Speaker 1Quick disclaimer before we dive into this episode. Nothing in this episode is medical advice and it's not meant to diagnose, treat, or replace guidance from your own doctor. Please don't try any of what we discuss without taking to a qualified healthcare provider first. This is for informational and entertainment purposes only.
Speaker 2We believe very strongly that this is going to be the future of health optimization. Dry fasting in and of itself is so profound and it's noticeable and your life changes in five or seven days. I myself did blood work on my five-day dry fast before and after all of my blood markers increased. My testosterone bumped up 200 points.
Speaker 3During the recovery period, you have a 70% documented increase in stem cells circulating in the body. Tell me one other medical or natural health therapy that can go into your brain, remodel scar tissue, release stem cells, and grow. New connections and heal the brain. There isn't one. It's the ultimate regeneration and that's irrefutable.
Speaker 1Theo, Sean, thanks for joining me, guys. Love being here. So good to be here, dude. Love having you. Love having you. Can you start by just introducing yourself and how you guys came together as a nice, cute couple? You go first. All right. Why is that funny?
Speaker 3Probably because we had to sleep in the same bed last night.
Speaker 1We've known each other. You didn't have to, by the way. You chose to. Facts. Yeah. I haven't taken ownership.
Speaker 3We've covered this, though.
Speaker 2We're all collegiate athletes. It's no big deal sleeping in the same bed, you know, shacking up for a night. So Theo and I have known each other for, I don't know, maybe eight years now.
Speaker 3I think so.
Speaker 2Kind of back and forth. You know, my work with the Optimal Performance Podcast and the Float Centers and. I think I.
Speaker 1Yeah. Yeah. You were one of the first podcasts I ever did. Ah. Doing what I do now, whatever I do. Yeah. I reached out early.
Speaker 2I reached out really early.
Speaker 1Yeah. Yeah. Like mid, early 2021 or something like that. It was a long time ago. I think it was even earlier than that. Maybe late 2020. Yeah. It was a while ago, man.
Speaker 2Yeah. Yeah. So, you know, the podcast, the coaching that I do, the content that I send out, you know, have a lot of parallels to. Theo's focus and the work that he does. You know, we're kind of, you know, natural health wizards. We like subtle energy work. We do lots of different sort of overlapping stuff that we're interested in. And we just connected online, started sending emails, started chatting about, you know, the things I'm into and the things he. You know, you've got tons and tons of internet friends that are like, hey, I like what you're about. Same thing for us. And then it wasn't until. It was really maybe two years ago where, you know, I would share something with him and he'd be like, eh, let me do my own research on it. And then he'll try it and vice versa. And then one day he said, you know, you got to start dry fasting. And I was like. He said it. He said it. Yeah, it was his suggestion. He's like, just go a couple of days without food and water. And I was like, eh, really? I mean, at that point I had done tons and tons. I've done the. You know, the Prolon fasting mimicking diet. I'd done water only fast and juice fast and stuff like that. Multiple days. And I was like, well, maybe I could try it. And then we worked more closely together. I've had him on the podcast a number of times. And, you know, we just connected as friends and shared lots of different information back and forth over the years. And it was. And the dry fasting was the thing that really kind of made us connect and build something together.
Speaker 3Yeah. And it was. I actually called you from the Irwan parking lot in Venice and I invited you to be on my Underground Health Summit.
Speaker 2Yeah, that's right.
Speaker 3So I used to host health summits, like, you know, the big online summits. And I did one called the Underground Health Summit, like, very early. Was it early COVID or right before? It was before COVID. It was like 2019, 2018, somewhere around there. And I called them and you were talking about the full moon fast. Yeah. And you want to talk about that, but you hadn't covered it. You hadn't created it yet, but you were into the concept of fasting, not only for physical benefits, but spiritual, energetic, and emotional. On the full moon specifically? Yes. Yeah. What was
Speaker 1the reason for that?
Speaker 2The culmination. So when you take a full moon cycle or a sidereal cycle, you know, there's connections with. You don't want to get rid of parasites on a full moon to get the eggs, etc. You know, you look at the frequency of ER visits on the full moon. Like, whether we like it or not, whatever the moon is, or isn't, like, we are a part of that cycle. And combining the preparation that I had done and the research that I've done in detoxification and fasting and also, you know, reducing inputs in preparation for ayahuasca, it was like, all right, well, can I put together a program where it's mental, physical, emotional, and spiritual culminating on a 14-day or 15-day half sidereal cycle?
Speaker 1So basically, starting on the new moon, ending on the full?
Speaker 2Exactly. Got it. Exactly. And because, you know, picking days to do a detox or do a program, you know, it's just willy-nilly, right? Maybe it starts on a Tuesday, maybe it's five days. I was focusing on harnessing the power of the moon in order to, like, really go through major changes. So that was like. It was nascent, you know? It was just sort of an idea, and I was combining all of these things together. And that idea, you know, resonated with Theo. But it wasn't. I never even released it. Like, I didn't even put it out because I was so interested in so many other things. So a lot of these practices, like, sort of grew into other things. But yeah, we did talk about it on your summit.
Speaker 3Yeah, we did a little bit, and then it was more the float center, kind of the float tank thing. And then, you know, we did our own thing and kind of kept in touch over the years. And the first time I did dry fasting, I remember, I think I said, I sent you an email or texted you or something. I was like, dude, you got to try this. And you weren't super into it at first. It took like a year. It did. To kind of wear you down. Yeah. But I was like, dude, this is mind-blowing. Because my whole thing with natural health is if you focus on the cell, if you focus on fixing one cell, you can fix them all. And if you can do that, you can de-age, you can have more energy, and energy is a currency of life. And my own journey in natural health happened after. Co-owning a commercial real estate investment company in La Jolla, California. So suburb of San Diego, basically. And I was burnt out. Did it for 15 years. I worked seven days a week and made good money, but at very high cost, mitochondrial dysfunction. And had chronic fatigue in my 30s, really bad, like real bad. I mean, I could barely wake up in the morning.
Speaker 1And you're 47, 48 right now?
Speaker 3I'm almost 49.
Speaker 1You're almost 49. Yeah. You don't look almost 49.
Speaker 3It's
Speaker 2maddening. You look
Speaker 3like you're my age. Well, we can get into this later, but I went crazy researching natural health because a lot of new people, I didn't know where to start. I was like, do I just work out all the time, which is actually how I started. Do I just take a million supplements, like Brian Johnson style? Not the liver steroid guy, but the other one.
Speaker 1Biohacking Brian Johnson.
Speaker 3Do I go full energy and just do that? Do I do weird diets? And just focus only on food, which, you know, there's a lot of people are very dogmatic about that. And I researched what's the unifying factor of health? What is the foundation of it all? And it's biophysics, right? So there's no chemical reaction in the body that happens without the movement of electrical charge first. So if you focus on the biophysics environment of your body, you can heal things at a root level. And the book that really got me into that was Healing is Voltage by Dr. Jerry Tennant. And so I read that book, it was revolutionary for me. And it's basically two concepts. Like, you know, the only things that cause low health or poor health are severe nutrient deficiencies and toxins and the nutrient deficiencies.
Speaker 1Would you add emotions to that too? Yes. Yeah. So I would
Speaker 3consider, uh, emotions that don't serve you a toxin.
Speaker 1And so, or unprocessed emotions, rather than emotions in and of themselves. Emotions are good. You need to have the emotions.
Speaker 3I had that part of me. My healing journey and Sean and I connected on that because I got really good physically, but something still felt off and then I was like, oh God, now I got to go into the emotional healing psychedelic world and I did. And it was great, but long story short to tie it back to our topic today, the ultimate expression of rejuvenating yourselves, rejuvenating your body mentally, physically, emotionally, and spiritually is a dry fast. So I found my way to dry fasting. And, you know, when all in, I didn't, I didn't train up, I just did a five-day dry fast, um, cold turkey.
Speaker 1No pre-feeding, no like preparation and opening your detox pathways or anything like that.
Speaker 3So I'd been detoxing for many years before, and we should definitely loop back on that because there are, there are people that shouldn't do what I did, but I'd, I'd been doing 21 day sauna, niacin detoxes, I'd done wet fasting before, or what I like to call a water diet because it's, it's a diet. You're still pregnant. processing stuff with your-- -
Speaker 1Ah, interesting, you don't even call it work water fasting? It's not a fast. It's not a fast. It's so funny, dude, because I've said to people who call things like consuming only bone broth or juices, a juice fast. Oh, bone broth fast. I'm like, no, no, no. It's a diet. This is just water. It's a fast, but you're going a step beyond and saying, even if you drink water, it's not fast. It's not a fast.
Speaker 3It's a water diet because it activates your GI tract. And when your GI tract is activated, a different biochemical pathway is going on, which causes gluconeogenesis. So your body will break down protein, your muscles and vital tissue, your organs to create glucose for energy. And when you dry fast, that pathway is not turned on. So it spares muscles. It spares your organs and it turns on radical ketogenic activity. And that's, that's where it drives the energy from. So it'll shred fat, shred tumors, shred cysts, said shred scar tissue, misfolded proteins, damaged DNA at all. It'll take all that apart and use it for energy and spare the muscle.
Speaker 2Yeah. I mean, if it's a, if you're doing, if you're hugging juice all day, you know, whether even it's really high quality juice, the best quality juice you can get your hand on, it's still, it's a diet. You're still consuming something that's activating all of your organs. And so, right. So like, you know, for as, as great a work as, as Walter Longo has done in fasting and innovations, like I did the prolon fasting mimicking diet. Have you tried that? I've done no.
Speaker 1So I've done a 15 day water fast before I've done multiple, cleanses where I've done like bone broth for an extent. I just, I just told you as we're coming. Yeah. I just did a three day only bone broth. Yeah. Cleanse. If you want to call it that. Yeah. I've done things like that quite a bit.
Speaker 2Yeah. Yeah. The idea that you're going to get the therapeutic effects of a fast while you're still consuming food now, it just doesn't, it just no longer competes. I agree with that.
Speaker 1Totally agree with that. But you can still cleanse doing that. It's just not, it's just not the same thing. But even with water though too. Even with water. Yeah. And you're someone who I bet prior to this, like maybe two, three, whatever, how many years ago before you did a dry fast were on a separate page where it's like, no, well, water fasting. It's a fast. I thought it was a fast. Yeah.
Speaker 2I mean, I'd done three, five, the, the longest water only fast I did was seven days and I was absolutely miserable. Like I was wrecked. I was totally wrecked, you know, and I was doing mineral water. I was doing, and then I did another one where I was doing mineral water, you know, and adding amino acids to it, you know, so I could like save that muscle, see that lead muscle mass. So I had done all these different experiments and every single one of them was like, absolutely like headaches, back pain, sleep disruption, agitation. It was a, it was a, it was a mess every single time. And I would lose a couple pounds and I would get less inflamed, but the, the suffering is okay sometimes, but it was, my body didn't really, I didn't really connect with that experience. And it was because I was still activating all my organs and my body was taking in the water, activating all my organs. And I was just trying to go through my normal day. I'm totally out of harmony, totally dysfunctional, a pain to be around. And then, so now, yeah, you're right. I don't think of, I don't think of water diets as a fast at all.
Speaker 3Did you have the withdrawal headaches? Oh, terrible. Terrible.
Speaker 2Every time. Yeah.
Speaker 1Can I share my experience just real quick? And I'm sure people who listen to this podcast are like, dude, we've heard it a thousand times, but just for context, for the sake of this episode, first off your point that you shared at the end, I was miserable to be around. I've tried doing what I would still call right now, water fast, but I'm open to the idea. It's not just water diet, uh, with my family and kids present. And I start having so much irritability because the first few days in my experience is so much low energy and food craving. And like all your addictive tendencies of like, you have a caffeine addiction or whatever it is, is coming up and like, there's nowhere to cope. So there's been multiple times I had intended to do an extended fast while I'm with my wife and kids. And I'm just like day three, day four, day five. I'm like, all right, I can't do this with them. So when I did the 15 day experience, though, I was by myself and I'm very grateful for my wife that she allowed me to go be by myself in Colorado in nature. And like I just said, the first three, four or five days were horrible. Day six, seven, and eight, the food cravings completely went away. And I had this well of energy that felt like it was endless, that felt like it would be replenished when I would stand barefoot on the earth and breathe, stand out in the sun, just be out in the elements. Or if I would consume a little bit of water, it felt like nourishment from my body. So my whole perception of what nourishment is, and this sort of builds upon, uh, Dr. Gerald Pollack's work with fourth phase water and understanding that we're likely comprised of that, et cetera, et cetera, completely flipped. And then days 10, 11, 12 were horrible. Emotionally, emotionally was absolutely terrible because there's nowhere to turn to, you know, food to cope or anything else. And it's, you just have to be present with all that. And then on the back end of that was bliss. And then I decided to break the fast for a variety of reasons, but I felt great doing it. And I lost, I don't know, 25 pounds. I wasn't like fat by any means. I wasn't chubby, but I lost like a good amount of fat, not a ton of muscle was able to regain the muscle pretty quickly. But the, I guess you could say the only negative effects that I personally noticed doing this were that I broke out in these rashes on both of my armpits around days four or five, and those went away around days nine or 10. But no matter what type of natural deodorant I used, it would cause both of my armpits to break out again, except for like a charcoal based deodorant, which is interesting. But that was my experience doing like the water fast. I'm not saying that's everyone else's experience. In fact, when I record an episode after my water fast, I had a lot of women in particular comment that this information is dangerous. You shouldn't be sharing this. Women should not be fasting. It's not appropriate. And I do know several women who've had negative experiences doing fast. I see you're going to feel the same way. He was already pulling out his notes. It comes up a lot. It does. Can I-
Speaker 2Yeah, comment on any of that. Yeah, what question do I have? That's fascinating that you were able to track that experience and the phases of how you, you know, your temperament and what helped to soothe, what didn't. And I think that there is a distinction between like a challenging experience versus a detrimental experience. For sure. Right? 100%. So what do you think it was? I mean, do you, was it challenging or
Speaker 1detrimental? That's interesting. I would say it was challenging for that one. The reason I paused for a second is because other fasts or cleanses rather that I've attempted to do-
Speaker 2You can call them fasts for now.
Speaker 1Yeah, for now. But I agree on your point. Like anyway, but other things that I've attempted to do like this, I would say the intention that I would coming, was coming into it with is like, oh, I need to heal this thing that I'm dealing with. Or I need to like, it wasn't, it wasn't a, I want to do this to nourish my body sort of intention. And I think, the intention behind it is what led to it feeling detrimental rather than being a challenging experience. Whereas the fast, I had finally gotten to a point in my life at that time where financially I was absolutely crushed. I don't, don't mean crushing. I was not in a good position financially. And then in my relationships, my relationship with my wife at the time was probably the rockiest that had ever been. And I was like, I need to go do this as some sort of like initiation type experience for myself. And more than the physical healing benefits of it, because I wasn't really dealing with any physical thing at that time, at least nothing major. It was more about the spiritual benefits of it that I had heard from other people who had done extended water fasts. Yeah. So there's your answer to that question.
Speaker 3Yeah. There's a few points I want to throw in there. So Sean and I have found that dry fasting is often a portal for people. So if they're in a time of life transition, or there's some stuff that they're working out personally, it's a portal that they step through. And we can come back to that. But what you said, it's a perfect time to do a fast because fasting doesn't only shed what doesn't serve you physically. It sheds what doesn't serve you energetically. It sheds the BS out of your life. It sheds. So many times we've had people say they were procrastinating. Yeah. They do a dry fast. They don't procrastinate anymore. Right. They just get on it. The other thing. Yeah. So we often hear from women. Can we fast? Is it harmful to us? Probably because that book, I think it was fast like a girl where that came out. It talks about the hormones. They're still talking about a water diet. They're not talking about dry fast. And so in Russia, there's a doctor named Valentina Lavrova, who wrote a book is a keys to the mysteries of life and female doctor, female Russian dry fasting and fasting expert. And so if you can find a copy of that book, that's what I'd recommend. But dry fasting in general has an amazing beneficial effect on hormones for both men and women. It has a very harmonizing effect on them. And there's a specific reason why, but it balances hormones out in people, both men and women. And because that's a big problem that
Speaker 1women bring up is that their hormones are mental to the hormones. Yeah. When they do a water diet, as y'all are. Yeah. Yeah. Can we start with that? If that's okay. Or sorry, did you have anything else to say related? No, no, I can. Okay. I want to start with that. You went into a little bit, Sean, but can you share why you consider Dry fasting, effectively the only true form of fast fasting relative to, you know, most people call water fasting, fasting. Most people call juice cleansing. I think that point is kind of obvious now, but just share a little bit more about why dry fasting is the only true fast.
Speaker 2It's in our DNA. We've gone, our ancestors all the way back, went for a day without food and water. They went for two days without food and water. You know, in some areas of the world, they went for three or four or five or seven days without food and water. And that sort of old wives tales, like three days without food, you're okay. Three days without water, you're not, you'll die. Right. You hear that all the time.
Speaker 1All the time, man.
Speaker 2Constant. And the fact of the matter is, is that when you go without food or water, as our ancestors did, you are tapping into an innate intelligence in this beautifully designed biological holobiont called the body. And that's what we're talking about. Right. We have everything that we need in here in order to thrive. It's in there already. Right. And there are references after references, just about every major religion, religion in every single holy book, you know, points to some specific form type of fasting. Right. So my, my original fasting, dry fasting origin story was in high school. My wife observed Ramadan. So her dad was Muslim. Mom wasn't, but she would still do Ramadan. So my sophomore year of high school, she's like, Hey, we're not kissing or holding hands. Don't swear around me for this month of Ramadan. Uh, and I was like, what, what do you mean? And she's like, it's a purification process. You know, we do no food or water, nothing in the mouth at all from sunup to sundown. And I was like, I'll do that. She's like, you don't want to do that. Like you're playing football right now. Like, you don't want to do that. And she's like, you don't want to do that. Now, like you need to be drinking and eating, uh, uh, eating, drinking. So I was like, I'm going to do it. Like she told me I shouldn't, which has made me want to do it more. Like I'm here for you. I'll be here. I'll do it with you. So my sophomore and junior year in high school, I, I observed Ramadan and it was pretty incredible. Like by lunchtime, I would find that sort of spot where I'm not really that hungry. Uh, I'm not eating lunch at school. I'm not really that thirsty either. I have a little bit of cotton mouth, but I would continue to go through this process. And, and, you know, little did I know that that was my, that was my first experience. Jainism, Hinduism, John the Baptist was, uh, uh, was fit, uh, to baptize Jesus because he dry fasts his level of purification, his level of purity. I mean, Moses 40 days dry fasting explicitly like, so there's all of these references, which tells us that. There is some historical context for this, that there is a purification process for this. There is a healing, uh, process that goes through this. So we have kind of told ourselves that we just need to be consuming, walking around with water bottles, having snacks, all that stuff. And I, I get it. I have a water bottle too. I like to snack too. But when you put the time in place and the protocols that we've built out are really just to optimize this process, you realize that this is as ancient as it gets, that there are tons and tons of, uh, references to this. There's clinical trials that reference this. And so for those reasons, that's why dry fasting is so powerful. And there's a, there's a biological explanation for, you know, uh, why dry fasting is better. You know, you know, you mentioned you Matt, you lost a little bit of lean muscle mass in your 15 day water only diet. You know, you mentioned you lost a little bit of lean muscle mass in your 15 day water only diet. You know, you mentioned you Matt, you lost a little bit of lean muscle mass in your 15 day water only diet. You know, you mentioned you Matt, you lost a little bit of lean muscle it. Um, we've done, we've had people who have participated in dry fasts with us who have done DEXA scans before and after there is zero in, in at least this one case, there is zero lean muscle mass
Speaker 3lost. He gained 1.5%. He got stronger.
Speaker 2He got more lean muscle mass, right? I myself did blood work on my five day dry fast before and after all of my blood markers increased. So all of these myths that we have around consumption, which are force fed down our throats by Nestle and Pepsi and, you know, consumer brands that we should just be eating all the time. Don't get low blood sugar. He got a snack. It, it, it, it goes in the, it's the most fundamental thing that you can do. And your great, great, great, great, great, great, great, great grandfather did it. And grandmother did it not, not voluntarily, but they would go for days without it. And they could still do it. And they still function for a couple of days without food or water. So in my mind, the, that, that combination of, of there is a score historical context. It is possible to not just survive, but also thrive through this practice. The fact that it's decentralized, it actually saves you money because you're not, you're not buying food. So for all of those reasons, it's like, okay, if I'm going to fast at all, I'm going to do a 36 hour dry fast. If, if, if I needed Sir Detox 5, I'm starting to feel sick. If I'm a little bit angsty or I'm a little bit heavy, like it's, it's in my, in my opinion, it's the only option.
Speaker 3There are a couple of points I'd like to add. Yeah, please. Okay, great. So everyone forgets that sleep is a dry fast. Yeah. So sleep is when your body regenerates. So even if you go to like the bro science of like guys that lift weights for aesthetic reasons, they all know that if you want to grow your muscles, you got to optimize your sleep because that's when the muscles actually grow. There's a system in the brain called the glymphatic system. It was discovered, I think not the lymphatic system.
Speaker 1No, it's glymphatic.
Speaker 3Yeah. It was discovered like 10 or 15 years ago. It's the brain's own lymph system. Our brain runs at a high metabolic rate all day. That metabolism causes a lot of waste products. And for whatever reason, that system is not hooked up to the greater lymphatic system until you go to sleep. And when you sleep, you're not going to be able to sleep. You're not going to be able to sleep. That stuff drains out. And it's because you're dry fasting. It's because your digestion isn't activated. And that's why you shouldn't eat right before bed because that digestion ties up so much energy that your body has to use to break down the food that ordinarily should be applied towards cellular metabolism to eject toxins from the cells, move them into the lymphatic system, and you pee and poop it out in the morning, basically. But sleep is a dry fast. And so when your body detoxifies, you're not going to be able to when autophagy happens daily, it's during your sleep because you're not eating or drinking. That's when your lymphatic system cleans itself. So that's big. And then, you know, as far as dry fasting goes, you know, Sean covered the kind of esoteric, you know, historical primal survival reasons during times of famine, plus, you know, some of the religious aspects. But in Russia, they've been doing this for 70 years. And so in Russia, since Soviet times, you can go to a hospital and they have a dry fasting. And they have a dry fasting. Department. Really? Yeah. And it's, it's, it's a part of their national healthcare system. So I feel
Speaker 1like we've been lied to about Russia so much. We have, especially because like, as we were saying before we start, we started recording some of the best research on consciousness on water on so many
Speaker 3different things. I'm so into Russian natural health because of biophysics and because of what they do with the energy, the energy realms, all of it. Yeah, man. So into it. I use a Russian detox gel called Interes gel. Really? It's amazing. They like figured out how to mill silica. So as a huge surface area. And you can get food poisoning, you can have too much alcohol, you can whatever, and it'll sober people up in 10 minutes. What? It's crazy. You can order it on Amazon. Yeah. Let's plan a trip to Russia. It's great. But so it's been used clinically in Russia for a lot of conditions, including just people that want to support their own wellness. But ultimately, dry fasting, is about getting out of the way of your body's own natural healing intelligence.
Speaker 2Well, you think about like when you feel sick, your appetite drops, right? And the thought of drinking water is annoying and cumbersome. You know, when your pet gets sick, it doesn't eat, it doesn't drink. It just rests. It goes and sits.
Speaker 3Well, let's talk about, you want to talk about the vet?
Speaker 2And Filanov's dog?
Speaker 3That, but there's even better examples. Do it. Go, please. Yeah. So there was a Soviet veterinarian, that was investigating fasting and he would fast chickens. And so the chickens, you know, on average, they'll live six years if they have like a full life and his chickens live 18 years. What? Yep. And he extended a bull's lifespan three X, um, by fasting and its hormone profile improved. And then the Soviet researchers on fasting took a little further and they would take animals that hibernate and they would inoculate them with radioactive materials to produce a tumor in their body. And then they would have them go hibernate and then the tumor would be gone when they exited hibernation. Cause hibernation is what it's an extended dry fast. Yeah. Yeah. I mean the, the, all the research on this has been done for decades. I mean, uh, Dr. Alexis Carroll was a French doctor. I think this was done, I believe it was in the thirties or forties, but he kept chicken heart cells alive in a Petri dish for 28 years. And he said, I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. 28 years. And the only thing he did is he changed out the mineral medium solution that these cells were bathed in every day the only reason he stopped experiments because he retired wow and so he so he wasn't
Speaker 1adding any nutrients here at all just the mineral
Speaker 3the the the the like saline solution that was in and the minerals they needed to survive basically but he would change that solution out every day and because cells produce metabolic waste as a part of their experience of being alive and your body has to get rid of that waste so he changed the solution out that those cells were bathed in every day and they lasted 28 years wow instead of you know six which is like your average chicken's lifespan and so when you do a dry fast you stop all inputs into the body completely and then you go through this massive detox and you're basically doing that chicken heart cell experiment on yourself and and cleaning the medium out and i
Speaker 2think that we forget that our body makes water yes the perfect water and we talk about that a liter and a half a day maybe of of metabolic water that your body is producing right and it's it's perfect it's in the vibration of the highest and greatest good it's clean it's structured it's coherent and so when we i think people forget that and every time most people don't
Speaker 1know that can you expand upon that a little bit yeah i just want to add to that before you do i interviewed brian sanders who has this film called food lies and one of the things that he did was he did a lot of research on food lies and one of the things that he did was he did a lot of research on food lies and one of the things that he did was he did a lot of research on food lies and one of the things that he did was he did a lot of is he traveled and spent time in africa with the hadza tribe and the messiah tribe and with the hadza tribe he talked about how he went on a really long hunt with him meaning that they were walking in africa and you know he's a western guy and it was super hot and he was just keeled over dying of dehydration right and several of his guys actually were getting kind of dehydrated that were there with him on his film crew but the guys that were there with him on his film crew were from the hadza tribe were going for hours and hours and hours without consuming any water so finally they like tap them on the shoulder and say hey our guys need some water we need some water and the hadza guys are kind of like okay here and they go scoop up some like brown muddy water in a leaf and like have a few sips give them a few sips like all right let's keep going but what occurred to me filling in again dr gerald pollock's work with fourth phase water which i'm sure you're both familiar with right okay so no need to get into that um we'll link that episode in the show notes for some context if you want to check it out and i'll see you in the next episode i think it's really important that people understand that from from my perspective but filling in the gaps there with what you're saying too with metabolic water is that i think because the the hadza tribe is living amongst nature in accordance with natural principles like not exposed to non-native emfs and all the things that truly dehydrate us that require us in western in the western world to introduce more inputs of water into our bodies you think i'm on okay speaking accurately here um their body's ability to produce metabolic water and sustain the coherence of the fourth phase water inside their bodies means they don't need as much input of water a hundred percent okay a hundred percent
Speaker 2i mean you're you're you're better at the at the water stuff and so you want to you why don't you build on that yeah okay fill in the gaps or point out what's wrong i agree with everything you
Speaker 3just said the fascinating thing is that you're not thirsty which blows people's minds but your body produces its own water the russians call it endogenous water production or they call it the water of life and i'll explain that in a bit because it's devoid of bad information essentially so as you enter a highly aggressive ketotic state during a dry fast which is usually by the end of day two beginning of day three your body will shred 100 grams of fat and for energy and as it shreds that fat cleaves it apart it produces 115 grams of water so if you burn a kilogram of fat it produces what was it 1.5 liters of water yeah yeah what it ends up being so what people are blown away by during a dry fast your urine production goes up every day it's the craziest it's crazy so the first the first two days it goes down because you're still burning through all the glycogen stored in your liver and your muscles it takes about that long to burn through and by day three you're peeing three times a day ton of ton of urine because all your fat is being shredded and used for water and so we have lean people that dry fast too and i say well about me i don't have that much fat it's like well first of all you do have visceral fat and two it'll do the same thing to misfolded protein damaged dna tissue that doesn't serve you like scar tissue tumors cysts of all kinds you know like there are previously overweight people that choose to do dry fasts that have loose skin and the body just eats it during autophagy and it shreds it for energy it's one of the only non-surgical ways to like get rid of the loose skin if you've lost a dramatic amount of late weight and that is basically the there's a complex biochemical pathway that turns on that you know achieves this so people are interested in that you can read august dunning's book the phoenix protocol and he goes deep into what exactly that pathway is but it's basically your body combines oxygen that you breathe uh with hydrogen from the fat that it's cleaving apart for energy and it creates water and the water of life part is because the water that's created from that is considered perfectly structured and devoid of negative information so your cells intake it very easily and during the dry fast as the water crosses through the cell membrane the cell is undergoing its own cleaning process and it ejects it takes that water and it takes that water and it takes that water and it pushes cells out uh toxins out from the inside of the cells which is very difficult to do there's only a few things that do that hemic and fulvic is one of them but a dry fast is like that on steroids so it ejects the toxins from the inside of the cell it goes into your lymph or you know interstitial you know water that your cells are bathed in then it goes into the lymph and then goes into your bloodstream and you you breathe it out it comes out of the surface of the skin you pee it out you poop it out it's wild it's
Speaker 2wild to be like day four no food no water and then all of a sudden you pee three four five times in a
Speaker 3day the darkest pee you've ever seen
Speaker 2it's like it's like arizona it sinks
Speaker 3straight to the bottom of the toilet it has so much sediment in it it's crazy looking
Speaker 2it's it's wild because you're like how how is this even happening like yeah it's a i mean we we've got so many i mean we could go we could tell you so many different stories yeah of some of the things that have come out of people yeah it's wild
Speaker 1definitely want to hear we could go yeah yeah for sure i want to
Speaker 2but the fact the fact that that your body knows how to work your body knows how to make its own water your body knows how to eject toxins you know your body knows how to eat up and burn up for energy all of the senescent cells the misfolded proteins the cells that are not functioning properly tumors cysts growths skin eats it up because it needs it and it spares muscle so wild it's i mean because you hear that from
Speaker 1people who do water fast that they like lost a ton of muscle right that they lose a lot of muscle and
Speaker 2your heart is a muscle yeah and that's interesting that's the one thing that that i think is is really alarming is if you're doing really long extended water only fast you you're putting a strain on the most important muscle that you have and you know i don't know if it's measurable i don't know if there's a study that shows how much of that uh muscle is lost but there are people change a lot their shape changes and they're you know the the shoulders that they had kind of go away um but you know nick urban who's here in here in austin did a sort of a massive quantified self-experiment and he actually gained he actually gained lean muscle mass which you know in that here as a general point we i think that we believe very strongly that this is going to be the future of health optimization that that dry fasting in and of itself is so profound and it's noticeable and your life changes in five or seven days at such a profound way that as if we can get past the old wives tales if we can get past the the pressures of of allopathic medicine and big pharma telling you that you need to be on this and on that if we can move past that and extend that i think that there is super important meaningful research that will happen in the next five or ten years and and theo and i are like okay first it was intermittent fasting cool like okay have a bulletproof coffee in the morning skip breakfast people are like what skip breakfast no it's the most important meal of the day and then people slowly like started to feel pretty good like oh i'm gonna have i'm gonna have butter coffee it's like a
Speaker 1mainstream thing now right it really is it totally is intermittent fasting is being recommended by primary care physicians it is really yes dude in some cases like 100 yeah it's like that mainstream now right yes and then
Speaker 2there's and then there's like eating in a window right everybody everybody's heard of that and then there's like okay oh mad so one meal a day yeah right so this idea that that people are coming around to the fact that that fasting is profound and when we say fasting, we're talking about dry fasting. Yeah. It's going to, it's going to change people's lives. And again, like when, when it's time to tell the stories of, of the vaccine injured woman who, whose body was an absolute disarray, like she was really, really struggling. And she's like, I'll try anything. Cause I'm, I'm really struggling here. And the results that she had from her dry fast. I mean, we've got so much more to share when, when it's time to get there.
Speaker 1Yeah. I definitely want to get to those testimonials.
Speaker 2There's a lot.
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Speaker 1Forward. And that's the way F W R D at checkout for 10% off. And if you'd like to learn a little bit more about heart and soil, I highly recommend checking out episode two 49. We go into all the things related to heart and soil and the nutrients that these supplements provide you. So one thing I want to say, and I'm kind of piecing this together as we go. So I interviewed Lauren Lockman a while back, and then I know Dr. Andy Kaufman has done Lauren Lockman's protocol. And that was, I think, that was a 26 to 27 day extended water fast. And Lauren shared, and this is, you know, his words, not mine, that a lot of people have gone to his place in Costa Rica. He has like a water fasting site there and healed things like stage three, stage four cancer. This is not medical advice, nor am I making medical claims, by the way, but a lot of people have healed a lot of, you know, very scary things like MS, a variety of stuff. Dr. Andy Kaufman But what it seems to, be in picking up what y'all are saying is that with that water fast, you have to go 26, 27 days with, with the dry fasting, it's like five, six, maybe seven. And you're having a lot of the same wild, absolutely transformative results. Is that, is that accurate?
Speaker 3Dr. Andy Kaufman I got this. So Dr. Ivanoff back in the 1990s through hundreds of clinical studies. And in fact, he did one study that had over, I think, close, to 600 people in it, documented that the one day of dry fasting equals three days of water fasting. And so one of the primary benefits of dry fasting is it's shorter in duration, and it's more easily tolerated than a water diet or a water fast, which seems counterintuitive. But you don't lose muscle, you get extreme detox, you get stem cells, you get all these amazing things that you don't get. Dr. Andy Kaufman So if you're doing a water fast, and the duration is shorter, so there's short dry fasts, which are one to three days. If you go over three days, you start to enter a stem cell release cycle, and you can't interrupt that. So if you cross the Rubicon, on the end of day three, you are now committed to five. If you have, if you want a little bit more work done, you got some scar tissue, you want remodeled, then you do seven days. If you have a serious condition in Russia, when they do a clinical dry fasting, you're medically supervised, they do nine days and 11 days. Dr. Shachennikov documented, and he personally did tons of dry fasting himself up to 21 days, no food, no water, personally documented the whole thing. He found that there was no therapeutic benefit beyond 11 days. So in Russia, if you have a really serious condition, let's say you got blood cancer. Dr. Andy Kaufman It's terminal, you're going to die. You'll go check into a clinic, and you'll do an 11-day dry fast. You recover for two weeks with all the right things that they give you, probiotics, the right diet stuff, and then you go straight into another 11-day. And then you recover for two weeks, and then you go straight into another one, and it just tears the disease out at its root. And so that's what they do there. For us, a five-day dry fast is pretty easy. It's incredibly transformative. We do have members that, too, used to do a seven-day. I did a seven-day last year. I did a five-day this year. My next one will be a seven-day because there's some deeper healing I want to do with some TBIs and some fat loss, to be honest. But yeah, that's the basic schedule.
Speaker 2From an experience standpoint, it is bizarre to go, like, I was starving through every water fast I ever did.
Speaker 1I definitely was at first, too. It's maddening. Especially these days, three, four, and five, dude, I'm starving.
Speaker 2Awful. And if you're adding salt to your water, minerals to your water, you get a little bit of salt in your tongue, and you're like, oh my gosh. That when you dry fast, right? Yeah. For some reason, you're just not hungry, and you're actually not thirsty. You do get a little bit of cotton mouth. You do get a lot of cotton mouth going without food or water for five days. But what you would find really, really consistently is that from an experiential standpoint, the first day is kind of psychological. You didn't have. You didn't have your coffee. You didn't have your water. You're not eating. What am I going to do with my time? My family's eating dinner. I cooked for my family during my five-day. Dude, that is torture. It was rough, but it gave me something to do. I'm waking up, cooking breakfast for everybody, and by dinnertime, I kind of went back upstairs and watched soccer and kind of hung out. But you actually don't feel hungry or thirsty when you just stop all of it. Uh-huh. The cravings for. Caffeine or a little Zin pouch, non-existent, no withdrawal symptoms, like none. I always had nicotine and caffeine and sugar withdrawals on water fasts. It doesn't happen, at least for me and what we've heard from others, is that it just. So from an experiential standpoint, it's just shorter, concentrated, and easier to get through for a lot of people. I'm not saying it's easy. Don't get me wrong. Of course. No.
Speaker 1I want to talk about what it actually looks like, what it feels like, and all that stuff. Yeah. All that stuff, too.
Speaker 2Yeah. Yeah. When you think about what that might be like to go for a single day without a glass of water or any food, it's like, whoa, I can't wrap my mind around that. And then you try it and you're like, oh, that was actually easier than I thought.
Speaker 1Yeah. Yeah. Have you heard the story of Prahlad Jani? Oh, you guys are definitely going to want to use this for some of your courses or whatever. So I was put onto Prahlad Jani by Dr. Pollack, actually. Prahlad Jani was this guy in India who claimed to have been visited by an angel when he was really young. And this angel told him he didn't need to eat or drink ever again. And now into old age, I think he's passed away now. But when he was in his 60s, I believe, he started getting a lot of attention in India for these claims. And he wasn't outstanding on the steps of some capitalism. He didn't have a podcast. Yeah. He didn't have a podcast sharing this with everyone. But he had become sort of like a local legend, I think. And the Indian government decided to test whether what he was saying was true as best as they possibly could. Obviously, they couldn't retroactively see if he wasn't eating or drinking for 60 years, as he had claimed. But they brought him into a hospital and they had every ologist you could think of monitoring him, 24-hour surveillance for 15 days. And for 15 days, he did not have any food or water. And he was running up and down the stairs and was- Totally fine. And I think it was the urologist that was monitoring him, was doing ultrasounds on his kidneys and bladders. And they found that his bladder would fill up with fluid and then retract. Fill up with fluid and retract. But at the least, the Indian government validated that for 15 days, no food or water. And he didn't have any loss of energy relative to how he was when he came in the hospital. So it indicated to him that, okay, this dude's not lying. He really lives this way. This is how he is. Yeah. But it's funny because- Because I was at an event in Serbia and they actually had someone, and this is just about a week and a half ago at the time of this recording. They actually had someone there speaking on the dangers of fasting. And I was pushing back a little bit to him and he was like, no, it's purely a degenerative state that you're getting into. And I was like, well, here's my direct experience. Here's the experience of other people. And he's like, yeah, but you can't point to outliers. So that doesn't mean that this is actually a beneficial regenerative practice. And I pointed to Prahlad Jani. Of course. And he was like, okay, that's an exception there. And I'm like, yeah, okay, that's fair. But here's my direct experience. So I I would just like to hear from your perspective, because this comes up a lot. I know fasting in and of itself is a contentious topic, that fasting is a degenerative state to be in. You're about to shake your head. No, you lead.
Speaker 3It's the ultimate regeneration, and that's irrefutable. Anybody that can point AI at Russian research papers to translate it for themselves can go and find this. If you do a dry fast, you receive waves of endogenous stem cells. They're pluripotent. They can turn into anything. People reverse age. After a dry fast, one of the most common reported things is that people are optimistic, and they have energy, and they don't procrastinate anymore. And one of the reasons that is, is because a dry fast regenerates your brain. It regenerates neural tissue. It's a potent detoxifier. So you don't have toxins gumming up your cells. Let's talk about deuterium. It's becoming more known these days. And deuterium is a form of heavy hydrogen that basically clogs up the little spinny gear things in your mitochondria that produce energy, because it's physically too big. And a dry fast is the fastest way to eject deuterium from the inside of your cells. There's no faster way to do it, and anyone can test this out for themselves for free. And it's measurable in people's urine output. The Russians figured this out back in, like, the 90s. And so it is the—like, I'm a big terrain guy, okay? I'm not into germ theory at all. My man. I'm all about—
Speaker 1Because I never know when I'm interviewing someone on a separate topic. I'm like, yeah.
Speaker 3Viruses are expressions of a poisoned cell. Thank you. That's what it is. So if your cells are toxic and they have poisons in them, they're not going to run as well, and they're going to put out little things called exosomes that signal to the other cells, hey, watch out, we're poisoned. You should mount your own defenses because we're poisoned. It's probably going to move over to you too soon, right? And so a dry fast ejects poisons from the inside of the cell so your body's own native healing intelligence can take over and say, great, thank you so much. You've provided me the conditions I can use to heal myself, and it does. And after a dry fast, during the recovery period, you have a 70% documented increase in stem cells circulating in the body. Now, if you want to go get stem cells, what do you got to do? Fly down to Mexico, pay 50 grand, they'll pull out your stem cells, spend them in a centrifuge, inject them back into your body, which is not natural, and most of them die at the injection site.
Speaker 2They run through plastic tubes.
Speaker 3It's weird. It's weird. And another thing that's gotten big in biohacking lately is ECPA, or like blood hemodialysis, so extracorporeal blood ozonation, oxygenation. So basically, suck out all your blood, put it in a dialysis machine, ram it through a filter, put some ozone through it, put it back into your body. And everyone's talking about how great they feel, and their blood's so clean. Well, a dry fast gives you better results than doing that. And think about it. So you do a five-day dry fast, your blood circulates past the same point in your body every two hours. And so there's no inputs. There's no inputs. There's no water. There's no food coming in. And your body's just hardcore detoxing. So your liver doesn't have any food to metabolize. So every two hours, all of your blood supply is going through your liver. It's pulling all that crap out. It's metabolizing all those toxins. Same thing with your kidneys. You're breathing all these toxins out. It's coming through your skin. You're pooping it out. You're peeing it out. And so the Russians found that the blood quality of people that have been through a dry fast, like the plasma is crystal clear. The red blood cells are plump and healthy and active. And they're not coining or what's called the Rouleau effect, where they stick together because they have a positive charge. They're free floating. And so their zeta potential is much higher, which means they're just not stuck together and coining, which is important because your capillaries, a single red blood cell is a fold in half to get down the capillary. too much positive charge they can't fit your circulation goes down and then you start to get these long-term diseases from low oxygen in the body. So a dry fast, in my opinion, is the single most rejuvenative, regenerational thing that you can do. I mean, I had TBIs from the college sport that I was in. I've been knocked out many, many times. I was in a contact combat sport, Olympic then they can't fit your circulation.
Speaker 1so in combat sports and just sports in general dude especially like my generation and above that so your generation as well not that you're way older than me but the amount of times that we had our bell rung and it was probably a verifiable concussion and yeah it's all right just get back out there you didn't pass out you're fine you're good rub some dirt on it so many times i was in
Speaker 3a fight in collegiate nationals where i got a spin hook kick to the back of my head and that guy ended up going to olympic qualifying trials he was good i don't remember the entire fight i didn't fall over and I continued fighting but every three minutes I'd ask my coach if I'd won or not and that lasted for eight hours and then I woke up and I wasn't in my uniform I wasn't in my warm-ups I had normal clothes on I was like where am I and like the thing that I remember the most is that it was daylight and I woke up and it was night that's
Speaker 1a bad concussion
Speaker 3yeah and my coach
Speaker 1It's just verifiable memory loss. Yeah, my coach just said, you're fine.
Speaker 3Just walk it off. We're going out. We're going to go to the restaurant, have some beer. It's fine. And so when I was older and I was running a commercial real estate company, a lot of people don't know this, but cortisol exacerbates existing TBI symptoms. And your brain can't handle the cortisol and the stress along with the damage to the white matter to route messages. And so stuff gets clogged. And so I was doing stuff like paying for groceries, leaving them on the little conveyor belt thing, leaving, getting in my car, driving home, parking my car, going in the house, and just didn't even remember going to buy groceries. And so the first time, we talked about this even today, the first time that I did a five-day dry fast, and what's unique about dry fast is that your body's own native healing intelligence will prioritize whatever it deems the most necessary thing to heal first. and for me on my first one it happened to be my head and so by day three i had a dull ache light pain and a feeling of wetness in the back of my head which is my occipital lobe yeah which is where i got hit the hardest twice my two worst knockouts were from that and it just felt wet and weird and i could feel work being done in there it was really strange and then after the dry fast my cognition went up and my memory was sharper and it was better. And dude, this is like 20 years after I'd been hit that hard. Wild. You tell me one other medical or natural health therapy that can go into your brain, remodel scar tissue, release stem cells and go in there and grow, you know, new connections and heal the brain. There isn't one.
Speaker 2It's like when you, when you're, When your body turns on in this very unique way, all of these different things are happening. The sensations are kind of crazy. Like, you know, it's very, very common for people to experience heart rate changes, fevers. We had a guy who was in a, what is characterized as a healing crisis. Day four, which is you've made it past day three, you're into day four. You may have been starting into your, uh, stem cell release that comes from your femurs. And he calls me and he's like, Hey man, I'm, I'm in a little bit of a tough spot. And I was like, what's going on? He's like, I got cold sweats. I've got some tremors going. Uh, my heart rate is through the roof. I'm starting to panic a little bit. I'm thinking about ending the fast. And I was like, okay, well, let's, have you taken a shower? You know, have you taken a cold shower yet? And he's like, no. And I go, have you been outside grounding yet? He's like, no. And I go, have you done what we've suggested, which is to move the lymphatic fluid through your body, through a rebounder or gentle bouncing on your feet? He's like, no, I haven't done any of that shit. I go, well, okay, go do that stuff and call me back in like an hour and a half. And he's like, all right. So he went and did those things, comes back and he's like, it's still kind of going, you know, I'm still have a fever. I'm still sweaty. And I was like, okay, what do you want to do? And he's like, I would hate to end it now because I would interrupt that stem cell release. I'm feeling kind of tired. I'm going to see if I can get some sleep. And there are some sleep disruptions too that happen with dry fasting. I'm gonna see if I can get some sleep and see what happens. So he went back and did a couple of more of those things. I think he went outside one more time, you know, got a cold rag and put it on his head, tried to sleep unsuccessfully, didn't sleep very well. And then in an instant, everything stopped. All of those symptoms went away. So he called me, it was like the middle of the night, you know, he was in, um, he's in Florida, Seattle, and I think it was like three, eight. In fact, I was texting with him. He didn't call me 3:00 AM his time. He sends me a text message and we're available for people during this process. He texts me. He's like, it's I'm I'm it's all good. I'm my fever is down. I feel like a million bucks. I think that I just sorted something out. out. Maybe it was an infection. Maybe it was an overgrowth. Maybe it was all these different things, but that healing crisis is, it can be a little bit spooky when you're going through it, but his body knew what to do. His body figured it out and it was rough for a little bit. And he was just about to press the button and end the fast and start the rehydration process, which is kind of elaborate. You got to go really slow, but he got to that point. So for people who say it's, it's only degenerative. I mean, it really could, it would take five minutes to do a little bit more research for the guy, you know, at the, at the conference to go look at all, not, not just the clinical research, but also at anecdotes that, that are kind of all over the place, you know, like there's the hard part is, and I found this recently as I talk about it on mostly Instagram and on the podcast, I'm starting to get censored pretty, pretty heavily. I know, I know, you know, I know, you know what that's about.
Speaker 1Oh, do I?
Speaker 2Right. Like, uh, do you need help? You know, a podcast or a post where I'm talking about, you know, five days, no food, no water. Instagram says, Hey, we removed your post. Um, you know, if you need help with eating disorders, we can let, we can, you know, we can, we can help you find somebody in your area. And so after the 15th time that I've said, no, you're misunderstanding this post. This is about an important issue. Sometimes it gets reinstated. I mean, that that's, it's the, it's the cultural issues that are impinging upon this deeply profound practice getting to the masses because it's like, Oh, well, you must have an eating disorder. You must have body dysmorphia. You must be, um, you must be a little, a little, little wacko. If you're going to be doing this, go into this extreme. And it's not that about that at all.
Speaker 1All right. And it's also the conditioning, even in the holistic health space, that you need to be eating a certain amount. You need to be getting your certain micro and macro nutrients, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, which I used to believe until I did my water diet. Um, once I did that, it completely flipped that whole paradigm in my mind. It really did. I want to ask you, Sean, um, and feel free to jump in for you too, Theo, but it sounds like since you were the one that told him about dry fasting, it took him a year. I want to hear from you, like what, what your hesitations were and then what your initial experience was, like once you decided to actually do it.
Speaker 2So I'd done Ramadan in high school. I did a podcast where somebody had referenced, you know, John Jaquish, the creator of Osseo Strong and X3 Bar mentioned it when I recorded with him years ago. Mentioned dry fasting? He would use it as a way to like lean up, um, before doing, um, like photo shoots. And it was just like when in one ear, not the other. I am a water freak. I mean, from float tank, water quality at all to, you know, the water that I drink at my house is gathered at a, at a primary water source that's 10 minutes from my house. I've been doing that for 12 years. Like I'm, I'm pretty obsessive about water quality. And so, uh, you know, I've, I've begun, I have begun to understand the difference between like drinking water and hydration. And there is a big distinguishing, you know, there's a big, it's a, there's a mineral explanation, you know, there's humic and fulvic explanations as to like whether or not you're being hydrated. So when he, he was harping on me about it and he's like, dude, you should try it. I'm like, well, why? Like, that sounds terrible. Like I've done water fast before they suck. Fair. Yeah. Nah, I don't need to. I was resistant to it because I just didn't feel like I really had the need. I too have sports injuries. I've got an ankle thing, a foot thing from soccer. You know, I do a lot of jujitsu and I have little injuries and so forth, but I didn't have, I don't have like, um, an illness that's very specific. I have had leaky gut. Since I tried vegetarianism and in high and college that I've been dealing with that manifests in certain ways. But I was like, I'm not really trying to heal anything. I'm not trying to win a prize for who can go without food and water. Like I'm good. And then he's like, just try it. You know, like it's worth just the journey of doing this and all the purification stuff, like the full moon reset that I was working on. I was like, okay, fine. I'll try it. I got, now I gotta know. I gotta, I gotta see this for myself. And so, I had organized myself. I had did some detox protocols. We call it pre-talks, you know, did some detox protocols for two weeks ahead of time. I was really thorough about making sure that I had my detox pathways open and then, you know, organize my work schedule. What I'm in the same boat as you is like, it's a big ask to just be out of commission for a couple of days, three days, four days, five days longer. I'm very involved with my children's lives. I cook breakfast every morning. You know, like I'm taking them to school. I'm making lunches. Like I'm very integrated into my, into my life and in my household. And so like being out of commission is not really an option for me. And so I've made enough changes to my schedule, set the date. How many days? Five days. Five days. Right. Okay. And I said, okay, I'll try it. I jumped in. I'm like, what am I going to do to pass the time? Like for the first two days, pretty operational, you know, a little lethargy, a little bit of like, Ooh, something's going on. But for the first two days, irksome that I wasn't just able to grab another glass of water or have a snack. Day three is often the hardest day for people in a five day drive fast, because that's when that, that massive transition into sort of profound autophagy is happening. That's when you're into therapeutic ketosis levels. That's when, that's when your body is really going through major shifts. I just sort of got through it by lots of walks, bike rides with my kids.
Speaker 1So you had the energy to do that. I had all the energy to do that.
Speaker 2Yeah. That's interesting. Cruising around. We went down and got into the water in the Puget sound and went for a little swim. Like I was pretty operational. Day three is when I started to get some sleep disruptions. I usually sleep, like I'm asleep in four minutes and I get uninterrupted. My aura of numbers are spectacular. So waking up a couple of times at night during my drive fast was kind of, was kind of challenging. It was a really hard day for me. I was like, around day four in the morning where I was like, all right, I'm feeling really depleted now. I don't look that good. You know, I look pretty like strung out. You sent me a picture. I'm like, kind of emaciated. My wife's like, you doing good? I'm like, I'm doing good. She's like, you're going to watch another, uh, you're going to watch the made another matrix movie. I'm like, yep. So I just go upstairs. I was watching soccer and all the John wicks. And I don't closely to my dry fasting experience. Just something about the, like the action movies. I don't know. Yeah. Into day four, after a really rough night's sleep, I was, I was, I was struggling a bit. And then all of a sudden I believe that I experienced the stem cell release. Like I w I have pretty good interoception. And then all of a sudden, like, Oh, I feel pretty good. Like suddenly I've got all this energy. I feel flexible. I'm not going to go work out, but I feel pretty darn good. So I go downstairs and I like grab the dirty, I go out, I grab the clean laundry and I start folding laundry downstairs. And my family is like looking around, like, what's that? What's that doing? Uh, my wife, Layla, she goes, why are you, why are you folding laundry right now? You okay? And I'm like, I have a ton of energy. I feel really good. And she's like, all right, well, thanks for the help. 10 or 15 minutes later, I kind of got into a little of a spot where like, I don't need to be doing this right now. Like I've got a green light to go be in this process while I'm home. I'm okay. I'm gonna leave that. But I just went for a walk outside. I went to this like field that's near our house and just sort of putzed around in my, in my shorts, shirtless, barefoot on the ground, you know, hugged a tree, sat in the shade, did some breath work, just kind of meandered and skated through day four, day five, scratchy throat. Like it was, I was, I was tired. I was reaching my, reaching the point. I knew that the end of the fast was going to come here. And like later that day, right. Like that anticipation for it. But for me, again, I would take that any day of the week over a five day water only fast where I'm irksome and edgy and angry
Speaker 1and that's my experience.
Speaker 2Right. So, I mean, when, when I think about the, the, the, the grand scheme and the way that we like to think about drive fasting, mental, physical, emotional, and spiritual, it's, all wrapped in there. And, and, and some of the experiences that, that I had in my meditation practice, it was really hard for me to meditate. And I've been meditating. My, my folks taught me TM when I was 12. Oh, wow. So I've been meditating not every day, but I've been meditating since I was 12 years old, really consistently. And I was really tough for me to get into my zone. Like I got into while on the drive fast, while on the drive fast. Interesting. And you would think it would be the opposite because there's no noise. Yeah. Well, the morning of the morning of day five, I'm sitting there, my, my, uh, my wife and kids were, uh, in the, uh, in a tent in our backyard. They're like, we're gonna let dad sleep in the bed alone tonight. So my wife is so nice. It's so great. Yeah. I'm like awake as the sun's coming up. It's like four o'clock in the morning. And I was like, you know what? I'm not sleeping. I'll just meditate. So I sit up, I'm like hour one, nothing's really cooking. I'm just kind of there, but I'm not really getting into the fittest I'm not connecting with my spirit guides. not getting that depth of my, what I'm so used to in my, in my spiritual practice, just sort of nothing. Hour two at about hour three of meditation, about seven o'clock in the morning on day five, I go from frustrated in my meditation to all of a sudden like a cork blue and this cacophony of sound and noise and subtle energy and the beings, the subtle energy beings that I have worked so closely with my spirit guides masters. Uh, it was just like a, like a rock concert happening up inside my head. And it, and it was like really overwhelming because I was sensitive already. Yeah. And I, and I'm just like staying in my method, staying in my process as this, this like cacophony of sound and noise and colors and light and sensation and bottle bodily stuff is all happening all at one time. And then all of a sudden it just stopped. And I'm like, what was that? Like what, what is that? That's what it's like. Yeah. Like what, what just happened? What did I miss? And then I get, it wasn't until later that day, as my wife is driving me to the grocery store to get all the liquids and stuff, the proper way to rehydrate. And I'm like, honey, listen to this meditation experience that I have. And I, and it's, I'm frustrated by it because I don't get it. I don't understand. And then she just starts laughing and she's like, and as soon as she starts laughing, I get this sense that I take myself too seriously. I was so hung up on having this profound meditation during my drive fast that I wasn't getting it. Yeah. And as she's laughing, I'm hearing laughing all around me. I'm feeling like a little wink from the universe from like, it's all right, bud. Like just chill out. It's all good. You don't got to take yourself too seriously. I started to like cry because
Speaker 1I was taking myself
Speaker 2so seriously. I cried because that answer that I was looking for at seven o'clock that morning, I didn't get, I just got this confusing experience that was so different from all these other practices, uh, that I've had in the past. And then, you know, come Dave, uh, that, that night we get home, I get the, I get the humic and the fulvic ready. I get the water, the way that we, you know, really suggest people to break the fast. And, and that first drink of water is, is like nothing else you've ever experienced after five days. Like it is, it is the most quenching, most exciting consumption of anything you've ever had or can think of that, that experience kind of now set the stage. And I was so, I was so passionate about it. I'm like, man, everybody's got to do this. Everybody's got to do this. You're right, Theo. You're right. Well, that's when you contacted me and you're like, Hey, let's, let's do
Speaker 3something with this. Let's do, let's build, let's build this out.
Speaker 2Let's help. Let's get, let's bring this to everybody.
Speaker 3Well, cause we started talking about it. We were both excited about it and we started talking about it to our newsletter subscribers and we both had the experience of people just jumping in with zero
Speaker 1research, which cause
Speaker 3dry fasting attracts somewhat extreme people. Yes. Right. Yeah, for sure. And so a lot of these people just jump in with zero research and then they'll freak out when their heart rate goes to one 10, for a couple hours or they feel weird or they have a fever and then they'll break it. And the problem with breaking is if you break it during a stem cell cycle, you're retired stem cell production for months. Oh wow. And so you can't, that's helpful.
Speaker 1I mean, that's super, you cannot
Speaker 3do that. It's really not good. Yeah. Um, I mean, there are certain cases when you should break a dry fast and they're very specific, but for the majority of people, they don't need to. And so I had, I think four or five people that did that for that. We're just reading my newsletter. I had a guy that panicked and you know, it was like texting me. It was like a personal friend. I mentioned to him once and he's like this extreme guy entrepreneur. And he's like, yeah, I'm going to reset my life. And then he like panicked and like he overate and drank too much water immediately. And then he got edema for a while, which can happen. So the recovery of a dry fast is more important than a dry fast itself. It's like very, it's very specific. Yeah. I mean, in my experience, water fast is the same. Yeah. It's like hour by hour, you do different things, but based on what you guys just talked about, I want to mention a couple of things. So, you know, we had Timothy who was 82 and he did one of our dry fast groups and his energy went up the whole time. So it didn't go down and he was rowing for 20 minutes a day on a rowing machine. And he was on every call and he was chipper and he's like, Hey guys, you know, and, and his energy just kept going up. So it does happen with some people and dry fasting is more easily tolerated by older people as well, which, which is interesting. The younger you are, the harder it is because your metabolism is faster and you're not as dried out. Old people tend to be a little bit more dried out. So they're kind of used to it. And then on my first dry fast, if we want to get a little bit more into the esoteric stuff, I had a source download similar to what Sean did. So for me, I was like, I'm going to get a dry fast. I'm going to get a dry fast. It's going to be at dawn when the veil is thin between the realms. It's very thin at 3am, 4am. And you don't sleep much the fourth night. And so I wasn't sleeping. And I was on my mom's property, the property I grew up on, it's about 70 acres. And I'm just wandering around dawn. It's in the summer, you know, I'm absorbing dew through my skin and it felt good. And all of a sudden in the back of my head, I'm like, I'm going to get a dry fast. And in the background, I could feel the consciousness of some of the plants and trees around me. And they were kind of amused by me wandering around in this state. I could feel it. It was very psychedelic. And then I was like, okay, like I'm obviously in a state here where the veil is thin. This feels kind of like doing medicine. So if this is going to be a psychedelic experience, let's kind of get into this. So as you know, I'm sure, and Sean, you know, the mind can get in the way, but the heart only knows. Truth. And the heart is a receiver for universal energies. And so I put my hand on my heart and I said, heart, we're in this special state. Can you do whatever you need to do to open yourself up to receive cosmic white light energy from source? I just, I want to feel that and let's bring it through my seventh chakra. Let's just see if it works. Soon as I finished, boom, huge download felt like a pillar of white light. So it wasn't insights. It was more just like receiving like pure untainted, clean, vital force from source. And it started coming in through my seventh chakra. And I was like, oh my God, this is a lot. And then I just said, heart, like do whatever you need to do with my body to accept this white light and burn out any weird information or darkness that's in my energy bodies that doesn't serve me. And it did. It was exactly like if you do it on psychedelics. Now on my last five day drive fast, which was in May, I didn't have that. We have a lot of members who, you know, do our programs and like Sean, they're cooking for their families. They're working every day. They're on zoom calls, they're shopping. And I'm like, you know what? I haven't had that experience. So I'm going to do it. So, you know, my mom's 82 now, so she still lives on the farm. So I was helping her out with some dental stuff, driving her to the appointments and whatnot. And so I was like, I'm going to work every day. And I'm going to help out my mom and do normal stuff. So I did. And it made the dry fast go faster. I didn't have the same kind of like download experience, but this one was interesting because it was mainly physical and I've had gut challenges since I sprayed glyphosate professionally. Oh, wow. So it was a college job. And so I literally every summer I was spraying glyphosate and I used to be covered in that shit. It was just, I even stored the gun between my legs or on my stomach and the gun would leak.
Speaker 2Can you imagine that?
Speaker 3Yeah. And they taught us to stir it in the morning with our forearms in the tank.
Speaker 1Oh my God.
Speaker 2I mean, like I stress out about eating Cheez-Its because of the glyphosate and swimming in it.
Speaker 3It was so bad. It was, it was, it was so bad. I was so proud of my Minnesota state license applicator license that I had too. I thought it was so cool, but I've had gut challenges since then. And the older I've gotten, the more they've become exacerbated. Like it's just like leaky gut on steroids. And you know, I have like one piece of bread and I'm like bloated for three days, you know, stuff like that. It's like, I look like ET, you know, it's just like very not aesthetic and I'm supposed to be a health guy. It's like very frustrating. Right. And so this last one, similar to a psychedelic journey, if you do a dry fast, you can set the intention before you do the dry fast. And Sean, I do this on the first call and I set the intention. I put my hands on my stomach and I said, gut, I'm going to remove all the inputs and all of the body's energy can be devoted to you to heal yourself. And this is our intention. Let's do this together. And the craziest thing, dude, on this dry fast, my gut was so noisy the entire time, just noisy. There was movement. There was sensation. There was all the inflammation went down. And a funny thing about inflammation, requires water. Inflamed areas of the body are swollen with what? Water. So it sounds so simple, but when you take away the water, can the inflammation exist? No, it goes away. So all the inflammation in my gut dropped to nothing, intense healing going on. And prior to that dry fast, I was using a little too much caffeine, kind of becoming dependent on it. And I haven't had any caffeine since May. And the funny thing is there was no withdrawal. And then afterwards, it's like a reset. And that's one of the things Sean and I like to talk about. Maybe you can segue into this when I finish here, but it's the easiest reset you'll ever do because I was eating too much wheat when I was having too much caffeine and it was time for it to stop. So I did five day dry fast. And at the end of it, I was like, I don't want this. I literally don't have any desire for green tea, for cortados, for coffee, gone. Wheat, gone. You know, sugar, gone. I didn't have sugar for a month. And then since then I've had, it's like very minimal, like a little bit of a touch of maple syrup on some cacao or something like that. But it's kind of like- Well,
Speaker 2you said when we got here last night, you got a chocolate bar. And that was the first like sweet that you've had since May.
Speaker 3Yeah. I got a Who chocolate bar, you know, like the clean one, right? Yeah, yeah, yeah. And I was like, Sean, I haven't had one of these since the dry fast. This is like kind of exciting. It was exciting. And then I had it and it like went through my whole body. I'm like, whoa, this is really sweet. And I felt kind of stimulated from the chocolate.
Speaker 1People don't even realize that either.
Speaker 3No. Yeah. I haven't had it for so long. Right. It's like very stimulating. Yeah. You know, here I am, I'm the oldest I've ever been. I'm, you know, 48 and a half, you know, almost fricking 50, half a century old. It's old. Like it's old. But I can have these experiences where I slap the reset button and- I have water and it tastes amazing and silky in my mouth if it's structured. I have a Who bar and I'm like, oh my God, this is like so intense. You know, like all the flavors are enriched. It's just a reset. It gives you an appreciation for like those little things that we overlook. Like how else in your life can you do a physical, mental, energetic, and emotional and spiritual reset? Like your first- All at once.
Speaker 2Your first blueberry after a dry fast is like-
Speaker 3It's crazy. Ecstasy.
Speaker 2Yeah. I mean, it's just over the top.
Speaker 1I believe it, man.
Speaker 2Yeah. I mean, there's some of the story, you know, especially with, you know, getting rid of caffeine and sugar. And I know you were a cookie monster there for a little bit. Oh, yeah. Baked goods, dude. We've had many people just, A, five days, no food, no water. That includes no alcohol. Yeah. That includes no cannabis.
Speaker 1Oh, no alcohol, people. That includes no sugar.
Speaker 2No tobacco. No tobacco. And we've had people who- And we've had people who haven't had a drop of alcohol. It was a problem for them. Yep. And they haven't had a drop of alcohol a year and a half later. And it's not like they convinced themselves that they needed to stop. It's like their body, their mind, their spirit, their soul, their highest self was like, we're good now. Yeah. We're good without it. Wow. Like, you'll figure out the social stuff when you're at a party. Like, don't worry about that. It's all good. But we, I mean, we've had so many people share stories that don't drink anymore or don't eat dessert anymore or have totally changed their life. But it's in a really integrated, easy way. Yeah. And not like they're forcing themselves or convincing themselves. That's amazing. Their body's just like, okay, you're done. That's amazing, man.
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Speaker 2Well, we'll start by saying this. This is not for everybody. I mean, there is a list of contraindications. There are a number of different things. If you have blood clotting issues, if you have deep vein thrombosis, obviously if you're pregnant. So there are a list of contraindications. First and foremost, you should not do this if you're dealing with this stuff. Number one. Number two, you don't have to jump into a five or seven day dry fast. You can do 24 hours, 36 hours. Just kind of test it out and see how that feels and see how you see how you tolerate it. Right. The, the fact that, you know, for people who are edge seekers, for people who, you know, maybe been into biohacking or they're, they're in a natural health and they think, okay, cool. Like I've done weird stuff. I've done hard things. I'm just going to try it. And you had lasagna the night before. Or like one. One case, you know, she had McDonald's and half a bottle of red wine. Oh my God. And then dove into it the next day and she, she made it, but she, she'd struggled a little bit.
Speaker 1Horrific. Right.
Speaker 2Yeah.
Speaker 1Right. Like hung over and then goes right into a dry fast.
Speaker 2Yeah. With like a brick in your gut from your Big Mac. It's so bad. Not good. Yeah. The fact that the, the, the differentiation between doing it on your own, this is such a strange thing. This is, this is unlike anything you've ever done. Before in your life, you're going to have some questions. You're going to want to be able to reach out to somebody to connect with them, to say like, Hey, did you experience this? You know what? I'm having this feeling or I'm having these experiences or my dreams are being like this. You want to be able to share that.
Speaker 1I literally had gray goo coming out of my butt and I need to know if, you
Speaker 2know, this is okay. Is this all right? Am I okay? I'm not saying I did. I'm saying like, I've heard
Speaker 1other people who drive faster. They're like, dude, I literally passed gray stuff.
Speaker 3It's usually orange, orange.
Speaker 1Yeah. That's not like how orange are we talking? Orange, like orange, like salt lamp orange, this sign orange.
Speaker 2Yes. Like, like river. So like minerally like manganese in your, uh, yeah. Yeah. It's orange.
Speaker 1It's the Doritos from really bad. Right. Yeah. Yeah.
Speaker 2It's so different. Your body is, uh, is going through something so profound that it's nice to have a buddy. Yeah. It's nice to have. Uh, to talk to somebody who's been through it before. And so don't go into it willy nilly. You want to, we, in fact, we've written out detox protocols that you can do to open up detox pathways so that the, you're the, so that you're clearer going into it. It's cause that's really important. Even more important afterward, how you complete and begin to rehydrate and renourish. But you know, for animals like Theo, and I, who were just like, all right, I'm just going to try it. Let's going to do it. Like there's always going to be those outlier people, but for most people doing it in a community with people where it's 24 seven telegram support, you've got all these write-ups, you've got what to expect, um, what to do when this situation comes up, when your heart rate elevates, et cetera. And that, that sense of community that we've, you know, we're going to be having our fifth drive fast with friends in January. And the people that we have drive fasted with often they'll do it again. They'll be at the next one. They'll be at the third or their fourth, uh, annual drive fast to be able to have a community of people literally all over, all over, all around the world who are, who believe in their body, believe in the potential for deep, deep healing in this way. It's nice to have a group of folks that can support you. And we still get surprised. We still get interesting questions. You know, interesting scenarios for people who are going through something like we've had, we've got parasites. We'll get to those, but we've got people who are going through these things. And when they may know that there's someone that's going through the very same thing on the other side of the world, who's also in, in the middle of a drive fast, it's just nice to get that, that support. And the relationships that are cultivated within that community are like, uh, are, are so there's, it's so real. It's, it's visceral, you know?
Speaker 1I get it though. Right. Especially having been an athlete or like been in, been, you know, in the, in the military, especially when you're going through a challenge with a group of people together, it, it creates closer relation relating essentially.
Speaker 3It does. It does. Well, and you know, you and I have talked about this. And cause it happened with us as well. A very common thing that happens during dry fasting is people come out of the woodwork when you started dry fast and tell you you're going to die. I mean, even my own mom who is super into natural health, uh, but you know, she was a nurse and she was checking on me constantly and she's constantly telling me I was going to die and how much it was stressing her out. And I hadn't drank enough water and I was going to die. And then what was she going to do? And it was every day. This is. Negative bombardment. And, you know, in the subsequent dry fast, she's now supports it. And she's even.
Speaker 1Cause she's seen you survive.
Speaker 3Yeah. And she's done her own two day dry fast now. Has she? Yeah. So it changed her whole paradigm too. At 82. Yeah. Wow. And, um, but people come out of woodwork. And so having a group that is supportive is fantastic. And not everybody needs to have a paid group. Maybe they just want to dip their toe in and we have a free program for those people for a one, two or three day drive. Which is the limit of what you can do before you kick in the stem cell cycle, which you don't want to interrupt, but there are a lot of people whose lifestyles wouldn't allow them to do a five or seven day where they just want to reset their gut because they're bloated. That's
Speaker 2probably the biggest, you know, like
Speaker 3you can just do a 24 hour or 48 hour and you know what, over time they accumulate and the benefits stack. And so it gets a little bit deeper in the healing every time you do one and accumulate. Over the weeks and months. So you can just do that. You don't, not everybody has to do a long one, but for those of us that have accumulated a lot of toxins, for those of us that want stem cells, for those of us that want to thin the veil and get more in touch with our internal world and get rid of some of the bullshit like procrastination or drinking alcohol every night, even if it's not a lot, but you know, it's just, it's just not good for you. Right. Or maybe you're consuming too much screen time, which is one that we get a lot. A lot of people stop doom scrolling after a dry fast, which honestly, like even me, I've noticed, like I get this weird dopamine loop where I'm just like scrolling. And my last dry fast, like I was scrolling during the dry fast and I looked at my phone and I was like, what am I doing? Yeah. Like, ew. Yeah. Like gross. Like, you know, so.
Speaker 2Well, it's that it's in a general way of like letting go of that, which no longer serves you. Yes. Like that theme we've heard in breath work. In all, you know, in personal development across the board, when you, that, that sometimes includes people in your life that you need to let go of that are no longer bringing out the best in you. Right. Like, and that's hard. That's a hard process. And so to know that there are people who are also going through that, I mean, it's, it's, it's deeply meaningful and it's supported and, and it, and I believe it enhances the outcomes tremendously. I mean, we know, we know it does.
Speaker 3Well, like we talked about, you know, a dry fast is not just physical, physically you shed parasites, but energetically you shed parasites too. Right. Zoom scrolling is a parasite. You might have parasitical people around you that pull energy from you and they, they leave on their own. It's amazing. I mean. It's the weirdest thing.
Speaker 1Of course it makes sense. Like with what I know about family constellations and just intergenerational stuff and the way we relate as humans, like when you change the dynamic within yourself, it changes it within the actual experience of reality.
Speaker 3Boom. Because you start resonating with a different reality. Yeah, totally. That's exactly correct.
Speaker 1On the spiritual side of things, um, we were mentioning off camera, the Lakota tradition of doing a vision quest. That's effectively a dry fast. Like it's, it's pretty intense because they're in some cases like standing on a hill praying in all four directions while standing for 24, 48, 72, 96 hours while not eating or drinking anything. But I have a friend who's done this several times. Now, and he says the, the visions or downloads, if you want to call it that, that he receives in this experience are next level. So I kind of want to frame this question as you have, have had both experiences where I'm speaking to Theo for those who are not watching, uh, where you've done it like very intentionally, not that it's not intentionally the other way, but where you're, you're maximizing the time for clarity for just being out in nature. And then you've also done it while you're working. So you guys can take people through both approaches depending on what they contextually have available in their schedule, right?
Speaker 2Yeah, we've in any given group that we're working with, we may have someone who is like for real kind of hermiting, you know, going into the cave, being by themselves, turning off all the media, turning off all the tech, spending lots of time in meditation. And then we've got someone in, you know, New York. New York city who is working and exposed and not taking time off. And it's the sort of harmonization of those different types of experiences that we can help facilitate, you know, through the daily group calls and through the telegram support that we're doing all the time. So it's really. You take them through the same cohort though? We'll take them through the same cohort. Okay. Yeah. Cool. Because the, and, and, you know, obviously there's a lot of sharing. So, you know, the, you know, gal in Germany who is deeply in her body, in her. In her experience, in her feels, um, processing trauma sort of naturally is just happening while she's doing this process.
Speaker 1Totally could see that.
Speaker 2Contrasted with the guy who like didn't take any days off and is still running the household. It's, it's the equalization of that, but there's still those insights that are popping through. And by nature of the practice itself, uh, and the purification process, you can choose how you want to set it up. However you want, you know, the performance. So, you know, if you're spending more time in nature by yourself, away from people, away from your typical day to day tasks, you're likely going to have more epiphanies, more insights, more trippy experiences. You know, there's going to be a, a, a deeper spiritual experience because you're not, you know, on Twitter. Right. But if you make that time, if you say, Okay, well, I'm going to take day three, four, and five to like really distance myself and just show up for the zoom calls, talk to the crew, look at my phone occasionally for the telegram support and people who are asking questions. But I want to spend the next couple of days really kind of working on myself. Maybe I want to journal a little bit, reflect a little bit about what I'm doing here, what I need to let go of. It's really up to that person. It's, it's, it's, it's sovereignty. It's at a fundamental. Mental level within the context of the practice.
Speaker 3Well, that was the, let's change the name slightly. That was Kate's experience. The last one. Yeah. I mean, she, cause she had both the physical and the spiritual downloads. We had a person on our, our last cohort who let's just say in her, her past earlier years was a, was a partier, a lot of, a lot of different substances, not, not so healthy. And then, you know, about 20 years ago. She got into natural health, but she went the energy realm. So she just full on energy worker and it's great. And, and she's nationally known and has a great community, but hadn't really paid so much attention to the physical. And she was very interesting to work with because she's so in tune with her body. She could feel things energetically as they started to shift during the dry fast. And on one of the calls, she, she mentioned, Hey, like I, something's going on in my liver. Like there's a, there's a lot happening in my liver and I can feel, and you know, my breast tissue, there's, there's something shrinking there's, there's, there's activity going on, you know, and she was kind of struggling physically a lot each day. I mean, she was kind of, kind of a wreck, you know, and, and she decided, you know what, I really got to go all in on this experience. So she got some friends, they drove her out to a natural home. So she got some friends, they drove her out to a natural hot springs and she spent all day in these minerals springs and then camped out under the starlight and just kind of had a mystical experience where her body talked to her and said, Hey, I need you to pay more attention to me. And the liver was kind of crying out for help. And then she got home and this was the morning of the fifth day. And this only happens with people that are super toxic. Like they've, they've, they've got. There's a ton of toxins in their body. She started vomiting and pooping out black bile and parasites at the same time. And. and we're not talking small amounts we're talking handfuls so the parasites looked like little tadpoles like basically like a ball with a tail yeah just coming out both ends and if you vomit black bile from the liver and you also are pooping that out that means that your liver is back flushing so hard it ejected the contents into your stomach whoa which is really hard to do
Speaker 1could also be indicative of some sort of like cancerous thing in your in in your digestive tract though too
Speaker 3yeah well yeah with the blood whole blood yeah it's like black goo yeah or like bilirubin is typically what they say it is and and like so like dark gallstones are typically calcified bilirubin which is what is bilirubin it's it's old dead red blood cells but her and it's often shows up in cirrhosis yeah and so she had this experience it wasn't over in 20 minutes it was like two hours and and she's just on the floor in the bathroom like purging but her body said you know what i am prioritizing healing your liver and one of the main russian dry fasting doctors of the modern age dr filanoff in his opinion he said 90 plus of diseases are from dysregulated liver and gut yeah that's what he's like that's just that's just what it is so we're back to terrain and so her body said your train's no good your liver's not good you're not good you're not good you're not good you're not good you're not good whatever is the most effective we're going to focus on that for me it was my gut you know for other people it's scar tissue from an old injury but so she went through that process
Speaker 2and what she shared with us because she does all this healing work all over the place she's a she's highly intuitive super tapped in but she had not ever once in her healing journey and healing others taking time for herself oh yeah that
Speaker 3was a big part of her
Speaker 2so she is just absorbing all of this stuff that she's clearing out of people that she's picking up and she's walking around with it yeah and then the diet doesn't help the way that she eats doesn't help she's just not she said i have never taken time for myself to do my own sort of detox or cleaning ever before and so all of that residue all of that stuff that she had been picking up from working on people she was holding
Speaker 3on to she said that she said she felt like the black bile is programmed with the bad information from stuff she picked up and she's like i don't know what to do with it i don't know what to do with it from other people could
Speaker 1totally see that right it's like uh in the in the caro tradition in peru for people who do sort of shamanic work or anything where they're like healing other people helping other people to heal they have to get really good at digesting like literally the energy is coming from other people and that is done in your gut uh i guess you could say in like your solar plexus region um energetically and if you're not good at doing that then it can overwhelm and kill you yes yeah yes absolutely
Speaker 3it makes a lot of
Speaker 1sense yeah on that note since you brought up a woman and again i get a lot of pushback from women specifically when it comes to fasting it's also because most people that listen to this podcast are women but have you had a lot of women go through your program and what are their experiences it's most of them
Speaker 2it's mostly women really yeah it's mostly women and interesting and we have i mean there's no way for us to know at what point in their cycle they are when they do it we're doing the group drive fast x day you're in whether whatever fourth whatever of the four phases of your cycle you're in it's just kind of what you got yeah and what we have found is women are incredibly strong they're uh they have an incredible amount of power and we have not found in our experience that that has been disruptive or detrimental and now we've got a pretty long case set of time you know we've got a couple of years so we and we follow up and keep in contact with everybody there has not been any like negative or detrimental effects by gals who have been doing drive fasts yeah six months 12 months 18 months later um you know what in thea and i were actually talking about this a little bit yesterday i think that there probably is a best time to do a drive fast in your cycle yeah that makes maybe it's maybe it's not who knows but i think it would be fascinating research to know like what is the optimal time but for all of these women that we've had it they they they tolerate it well and they haven't i mean we haven't can you think of a of a follow-up we've gotten from any women that have said like this has not been good
Speaker 3for me well remember we had one who hadn't had a cycle for two years and then it restarted so
Speaker 1it helped her hormonal
Speaker 3still going yeah yeah and also uh the russians found out that if a woman is carrying a larger amount of toxins no matter where she's at our cycle she'll start a cycle during the drive fast and women have an additional detox pathway that we don't have which is is that one and so it'll push stuff into the blood the uterine lining and move it out yep um and so they'll just start spontaneously and then they'll start spontaneously menstruating if they have that kind of toxic load yeah yeah it it it'll move
Speaker 2it out we had we had a gal uh a couple of cohorts ago who was the the vision of sort of natural health like lived on a farm um yoga breath work works in marketing and natural health like the sort of vision of of what you think of a of a healthy woman to be and she was doing a lymphatic massage she went from her place in spain kind of the uh and to the outskirts outside of madrid or whatever uh and did a lymphatic massage and after about an hour of the lymphatic massage she's like uh we need to wait we need to take a break i need to go to the bathroom she goes over to the bathroom and similarly to the gal that theo just mentioned she had the same thing and it was coming out of her she was puking she was she had diarrhea she was pulling parasites out of her eyes what she had parasites coming out of her vagina what and she went through a 90 minute process of just this total profound parasite purge that came out of every orifice of her body including pulling parasites out of her eyes and then afterward she went she got herself together she jumped back on the on the table finished her lymphatic massage and in the call later that day she's she goes she goes you guys are not going to believe this you're not going to believe this but i'm going to tell you anyway listen to what just happened and she goes through the whole thing and she goes and guess what she's i mean she's probably she was 60 60 she's like my vagina has gone back to when i was about 19. i remember that car that's like i was i was watching everyone's face because i was like oh my
Speaker 3god
Speaker 2my vagina i have a young vagina again the young vagina she went
Speaker 3on for like five minutes she kept going yeah it was
Speaker 2like yeah she was super stoked about that she was over the moon after this episode during her lymphatic massage her stuff's moving all around and she's like she's like not to be too graphic with you guys but it's like tighter and firmer she was graphic it's wonderful like i can't believe it i did not expect this from my experience
Speaker 3we didn't expect that either i mentioned two points yeah so on the parasite by the way thank you yeah it was actually really good yeah on the parasite topic so um during a dry fast obviously there's no inputs of water yeah and so the body's native healing intelligence prioritizes the water for your own systems and the parasites do not have the ability to produce their own water they take it from the host and so when there's no water available the parasites freak out and it's by day five where they reach the end of what they can tolerate and they either move out of the body or they
Speaker 1die interesting but
Speaker 3that that come that question comes up a lot and so it's it's when you take away the water inflammation goes down the parasites can't survive all these other things happen and then since we're on the topic of dry fasting and the gens if you want to talk about the guy that you i think you did a dry fast with them he was on trt yes you want to mention that well it's kind of cool it was
Speaker 2a husband wife duo yeah and they they did it at the very same time that i did this was before we started any any of the dry fasting group stuff so he's been on yeah he's you probably you might you might have seen him before super high intensity guy black belt special ops like stud alpha black belt runs jiu-jitsu gyms been been on trt for 10 15 years i think uh and what happens with exogenous trt is that your testicles shrivel like that's just everybody knows that his plumped back up and they after the dry in five days wow they plumped back up to their pre-trt uh shape and size and i i firmer
Speaker 1young vaginas and plump balls
Speaker 2that's it so his wife his wife did it she had uh two c-section births uh-huh and she had so she had the c-section scar yeah yeah she had stretched she's got stretch marks from you know from uh her pregnancy and her C-section scar got – what happens is as it goes through the healing, right? So that scar tissue is scraped by your system for energy. So the scars on your body, which are – it's useless tissue that is now scraped for energy and so it gets kind of bright red. I know that Theo has had this experience too, these scars. So the scar tissue gets red. It gets sore. It gets inflamed for maybe a day or two. And then afterward for her and specifically, it got – if it was three-quarters of an inch thick, it went down to like a quarter of an inch. So the scar got smaller. It was less sore. Her fascia moves better across that scar as well. Wow. And simultaneously, she had – and this is the first time I had heard this. She had a chipped tooth. She had a chipped tooth going into it. It had chipped like three days before she started her drive fast and she was like getting her tongue on it. It was scraping her tongue. It was bugging her a lot. That filled in. Really? In five days. Wow. And these – there's no reason to make this stuff up. Right. Right? Right. Like why would she – because she was really skeptical but her husband was doing it with me and she's like, okay, I'll do it too. So that's just one – another example of these – These little things like the body wanted to repair that tooth. Yeah. The body wanted to repair those – that C-section scar. You know? Like I think you never really know what is going to happen or what you're going to get but the body knows what it wants to handle.
Speaker 3Yeah. I've had multiple surgeries on my right wrist. I got broken fighting in a practice bout and then I fought with it two weeks later with it taped and still broken in collegiate nationals and had to have a couple surgeries.
Speaker 1Been there. I've had four. Four surgeries. So I understand.
Speaker 3Totally get it. And it was on my second dry fast where the scar flared bright red and it was hot. Like hot, hot, hot to the touch and it hurt a lot. And then it just – it stopped and it went down. It like sank into my arm. It used to be kind of raised and puffy and red and now it's white and flat. And the other thing that happened was in my late 20s I was ego lifting. This show off. And I was doing deadlifts. And at 6'4", when you're reaching down to pick up something really heavy off the ground, your body, your lower back is in a compromised position. There's just, you know, a dude that's 5'6". He's a lot more up and down when he's picking it up. I'm not. Throughout my lower back, never healed. I would throw it out sometimes. Like I'm reaching down to pick up a sock in the bedroom and it would go out. And then I'm like, oh, God, I got to deal with this for three days. And it was actually the last day and then in recovery, my lower back hurt so bad. It was – it hurt the whole thing and it was right where it – During the dry fast? During and after. During the recovery period.
Speaker 1If you frequently tune into the Way Forward podcast, don't skip this one. This is personal. If you've ever felt a shift from something that you've heard on this podcast, if it's helped you to see things more clearly, if it's helped you to break down a limiting belief system, if it's helped you just to – or if it's helped you to feel less alone, then I'm asking you from my heart to help us keep going. We're not backed by corporate sponsors, venture capital money, or big donors. And that has been a deliberate choice. And we've said no to a lot of ad deals that weren't aligned because we don't want our mission to be shaped by products, brands, and agendas that we don't actually believe in. There are a few trusted brands and products that do support us and we're incredibly grateful for that. But the reality is this is primarily sustained by our listeners and viewers. Right now, this podcast has roughly 140,000 video and audio downloads a month and it's continuing to grow. And only a small fraction of that actually helped contribute financially. That's not a guilt trip. It's just the reality. We haven't said this directly enough, so here it is. If you'd like this podcast to continue, please help support us by becoming a member of TheWayForward.com. If even a small fraction of listeners and viewers chose to support, we'd be able to easily sustain this. A membership at TheWayForward.com is $99 annually, which amounts to about – $8 a month. Think of it like a couple organic kombuchas at your local health food store or maybe a fancy latte every month. And also think of it like this. In addition to ensuring that we can continue, you're actively supporting yourself in the process. TheWayForward.com is a private membership platform that allows you to instantly connect with aligned people, practitioners, farms, schools, restaurants, and more in your local area. And if the platform isn't for you, we've added a donation option as well. You'll find both of those in the show notes. If you've received something from the show, please consider giving back by becoming a member so we can continue to reach people, not just as a podcast, but as a movement for something good, true, and beautiful. Thank you so much for tuning in, and thank you for walking this path with us. Were you kind of worried at that point, like, shit, maybe this is – It was bad.
Speaker 3Yeah, yeah. It was – and pain.
Speaker 1Maybe I'm wrong about the dry fat.
Speaker 3Yeah, yeah. The people we have that do it, they will experience pain if they have injuries. It's part of the deal. It's part of the deal with dry fat.
Speaker 1It's just – it's drying, like, it's healing that area.
Speaker 3So what it is, it's really aggressive autophagy that's actually going into the remodeling of the scar tissue. And so as it breaks down, you feel pain. Yeah. And so it broke it down, and I was like, God, dude, this hurts. Like, I couldn't even bend over. I was walking gingerly. And then four days later, gone. And I've never had it since. The injury is permanently resolved.
Speaker 2Wow. We had a guy, speaking of, the back late 70s said that since he was 40 years old, he had a hunchback. Oh, yeah. Morbidly obese in addition to having a lot of back issues and was, like, hunched over. And he pops onto the call on day five. This is, like, right before everyone's breaking the fast. And he's, like, super subtle, subtle guy. He's like, yep, something kind of amazing. Happened to me today. I'm like, okay. Like, yeah, I was walking down the stairs, you know, typical way that I do. And I was looking at my own feet, because that's what I do. I look at my own feet, because I, you know, had a hunchback since I was 40. And on the fifth stair going downstairs, suddenly I was able to stand up tall all the way. Wow. We're like, what? He goes, I'm not saying it's a miracle. I'm not, I wouldn't use that terminology, but I can stand up straight now. Wow. And he goes, I called all, everybody in my family and said, hey, I can stand up straight. He goes, so now I've got a new lease on life, because I don't have to stare at your shoes anymore. I can look you in the face. Wow. And, like, I don't know what that was. Yeah, I don't. Who knows, right? Maybe it was an energetic thing. Maybe it was a disc thing. Who knows? But the fact that he went, that, I mean, that would change your life. You've been a hunchback for 40 years. Yeah, man. And then suddenly you can stand up straight. It's pretty wild. Like, your life changes. And if you're open for it, I want to go through a couple of the different stories,
Speaker 1because I. Dude, that's what I was literally about to say. Yeah, perfect. Since we're already on that, we might as well just go into them, and I can ask other questions after.
Speaker 2So we've got mental, emotional, physical, and spiritual. And I just jotted down different categories of different stories that people had. We had a guy in our last cohort group who was sort of admittedly obsessive, obsessive-compulsive, like attention to detail, to the utmost, to the extent that it was kind of debilitating, because he was just obsessing over every little detail of his business. And how he did his thing. And he said that this is the first time in his adult life that he has felt like he doesn't have to obsess on things anymore. That things are going to flow in a way that is brand new to him. And this was the week after we completed the drive fast. We were talking. We do a follow-up call with everybody. How's everybody doing? You know, what's going on? And he's like, I'm not obsessive anymore. He's like, I still pay attention to details, but the energy and the, you know, like neuroses around the detail is gone. I can still get stuff done without obsessing over it. We had a guy, another guy, interestingly enough, that I actually did a podcast with. It was titled, What Happens When a Normie Does a Drive Fast.
Speaker 1We'll throw that in the show notes.
Speaker 2So Chris, I went to, he was president as a kid. I love that one. And he's like, I'm not a biohacker. I'm not a health nut. Like, I'm just a dude, man. Yeah. But I saw you post about it, Sean. I wanted to try it. What's the most extreme thing that I can do for my health? I'm going to try it. Not only did his sleep totally transform, but his procrastination ended. Wow. Like, he goes, I would put things off until the very last second in everything, from laundry to tasks at work, always to the last second. He's like, I fed off that tension and pressure. I thought it was helping me get things done if I just like put it off and get it all done at the last minute. So the procrastination was gone for, and I'll use his name because Chris, we had another gal who is a clinical psychologist who has been depressed essentially since puberty. And she said, she walked, she walked through all of it. She's like, I'm a, I'm a therapist and I work and I specialize in people with depression because it's something I've had to deal with my whole life. And she said, and for the first time in my adult life, I don't feel the same dark cloud of depression that I, that I have just coped with. - Wow. - Forever. And she- Her face, like her face changed. Like it. So we had a guy who, um, is a very high level guy, works at a tech company in a sales role, like elite, elite at a massive company. And he would sort of, uh, perseverate on these big decisions, big deals with multimillion dollars at stake. And he would, uh, get stuck and it would disrupt his life. Like what he said was that he, he makes faster decisions, which allows everything else to flow in his work life. So he's way less stressed because he can come to a decision point faster.
Speaker 1Makes sense. Like if you're saying that one of the primary things people experience is that they heal their gut, obviously like there's a gut instinct associated with that, that a lot of people have been cut off from for a variety of reasons. Yes. And I feel like if you're healing your gut, you're able to tap into your gut instinct a little bit better energetically. And it's like, Oh, I know what's right in my gut.
Speaker 2Great point. I think you're right. Yeah. Yeah. We've had, again, multiple people just let go of alcohol completely just done with it. Now I would imagine
Speaker 1a variety of months later. Yeah. That's incredible.
Speaker 2Cannabis scrolling, all the stuff. So from an emotional standpoint and I'll, I'll hammer through this kind of quickly. Uh, we had a gal who, um, uh, again, very, very in her process, very in her body, very high, a highly emotional person, wonderful person. We love her so much. And she was giving herself permission to be herself. Oh yeah. She was like giving, she's like, I can just be who I want to be for the first time in my life. I'm now feeling like I can really be who I am and I've never felt okay being who I am. And now because I've gone through this, I'm more in touch with myself. I'm more in touch with myself. I'm emotionally more intelligent, more rounded, more well-rounded. I can be whatever I want to be. That's amazing.
Speaker 3I was like, Oh God, that's supposed to be a German accent. I was going to get something like that. I got more. That was good.
Speaker 2We had, we had a guy who South African at first, but beat South Africa. We have a guy who has always been detached from his emotions since he was a kid. Childhood stuff, overbearing father detached from it and has just found workarounds, you know, in his relationships predominantly for, um, kind of navigating around that. And after his, he had a bunch of back stuff, heel, he had a, a bunch of physical things, but he said that the most meaningful experience that he has was that he could actually get in touch with his emotions. Like he was crying for no reason during the drive fast. And he's like, I've never cried. I never cry. I don't know why this is happening. And then he cried so much that he kind of like was like, Oh, this kind of feels good. Like this is a little bit cathartic. And he said that that was the biggest one was that he's now able to feel a wider range of emotions than he had ever before. I mean, we talked about,
Speaker 1there's something about man, when you're, when you're cut off from the noise of the world in so many different ways, including like the food that you're eating, which like, again, not saying that that's bad noise necessarily, but it's, it's just like more external noise that you're taking on that when you cut all that off, initially a lot of your internal noise comes online, you know? And so for, for me, like I can only speak to my experience and fasting and things like this is that comes up and I have to just sit and be with it and process it and deal with it. And then after that though, is noiseless. It's just stillness. It's bliss. You know what I mean? It's just like pure bliss, just doing nothing, literally just no breath work protocol. Anything like that. I was doing Qigong a lot of the time, but just sitting and being was like bliss, man. Yeah.
Speaker 3The sense of presence that people derive from a dry fast. We hear it all the time. I've experienced that. I've talked to you about it a lot where you finish a dry fast and you can just sit down and do a task and not reach for your phone, not glance at social media, not look around the room, not get up and go get a snack. Cause it's entertaining. You just, you're just beat. You're just present at all that. The Russians call it an informational detox. Cause you don't have all this information, just like you said, coming in from water, coming in from food, and then your body's only getting the water of life, which is perfectly structured and devoid of bad information. Your blood's been purified hundreds of times going through the same filtering organs. And so you're just kind of crystal clear. Like people's eyes get brighter and they have a sparkle. Like the white of
Speaker 1their eyes is so bright. Yeah. But also their energy, you can
Speaker 3see when you look at their eyes, they're kind of sparkly and it's, it's, they're energetically clean. There's less noise in their body. The volume has been turned down. Inflammation is noisy to the body, right? The volumes turned down on that. So people are much more present. Remember, I believe he later became a coaching client of yours, but remember it improved his relationship with his son and his family. Yes. He was more present. He was more present.
Speaker 2Yeah. He, the, the level of stillness that he experienced in the drive fast allowed him to translate that into his family. Amazing. Like, like, okay, we're just going to sit on the floor and hang out. Yeah. Like you've never done that before. Yeah. Right. Yeah.
Speaker 1That's incredible. Wow. Keep going. Sorry.
Speaker 2No, there's no, there's a, well, so, you know, I mentioned, I mentioned my blood work earlier, the testicle growth, the vaginal rejuvenation, the tooth regeneration, passing black bile parasites. Yeah. That's the other thing too. And this is one thing that we, that we haven't really talked about at all. But I, but because we're in the physical category, people are going to immediately go start, start doing research, right? Which we want you to please go read as much as you can. There, there are some distinctions in the dry fasting community between what's called a hard drive fast and a soft drive fast. Okay. Right. So a hard drive fast is you don't even touch water. You don't even, you, you, you actually.
Speaker 1Oh, I know someone who's done that because they said their first experience of water after dry fasting was jumping. In the ocean. Right. And they didn't, the whole time they didn't shower, nothing like did not even touch water. Right.
Speaker 2So that would be in the category of a, of a hard drive fast that that's fairly impractical for just about everybody. Yeah. Right. Most people are not going to go to those extents. So we, we don't really, what is, what is the benefit of that? Well, so, you know, when you're dry fasting your skin, you're like a dried out sponge, right? Yeah. So if you put anything on your skin or if you get in the water, or if you take a shower with tap water, and you're being washed over with chlorine and bromine and. No, that makes sense at that level.
Speaker 1Well, let's say someone, it already has a water filtration system in their home or whatever, like has natural springs nearby that they swim in typically. Like what would be the benefit?
Speaker 3It's still theoretical and there's huge debate in the Russian dry, dry fasting scientific community. And some of them are staunchly. Don't even touch water. Don't even touch. And the other ones say that's crazy. You need to be doing enemas. You need to be walking in the rain. You need to be taking baths and soaks. We fall on the side of what they call a soft dry fast because you're what the, the water is going to enter your body anyway, even if you're doing, I've done both. I've done a hard dry fast and, but most of them have been soft. But when you absorb water through your skin or through the bottoms of your feet, or you take a deep breath, you're not going through digestion.
Speaker 1And so it's just not going through digestion. Yeah, exactly. Dr.
Speaker 3Shachenikov, he supports enemas and, and, and getting water on the skin, cold showers, water enemas specifically.
Speaker 1Yes. Yeah. And so all
Speaker 3that water goes into the body and then it, it goes through cell membranes and injects even more toxins that supports the detox. The caveat is exactly what you said. You better have ultra clean water. And specifically Shachenikov says you need to do it. Mountain spring water, glacial melt water. So he's not saying, you know, throw a carbon filter tap on your bathtub. Right. Right. So I've done both hard and fast or hard and soft. I mean, it wasn't, I didn't find the hard particularly difficult.
Speaker 2We, we, we fall on the soft dry fast protocol because water can ease the process. Being in water can ease the process. And he's going to laugh when I talk about it, but enemas are profound. I want to see, I want to see some stuff. I want to see what's coming out, you know, like, okay, I want to do the, I, so I want to do the enema water only. And I want to see what I was hanging on to. Yeah. And it's like, it's a lot. It's hundreds and hundreds of gallstones, hundreds and parasites of five different species that I catch in a strainer and annoy my wife again. Using the strainer with an enema on days four or five will produce and flush out those parasites and stones. And then you can see in this strainer what's come out of you. So that obviously that's a soft dry fast because not only are you absorbing water through your skin, you're taking it and then it's flushing all that stuff out. So I think that the, and again, in Ivanov and Shenikov were in these enemas, if you need them, it can be really soothing and it can also clear you out in a way that you wouldn't be able to do previously.
Speaker 1Have you passed mucoid plaque? Oh yeah. Okay.
Speaker 2So this is such an interesting point because
Speaker 1a lot of people who are skeptical of fasting and cleansing and people passing mucoid plaque will say, that's just a function of the supplements you're taking during your cleanse, or that's just a function of the, you know, what, whatever you're taking to cleanse in those situations. But my friend, Mike Cardamone, and then you guys are saying this now too, have done, you know, he's done 21 day urine fast. He's done a variety of wild fast, but on multiple occasions, he's passed mucoid plaque. So he's like, that completely debunks that idea that it's some of the elixirs and things that you're taking during your cleanse.
Speaker 2Yeah. Yeah. No, you'll, you'll pass dead stomach lining and you can see it when it comes out, you know, just dysfunctional, like layers of stomach lining that are no longer serve you. They're no longer functioning. They're just kind of hanging. Out in there. That stuff gets passed.
Speaker 3Okay. Yeah. Thing that people are going to find really useful. So as you know, I'm sure the gut has a complete cell turnover every 24 hours. It's the fastest regenerating tissue in the body. And so if you do one 24 hour dry fast, you get a new one cell thick layer on the surface of your gut. And that's just one day. So imagine what five days or seven days does
Speaker 1completely transformed gut
Speaker 3transforms the gut. I mean, your immune system goes into. Overdrive and it just starts getting rid of what doesn't serve you. And so for, in my case, cause all the damage from spring glyphosate with the guys at Phillips tree service for the utility back in the day, you know, it's always the gut. It's like every time I do it, there's other stuff that gets fixed when my gut is it's always doing work, man. That's amazing. And, um, do you want to keep going? Or I got two anecdotes too. Yeah. Short ones.
Speaker 2The last little category, the last little category is, is, is the last little category is the spiritual insight. Oh yeah. And, and maybe, maybe more than the previous cohort groups. This last group was, was a very, for whatever reason, deep, deep spiritual insights, downloads and meditation. One guy went, he was in Estonia. He went and on, on day five and got in the river and he'd live, um, at this, he travels a lot, but lives. In this place that's next to this, you know, glacial river in Estonia. And he's like, you know, I just decided I would just go get in that river for the first time. I've been living here for six months and I've never gotten in this river. And he got in and had this like ecstatic connection to Gaia herself in this moment, this water rushing over him. He's like, I, he goes, I can't even, I can't even describe what the feeling was, but I felt such a deep connection to, to my body. My body felt connected to the earth, which is connected to source. He's like, I can't. And he, he, he's to hear him talk about it
Speaker 3was like, Whoa,
Speaker 2very analytical.
Speaker 3Like he was super left brain. Yeah. And that call, I was like shocked. Dang. All right. We're not expecting that from him. Like he, he had that moment.
Speaker 2Now you could, you could, you could have that experience and psychedelics or float tanks or ecstatic dancers, all these things. But, but on the natch, no food, no water for five days. And then you just go hang out in a river for, for 15 minutes and have this like oneness feeling like, come on.
Speaker 1Dude, there's something incredibly appealing to me. Uh, again, I'll just speak for myself. I'm sure there's people who are different about being able to induce that feeling on my own with my own stuff. Yeah. Right. Yeah. That's really profound.
Speaker 2Right. It's huge. Yeah. On day five of mine, I walked out, we went down, we went down to the Puget sound waters, 55 degrees with the family. I'm like shuffling around, not very much energy. My kids are playing at the beach and I'm like, I'm almost there. This is after the morning of my, my meditation crescendo, I'll walk out and I'm just like chilling waist deep in the Puget sound. And I'm just like looking in the water and this like little fish swims up and I'm like, Oh, that's kind of cool. I guess I'm just sitting still enough that the fish don't bother. And then another one swims up and then another one swims up. And in five minutes of me just sitting here looking down at the water, I had probably 12 or 13 different little fish like hanging around on my feet. I felt like a Disney princess for a minute, you know, like all of these little fish are like hanging around at my feet. And I'm like, Oh, that's kind of cool. And then another one swims up and I'm like, Oh, that's kind of cool. And so I thought about that. I reflected on that a lot. You know, my, my, you know, the world is still happening. My kids are still around. So I'm not, you know, like deeply in my process, but I'm just at the novelty of all these little fishies hanging around my feet, you know, a frigging flounder that's like eight inches long is just like resting near my foot. And I was thinking about it and I had reduced the noise in my body and in my brain and in my emotions and my spirit. And I was like, Oh, to the extent that I could just like have this level of integration and oneness with the earth.
Speaker 1Totally makes sense.
Speaker 2And they were like, curious about that. Like this guy's, you know, might as well be a tree hanging out in here. We're not scared of trees. Dude, it was the weirdest experience. That's so cool. And I had never had anything like that before. Like anecdote after anecdote for people who just feel greater connectedness, deeper and richer dream states, um, greater connection to people who just feel greater connectedness, deeper and richer dream states, um, greater connection to people who just feel greater connectedness, deeper and richer dream states, uh, to their inner self and the collective unconscious. I mean, there's just so many anecdotes. I know you've got a couple of two to add.
Speaker 3Yeah. Minor, minor brief and more on the, on the practical side, which Dude, shut up.
Speaker 1Squirrels coming in your window and like wanting to chill on your shoulder is the most practical thing there is. Talking to plants. Yeah. Talking to plants. That's the most practical thing there is. That one was weird.
Speaker 3I'm just kidding. Yeah. I just want it. That's so cool. They were kind of smiling and winking. Um, they're there. I believe they were amused by my presence, like moving around quickly. And yeah, it was funny, but That first thing's so cool, dude. Yeah. So cool. So I'm changing the name slightly, but Larry, uh, uh, two time cancer guy, right? Yep. And so he was undergoing, you know, he's, he has done the dry fast with us twice. Uh, and his second one, he decided to go seven days and this is after he'd already received the toxic, uh, T-mode radiation. All that. All that. Yep. So pretty, pretty gnarly, pretty heavy duty. And so he did a seven days and we asked him how he was doing afterwards. He said, I'm bounding up the stairs. He used that word specifically bounding. I'm bounding up the stairs. He had tons of energy. And then you remember the mountain bike guy? Yeah. Yeah. So I love this story. It's so simple, but it's just so impactful. He had been riding the same mountain bike trail in the mountains behind his house for 15 years. And there's always one section that he couldn't clear. He had to get off and walk it up. So five days in recovery, he went and rode that same trail and he cleared that for the first time. Wow. So he's the oldest he's ever been. He's never cleared it in 15 years and he cleared it. That's incredible. And what I want to say about that, and we've touched on a little bit, but it's important that when we're talking about terrain healing stuff during this process of autophagy, your body will take out old, sick, underperforming mitochondria. And grow new ones and improve the existing ones, make them stronger. So when people have this more energy, it's from improving the train for your mitochondria to heal themselves. And so if you can swap out old mitochondria for new mitochondria, younger ones, you become younger as a body. And one other thing I want to mention is specifically because I see that cap behind you is one of the things. One of the things I'm really big on is the recovery part of the dry fast, which is actually more important than the dry fast itself. And there was a famous West Point story about Fletcherization. Have you ever heard about this? Uh-huh. What? Okay. So Horace Fletcher was a guy who in the 1890s, 1910s, 1920s, at 44 years old, he was debilitatingly chronically ill. And he had all these gastrointestinal problems. And heart disease and just not in a good way. Even back then, after going to medical doctors, he got frustrated and said, "You guys are just trying to put me on weird drugs and just treating the symptoms. I know there's a better way." So after studying health for years and years, he came up with a process he called Fletcherization. And this is what we teach people who do dry fast with us, which Fletcherization is chewing your food up. And this has even been scientifically documented. It's called Fletcher esophageal reflex. So when you chew your food past a certain point, you don't actually swallow. It just disappears. Interesting. You're not doing conscious swallowing. You just chew, chew, chew, chew, and then it just disappears.
Speaker 1So this is really big during the refeeding period.
Speaker 3Yeah. Yes. We teach everybody to do this. What is it?
Speaker 1How does it relate to West Point though?
Speaker 3We're getting to that.
Speaker 1Okay. So I try to think back to when I was a plebe, which is what our word was for freshmen. And I know we had to do a lot of weird stuff. weird stuff at meals and i'm trying to remember like did they make us eat like well this was this was over 100 years ago they did this study and they like to keep their traditions at west point
Speaker 3okay yeah well i don't know if this one lasted but what they did was is they took uh what are you are you called cadets yeah okay so they took fat cadets and they took skinny underweight cadets and they broke them into two cohort cohorts and they fed them the exact same portions of food and the exact same food and that's all they could eat and the only requirement was they had to chew their food a lot i think they were doing like two minutes per bite uh-huh and so it was like considered like therapeutic fletcherization yeah and the fat cadets lost weight and their weight normalized and the skinny ones gained weight and their weight normalized wow isn't that interesting so that is interesting when you masticate your food a lot your mouth actually becomes the first digestive system and in the west we're taught to eat really fast and get it done and not eat consciously go go go and everything you have these big chunks of food going down and it doesn't ever get properly digested and then it passes through so we have found with fletcherization um you know after a dry fast your stomach is shrunk down really small it's like this like less than the size of your fist um your intestines have contracted in size quite a bit and so you have to wake them up very gently and chewing your food a lot when you get to the solid food phase is huge it makes all the difference and for people that are interested in weight loss and fat loss this is what extends the benefits and i'm an example of that because at my last well prior you know laughing but you've seen my struggles man i did a really extreme fasting diet for 16 years that was really advised i ate one meal a day for 16 years and
Speaker 1how did you feel
Speaker 3doing that i actually felt undernourished but like as far as how i looked aesthetically it was pretty good and i just decided to stop one day because my brain just wasn't working well eating only once a day if you're doing a lot of cognition all day you need to eat something yeah and so i only ate dinner interesting and that was that so i stopped doing it but my metabolism was damaged by this practice and so as soon as i started eating two times a day i piled on a lot of visceral fat really fast and he's heard me complain about he'll laugh but i was texting him i'm like dude i'm fat for the first time i like had a six-pack since i was 13 like this sucks what do i do and you know all this stuff and then we got into dry fasting and this last dry fast was only a five day you know seven days where you get significant fat loss but in addition to the gut healing i started at 231 pounds and when i finished the dry fast and i'd recovered for five days i was at 212 pounds in may wow and i'm 212 pounds right now that's amazing and so i've extended that weight loss from fletcherizing my food like we we were laughing about it at yeah the barbecue place yesterday because i was like dude you know we gotta chew the heck yeah he's like yeah we're gonna be here forever
Speaker 2but it is the strangest it is the strangest experience when you're chewing food so long that it's just gone it gets so pulverized get masticated in such a small amount that you don't actually consciously swallow at all it just slides down and you're like whoa yeah that's wild your digestion improves and that i mean for anybody listening right now wherever you are just try it just try it for like a day try it for two days just requires
Speaker 1a lot of presence because like you have to be aware enough to realize it's like it's for example like one posture like in order to have good posture it requires that you're present i'm gonna fix mine right now yeah right you know what i mean though like to get really present with yourself while you're eating that's what it requires and
Speaker 2it will extend dinner time by a good hour i mean it will
Speaker 3it's it gets crazy and shit do you want to hear the original therapeutic schedule for fletcherization it's crazy so it's five weeks long and this is they actually treated people like this up until the 1950s but week one you had to chew every bite one minute week two two minutes week three three minutes week four two minutes week five one minute and and people would do that for five weeks and their weight would normalize and a lot of gastrointestinal challenges would
Speaker 1would get fixed you probably realize how little food you actually need during meals it's so little
Speaker 3because it becomes more bioavailable in your mouth there are digestive enzymes released from your saliva yeah as you chew the food you're eating it's like you're eating a lot of food and you're chewing that make it more bioavailable it hits your stomach it goes right in the intestines and and you don't have a leaky gut because there's not undigested particles going through the membrane getting in your bloodstream and things get weird this nobody wants to do it yeah because in our society we move so fast and we're always on to the next thing and it's just like dry fasting like you know people like oh shouldn't can't i wet fast because then you know i still have energy and i can be on my phone and i i can work and you know sean and i say look you can just just go all in for five days yeah and and then you recover and then you're good for a year quick
Speaker 1shout out to podigy the team that we brought on to produce our podcasts we started working with them last year and the difference was immediate way less stress on the back end for us with podcast production and our youtube has grown significantly since bringing on podigy if you're already running a podcast and looking to boost your production value or if you're thinking about starting a podcast i highly recommend working with podigy if you check the show notes there's an assessment that podigy has put together to give you specific steps to take to grow your own podcast and that's whether you're just getting started or looking to take your current podcast to the next level each month they're giving away a strategy call with their founder justin moore and he is incredibly talented and incredibly smart and he really knows how to grow a podcast from the ground up so if you're interested in working with podigy just head to the show notes and take the assessment and if you decide to work with them just mention alex zek in the way forward and they'll give you a nice little deal on the refeeding thing before you get to the eating solid foods you have a period of time where you guys recommend just liquids at first right but can you just share the whole process of refeeding
Speaker 2yeah lay it out
Speaker 1you want me to take well yeah very precise yes
Speaker 2so obviously minerals are really important it is very precise like to the minute you know it what he's going to avoid talking about his products because he has a humic and fulvic product that yeah are phenomenal so i'll plug it for him we include a good guy well what a good friend yeah there we go there there it's it's really really important to include those first thing right you need to re you need to nourish the gut but yeah so good
Speaker 3well i mean let's just talk about how it starts um because this is where a lot of people that go rogue and do it on their own screw up and we have a free program for people that just want to dip their toe in because if you do a one day, two day or three day, you can just go right back into it. There's no special refeed. You get tremendous benefits from doing up to three days. If you do a five or a seven, you got to do a really specific protocol or you can get edema, which is retaining water and it doesn't go away fast. It's there for up to weeks. You can cause other problems like stress out your pancreas and you can spike your insulin really hard, which will then program your fat cells to come right back even worse than they were before. These are all significant things and that's why some of these other books and stuff that are on dry fasting, there's some advice in there that those of us that have been in natural health for a long time know isn't great, some of the recommendations. We hired a professional chef to create a specific menu that is hour by hour, day by day to follow so people don't have to wait. We hired a professional chef to create a and you can prep all this stuff beforehand.
Speaker 2It's really centered around, again, you just have this proliferation of pluripotent and omnipotent stem cells that are now circulating through your body, repairing things, right?
Speaker 3Yeah, and you want to support them.
Speaker 2You want to nourish those so that they can be optimized as they're circulating through your body. This is blueberries, berries.
Speaker 3Later on. Later on, right. Yeah, because they're too sweet at first.
Speaker 2So, to finally break and have that first sip of water, we're talking about eight ounces over 15
Speaker 3minutes. Yeah, 15 to 20 minutes. And so, the first day is just fluid. So, we recommend all your water is mineralized. So, we like humic and fulvic quite a bit because it does double duty of donating electrons to your mitochondrias. It makes the water more bioavailable. So, it goes through the system. It mops up toxins. And so, you're quite toxic after you do a dry fast. Your lymph has a lot of shit in it. Your blood has a lot of crap in it.
Speaker 1Because it's been mobilizing all of them. Yeah. So, this is really a part of the fasting experience itself. It's like finally getting out a lot of that. That's right. Which has been mobilized.
Speaker 3Exactly. So, it goes in and you can use it to grab VOCs, heavy metals, glyphosate, which humic and fulvic is good for. And then, we recommend potassium because that restarts the sodium pumps and also dopamine. So, it's a good thing. And then, we recommend potassium because that restarts the electrons and gets the electrical part of your physiology working well, especially your heart and then magnesium. And so, the first day is you're just sipping water that's mineralized. That's it. drink anything the second day by the end of the second day you're getting more into broths and then we like the addition of sparkling water i don't know have you gotten into like carbon dioxide and breathing it and sparkling water and how what that's doing that's going to be the next big thing like i free dive so i'm always doing high co2 training but i
Speaker 1know that like breath work if you have the right intention is more about your tolerance of co2 than it is your ability to fill your lungs
Speaker 3with oxygen correct and co2 is is velcro for oxygen so we want to increase circulation we want more oxygen in the bloodstream because it helps oxidize toxins so when you drink sparkling water you're increasing the circulation via the co2 um and it works really really well and it's very easy and it's it's it feels amazing and it tastes so good so we have people add in sparkling water and then we love
Speaker 1sparkling water it's so good and
Speaker 3it's so helpful they're using it they're having um dementia patients breathe co2 to remove the amyloid plaques now yeah it's getting crazy whoa yeah there's a lot of cool stuff coming out with co2 wow like i was i was literally online the other day like trying to figure out how to carbonate my own water and like ordering the stuff from homebrew stores and stuff but be careful dude the climate
Speaker 1agenda people might get you they think co2 is bad it makes plants grow fast that's right it's literally in the greenhouse they have co2 blowers it's it's if people like really sit and reflect on that it's like oh plants literally need co2 it grows faster eliminate carbon so that we're eliminating the food source for plants like what yeah never forget that we're the
Speaker 3carbon they want to eliminate yeah it's like but then you get into the broth and we have an all-natural broth recipe that's super easy for anyone to make and then we slowly get into the solid foods so like light easily digestible proteins um and you're fletcherizing it you're you're chewing it a lot and the thing is is we don't do a ton of vegetable stuff at during this period because vegetables are a lot harder for your gut to break down than plant material because we're not plants we're made out of we're animals and so those proteins those amino acids are desperately needed by the body during a dry fast because after a dry fast ends you need these amino acids you need those proteins because your body goes into rejuvenation rejuvenation so it's the detox is done the rejuvenation starts and so you're you're building new cells you're building new tissue you're remodeling the tissue that was broken down during the dry fast so animal proteins animal products are really important essentially that's
Speaker 1interesting because i i could see where some vegan raw fruit people vegetarians would be like
Speaker 3screw up your gut yeah if you just
Speaker 2go straight into kale
Speaker 3shakes they don't have the amino acids your body uses as building blocks and you want to come back from a dry fast and regenerate and rejuvenate so you need those amino acids and so our menu is it's animal based and we we did have one objection on that yeah we did um you know there's no meat in the pumpkin soup i just yeah so we do have a pumpkin soup so you have an alternative yeah we do yeah but here's here's a hack uh that we're actually adding this one to the next cohort so one quail egg 3x per day raw contains the entire periodic table and stem
Speaker 1cells okay so active stem someone who's a vegetarian you can still consume eggs right
Speaker 3yep yep yep so you're fine well and specifically quail maybe raw
Speaker 1milk though too possibly or no
Speaker 3that's in it it's in our yeah it's a program okay so we have something called a stem cell smoothie yeah that it part of it is raw milk and it's it's after you've recovered because it has a blueberry in it and you don't want to spike the insulin during the recovery period but it supports stem cells in your body but the quail egg 3x per day raw contains the entire period periodic table elements all these beneficial amino acids and it contains stem cells amazing so it helps your body regenerate yeah that's amazing so that was but that's that's basically it i mean there's a ton of other stuff but what about in
Speaker 1the pre-talks period though oh yeah that's a good one we haven't we haven't talked about that yet yeah we that's the period just for people's context before we're talking about the pre-talks period before you actually enter into the fast yeah you want me to do the meta on that and yeah
Speaker 3you get into it yeah okay yeah so this is something that's missing from the material that's available online and there are people who if you've never done a detox you should not do a dry fast because during a dry fast there is an absolute freaking river of toxins being ejected into your lymph and your bloodstream and if your detox pathways can't handle it it's no good you got to go do it detox for people that have been healthy for people that have been eating clean for people that may have done one or two detoxes we have a pre-talks program and it's it's seven days and it's focused on cleaning out your gut for the most part we do have a component for the bloodstream which is involved with activated charcoal but what we've found is that if somebody has a blocked gut and they have this is gross but a lot of people have impacted fecal matter in their gut it's tucked into the crenelations and it's just kind of stuck there so we have a component that uses whole psyllium husk taken in a specific way on a specific schedule it's like it's like velcro for impacted feces yeah is you know and it just hooks onto it and it pulls it out and the other thing that psyllium husk does that is quite amazing that nobody talks about and this is super important pre-dry fast is that it stimulates the release of bile and so you take psyllium husk on your gut and on an empty stomach your bile drops the psyllium is sitting in your gut and so the bile encounters that and psyllium is a light binder so it cleans the bile out and then the bile gets re-uptaken into your gallbladder a lot of people don't know that but bile is so valuable to the body it drops down it does its job and it goes back up but it also carries toxins and so we stimulate the bile it drops down the psyllium pulls stuff out the charcoal that's in the gut and it goes back up so that we have people taking out
Speaker 1taking all the toxins
Speaker 3and then it comes out and we've had people do this where they're they literally have changes during this and this is like the most simple detox ever because i had to write a protocol that anybody could do anywhere in the world and psyllium husk and charcoal is available pretty much anywhere because we have so many international people do this clearly by his accents yeah yeah exactly but and there's a specific way to take it and it's got to be outside food and we have all these different ways to take it and it's got to be outside food and all the timing but that that's basically it and so there's no worse feeling that if you do a dry fast and you have fecal material in your gut what happens is is that your body needs water so pulls water from that and then it becomes dry like concrete and it just sits there yeah and and so if you do have that we recommend an enema by about the third day um but my last one i didn't even need an enema because i did that program and i was really on top of it took the psyllium on a super empty stomach and you know it was i was completely
Speaker 2clear yeah by the time we did that yeah i mean there's there's so many detoxes out there you know there's i'm sure you could list seven just off the top of your head oh yeah the gut ones matter the most yep right yeah the gut ones matter the most to clear the pathway so that it can pass through and as you rehydrate and as you start refeeding and renourishing you want a clear pathway to get that all the way through your body so psyllium husk is really valuable i mean you know the amazing liver and gallbladder cleanse that so many people have done um is also really really helpful again to clean up and clear out your liver and your gallbladder to get those stones out so that they can do their
Speaker 1work maybe doing some castor oil packs beforehand absolutely yes
Speaker 3yeah yeah absolutely if people are already into this stuff whatever detox works for you you need to do it yeah yeah what
Speaker 1about like some lymphatic movement some qigong some because i know you mentioned that during the actual dry fast but prior to to
Speaker 2really yes yeah yeah whether you're doing qigong or you're on a rebounder or you're doing the big six i mean that's that's good for everybody to be doing that six is the
Speaker 1big six lymphatic movement yeah you're doing the this
Speaker 2one hit the mic you know to get the to get the lymph moving because it does stagnate while while you're while you're dry fasting so if you can amplify that ahead of time but better yet if you can go you know get a you know an lymphatic massage during your drive fast that's even better that's what they do at the russian clinics where they're doing the 11 days they're getting daily lymphatic massages to keep the toxins moving so they don't stagnate yeah so they're doing that all
Speaker 1the time those people are passing some gnarly stuff gnarly
Speaker 2and they're all in i mean they've flown to mongolia to go do that so yeah i mean the this is something that we actually harp on a lot yes you can be proactive before you start the fast to get the grease the wheels in your lymphatic system rebounding is great walking is great gentle bouncing on the balls of your feet standing up is just going to move things walking is yeah
Speaker 3it's absolutely one of the best ones that's what the the russian researchers recommend because a your lymphatic system is a group of one-way valves and only mechanical motion moves the fluid so walking is it's literally a pump for the lymph
Speaker 1We were designed to move all the way.
Speaker 3And you're also. breathing more and the increased oxygen as you walk oxidizes toxins in your bloodstream. So that's a really big one. I personally, it's hard for me to walk during a dry fast. Like it's hard, but I still go and do it. I don't go crazy. I mean, we had one guy who was doing three miles a day.
Speaker 2Yeah. He was cooking.
Speaker 3Yeah. You know, but I'm like, dude, I can barely get to the mailbox, but, but it helps. Anything helps, you know?
Speaker 1Yeah. So a couple more questions. I know we've been going a long time, but the people who listen to and watch this podcast are used to that. My average episode length is like two hours and 50 minutes. So it's like not foreign to them, but question that I have related to seasonality and how often to do dry fasting. And, um, you know, even for the people who've done your dry fast before that, some of them seem to be coming back from what you guys are saying. What do you recommend with, with that?
Speaker 3It depends on your goals. So if you are just after health optimization, rejuvenation, regeneration, if you want to max out the experience once every six months, because the stem cells persist in your body, like an increased level of stem cells persist for six months. And then you can do another one once a year is also great. Um, I tend to do essentially one a year and then I do mini short dry fast kind of all the time.
Speaker 1Y'all just did one flying out. Yeah. Yeah. Like you were on the flight. Yeah. 24 hours.
Speaker 3You should never fly eating or drinking anything. Yeah. There's so many insults.
Speaker 2Let's do a really quick PSA on that. Yeah. Try it. Try it. Do a, the next time you fly, go for 24 hours, including that time that you're in the airplane, no food, no water, you will land feeling so much better. Everyone who's listening, try it out. It, it, you know, you think, well, I should stay hydrated because I'm going to be in an airplane. Well, you're flying in a microwave tin can with insane assaults on your biology. Every time in any amount of biogeometry or Aries tech or Pulsar or any sort of protection you can do from that EMF at non-native EMF exposure is going to be amplified if you have food and water in your stomach. So your body has to
Speaker 1use energy to digest.
Speaker 2Exactly. So it's depleting you. And so every, everybody should try that.
Speaker 3Yeah. I mean, the Russians did a study about radiation. So dry fasting reverses radiation damage and they compared wet fasting or water diet to dry fasting and a water diet took 12 to 14 days to remove radiation from the body. And a dry fast was three days. Wow. So it's a, it's a significant difference. I'm going to start calling it water
Speaker 1diet now. Water, water diet.
Speaker 3Yeah. And re in regards to your first question. So that's kind of your optimization schedule. Um, and then I like to throw in short dry fasters, the Russian body recomposition protocol, which is you do a 24 hour dry fast and you walk 10 kilometers. That's 6.2 miles. Wow. Um, I try to do that once a week. It doesn't always happen, but when I do do it, it is amazing. It works. It recomps your body super fast. And they use that clinically for
Speaker 1weight fast. So 24 hour dry fast and you do this six miles during it.
Speaker 3Yeah. So you go, just think you go dinner to dinner. Okay. So you eat dinner and then you go to bed and then you wake up and you walk 10 kilometers, 6.2 miles. And then you go to bed and then you go to bed and then you go to bed and then you go to bed and then you go to bed and then you walk 10 kilometers, 6.2 miles. And then the rest of the day you don't eat until you hit 6 PM or whatever. And then you eat and drink.
Speaker 2You can tell like you like looking in the mirror,
Speaker 3it recomps super fast.
Speaker 2You're like, Whoa, it's your, your body, your body. That's incredible. It's great.
Speaker 3Yeah. And, and the clinical version of that in Russia is they do that two X a week. Wow. It's pretty hardcore.
Speaker 2Yeah. I probably do it twice a month now. Yeah. It's awesome. Yeah. And it, and it, and it helps. I mean, you less inflamed. So it's like good maintenance. That's what you'd consider.
Speaker 1Maintenance. Yeah. Yeah.
Speaker 2That's cool. Yeah. But generally dry fasting longer than three days, if you're going to do five or you're going to do seven once or twice a year.
Speaker 3Now, if you have a specific condition that you're dealing with and, you know, as we know, we're not allowed to talk about specific disease models and such, but in books like 20 questions and answers about dry fasting by Dr. Philanoff or the Phoenix protocol, there's hundreds of references in the back of both of those books on the clinical studies. So in Russia, if somebody has like a severe condition, they're trying to heal. Um, let's say it's blood cancer. They go in, they do an 11 day, they recover two weeks, they do another 11 day, they recover for two weeks, they do another 11 day. And then the disease is torn out by its roots and never comes back. Incredible. And there's tons of literature on that, mostly in Russian, but it's, it's out there if you dig deep enough. And there's so many conditions that people use this for that's documented in the literature. It's, I mean, take your pick. Yeah. It's just, it works at such a foundational level in the body that it just, it works, you know? So if people are dealing with something serious, it's, you definitely go more than twice a
Speaker 1year. Okay. Yeah. Cool. Last question I have is during the experience of fasting, what do you recommend typically to the people who come through your protocols and your cohorts, uh, that they do to, in order to maximize the experience? Like obviously one of them, uh, doing a water enema isn't going to hurt. It's going to be helpful, uh, rebounding Qigong, spending time in nature, anything else in specifically?
Speaker 3Well, we have one, I'll do the, the bath one, and then you want to add in some other ones, but we have one that is, I don't know of anyone else that is, is teaching or doing this at this scale. We are, so we're huge fans of food grade hydrogen peroxide. Okay. And so we have a protocol for people to take a hydrogen peroxide bath, but for anybody listening, you can just go and do this right now. You, you go get yourself a gallon of 35% hydrogen peroxide. That is food grade, never the brown bottle stuff. Cause that's heavy metals and toxic stabilizers in it. You take two cups, you put it in your bath and then you just soak in the bath and hydrogen peroxide is the active form of oxygen when it encounters organic molecules, such as your body. And so during a dry fast, you soak in the bath and you soak in this tub. All these toxins are in your lymph and your blood, right? And your body is struggling to oxidize them. So it goes through your skin. It skips digestion. So we're not activating digestion. And then it just oxidizes all these toxins. And people love doing that because you, when I do a dry fast and I do the bath, I'll be in there for an hour. I'm just reading, soaking up oxygen and you feel better. You feel like you get a little perk of energy and it feels pretty good. So that's one of the things we do to enhance it.
Speaker 2And nebulizing too. Oh yeah. Yeah.
Speaker 3We almost forgot. Yeah. So we teach people exactly what to buy down to the very specific thing to get. It's super cheap, but nebulizing 1.5 to 3% hydrogen peroxide. And what we like about that one versus the bath is that when you nebulize hydrogen peroxide, you're basically getting an ozone level of active oxygen treatment without investing two grand in equipment. And it's kind of complicated to nebulize ozone. You got to bubble it through an oil and it's this whole, it's this whole thing. It's this whole thing. It's great. I love promo life and what they're doing. It's awesome. Right. But you know, for 30 bucks, you can get yourself a desktop nebulizer and for another eight bucks, some food grade hydrogen peroxide, you dilute it down and it goes into your lungs and then immediately goes in your bloodstream. And so I love nebulizing HP during a dry fast because the effect is immediate. You perk up immediately and then you can feel the detox happening and dry skin brushing.
Speaker 1Yes. Cause your skin makes sense. Move your lymph.
Speaker 3It's a huge detox organ. And, uh, my first dry fast, I had like weird spots show up on my legs specifically over like lymph points.
Speaker 1That's interesting. It's gross.
Speaker 3It was like
Speaker 1a lot of people get skin issues at first.
Speaker 3There's fluid coming out like yellow fluid and just is it was so weird.
Speaker 1I know orange poop and yellow fluid. It wants out.
Speaker 3Yeah. You provide your body the conditions to improve its terrain and the, the healing intelligence just goes in and says, all right, I'm going to work.
Speaker 2What do you want to add from a, from a softer side? We always encourage prayer and meditation, prayer and meditation, the, the, the shape form and approach, the features, the experience that you have, prayer and meditation in a dry fast are unlike any other time. You know, the, the way in, in order to, to tap in, to connect with God, to connect with source, to connect with yourself, like the, the profound value of like, okay, I'm really going to go in and do work on myself. And you don't have to, it doesn't have to be elaborate or complicated. It's like whatever your sort of meditation you want to do, you want to play something on YouTube and do that. Like we, I, we, uh, we don't want it. We try not to overcomplicate, you know, so do a little breath work, do a little meditation, do a little prayer. And because you have a bunch of extra time on your hands, because you're not fixing food, you're laying low. It's a really good time to like, just go deep into that stuff with a gentle disposition. You know, people get a little hung up on it, um, because they want to make the best of this, this experience. Totally. And then they pile on pressure to like, man, I'm like, I did.
Speaker 1Yeah. That's what I'm just about to say. Then they have their guides show up laughing around them.
Speaker 2They're like, yeah, you fool. Like, chill out. You're like, Okay. You know that it's, it's, um, it's, it's extremely useful. I mean, there's, there's so many other things, you know, emotional freedom technique is, is really useful. You know, the energy medicine that we have, the biogeometry, the Pulsar, like the one device, like these, these are really useful. They're really helpful, but anything that will help you just kind of give yourself grace through this period, then do it.
Speaker 3What I like about what you're saying is the veil is thin. So if you want to connect to your inner world, it's easier. Yeah. Makes sense. And so there's so many gateways for that. And you're so good at helping people do that. You do the little meditations. I mean, you've been doing this work for way over a decade. Yeah. You know, transcendental
Speaker 1meditation since you were 12. Yeah. Yeah. So you're, you're hard. Yeah. That was cool. This is awesome. You guys. Yeah. This is so rad. Thanks for having us. I'm curious. Are you, are you considering it? Not only am I considering it, bro, like I'm in, I'm sold. Yeah. 100%. Great. Let's go. Water diets were already great for me in my experience. And for me, I like to just experiment, experiment on myself and try stuff. And I mean, this sounds like it checks all the boxes of things that I like to do. Let's improve your train. 100% in, man. Yeah. Seriously. Awesome. 100% in. So in the show notes, for anyone listening or watching, we have all the resources, all the things we talked about during this episode. Also Theo and Sean's, uh, sort of like group that you can join. What's it called? It's it drive fast with friends.
Speaker 2I love that name. Yeah. So simple.
Speaker 1Literally the best. That's what it is.
Speaker 3That was Sean's name. Yeah. I was like, this is the best name I've ever, and that's what it turned into. These people are friends. Yeah. I love that.
Speaker 1Drive fast with friends. Okay. So if you want to check out drive fast with friends, their next cohort is in January. So you have plenty of time by the time this episode comes out to join and check it out. And then you also have free programs for people who just want to sort of dip their toe in a little bit and try it themselves. Explains that will be in the show notes too. So anything else as we're closing, you guys want to say,
Speaker 2I just want to say, thank you. You know, uh, obviously your setup is great. The content is great. You're so consistent and you pull from so many different areas. So many different
Speaker 1experts. You do too, dude. I try. I do.
Speaker 2I try. I try.
Speaker 1Sounds like you do too, by the way. I don't know you as well, but it seems like it.
Speaker 2It's like the things that I think are interesting, other people are probably going to think are interesting too. And you've, you're willing to take some chances. Obviously you're willing to stick your neck out and say the unpopular thing and the way that you present content, material, ideas, education is just, um, you're, you're, you're a beacon for so many of us and for so many other people who are like, yeah, I, what he said. Thank you, bro. It means a lot. Thank you, man. And I know, you know that because the travel, the conferences, the community, the WayForward community as at large as full of the most thoughtful people. And that is what we need. So thank you for having us.
Speaker 1Thank you, bro. Thank you. And thank you for resonating with that and being a part of that too. That means a lot.
Speaker 3Yeah. I'm just so happy that we resonate on the terrain side of things. I sent out a newsletter during COVID about train and I got hate mail for it. I'm like, I don't know what to do. COVID about train. And I got hate mail from nurses, like, like crazy, dude. And they, they, they said, I was like spreading harmful information and all this goes well beyond
Speaker 1for the like normie type of people like anti-vax stuff. This is like, this is unheard of. How could you possibly say that there's no such thing as SARS-CoV-2?
Speaker 3Yeah. Oh God. Yeah. That, that one. Yeah. I got hate mail on that too. Yeah. The, the whole viruses don't exist thing and expressions of a poison cell. But for me, it's always been detox or die. Yeah. What moved the needle for me most in helping my cells generate more energy, which is the currency of life is improving my train and detoxing. And I feel dry fasting is the ultimate expression of improving your train. And that, that I'm, I was just so excited because it's to say, to talk about train and have somebody be, yes, it's so rare.
Speaker 1John the Baptist would also agree. Yeah. Which means Jesus would probably agree too. That's right. JC was fully on board. Yeah. Yeah. I wonder if you did that for 40 days in the desert. Was it, cause I always said he probably water fastened. Maybe he, maybe he dry fastened.
Speaker 2There. I want to be careful about, I'm not going to cite scripture. Uh, Moses, uh, 40 days, uh, no food, no water.
Speaker 3For sure. Yeah. I mean, that one's, you can look up, look it up. That's incredible. And didn't Yogananda was cause he like, yeah. In that book, they talk about the breatharian type, the yogi breatharian type people. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
Speaker 2What was the, what was the name of the guy? Prahlad Jani. Yeah.
Speaker 1Prahlad Jani. Yeah. It's not new. This isn't new stuff.
Speaker 2Yeah. This is not new.
Speaker 1Yeah. It's ancient.
Speaker 2Yeah. So ancient.
Speaker 1Thank you boys. This is awesome. Thanks out. Love it. you
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