldn't afford it. So just guys out there, please be careful. Like, if you can't afford it, changing the structure to get it approved doesn't mean you can afford it. Hmm. Just means you can get a loan for it. Doesn't mean you can afford it. So yeah, be careful. Be careful. So another question that keeps that was reoccurring G's, what happens if you have to start clean slate, no properties, new business? I did 2012. What did you do differently? Everything. So 2012, married, divorced, met my wife now, at about 248 grand worth of debt, like I'm like fucking disaster in the separation. Credit cards, personal loans, like you know, as a fucking disaster. And yeah, that's actually how infinity was built in 2012 and launched 2013. It was through our ownness. That's why it works so well, right? What I teach people, I actually, these young people, and all people, basically, what do you do? You've got no family support. No, I had nothing. We literally had nothing. And guess what started us? We bought a one bedroom unit for $200,000 off the plan. You know what that risk was? We needed 20 grand. We didn't even have 20 grand. We had to borrow our family and friends and we had like some money. We had to borrow our family and friends and make the decision to pay a bill or actually pay a deposit. Yeah. And we ended up with six or seven of those units because while they were getting billed, I knew they weren't worth two, they were worth two 25 and they were worth two 50. And then we had six or seven and we sold them all when they were billed and that got a set up. And then we bought a property for about 900, 800, 900 grand, import and inquiry. And it was waterfront property and it was strategic because waterfront works. It was a little three bedroom duplex on the water and port and quarry. And we only had it for a year or two. Then we bought in Bela Vista waters in Sydney. We became a big shot. Yeah. So literally like in 2016, we bought a 6.1, 5 million dollar home, in Bela in Eban, Crenada on deep water. That was all wank and that was all ego and I realised the year or two later that I was a fucking moron and we sold it. So different strokes for different folks but I think it's important that people keep in simple. For me, properties always work. I hope bricks and mortar, it's insured, you can live in it, you can rent it if you don't live in it. It just makes sense. Like properties, it's on my podcast with Doc people who can list of you guys have seen it. Properties never crashed in Australia. The last 40 years we had reliable data, the capital city median chain. The biggest corrections being 5.5%. I share that slide all the time. And after we've never had two consecutive years as well, like of crash, it's like correction, I get excited because everyone freaks, I buy a lot and then it jumps 8%, 10%, we drop 5.5 and the next year it grew like 8 or 9 and Sydney say. So, yeah, I think, I know it's hard for people like rents, everything, okay, put this way, everything's hard. So I want to get fit and healthy. Yeah, I'm going to do these health tests in America, cancer screening, do all this stuff. Everything's hard. Guys, everyone listening, there's a message in the book, choose your hard. It's hard to rent, it's hard to own. It's hard in business, it's hard to have a job. No matter what you do or don't do, it's fucking hard. It's hard for Kevin to get out of bed this morning. Bed is here. Choose your hard, yeah? Like, everything's hard. They're all saying, I do like saying if it was easy everyone would be doing it. Like I do actually enjoy that, right? It's fucking hard. It's fucking hard. But choose your hard. Your head is hard. It might be 30% of Kevin's hard because you're happy at that. Does that make sense? Do you want to be number one buyer's agent in Australia next year at the awards? No, it doesn't interest me. Okay, it's a wink factor anyway, right? It's going to be, well, it's not for the award, but I want to be the number one go to agent in Kellyville. Yeah? Definitely. He's there. Right? But then what, it says a really cool thing. Actually you had Toby on your show. Toby says, and then what? Always. And then what? It depends. And then what? So why are you doing it? Well, it depends. Are you building a business to sell? Are you building a business to keep? Am I building a business to sell? Am I building it to keep and hand down to children if I have children? Okay, I'm building a business to keep. And then what? Does it like, so everything you do depends on what you're trying to achieve. And then how hard it is is based on what you're trying to achieve. And once you get there and you know number one, and then what? Now what? What now? What now? Well, it funds, it funds the developments, funds investments. See, now he's got a really good service ability. Because let's say it has three million income. That's pretty good servicing, right? Versus other people that don't have that servicing. Well, the way that I see it is, I'm going to work my ass off for the next couple of years. Live a few years like most people won't, but then I can live the rest of my life like most people can't, right? Bingo. And that's what I'm doing. So. And it will change along the way. Yeah. And I'm going to spend a couple of years of my life like no one else is prepared to, if they don't have kids, you don't have commitments, you can just be a worker, and you can commit and give back to the charity and the orphanages. And that's another thing too. There's a lot of people out there killing it. They're giving zero back guys. It's going to be very clear. You don't give back to promoter. You didn't go build a website saying, "Hey, I'm this amazing charitable organisation. No one would know unless we were connected to you. You're not doing it for brand. You're not doing it for tax. You're doing it in a different fucking country, right?" So it's really, really important when someone says, "I'm going to spend a few years of my life, like most people are never prepared to, to spend the rest of my life like no one could ever imagine." I don't know if you're saying, "On one of the videos and the reels we did about budgeting, someone commented on a watch I was wearing." And the watch I'm wearing actually comes in a little set and it was a gift and it's $4,000. What's funny, the persons probably don't talk about budgeting wearing a $4,000 watch. Fuck you. It's a fact that you know the watch is worth $4,000 yet made that comment. It says, "More about your ego than mine. I got that as a gift and I'm successful. Why am I not allowed to celebrate my success and it's okay for you to pick on successful people because you're a failure or because you deem that you're more successful than me and took the time to pause the video 36 times until you can see what the watch was. Grow the fuck up." "You could have been wearing a $4,000 watch if you wanted it." "I could have literally, I could wear a $4,000 watch but that's ego, but am I no?" So is it not okay for somebody who's successful to wear, to own something nice or to wear it? And by the way, motherfucker, I got there by budgeting because in 2012, I had $248,000 of debt. So now what's your fucking problem? So you've got to remember guys, no matter what we do, choose your heart. It's hard to help people. It's hard to get attacked by people. It's hard to do nothing. Just let them go. No matter what we do in life, it's fucking hard. Choose your heart. It's all probably a dreamy thing. Massively, but. So I'm off to America in a few weeks. Also, Kev's going to experience something, right? Where he goes, "Right, I want to make X amount of $1,000. It's going to fund this. It's going to fund that. I'm going to do this. I'm going to be number one." I don't think that he's going to stop because I was just like him. That's probably why we get along a little bit, right? So when I was 30, 29, 30, now 41, I was wired that way and I had nothing. Does it look like I've slowed down? No. He's sped up. I was sped up. He said, "I'll spend a few years of my life like now. It's prepared to. A few years. Fuck, 40, that was 12 years ago, boys." That's a bit more than a few. Do you feel you're stuck in destination addiction? Hey. Do you feel that he can get stuck in the destination addiction? I think it's an addiction for people, whether it's healthier or unhealthy. But you know what? You can get stuck in being broken, sad and miserable a little bit. Choose your heart. I know. Choose your heart, right? Choose your own adventure. That's right. I've been in hard, hard. Do I remember growing up in terrible circumstances also. I remember going out with friends as a young bloke and going, "Oh, how cool this one I had no money." Nobody was there to buy me a drink. I walked to the train station. There was no train so I slept on the train bench at 18 years old. I had a pissing down rain. You grow up, you mature. Shit happens. But choose your heart. It's hard to be broke. It's hard to be wealthy. It's hard to try to remain wealthy. It's hard to try to break free. It's choose your heart. Bigger money, bigger problems, guys. That's the truth. Just to go back for a second, the people that really are struggling first home. Look up all the grants, right? We might pop some of the links up here in the screen in the editing and pop in the show notes, etc. There's 2% deposits for first home buyers or divorcees. There's co-ownership. Victoria doing co-ownership now as well. WA do a co-ownership. A lot of you might have to relocate. I mean, let's be very clear. Melbourne and Sydney incomes are about the same, yeah? Melbourne property is a fucking slither of Sydney's property. We'll have to have one of the biggest recoveries in this world. Australia because it was like the most locked down city in the world. I know that's a long distant memory, but it wasn't long ago. And at the moment, it's still underperforming. So if you could earn the same money in Victoria that you can earn in Melbourne, that you can earn in Sydney, but you can buy a brand new apartment with the first homeowner's grant or co-ownership for $4,500 grant, brand new. You got a gym in your building. You don't need to join the gym for $560 a week. You got to sit, like choose your heart. Maybe you need to relocate for work and lifestyle and get into the market. And then two, three is lady, you love it. If you hate it, maybe you come back to Sydney to your family. I think there's this misconception too that everything's well I grew up in Crenulla. I deserve to live in Crenulla for the rest of my life. Not unless you earn Crenulla income. Yeah, you might have to go to Central Coast, Blue Bay. You know, you might have to go to Woolen Gong, Shell Hart, like different strokes for different folks, but choose your heart. And if you're not prepared to choose your heart and stick to it, you might have to relocate. That's not fair. No, that's life. Life's not fair, guys. Life's not fair. Life's not fair. It's life. But I can tell you, however, this conversation in 10 years time, he won't have stopped to live the rest of his life like other people can't. He'll still be going. Like I'm still going. And that's off to me. I'm very proud of him. Like he's really smashed it and committed. Like he hasn't deviated. He stuck to the plan. Even though I've seen him, the struggle he's had to go through to get there. He's not gone off. Yeah, but I find you guys intriguing and from both sides of the aspect of, you're doing really well, but you're doing it in a different way. You quite measured in your approach. You're like me. You're fucking balls to the wall, bad out of hell. I sleep. I'll sleep when I'm there. You know, like this is you and yeah, yeah. And what's important to each of you are somewhat different. Yeah. That's when I talked about your wiver. She why not. Yeah, your wiver. She why not and pick your heart. Doesn't mean either of you are right. Yeah. People would attack if Kevin comes really, really prevalent on social media. And you did as well to they're going to attack you for different things. Fuck mother Teresa gets slagged off on Facebook. You know what I mean? Like he can't win. He can't win. You cannot win. So pushing that aside, because let's not, let's not give the trolls too much energy. What else do we get? What are the current themes from people? I want to know how to make a million bucks. A million bucks. I want to know the tell me the juice like the actual. How do I make a million bucks? The easiest way I make a million bucks, which I show on my events and earn my free courses is I buy and sell property. And one of our biggest reels with millions of hits and comments from the first podcast was every Australian makes this mistake. When I talked about trying to convert your home full of cash into an investment. And then capping at your service ability, which he wants service ability. You know what I like? So I sold a bought 14. I think I've sold 12 13. I was just on the phone before in the break to an agent got one left in the middle of COVID. Actually, somebody else in a way, so who another agent in Australia said never buy a holiday, let the place like surface paradise. And how do I do? I've seen that. Yeah. So anyway, good guy. No problem. So I went and bought 14 holiday units in surface paradise. That's a great point. Now, I bought one level 58. I bought it for 1.75 mil within a year and a half. I sold it for 2.15. I made $400,000 gross profit. Now, I sold that so quickly. Now, I bought another one. I made 300 200. He's the point. Well, everyone else is out going to work. If I can buy a property and sell it and make $200,000 capital growth, yeah. People learn where they think they pay 50% tax. There's this thing called the 50% CGT discount. So if I sell a property for a $200,000 profit, and I'm an Australian resident for tax purposes, and I've owned it for more than 365 days, that $200,000, $100,000 of it is completely free tax. Yeah. So you're only paying tax on the 100,000, which is 50. If you're, you got to deduct the security and you got to deduct the agent. It's a commission because your cost basis come out of it as well. So I might earn 200,000, 100 goes straight into the bank. Yeah. The other 100, but we're out of the 200, sorry, I got to deduct my stamp. Judy, let's call it 25. My agent's call it 25. My capital gain isn't 200 now. It's 150. And then out of the 150, 75 is cash and 75 is taxed. But I'll get 200 gain to bank that the taxes worked out on the cost base, the asset, the expenses, et cetera. So let's just use this simple number a little bit. Let's just, doesn't make sense. Let's just say I make 200 grand. Yeah. If I buy five properties and sell them the next year. So let's say I'm buying 10 and selling five every year as a job. Come through me. So I buy five, I buy 10 selling five. If I sell five properties and make just 200, I have a saying, I'm greedy because I'm not greedy. People buy and hold and think that's a fucking strategy. Cool. So if I buy and sell these properties and I make a million dollars, right, 200 grand times five properties. I mean, a million dollars, what I slept, did I go to work? The service, the debt. Yeah, but did I have to work? No, you know, it's a separate, it's a third wheel. It's another podcast done with my wife, right? It's a third wheel in our relationship we're both aware of. Yeah. Yeah, it's like the extra person in the, it gets up and goes to work every day times five. Well, times 55, you know, it's better than one, 21. Yeah. So in that scenario, I'm going to make a million dollars by selling those five properties. And ever because don't do that, they'll go up in value. You're an idiot. Oh, never sell people that just buy and hope they go up in Vegas, what they never sell. They're playing monopoly, right? And they get sucked into and this is why people lose money in the stock market. Well, crypto, they get sucked into the fact that it will never go down. And if it ever does because they're skeptics out there saying in the market, it's going to crash good luck, then you're fucked. You only make money if you have the money in the bank. So for me, if I can buy sell, buy sell and I buy more than I sell each year, I constantly have a portfolio to sell. But when I sell one, I buy two because I'm creating service ability by reducing debt. That makes sense. The quickest way is a business or real estate. That's the quickest way to make a million dollars. And people say, million dollars, you know, I say, million dollars, the biggest number you can think of. But we had to make a million bucks. I didn't make a hundred grand. Till we're not. How do you make a million bucks? Like, it's like a business, right? An investment, but you can't out save in a business or a job. It's very hard. It's a huge business. You can't out save the market net attacks. And property values jump in Sydney, Brisbane, Perth, Melbourne. And you're earning $80, 90 grand a year, 60 grand a year, 200 grand a unit attack and then net attacks. You can't out save the market growth on a $2 million home or unit. You got to live if you got to eat. It's the different strokes for different folks. But look, for me, it's real estate. For other people, it's other things. If you look at the ASX, like the All Ordsverse property over the last years, it's pretty dismal. And you can ensure your property. So look for me personally, it's property. I understand it. Some people shouldn't do property. Some people should. Now, you're personally coached by Andy Fressella and Ed Milatt. I'm in a group called Harita. Yep. So I do some stuff with Andy and Ed in America. Now, what would be, what's the best advice you've been given by Andy and Ed? I think that some of the best advice I've ever heard from them. I mean, and they both, both very young and young as well, right? So I think, um, so what do you talk about? If we're talking to Andy, you're listening to Andy. He's pretty ripened tear and blunt. And he really genuinely doesn't care what anyone thinks about him. Like he's just there to give value. And whether you like it or not, that's up to you. Ed's quite measured and controlled in his approach and very calm. And it probably a bit more spiritual, but seems more spiritual. Like they're quite different personalities. Um, I think some of the best things there, Andy's always, I've really taken from him to just be like, you're like your authentic self and just strive for personal excellence. Like that's why I end up doing 75 hard frequently because that's my time to strive for excellence. I need to read books. I need to exercise. I need to not drink alcohol. Like, I mean, let's be face of the Australian way of life is you knock off work and you reach for a drink. Yeah. Like that's not normal. I know we think a people get pissed off listening. And I attract a lot of traities, but it's not normal to knock off work at 330 or 530 and reach for a drink. It's normal because you normalised it. Yeah. I've had a rough day. I needed to crack a bottle of wine. We all had a rough day. Choose your hard. So yeah. What about Grand Cardone since you've met him? Yeah. Grand's Grand in Atlanta are awesome people. Like I remember meeting them backstage for the first time and Grand's really interesting because the first thing, hey, man, how can I help you, bro? I was like, pardon? He's like, like, do you need me to call a bank and help you do a dearly work? You know, like every time I've ever met someone like that in Carboh with Grant in Atlanta with an event, like always asking how I can help you. And again, he's a big, like me. People get cranky, right? Big, brash personality. Right? And I'm like, oh, these dude, like, but He's a fucking good dude. He's like, "How can I help you man?" You find most of these people you meet that have done really well. You talk to them and they all ask how they can help you. They're all in networks and business groups and communities. Like the reason I do that are at Aaritae Business Coaching, which people in the Stoamail may not have heard of, is it's a community. It's a private community. You have to apply. You have to be accepted. You have to pay. You have to be full. We do events, right? We did an event last year in April, which had Goggins, Andy and Ed. David Goggins, Ed Milett and Andy for sale. They come on, right? That event. They talk about it in the morning. Guys and girls, we had to leave this venue cleaner than when we got here in the morning. And I'm talking. I went into the bathroom when someone was on stage. And the three guys that were in there that washed their hair were cleaning benches and mirrors. Like that personal excellence. And I'm telling you that place we had. Do you know that night with a small group of the people there? That venue was cleaner than when we arrived. That's the ethos of striving for excellence and being the best at what you do. It wasn't. And you see this in cultures. If you look at the all black dressing sheds or the Japanese, I think it's the Japanese fans, whereas they clean the stadium after a game. They don't let the cleaners do it. They let soccer and football and stuff like that. So that's where culturally, I think that there's some really good things that people could learn from studying other cultures and beliefs and so forth. It's so true. Japan, I had a partner last year that went to Japan. She's like, "Oh, she's like, it's. We walked, put me in my mom walk past the nightclub, it's midnight." And there's a line of like a hundred people and they're all quiet standing to an arrow. Hold it. Like standing outside of a nightclub at midnight in a row, orderly. Yeah. It wouldn't happen in Sydney. No. No, it's the same as I love whenever I'm in America for business or pleasure, etc. People tend to be typically more friendly. You don't tend to see people having a punch on and all that sort of stuff. I see it on the news the other day. What's that fancy, wanky bar in Sydney? I'll be there's a punch on a scene on social media. Now, America, you probably don't do that because someone will shoot you because you can carry guns in America, right? But even just the thought of that, they don't tend to have that fruck or that ruckus or fruckus. People tend to be a bit more respectful and interactive in society, typically, maybe not on social media. But yeah, I think, look, choose your heart, your wife or your wife or not. Your wife's got to be deeply rooted in why you get out of bed every day. You need to choose your heart, like everything's hard. Staying in bed's hard and being upset and miserable and depressed and broke. Being broke's hard. Being wealthy is fucking hard. Being poor's hard. Being wealthy's hard. It's different problems, right? People go, "Oh, money doesn't make you happy." No, but it can make it a lot easier when your children sick or. It's so true. about my grandmother's early just passed and I had to get down there instantaneously. And I had the financial means and resources to get down there when other people wouldn't have got down there. So, choose your heart. Best business books. Best business books, besides the money mentor. Best business books. I really like a book called The Art of Thinking Clearly. Rolf Debelly, R-O-L-F. Very simple book. The reason I like it. I've read it about six or seven times. The chapters are just a few pages each. So, I'll give you an example. There's a chapter in there called The Sunt Cost fallacy. So, use an example and say, "Nike does a $10 million marketing campaign." And they say, "We're going to do this for 10 years and they're five years in and they've buried $5 million." And they don't have a single dollar of revenue attributed to the $5 million five-year campaign. They're in the boardroom. What's the natural evolution? We've sunk so much time, money, effort. It's cost is five minutes. So, I'm going. It's like a bad relationship. Oh, but we've been together for 15 years. So, the Sunt Cost, maybe only two or three pages is chapter, but it teaches you how the art of thinking clearly how not to get sucked into the Sunt Cost fallacy. That's just an example of a chapter of that book. And because it's only two or three pages, it's something that you can pick up. You can read a chapter. You can put it down before you read something else and get clouded. You can absorb that piece of content. Yeah. I really enjoy that because I'm a Scout Cat. I'm very many, right? So, the power of one, Ralph DeBell is one of my favorites. Ed my Let's book. One more. I don't know if anyone's read that. Is that the new one that he just released? Nothing. Yeah, the new one. If you haven't read it, of 75 Hardee and also Mental Toughness, Andy's new book is a cracker. But Ed's book, you haven't seen it actually, guys. People go to YouTube and you should find somewhere. Ed my Let The Speech that broke the internet about one more. For man, I cry every time. He did it last year, probably for one of the last times. And made I was in tears. Absolute tears as a grown-ass man. Well, it's one of us, a personal question. What advice would you have for Kevin and our self to be able to get in front of an interview people like an Edmoylet or an Andy Frissala? Oh, a big checkbook. Look, guys and girls like that. Typically, they'll reach out to people that they see doing phenomenal things that are lying with them. I mean, you look at Ed my Let's Podcast, he has the best people in the world, right? Yeah. Like Stephen Bartlett from Darius. These guys have the best of the best. And Andy's the same. He won't have anyone on there for fluff. You couldn't buy your way onto Andy or Ed's podcasts. Right? Just forget it. They will only have people on there that they are lying with, I have opposing positions as well and talk that through. But there's people out there, some guys don't, girls don't really want an Australian. Other event promoters and stuff. Some people are so to speak for sale. You can get, you could pay David Boggins to come to Australia. You could pay, like there's a lot of these people come out and speak and do things, but they'd be really fucking expensive. I know I've done a lot of tours with Robert and Kim Kierzaki, right? Rich Dad, poor dad, cash flow quadrant. Now, I know a lot of people in Australia who have paid for Robert to do zooms with them and events with them possibly, you know, and stuff like that or podcasts, etc. I haven't done that. I haven't want to done a paid podcast with Robert because I could, but I think it would be incongruent. Like, you've Robert wanted me on the podcast, I've been on Robert's podcast. Yeah. Really? Yeah. Doesn't need me. So I think for yourselves, you're not, they're trying to do those sorts of things. Again, social media, consistency, work your way up, it takes time. Do the apprenticeship. Same thing. I like that do the apprenticeship, right? Become the tradesman or the tradeswoman and you'll find that if you do the apprenticeship better than the other apprentices, eventually someone will notice you. It's the truth. You know, someone will want to advertise and promote your podcast or they'll want you to be a guest on something. So I would say to continue doing the apprenticeship and do it well and don't stop what you do. You're doing a phenomenal job. You've got some great guests. I love listening to this stuff. So keep doing it and eventually things will fall into place. I went from 23 years in my industry now and 2019, I got approached to speak on stages with Grant Cardone and Gary Vee and Kea Sarky and Sir Richard Branson again. You know, like, it didn't happen overnight but it did happen. Yeah. And it was fucking hard. Choose your hard. There's a question here, Jess. Is she still angry from the weekend? Yeah, geez. Jeans now calm down. Somebody must have been on the masterclass on the weekend, I guess. What happened, mate? Talk us through it. Usually my events when they're two days or live or Zoom or whatever, a nine to five, nine to five. Yeah. And I typically almost always kindly volunteer. Hey, if you can hang around, it's on Zoom. I'll quickly have something to eat for dinner and I'll go to 7, 8, 9, 10 pm. I went till 10 past one. So what do you 8, 9 am start? Went till 10 past one. And I think 127 in a row, life coachings was the exact same thing. Everybody just wanted me to talk or draw their scenario on a whiteboard. And I'm very fucking clear, if you pay attention when I'm doing your scenario, it's going to be slightly different to your scenario. But if you listen to what I told him, you just got the same advice or information to consider. I said, please do not get on and say, hi, Graham. My name's Bob and Mary. We're 38 and 39 years old with two kids in Melbourne. We've got one home and we bought it this year. I can never think they're special. Now our circumstances unique, really unique. If I had a dollar for every time I've heard, our circumstances really unique. For fuck's sake. You pay rates, insurance, electricity, your buy groceries, your buy petrol, you have a mortgage. What's really unique about it? I'm self-employed. So he's half the fucking country. You know, like, these are. You guys have sent around Q&As every now and then on Instagram and I'm fucking brutal. Right? Brutal. Because people just lie to themselves. We're just full of our own shit. We're in our way. We're just. we're sometimes we're just fucking silly. And some more jobs. is to just cut the bullshit. So the problem being, I am quite nice, like I want to help people, right? So I sat there and did another one after another one after another one after another one. There were some really, really good ones. I paid people's homes off live. We did this. We did that people away. You've changed my life. But I was fucking angry. And then the next day, I barely had any voice. I lost my voice and it started again in a Q&A after the economist. And I was like, "Fuck, and that's it, no more." And what was funny is, in five years of running this education, I've never had to take a break. I had to actually leave the building and fuck off for 20 minutes and go for a walk out in the sunlight. Because I was livid at not the stupidity that's not fair, at people's ignorance to listen and learn. So what was happening is no one was listening to anything that was being taught, like on social media. They don't listen to the real you guys created that leads to a podcast. That's what the real is, therefore, here's a snippet of some of the shit that we taught people right for free. They don't listen to that and go, "Oh, I'll go check the podcast." They've vomited into the chat bar, into the comment section of this. That's wrong. Which bit out of the three hour podcast wrong? Or just the 60 seconds that you have an opinion on. And it's so rushed. We've stopped responding to them, right? Because the ones I did respond to, remember when I wrote like three page essays, gave them the math and then wrote a question mark and they didn't respond. So each day I go back question mark it. You can't win an argument with an idiot. It's just impossible. So now we're just like yet cool comment, whatever. The people that really want help send a DM go, "Listen, I've listened to the podcast twice. When I finally got it on the third time, thank you so much. How do I come and do you? Of course. I'm like, "Here's a discount code. You know what I mean?" What do you do? I'm not angry anymore. Boys and girls are okay, but I did blow up. I had to take a 20-minute break, go for a walk. And it was funny. I got back and in the chat bar about 60% of the group, like can everyone please shut the fuck up? Can you all please just listen to what G's saying? Take notes, listen to the final, how to financial planner and accountant and economists. People just vomit out, they don't ask you a question. They wrap it in what they believe. You're asking me to validate your fucking wrong bullshit, which is why you're here. You're paying me to fix it, but you're not listening, you're just telling me what you want to hear. I'm not going to validate that shit. It's wrong. I don't know how to make any friends. I'm not here to make any friends. I'm not here to make enemies, but I'm not here to make any friends. Because a good advisor or a good coach, as you guys know, he's fucking tough. And I don't want people to pay me money. That's the point. So I have a money back guarantee on everything I do. It's hilarious. It's going to be a draw. It's got to be, well, it's risk-free. It's got a money back guarantee. So, test me out. Money back guarantee. What would be your best piece of advice for myself, G? Besides Mum, to accept my friend request on Instagram. Yes. Sorry, Jules. Jules come on. My pen, my request still, penning Jules. Now, let's, let's device for yourself is for everyone, not just yourself. No, just myself. Just yourself. Okay. I'm being a bit selfish here. That's right. I strongly suggest you take the time and get into your reality as in, work out your why versus your why or not. So she got really hard for you today. And you consider throwing in the towel like I did many years ago. Which I was at that point with Get Layles. Okay. Same as the head of the cab. Your why versus why not. Yeah. What would be, what would be big enough to break you right now? Only something happening to Mum. Okay. Other than that, I could handle pretty much everything. Okay. And would Mum want you to give up if she was sick or something happened to her? No, it's still make it work. So your why is bigger than your why not? Yeah. Okay. Now, your why and how big that goes sounds like part of its attached to Mum. She's your rock. So I know I've been able to buy my mum a house. And I was able to get her a new car. She picked the house. I never went there. We just paid right? She picked the car. Some little red MJ thing. She fucking loves it. I don't know what right. Like that's why I do what I do with my family struggle. So like what Kev's doing now, I want to be able to provide. So at the moment you get, nah Kev's chasing the money he's doing this and doing that. And you're going to, I'm happy sitting in this pocket. If you needed tomorrow to put a roof over Mum's head and touch what you never do and pay for some medical treatment and do something that no one could afford, would you be working your ass off? Fucking no. So you know why I work my ass off now like Kev does? Because I know that's going to happen to someone I care about one day. And when it does I can cover it. I won't chase later. And that's on the assumption like when we talk about unexpected bills. Yeah. They're expected. Very good. So in life, choose your hard. Shit is expected. Although it's unexpected. I am going to get sick one day. I will hurt myself when I nearly lost my arm in an accident, right? I had insurance thankfully. So for me, I'm just very, very aware now from my life experience, from good and bad shit over and over again. Shit happens and I need to be prepared for it. So if I'm prepared for it, when shit happens, I'm okay. Because in the day life goes on. The happy, sad, mad, glad life goes on, right? Choose your hard and fucking sit. So go back to that. Why am I not? What's at the very end for you? I call it rainbows, lollipops and unicorns. If you're on a whiteboard and I go, Kev's here and he wants to be here. What is that? The amount of money you earn, the home you live in, the colour of it, the street of it, the car you draw like that. That image, not like there's a check in the mailbox that's coming farc off, right? You got to earn the check. But what does the end look like for you? Once you know exactly what the end is like, then you can go to that in a straight line in the shortest amount of pain and time possible. Now, I very clearly know what my end like so I could stop now. I could have already stopped. Kev still chasing, he's not sure yet. Give him another couple of years, you'll have a clearer vision of the end because he's still young. I'm old now, I'm old and moldy. If you go away and you really clearly know what the end's like, okay, if we're playing a game of soccer, yeah, and there's goals on the field, I'm going that way, you're going that way, you know how to score, yeah? If I took the goals off the field, what would we be playing? Fuck knows. Fuck knows. What would be the outcome of the game? Ball kickball kickball. Just see what I'm going. Think about how many of you think about your selves right now in life. You're playing game soccer or basketball, whatever it is, you know where the goals are? Do you clearly know where the goal is? So you're kicking the ball, you're running, you're sweating, you're falling over, you're getting back up when you're getting knocked down. Times running out the full time whistle's going to go. You score one, but do you need to score seven? Three, what happens when you've scored two and the other team scores two? And then you fall over and you hurt yourself. There's an analogy, it's life. If you don't know exactly how many goals to score, IE, where you need to live, how comfortable you need to be. Do you have health care? Do you have edge? You don't know what that is. IE, how many goals to score before the whistle stops. You'll never get there. And the other thing is you can't change it. You can't change that because I'll give you an example. I'll go to client at the moment like I want $100 million and I said, "Why $100 million?" It's the biggest number you can think of besides the billion, right? I said, "$20, $30 million will completely change your life." So you sold a business, right? And you wanted to sell. Do you need more than 20 or 30? What are you going to do? Buy a mansion, whether it's two million or five, so you spend $5 million on a mansion. Yeah. Well, 10, whatever. So you bought a Lamborghini and you bought an Audi and a Porsche. What have you spent? $5 million on a house, $2 million on cars. So you bought your parents a home for a million. But it's still ongoing. It's pretty hard to get to $10 million unless you're an absolute moron. Yeah. And I say you had 20 from the sale of your business. You go and invest $10 million and get 10%. You've got a million dollars a year without getting out of bed. So do you really need more than $20 million if that was your life long goal? Not really. Not really. Well, in Vaxi, it sounds pretty good. A million dollars a year for the rest of your life with $10 million invested and $10 million of assets and toys. How quickly do you reckon we can get to 20 million? How long's the piece of string? Folded in half, it's twice as long. Folded in half, it's four times as long. They've folded again. And again, when I tell you that now, all of a sudden you'll leave you today or someone listening, it's going to go, he's right, now if you're in a regional area, you might say only need 10. If you need to $1 million a year to live. So different strokes for different folks, right? But people just pick big numbers and they're meaningless. How have I been getting to where I'm going as I said a goal and I do not change it until I achieve it Because that would be like taking the goals off the course. Yeah off the field. Yeah So until I've scored that goal, I do not reassess When I've scored the goal and the full-time whistle go let's say I want to make my first 100,000 Caching the bank when I get to 100,000 and one dollar I can sit down I can take it a couple of days away your day would and I can reengineer to a million Yeah, I get to a million I can't move the goals Until I get to the first one. Yeah, otherwise you're just going to chase your entire life Hmm, doesn't work And do you set small achievable goals that you do if you set the goal? I have goal. I want to achieve everything with a it could be just to deal with this particular situation It could be to buy this asset sell this property It could be to go and hire this person and poach them from another business It could be in my relationship to do some gesture for my wife because I've been super busy at work Could be just to randomly send a flowers, right? Like every day I have a little goal. Have several lists That's an Andy thing I learned if anyone's done 75 hard off a power lists tasks etc So every day I have things that I want to get through that every morning I wake up a guy and I need to do this I need to do that That's critical if I did nothing else those that that day those items will move me forward as a human being Every day is a not negotiable yeah So I like this. This is good. Yeah, so you've got to have outcomes. You can't just wake up We're gonna go to work today. Oh, and I just go back to bed. Kevin fell back asleep. You're ringing him again All right, all right. I gotta get up now, but he's got a whole sheet of shit He's got a tick off his list. He's got people trying to buy himself from the like fucking busy, right? Yeah So you've got to tick these things off you every day. You've got to achieve something just just be one percent better every day Hmm And I'm far from fucking perfect My health is the thing that suffers now What prevent you from doing one thing a little like a little bit instead of doing 75 hard what stops you from just doing a walk or eating personality So I do but it doesn't get the same result so I'll typically walk every night people send on so I've got a home gym I've got ice baths. I've got and you know you see these days the big things that ice bath right everyone goes I'm in the ice bath. I published it on social media. I'm doing the work Well, not if you ate a zinger box in a fucking family meal for lunch and you know, you know what I mean like and you're out in the club So I think for me like I work too like I can do 15 18 hour days So that day I might sleep in with a me like an extra hour Five hours or six instead of four or five I'm not necessarily doing what other people do as relax and recover and it does take a toll on your body Yeah, I'm not at the diggin holes and I'm profess to be manly exhausted or anything It's a different kind of hard choose your heart Minds mental and emotional and psychologically draining but that has a physical impact on you Sitting is like a new cancer Like I sit for 12 15 hours a day like it's not healthy you got to get up and move your body so Yeah back to choose your heart, right? That was good. I really appreciate it. But the quickest way to make the million bucks is start don't give up and Then look at whatever you're doing and try to diversify and scale it Do you reckon I'm better off doubling down on the podcast or keeping the buyers agency as well I guess they're both one and the same at this point, but would you be focusing on one that depends if you want to monetize the podcast or not Yeah, good question. I mean realistically I think that if somebody wasn't coming Somebody was selling in Kellyville right now they fucking meant more mentally I got more issues than Vogue but if you're saying Kellyville right now You don't call Kev you're fucking more fucked up than me right? He's guy But you go, okay, can he monetize the podcast? There's only so many homes in Kellyville that you're going to sell right or list or help people buy sell move help them really Okay, there's there's this pool in that patch. Yeah, or you have to expand to the next patch Which may work it may not work right and for yourself people are buyers agent and they weren't working with me for what I do They should be reaching out to you based on your experience and expertise but based on the followers we have and the interaction we have on this podcast You wouldn't be able to service them all Because you're not set up like I am at scale at the point. Yeah, that's right. So scale is a big thing And do you want to be like that? Bigger money bigger problems I don't know if you want that he will take it If he could be the only agent in Kellyville right now and all the others quit and we know if I kept too good he'd love that right now But he already doesn't sleep enough and he already doesn't mess to enough. Like me. Yeah So my question for you is how do you actually switch off because I'll go on holidays and I can't switch off Well, if you remember I went on holidays in the army my poor It was great and I came back after four days because his message means I have the podcast launch bro I got on a plane and come on. That's Kevin. That's you. I did four days I burnt like I can't even imagine to tell you how much my holiday booking was I had like 14 days in this beautiful pool villa and I came home after four days And it's a good idea at the time to take a break right But more than like two days of floating around a pool and reading a full book and maybe having drinks for a change Because I don't drink all the time like whatever like it's fun Like day three like day four my wife and I looked at each other in the pool We're like you want to go home like So I don't know that you ever do switch off like I'm trying to get in the sauna each night and put some Zen music on I call it my happy space or place at the moment, but it's not really doing it for me I'm like it's difficult does that make sense like more of a chore? Well, I'm trying to change that because I'm not someone who can meditate or yoga or my All right get in, vlog myself get the session like some trying to find some me time. It's really hard Really really hard So I'm not an expert in that space. I couldn't but I'm reaching out to people who are yeah By the way, please all the people that all of a sudden just realized they're a life coach or a Meditation you please don't I appreciate it, but please don't reach out and DM me I've got my peeps and my peeps are some of the best you know like I'm going to do my Tony Robbins health stuff in America and Neuroscience and all like I'm doing some cool shit. So please like respectfully like I get so many pTs Reach out to me and nutritionists and stuff like that and I'm like and they'll for free which is great But I'm not gonna stick to it if I don't have skin in the game Hmm, and then I saw with okay, you need skin in the game because if hurt me say that I'll do it for this amount of money to make you do it I don't have to do it Even if I spend the money I didn't have to stay on my 14 day holiday and come back by a Singapore and Because I do what I want to do like you go you get bored you come back right? so It different strokes are different folks, but unless people are prepared to change they'll never change guys They'll never change The people you asked about earlier that are struggling financially right now What are they prepared to change? Are they prepared to stop renting that house that they have on their own? Are they prepared to sell their flash car and have a little bomb? Are they prepared to not get a new iPhone? What about the 40 year old who feels a bit ashamed that he's not got the level of success he'd hoped at that age? Has a business is looking to invest and is going through really in that position where they're wanting to work through their financial barriers What do you what's your advice people that feel that level of shame? That I don't know why I don't know why they're feeling shame. I mean Shame is only should only be if you've done something wrong Or you've let somebody down and it sounds like they built an unrealistic expectation of where they should be Or compared themselves to someone they wanted to be like And they just didn't achieve it But if they tried should they be shameful or should they be happy? Because you told me that they're looking to invest in their own business They've achieved business ownership successfully and it's not failing And they have an income and equity position to invest What the fuck is shameful with that? I'd give them an uppercut to them to grow up I'd knock the shame right out of their fucking skull To see where I'm going like so see that see how quick that was in that person to go Oh why am I shameful that I wanted to be Graham but I become Graham 3.1 Yeah, I'm just using an example here. There's nothing fucking shameful about that You got a successful business you look at you're about to be investing get alone approved and own an asset beside your business You should be fucking pumped you're like better than 95% of society in our country Fuck shit actually you actually went and started a business Probably employ people and pay them pay tax and contribute to you'll fucking heaps better than most of our society You had a crack I fucking love that I don't know what's there to be shameful about Really Well said We all interpret things in a different way Some people understand what I do we get the messages Thanks so much. I'm seven years ahead of my mortgage just listening to two podcasts so many of those messages How fake it can you can't fake it right then to get people saying the the shit that Graham's talking about the bullshit Well, whited 300 random people message screenshots of their statements and they're this and check our dms I don't check my dms for the proof or the receipts from my dm - I've seen through it, I start cheering them now. - There's tons of it. - I reckon we're gonna have to cut this episode into two, but that's it, right? - Yeah, we've gone, we've gone. - Bigger, right? - I love it. - What else do we got? - What else do you want to know? 'Cause you guys put the Q and A up. - Yeah. - Well, the way let's not forget, from the end of this session guys, the learnings, we'll repost it, someone's gonna win 20 grand, yeah? - Oh yeah, we need a, yeah, there's $20,000 going out, big G's, obviously, funding this, isn't from me or David, or just an F- - I'm not, I'm not, me and B- - I'm not gonna give you all my money. - You know, I've got a, I'll take the contribution. - But I did put it out there, yeah? - Yeah, G's the fuck a man. - Okay. - Make sure you, we are looking and receiving and recording every single post that's being put up in every learning that's being adapted. - And can we say too, if you're on private, the tags don't work. - Yeah, correct. - So if you are on private on say Instagram, the tags don't work for us to reshare or we might not see it. So if you are sharing these to go in that competition, not just to learn, please at least screenshot and DM us, yeah, post with the tags so we can reshare the image or you just need to come off private for the couple of days to share the learnings. That's, that's important. - Yep, I wanna give a shout out, 'cause to my favorite guy, that's in the car, that does a selfie, you do, he's gonna, be God, he's name. - I think I know who you're talking to. - He's so good. - I'm not gonna say what I think I know who you're talking to. There's a young bloke, he goes to shift work in like his high viz, and he does fucking funny video of his learnings each time. - Jackson, yeah, I know he's talking to me. - Yeah. He's, he's a big, gonna be a front runner at the moment just talking to my favorite guy. - He's gonna be a front runner. I think that's not just gonna be who's the funniest obviously, but, and it could be somebody who's renting that wants to buy their first time, it could help with the deposit. - People in New Zealand, I don't know if you know guys know, you've got a huge following in New Zealand. Only pocket hoops of DMs from New Zealand. - Really? - It'll be referring to my business partner in New Zealand. So we're global, just to be clear and Singapore. But this competition is only valid that I'm doing for people in Australia. Yeah, you can still share your learnings, you can still share, but yeah, all the NZ fam, all the fun over there, sorry, that it's only for Australia. - Well, I appreciate that, it was awesome. We've been slammed with about 20, 30 questions that we just wanna rapid-file if you don't mind. - Only 20, 30, shit alright, that's a good start. - Oh fuck it. - Oh fuck, that's hundred. - Okay. - 20, 30 is an understatement. Moving to spam. - Let's try to get through 10 or 20. - So let's rapid-file him if you can, as fast as possible. So I'll start from the bottom up. Thinking of buying a gym, space under myself, and then renting it for a PT business. What are your thoughts on that? - I'd say why the hell are you thinking that? Most gyms go broke. If you're going to invest into a commercial premises in your self-managed superfund, that could be a great idea. Why does it have to be a gym? And are you trying to fabricate something 'cause you're in the health and fitness industry? Don't have ideas. As long as there's a fucking heap going on in that question. Now, let's get some context 'cause we're lacking it. If they said, "I'm a PT, I run my own health "and fitness and personal training business, "and I've got a couple of hundred grand in super," and I want to buy a commercial premises to trade my gym in, which you are legally allowed to do, because of the way the bear trust lending and structure is with self-managed super, and a commercial property, your business, and the superfund that can actually rent to each other. If you bought a house, you can't live in it or rent it to friends and family. But, the big thing, I'm thinking of, here I'm thinking, oh my God, why are you thinking like financial decisions should be advised, structured, assessed on their merits? I want to buy a commercial property in my super. I don't know why anyone would specifically be thinking about a gym, which is a subscription-based business that most of them go broke. IE, F-45. I know, my wife and I owned one, right? F-45 is going broke in Australia. You're seeing all their gear up for auction. The franchise agreements and license agreements are terrible. It was very difficult for the actual owners to make money, and it got really nasty that they actually franchise fees went up and up and up and up and up, and they really struggled, and you see a lot of them sell, go broke, or they're all for sale. It's a really tough gig to get hundreds of members paying constantly, people come and go from gym. So, I would suggest that's a high risk transaction. I would want to know why they're thinking it, or who advised it, unless they are PT themselves. For example, I have a client who's an electrician, who had a huge mega-shed they built at home and traded from there. We sold the home, we separated their business and personal life, and they bought a warehouse in their self-managed super that their electrical company rents from them. That makes sense to an electrician. But if this person isn't a tenant, isn't a health and fitness or personal job, what's making him think that? They're just saying I want to buy a warehouse, then it has to get DA approved for health and fitness. Then it has to have the relevant amount of parking and the noise, the music pumping, the people coming and going, the time. It's really hard to actually get a DA for a gym because the biggest component is parking, which is why big gyms are in old mud bunnings and masters and all that sort of stuff. Yeah, wow. A lot of gyms don't even have DAs if people look them up. So, I've left rapid fire, I'll stop there. Sounds like a terrible idea and I want more context. So, with all due respect, I don't know where the idea is come from, but there's heaps better commercial properties you could buy than gyms. For example, what would you buy? Well, you're talking about a big space, right? Like a warehouse, big, big gym chain for a big franchise. You'd get more rent if it was a transport in a logistics warehouse than income from a gym paying your rent. Hmm, yeah. Well, that space could then be mezzanined and have something else up. So, again, merits, feasibility. People have a lot of ideas financially. I've never fucking heard a good one in 23 years. I'm being honest, right? The idea is people hear something of someone because it's their idea and I'm not picking on this person. They said, "I'm thinking of why the fuck are you thinking that?" Who put it in your head? What they should be doing is saying, "Hey, guys, can you ask a new one?" I've completed a detailed financial feasibility for a particular commercial premises that I think is well suited or has an existing DA for a gym. That's not what I heard. But I could be missing some context. Wow. Get me, rapid fire. That was fucking awesome. I don't know. I could be wrong and been that person who'd DM us to go, "Here's all the other context, guys, "and I can put up a Q and A after this "to give them a better answer." That was really good. I've got one from Rage. I have 200k sitting in a loan redraw account. Nothing is owing on the loan. Unshore next steps in getting an IP. Yep. Do I close the loan account and use the funds? Absolutely. Do you not close the loan account? Getting a new investment loan. Absolutely. Just make some assumptions here. You can DM us after we've published it. But you've got $200,000 in a loan redraw. The loan doesn't owe anything. It's just sitting there. You do not need to apply for that $200,000. Even if that was a home loan and she's paid it down. If it's got debt recycling, you can draw that money out again and recycle that loan. It's just a loan account, right? So she can, Reg can actually draw the $200,000. Put that as a deposit and cost on a new property. So for a million dollars, there's 20%. On the property itself, she can get the bank to lend the $800,000 and use it as security. She's now got a brand new investment property. She only had to apply for the $800. She's already got the $200. The interest will be fully deductible because it's the destination of the funds or the purpose of the funds. So people don't always understand, have got a home loan, I've paid it off. And there's 200 grand in the redraw limit. Well, it was a home loan. If you draw it back out and put a pergola in it's still a home loan. It's for personal use. But if you draw it out and use it for investment, that interest becomes deductible. So do not close it. I would never close a loan facility because a bank is a place that will lend you money when you can prove you do not need it. Yes. When you need it, they will not lend it to you. Well, I was sad to say. Next. LMI, are you an advocate for paying LMI? Or would you go with a 20% deposit? Absolutely. You know what's better than one? 21. You were going to say two. I was. I should never. I should never. I should never. I said, what's better than one? 21. So, while Lenders Mortgage Insurance is expensive and it can be prohibitive, do the math on the exercise, I would rather buy two properties with only 10% deposits. Lenders Mortgage Insurance, talk to your account, could be a tax deductible cost as well. Could be a lending cost written off over five years. Could be an ongoing cost. I've got some loan products with paid by the month Lenders Mortgage Insurance. So, you start paying it, but if the value goes up quickly, you don't have to pay it anymore. So, I would rather buy two while every other person goes out and buys one. Well, I love that. What is the most beneficial way to pay yourself from your PTOIL to the company? Good question. I don't play accounting. I've studied a bit of it, but I would say talk to your accountant. Everybody will have unique individual, personal, financial circumstances and objectives. There's lots of ways you can pay yourself. You can pay yourself a salary. You could pay fully-franked dividends. You could pay unfranked dividends. So, there's lots of ways, there's drawing. So, depending on the business, the structure, but the scary thing is, people, if you're asking this, you need a new accountant because you're accounting. shouldn't be advising you this and you should be paying your account for this advice. They should know you've got a home loan and a couple of kids and a dad and you need to draw X amount of money every single week or fortnight to pay the mortgage, put a roof over your head, feed yourself and function without any pressure and stress and X amount of taxes paid on that. Then they may have a strategy that at the end of each year you also do some fully frank dividends for taxes. There's a gazoon in one way to pay yourself but what do I say? Your strategy keep it simple silly or PhD push your dummy, I'm not that smart but I pay my accounting experts for that information and they should do the same. If they're asking me and that's because their account hasn't told them, they need to smash their accountant or don't be a fucking tight arse and pay your accountant for some tax advice. Now, I know most accounts use their personality as a former contraception, only choking, sorry not sorry at all the accounts. But you should be getting this guidance from your accountant, they have your information, they hold a lot of intellectual property about your financial circumstances. That should be a phone call or an email, hey how are we paying me? This doesn't make sense or can we improve it? I want to pay my debt down quicker or I want to invest. I know that means we've got to pay more tax and shall bigger income. All of these things come into play. So have a chat to your accountant. If they've got a shit account, are there any you recommend? My masterclass paid events with the money about guarantee my personal account and my business account presents and shares but they won't take on everyone as a client. You've got to be the right fit like client advisor. But we do some tax sessions but yeah, I've only really got two or three accounts that I have every four clients to based on my experiences and that's all I can go off. So not all accounts are created equally well said or buyers agents or real estate agents or brokers or doctors. That's right, that's right. This one from a good mate, Joppo, is offset accounts still okay if you're strict with money or still better to put in redraw? I guess all the time people really struggle this. If you think offset's great, just fucking do it. My saying is you do you boo. What I can tell you, you've got hundreds of them, I've got hundreds of them, I'm going to start posting them. Every single person that I've worked with, not the last 23, the last sort of 11 or 12 years, that stops using offset that tells themselves they don't touch it, they don't spend it, they're very good with it. Every single person who stops doing that and puts their money in their redraw and only has a budget each week and actually sticks to it. Statistically in my world, they all take more off their mortgage in 90 days of that structure than they did in the entire prior 12 months. I've got the message just to prove it and the client's statements to prove it and back it up. So if you good mates, here's my question. Why does everything offset so good if they still got a mortgage? So my question and answer to that is you do you boo. If you think it's so good, get your financial year statement of your offset account and it will say this financial year, you have saved 13 cents or 13,000 dollars. If offset is working, your account balance from July 1 to June 30 should go up exponentially. If the balance has not gone up 10, 20 grand, I guarantee from the proof I have, if you put it in your redraw and have a budget, your balance of your loan will go down an extra 20, 30 grand because you won't blow it on shit. So the question I say to everybody is if offset is so good, why is everyone struggling so much? You could be meticulous and mate, you know better than me, I don't know, you said the mate. If he's meticulous with his money or does every now and then he buy a Mocha Chocolata, some sushi, a beer at the pub, the answer is yes, he taps occasionally, offset doesn't work. But I have proven, because I care under my best interest duty, is I audit my customers when they come on for the previous year before they work with us. If I can't see their offset balance increase 10, 20 grand, depend on their surplus cash flow and their mortgage going down so they're down 10 and they're up 10 and they're 20 better off and I see them spending offsets are gimmick to them because they spend it, then it's not there to offset. Yes, put 100 grand in there, don't touch it, don't leave it, you're 100 grand better off my next question, why do you need access to 100 grand in an offset account that could sit in redraw when typically loans with redraw are cheaper than offset account products? You usually pay for the feature of offset in a package. So now you're paying more for a feature you may or may not use because society's manipulated and ingrained you into believing that's the best way. My grandparents never had an offset account, they didn't exist but they own their home. There you go. You've got it offset accounts get introduced because banks know that human beings are impulsive and they'll spend what they have direct access to and they won't offset shit. Tap it, tap it, tap. But yes, you know, it's to your question, they should do exactly the same thing but I can fucking tell you, they don't because we don't use them the way they're intended. 80, 90% of us don't. And a big thing on that, even if you don't tap away, like I'm guilty where you transfer across. Either way, you're spending it right. It's going in and out. It's going on, it's not offsetting. So the intention is right, the gimmick, the product, the benefit, the perceived benefit is right. It's the psychology of money that fucks us all. Well said. Advice on spending company income as a contractor sounds like tax evasion. Yeah, that's confused. Like, should I skip that one? If your business generates income and you're spending it without paying tax on it, that would be like a division 7a directors loan. You'd be taking, yeah, so lacking context. So keep that one. Advice would be not to spend the company's money because you should pay tax on it and draw it as income. So my advice would be not to spend your company's money. This is a good one. First three things G would do if he left an office to start his own agency. So real estate question, if I was to leave. Real estate and we'll do broken. Okay. Well, I'm already my own. I've always been a franchise. I've always been my own independent brokerage. And I'm a real estate agent as well. I'm licensed real estate agent in multiple states and territories. First three things I would do if I left and started my own, well, I've already done that, just trying to think the first three things that I did. I wouldn't say there's any particular step one, two or three. I did this in 2012, 13. So what are three things you offer to the top of your head, which are important to be front of mind? I'd suggest in a real estate capacity, you need to understand the market segment that you're going into. So for Kellyville or DAPDO or Dubbo or Gundagoy or wherever you are, right? You need to understand that area and you need to have market presence there. So the first thing you would have to do is a branding, marketing, awareness exercise. Definitely because you can't sell something for not for sale. And if you are the service for sale or the product for sale, if no one knows about you, you screwed. So the first thing would be an awareness branding marketing campaign across socials, across letterbox, fridge, the whole kit and caboodle. But again, that has less than a one to three percent take up. You'll know that, letterbox drops, flyers, etc. But a wet market awareness. Same for broking, for broking. I'll be figuring out who is my core client that I'm very skilled to assist. So you can't help everyone, right? So I have lawyers and baristas and countencers clients. But I typically want to attract mum and dad or couple or person single that wants to aggressively pay down debt so they can reuse it to create wealth. I'm not trying to attract somebody who just wants me to refinance and sell them alone, receive a commission and send them a Christmas card or a scratchy each year. I want people that want to come to my Christmas party every year and want to come to personal development events with me and be part of a community. Like my clients in our private group, they have a new castle, a Queensland and ACT, a son. All of my community of thousands of people meet up independently without me. Now if you want to talk to your local Bob the Broke, about the cabab shop. I guarantee their clients don't even know each other, let alone meet up. So the second thing I do in both aspects of an agency and a brokerage is explore how to create a community which we've touched on on another podcast. Build a cult. Yeah, probably don't build a cult. No, I can't. Yeah, you do. You're really strong. It's like a cult. You guys are like man, the messages we get, the love, the appreciation. It's kind of creepy and cultish because we've built a community of like-minded people, all trying to achieve the same thing. That's my, so the third thing is, what is your client avatar? So who are you doing business with? So if you're like I'm trying to do business with like-minded people that are very lovely good people, I'm not looking for double bay, double pay, fucking elitist attitudes that just want the cheapest possible rate and then they're going to pay the fucking minimums for 30 years. I'm looking for people that want advice, that want guidance and their national, I have a New Zealand, see I get quite small over the world, America I'm there in a few weeks. So I'm looking for a particular set of clientele that want to be part of something and are driven to achieve something. If and you guys know this, I say sales isn't qualification, it's disqualification. Some of the other day comment on everything, oh you'd be so much more this if you didn't use it. I said why would I change myself to impress you? I swear, fuck off. Sorry. Sorry. I can be a house machine. If you don't have to wear a suit and tie and be some fake wanker. Yeah. So impress one person. That person's just, I love your content, but why swear? Well, you can love my content and not love me. Doesn't mean you still don't want to deal with me as an expert. But if I rub you the wrong way, I'm not the right person for you. So figure out that third thing would be figure out your core client avatar. I like that. Yeah. And really, really make sure that that is who you're looking to serve. And I would ignore everything else. I don't take inquiries. We don't do phone calls. We don't do chats to see if we can help you. Until we're fucking free webinar every week. I tell you at the beginning, there's a sales pitch at the end. And I tell you before I do it so you can log off. People say there's nothing for free in this world. They're fucking is. It's got a podcast. Go to the library, get a book for free. It's called YouTube. It's called the internet. If you can pay for your internet, you can listen to music, podcasts, YouTube, you can educate yourself. There is stuff for free in this world. We're going to fuck up tall poppy syndrome in Australia. So those are the things I would look at. I love that. They're the core things. I'm inspired to do my own free webinar each week now. Maybe, mate, you should look each time. You know, I know you've got an appointment tomorrow. You've got an off-market opportunity for your client. We were chatting about we had a little toilet break before and cut for a second. I would be doing a heap of content while I was there. And a full market update on that area and publishing that, whether that's the right property for the client or not. It's still an amazing amount of information that can you can put out into the world without any expectation. And it kills two birds we've on stone. Well, now that whole area market update, as it that date's done, I do it each week with Doc Wilson, right? And we have builders, developers, real estate agents, other brokers watch my podcast every week. Because it's free. And then they can listen to that and they don't have to go do their own research. And now I collaborate with some of those people because they thank me for the content. Compete or collaborate? For nominal. When did G realize that he had a skill where he could help people be financially literate? When did I? Yep. I actually realized it pretty young. So I was in banking. So I was probably-- Oh, 2021. But I was a bit pigeonholed and caged. Because I only had one or two products to sell for that particular branded institution and organization. So I realized about 2021, maybe 2021, 22. And one of my mentors and managers realized that and helped me escalate and grow my career. Yeah, it was early '20s for me. Really '20s? Best advice for a young bloke saving for their first deposit and best way to do it. OK, probably not going to like this. I would probably completely change everything you're doing right now. IE, if your fun and enjoyment is going to the pub on Friday and I'd say you're a tradeee, and every day you knock off and you pump a beer at 3, 4 o'clock, I'd cut that straight away. And I would completely change all of a sudden. Firstly, actually, go back. Reverse engineer the outcome. How much deposit are you trying to save? And by when? 5% deposit? 5% deposit on a $500,000 property, 25 grand. You know what they're trying to save a $1 million property, 50 grand, and how quickly? If it's 50 grand in a year, that's 1,000 bucks a week. Yeah? So how are they going to achieve that if they don't earn that? They can't. But if they work the number gear yet, I want 50 grand. I want it in two years. And my young tradesmen, I want a good income, I could put aside 500 bucks a week. OK. But could you put aside 750? If you got off the beers and you went to the gym or played start a play and touch 40 instead, you're like, I have a really good saying, a friend of mine who's a partner at a law firm taught me many years ago and they're going for something. And it's something has to change or something will change. Something has to change or something will change. Do I be able to get that? And now it sits rent frame in my head really deep. In other words, for all of us in life, something has to change one day. Health, fitness, relationships. Right? And so something has to change or something will change. If that person wants to save a deposit for a home, something has to change. And if they don't control the change, guess what will happen anyway? I, right now, people are getting priced out of the market. So something has to change. I need to save more and change what I do with my spending habits or I'll get priced out of the market. The point of that statement that I love is, you should control change before change controls you. That makes sense? I can spit in quite today. Choose your heart, choose your heart. So I would say that person start with the end in mind, get a pre, not even a pre, but get a borrowing capacity, right? Don't fuck around with your credit file. Get a borrowing capacity from a really good reputable broker. Don't go just into the bank. They only have a particular lending policy in rule. This fucking heaps of good brokers out there in Australia, guys. Go on contact one digitally, local to you, whatever you like. They can shop all the different land. There's all your circumstances. You give your three or four capacities with different institutions and rules. And start there, right? By the way, if they do that work for free for you, go back to them for the fucking loan. I don't piss in their pocket, you know what I mean? Get them to do your borrowing capacity. Once you know your borrowing capacity, they can guard you on the deposit you need to save. And then you can set a plan in place. And that may be he can stay on the beers. He maybe needs to get off the beers. But once you start with the ending one, when you know where the goals are, you can play the game. Love that one. OK, all examples so far have been for new or new new mortgages. What would your advice be to somebody that has only 17 years left on their mortgage? I think I've actually got this damn as well for this lady. I think you've overcomplicated or overconfused it. What we're doing when we use these comparisons in the other podcast is we're using the minimum repayment on a 30-year loan at all times, whether they've just got it or had it for five years, three years, et cetera. I don't actually say go and get a 10-year home loan. I say get a 30-year home loan and pay it off in 10 and then you've got 20 years to redraw it. So I think people money's quite tricky to the average person and they get little bits of what people say and they run with it, if people in the industry, and they misinterpret. I have 10-year home loan products that have huge minimum repayments. I don't suggest that. I use 30-year loan products and white label lending that I've got designed for my customers that no other broker has. That's what pisses people off. But other brokers have good products as well. So that's fine. But those products that design that we can use them like a credit card or a line of credit for 30 years. So you can get your home loan going in 10, but you could redraw it all to use it to buy another investment property or a new home loan. So I know the exact lady, she misinterpreted. Jump on one of my webinars for free. She can log off before the sales pitch. They're 17 years in. So what I said is it might not be best for them to refinance for 30 again. They could refinance and ask the bank if they could have 17. But they might not demonstrate that with the service ability buffer on paper. So it's not always good to refinance and go back to the top of the graph for 30 years when you got 17 left. But they could refinance 30 years again. The minimum will be low, which will give them strong service ability. But then they could pay it down in seven. It doesn't matter that they're serving it. But as well, they can call their bank. They can negotiate a better rate. They can look for a better product. There's a whole heap of things that that lady could do. Beautiful. Advice-- this will be a good one for myself. Advice for calm only sales agents that struggle with budgeting and savings. One, don't spend your money before you earn it. Because when you get a sale and you know the comms coming, that means shit until it's in the bank. And then you need to deduct tax, super, pay, holiday pay, normalize it as if you are an employee. And if you are not doing that and you don't have enough money to do that, then go and get a fucking job. Because when you-- let's just make up a number-- say they earn a big number. What a little one? $10,000, big number. Out of the $10,000, let's say they're in the top tax bracket. Well, there goes like $45 cents in the dollar, right? Yeah. So $4,500's got to go for tax. Now they've got $5,500. They also should have some super. So there's another $0,000. It's zero and go, like, you've got to actually do all the math again. If you're a calm only salesperson, your accountant has not given you a structure and a strategy to go, x% of income, 11, 12%, we're going to put the super this much for tax, this much for this is your net pay. Every single income earner out there should have a financial structure. If they don't, go get a fucking job because you don't have many gym money. Sorry, not-- sorry. Sorry, not sorry. Get the hate coming. Similar, a broken advice. If you're starting from scratch, how do you start to build and succeed? Yeah, if you're in the broken industry, one, I would say don't just sell products and services. But also, I'd assume that you've got an abundance of knowledge in your head, like an accountant financial planner. I have a different business model. I'm a fee for service. I hope you think so. my whole industry should go that way. I'd like to see them strip commissions eventually, which have done in other countries successfully, and people pay for advice, because it'll clean out the industry. Because if you're just selling someone a product and getting a commission and think you're really smart and they want to debate with me, there's nothing smart about what you're doing. You do a three day course to get your cert for. So I'd say to these people, what expertise and knowledge do you offer? It's different than selling the main four to six lenders product, because if that's all you do, you're a salesperson. So I'd look for ways and means where you could educate, grow, community wise, podcast, books, courses, educate, like you've got a lot of knowledge if you're accredited and licensed in something, how do you help people with that like I do? That's where I get shit loads of business from. I have to say no. Like who's business is saying no to customers every day? I'm not competing with anyone. It's a good problem. So think about some things that you can do. Again, give unconditionally, especially we talked about socials at the top end of this at the start. Give unconditionally what can you put out into the world on socials and YouTube and podcasts that help people become financially literate? Because we all think we are, but we're not. I still have bad financial habits, but I know what they are. Yeah. Yeah. Made us very true. Very true. Okay. House ready in 10 to 12 months. Mortgage starts. How do I tackle the banks loan type money? Doesn't make sense. Yeah. For a lot of the people that are messaging in and reaching in and saying, "Well, first time by is how do we do this? I'm going to get a home in a year." I think people overcomplicate it because they're in here and they're learning, which I look, I absolutely love these people for doing that, but don't overcomplicate it. All you can do is save as much as possible. And the loan products that exist today are probably completely different in 12 months when you go to buy a home. The economy will be completely different. The market will be completely different. You need to save your little back sides off and a couple of months out from looking to buy. You need to sit down with a really, really good broker, start to get some guidance. And all I say to everyone is, don't just deal with a bank. You don't get a cheaper deal if you go to the bank, right? I can get better pricing, discretion and negotiation power as a broker than I could when I worked for a bank. And there's more than one bank in Australia and Lenda. So a couple of months out, engage with a really good broker or now, figure out what you're borrowing capacities, build a relationship with that broker. And I'm sure they'll be happy to help you hand a little bit. Do you get to the point of them writing a loan for you and they'll get remunerated then? Or offer to pay them. Just go, "Hey, how many, I don't write a loan for a year or so. We're saving. How much would it cost to get your advice?" Most of them will save for free. Then if they realise they can't do anything with you for a year, maybe there is a charge if you want them to give you some information and some professional services. I think it, and rightly so, like if you pay someone a 500 bucks for the right plan, 500 bucks, then you got to check in with them every couple of months. See if you're borrowing capacities changed at all. I would invest in that. But I'm going to go spend 500,000, 500 bucks. A couple of hundred bucks would be nothing to talk to an expert. I don't know what. On what of these would be kind of efficient? I'd love to check some of mine as well because I got absolutely peppered with some of mine. Let's have a little look, see. Are you guys going to keep some more of mine? I can answer one that I've got to the team have filed all of these for me. Guys, and thank you to all the people that are saying thank you and moving money around and finding their leaky buckets and FTB. One of the main ones I get is trying to get my help. So just to clarify, into the assailor, I don't do inquiries. I don't take clients. People see all my content. I do heaps of videos, heaps of reels. Most Tuesday nights, the guys have shared the link as well. I do free educational zooms like webinars on Zoom. They're free. They're live. They change each week slightly. But that's the only way to work with me. The only way I get sometimes 4,500 typically register. I get from 1,500 to 2,3000 people on a Tuesday night, which is insane in the Australian finance space every Tuesday night. And then I teach you a whole heap of shit, but you get all the messages. People can execute instantly that night in the next day and clean up their finances for free. Then if you're interested, I do a sales pitch at the end. And you can pay income and spend two days with myself, an economist, a financial planner, an accountant, an asset finance expert, like I literally bring in over two days on Zoom a team of experts and do it from home in your pajamas on the couch. And that is a life-changing program and they all have money back guarantees. All of them have zero risk to the consumer to overcome Australia's top-off syndrome. So where can you get two days with an economist that would charge 5, 10, 20 grand to speak at a big event somewhere? A financial planner and accountant, you know, like you get all of that risk free because if we don't give you a particular saving, you get a full refund. So I love when people go, it's too good to be true, scam or all this. That I'm like, enjoy being broke forever, fuck with. You don't know what you don't know. Everyone's such an expert in Australia. At some point we've got to grow up and have a crap or be broke. So look, I'm not for everyone. I don't need to be. I've got a couple of thousand people every Tuesday tuning in. And out of that, I usually get four, five hundred messages by the time I wake up the next morning saying, thank you. Hey, I feel good about myself. Some of the messages are, "Who hurt you, bro? I'm providing a service. Whether I get paid or not." So some of those messages, guys, every now and then I do Q&A's by demand on Instagram and all that sort of stuff. But the only way to get my help is try the free webinar, learn. If you love what I teach and you see value in it, you can do my course. From the course, I then take client applications. But I decline about 40% of the people that apply. Wow, you decline 40%. About 40%. What will be one reason why you decline someone? Shit human being. I used to be one, so I know one. Thanks one to no one. Now, if they're bad human being, also a lot of people don't want advice. They want the shortcut. Yeah. Now, there's no get-rich quick scheme. So I like to provide the education and the knowledge and the information they can execute themselves or they can pay to have it underwritten and insured and done. But if we're doing for you, we're going to give you the written advice and do. If you're not prepared to do, that's a waste of time. So what are we doing now? I don't want to keep you money. I don't want to waste your time, but I'm not going to waste my time. I'm still a business at the end of the day, no matter what I do for free. So, the victim would say that happy to help as much as possible. I put a shitload of free content on my YouTube channel, all of my socials and free webinars. But outside of that, I can't help you unless I know your individual circumstances and you apply to become a client. But I'm not out there desperately waiting for someone to book a meeting with me and have a chat. It's quite the opposite. I can't do chats. So, it's a good position to be. Hopefully we can get a bit of a bigger movement going and hopefully my whole industry grab hold of this. I've got some very, very well respected, highly regarded senior industry body people that consult to me. And that is because they agree that we need change in our industry and we actually need to go more to a knowledge and education and service rather than just selling the bank's loan. So, that's a big thing I'm working on this year. Big thing. And that was the main one I had over and over and over again. We get heaps of it. It's a simple one. But people have stuck on the idea of debt recycling and how you use equity to buy multiple properties. Can you just, for the person that's got no idea how does debt recycling work? Yeah, look, I've got a couple of YouTube's and my boards on this. People can find them as socials as well. Some people explain this very poorly in the industry. I've sent a few videos pop up and get pulled down and they were all wrong. I would say to people very simply alone is alone. What you do with the funds lent determines if you bought a house that's a home loan, like a home. If you bought a car, it's really a car loan secured by your home. If you bought a business, it becomes a business loan. So, people first need to understand that a real estate asset is just security for the debt and the purpose of the funds dictates what the funds are for, where they used for tax purposes or not. When you pay down a loan facility and it's extinguished, if it was a home loan, that means there is no home loan right now. If it's an investment loan and it's reported to the ATO, that means there's no investment loan right now. But you still have a loan account. It has an account number. It has a limit and a balance. So, just in simplicity, you can recycle that loan facility. I won't get into the full debt, but you can use that loan facility again for a new purpose. In other words, the bottle that you destroy, you can recycle and make a plate, a cup, another bottle. All right, just simplicity. There's a better definition, but I'll just keep it simple for now. So, the first thing I help with my clients do is when they pay down their home loan and they have equity or redraw, we redraw that. We make it a new separate loan in Split called Investment Loan, interestingly. and they use that with the financial plan into invest or real estate, et cetera. And it becomes tax deductible interest. That's the layman's basic version, right? It doesn't need to be more complicated than that. There is a big problem in the industry and social media of professors' gurus where people are like, no, and it's on one of our ears, you draw the equity of your home and you put it over there and that, once you pay your home off, your home loan's gone, right? Same as on an investment loan. Drawing equity versus cold hard cash, they are not the same thing. Hmm. Cash has been taxed, it is not tax deductible. Go study Robert K. Sarky, debt is tax deductible. I can borrow millions and millions of dollars and pay no tax on it. I get a tax deduction. A lot of people, even people that own three, four, five, four, don't understand this. So I would say to people, just be careful where you're getting your information and knowledge from to make sure that it's accurate because there's some really great content out there. There's some content that maybe is good but hasn't been explained very well. I'd always say that if it involves tax, go back to your accountant. They're usually conservative by nature but validate the content with your accountant or validate it by a couple of other pieces of content or some quick research on the ATOs website, on another big accounting firms website, they have a lot of blogs. Maybe go through three or four blogs or websites and check that these four are all say the same thing but the person on watchin' on Tiki, Tokki or fuckin' Snapchat or Facebook, it's different, you know what I mean? Just make sure that you dot eyes and cross-tees before you look at executing financial strategies. And on that, like, should you pay off your home first before you get any investment property? Can you just talk? Absolutely not. So the market waits for no one. I see, you see some of my Instagram nearly every day I've put up a graph from Doc Wilson. The market doesn't wait for you. So while you're paying down only eight to $12,000 a year of principal for 20, 30 years, your property values typically doubled or increased substantially. So the best time to buy an investment property was yesterday. And the best yesterday, the day before, the next best days today or tomorrow, homes have never become cheaper in Australia. We've got a big issue now. We've had lots of migrants post COVID to catch up. We've got a housing crisis. Look at rental applications, lines out the door, open homes. It's really tough right now for everyone in Australia. So all I can say is you should not wait to invest. If you can get a loan approval, the buffered that's conservative, and a bank will give you a loan approval, I highly suggest you explore taking it. Even if you've made a terrible mistake and bought the house around the corner from where you live, because you're an expert of your local area, I'd say that lacks diversification and it's quite risky. But you don't have to go into state, you don't have to go over, like, get something. Yeah, do not wait to invest. Investing requires this really important thing. It's not called timing the market. It's time in the market to make money. Therefore, if you're thinking about investing, thinking equals losing money. Yeah? Every day you delay, you pay. It's a great little rhyme. I love to tell myself all the time and I think about investing. So summing it up, buy for it, put, invest your money. Would you go, do you have a preference? Because a lot of people get on the topic of brand new or established, do you have a preference or do you think there's a place for both? I think there's a place for both. My personal preference, I mean, I have choked on my master classes in my zooms. I bought 14 old units in Surface Paradise just to prove a point and made millions dollars out of it. Would I do that again at the moment? Probably not, based on the market. I tend to lean towards near new to new depreciation. Because I'm looking at it from a financial aspect of depreciation, deductibility, warranty, all that sort of stuff. I personally like shining in new. That's my personal preference. A lot of my clients, to near you. It's very rare that I do a lot of old stuff. And I do a lot for me personally. I've been buying a lot of during COVID. I was buying waterfront apartments on the Gold Coast whenever I said I was an idiot. I bought two bedroom units for 5,600 grand that are worth 1.2, 1.3 right now. And I just sold two bedroom 20-year-old units for 1.2, 1.3. So I know the value is there. Same as land. I bought a lot of unregistered land. And they're doing a big subdivision in a great area. You were going up to Springfield to look at something for a client for nominal area west of Brisbane there. Huge master plan city. Marta Private Hospital Cancer Research Facility Sporting. And all this stuff, train line AFL, they're like, it's a family hub, right? So you're looking something for a client up there, like, great area. But I would probably go more towards the near new to the brand you there. People can afford it. That's what they, you know, ducted air, shine, you know, electric roll the doors, all that sort of stuff. But I've made a lot of my personal wealth in taking that risk because there's risk if I'm putting a deposit down on an apartment on the Gold Coast that doesn't exist yet, it doesn't get built on me in trouble, right? But also, I've been able to put deposits down of 50,000 or 100,000 or 100,000, 500,000 a million dollar unit that have now made me, like 10, 4, 10, 20, 30 times that, like, $1,000 a unit, you put 100 grand down and announce worth $2 million. I've made $1 million and all I did was put 100 grand down. At 6% per random, it cost me 6 grand per year to put the 100 grand down in interest. So over two years on one of those, it cost me 12 grand in interest to pay the 100 grand deposit. But when it settles, I've got $2 million equity or cash if I sell. Not bad for a. Not bad. There's risk in that. So I'm not telling everyone to go out and do that. It's educated risk, right? I can't even know who the developer of the build, it actually had to come out of the ground, et cetera. You know, I bought a part-many main beach. If anyone has main beach on the goal coast, the fucking very wealthy cracking area. There's no really no more land right there. So you know, you can do your numbers, you can do your homework. Anyone not sure of how to do that, talk to a buyer's agent like yourself or, you know, someone like myself, or have a jump on like last year, Doc Wilson, I'm a number one for investing in our podcasts. On YouTube every week with a QR code, and you get like live data on the market. Like just go and grab that free data, I don't care. What's the podcast or YouTube? But make decisions that are not emotional and not influenced by whether you get paid, I get paid what is best for the listener. Like what is best for them? When they know what is best, when they can make data-driven intellectual, intellectual, mathematical, informed financial decisions, doesn't matter what any advisor or someone getting paid said, but you've also got to have the knowledge. And some of them might take three weeks, six weeks, six months to get enough intellect and enough experience in trying to understand investing. Yeah. I don't think people should invest until they get knowledge. Yeah, because trust is something that's formed knowledge will help with trust with an advisor or without an advisor. So I'd say to everyone tuning in, do the research, take a scientific data-driven approach, but not analysis paralysis, because every day you delay your pay more because houses aren't getting any cheaper. Houses aren't getting any cheaper. Well, we don't have enough of them. Man, that was really good. I think we might pause there. Is there anything do you want to keep going on other pauses like that? No, I think we've probably got a couple of hours there. That's pretty good. I think we'll remind them of the-- So I'll just jump in and say, hey, just want to remind everyone about the 20 grand. Now this is getting published. Blah blah blah. I think I said I'll take 20, 1 to 30 days to judge it all. Outside of that, guys, make sure you subscribe and other boys follow them. You know, if we get enough popular demand and we didn't cover enough of your questions, maybe we can do a couple more, guys, whatever we want to do. Maybe it sounds like at the moment it feels like it's a running fortnightly or weekly session or monthly session. We wish-- [INAUDIBLE] OK, yeah. Sweet. So I'll just jump in and say, hey, Matt, just want to cut off. Sorry. Love you. Oh, that was pretty good. I was really cutting now when they edited it. I just want to remind everyone of this. Crazy I know. But I just want to see people learning every day. It fills me up like the DMs and the message. That's what gets me going. That helps me get out of bed every day. So hence the 20 grand. And remember, if you want to. So we'll just go through that. Perfect. I got a pause. I guess that's it for now, mate. Well, mate, that was really good. I think that's it for now. We won't, I think, with finance and the topic can be a lot for people to digest in big cities. So we'll definitely be around for more sessions. And I just jump in, boys, and say, remember, please, just very quickly. Some give it away. The 20 grand. If you're under a rock, we're not aware. And if you're on private, please come off or send us the screenshots at least in the DMs so we can reshare. Everyone knows the drill. They can go back and find the real. But there's four episodes. Check the stats at 60. It ends at 69. Watch all four individual posts. Tag myself both sides. Caved down, Graham, Instagram, preferably Tiki Toki face base, whatever. 30 days from this being published, everyone will see it published episode 69, both sides. 30 days after all of judge that. And one lucky or couple, somebody is going to win $20,000 cold cold cold cold. 20 bucks cash. 20 bucks yeah 20 bucks cash up. That's insane. Yeah, it's as bad as you got to earn 40 to pay 20 in the top tax bracket but hey, I'm really pumped for somebody. I can see a lot of them coming through. There's some funny ones. There's some really deep emotional ones so I just want to thank everyone that is learning and thank you for the messages of appreciation. I love the dumbass comments and the gurus I ignore now because there's hundreds of people saying thank you sending screenshots that they're seven years ahead of their mortgage is one I've got a couple of times which is a weird number but it's like that erode some decade in the comments saying no, this is wrong. You should do this. Well, it's not wrong because this person just proved it. So I just want to thank all of you who are tuning in regularly sharing the learnings. Thanks to the boys if we don't do any more but I'm sure we're probably going to do a couple more of these. But thanks to you guys for inviting me initially and and and blowing us up and yourselves and and there's some really good content you guys are doing so keep doing it. You know, doing a really good service for everyone and maybe we'll do this again. We will definitely see by popular demand. I think so too. We'll see what happens. But mate, really appreciate it. You've been a blessing and someone that's scar-occuited one of our dreams to become a reality. So mate, you've gone above and beyond. Thanks to Jules for the candle. It was a lovely project. Thanks Jules. Thanks guys. Thanks Jules. Thanks guys.