EP #147: Building Your Coping Toolbox & Other CBT-Based Strategies for Flourishing with Dr. Rachel Goldman, Clinical Psychologist

Welcome back to another episode of Everyday Endorphins, a mental health podcast focused on the importance of finding joy and happiness and daily living. I'm your host Stella Steffanopoulos, and this week I am so thrilled to have Dr. Rachel Goldman on the show. She is a clinical psychologist, a speaker, and is also a clinical assistant professor in the Department of Psychiatry at the NYU Gersman School of Medicine. Her work has been featured in various media outlets, and I think that one of the coolest media appearances that Dr. Rachel has had the privilege of getting to do is speaking with Oprah as an expert guest on all things related to mental health, while being and her approach in cognitive behavioral therapy. And so in this episode, I really had the pleasure of getting to sit down with Dr. Rachel to discuss a really unique framework that she has around thriving and flourishing in life, and her approach is really rooted in this idea of creating a coping toolbox. What that means, why it's important, and how being able to do so actually gives you agency and power to feel confident in the choices that you're making to support your own health and your own well-being. We also dive into how our thoughts are tied into our behaviors and how these thoughts and behaviors will then therefore dictate our reality, so she gets to kind of deconstruct what CBT is as a therapeutic approach. And we also kind of talk about ways we can manifest the things we want in our lives through looking at it with the lens of CBT and how CBT helps you gain more insight into the relationship between our thoughts or behaviors or emotions or actions or reality. I think one of the most exciting things about this podcast and all the topics that we got to discuss in this interview is that she's actually coming out with a book where a lot of these concepts are synthesized and communicated in a really digestible and engaging way. The working title is called Training for Life, and it is all about how to use holistic wellness practices and CBT skills to equip high-performing women with tools to use, not just when they need them, but before stress arrives at their doorstep. So the idea here is the best mental health tools are not just needed before moments of crisis. Excited for you all to listen to this episode, so without further ado, let's get right into it. Hi Dr. Rachel, thank you so much for coming on to Every Day Endorphins. It is so wonderful to have you here and to also be the first recording that I'm doing in the new year. Yes, I know I'm so excited and thank you so much for having me and your rate. This is your first one of the new year. Actually, my first podcast interview of the new year as well. So we're starting off on a great note. It's a Friday morning. We're caffeinated, coffees in hand, and I'm just really excited to be here with you today. It's crazy because I remember having seen your content a while ago on social media. I love following therapists and other people in the wellness community and self-help community on social media, which is where I actually now get a lot of my advice. Now fast forward, I don't know how many months later, we're getting to sit here today, but we actually got to meet in person like two months ago at the One Girl Summit, which was so amazing to hear you speak live in front of an audience. There was a concept that you had talked about that really resonated with me. It was about creating your wellness toolbox, which we'll talk a little bit about later, but I'm so happy that I saw you speak and then I went up to you and introduced myself. Here we are today. That was a great summit, by the way. It was a great conversation. Just a really wonderful group of people in a room together. Yeah, it was so great and I loved meeting you that day. As I know we were speaking about this before, but I just I loved that you reached out to me and came in so high because I always tell people if you see me out and about speaking or anything, come say hi, I want to meet you and I just love that you did that and we had that opportunity to connect. Now as you said, here we are, which is just wonderful. I love that we're doing this. I think that's also a really great sign to be receptive to have people come up to you and be open to that. Sometimes I think people are afraid to put themselves out there because they're afraid that it's not going to be well received, but you actually never know unless you try. There's really nothing to lose by putting yourself out there more, which could actually be an entirely different conversation, but I'd love to start off by having you share just a little bit more about yourself, your entry point into therapy for some of my listeners who maybe aren't familiar with your platform or your therapeutic approach. As you already said, but I'm Dr. Rachel, Dr. Rachel Goldman. I am here in New York City and I'm a clinical psychologist and also clinical assistant professor in the Department of Psychiatry that NYU close in school in Madison and in addition to providing one-on-one therapy to my clients and my private practice, I also do a lot of things like this and speaking engagements and working on some other projects as well, which we might get to later. But I take a very CVT approach and for people that don't know what that is, it's cognitive behavioral therapy. And there's all different types of therapy or therapeutic modalities that we call it. And then CVT is just one of them and it's one that really speaks to me on many levels. I kind of joke that I think breathe, eat CVT, sleep, eat everything CVT because it's so the basic premise behind it is that our thoughts, emotions and behaviors are all linked. And if we think about it, they really are. We say something to ourselves, we have a thought, we have self-talk and it impacts how we feel. And then that feeling impacts our behavior. And it doesn't necessarily need to go in that order. There's something that's called the cognitive triad, which is a triangle. And each point of the triangle is thoughts, emotions, behaviors. I often say that I wish it was a circle with double arrows because I really do believe that it can go in any direction and it's not really like hitting to a point. It's more a continuation of a cycle. So they can really influence each other, but that's the basic premise of CVT. And it also is a very direct approach. So for somebody who's been in therapy before, depending on the approach of their therapist takes, or if you see therapy in media and movies and things like that, you might think that therapy is just like sitting on a couch and having the therapist nodding their head and going, "Ah-ha-ha-ha-ha-ha." That's a different type of therapy. But CVT is very direct. It's the therapist and the client are really a team working together and it's goal-directed. It's challenging in a way so that therapists can challenge the client when they think that the client is ready to be challenged. And most importantly, that I didn't mention is CVT's evidence-based. It is proven, science-backed research has proven that it is a treatment of choice for many different things, including depression, anxiety, among many others. But what I love most about CVT is that there's skills and techniques that we can all use to help ourselves just live healthier and better lives. And you don't need to have a diagnosable mental illness or mental health condition to benefit from CVT or to benefit from therapy overall. So that's what I really like to share on my platform are those kind of tips and tools that we can all use to just kind of feel better in our everyday life. Which is what I love about your podcast and the title because I think it really is coincides with that and what we're talking about. Yeah. I love how you're kind of describing the cognitive triad and like our thoughts and our emotions and our behaviors because you get to create the reality that you live in. It all starts in your head. If you are able to visualize something, you're kind of one step closer to having that because our brain is so powerful. And in the spirit of the new year and reflections and all those things, I'm really big into vision boards and I've been doing them for the past few years. And I've looked back on previous ones and I've realized I've actually brought those things or elements of those things and experiences into my life because I've started to visualize it. And you definitely can describe this better than I can. But I feel like when you're able to visualize something and create like a different neural pathway in your brain, you're more easily able to actually bring that into your life because you're priming your brain to believe that you already have it to some sort of degree. Absolutely. And you set it beautifully, actually. And you know, whenever I think about visualization and imagery, I like to use the example of sports psychology, actually. So during my training, I did some sports psychology and worked with different athletes and teams. And something that I loved to do when I was working with the athletes, which we can all do, is visualizing the success, right? Visualizing, crossing the finish line if you're a runner, visualizing hitting the base, you know, the baseball, visualizing different sports and succeeding. And the reason is what you just the way you described it is that you're telling your brain pretty much to create those pathways and you're already doing it in your brain, which means that your brain is familiar with it. And it's not now the first time that you've done it, right? So it's practicing in a way of not physically doing it, but physiologically and in our brain doing it. And then it's not new, right? And what's scary about new is that it's new, it's unfamiliar, there's uncertainty. We don't know, but if we can say, well, I saw myself doing it. I visualize myself doing it to our brain It's not new to our body it might be but the mind and body are connected and I'd like to remind people of that The mind body connection is real Anxiety is a great example of this. I had a client yesterday and we were talking about this that she was physiologically Feeling those anxiety reactions to something and I had said you know your body Knows and then your brain knows, but now you can retrain your brain to calm down and reassure it that it's okay Right also anxiety is not a bad thing, right? It is protective actually Right our body goes into these physiological anxious states for a reason it's protecting us at things that's in danger You know, and this is why you know again going back to your vision board Visualization is so powerful So I think if we can imagine if we can visualize ourselves doing something we are a step closer And we see ourselves doing it right like I'm gonna use an example of my son for a moment They were six year old and kids are always like I can't I can't I can't right like I can't do it. It's too hard It's too hard and like no you can you have to try and Even the other day he was mommy. I bitch like out of the blue I don't even know he's never heard me say this but it was the cutest thing. He was like I Visualized myself doing it like whatever it was and I was like oh my god like are you kidding? It was amazing, but I was like wow this is great You know and I and I kind of was explaining to him in a way that we just talked about it in a different level But if you can visualize yourself doing it you're literally halfway there, right? So much as if of it is the mental game and I use running with a lot of analogy is because I'm a runner But they say running a marathon for instance is 80% mental 80% right? That's it's huge but think about it if we tell her says we can't do it You're not gonna do it because you're telling yourself you can't do it Absolutely and our self-talk becomes our reality because of that connection of the thoughts and emotions behaviors So maybe we don't know if we can do it You know, I have to tell people don't make the self-talk super positive that it's unrealistic because you might not succeed We don't know but you can either say I can try I'm going to try or I think I can do it But something a little more neutral something a little more positive than I can't I can't do it We don't even know but you're already giving up so you're not gonna do it And that's the power of CBT right there Exactly in a nutshell podcast over I'm gonna Not exactly but yes You were a runner so you got the indoor fan high which will get to you a little bit later I have a million fallen questions. So let's see where my brain takes this one And there's also kind of like a fine line between Visualizing something that you want and not being wrapped up in like a specific outcome of it, right? And I think that's like a really hard balance to also find like walk in a way because If you want something so badly and you're visualizing like this end outcome or Whatever that end result could look like and you don't achieve that specific thing You can feel like you're setting up for failure However, I do think that if you visualize maybe some sort of desired and state but you Hold on to what the feeling is more so than that like actual thing You're more likely to get to the thing that you want whatever that outcome could look like and I've seen it for myself And I think that also kind of ties into like somatic healing work too when you're able to again back to your common on the mind body connection When you're able to get really in tune with how you feel about certain things or how you feel being around certain people or how you feel coming away from certain interactions you can allow That intuition to guide you a bit more to then continue to visualize what you want rather than focusing on what something optically could look like With you saying that it actually makes me think of going back to this idea of like New Year's resolutions, right? But really thinking more about like long term goals versus short term goals or rather like outcome goals versus process goals, right? The outcome goal might be that final outcome But then the process goals or the short term goals the steps like if we think of a staircase The steps that it's going to take to get to the top of that staircase and I think going back to mindset It brings up this idea that we have to be flexible, right? We might think we want this out-term goal But as we're going up the stairs as we're getting closer Maybe it changes a little bit, right? And that's also then getting away and accepting getting away from the all or nothing thinking So when I think of a staircase or when I think of process or progress, it's not a straight line Right people like to think that it is. It's like well if I go xyz It's going to get me there But oftentimes it's going up and down and all around and circles and all these things But we have to be open to that possibility and if we are open to the possibility That's where I think other opportunities arise and then we realize Maybe this wasn't actually the outcome goal. I had wanted you know It worked out this way and maybe that's even better, right? But that goes to again thinking about running in marathon. You don't just wait to cross the finish line You know if you are waiting to get to the finish line like I'm sorry, but those 26.2 miles are gonna be pretty miserable Right? But if you enjoy the process if you enjoy the training if you enjoy every mile especially in New York City marathon Like enjoying the crowds and everything along the way it feels different right and going back to that mind-body connection Even now it's that feeling along the way that's also giving you insight Right that intuition like you just talked about we have gut feelings. We have reactions We have intuition. We have these reactions emotional responses and that's giving us information along the way And if we're listening to it if we're tuning in then we can pivot and then it doesn't feel like a failure I actually don't even believe in the word failure for that reason because we're just pivoting We just you know what it didn't work out But look at what I am or it didn't work out and I'm gonna figure it out Right again mindset shift. It's all about the way that we think so I often say that every situation is neutral until we interpret it Right you and I could have been on these axiom train this morning I didn't take a train this morning. I don't think you did either but anyway Right you and I could have been on these axiom train or these axiom traffic and some like maybe it was traffic and One of us was like oh shoot. I'm gonna be like to work Oh my gosh that thought turns into this feeling turns into a behavior Whereas one of us could it maybe you would have been like I'm gonna turn on my podcast and listen to one of my episodes I'd take the time to just stick here and be present right the situation was the same thing We both were in these axiom situation that we interpreted them completely different. That's how powerful our thoughts are I could not agree more I've been thinking a lot about this too both concepts the first being more process oriented versus outcome oriented And secondly seeing things more as neutral because Experiences are what they are the moment is the moment. It's the same really is the same Context but what makes it different is how we interpret it and and the meaning that we assign to it like the emotional response that we have to whatever is going on and I think I might have talked about this on a previous podcast or maybe I was sharing with a friend But like of course there's tragedy in the world and there's things that we would never wish upon anyone and I do think those are like Horrible things that happen We think about just like the in the context of everyday life and just trying to like get through the day from a more positive psychology lens like Flourishing in life. Is there really anything that is like quote-unquote bad versus quote-unquote good? It's really how you look at it exactly to your earlier point The one other thing that I wanted to bring up was Around what you mentioned about pivoting which I think is like such a good word to use when we make changes in life because it's not as We don't feel the same feelings that come from when we think we failed at something like if we're pivoting We're simply just changing course Well, it's not an in a resolution, but I'm doing this thing this year where I have a word of the year and I'm using it as something as to be kind of like a guiding principle or something that I can kind of benchmark myself against or When I need to make a decision think about the word and think about how it applies to that situation and my word is permission So giving myself permission to like change my mind if I want to the permission to pivot because I'm very much the type of person that like Needs to follow the process like needs to follow the rules likes to follow the rules because things that following the rules gets to the result that then shows that I'm successful And then I did a good job and then makes me feel good about myself But nothing there's no playbook for light like I'm realizing this now that there's no playbook and Sometimes I felt like I wanted something and then as I was climbing the stairs I realized I didn't actually want that and I didn't give myself the permission to pivot or to change my mind And that is something I'm working on this year is to give myself the permission to just enjoy life like to actually enjoy Making the changes doing the crazy things saying no more often. I mean the list goes on But permission is what really resonates for me. I absolutely love that you said that because I think many of people get stuck in this idea That you know, this is the way that we quote should be doing things right like this is the timeline that everybody is on You know me thinking of a lot a lot of my clients that are like single and comparing themselves to their friends that are getting engaged They're getting married or having kids and I often say this a lot on my platform and I'm gonna say it here Similar to what you just said, but there's no timeline right we need to do things that feel right to us And unfortunately I think when we do things that we feel forced to wherever we feel pressure to that should then we end up getting That outcome goal that we thought we always wanted but when we get there it doesn't feel right Right and that's because we felt pressure to go go go go go and get it because everyone else is around us, it appears that they have it, but we all are on our own timelines, we all are on our journey. And it's okay that our path and our journey looks different than everybody else's. And to be honest, I hate the word "shud," but it should because we are all unique individuals. Right? If we were all robots, if we were all machines, if we were all at the same bubble, then fine, maybe. But we don't. We're humans with emotions and have feelings, and we do change our mind, and that's allowed. So I absolutely love that your word is permission, and you're giving yourself that permission to do it, because I actually believe, and maybe in a year from now, we'll have a continuation, or to be continued and catch up about this. But I believe that your year is going to feel different. You're going to have less pressure, less expectations on yourself, and from others, because you're allowing yourself to be more present, and be able to feel like, "You know, this doesn't feel right, I'm going to pivot. This doesn't feel right, I'm going to do this instead." Or, "This doesn't feel right, I'm going to say no." There's a lot to that, that I think, for many people, it comes with years of experience and living to get to that point. But I love that you're doing it now, because I think we can all be living a healthier, happier life if we come to that acceptance, that things can pivot, and that's okay, and giving yourself permission to do that. So I'm excited for you, and I'm excited to see where you are in a year from now, knowing that you're just letting that be. Let's check in in a year, because I'm excited too. And, you know, what's funny is that I don't think I would have been able to come to this realization if I hadn't started going to therapy a year ago. If I hadn't given myself the space to ask harder questions, or to be asked harder questions, questions, I didn't even know could be asked to me. And it was through that whole process where I really felt like I was peeling back so many layers of things I didn't even realize existed in my life. Only then did I start to realize, "Oh, this is why I have these certain thought patterns." Or, "This is what contributed to me, you know, making this choice in my life." And in that whole process of like just building the awareness, first and foremost, then I was able to take a step back and critically think about like, "Okay, now that I have 20% more knowledge about who I am and what drives me and how my environment shaped me, how my family shaped me, how my social circles and friends, and all the things that I did growing up, how that has shaped me into who I am, how do I use this to my advantage to set myself up for the life that I want to live, rather than being presented with all this information that was really difficult for me to process and like freak out about it. Like, how do I use this to my advantage? Or in other words, how do I accept these things about myself to move forward in a healthier way? And so I needed to kind of do that work in order to get to the realization that permission was my word. And I love that you just shared that because actually I don't think enough people share that there's a process and work in order to get to where you are, right? So going back to that idea of the process, schools and outcome goals, but on social media, unfortunately, we see a lot of highlight reels, right? We see a lot of like all this positive stuff, these accomplishments, everything that people have done and we don't see the behind the scenes as much, right? And for you, that was you going to therapy and doing the work. And that's incredible. And I just really appreciate you sharing that with your community because I think it's important that we just don't wake up one day and we're like, "Oh, I'm going to change my mind and I'm going to do that, so I'm going to just give myself permission and that's not. It doesn't work that way, right? Like even talking about our thoughts and emotions, behaviors, it takes time, it takes work. I often say to my clients all the time, like, "I know this is hard." When I say, like, "Okay, let's think about the way you just said and how that's going to impact you and how can we tweak that word or how can we tweak that thought." It doesn't just come like that. And the reason it doesn't come like that is because we've had years of thinking the way that we're thinking. They're called automatic thoughts for a reason, right? Cognitive distortions are automatic thoughts and we can rewire our brain to change them, to tweak them, to work for us. But it just doesn't work like that. It's not just like, "I wake up and, oh, I'm going to think positive and I'm going to be great today." It takes work. Our brain has to hear it over and over and over again. We have to start believing it. So I really just appreciate you sharing that because it is work. It is a process. Thank you. No, I appreciate you saying that. I also try to be open about that because I know that the podcast is about happiness and it's about endorphins. I think there's a misconception, maybe less so now versus maybe a few years ago, but around positivity and toxic positivity. It's not the same thing, which I know you know. So, say we could talk about that for a whole nother-pound cast episode. Exactly. Maybe that's part two. But I've always had very very happy demeanor in my life. I do think maybe certain people are more wired to have a more optimistic outlook on life. And I feel blessed that I am one of those people. Like, I've always just leaned that way. But that doesn't mean that I don't feel stressed. That doesn't mean that I don't feel anxious at times. That doesn't mean that God forbid something really tragic happened in my life. It would be odd if I didn't fall into some sort of depression from it. It wouldn't make sense to feel no negative emotion to something not good happening to you. So, I feel like I've learned a lot through giving myself the space to reflect in that way. And I think that when it comes to building happy and healthy lives for ourselves, you do have to do the work to create happiness and joy. It doesn't just like automatically appear. And there's actually a question that I wanted to ask earlier, but I'm remembering it now. And it goes back to when we were talking about visualization. I'm sure people are listening and are thinking, well, if I'm really depressed, how do I even visualize something? Like, I'm not going to be able to feel that. Like, it's not clicking in my brain. It's way easier to do if I'm already happy if I'm already in a good place in my life. I feel like we don't want to wait till we're in a good place to be able to visualize something. Granted, it may be easier to do that when we feel psychologically well. So, what would your common be around that? Like, how do we do that practice if we're not feeling so good in ourselves? So, I'm going to go back to the staircase approach for a minute to think about that. So, imagine we're at the bottom of the staircase. We're just starting. We can't just jump to the top. We can't go from zero to 60 in a second. What I'm saying is that we have to start with baby steps. Same thing as if somebody says, when I read my first marathon, people are like, how did you run around them? I'm like, it didn't just wake up in run 26.2 miles. It took months of training. It took months of thinking about it. It took months of preparation and baby steps in order to get there. So, we have to remember that whenever we think about these things. If we want to make a change for most of us, some people can jump all in, but it's not healthy to some degree. But for most of us, that's be realistic. For most of us, it takes baby steps. So, I'll give an example, another example that I've used with many clients before. Say clients want to start going into gym. They've never been in the gym. Maybe they don't even know what a gym looks like. Maybe they don't know what to expect. They don't know how to use the machines. They're anxious to go, right? I tell them, you know what? Just walk by the gym. Or if they live in the suburbs, just drive by the gym. Don't go inside. Just walk by. Maybe the next time you go in and say hi to the person at the front desk, maybe the next time you ask for a tour, maybe the next, like, baby steps. Just put on your gym clothes, right? So, we have to start somewhere, which is even very difficult for people that are really in a low, low state. But once again, we have to start somewhere. I'm going to come to CBT. But I love about CBT too, is that there's the cognitive piece, the thought process, and there's the behavior piece. For some people, it's really, really, really hard to think about changing their automatic thoughts or tweaking their automatic thoughts. And for that person, maybe we start with the behaviors, right? So, maybe we don't start doing self-talk and trying to work on their thoughts because it's just really hard. They're not there yet. So, for them, it might be like, let's just get out of bed today, right? Like, maybe if somebody that's in bed all day has really difficult time getting up or getting dressed, I'll be like, let's just get up and go to the kitchen today. Just get up and put on clothes to go outside, right? So, we have to start with where you are right now, first of all. And that's where we have to stop comparing ourselves to others, right? We have to start where you are right now because where I am is not going to be where you are and vice versa. And that's okay. But we have to start where we are except this is where I am today. And then what is one thing? And actually, as I'm saying this out loud, I'm thinking I said something similar the first time that you and I met at the One Girl conference. But what is one thing that we can tweak today that gets us one step closer to where we want to go? Again, we're not going to jump there. We can't. It's impossible. We're going to fail. But we can do one small thing honestly every day. Even it's the same thing. We can eat, maintaining our behaviors is also enough. But one small thing that's going to be getting me closer for the person that you're describing who can't think to visualize that yet. Don't visualize it yet. Just write it down, right? Just put it out on paper or just get out of bed or just get yourself, you know, something. One small teeny, teeny thing. And a lot of people might even think, well, what's that small thing going to do? It's not going to get me there. It actually will, right? It's a small thing that we see that we can do it. But that accomplishment, we tell ourselves, oh, wow, I can do this. That thing creates motivation that keeps us going. But if you try the end result, like if you've never been to the gym or if you've never run a marathon, then you go to try to run a marathon tomorrow. Maybe you can do it, but it's probably going to be really, really, really difficult and you might not be able to do it. Now you just, I hate the word found, but now you just failed. It didn't work. And you just lost all your motivation to probably even try again. But if you just take one step and you're like, wow, I can do that. Wow, I did it. So going back to the visualization part, maybe you can and visualize it yet. And that's okay. But think of what you can do to get one step closer. And that I know we can all do. One teeny teeny teeny little thing today. - It's also I think the science of habit formation too. It's like you have to break your goals down into micro goals and micro steps and make it really small and easy to accomplish for yourself. And then you build it up in your rain that you show yourself, oh, I can do this. So then it's like that intrinsic motivation versus the extrinsic motivation. - Yeah, I love that you said that. I always describe that and talk about that with my clients. And another thing you're talking about habits and how it becomes automatic. I like to remind people, and of course I have kids so it comes up often these little things. But when we first learned to brush our teeth every day, we had to be reminded, right? Like now we don't need to, hopefully most of us, don't need a reminder to brush our teeth, right? It's just automatic, we do it. But like how many times do I tell my son, like don't forget with your brush your teeth, let's go brush our teeth right now. Eventually it becomes automatic because our brain and our body is used to the motion, it's used to the behavior. So again, it's going to be really, really, really tough to change a behavior right now that you haven't done before. You've never done or that you haven't done in a while, but the more you do it. So I always say practice, consistency and patience is going to get us to creating new habits or creating new behaviors and make it more automatic. So the first time, maybe you went to the gym was really tough. But now maybe it's an automatic, maybe it's built into your routine, you integrate it and it's just your normal thing. That this is what you do on these days. But if we look back, and that's where the data comes in, right? You and I were talking about earlier, like looking at the data, the information, but if we look back, it was really hard the first time you did it. And now it's easier, but we all have to start somewhere. And we have to start with where we are right now and think forward. - I love that. Like being able to start with where you are right now, without feeling bad that you're not where you want to be, accepting where you are and embracing it. I love that you bring up the example of brushing your teeth 'cause I honestly forgot, like now I'm thinking about when I was a kid, my parents simply reminded me to do that. Like I really forgot about. (laughs) - I'm like, how many times did I say to myself, "This morning we have to brush our teeth, before we walk out the door, "come on, we have to brush our teeth, "your teeth are just ready, let's go brush your teeth." - Right. - It really is a kid, you're not like thinking. But then obviously as you get older, these things become just automatic. So maybe it's, you know, how do you prime your environment to make those changes a bit easier? I'll give you actually an example for me. One of my goals this year is to eat better food, cook more often, eat healthier, really fuel my body up. And on top of that, have more supplements because I know that like my diet is not giving me all the nutrition that I need. And I remember like I had seen kind of like a holistic medicine practitioner a few years ago and they gave me like this huge order of different supplements and I got so overwhelmed 'cause I was like, I can't take 20 pills a day, like then the morning and the afternoon, it was just too much. Like if I have to go to the office, like what am I gonna do, schlep around like three pill boxes, it was just too much and it was very stressful for me. So I just stopped and I have a really good friend who has a dietitian and health coach. She knows me really well and we're good friends. So she was telling me like, oh these would be great supplements for you to take. 'Cause I think this would be beneficial for you. And I was more inclined to listen to her 'cause we're friends and like I feel close to her and she was like just gonna like a little pill box and just put it on, keep it in your room. And I have it now in front of me and it is so easy to take all the supplements I need every day because I already have them sectioned out and they're right in front of me. I have no excuse to not reach literally to three inches away to swallow the water in the morning. So it's the really small changes that make the difference. - Absolutely. And what you just said was such a great example and it's funny 'cause before you even started using that example I was thinking of supplements and vitamins as a great example. 'Cause a lot of my clients also forget to take their medication or forget to take their vitamins or supplements and another great tool that we can do is habit stacking. So like talking about brushing your teeth even. Like maybe you start taking your vitamin or your supplement right before you brush your teeth or right after you brush your teeth. But visually if you're seeing it, it's easier to follow through. I often tell people that that wanna work out in the morning. I'm like put your clothes out in the morning right next to your alarm clock. Like the alarm clock goes off, you see the clothes and you're like, "Oh right, I'm waking up because I wanna go work out." But without that visual cue or the environment piece, it's very difficult to follow through because we just forget it's not there. But eventually it's just so automatic. One day your pillbox isn't gonna be there 'cause maybe you forgot to fill it the night before but you're gonna be like, wait a minute, something feels off. I need to take my vitamins. Oh right, and it'll become so automatic that if it's not there, you're gonna realize and you're not gonna forget. - I love how we were thinking of the same example. (laughs) - Yeah, it's great. And I love that you also said how overwhelming all of those supplements can be because that is exactly why any big change, why it doesn't work, right? It was too overwhelming, I just stopped. That's why we're at the bottom of the staircase thinking about the next step and not thinking to the big end result yet. That's why resolutions don't work. It is too big, too lofty, too overwhelming. We end up throwing the towel in. We don't see, we can't visualize how I'm gonna jump there so I'm just not gonna do it. But we can see how I'm gonna take the next step. We can see going up the ladder, up the staircase. And that's why it's more realistic to think of it that way. - That's so beautifully said. Basically everything we've been talking about as well ties into this concept around building our own coping toolbox, building our own wellness toolbox, which gets back to the point I made at the beginning of this interview when I first met you and I heard you share this phrase around like the importance of having a wellness toolbox, knowing what's gonna go in it. So can you share a little bit for my listeners who maybe were not at the One Girl Summit, who didn't have the opportunity to get to hear you speak? What this concept is and what it looks like in practice to build your own coping toolbox, your own wellness kit. - So as you've been saying, you know, kind of like life happens, right? Things sometimes don't work out and that's just the way the life is. And we all go through stressors and there's stress all around us. We can't avoid it, unfortunately. But also not a bad thing. Once again, stress can be adaptive very much so as well. So I always say that we should have a coping toolbox or a wellness toolbox or toolkit readily available. When I mean that, I don't, it's funny. I shouldn't buy myself like a little toolbox just to like show what I describe this, but I don't mean that. Like not like having the toolbox there. It's a toolbox that you carry within you. It has at least three. These are my recommendations. We have at least three tools in it that we can pull from when we need them. And what I mean by that are things that we can do in the moment that going back to you and your endorphins that can bring us joy that make us feel more balanced, that make us feel calmer in the moment. So things could be like, I've mentioned running, right? Like running is one of my tools in my toolbox. We've mentioned therapy. There are kids are great to have in our toolbox. Talking to others, you mentioned having a good friend, having like friends, talking it out, journaling, meditation, visualization, all these things that we've been talking about are great tools to have in our toolbox. But the key is I always get asked what should be in my toolbox. It's the key question, right? And I always say, I can't give you that answer. And the reason is because if you are not a runner, and I tell you to put running in your toolbox, what are you gonna do if you feel stressed right now? Or if running is in your toolbox and it's really bad weather out, otherwise probably might still go on a run. But maybe you won't, then we need to also have more than one tool in our toolbox. So the key is to have at least three. The reason I say three is for that reason. If it's bad weather and I'm not running, if you're my friend and I need to talk to you and you're not available, what am I gonna do? So at least one of the three is something internal that we don't need anybody else for or anything else for. So yes, running is easy, all you need is a parachute is an abhievement, but you may not go. So something internal, like a breathing exercise, like visualization, like mindfulness, meditation, things like that, that you can do anywhere. And nobody needs to know that you're doing it either. So a great example I usually give is, I've gotten to the point that I've given enough speaking engagements, I've done enough talks that you don't really get stressed, but I'm sure on a physiological level, there's a little bit of stress and anxiety, it's normal, it's a normal reaction. I'm stepping up on stage in front of a large crowd, totally normal, even though I'm not feeling it, I just pause and I take a few deep breaths, I actually use diaphragmatic breathing, I take a few deep breaths and what that does is it lowers the stress level before I even step on that stage, just in case. So same my stress level was here, maybe even a little bit higher. Now it's gonna bring me here. So we can use these tools as preventative measures as well, preventative care, but the great thing is, that also when we really need them, we have them. My recommendation is that we first choose what our tools are gonna be, going back to acceptance that we've talked about, except the fact that these tools may not always work for you. They may not work in every situation, again, which is why we need more than one, but we can also tweak our toolbox, right? One may not work this day with this situation, but something else might. But we need to know what our go-to's are, and in order to know we also have to try and practice. So if you've never done diaphragmatic breathing, I don't wanna be like, "Diametric breathing's in my toolbox and I'm gonna use it tomorrow when I get released to us." Well, if you've never done it, in the moment, you're gonna actually be more stressed and anxious 'cause you're gonna be like, "Oh my God, "I don't remember dry breathing, "so my nose dry breathing, so this way wet, "I don't know what to do, that can be really scary." So you wanna practice when you don't need it, and then you become a pro at it. So then when you need it, once again, I step on that stage and boom. I'm taking one deep breath as I'm stepping on stage, I did it. It's not like, oh my god, I'm so stressed what do I do right now? Of course, I can't just run outside in the middle of a talk. So like having that internal tool is really important and practicing it. So that was probably a really long-winded way of answering that question. But I like to kind of give those examples because it makes people understand that every tool is not going to work in every situation and that's okay and that's normal. But also we have to have the tools readily available to us and try them. And sometimes we need to, like a combination, like I always tell people, "Colodies just happen to a lot of people are having stressful conversations and difficulties, you know, going home and comments about different things. Sometimes we need to excuse ourselves and be like, "I need a moment to cool down." Take that breath, then write you about a respond instead of reacting. So maybe the tool is, "I'm going to breathe, I'm going to remove myself in the situation, I'm going to splash water on my face, I'm going to do something like that, and then I'm going to come back and talk about it." So kind of remembering that too, that sometimes a combination is important because there's a reacting and there's responding. We can learn to respond to situations when we can learn these kind of tools and being insightful enough to know what works for us. Like if something doesn't work, now I don't want you to try once and give up, but try a few times and if it doesn't work, get rid of it. Take it out of that toolbox, try something now. But give it a fair try unless it doesn't feel good in the moment, like sometimes certain breathing exercises just don't feel good to some people. That's one thing. But you want to try something that you think, that you can actually visualization, that you actually see yourself using. In the moment, do I see myself doing that when I'm stressed? No, oh my gosh, take it out of that toolbox. But if you can see yourself doing it, give it a try. And if it works, keep it in there until it doesn't work any longer. Right? If it's working for you, keep doing it. I love this whole concept because I think it's a framework that gives people the agency to feel good about themselves. The wellness industry, the way it's portrayed on social media, still largely paints a picture that you need to do 30 different things at the same time to be healthy, to have your shit together. And that's just not true because if one of those things doesn't like fit in your toolbox, you're going to feel like you're failing to your earlier point. And I love that you talk about a, diversifying what's in your wellness toolbox and be giving yourself, I'll use the word permission, to change what tools are in at what different points in your life. You know, there are times where meditation really works for me. There's times where yoga really works for me. There's times where none of that works for me and I need to actually go on a run. And there's times where like I just could not be bothered going on a run and I'd rather sleep in in the morning. So it's very fluid and flexible. And it's important to remember that because as we are evolving, as we're going through different stages of our life and transitions, our tools should be involving also. Right? Like we are growing, we're learning more about us. You know, I mean, even thinking about myself being a parent, like my life looks very different than it did six years ago. Right? It would not be realistic for me to be pulling the exact same tools as I did and for them or maybe some pulling the same tools, but they look different. Getting a 10 minute run in sometimes is enough. I drop myself at school in my running clothes. I run home and extra block. 10 minute run sometimes is enough, but years ago that wasn't the case. Right? So we have to be flexible and tweak the way that we think about this. We're back to the mindset shift, accepting the way that we're evolving, accepting the way that we have to be flexible in order to get what we want. Right? If we have that all-or-nothing mentality that it has to be an hour run or nothing, I would never maybe once a week, but I would never get out there. Right? But if we're able to accept it doesn't have to be, oh, or nothing. I often say something is better than nothing and accepting that is huge. Again, pivoting in that mindset shift is everything. I could not agree more. And I think this brings me to my last question that I have for you that I ask every guest on the podcast and it ties directly into the theme of Everyday Endorphins, which is about sparking joy in life. I think a lot of what we've been talking about today are tools and insight into ways that we can set ourselves up for more happiness. Right? And there's many ways that we can do that, but it largely starts in the way we think about ourselves. The thoughts that we have in our minds. So to that point, I'd love to hear from you, Dr. Rachel, A. How you define happiness, given everything we talked about, and B. What is something that brings you a bit of endorphins every day? Can we just box up everything we said and say that's my answer? I'm just kidding. But really, it is. Because I really believe that happiness is about finding a. I don't like the word balance, but I'm going to say finding a balance in terms of feeling in control. So a lot of it is feeling in control when we're anxious and stressed, we don't feel in control, and that's really scary. So it's about feeling in control. And actually, it's not balance. I went back. I thought balance wasn't the word I wanted to say. It was grounded. It's feeling in control and feeling grounded. And I think those words go hand in hand. When we feel in control, we feel like we're capable of doing what we want to do, which brings us that joy, that happiness, and makes us feel fulfilled. And it's about knowing enough about ourselves, that insa, that self awareness, that allows us to say, "This is what brings me joy, and I'm going to do it." But in order to get there, we have to turn inward. And we have to do the hard work, right? That you talked about. We have to turn inward in a knowledge that this is how I'm feeling, and this is working, or this is now working. And then be empowered enough to make those changes. So I think happiness comes with all of that, and feeling more grounded and in control, to live the life that you want, because we have a choice, right? We wake up and say, "I'm bad all day or we don't." Sometimes it's really hard to get up, but we have a choice. And we didn't mention this earlier, but I will just say that a lot of what we talked about today, I'm actually working on in a book, which I'm really excited about, and it has a lot to do with the things that we talked about today, and kind of creating that life that we're talking about. But to answer your final question about Endorphins, I have so many ways that I can answer that in terms of what gives me that, as we know I'm a runner. So there is a real thing, the runner's high, definitely is part of that, and just in general moving my body. So I used to dance actually growing up for several years, and I joke that I was a dancer, turned a runner. But since I've had kids, we do daily dance parties. And just like throwing on music and being silly and dancing at out, again moving your body really does that for me, and seeing the joy on my children's face, the smile, the laughs, we all just get go and laugh at each other, do silly things. I think really does it for me too, and I think we all need to find those moments, because they can be moments. They don't need to be an hour, they don't need to be waiting for the weekend, they don't need to be waiting for the new year, creating those moments throughout the day, that spark us, that give us that joy, is going to keep us going, and we can all create those moments, like I said just pound music and like be silly. You know, it's like that saying like dance in the rain, or dance as if nobody's watching, right? Like literally my children are watching. Sometimes they videotape me and it's pretty silly, but we can all do that in it for me, that really does it. And those are things in my toolbox for that reason, because they just kind of leak around me and remind me of why I'm doing what I'm doing. I love that. It does. I also, I love to dance too. I also was a rower in high school and that sports very rhythmic, and I also used to play the violin, so I've, rhythm's always been kind of like a theme in my life, and dancing is a very direct way to be grounded in your body and to just have fun. So I really resonate with that answer. Actually, this is really funny at the one girl summit. You know how there was like a little stand with like a little vendors and people selling there like jewelry and whatnot. There was a little jewelry stand and I was looking at some of the rings, and there was a ring I have it here on the lake on the ring. It says shake some ass. Oh my god, I love that. I didn't see it. I wear it because it reminds me to have fun and like, and I think it's hilarious. And anyone who knows me personally knows that I love to dance. So I just think that is like a really lighthearted reminder to keep things fun and playful in life. And it's silly for sure, but I resonate with your answer. And I'm so excited for you with being in the process of writing a book. We can definitely talk more about that in a part two, but I'm excited for that journey to continue to unfold for you. And for my listeners who want to stay connected with you, follow along your platform and also hear more updates around your bunk. Where can they connect with you? So on Instagram, I'm Dr. Rachel and I see and I also have a newsletter that comes out monthly. This one just came out yesterday, but that I'm always sharing like tips and reminders for the month ahead. But as well as exciting news or or my media links and things like that, you know, people can either DM me to get that link or I have it on my Instagram, I guess one of the links as well had a sign up. I always also say I love to connect with people. So if you follow me, DM me say hi, although Instagram is not therapy, I'm always happy to connect and provide people with resources or referrals. If they do, you know, want that or you that as well, but I love connecting, saying hi as you know, I'm so glad that we did this today. So thank you. Thanks for tuning into this episode of Everyday Endorphins. If you liked what you heard and you want to continue to follow along, make sure to like, rate, review, and subscribe to this podcast on which every listening platform you prefer. If you want to stay plugged into Everyday Endorphins outside of the podcast, I'm on Instagram, I'm on TikTok, and you can also drop your email to subscribe to my newsletter. It's the Everyday Endorphins sub-stack where I talk about the interviews that I've done that month, any events happening in New York that I've hosted, and just a stream of consciousness of my thoughts. Thanks again for tuning in and reminder to keep spreading Endorphins and finding the things in life, that bring you joy. Until next time.