Ep 595 - The Man Who Saves the World? (feat. Gabe Polsky)

- Wow, wow, wow, Wes. - All right, we're live. Gabe Polsky, man, thanks for coming. - Yeah, thanks for having me. - Thank you for coming. I wanted to bring you here. I saw your documentary a while back. I got a little screener copy. Honestly, I said I'm not just fluffin' you. It was what I thought was one of the best things I'd watched in a really long time. So, a man who saves the world, that's it, question mark, not the man who saves the world, no question mark. That's about a guy who didn't drop the nuclear bomb or something. - Yeah, yeah, that's another film. - Yeah. Years is the man who saves the world, question mark. Which dude, I swear to God, I like, I, Brandon, our mutual friend from Ruffal, sent it to me and I was like, all right, you know, and I'm like, I'm pretty like precious with my time. Some someone's like, hey, do you wanna watch this two hour thing? I'm usually like, yeah, yeah, yeah, watch it. But I read the tag line, I'm like, dang, that sounds kind of cool. Dude, one night, I saw it through it, so. - Congrats on that. - Yeah, it's 85 minutes because I know that, you know, two hours, two hours scarce people, but. - Dude, now I feel like, now the documentaries are six hours. - Yeah, it's, it's. - Murder mystery doc. - I have things long as. - I know, but the murder mystery doc, I'm telling you, man, I don't wanna start by, I don't know, negative no, but like, dude, I would really like to move back from the six hour twisty murder doc. It's like, just, I don't need to watch this for six hours. Give me an hour and 20, hit me with a twist at the end. - I agree, I'm the same way. - It's like a full work day. - Yeah. - Signing up to watch this lady get murdered. It's like, dude, hit me with the facts. - I know. - Give me the facts. - There's a stretch in, you know? - Yeah, yeah, true. But no, I thought your, I thought your documentary was honestly fantastic, and just to like, I don't know, I don't wanna give the whole thing away, but just to recap, I try to explain it to people, and I like, I always sound crazy. It's about a guy who, by the guy alone, could have been, what's his name? - Patrick McCallum. - Patrick McCallum, I mean, obviously, it could have just done one on that guy alone. His life, his crazy, was a peacemaker, or, you know, he just does everything. But he got convinced somehow that he was the center of some ancient indigenous prophecy that he was going to, was it save the world or bring everyone back together and thus save the world by saving the Amazon? - That's right, I mean, the second part, yeah. So basically, these indigenous elders from the Amazon came to this guy at like a peace gathering in India, and they said to him, you know, we think you're this guy in our prophecy that we've had for, you know, hundreds of years. So different, different tribes of the Amazon, they all kind of got together and identified this guy and said, you know, we think you're this guy. And, you know, initially, he's just like, I don't know what you're talking about. I'm just kind of a regular guy. I don't think I'm the guy. And they basically, for eight years, kept coming to him and saying, you know, when you're gonna come and fulfill this prophecy of ours, you're gonna come and unite the tribes of the Amazon and essentially save the Amazon and restore the Earth. And after many years, he's just like, all right. Like, I guess I'll like do what I can and go down there. - First of all, how, that's crazy he was able to fight that off. I would immediately be like, yes, I am. Getting hit with the chosen one is my personal fantasy. So that's crazy he got to live that out. And it's not that he was like, no, no, no, no, no, no. Which obviously he was the chosen one. If you're gonna be like, no, I'm not the chosen one. It's like, you're definitely chosen, yeah. So he was like, but dude, he, but then you, so I'm like, okay, that's first of all, that's a kind of a wild concept. Then you get into that guy's life and it's like he, it's, that guy was, I've never even like heard of or seen a guy like that. - Yeah, I mean, most talented guy, I think I've never seen it. - Yeah, no, that's kind of what drew me in. Honestly, the prophecy part of it was just to me, just so bonkers that I was like, this is, this guy's a bullshit artist, this is crazy. And I was, you know, incredibly skeptical of it. And then ultimately, I, you know, first of all, I started doing a lot of research and hired a private investigator, you know, to look into this guy, you know, was sending his best friends with Jane Goodall. And I didn't really believe him there. - I forgot about that. He was buddy, buddy with Jane. - Yeah, and then I, you know, reached out to her personally and got an interview and she said this guy's the most fascinating guy she's ever met. And, you know, one of, and so obviously, that voucher, but really, what kind of drew me in was how weird and amazing this guy's life was. He was like the most fascinating guy of everybody's, you know, he was a carny. He was a jeweler designer to, I guess, you know, Ronald Reagan, John Wayne and Russell Crowe. He was, you know, a carny, a carny. So he basically, at 12 years old, he like joined the carnival for like four years 'cause his brother got cut in half. - Yes, I remember. - Okay, yes, and his parents needed, it's crazy. - Yeah, I don't want to laugh at his brother. - He was probably gonna cut half, but yeah, his brother got fucking cut in. - Yeah, and so his parents had to go basically take care of his brother, so he was left kind of on his own at 12 years old. And so what he decided to do was join the carnival. And there he kind of met all these freaks and married a prostitute, which isn't in the film. But, and then, these are like a mythical guy. - You know what I mean, it's a mythical, it's like fours gump. It's like Zealig, it's like, the guy has literally done everything. - Yeah, he's, and so, yeah, I just felt like him alone as a character study, I don't know if you, you sort of like character study of movies or documentaries, you know, just a fat, just him alone I knew would be kind of fascinating. And then on top of that, you've got this whole prophecy, you've got, you know, indigenous, you know, going into this sort of indigenous world that, you know, most people have no idea about, you know, and learning about, you know, there are wisdom and connection and all that and having this guy kind of fulfill this prophecy. It's just like the strangest story I've ever heard. - And you kind of followed him around more so, kind of like fact check, which I could pick up on towards the middle, towards the end of the doc was pissing the guy off when he were fact checking him and he was just like, "Well, you don't believe me dude, "you don't believe me, I'm the chosen one to save the world." (laughing) So yeah, I don't want to give it too much away, but it was due to the documentary, it was fantastic. So how does that work? Like when you want to do a documentary, you just, I guess you just got a hot tip somehow. And then you got to go like, you just followed the guy around, like what was it like? I mean, I guess you weren't with him all day every day. When I see a documentary, for some reason I imagine, you're just like living, eating, and sleeping in the same quarters with the guy, I was gonna say sleep with the guy. You're sleeping in the same quarters with the guy, but you're just kind of popping in, recording, popping out, you know, going back and forth. What is that like after a certain time? Do you guys become like super close, or is it just kind of like all biz? - Yeah, well, everyone is different. I mean, this one I actually really did sleep at his house twice, which was pretty wild. I mean, his house, he's got two places, one in Morocco, California, and one in New Mexico, and they're both kind of really wild. - Yeah. - But, yeah, I mean, in this instance, it was kind of on and off, and you know, I was kind of documenting him and following him, but it was really kind of on and off. So I would shoot with him for a few days, and then maybe a couple of months would pass. I would sort of shape the story a little bit more, then know what, you know, something else is coming up, then I would go and shoot that, you know, until I kind of, you know, was trying to wrap it all up and say, where is this going? When is this gonna end, you know? - How long was actually the most? - How many films were, how long you said? - About three years, you know, on and off. - Thanks, so I mean, that's gonna be nerve-wracking, especially if you're filming, filming, filming, you're like, all right, come on, go meet these guys, go do the stuff. - Yeah, how does you handle kind of like, trying to keep them on the timeline with that? - Well, I would constantly ask, like, where is this happening, what's happening next? Is the prophecy, you know, gonna be fulfilled? Like, you know, in our culture, you know, we're constantly, you know, we want results, you know, we want, and plus, like, I don't want to be shooting this for like 10 years, like, I put other things to do and whatever. So, yeah, I would be, you know, putting a little bit of pressure on him about, where is this going? And that was kind of the most nerve-wracking part of this particular documentary that I made was just that it was so unknown where this was going. And I know, I don't know if you've ever been in a situation where you get involved in something, you have just no idea where it's going. And you think you're crazy, why am I doing this? I couldn't even, like, a marriage or something? - A marriage thing, it's so hard to, yeah, exactly. (laughing) - Yeah, a little idea. - No, a project like that would be, it would drive me insane, to not know. - I was literally on the verge of insanity, like, yes, especially because I, you know, you got, I don't know if you've staked it yourself or you have financial backers, you're doing this, and this sounds awesome and you're like, "Fuck, dude, come on." - Well, this one I was kind of on my own, because as you said earlier, you know, pitching this story to, like, Netflix and HBO and places like that, I mean, it's just so far out, and so weird, they're not making this kind of stuff. You know, I haven't seen anything like that before. And so I, even going to investors, you know, they're just looking at me, like, what the hell are you talking about? This is too weird, you're crazy, and so I, I was kind of on my own, at a certain point, when I decided to commit to this, you know, I realized that I was kind of gonna be on my own here. - So that put a lot of even more pressure on the financial also, like, one of my biggest fears is like wasting my time, you know. - Yeah. - If you've spent three years of life, like, what have you been doing, you know, you talked to your friends? and family like, "Well, what are you making now?" - He's a tough one. - What are you making? - Just like, "Yeah, this guy, he's in the middle of a prophecy, they think they're like, "Dude, you're out of your mind, and you gotta go see somebody." And so, it's been hard to kind of, but I did see a vision about this film, no matter how crazy it was, I knew that somehow I could weave all these really interesting things together into something really meaningful and funny and really bizarre. It's like a trip. This whole thing's just going into a psychedelic, kind of weird trip, but that also, I think, gives you a lot to think about afterwards. - Yeah, and especially, again, it kind of does, too. And I'm actually reading a book right now, speaking of the Amazon, about the first conquistadors who, like, sailed or, like, went down, I guess, in a canoe or to navigate at the entire Amazon river, and the author went down there, 'cause he always likes to visit the historical sites or whatever he's writing about. And he did say, he said the Amazon in particular is like, he's like, "It's literally like a magical world." And he's like, "You know, there's obviously a lot of it, "it's been destroyed." But he was basically saying that if we do lose, like, the rainforest, we're kind of fucked. 'Cause it's like, it retains moisture, and if you knock down the trees and plant different trees, they don't retain the same amount of moisture, and it gets hotter and blah, blah, blah. But, so hopefully, it's true. Hopefully he does the thing. 'Cause it's like, I don't know, again, no spoilers, but I was like, you watching, you go. Maybe he did, maybe he did the thing. Yeah, yeah, I mean, you know, that was the whole thing. I mean, I would go to these gatherings, you know, where he was essentially uniting tribes at the Amazon. You know, and, you know, they would be these sort of small-ish gatherings. You know, there'd be, there'd be tribes from various parts of the Amazon. And, you know, let's just say about a hundred people. You know, and, you know, I'd be looking at this, and they'd be doing, you know, indigenous ceremonial things with feathers, with fire, and all kinds of things, and connecting with spirits, and so on. But from an outsider perspective, you're just looking at this thinking, you know, what the hell am I looking at? You know, this is so weird. This is about saving the world. It's a uniting the tribes here. But then, I started thinking to myself, how does any business deal or any, even Jesus Christ for instance, when He was doing His sermons and starting out and talking to people, it probably didn't look like anything. It just kept talking to people and doing about some weird stuff. And, you know, no one would have said, "This is the guy." He's going to be just happening. Everything happens even on a big things that end up having these ripple effects that are huge. They start off really small and they probably don't look like anything that special. - Yeah, well that was, when you guys started your podcast, you know, it was just you guys in a room and then it becomes far from clambers. - Yeah, exactly. - Yeah, that was the meetups in the hotels where it's just like a 20 person meetup in a hotel convention center, that was kind of crack. That was cracking me up. - You're just like, "Bro, wait, this is the big meeting." (laughing) - Yeah. - I will say what I liked about Him too, was that like, He would do those meetings. You know, it doesn't look great. There's just a couple of people who's true. And he would get out and be like, "That was awesome." - Yeah, that's exactly what we needed to do. - That's exactly. He's like this insane optimist and every time I would talk to him, it would just be like, literally he just did the biggest thing ever. And I'd be like, "Where are we at the same place?" Like what is going on here? - Yeah, no. - I don't know if have you met people like that that are just like so positive and so, you know, almost in slightly delusional way, but it becomes kind of contagious and weirdly self-fulfilling. - Yeah, it is. Yeah, on my good days, I can kind of do that myself a little bit, but then, you know, I slip all the time. We're all just going anywhere to do a show and be like, "This is it, I fucked up, I'm done. This is how I'm going to freak out on stage, I'm going to walk off." - Yeah. - Happens to me like 40% of the time. I mean, the middle of starting a set and I go, "Well, I'm going to have to leave and everyone's going to be furious and I'm going to go home. I'm going to move back in with my parents. I'm on stage, this is the first like seven minutes." And I'm like, "I'll just move it back in with my parents." It's no big deal. But yeah, I try to persevere. But there is something nice about that, especially now where like, I feel like intense pessimism and negativity is almost like in, in a way, where it's like, it's almost cool to be like, fucking world's ending, dude, we're screwed. Everything's done. It's like, I don't like that stuff, honestly. - Yeah, I don't need anything. - You know what I mean? It's such a fight to stay positive. - Yeah. - But it's so important. - Yeah, man. - No, I mean, it's like, how do you do everything, dude? And once you start that negative talk to yourself, it's really bad, dude. - And yes, it's literally like the worst thing you can do, but there's nobody, in my opinion, there's like no emphasis put on the responsibility of not being a gigantic bummer. - Yeah. - 'Cause if you ever had like a, if you ever had like a, you know, I remember having like regular jobs. 90% of the people I've worked with were like massive, just chronic bunners. Every single person I've worked a regular job with shows up and they're like, shit sucks. - Yeah. - No other way. - This is what the whole thing is. - Yeah. - Just show up and be like, another day here this fucking bullshit ass place. I hate this way. He's like, dude, I just, I just got here. Can we just chill a little bit? So yeah, I mean, I wonder what people would need though, 'cause I don't know, I feel like without religion, I don't know what else could possibly stoke somebody day in and day out like that. - Somehow my mindset, I mean, even like, you know, making documentaries, it seems like the greatest thing. I have a, oh my God, you get to tell that story and this one and that one. But on a daily basis, the grind of it and the pressure is, you know, it's so easy to get into that negative talk. - Have you ever been tempted? - Even the best thing. I mean, they should teach it in schools, you know, about kind of the art of positivity and so. Because that's all related to this mental health. - You need it. - I'm saying. - You need that. The problem is it's being delivered by school teachers who can be a little negative and nasty. It's tough. If you're like a 27 year old lady being paid 30 grand a year, it's tough to get the kids and be like, "Guys, life is awesome, life is great." You guys just gotta believe in yourselves. - Yeah, teachers, that's one job I would never. I would like to have, but it's a, I don't know if I can do it, man, especially like, it'd be one thing if you had like other sources of income, but if you're just living on that, like the teachers I've talked to, apparently they just get crushed by the administration because they're like, you have to do it this way, none of it makes sense, but this is that the way we're gonna be funded, and every parent is like, "Dude, you suck." My kid's right, you suck, blah, blah, blah, so. - With coaching, too, yes. - Yeah. - Similar. I mean, the parents getting involved. - This episode is brought to you by PrizePix. The big game is right around the corner. Once championship Sunday hits, there's only three more football games this season, which means you're running out of chances to get it right this football season, and there's no better place to get it right than PrizePix. - Oh, yeah. - With player picks and team picks, you can pick how many yards the QB will throw or who will join bad bunny on stage. - You want to do that, Bill? Bill don't do that. - No intent, zoom up, dude. - No intent, zoom up. - Dude, it's out of our contract. I don't like the way I look. I don't like the way I look and what you're doing is that's not right. It's like enough to do what I don't like it. - That's literally like doing an ups year, I don't like it. - Guys, download PrizePix app today and use code drench to get $50 off in lineups or to start it over. No, no, no. - What specific players do you think you're gonna do really well? - I think Chris McAfry is gonna continue to do well. - He dominated it. - Download the PrizePix app today and use code drench to get $50 in lineups after you play your first $5 lineup. That's code drench to get $50 in lineups after you play your first $5 lineup. PrizePix. It's good to be right. It's cool, I'll know a little bit. - I don't know, like the pressure for coaching, I don't know if that's like, is that like scholarship pressure? Like I played sports. My parents are just like happy around the house. They would show up and be like, great. - Yeah, score zero points. - Mine didn't show up that much, but yeah. - Oh, man. - I'm sorry. - No, no, no, no. But I'm saying, I'm just saying, you know, I didn't, that's, sometimes it's a good thing, you know. Your parents are there every single time. - I preferred them not to be there, honestly. I didn't like, if they came, it was like sucks. Then like, you know, I would ride the bench for most of it. There's nothing worse than your parents showing up and you're on the bench, the whole game and you're like, I'm sorry, I brought you guys here. - I know, I agree. I happened in college a couple times, you know, when I played. - You played college, right? - I played college hockey. - What? - They yell, yeah. - Damn, dude, what the fuck? What position? - So I was a forward. - What? - I didn't know you were a hockey player. - Yeah. You don't strike, I mean, yeah, I'm not saying, you're not like rough and tumble, but you don't strike me as a fucking college hockey player. How long have you keep on your teeth? - Yeah, we wore masks in college, you know? - Yeah, okay, fair enough. - Well, when you play it professionally, then the masks will come off, but. - Why? I don't know, I don't know why they kept their rule. Maybe they wanted people's faces to stay. - Yeah, yeah, yeah. - Until until you play pro. - Thought it was time to take the mask off and show that beautiful hockey face. - Yeah, for advertising, they need to see the faces. - True, for the game, yeah. - Yeah, because if you're wearing a mask, it's not, you can't relate to the players. - Yeah, that's true. So what was the hockey grind like growing up? You must have played-- - It was tough, yeah. - Yeah, that's the sport you play early in the morning. - Yeah, it was, it was, You know, like anything, just such a huge commitment, but to find ice time into the more often times like when you're a little kid, you have to wake up at five in the morning or school and stuff like that. I think a couple of times a week. It was, it was, you know, just like, it was just a huge commitment your whole life. You know, you want to be a great player. You want to play? Did you cop the scholarship deal? They don't, you know, they, they give financial aid. So if they look at your income and decide what, what they, to do with you, you know, they're, they're not allowed to just, I don't know about now, but back then, you know, that's how they did it. But I got, I got offered a couple of scholarships from like Notre Dame and, dang, other places. So you're nasty. I was, you don't want to, you don't want to, you don't want to, you don't want to get it. So, how many documentaries have you done? I've done, I've directed four and then, you know, made five. Okay. Yeah. Well, what, what was your favorite one? You think, you know, well, that this one, that they've all been very different, but one that's kind of near and dear. We're talking about hockey. Well, I've done, I've actually done several there are someone hockey related, but I really love in search of greatness, which is about the greatest athletes of all time and about the nature of greatness told from the perspective of the greatest athletes. And it's, it's really about kind of creativity and about how, you know, most of the greatest athletes from Gratsky to Tom Brady, you know, messy, they're, they're, they're not what we think they are. They're, they're actually on a spectrum of like athletic ability and speed and this, they're actually like worse than the average athlete's strength and speed. Gratsky, let's take, for instance, you know, I don't know that. Yeah. I mean, he was, he was like an anomaly. It could barely bench press anything. He wasn't very necessarily fast. He wasn't, didn't have the heart of shot. He was, but he was just because of these weaknesses, he had to figure out, you know, another way to play the game and he just, you know, was the greatest ever by far, you know, because he had to come up with these comp, you know, compensation tactics. So he, he just thought he thought faster. The same thing with Tom Brady, if you look at his combine score, whatever. So what I was trying to argue is that I think we, we see sport in a, in the wrong way. We, we're not looking at the right things, you know, and for me, it's all, all about like creativity and sort of what we do with our weaknesses, you know, and, and that we can actually reinvent our fields by thinking about sport or whatever it is, and a complete different way. You look at artists, it's the same thing, you know, in order to reinvent something, you have to, you know, it's not what you think, you know. I know, I know you're saying this. It's not all about like the 40 times. It's not all about, I mean, this is totally the opposite. It's about the mind and about creativity. That's pretty cool. Did you see the movie Inside Out 2? I'm a few watched out with your kids. I don't, no, I don't think I, dude, Inside Out 2. A lot of motions. Yes, it's all about emotions and stuff, but there's a part in that where, you know, the, it's all about the kid having the motions, the motions get out of control, and they got to find some like equilibrium. And that's kind of like the whole movie, basically. But there's a part in the end of Inside Out 2 where the girl, Josh, you've seen this movie? This girl's having a tough time. Her emotions are a lot of wax. She's obviously sitting puberty too, so there's like new emotions. And there's a part where like it all, like the thing you're talking about finally clicks. And it shows that like she's all like gung-ho, like I got to be the hardest fastest. And then like she just gained some sort of peace in herself. And there's a thing where she's like skating serenely through the ice playing hockey. And I started to cry. It was just such a beautiful, like stuck with me for three days. Just I was like, God, man, that was, because there's so much going on in her life. And then she just was like quiet inside her head. And she was able to just like part through like having fun rather than like gnashing her teeth. That's exactly what the point of this movie is. And in fact, my greatest memories of maybe in life are like playing hockey in an outdoor rink just skating on my own. And just like that, enjoying kind of the feeling of it. And you know, it's magical. And that's what the essence of life is and sport too. It's just this free, this feeling of freedom and being able to experiment. And it's the same with, I'm sure, comedy too. It's all about just that period of experimentation and just yeah, unstructuredness about it, you know, that creates. Well, yeah, once you get in your head, it sucks. It becomes a nightmare if you get in your head. And it becomes ritual. I got to do this. I got to do that. And you know, no, it's talking to God. I'm blanking on the guy's name Kirk Fox. Who's a guy? Kirk Fox is a comedian. He's an L.A. And you know, I was at the mothership. And I was just like in one of my little funks where I'm like, I had like started doing newer material. I had to work out the hour. And I was just like, you know, possessed being like this has to be good. I would just go on stage. And I could feel crowds being like, because I come out like, hey guys. And they'd be like, you know, this is, that's not what this is about. You should be having fun and making us have fun. And I got off. And I was about to go on and maybe I was between shows. And I was just like talking to him. Like, I don't know. I'm just like fucked up right now about all my stuff. And he was like, he's like, looked at me. And he's like, who cares? Like just go have fun. Stop being, you know, such a simple, such a dumb thing. But I like at the moment it hit me. And I was like, God damn it. You're right. I went on after that and had a blast. And I was like, yeah, I was doing it as serviced everybody else by being so self centered and being like, no, I have to be the best. This needs to be great. And it's, it's, it's like literally a scourge. I get we all fall into that crazy trap. You know, but it kind of comes back to what we're talking about earlier about positivity and and just kind of having fun with things, you know, and trying to find that somehow because you get pulled back into that seriousness of the negativity. And you know what I'm saying? And you can't, oh, dude, it's literally the worst. And you can't perform either as well, you know. No, it affects all things. I'm up the age now. I'm turning 40 in like literally a week. And I like like clockwork now. Like I was, you know, my whole life. I've been so cock sure in terms of erections. And man, like I'm noticing now, I'm like, dude, if I even think about anything else while I'm having sex, you know what I mean? I agree. Like anything else enters my field of awareness. If I start going like, what's this like? Is it? It's gone. I'm not even gone, but it's just not, you know, it's not. Yeah. It's not the dick. It's gone. And it's like, it's been fun for me now being like, all right, how do I, you know, what do I got to let go of? You know, and maybe it's just going to get worse and worse. But that's a, I sort of, that's an interesting one. I've never had that problem. And like, I mean, that's like a very, you know, localized example. But, you know, we'll see. That'll be my next quest to see if I can somehow overcome that. But it's, you know, plus like, you know, if you're with the same person, it, you know, it's a little harder. What are you talking about? What are you even talking about, dude? No, it's amazing. But I'm just powered by the strength of our connection. I have no idea what you're talking about. No, yeah. Obviously, it's like, you know, you know, as I find that, like, if you close your eyes and not, not that you still connected your partner, but turn on lights and put on your blocks. No, no, it does internally. And so how you're feeling and, you know, less stimulus. Yeah. So it, it, it, that helps a little bit. I think so. I think so. I, for me, I just eat pussy and I recharge, but the, uh, that helps. That's the move. Like a babe. Time out. I need a water break. I need a water break, babe. But I agree with you, man. I, it's like, you know, that's, if I, if I could somehow, you know, if you think about just stealing all of your life's efforts into like one thing, it, for me, it really is trying to figure out how to kind of spread the stoke as much as possible. And not even like, um, I feel like it gets a batter app because there's that like, vapid version of that where you're like in the mirror being like, you're a champion. It's like not that at all. It's like, no, you're a worm and you're pathetic on some level. But despite all that, you can still transcend that inside yourself and not be a total drag on your own life. And, you know, everybody else's. Yeah. Like when people say, you know, it's, it's, I hear this saying all the time, well, you've got to love yourself. You've got to love it. I can't quite try. I do it. Yeah, it's just a weird thing. You know, so it's, I don't even think it's that. I don't, I don't think you have to, you know, you shouldn't like, hey yourself and beat yourself up. That's the thing. But yeah, loving yourself. How do you do that? Oh, I love you so much. It's the weirdest thing. I've really tried this. I was, I can't, I was on LSD one time. And like towards the end of it, I got this wave where I was like, I got to show up for myself. I got to love myself. And I like looked in the mirror. And there's a first start. My brain was like, shut up. And I was like, all right, my bad. Try to love you. But you pushed me away. But yeah, I personally think, yeah, I think that's one of those things that like it sounds great. And then you try it practically. And you go, okay, shut like this is impossible. I personally think you should not beat yourself up. Like you're saying. And just rather than trying to play some weird mind game with yourself and like loving yourself, just go do something for somebody else. That's that's that's that's easy. I can, I can pump someone else up. I can show someone I love them. But yeah, that whole thing like love yourself. I don't know where that comes from or like where that even originated because there was no way that's, I think that must have come in like the 80s. Like that was nobody said that in like the 50 60 70, maybe 70s and 60s, but I do think that love itself. is a key to that feeling of like, if you can get that right here to love other people and to get that feeling for other people and for life, and it makes a big difference too. It's similar to positivity or whatever, but that feeling of love is what I think we all crave in a non-not to be cheesy or whatever, but there's something to that too. - For sure. That was the, - That's what you say helping other people. - Yeah. - It's that. - It makes me feel like it transforms you. You know, if you could get wake up and sort of try and channel that feeling of love rather than hate or, you know. - Yeah. - Or, I mean, it's what all religions, what all spiritual traditions, you know, are saying. You know, and all the great people from, you know, Gandhi, Martin Luther King. It's the key themes to have it, you know, have it good. - For me, like, if I want to try to alter my own mood, it's such a labyrinth and mind game that it's like, I'm just gonna end up probably having a panic attack. If I like close my eyes and start going like, all right, dude, let's make yourself feel as good as Bob. I'm gonna, I literally did this the other night. I was like putting my kids to sleep and I lay on the floor while they were like getting ready to fall asleep and I like started having a panic attack and I was like, all right, I gotta get out of my head. But I can easily text my wife and like, you look great today and she's just like, oh my God, thank you so much. - And then I'm like, oh, I feel good now. - Yeah. - But when you try to apply it yourself, it doesn't work. - You can, yeah. - So what I do is I do really nice things for a lot of people and then I keep score if they do nice things for me. And then I eventually explode on them and say, you find nothing for me. Don't you look nice 10 times this week? (laughing) - Well, yeah, man, it's a- - Yeah, keeping scores is can't keep score. Can't keep score. You just gotta be- - Especially for married, you know, jeez. - Can't keep score. You can tell them how hard you don't keep score. That's what I do, I go, look, the other day you left your stuff out, I didn't say anything but I don't keep score like that, so yeah, exactly, right? But that, I mean, marriage is one of those things that like, yeah, man, it's like if you really want, I feel like, again, I only know my own self, but I do feel like, let's say collectively, it is like a furnace 'cause you and another person, you have different ways on like, this should be done this way, this should be done that way. And in my experience, you either like, let go of a lot of stuff or just fucking explode. Like there's no other way, you have to, you know. - And also you gotta really anticipate that people are gonna change, that nobody stays the same, that's not the point of life is to stay the same, it's to people are growing, they're doing different things and to anticipate that, and then really, I think make that just commitment to kind of go with it and whether or not fight against it. - No, no, Tony, I used to always, always when I was younger, I hear people say, like just that similar, like kind of folksy, happy, look, wife, happy life stuff, and I'd always be like, never. I'll never give up. And then you get the point, you gotta fucking give up, dude. I'm done, I'll do, I'll just fucking clean up my plate or whatever you're so freaked out about. But yeah, but it's good, you know what I mean? It sounds not, but it's like, I don't know, you know what for me, this is kind of different, but COVID for me, this whole thing about being kind to other people, 'cause I was like, I'm a nice guy, and then I would notice, I didn't notice how much I did this before COVID, but I would be in a grocery store and I would like, I would just see a person, and my brain, my brain was constructed to keep myself somehow above anyone around me and any way I could think of. So I would like see, I would see like a tall, handsome, muscular man, I'd be like, fucking loser, guys, it's probably a big dork, thinks you're so fucking cool. Guys, literally probably a dumbass, and then I would just see like a lady, like, fuck that fucking lady. And I would just do this in my head. I know, I know what to do. I'm the same, I was not, no, I would do this all the time. I'd walk around and go, I'm just fucking look at this guy, and then COVID heightened it, 'cause it was like, people would have the mask, I wasn't a fan of it. I was like, I think it's weird, we're all afraid of the air, so I would go out, I wasn't being super aggressive with it, but like if I was outside walking my dog, I'm not wearing a mask, like I'm fine, I'm not worried, we're all far apart from each other. And I would get like dirty looks in my neighborhood, 'cause everyone was like completely K95ed up. And I had, they like, it like heightened that thing in my head. So now it was like enemies to me, and I was like, fucking look at this fuck. Now it was like really amped up, and I remember, I think I was in like a Whole Foods or something, and I realized somehow that every time I'd walk past a person and be like, look at this fucking piece of shit, it gave me a bad feeling, and I just, something like snapped at me to where I start, every person I saw, I'd be like rooting for them on some level, I'd be like, I wish them the best, and I'd still have that look at this fucking lady's weird ass fucking past, but I'd be like, but I wish her the best, and dude, I have filled with like an incredible sense of peace, and ever since I've been, 'cause the whole thing for me is like, even if you see somebody who's like kind of unbearable, maybe doing something crazy or whatever, once you have kids, you're like, oh that's somebody's kid. So like if my kids are out in the world, God forbid someone to walk past them or like, nice fucking hat dumbass, I'd be so upset. So I started being like, well I'm gonna treat everybody, like there's someone else's kid, and you know, and it's like, 'cause you know, I would hope their parents would like want them to be treated nicely, and if their parents don't care if they're treated nicely or not, then they need even more kind of like loving careness or you know, loving care and whatever it's called, and-- - Having a kid's really helps with taking that kind of perspective too, especially like with your own parents, like once you have a kid thinking about your own parents, how they dealt with you, and having a little bit of respect for that, you know, being a dad and having a dad, you know. - Oh yes. - And other people too, like you're saying, but I don't know what that is. I had that same thing about judging everybody, and it's a weird, where does that come from? - I have, even if you're self-aware, you're like, why did I keep doing that, you know. - I have a theory, I have a theory, and it's a, my theory is that, so it goes, I think it goes all the way back to like, it's just a thing in nature. Like if you're an organism-- - You have to, you have to size everything up. - Exactly, but if you're an organism, say, and like there's a bigger organism than you, you have a fear of annihilation instinctively. You're going, "This thing's bigger than me. Now I'm going to die." And I think humans have so many dimensions to judge where it's like, money, looks, success. What, it's like infinite, like, so, like, comparing. - So if you sense someone somehow bigger than you, then it's like, you have to somehow cut them down in your head, 'cause there's like a weird innate fear that pops up. That's my theory. - Yeah, yeah. - So you just walk around the day at all night, and then if there's someone that like, you can just completely slam dunk on, it's probably just a feeling of victory, where you're like, this fucking piece of shit. So, yeah, I don't know. That's my theory about that, but it doesn't help you. And the thing is, is you think you get this buzz off it, but I really think it makes you feel worse. - Yeah, it does. - It's kind of like when you're in grade school, doing that, you know, it starts there almost. - Oh, for sure. - Kids are making fun of other kids, and you still feel like when you're an adult doing that, you feel like you're a kid, essentially, it's still. - It's a ruffle, but I, yeah, I mean it's fun. - Well, if you're with your bros, it's fun to mess around with your bros like that. But yeah, if you're out in like in public around someone who's essentially a stranger, and you're like, I know a lot of people do this, it starts just absolutely ragging on people away from where you can't do that. It's not nice. - Yeah. - But, but that helped me with social. - It's a very comedy though. Don't you always have to be observing, and like it's part of it, it's picking people apart, or they're inter-syncrasies, and it's part of the. - If I'm struggling on stage, I'll sacrifice a crowd member, just 'cause I'm like, I'm not doing well, and I'll just absolutely sacrifice somebody. And I know I'm like, this is wrong, but I need this laugh right now, and I'm gonna make fun of your hat, and I'm gonna make you feel terrible right now so that I can continue. (laughing) And I know it's not right, but it's, you know. - Well, you're doing it to yourself too, like about your own life, and how. - Yeah. - Well, I do that, but if I, if I, that's an easy trick to get a crowd on your side, it's absolutely just crush somebody in the crowd, and then they're like, alright, you got any of you guys want this? You better start fucking laughing at me. I will fuck you. No, that's how I'm like growing up. My family dinners were like that though. Like, we'd all, I was one of six kids, and we'd all sit around the table, and it was just like, it was a war zone. Like everyone was starting making fun of each other. Like my dad would get involved, and like, hey, he would just like, it would be one victim. You'd be, if it, the light turned on you, whatever it was starting, just saying whatever they could to just completely humiliate you. - Yeah. - And you had to like strike out against somebody else and it would turn the attention on them. And it was like, it was like every night at dinner. - That's probably how your comedy started, no. - It could be, I don't know. But it's definitely, that could be, at least where that very critical negative voice came from, was you to be eating, and like, did you have five other people being like, whoa, look at your fat legs, and you'd be like, fuck! - You know, you'd have to fire back somehow. - Yeah. - So, it's not the best, but it is fun. - I don't know. - I do think it's fun though. Like, it's fucking with people, if they're, you know, I don't know, even when they get, when they react negatively to it, it is so much more fun. If you catch someone who takes himself so seriously. - Yeah, I know, I know, right. - I'm kind of like a bloodhound for that. If I detect somebody's kind of like getting like, pissed like that, I can't help it. I'll start like, needling a mess around. - Yeah, yeah, yeah. - But when I was-- - When we were kids, yeah, my friends and I would just kill each other, I'm like, yeah, I assume it's like in every, you know, in every circle when you're a kid. We just kill each other. - Yeah. - Over and over. It's part of the whole and then but people would laugh, you know, it's just it's funny to that that's a difference Yeah, if you got to be able to take it. Yeah, cuz that's my that's my mom's big critique of my dad loves giving it out But if you get him he's just like you guys are asshole. He doesn't he doesn't like it Love's dishing it out can't take it, which I think that's probably everybody but But nice man, so you so the the sports doc. So you're talking grisky who else who else is an example that there's Tom Brady Gretzky so Rocky Marciano who was one of the greatest obviously boxers ever of his time was like, you know, really short He had no reach, but he developed this style You know where he would just really like Tyson had this to he would get close he basically was undefeated and he would get close and And basically like hit from up close. He would just keep, you know get staying your face Exactly, and he was undefeated, but his body was like, you know Was not meant for heavyweight boxing. Yeah, I'm saying he was he was short You know not very heavy and had a short reach But developed a style like Lionel Messi. I mean he was also shorter than most people he had this Human growth issue where he like wouldn't grow when he was a kid and had to get testosterone, but he was you know He also developed this flea like style of like You know deacon people and he was so good with the ball and smart you know what I'm saying? So yeah that deficiency, but he over compensated in other ways I mean you go through even jury rights. So he's When best receivers in history, he said he wasn't very fast You know, but he he basically memorized timing and route so perfectly that It gave him that you know competitive advantage because he was in the right place at the right time You know exactly when you know when the ball was coming. You know what I'm saying. Yeah I'm just thinking of all that that's really nice too because I especially like with little kids I've noticed it's like Maybe it's always been that way, but it like I'm just noticing now so I have kids But there's like a serious paranoid about any even signs of like just kid showing any devil Then I'll just let you know delays mobile while people are referring out about that and it's nice to think like yeah rather than trying to like Force my weaknesses to become something they'll never become how can I kind of you know adapt and kind of you know Played in my own strengths. I'm like even like Greg Maddick's I was just thinking I mean he would he's not even in my film, but like Same thing. I mean he was he sort of doesn't really look like a baseball player like he's a little bit shlubby He's not that tall. He's not that strong, but his accuracy and his ability to Understand batters and you know was on a whole another level. Yeah, it's you look at every sport every of the greatest athletes It's something like that, you know, that's completely unexpected, you know I call it like Polsky's law because it's like everything you see everything you see is like the opposite. Yeah You know, that's pretty cool. You coin there. I did coin it I say to my family. I don't like Well, now here on the podcast, but what just that I don't like to be like a douche bag You know why I want coining buddy. No one else is gonna do it for you. Yeah, you don't do post these law people are taking it They'll call it maybe McCusker's law Everything you see is the opposite. Yeah So what is what is the law again? You're saying everything is opposite is what you everything is the opposite of what you see You know what you think so if somebody's like happy all the time, you know, like They're they might be you know the saddest people got you. You've seen things like that or you know These sort of paradoxes of opposites. Yeah, I like the surface let the thing you present is yeah the reality is probably compensating Yeah, hey guys real quick. I have some shows this weekend coming up. I'll be doing live stand-up comedy. I'll be at the Belding theater and Hartford, Connecticut January 23rd. That'll be Friday Saturday. I'll be at the Egg the heart theater at the egg in Albany, New York Both the take most of both those shows shows are almost sold out. So please come And if you want to come there's you know if you take it's left also the I'll be in Las Vegas then Denver, Boise Idaho, Salt Lake City, Cleveland Just go to matmacusker.com. There's a bunch of other places for tickets. Thank you I'll be in Helium Atlanta tonight Thursday through Saturday. Please come if you can if I know the weather's gonna be bad But I'll still be there. So please come shongardini.com. The link is below. Thank you very much I'll be at Dallas Hyenas the 23rd, which is Friday or in yellow. It was keen on Saturday Paintings and mouth pockets. Come on guys. Woo Fair. Did you ever see the guy? There's a guy on Instagram who does facial scanning where he'll be like The big guy this guy has a this kind of face and you know, he has always funny names. So there's like tree face Blockfit and it's like it's not like it's a rocket or things like these are the facial structure terms But he'll like he says like no one's two eyes are the same and it'll be like so we'll cover up the left eye Make the right eye is the eye of the father and that's your secret hidden self and like look how afraid he looks in this eye And they cover this eye and they'll be like this is the eye of the mother and this is like your you know outward personality But it looks like angry. It's really kind of fascinating And when you see it, it's like it's not complete bullshit because like everyone does have like slightly different looks in each eye I've been in the mirror nonstop the last couple weeks. Just trying to like see which side of time in which eyes with like what it says about me It's kind of a tear that he like looks at people's faces and he breaks them down To a tee and some of the people of people he you know, he like knows nothing about and then the producer goes Oh, this guy like killed his entire family. He goes well. Yeah, I Told you look kind of fucked up and they the craziest thing they said there's a term called um If you notice it, but it's like it's called whites on three terms three sides of the eye So like when people have a lot of white showing underneath their eyeball He's like that's like a giant red flag Because he had he had done the guy Fuck, I forgot his name the guy who killed his parents The grinder he did a facial analysis of that guy and that dude's eyeballs are like like you see a lot of the whites under his eye So I've been on the lookout for that lately But there's it's like a Japanese saying for whites under three sides of the eye and it's like kind of like you see that Be careful. Oh wow. That is cool. Tampaku. Is that what it's called? Oh, yeah, Tampaku whites on three sides of the eyes Yeah, I feel like all the those serial killers. They all have that look. Yeah, I don't know if we're sort of If that's a stereotype. I don't know, but they do have I don't know if it's like you know, they took too much acid or whatever could be I and this the funny thing was so I heard about that white on three side of the eye thing and I kept saying to myself like I would hear of people being like oh, I just did like a bunch of Iowasca And a lot of them would get this wonky look in their eyes and it's literally it kind of looked like you'd see a little bit underneath And I can never like pin down like what is that about that? But it was like a I don't know. Yeah, I've done I've done Have you done Iowasca? Yeah, do I have that? How do you know you don't have that you have you're free from what's it called again Tansaka? Yeah sandboxa. What's your thoughts in Iowasca? it's Well, I You know, it's very mystical. It's opens kind of like a portal to different dimensions that you know It's just it's just it's very hard to describe, but it's very mystical. It's it's beyond Opening a portal to something that you can't experience without You know taking Iowasca, you know, imagine, you know God or somebody saying, you know, let me just show you this New dimension or several of them of what what's possible in the mind and you're just like oh my god This is insane, you know, to have an experience like this and you know, part of it is you know, and I can't confirm this but is the healing healing of You know past traumas and you're throwing up. You're purging. You know, you you feel better afterwards It's not that I I didn't do it because I necessarily I'm looking to get healed or anything for me It was more of a curiosity and and and just sort of understanding a deeper understanding of who are we? What are we doing here? What what is all this? You know, yeah, and it's just if you're somebody who who is curious about Reality and mysticism and sort of understanding deeper About reality and stuff like that. I think it's it's fascinating and enlightening in that way You know, go I mean it's definitely still confusing because it's like you're opening into this portal and you're just like what the hell is all this this is this is Incredible and crazy and strange and you know, I'm saying but it's not it's not like oh here's the answer to life sure Some people do say oh, I was told this and you know, I met Jesus or I don't know what what they happens then for me, you know I can't say that I have a lot more clarity about everything, but It gave me a richer Feeling about life and what's beyond what we can see yeah, you know I don't know if you've ever I mean That with mushrooms yeah, that's what I was gonna ask you. How does it compare to like a super high dose of mushrooms? I don't know if you've ever done different almost as dimension You know, it's like you know mushrooms you go into In one dimension, which is like I don't know. I mean it's also mystical. You're in a portal. You're you're seeing things that are Yeah, you could never imagine, you know but ayahuasca's like even a little bit of a different, each plant has its own almost world or something. - Did you feel like out of body or was it you were just looking around at stuff? - Kind of, but you're just, you're just in another world. You don't even feel a part of your body, you're just almost going into other dimensions with different, you know, patterns. You feel like almost in, and again, and everyone has different experience, but I felt like I was in some kind of strange matrix of patterns that were, you know, in the patterns would sort of tell you stuff in a way or like how many times you're dealing with you. Do you have these feeling, you know? - How many times did you do it? - I've done it like seven times. - Really? - So that's been my thing with ayahuasca. I've never done it because I talked to people and they're like, I've done it like 55 times, like literally like 55 times, and I'm like, what, why would you think so many would do it that many times? - Well, why would somebody do it? - I mean, I don't know. There are people do it for different reasons. Some people, they like need to get healed or they're trying to get to something and they're trying to, it's a medicine. I mean, some of these shamans or people in the Amazon, they're doing it thousands of times, you know? So for them, that's not a big deal. You know, it's just part of daily life. They want to access the spiritual realms. You know, they want to be close to that because there's a lot happening right now that, you know, we're not perceiving, we're not seeing. You know, some people can be in both worlds at the same time. They can be in this reality, but also experiencing, you know, this spiritual reality at the same time. The question you ask was, why do they need to do it that much? I've also noticed that people can do it a thousand times and they're still kind of the same, you know? Which is, I don't know, are you trying to change so much? Sure. I see what you're saying. It's like looking at it from like a cure perspective where it's like, you hear that. I've seen people get better mostly. Yeah, mostly you get better. That's cool. Of a person, that's nice. Yeah, I mean, so if you're somebody that is just like constantly depressed or has negativity, just, you know, generally, well, will Smith, after the slap, I think he had done ayahuasca like 30 times. Really? I sort of got, he did, he came out of the ayahuasca portal in a slapped Chris Rock right in the face. I could be wrong about that, but I read his book and he was like that, he claimed like that was something that came kind of for like the right time for him. But yeah, that makes sense. So it's not like a cure all, but it definitely, 'cause I agree with that, like with like, you know, just doing like mushroom, I've only ever done like mushrooms and acid and stuff. Have you done it like in a party setting or more, just like, whoa, I'm gonna go deep. I'm gonna go on my own and I don't like the party setting. Yeah, I don't like that. Although I took acid out of concert, it was awesome, but that was sick. But the, but I prefer to like lay down somewhere quiet and do it, that's how I did the mushrooms and it was like, it was awesome. Yeah, it's great. For me, it's like, it's awesome. It really does like shape. For me, like in the experience of it, you're like, oh, I've figured it out. What are you in it? You're like, I figured it all out. But in reality for me, it does like shave edges off, so I'm gonna answer my own question. That's why I do it 55 times. It does feel like it like shaves off edges slowly, but you know what, it's like a two percent. Like once you, weeks later, once you like the afterglow and that stuff wears off, you're like, you're like, I'm still the same, but it has like, shaved off a lot. Like the mushrooms are subconscious, didn't really. And it helped the mushrooms help for me realize how much, I didn't realize how neurotic I was. I always knew I wasn't like, you know, like not neurotic. But when I took those mushrooms, it was like, the five grams, I like laid in bed that whole thing and kind of blindfolded and all that. And I, the day of I was like picking out clothes, like they're like, what am I, I'm gonna like wear something comfortable and there was like, I was looking at my closet and there was like stuff I had gotten a long time ago from Goodwill and I would look at shirts and like, that could be on a, that could be like a dead guy shirt. I was like, I'm not wearing that today. Like I, I didn't realize, and then when I did it, it was like, it just really just kind of like, always tell people, it feels like there was like, you know, like your own frame of awareness is like a football helmet, you can't take off. And it was just like, take it off. And I got to like look at it and I was like, dude, I'm fucking nuts. And then I was like, I'll fuck. And then, but it was good. And then like, well, I'd like wake up in the middle of the night to pee and I'll just get like rushed with the most insane thoughts of like, I gotta get it back better right now. If I don't fall back asleep, and it's like, it just kind of like, dead it a lot of that stuff, which was, that was like nice. Yeah, and it's hard to, sometimes you'll, you'll feel like you've got the key to life. It's right there. I figured it out and then literally, like two seconds later, you forget what just happened. You forget everything. It's amazing. You have the most incredible experience and, you know, a day later, you just can't remember anything. Yeah, that's kind of a weird thing. But it does go into your subconscious. That's true. And I do think it'll be nice to this before, but it'll be nice for people now who will like have to confront death, you know what I mean? Like when you're getting older, it's like, yeah, like that, that's gonna be a godsend. 'Cause before it was like, you just had to like, smoke cigarettes and like watch TV. And that's like a really gritty way to like die. You know what I mean? To try to like contextualize your death and like come to peace with it. So yeah, I think that'll be a good thing for a lot of people. I think that like, did you get this sense when you did, it's like a Daleks that like, somehow you, this is where you're going like, after you die like into this kind of dimension or. - No, that I kind of would prepare you for. - I didn't get that feeling, honestly. I honestly, I just more so get stuff of like, you know, mine's more about like life, about like, this is just kind of what life is and you know, blah, blah, blah. Like yeah, but no, I've heard people say that with DMT, like, oh, like yeah, and now I know like. - It did feel like that with ayahuasca that like, somehow that I'd been to that place before, this weird dimension that I've been there many, many times, you know, and so I do feel like that might be where, where you're headed, you know. - Yeah, that's plausible. I mean, again, I know, I agree, man, that's the one thing of like, just having some form of religious or spiritual sentiment, like sentiment, like whatever sentiment out, I don't even know the words, sentiments, words, just having something to be like, I'm not going to die in rot in the ground for nothing. Like it's my life as a meaning. Like that's, it's so bad for you. And I remember reading, I think it was Carl Jung was saying that like, he had, I think that's how AA kind of started, where he met whatever the guy's name was, Bill W. And told the guy, the guy was like, dude, I've tried everything to get off alcohol. I don't know what to do. And he was like, yeah, dude, you're like 35. Like if you don't somehow come to grips with like, some concept of God, you're toast. And he's like every person I've ever worked with, that's kind of the X factor. You're like 40 and you're like, I'm a staunch atheist. He's like, yeah, you're gonna be depressed though, so. - Yeah. - Good luck. - I kind of agree with that, yeah. - Yeah. - Yeah, some spirit, some creator or something. I mean, you know, we're here for some reason, I mean. - Yeah, and it's, you know, we're, we're, we're. - Well, it's funny because this is a childish superstition. It's like, I can face it by myself. It's like, fucking good luck. - Yeah, I can't handle it. - Yeah. - Well, yeah, well, that's cool, man. That's a, how long, when did you start doing it? Like, when did that kind of come into the mix? - I think actually during this process of making this film, that makes sense. - Yeah, exactly, but I've always been super scared of it because when I was like 12 years old, I smoked pot, you know, and I totally freaked out and thought I was crazy and just like for a good six months, like I had a panic attack and was still like just in shock. It totally tuned me up and I was just like, what the hell? You know, it was devastating. And so after that, for like 20 years, I was afraid to do anything like, wow, if pot, you know what I'm saying? Like, the thing. - Oh, so you went from like, no, anything, nothing? - Nothing for like, you know, I mean, obviously, you know, alcohol and stuff like that. But because, you know, I, the weed was so like insane for me, I have an experience in jockeying. - What was the bug out like at 12? - 'Cause I smoked weed when I was younger and I was chill. - Wow, it was freaking out. - No, I did do it one time and it was chill and then I did it again and I just completely lost it. Like, yeah, I was just like a panic attack. I wasn't prepared for the psychedelic aspect of it. I mean, it was just like really, you know, I did a lot, like a lot of kids, you know, and just everything was like this and I thought I was gonna die. I thought I was going crazy literally for whatever. And it was so traumatizing that for months, I was just like, is this real? Is this what is going on, you know? - Yeah. - And no one knew like what to do. They thought I was like, very easy. - And he couldn't tell you, but I just, I did tell them. - Did you realize I was just like, you know, I needed to go to the hospital, like this is. - Dang, what did they say? - They were all with me. They had no idea what to do. I mean, gradually, they, it's dissipated. - Yeah. - It never felt like my old self, you know, and it really kind of tuned me up and made me feel like very vulnerable. - Yeah. - And it's alright. - Yeah. - That's a, dang, that's crazy. - And so since that point, I was like terrified of losing my mind, you know? But ultimately I gained enough courage, you know, in the last few years to like, you know, it's just so curious that I wanted to try it and I kind of started to. - They have most of the girls here. - Terrific. - Like, absolutely, like, and I think everybody's a little bit terrified of these, you know, these plan medicines or mushrooms because, you know, everyone's afraid of losing their mind, you know? - Yeah, true. - But I think part of it is that's what we kind of need to do, you know, that this world is tough. - Yeah, I've been, I've been just for like, you know, was doing a podcast ago. I'm like, I should know, like, what's the top 10 new stories right now, and I've been, like, rocking being like, you know, what's, hit me with the top 10 new stories? - Yeah. - So scary. Everything you read is like really bad. - Yeah. - That's like, fuck, this is, you know, and it is, it is funny. I mean, it's one of those things, where it's like, we should just get along, but it's like, it's got to be something we can do. - This is, this is kind of nuts. You read every story. It's just like, the technology's too good. We can't keep fighting. The technology's too strong. Get into like, bio weapons, all this other shit, it's like, do we got to be nice? That's literally where we're going to die. We're all going to die, and like a hot nasty flash, and it's going to be pretty, pretty sad. - And going back to the movie, I mean, you know, I guess what I learned was that a lot of these indigenous prophecies, kind of we're all saying the same thing. So for the past like, 100,000s of years, they've been saying, at this time, the world would be going through incredibly difficult place, like cataclysmic kind of things, and that it will be in such a bad place that, you know, we're going to really need indigenous wisdom. Go back to the original, they called the original order. You know, the, go back to the origins, you know, of indigenous wisdom and connection to the earth that we're going to need to basically save it ourselves. - Yeah. - You know, part of that is connection to, you know, the earth listening, the earth listening, all what's going on, and then behaving in the right way. I don't know. It's, yeah, I mean, it's fair. - Because you're here, we're going to run out of water. It's like, fuck, yeah, three quarters of the rest. What's all water? - Yeah. - Fucking use it up. But yeah, that's a, yeah, I mean, I think the thing that freaks me out is I think human beings need a cataclysm. If you're not going to like completely like rock your socks or psychedelics, it's like, well, reality's going to reach a fever pitch so hard that like, it's either going to make a plague. You know, COVID was like a minor, that was like a little bit, but like, I mean, it's nothing like, you know, like the black death in Europe. That was like a real kind of rocker socks moment. COVID was like scary, but you know, it wasn't like, you know, kids dying. It was still like the elderly, which is like, you know, sucks, but it's not like as gripping, I would say, is like every, you know, 10th kid fucking dying, which is like, maybe we'll never have that again because of medicine. But yeah, it's, I do worry that humans need another big old cataclysm to kind of like, all right, all right, all right. And I think now like God knows what that could look like. If it's not a natural disaster, if it's like a man-made cataclysm could be, that could be rough. Yeah. And it's for like, for what? It's like, you know what I mean? Like, what are we, what are we doing here? Yeah, I mean, I don't know. Yeah, the reality is definitely getting weirder and weirder, you know, right now. Yeah. The world and it's just, an understanding reality, understanding, you know, what to believe. You know, that's kind of, these are big things in my movie too. It's just what stories do we choose to believe? What do we believe in this kind of chaos, you know? Yeah. You know, it's true. Yeah, I, again, I just read the news now and I just prayed, don't know this is true. I hope it's all fake. I hope it stage to scare me. That's like the best case scenario. I need to look at it like now. These are probably a bunch of psychos fighting and, you know, yeah. We shall see. But Gabe, thank you, brother. Thank you, dude. Dude, definitely go check out the movie. It's called The Man Who Saves the World. Question mark. And it's, dude, I, I'm telling you, I liked it so much. I was, as soon as I watched it, I was, I was, I was talking provided. I was like, dude, this is, the shoot was awesome. Where the fuck, where'd you get this? So what it, you did a theater run in it, right? You released it in theater. Yeah. So we're still, we're still in theaters. We're doing basically like a tour, like a common, you know, comedy tour. We're basically, you know, been all over the country and, you know, so people at the end of the month where we're doing four cities, you know, we're, we're doing San Francisco on the 27th and then Oakland on the 28th and then Boulder on the 30th. This is January. This is January. Okay. Nice. And then from there, what do the plans just keep? Yeah. So we're, we're kind of building, you know, this grassroots, you know, brand, you know, the audience swallowing and, and then ultimately, you know, it'll be more widely available, but cool. Yeah. So we're, we're just, we're out there getting the word out and, and doing these theatrical events. Nice. What do you, what do you have, you have anything down the pipe? We're, we're, wouldn't it be an Austin by the way, February 26th? Oh, there you go. Nice man. You, what do you have any other projects you want to work on? You know, I'm so focused on just taking care of this that, that, that it's kind of my main focus right now is just making sure that this is released well and, and then, yeah, I've got, I've got a bunch of other things I'm, I'm sort of thinking about. Cool. Yeah. All right, man. We'll do. Thank you. Yeah. Thank you, dude. Of course. Watch new episodes of Matt and Shane's Secret Podcast on Spotify. Do it.