EP#10- Finding Balance and Reducing Burnout with Camryn Okere, Founder of Rem and Company

(gentle music) - Hi, welcome back to Everyday Endorphins. This week's episode is all about finding balance when you do 30 million things at once. And I couldn't think of any better person to bring on to the podcast than Cameron O'Care, who went to Washoe was a year above me, recently graduated and is now working at MasterCard in their FinTech and Digital Payments team, and when she's not doing her full-time job, she is running the founder, she's the founder of her own company called Remyn Co, which is a nonprofit that consults for small businesses, which is so cool, she's doing so many things at once, which is probably really taxing and exhausting as you will hear in the episode, but it's so important to find ways to reduce feeling burnt out. And that's exactly what we talk about. So I hope you guys enjoy this episode. Cameron is an absolute superstar, and I don't know how she does everything, but I am incredibly inspired, and I hope that whoever's listening, whoever has an entrepreneurial spirit or wants to achieve a lot in their life and is really ambitious can hopefully take away some practices or lessons that Cameron has to share with us in this episode. Before we get into the interview, of course, gonna give a shout out to anchor, which you will hear in just a second. And also, if you love coffee, order a bag from strive and use the code Endorphins for 10% off of your order. (upbeat music) - Hi, Cameron, thank you so much for coming on to the podcast this afternoon. - Thank you just so much for having me, Stella. - I'm really excited to connect with you again here. It feels like just yesterday that you were back at WashU, even though you're currently in St. Louis right now. How have things been after graduating? - I think things have just kind of been a little bit crazy, not gonna lie. I feel like it's always just really interesting for me. I never expected to kind of like stay in St. Louis, but for me it was kind of crazy, just because I felt like so many of my friends were leaving schools just kind of figuring out how to do things online. And I had all of this extra time. And for me, I feel like I'm one of those people that just doesn't do well with extra time. Like I'm used to like doing a thousand different things. To be honest, just like sitting at home here in St. Louis, like bake studying for like the GRE, just like have myself like something to do. And then I saw just like a lot of small businesses like really struggling. And then just like constantly trying to be like a second semester senior like finding a job. I was on LinkedIn all the time and just seeing like the stories like so many different companies having to like percent internships, cancel jobs, et cetera. But I also just realized that then there were tons of young professionals out there. That kind of like needed something to do during this time. So kind of just seeing the small business landscape than all of these young professionals. I decided to start Remem company, which is basically this social impact initiative where we help small businesses navigate the pandemic. - Yeah, that's incredible. And I remember seeing on Instagram or maybe LinkedIn that you would started your own company right around when your senior spring was ending or in the middle of that going into the summer, you would probably launched around then. And I was just like, oh my God, like that's so cool that Cameron did this. Being a competitive athlete and also really being committed to your studies and all the other things you did at WashU really helped you become a go-getter. And put your motivation and your drive first to start something. So niche and that's something that's very helpful for the community, especially during the tragic time of this pandemic. - 100% Stella. I also think even just like looking back at like, my WashU days and other things that really just like helped me. I think the main thing was like really building a diverse network more than anything. I think it's like really funny. Everyone is probably like spoken to me at some point. It has kind of been like riled into Rem and Company and even people that are on our leadership or it's like people that I've studied and brought with or worked with or just like randomly had like classes with. And also I think just like stemming into many different departments was something I was really huge. So while I was at WashU, I studied like leadership and strategic management, which I think is now called like organization and strategic management. - Yeah, they always change the name. - They always change the names. And then international business. And then I was also doing a lot of stuff with like design and modern dance. So it was really interesting just because like the people that I picked up in my dance classes are now like in our leadership team of Rem and Company. People that you know, we're in my financing we're also there, but it's really interesting just to see like when you're building something like this, you need people of all different kinds of backgrounds. - Definitely and you know, you're able to pull from a lot of diversity of thought by having people throughout your entire college experience and other networks in your life come together and you know, come along on this journey for Rem and Co. I want to circle back a little bit to your time at WashU. You said you studied leadership and strategic management and international business. Did you know that you wanted to be an entrepreneur at 22, 23 years old? I never knew that I was gonna do this this soon. I think I definitely know the personality and know that like I want to be in charge and I want to be leading things. So definitely thought a few years down the road but I think it's also really exciting to do it in a way where right now like Rem and Co. is just a social impact initiative. Like we have no costs. We're not worried about anything. We're helping the community like example for me like if we help one small business it would be a success if we're helping hundreds of new yarns down. Like it's also the success. But I think it's a really cool environment where there's not this like fear failure and also we've so many people that are excited and are coming together for community that it's also not something where like everyone stressed. Yeah, and I think it's so amazing that you've had so many diverse experiences from you know, interning at SoundCloud to the Wall Street Journal to doing eye experience which we both did over the summer and you know really being open to trying out so many different things and now ending up in MasterCard but also pursuing another side hustle starting your own company. Being open to different experiences allows you to really explore what's out there and it doesn't really pigeonhole you into any one job or one industry. Something that's challenging in college and I don't know if you experienced this or if your peers experienced this while you were still at WashU but imposter syndrome is so real. You know not feeling like you're studying the right thing or you're smart enough to study what you're pursuing and WashU, it really breeds an environment where everyone is an overachiever. So how are you able to stay very focused in that environment and also not let it kind of bog you down but instead let it propel you to explore as many different things as possible. I think kind of like knowing what your priorities are I think is like a huge huge huge thing. I was like never the kid that was like always and it was just because I was doing a thousand other things to do that. So for me like a huge part about my college experience just like what you can learn. So I was the kid that like was taking 21 credits almost every semester just because I felt that there were random classes in the art school that I needed to take other things that literally were random that I was just like really passionate about. But for me I kind of needed to know like because I'm in every single class it doesn't mean I can really do well in every class it's just not physically possible. You aren't just pigeonholed it to everything that's going on with school. There's a thousand other just like jobs or paths that are out there that schools isn't really even like teaching about like I know, especially in Olin I feel like there's a lot of pressure to either go like the IB or consulting route. And Rian just like okay I guess those are the only two options but literally doing like a quick link to insert about like everything else that's out there and kind of like what your passions are really showing me that there were like a thousand different things that I'd be really good at and just kind of knowing like how to research them and kind of what are the industries where like grades don't even matter 'cause all about like building connections or doing other things or just kind of knowing I guess like how you operate where the places you want to go and not allowing other people to kind of like interfere with that whether that's through like peer pressure or even yourself in terms of like imposter syndrome I got really good advice about imposter syndrome and it was basically two things like the first thing was one you wouldn't be put in this place if someone didn't think you were really capable. So going through and having like five interviews a super day who knows what like people believe in you even if they're not responding to like everything you email that you know you're sending them who knows what but know that you're here for a reason and then secondly the idea that like people wouldn't put you in this position if they weren't there to also support you and I think it's something where one kind of helps me think about that is like what support really looks like in terms of like meeting even like company goals like people aren't gonna put you in a position where like if you don't do your job like things can't get done and the company's gonna like fall apart like someone's gonna be there to help you and also like even if it's not like you know chicken little like the sky is falling issues but even through little things like people are there support you, someone's been in your place beforehand. So even for me at MasterCard, it's been really challenging just because like digital payments is something that I knew like nothing about. It's something where it's like really really complicated. Like soundcloud, I love music, I knew digital platforms. It was not something that was like that craze for me to like wrap my head around. But like cross-border payments, what's going on with processing? Like there's a thousand things for me to kind of know from when that first payment happens. Actually when you're like package of products is actually received. So for me, it's constantly just like one, knowing that I need to like reach out to people and ask for help. And I think even in remote settings, it's really hard just because there aren't those like physical people around you where you can just like literally see like wow, there's like 50 people in this room that I could ask. But like going through like the list serves and being like okay, this is someone who I could actually connect with and constantly having. So I think like put yourself out there and really just be an advocate for yourself a little bit more. With everything about imposter syndrome, it seems like the most important thing is just to recognize that people are there to help you and that you you can do it. Telling yourself that you have the ability to do whatever it is that you're putting your mind to. And just also taking you know greater perspective. Life moves on after college. You've graduated. You have your first job. You've also started your own company. Things move forward even if you have to take accounting like a few times. And I think it's so hard to keep that in perspective as a college student. And you're also entering the working world now in a very, very different environment. Everything I'm sure is remote for you right now. How has that transition been like? I think it's been something that's really interesting. I feel like I do really well remotely just because I have really bad ADHD. So I'm definitely someone who is in like the like cornerstone all the time taking my classes like in a little room. So for me, it's like a really helpful to kind of like be in my apartment. Like alone for the most part like friends kind of checking in here and there. But it's really important for me just because like it allows me to really focus and having that time where it's like there's no distractions. Whether it was like siblings parents, etc. Like for me, I was literally for like a few months really alone. But that was kind of like a really cool incubator on like how to build this is because like every hour is being utilized and like there wasn't time for distractions. So I feel like it's been really cool on the reman company side working remotely. But also just because you get to like meet so many like new people, it's really cool. So I feel like it's something that was definitely adjustment. But especially because I'm someone who loves just being social. But I think in terms like building something in the focus that you need to do that, it was very beneficial. And then on the mastercard side, as I said before, I think constantly like having to like really tell people when you need help. And it's also one of those things where like people can't really see you struggling. You're on all the Zoom calls. And for the most part, it's like cameras off, you know audio muted. So it's not like people are going to be like she's drowning center of life best or something. You kind of really have to be an advocate and also just like understanding this is like a part of the system. So making sure you understand like there's certain times where it's just necessary to like swallow your pride and be like, yeah, I don't know what that term is. Or I'm actually really new to payments. And I need to you know, have a little bit of extra help for like what are books that you've read or what are different resources that we have in this company to help me do that. It's because like it's so hard to actually like communicate that you're struggling when people can't actually see that. Yeah, how do you find the courage to ask for help? I feel like in your first job, you may feel like you're expected to know everything or it's really stressful because everyone around you is doing such a good job and you're you've just started and you have no idea what's going on. So how do you find the courage to put yourself out there and say, hey, I'm kind of lost can someone help me with this? I think to be honest, just knowing it's a part of the process. Like for me, it's like, I'm going to spend a lot of time and like do this incorrectly and also just like balancing that and remnant company. I just like don't have time to do it incorrectly. That for me, it's like, this needs to be done and it probably needs to be done incorrectly. That I need to kind of just like swallow my pride and say like, yeah, I need this to be done, you know, or like I need help with this just because I think people will want this respect you more. If you not to say that you need to go to someone immediately when like they've given you an issue and you're I have no idea. Obviously like Google search it, try to problem fix it before you like go to your superior, etc. But I feel like for me, just knowing like at the end of the day, they're here to support you. It's kind of better communicating that and I feel like also it's like a really interesting time where you really can milk this kind of like promote learning like the entry level of the training. It's like such a process where it's like I'm going to be new for literally like years maybe and still need to be learning things and compare it to like some of the people that are on my team that have been a master car for 20 years. Like I will be new and not know things for years to come. So constantly just like conveying that and being able to say, you know, like I'm not on the calendar and like could I be on it instead of just being like, oh, you know, I didn't get the email like let me have an extra long lunch, but just kind of communicating things with people. I think it allows them to like really respect you a little bit more. Yeah, I want to talk more about how you're able to balance your full-time job at MasterCard and also being the founder of your own company. My podcast, as you know, is a lot about mental health and well-being and I'm sure it's stressful just starting the working world once you graduate. On top of that, having your own company and getting that off the ground and trying to make that a success, how do you do both? What are some strategies that you've used to help find, you know, peace and center yourself amidst feeling very chaotic, trying to do so many different things at once? I feel like it's first kind of important to note that like I definitely don't have this stuff figured out and I think it's going to be like an ongoing process just because I feel like there's been many different stages. Like I feel like I had like a really long period of like just working with REM and it also was something that was really interesting because it was the summer. So even our professionals that working amazing companies they were having like summer Fridays, we had all these people that because of the pandemic, it was literally like their only internship. So literally like if I needed a meeting, people were there. But now we have people in school, people with like really like busy work schedules that it now has made it into something where it's really really really stressful just organizing everything. And I think for me, the biggest part about that is like really identifying what your strengths are and what your weaknesses are and then like also being able to convey that to other people and also just like explain to people that there's a lot of different things going on and like that just won't be done today because there's not enough hours within the day. And I think going back to the strengths and weaknesses, the things that you really have weaknesses in, finding people that can support you within that. I feel like REM and companies are really interesting structure because we have our like me and kind of some of our like other leadership positions. But it's really me and Justin, our director of operations that do like everything on like the day to day basis. So even at REM, like I oversee over 350 people. And we have like so many different teams, whether it's teams with like social PR, this whole pill talk thing that we're doing or even on the side of like all these different consulting teams. We have tons of different chapters at different schools. So for me, it's like crazy because it's not just like a figurehead position. It's we're also so new. It's been a huge thing. It's like conveying to people and understand like explain to people even whether it's clients or whether it's volunteers like everything that you are doing because certain times people just see you in a silo where it's like a live speech, a camera for 30 minutes of the day. So everything that I'm telling here like she needs to do right now. And it's like no, you know, I'm speaking to a thousand people like you for those 30 minute periods. So for us, it's like figuring out when things can actually be done. And then I also think a huge thing just in terms of like wellness was like beginning to hold people accountable and expressing to them what was going on. So for me, just like communicating with people when you need help, what's going on. I think it's been a huge thing. Communication is so important, especially if you're just starting like a smaller company or nonprofit and your smaller team, making sure everyone is aligned and on the same page is so crucial. I think it's really interesting also that you're assuming such a strong leadership position at Remenco, but you're also working as like an entry level employee at MasterCard. Have you found that assuming more of a leadership role has helped you be a better employee at MasterCard? I think it's almost made me be a worse employee to be honest because I feel like I'm like the like most critical or it's like, is this necessary? Why should I be here? Like there's like, we have tons of processes that take hours and hours, and I'm like, there needs to be a faster way to do it. Or just thinking about how you utilize today. So for me, I think it's always hard because MasterCard definitely has like a really, really, really chatty culture. And for me, I'm like, I like, I could challenge you on the weekend. Let's get this work done right now so you can move on to the next thing. But I think it's given me like an interesting perspective just because you see how in larger businesses it takes really, really, really long just for like new ideas to launch. When example for us at Remenco, when someone comes just an idea like within the next two days, something's built. And we also have so many people where you have a team that's like supporting you, etc. And that just doesn't work because there's tons of red tape. We have to deal with legal teams, other things when you're working at a big company. Example like a MasterCard, Wall Street Journal. So for me, I think it's been really cool just to kind of like challenge yourself and kind of see like how much can you get done? But also on the other side of that like really yourself back and saying like What are my boundaries? And I think that's the thing that I've really been working on. I remember like the first few weeks of Ram like we were Literally a 24/7 operation It was really really really hactic just because I was constantly on the phone I was on every client call everything and and we were working on the week I wasn't taking lunch. It was like really really really stressful for me And then kind of realizing like wait like to actually be able to maintain this like I need to take the weekends off I need to make sure that I'm actually eating All kinds of stuff just because it's so stressful and it's so easy just to be like Here's the goals that we're working towards and also being like in a sila word You're just hopping from one call to the next like for me. It was so easy Just like having a snack that like I put out in the morning and like a post it It's like okay eat this at this time like having a reminder just because I'd be working so hard that to be outside forget Yeah, I I'm so happy that you brought up boundary setting because It's so important to identify when you're feeling burned out and knowing when you need to sit set boundaries and which boundaries You need to set and this is something that I've learned over the past few years in college whether it's with Friendships or with my schoolwork trying to carve out time for myself And I can only imagine how much more challenging it may be when you're actually in the working world especially now that Our working world is actually in our own home environment because everything is virtual How to set up boundaries at home so that your work does not become your home in personal life I think is really crucial and really hard So I'm really happy that you brought up this concept because now as a recent college grad who's Juggling 30,000 things at once and is so successful and so entrepreneurial I'm really curious to learn more about How What strategies you've adopted to identify when you're starting to feel a bit burnt out and then what actions you take to Curved up or now and also put some boundaries in place where you can show up for yourself first so that you can be a better leader for others I think definitely for me it kind of just makes me think back to one of the things one of my mentors really spoke to me patty Aubrey And she constantly kind of just like made me rethink different decisions or even just like different tasks whether it's something where like oh like you need to do this or like you have to do this Or that you want to do this so something where it's not like everything is at the state of crisis where you need to do it right now Or other things where kind of people have influenced you to say like this that this needs to be done It's like well actually let's redefine this think about the scope of this like if I don't do this right now How is it actually affecting what's going on tomorrow or within the next week and also just understanding that like Your priorities may not be the same as other people's priorities and kind of figuring out how you read in the middle of that And I think also boundaries just kind of like I think even with how like what we're talking about with clients and like also just like emphasizing Their boundaries and other things like for us like feel like it's hard because everything's volunteer and we're scheduling things where it's just like Oh, you know what like this is so good. It's so free like they should be able to meet whenever But it's like they have families they have other things there's so many things so kind of knowing like What works best for them and also just like keeping other people's boundaries in mind. I think it's something that I would think is really helpful. I know a huge thing that I saw on Someone's email signature that I thought I definitely should incorporate into mine was just like my working hours or not You're working hours like do not feel the need to like respond if you know This is not during the time where you're actually like you've set aside to do work or something like that And I thought that was something that was really really really important just because even at school I do like my best work in like the middle of the night where no one else is awake So I can have no distractions at least that before like really bad ADHD So for me like if you're getting like an email from me and like The middle of the night do not think that you need to be you know Well, good up and doing that just because for me It's just like that's when I work best and that's kind of also working with mastercard and other things Where I have time to kind of like follow up and do stuff But like conveying Those things to people that things important because I could then definitely have volunteered for it like This is urgent like I need to be up like email in the back when you know Yeah, I really want to respect their boundaries as well That's funny. So you mentioned that you get your best work done in the middle of the night I was going to ask if you're more of a morning person because I feel like a lot of entrepreneurs and really successful business people How you know, they wake up so early and they're super productive in the morning and they have like a very structured routine Day ahead of them would you say that like you're that type of person or is it a bit more Um, you know more you're like a night owl or you get a lot of your work done later in the night To be honest, I feel like very much both um, I think I'm definitely someone who is Up when I'm very passionate about something. I think that's something that I saw Um within just like REM There was so much that like needed to be done during the day that I was just like losing hours by sleeping And also I'm one of those people that like one just has tons of issue sleeping So for me it's like whether I'm getting four hours or six hours or eight hours. It's not really it doesn't really matter Yes, because either way it's like not that much of like a you know stress fees free sleep etc But I feel like for me especially with starting REM like I was up and working like Every morning probably like six a.m Just because there was so much that like needed to happen and also just like Kind of planning so for me like building in those like three extra hours where no one's speaking to me It's something where it's like really really really important Definitely I've been talking about setting boundaries reducing burnout Making sure that you can be the best version of yourself so you can most impactfully lead others I want to talk more about some maybe like wellness practices that you do or ways where You found yourself able to just quiet your mind a bit when you're feeling a bit stressed or overwhelmed by all the things you have to do I think to be honest a huge thing that I love doing is listening to podcasts Um like this one exactly Also some of my favorites like how I built this with God. Oh, I love that podcast I love just like to be honest like listening to those whether I'm like Folding laundry or like doing the dishes just because like it's really interesting just to hear like what other people are going through and also in a way where you like Don't need to respond. It's just like so easy. Just like listen and hear their stories and hear just like you're not alone I also think another thing that's like a really important is exercise Originally, I think like I was doing so much work that I didn't have any time to exercise and it was just like wait I can't dedicate like an hour to exercise because like an hour I couldn't do other things But then like quickly realized that like my exercising my mind was like so much clearer I could accomplish like much more and less times of making sure that like Whether it's every day or every other day like really setting aside time to Exercise um and just like keep your body active as well, especially in a time where you're remote You're not like walking around the office. It's something where you need to kind of like Stay active or even like walks with friends. I'm really into playing great. Yeah in the central west end Oh, are there any like specific workout classes that you like to do or types of workouts that you enjoy doing I've done plank before also with the mega former. It's great I love plank and I think that was really fun also just like having a friend to kind of keep you Accountable to kind of go so I have one like plank buddy that I go with later every other day Just because of right around the corner and it's so easy to like walk and also like support a small business Which I to be honest love doing I also was like a huge fan of like berries bootcamp over the Instagram lives like there's no berries in like St. Louis And also it's normally like super expensive So I was so excited to have literally like a whole summer of basically like free Instagram live classes And I always tell myself kind of doing those things on like the odd days when I wasn't that plank Yeah, definitely. I think I I totally agree with you It's really important to just carve out even like 30 minutes just to get in some physical activity because When you move your body and you're getting the oxygen flowing the blood pumping You're just taking the moment to step away from all the things that you're doing Giving yourself some time to just breathe move a little bit clear your head and then I mean, I mostly feel refreshed after I work out and then I feel like I can be productive again get back into what I was doing I'm hearing you. I think it's literally the same thing and just like Emphasizing again how important is and I think what's really important about just like Whether it's like the start of mindset or entrepreneurial mindset is that just like you have to set aside times for the things that actually matter Whether that is sleep whether it's exercise whether it's just like hanging out with friends Because like at the end of the day to be able to build great things You kind of need to make sure there's like a strong foundation for those things to actually be built upon and oftentimes when You're the founder of the CEO like that foundation is actually you so before you kind of need to invest in your company You also not try to be a cliche, but definitely need to invest in yourself I completely agree and that's why I was so happy that we were able to record today because I think a lot of kids at Washoe in particular are very entrepreneurial and spirit and even if you're not it's so important call just such a pivotal time where you're learning about how to be selfish in the best way possible, how to really put yourself first and give yourself as many opportunities as possible. And with that comes listening to your mind, listening to your body and prioritizing the things that matter to you the most. So I think you're just a really wonderful example of that. One last question that I do ask all of the guests that come onto the show is about mental health and happiness and well-being I'm wondering what is something that brings you a bit of endorphins every day. I think what gets me really excited to be honest is like having a quick like literally a minute call with my grandma, which I can normally do every day. It's super funny. My mom is a dean of like diversity and inclusion for law school. So oftentimes she's on Zoom all the time and like whenever I actually need to speak with her about something, sometimes she's like I'm on Zoom. And then I just know like okay I should call my grandma for like two seconds just like speak with her. One because like she's no one's no one's speaking to her other than like me and a few other people. And it's literally such an easy conversation to have because she speaks me just about like like what's going on but also in ways that are so simple. So you know it's like a one minute conversation where someone's like are you okay? And I'm like yes. And it's like okay next question like she's literally sits outside and like watches the squirrels all day. It's like are the squirrels out? Yes done. Like I get super excited just about that because I feel like I'm always having like really hard conversations. Whether they're with just like everything that's going on in the world today, orders with like Rem and building something that really has to be strategic and we're always thinking in the future. So sometimes the kind of just like gives me and door friends and gets me happy is just like having a really easy conversation where I know exactly the format that's going to be. So that's kind of what gets me excited. Totally and checking in with your family is so important. I feel like we don't do it enough. Like I barely called my grandparents and this is reminding me that I probably should talk to them more often. Well thank you again Cameron. I appreciate you coming on to the podcast. Thank you so much for having me Stella. It's been amazing just to kind of see all the different amazing people that you've had come on this show and just talk about really important things because like mental health as we've seen is something that is like a huge issue like across our country and something that not only do we need to work on you know as a large group but also really individually every day. So thank you so much for reminding us whether it's every week or every month that this is something that's really important and should be at the forefront of our minds. (upbeat music)