EP #114: Strategies for Living More Intentionally and Fostering Greater Self Connection with Isa Watson, Entrepreneur, Author, and Podcaster

(gentle music) Welcome back to another episode of Everyday Endorphins, a mental health podcast focused on the importance of finding joy and happiness in daily living. I'm your host, Stella Stephanopolis, and this week is all about the power of learning to establish a greater connection to the self so that you can lead a more intentional life and make more intentional decisions in life. And I have the opportunity to interview Isah Watson for this week's episode. She is an entrepreneur, digital wellness expert, competitive skydiver, an author of Life Beyond Likes, which aims to elevate our awareness around how social media impacts our daily lives, our self-worth, and our real-life relationships. Isah's had a really interesting career path which we get into during this interview, and she's also experienced some difficult hardship in her life that forced her to reevaluate her career, her mental health, and how she seeks validation, which is what led her to launch a social app called Squad, which helps people make more meaningful connections, and she recently launched her own podcast, which is focused on advocating for the importance of living life with more intention. Isah's one of the highest fundraising black women in Silicon Valley. She's been named the top 100 MIT Alumni in Technology, and top 100 female founders by Ink Magazine. Isah has a really incredible story, so it was such a pleasure to get to have her on the podcast this week to talk about her own career path, how she's found balance as a multi-hyphenate, how she's processed trauma in her life, and really the importance of learning how to connect with yourself and strategies to do so, so that you can lead a more intentional life. We also talk a lot about the intersection between our careers and our identity, which I find to be super fascinating, as someone who also has a job in corporate America, in addition to hosting this podcast and teaching yoga, and I think this is a topic that a lot of young adults are struggling with, how they make meaning from their careers and how that plays into their identity, and really how they build their own identity. So lots of interesting things that we dive into in this episode, really excited for you all to listen to it, but before we get into the interview, reminder to like, rate, and review this podcast on whichever listening platform you prefer, and follow along on social media at Everyday Endorphins, Instagram, TikTok, all the good stuff, to stay connected with the show beyond the podcast. Vents that are run in New York, and you can also subscribe to my newsletter on Substack Everyday Endorphins to stay up to date with my own stream of consciousness as well. Hi, Issa, thank you so much for coming on to the podcast. Thanks for having me, Stella. I'm really excited to dive into your incredible career journey. You're such a multi-hyphenate from starting your career at Pfizer, then going on to JP Morgan, to very separate worlds of finance and pharma. Can you talk a little bit more about yourself and your career journey more broadly and how you've just developed into this multi-hyphenate person? I say that it all starts at home. My dad, as its old-school immigrant engineer, his philosophy in life was, if you can't build it, you shouldn't be using it. So I was that little girl who was under the hood of a car 'cause I was like, what does this do? What does that do? I used to build computers with my dad from the time I was seven, and that just morphed into me loving to build. I actually got my first job at 14, as an organic chemistry researcher at UNC Chapel Hill. So I was in a summer program with the American Chemical Society, and ended up becoming the youngest known published chemist at 19 from where I work with Google Kines activators. And so, for 14 to, well, it's my 20s, all I knew was the lab. I transitioned to finance because I went to business school. Prior to that, I had studied chemistry and mathematics at Hampton University, I had studied biochemic Cornell University, and then I went to MIT from my MBA. And when I initially went to MIT, I went because I set to myself, oh, okay, I'm doing all this science early sage research. It's so far from the impact. Anything that I was doing in a lab wouldn't touch a customer or a patient for like 15 years. That's a long feedback cycle. So I said, oh, I'm gonna go to the business development side of farmers so I can make high impact. And I did not expect to fall into Wall Street. I got recruited by a lot of the Wall Street firms. They were like, oh my God, you have this chemistry background. You're so analytical. And I was like, I don't know the first thing about a balance. She, I don't know what e-bots of really means. But ended up at a leadership program at JPMorgan Chase and a program that Jamie Diamond had created to facilitate a pipeline of general managers. And essentially, I was tasked with very big building things. That theme of loving to build, right? They would say to me, Isaac, move out to Hong Kong to build retirement products for Hong Kong time one in Singapore markets, right? Or Isaac, come back to the US to build a, you know, one and a half billion dollar revenue strategy for our five million American small businesses. And so, you know, I was still kind of building a lot of things from scratch. And with JPMorgan having 300,000 people, it's a highly matrix organization. And so there was a lot of translation of skills of how I built and how I was analytical and how I was a problem solver to the work that I did at JPMorgan. And today, as you know, I'm a tech entrepreneur about how did that happen? (laughs) You know, I always say my journey to entrepreneurship is one that's deeply personal. My parents sponsored a bus trip for 'cause it visit Hampton University every year. And this particular year, the bus ran off our straight road, flipped over and injected both my parents out the front window and my dad didn't survive that. And it made me, it just redirected me in significant ways. And one of the things that it made me feel is a lot more passion for connectedness and loneliness because the loneliness that I felt was just exacerbated because like, at that time in my life, I had a big social following and I was just so focused on impressing these people online that I would never laugh in this room with. And I didn't want anyone to feel the love of loneliness that I felt, you know, having a band in my real life for that during that phase. And so I love to start a squad, which originally started as an app to make it fun and easy for you to talk to your close friends away from social media. But, you know, there was a really nice extension of our product where we're anchoring it in the fan bases of professional sports teams. So we're launching with several teams in the NBA this season for their fans to use our app, you know, as a social, next-gen interactive tool for sports fans. And so chemistry, biochem, organic chemistry, environment chemistry, there's a lot of things in there. Finance, you know, strategic building and Mt. Tech. So, I mean, it doesn't make a lot of sense on paper, but I don't know, I think it can all work out. - I like how you mentioned that entrepreneurship is really personal 'cause I also think that the ability to job craft is also really personal. Like allowing your different passions to be expressed in different ways through different careers, working in different industries. But I really think it's more so about how you tell that cohesive narrative. Rather than, oh, you know, I worked at Pfizer and then I was at JPMorgan Chase. Yes, two different industries, seemingly very different jobs. But it's, I think, more so about how you find ways to infuse those passions together, right? - As passions, but it's also transferable skills 'cause I'll tell you that when I first went to MIT, I used to tell recruiters who would reach out to me, I was like, I'm just a chemist. I'm just a chemist. And like, one recruiter pulled me aside and she was like, don't ever say that to anybody ever again. Because yes, you are a chemist, that is your background. But what does that mean? That means that you're analytical, you're a problem solver. You are a shanky communicator, right? And so it's like, it's a passion, a fusion of passions. But we all have translatable skills that a lot of times we're just not trying to talk about. - That's a great point. And I think also a lot of people tie their identity to their job and their career. And maybe they feel stuck in like, if I work as a chemist at a pharmaceutical company, that means I am a chemist that is my entire identity. And I feel like we could record a whole separate podcast. - That's the American way for sure. 'Cause when I go and I'm hanging out in France, like they're just like working just to live, right? But here we live to work. And there's so much status and identity tied up in like what we do. That's why I live in New York City. I hate going places. And the first question that people ask you, what do you do? - Why? - Yeah, exactly. 'Cause we think that's just a reflection of who that person is. So how have you tried to rethink what it means to build an identity with this mindset, with this philosophy around, you know, just because you've had so many different types of jobs. And it seems like you're more focused on the skills and like the learnings that these opportunities have given you. Like how do you reconcile with having maybe even multiple identities? You know, I struggle with the question a little bit because it reminds me of this whole notion of being boxed, right? Every time someone's tried to put me in a box, they end up being more frustrated than I am, right? And so people, they get confused, right? They get confused as black girl and I brazen, but I went to MIT. I love Jay-Z, Jay Cole, like Andrew Glamar. And I can also be a top decorated campus, right? And it's like, I'm this and that. And it doesn't make sense. And I know you haven't seen this combination before. But a lot of my identity, I actually root in how I make people feel. People often tell me I was at the Dense Assistance Morning. And one of the Dense Assistance told me that every time they see my name on the patient list for the day, they like argue over who's going to be the assistant with my dentist. Because you're like, every time you leave here, the office just feels brighter and lighter, right? And to me, that makes me feel good. Like, I'm very much into how do I make people feel? Do you feel a little bit lighter, brighter and inspired after engaging with me? That's where I feel like my identity is centered. MIT, Cornell, Hampton, JP Morgan. You know, these are all big brands, Pfizer. And I guess you can't take away my experience. But none of my identity is tied to that. That's such a profound point, not letting your identity be tied to your achievements, your accomplishments, the things that you do. Because that, as exciting as that might be, and as incredible as those achievements are, it's not necessarily who you are at the core. And I also want to bring up this quote by Maya Angelou that I'm sure you're aware of. It's not necessarily what you say, but it's about how, you know, you make people feel, because people are going to remember how you feel, not necessarily exactly what you say to them. I might have butchered the quote, but the point being exactly what you're communicating, people are going to remember the impression that you make, you know, how you make them feel. And so I think that that's something I've actually given a lot of thought to recently, as I'm thinking about, well, what is my identity? How does my career fit into, you know, the impact that I want to make on other people and in the world? Because kind of like what you said, you know, I work in a corporate job, but I also have this creative passion, building this podcast and brand. And I also teach yoga, but I also love rap music and Don Tolliver and Travis Scott and most people, when they hear that I'm a yoga instructor, they think that I'm vegan and that I want to like smoke weed every day and like run through the fields. And it's funny how we all tend to put other people into these boxes when it's so important to recognize that two truths can exist at once. You can be this and you can be that it creates the sense of, you know, a dynamic spirit, I think. And thinking about that concept of duality, when we think about our emotions and moving through difficult experiences in life, I want to tie this back into the experience of losing your father in that tragic accident. I can't even begin to imagine what that was like for you. And you have such a positive and happy demeanor now. That experience influenced the way in which you see duality of emotions and moving through difficult emotions. You know, this emotion journey that I've had or the ability to deal with my emotions productively is still a bit newer to me in my life, you know, because I've had a lot of therapy to be able to unlock and to recognize and to sort through my emotions. But one of the things I used to do was when I was feeling something very strongly, I would just completely subside it. Like, I mean, it was like a cockroach. I would just boom, you know, just slap it down. And over time, I realized that that was unhealthy. And so, you know, when I think about even how I deal with my father, my father's passing is, you know, my dad and I were very close. I honestly, I'm still sad by it. I wake up and I'm like, dang, that void is just not going to ever leave. But then it'll be something like, I'm in a store and they're playing like Moon River. And that was a song on the piano that my dad and I used to play together all the time when I was a kid. And how I feel like, oh my god, it just reminds me of my dad's like a light spirit. You know, my dad had this like very attractive, like dynamic smile. When he smiled, like, it just lit up the whole room, right? And I would feel that. But I like, at the same time, I could also feel sad. Like, I want to be here. And so, I think the duality of emotions is really something I've learned to master. And how, because I just allow whatever emotions arise to be there, I acknowledge them. Almost like they're ghosts, right? I acknowledge them. And I just, I sit with it. And I think I've learned to sit and duality a lot, you know, because of that. That's a great point. And I love how, you know, the anecdote you mentioned about Moon River. These things that just happen in life around us can actually remind us of such great memories of those who have passed and those who we were close with that have passed. And so, I think, like, looking at those experiences as bringing you a source of joy also can help move through difficult times as well. And it's interesting because having this conversation right now, doing a podcast virtually, we've never met in person. We're sitting, you know, in front of our computer screens talking for the first time, really. And I feel like I'm getting to know you on such a deeper level. Like, I feel like there's a deeper sense of connection, even though we have a met and person. And we're entering this call just with completely different schedules and different things going on during the day. But it feels like we're kind of in this flow. And it's very hard to achieve that feeling sometimes even with your closest friends or when you're in person hanging out with people. And I think this speaks to a lot of like the nuances that go with building a connection with someone and a fostering a deep connection. And I know that's really what the mission is behind your app, behind even your book, which we haven't talked about yet. And I want to bring up as well. So diving a bit deeper into the topic of just fostering connection. How can we do this in such a digital age? Because there is a paradox here. Like I mentioned, we're using technology to have this conversation yet I feel deeply connected. However, we know that our phones really isolate us as well. So what are some of your thoughts on that? I think that the only way to build a true connection with someone, anyone, is to not be afraid to just show people who you are. And so can you do that online? Sure. But I also think that at some point, a lot of the technology is not the thing that's going to connect us. It's just more of a medium for when we're not collocated to be able to talk and to be able to discuss whatever or connect. But one of the things I realized about part of my 20 is that I had this wall up that was more so just trying to get people what I thought they wanted from me as opposed to just being myself or just trying to pretend to be strong all the time. And sometimes I just didn't, their days are just so feel so strong. And I think that's okay. And it's funny because with my team, by people can make the argument like, oh, you're a CEO, you have to be super formal and you know, very professional in this way with your team. And we have our all hands on Mondays and they've been times when I'm like, you know, last week was just a rough week, man. And they're like, wow, like our CEO is a human. Like she's a whole homo sapient with like 46 chromosomes. Like, you know what I'm saying. And I think we were so guarded because we don't want people to judge us because we don't want people to think negatively of us. But the reality is that, you know, I think this is where validation comes in a lot because we have to learn to validate ourselves. And in this digital age, we're looking for too much validation from strangers we've never laughed in the same room with. And I think for me, I'm very comfortable with who I am, who I am, very comfortable standing in my two feet. I'm not everyone's cup of tea, right? You know, Jamie Donney used to always say this about like our products at JP Morgan or any initials we did, he said, we can't beat everything to everybody. We can be the right thing to the right people at the right time. That's a great quote. Yeah, I think about that like as a person too, I'm not going to be everything to everybody, but I can be the right thing to the right people. And that people part has to include myself as well. And so I think that again, we can have connections in like via social media and things like that, but that also has to be complemented with kind of in person as well and just being able to continue to build offline. So I want to go back to what you said about learning to validate yourself so many people have trouble with this for one of the reasons that you mentioned that we seek external validation from people we've never even met playing the comparison game is one of the most dangerous things you can do for your well being. It's a thief of joy. Because it comparison is the thief of joy I've been there before it's like when I look back on certain periods of my life where I've not felt very confident and that energy will like exude outward and it just puts me in a weird head space. That lack of confidence came from me comparing myself to other people and measuring my success up against other people, which success is entirely subjective, I believe. But you were comparing your whole life to their highlight room. Exactly. And that's where it gets to be super dangerous. So, you know, I had to learn and it still up something that I'm trying to learn and I'm working on is how do I validate myself? You know, how do I give myself the same kind of love and care and nurturing that I would give a friend who is struggling or not even struggling. Like, let's say it's their birthday and I want to express my gratitude for them. You know, how do I give that to myself? So there's some strategies I've been trying to adopt, but I'd love to hear from you. How do you try to validate yourself? What does it look like to comfort yourself and fully connect with yourself? - Yeah, I think that validating yourself is of powerful muscle that everybody needs to build and strengthen. And for me, it changes and evolves over time because my struggles are evolving or what I'm struggling with in that moment is evolving. My phase of life is evolving. But one of the things I realized is that I'm very quick to talk negatively to myself and heart-bomb, man, I should have done this, I should have done like this, I should have, you know, should have cut it what it is, right? But I'm very slow to celebrate myself or to create space for that. And so I said, okay, I have to learn how to show myself more love. So on every Monday, I actually write myself a love letter. It's like a love letter, a pep talk and a splotter is in this love letter right here. And it's a way for me to just practice to myself, like talking positively to myself. And, you know, over time, that became very validating because I was like, yo, I'm not perfect, I will never be perfect. I will make mistakes, I will apologize for them and I'm not gonna make all the right decisions. But I'm okay with that. You know, I'm perfectly imperfect and most importantly, I'm very comfortable with who I am as a person. And I don't have any like notifications on any, like anywhere on Instagram, on Twitter, anything because why do I care if you like my shit or not? Like if I post something, I'm posting it because I want to post it, you know, and there's all these engagement farming tactics where they're like, you know, you gotta post this, you know, time of day to optimize. I'm just like, listen, I'm gonna post what I wanna post when I wanna post it and I put my phone down. Whatever people like or comment, okay. But when I was oriented my social media use like that, it was so free because once I validated myself, it didn't matter who else validated me, right? I do think that your friends and the people that you have genuine relationships with can be validating as well. And there's certain girlfriends that I have where if I'm going through a certain type of thing, I'm like, I'm calling this girlfriend because I know she's gonna hook me up like emotionally in this space I need or if I need the other thing, I'm calling that girlfriend and it's very validating. But I really do think it starts with validating yourself and it's really about experimenting with different activities and tactics to do that. - Mm-hmm. And I think there's a difference like you're mentioning between having a strong support system versus seeking that validation, right? You know, I've also noticed the importance of having quality people around you in your life. And like attracts like. So when you're filling up your own cup, you're gonna act with more love. And that's gonna, well, you're the chemist here. You're like, I feel like this is related to quantum physics, honestly. Like you're putting out that energy somehow into the universe and then you will attract people who are kind of vibrating at that same frequency, comes back to you and then they also help to fill up your cup because they're providing like a healthy source of validation, I guess. And so that's, I think a really good nuance that you call out really like the difference between seeking something versus having it within yourself but then letting good energy feedback to you. I attended a talk recently at my office around positive psychology and it was like strategies to infuse more joy into your life. And the woman who was leading this, she got her masters and applied positive psychology at Penn. And she was speaking about how emotions are fleeting, you know, our feelings change, but also emotions can create spirals. So oftentimes we think about negative emotions and going down that like downward spiral, right? Like you woke up and you didn't get enough sleep so you're cranky and then you missed your train and it's raining and it's just like a horrible day and like one thing after the next, after the next, right? It's like I can't get a break. But then positive emotions, let's think about those for a second. They create an upward spiral. So let's say you feel really good in yourself. You want to smile to someone when you're walking down the street and then they smile back, creates that feedback loop. You're happier, you have a more optimistic attitude. It's like this positive domino effect and if you can bring good people into your life that validate you in that healthy way, that actually can lift you up and create this positive spiral. So, you know, it's interesting because social media definitely I think can dampen that positive spiral and your book is about life beyond likes. And I think we're all now trying to figure out how could we lead a life that is beyond the validation that we get from likes and comments in this and that. And I honestly don't know what that life looked like for me because or prior to all of social media because I think, you know, it came into my life when I was middle school, ish seventh eighth grade. So I didn't, you know, luckily I didn't as a child grow up with social media but it hit me when I was a middle schooler teenager. And so my whole adult life is in this world. And I think it's something that young adults are really trying to reconcile with right now. - Well, yeah, what social media has done is that it's conflated connection and consumption. People, we spend time, 90% of social media users are just lurking, all they do is scroll they never post. And what we're doing is just consuming perfected highlight the rules of everyone else's life. We're like, oh my God, they're perfect marriage. They're perfect job and they're perfect career. Oh my God, they're perfect kids. Why are Mike is behaving the right way. And so I think that, you know, people have to contextualize what you're seeing on social media. Like you're not seeing the good, the bad and the ugly. You're just seeing those select snippets of people's, the highlight rules of somebody's life. And that's where the comparison track is particularly harsh and self-inflicted because we are comparing our whole life. Which is messy and non-linear. We're comparing that to people's highlight rules. It does us a disservice. And so yes, in life beyond likes, logging off your screen and into your life, the book that I wrote that debut earlier this year, I talk about, you know, the impact, like just how social media has made us think about ourselves and how it's made us think about, you know, the world and how we want to navigate. Like, I mean, you live in New York City as do I. You've seen these activations around here that are like, oh my God, these are so Instagram-able. I'm not going to inactivation because it's pretty. And like the photos will look pretty on Instagram. Like it's like we're kind of like un-serious, you know, when we operate like that. And you know, I also say that it's really important to actually invest and live a real life. One of the things that I firmly believe I will die on this hill is that friendships are a huge untab source of joy. You know, the surgeon general, Dr. Vivek Marthy, he has said that loneliness is his number one focus right now. It's the public health threat. And people think that you die from like diabetes and you die from obesity, you die from all these, you know, heart disease. And that's true. Like there are people who die from that. But social isolation and lack of connectedness is actually a bigger predictor of you dying sooner than expected. And people don't like, people don't realize that. And so one of the things that I do is I block off front time in my calendar every single week. So you know, I tell people whether it's like two hours or three night, you know, two hours in the middle of the day on Saturday, block that and just fill it in, but protect that time because I can't tell you the number of, you know, adult friends I have where, you know, I was like, oh yeah, let's get together. Oh, oh my god, this week, I'm trying to LA next week. You know, now I'm in your abound vacation. Okay, now I just really need to like, you know, we just kind of keep pushing it off. But if we had just a little bit of intentionality around our social calendars, our connectedness calendars, our joy calendars and making sure we're integrating that into our lives. If we had a little bit of intentionality around that compared to the intentionality around our work calendars and making sure we're prepared for all the meetings and the pre-many for the remanings for the post meetings, then we would just be much happier. - I love the e-broad up loneliness. I interviewed someone a while ago now about loneliness. Her name's Julia Bainbridge. She's a writer, a journalist, and she used to host a podcast about loneliness and kind of exploring this topic. And what's interesting is that loneliness is a universal human condition. Like we all will feel lonely at certain points in our lives. And in a way, loneliness is kind of necessary for personal growth. Like sitting in that discomfort can actually be helpful to leveling up in our lives, to making changes that we need to make, to grow, to progress. So to an extent, I do think loneliness can be good for us, but it's the chronic loneliness is what is really the killer, I think here. And I know that you mentioned that creating time and air calendar for friends, for connection is one strategy towards living with more intentionality. What are other ways that we can cultivate greater intention in our life? So or a side note, Bye. in my yoga class, I'm not the most like spiritual hippy-dippy ho-get instructor, but I do think a lot of, at least for me, personally, what I've gained out of the practice is when there's a bit of that spirituality that's infused into it. And what I mean by that is not necessarily chanting, but setting an intention during practice, like really disconnecting, being present, getting off your phone, tapping into your breath, tapping into your body. And I always lead a class with asking people to set an intention or think about something or someone that they want to dedicate their practice to. And so this idea of like setting an intention, whether it be for the day and life, whatever it is for you, like how do we think about what it means to set an intention and fully actualize that, fully express it in our lives? I define intentionality as using the potential of our minds and the power of our actions to live a life-rooted enjoy. As you know, I launched a podcast called Intentionality with Isle Watson this year. And quite frankly, a lot of times when we're trying to make change, part of the reason we're unsuccessful is because we were trying to bite off too much. And I think intentionality is really about shifting those small things, one thing at a time. For example, when I was scroll social media, scroll social media in bed, it would take me forever to fall asleep. I was like, oh my god, my life sucks. Like I'm seeing all these perfect things. I actually don't get on social media within an hour of going to bed or an hour coming into the day. As I don't want to start in my days, looking at people's highlight rules. I need to start in my days with myself. And that was intentional. And I feel better. I feel I get up and I'm grounded. I'm like, I drink my hot water with lemon. Sometimes I do a little journaling. And I go outside and I walk my five to seven thousand steps before I open up my computer. That was intentional. And so I think that for another thing too, I used to live more extreme example, but I used to live downtown Manhattan in this apartment that had one very small window. And I realized I was like, yo, I'm like, I'm so depressed, I'm so dark in here. You know, that was vitamin D deficient. I realized I need light. Like now I live in an apartment that has floor to ceiling windows and I have so much light. But also I'm much happier when there are plants around me. I'm not the best plant mom and my plants do die, okay? But that was intentional. So I think there's small things, that small shifts, small habits that we can make to live with more intentionality. So that we're centering our joy. One of the things I haven't talked about is the fact that I am a skydiver. I'm a licensed skydiver. It's 40,000 of us in the United States. And I jump out of planes for fun. And I love it there. I love it there. I find so much meditative peace in the sky. So you know how some people, my brother, my younger brother, I just, like if he's hungry, I'm just like not top of it. Because I'm like, dude, why are you so mean right now? You know, but like, you know, if people get angry, when I'm like kind of moody, whenever my friends would be like, so I was like, what's the last time you skydiver? Because you kind of probably need to go up and get some jumps in because you're extra grumpy right now. And so I think also finding and experimenting with the activities that bring us joy is important to be intentional about centering our joy, but not enough people have the patience to see those experiments through. This really ties into kind of honestly the mission behind everyday endorphins. Because what I've learned through doing this podcast and what I try to communicate in every single episode is the fact that there's a wide variety of experiences that bring joy in life. Genuinely, like endorphins, metaphorically speaking, can come from so many different activities, not just what we commonly think of being physical activity, exercise. And I lovely, Gleeblon, don't get me wrong. Exercise, we can see endorphins and endorphins make you happy. They do. And exercise definitely does. I notice it changed in my mood, like if I work out one morning versus if I don't. But the caveat to that is also like learning when you need to rest your body. And sometimes it's totally OK to not go to the gym. The day can still be full and productive without needing to get in all of this, not movement. So it's this idea that to your point, experimenting with the different things that bring joy in life. And knowing that it can change too. Just like our emotions can change, we can change our mind. Things that are those little endorphin thrills and endorphin producers can also change because your priority shift in life and circumstances change. So I love your answer. But I want to underscore that really quickly because the things that used to bring me a lot of joy in my 20s are not the same as the things that bring me a lot of joy today. And to your point around the evolution, that's so important because, like you said, circumstances change, liked any of them exchange. Like one of my best friends has three kids. Two of them are under two. She loves, like, just going to a corner of the house where it's quiet. She just loves silence. And then she's never lost silence before, right? I mean, just things change so much. So being open to experimenting continuously because things change, I think, is really important too. So you mentioned what brought you joy in your 20s is a little bit different now. What were some things that brought you joy when you were younger, that maybe no longer are top of your joy list? I have been to 40 countries. And I remember, oh my god, I'm so stressed. I just need to hop into playing and end up in France the next day. And I loved-- I was still spontaneous. I was just kind of living life. I lived in Hong Kong for a bit. I lived in London for a bit. But now the thought of getting on yet another fight makes me tired. I love my bed. I love being at home with my dog. And so I used to get a lot of joy from traveling. I still travel a lot. Now I don't know that I want to be a diamond medallion member until I was just too much. I think that I used to get a lot of joy out of just a variety of activities that I'm just like those have shifted. Right now, I think the things that bring me joy are more so grounding and just oriented around me. But I used to get a lot of joy and blow off seeing going with my friends and party hand and going to dance clubs in my 20s. And now I'm like, you want me to come out my apartment past 9 o'clock? No, boo-boo. That's not going to happen. We'll be leaving the apartment at midnight. And that probably a lot of joy, you know? I'm 24. And I think that still does bring me joy. But I have realized that not every Friday and Saturday night is a sustainable thing to do. And so it also can drain me for sure. So I resonate with you on that one a lot. But I'm also trying to still enjoy the youthful period of your 20s. Not to say that past your 20s is not youthful, because I see my parents as youthful figures. So then they're definitely older than their 20s. But I digress a point being priority shift. And that's OK. And different things can spark happiness at different points in your life. And with that being said, I said, the final question that I want to ask you, that I ask every guest on my podcast, is what is something that currently brings you a bit of endorphins every day? Every day? It can be every day or just a practice in general that brings you a bit of happiness. A skydive into extreme, but I already talks about that. I would say that it sounds very silly, but in between meeting sometimes, especially if I'm working from home, I'll just sit and have a quiet moment with my dog. And he's a 10 pounder Yorkie poodle. And I'm just like, OK, let me just relax. Let me exhale. I have like five minutes before this meeting. It's like, let's go to your attention. It's like the little things every day. So quality time with my dog actually is very-- it just kind of brings me a lot of grounding energy, because my life is just so chaotic. I need those moments of quiet. A lot of people have said that also on the podcast, spending time with their dog or a pet. It is a grounding moment. And I think it's also a loving moment. Pets give you unconditional love. I think also though, I feel bad is already said, the skydiving is hugely meditative for me. And it brings me so much joy. I wouldn't trade it for anything. Well, you're allowed to repeat answers. And that's a very unique activity. And one that I'm sure is the biggest endorphin thrill. I had to work up the courage to go on that one famous roller coaster at Coney Island. And that was freaking me out. So I don't know if skydiving is in the cards for me, but I love that for you. I would hope one day I could gain the courage to actually experience that, because I think I would enjoy being in the sky, but not the lead up to it, too anxiety-inducing. You're definitely-- the invite is always there for you to come with me. Thank you. So the next podcast we do will be "While we're skydiving," that'll be really entertaining for people to listen to. Thank you so much. I said, it was such a pleasure having you on the podcast. Where can my listeners follow along, get your book, stream your podcast, download your app? Like, how can they stay connected with you? Walk through it. So me, I'm isawatson.com. Isadee Watson everywhere. The book, "Life Beyond Like," so you can get it from Penguin, Amazon, anywhere books are sold. It's tensionality with Isowash. the podcast. You can download that wherever you enjoy your podcast, Apple Spotify, etc. And for Squad, we are a social sports fan tool. And you can actually go to the App Store or Google Play Store to download the app and follow along with your friends and your favorite teams. Amazing. All of this will be linked in the show notes. So everyone can go check it out there as well. Thank you again. This was such a pleasure having you on the podcast. Thanks for having me Stella. Thanks for listening to this episode of Everyday Endorphins. If you liked what you heard, make sure to like, rate, and review this podcast on whichever platform you prefer. You can also follow along the Everyday Endorphins Instagram account to stay up to date with episodes, future events, and all things related to mental health, well-being, and happiness. Don't forget to keep spreading Endorphins and find things in life that bring you joy every day. Until next time.