Emergency Group Chat: The Taylor Swift Wedding

(upbeat music) - Welcome to Justice Girls at His Page, Katie and Sam. Quick housekeeping, today is an emergency episode 'cause we figured we'd need to talk about the Taylor Swift wedding, ASAP. - And it couldn't be more fitting that I have real emergencies going on in my real life, but this is the true emergency. So I'm here, I'm locked in, let's go. - Yes Sam, do you want to tell your family? - What the hell, my husband is in the hospital for an appendectomy. He is stable, he is great. He might be in the hospital, but Taylor Swift only gets married once, so here we are. - Yeah, for the record, we said, "Sam, you do not have to come." - Yes, for like, you don't have to be. - And because I have a sick child home with me, that's the only reason I'm here, otherwise I'd be at the hospital. But again, this is an emergency. So let's lock in. - Lock in. Actually, when we left New York last week, Katie and I walked through MSJ and the street for shutdown, and there was paparazzi, and people unloading trucks, and we're like, "Oh, is happening." - Oh yeah, I was taking so many pictures, 'cause I was like, "We are boots on the ground." Like, "We," I think, am I a reporter right now, and I'm a journalist? Katie, I don't know if you clocked it. I saw some Gen Z people walk past us, and one of them jokingly said, "Beuts on the ground, journalists." Are you sure that wasn't me? 'Cause I said the same thing. No, they were making fun of you. Oh my gosh, stop. I didn't literally, and me, I'm like, "I'm so cool." 'Cause you said it. You did it, and you're like, "Beuts on the ground, journalism." And then they walked by, and they just mocked us. Oh my god, what is it? We're chuggy, is that it? - Yes. But you're doing the artwork. I had texted you guys that I have three people. It's very weird, the invisible strings. Let's see how many like puns we can do of Taylor's songs while this episode. But the invisible strings I had to people that were at the wedding. I had three, but the one neighbor on the street, his good friend played football with Travis. And he had texted and was like, "Hey, we gotta know "what's going on. "This was days before." And he said, "Hey man, can't say, but we're in New York." And they, so did they sign NDAs? Because I saw, okay, okay. So yeah, he just said can't say, but we're in New York. And then we just were like, "Hey," and that was all. And then the other people I knew posted the pictures obviously after the wedding just all dolled up in their-- - Well, I actually saw Nikki Glazer. She put a picture up of her in her dress and then she said, now I can say it wasn't just for a black tide comedy event. Because I think even they couldn't tell their stylist, like it had to be locked down, which makes sense. The world has a lot of feelings about this wedding. I think there's like two camps of things and we can talk about whatever you guys wanna talk about. You're the Swifties, I am not. There's the bucket of like YMSG. What did it look like? Who was there? What was it like? Is there a castle? Y Adam Sandler, like all the things. There's just like the discourse about the actual wedding. And then there's the discourse of like, Taylor Swift billionaire shut down MSG, shut down streets in New York wedding, right? And so like, that is my entire algo. It's like, why did Taylor Swift do this? Tacky wedding at MSG. And then like, why do we care about Taylor Swift the billionaire? I don't know, there's so many feelings. - Yeah, and I think we should touch on kind of all of them. I literally, as per usual, I have a running note in my notepad. 'Cause like, as it was happening, as my algo was unfolding, I was like, there's so many different things to talk about. I feel like every group chat I was a part of was texting about it and to your point page, all the different perspectives on it. And I don't know about you guys, but I feel like a lot of the different arguments. I am like riding different sides, depending on which one. Like, I am, and I said, I don't wanna speak for you. Like, we're both quote unquote, I guess, Swifties. Like, I don't even know what it means to be a Swiftie anymore at this point. - Yeah. - But, you know, when to the Aristotle, I've been to a ton of her tours, love her music. But, you know, everything has evolved. Over time, we have evolved as people. And I think, I don't know, I don't think it's a black and white issue. I don't think you could be like, this wedding was wonderful, let her have her time, everything was perfect, it's not of our business, but I think on the other side, the, like, tacky, I hate you, everything's horrible. Like, she should have been married in a cave with one person. Like, I think that's on the other side. - I totally agree with that. And have you guys seen any of the clips? I feel like she's done a lot of interviews with BBC over the years. And there was, there were like a year ago, Taylor Swift, like, basically sent out smoke signals and told everyone that like, this was gonna be her wedding 'cause she was like the worst. They're like, what is the most stressful thing about wedding planning? And she was like, sitting down and telling people, or like, talking with your husband or your fiancee at the time and being like, this person can't come or this person's not gonna make the list. And she's like, we're gonna invite everybody. And she like, told the guy that was interviewing her. She's like, well, you'll see. And he was like, what? And she was like, yeah, you'll be there. And he's like, I'm invited. And she's like, of course. And so like, the amount of people that were there was insane. But something we mentioned on our previous episode was the Blake and Ryan Reynolds of it all, which I think is why. - Yeah, okay, so I think there's a good list. - Yeah, yeah, yeah. I think maybe that should be the first one we touch on is the 1,000 people of it all. And I'd love to hear what side everybody is on. My personal perspective is I, I think it depends on the kind of person you are. Like what I see is like, oh my gosh, she had 1,000 people. Zendaya got married and nobody knew. And I'm like, okay, but it's like, I think that's where like, a little bit of the misogyny plays into it, where it's like, who cares? They're completely different people. And I think it has to with your personality type. And also she obviously is a billionaire. She can invite whoever she wants. And that is not an issue. But I don't know what you guys think. - I think, okay, we're gonna come at this for me from the lens of like, if I were talking about a normal person, even not Taylor Swift, just like a normal person. I have friends who wanted a big ass wedding, right? They wanted that, they wanted to dance and they wanted to be the center of attention. I eloped. You couldn't pay me to have a wedding. Like, I'm one of those people who, when I met a wedding, or even like a party that I'm posting, I'm always so worried about whether everybody else is having fun. And then I don't have fun. And I knew that would be my wedding if I did that. So I didn't want that, right? And so I think that's the question. Like, everybody gets to choose what their wedding is. We know Taylor. Taylor wants a big blowout eyes on me production. Like, eras tour wedding. That is what she wants. And that's not surprising to me. Like, that wasn't surprising to me at all. I think you can get into the, like, who was invited? There's some problematic people there. I think you can get into that conversation. But it's, yeah, I don't think this is surprising from Taylor Swift. - Yeah, I agree. I think there's, like you said, page like the eras tour of it all, like, she loves a production. Paul McCartney and Stevie Nicks performed at her wedding. Like, she is the Taylor Swift. She has the most iconic people ever at her wedding. I also think it's like, we can't even contextualize, like, I don't know if you got how many of her documentaries you've watched over the years. I guess it's the reputation. No, the 1989 one they have where like, she just has like so many deep, deep connections with so many people in the industry too. That I can't even imagine trying to make a cut off list. And again, that's just from what we see on the outside. Also, one point I was thinking of is like, I'm writing down as you guys are speaking. Like, I look like that crazy meme of the guy from it's always sunny. But she kept talking about how like what Travis, her biggest compliment, she's gotten from people that are close knit to her. She's like more herself than she's ever been. And she loves like dancing at award shows and like being goofy. And yeah, so I think like, if you have a, over a billion dollars and you have a lot of fucking friends, like, why not? Yeah, I think we also have to remember, say, and I think a lot of the argument to that Sam is like, how much of that is PR? Like, how much of it is her being like, oh, I'm having the time in my life 'cause that's the brand I'm selling. You know, that's the line people are writing. I also think people have to remember, she is a business person. Like, you know, she's a business woman and so is he. So when you're having a wedding, like, I've had friends that have gotten married and they had 400 people there because one of their parents is the executive of a company and they need to have everybody under that umbrella 'cause you don't want to piss somebody off and not be invited to like an event on the town. So I think we also have to remember, yes, this is their wedding, but a lot of weddings inherently are also business transactions where people need to be brought under the umbrella, like, for the appeasement of going forward. - Weddings are inherently a contract between two people, legally binding document, I think. Yes, I was literally gonna say the same thing as you Katie. I feel like every wedding I've been to, it's like, I'm inviting this random person I've never met because my mom said I have to. - Yeah. - And, you know, but like, I think it is PR. There's always a narrative, there's always a spin. There's a reason Adam Sandler is doing this. I get it honestly, can't. Okay, there's also a reason Blake was not invited. And I brought this up. I said, do you think Blake will be invited? And I didn't know, I was like, I don't think so. Sam, you said yes, I didn't think she would be there because I don't think their friends anymore. I think it's dead, like it's done. I don't know, it seems to be done. The billionaires are billionaring. They're fighting with each other. But I think it's really, oh, do we think Harry was there? - He was. - No, he, so he actually wasn't. He was invited, but he had a show. - Oh, okay, I can't remember. - Lovely tour. - Yes, because I was also incorrect about the Blake lively of it all. I thought she would be invited. And I think that like draws such a line in the sand as like there doesn't need to be speculation about like what went down anymore. It's obvious. It did not end well and part user severed. And so after that, I was like, ooh, was Harry Styles invited. He was as though he crept as plus one. - Yeah. - Just conveniently had a show. - Yes, I was gonna say, I did not say that Blake was gonna be there. Although I probably like got changed. - That was Katie. - Sorry Sam. - Okay. I accept your apology. No, but I agree with you Katie. It's like, oh wow, okay. She is Taylor Swift is the Godmother of their children and like they were not the wedding. Like that says a lot. - Wild, wild. - That happens so often though. Do you know how many people are like, oh yeah, that person's my Godmother, but we haven't talked to them in 20 years. It's such a typical thing to happen. It's like, what is going on? Pick family. Don't pick friends. Okay, but I do wanna go back to really quickly that I'm Sandler of it all. Because I saw so much speculation about that and like negative speculation about it. Truthfully, I don't know, I'm a big Adam Sandler fan. I've been lucky around to be in his orbit in like the Hollywood world of it all when working. And he's so funny down to earth, a wonderful person. My theory if I had to put money on it is like, you come on, think about it. Like we've all gotten married. It's like you have some of the things that you really want your must-haves. And then like, well I guess it paid you a lot. But like your husband might want a few things he's willing to put his like steak in a sand over. I bet you Taylor planned 99% of this wedding. And it was like Travis who was like, y'all like how funny would it be if Adam Sandler officiated us? And Taylor was probably like, sure baby. Like, you know, here's your one thing you can think. Like that's what I feel like probably happened. Okay, but did you see at the Aristotle movie premiere in LA, Adam Sandler and his daughters were like in the theater with Taylor back, you know, when that came out and his daughters are obsessed with her. So when I saw that he officiated the only people I was thinking about are his daughters. Like can you imagine if you are the ultimate swifty and you're like, yeah, my dad officiated their wedding. Like what? That must be wild. I also think you need two things out of somebody who's officiating somebody who's gonna like make you tear up a tiny bit and then somebody who's gonna make you laugh. Like you can't have a person who doesn't know how to do like both. And I feel like Adam probably can do both a little bit. Like all I think about when I think about Adam Sandler is happy Gilmore or what's the other one where he can't spell. I don't know. My husband just quotes those movies constantly and what is it big daddy? Yes, big daddy. It's big daddy. I can buy my own ass. That one. Yeah, so good. I'm like that guy. That guy's up there in Bruins, Jersey. Probably like that's crazy. I mean, hey, good for her, I guess. I don't know. It's all, do you think there was a castle? Was there a castle? Do we know? I mean, I wouldn't be surprised. I also don't know. Did you see that AMC, the CEO of AMC like Tweeted something out like right after and then deleted it because there was so many things so much. What was the Tweeted? It was a very long Tweet like describing kind of like what the night was like. I saw a lot of things about like there were five story high like artificial trees with lighting like which I'm like if that's real, that's kind of really cool. So I wouldn't be surprised if there was a castle. I feel like it very much like goes with her branding. I mean, she's like the whole thing is like she's been a hopeless romantic or a whole life. It was the Juliet to the Romeo. You know, like I wouldn't be surprised. Yeah, it's a love story, baby. Just say yes. There was a castle there for sure, for sure. You're going to make Paige roll her eyes. I know. I'm going to just keep pulling lyrics out, but Paige isn't even, it's going to go over her head for some of them. It's not going over my head. I've heard every thought. No, that one. But what was the one Katie and DC you pulled out one and Paige didn't get it? What was that? Oh, yeah. Are you still at the restaurant? Yeah. She was like, what? Which restaurant? I did hear that they pulled up out of the carpets. They changed the carpets. And so she was like, she was all the, but I'm wonder if she was to change them again after, which I'm just like, here's the thing guys, wasteful, wasteful money, problematic, whatever. Anyways, like in a world of like, you know what, so you're wetting, do what you want. But at the same time, it's like, oh my gosh, this is crazy, like crazy business. So maybe what we should do, we could do it, so Paige and sororities in college, what you do when you're going through recruitment is, and Sam, I don't know if you did this too, but you'll do a pro con, con, pro. And like when you talk it, I know it's like the whole thing and it's weird. About people? Yes. I know. It's like really not okay. And I'm hoping that sororities fraternities don't exist by the time our children go to school because it's like the thought of my children going through this at all. That gives me extreme anxiety. And the fact that we're taught that it's okay, it's not okay. But the whole idea is like you start and you end on a good thing. So it's like, it's like a sandwich. Okay. Yeah, it's supposed to be the Oreo compliment, it's the cookie sandwich. Yeah. Yeah. Good, bad, good. Yeah. Yeah, it's what we do to our husbands. We're like, oh my gosh, thank you so much for taking out the trust, but you really need to do that thing. And then, oh my gosh. You're so cute. But yeah, you're so handsome. But maybe so we can do, I think we did enough doding on her. And maybe we address some of the problematic things in the room. Yeah. Where do we start? Okay. When I saw this morning, and again, I feel like my algorithm is definitely more like Google lied over her versus the problematic. But there was somebody there, somebody's dad was there that was very problematic. Did you see that? Someone from Ohio. Steven, what was it to me, Trio, is he the one with the attention center? Yeah. Huge. I didn't see that until this morning. Yeah, same. Yeah. So from what I gathered is Travis Kelsey's childhood friend, dad is who he was. And I actually, yeah, I agree, it's extremely problematic. I actually had this conversation with my husband this morning because I was like, did you see that this person, but he was like, no, I didn't see this person who was at the wedding. I definitely think it's a problematic choice. Definitely. Because it's like, yeah, it's their dad. But like, if your dad was Hitler, would he be at the wedding too? Like this is ridiculous. And I was seeing people like the, woo, yay, Taylor's side. We're like, all of the chiefs were there except for one. And they were talking about the kicker, right, who like talks about women. So supposedly everyone he's played with over the last 10 years was there except for him or maybe like his current teammates, I don't know. And again, I don't know if this is true, this is on my algorithm. But it was one of those things like, look, they cut him out because he's problematic. And it's like he's, he's spewing crazy propaganda about tradwives, but he's not overseeing an ice detention facility. So like, let's not keep flowers. Right. I also think that even is like, okay, this is your friend's dad. I talk about a cusp invite where you can definitely, the fringe. It's not your uncle, it's not your sister, your brother, like it's your friend's dad. So it's like, I was talking about this specifically because it's like, we invited some of our friends' parents to the weddings and, you know, there are people at our wedding that definitely have different views than us. But this person is in charge of people dying, a mass like a horrific time in American history right now. And I definitely think that that it's a no cut that from the list. Totally. Not that from the life. Cut that. Yes, that one. Like, use your billions of dollars to do whatever we need to do here, but like, I just think it's, I think at a time where she is being quiet, we know that every move she makes is strategic. I imagine if I was thinking about it, she probably didn't think his name would be the one that people were talking about. They're probably like, oh, is Blake there? Is Harry there? Right? Like, who are we talking about? We're talking about famous people. Not famous person, he's a quiet person. And yet people find out, right? Like, people are going to find out. I think that was a, yeah, that was not a, not a good move. Yeah, you can't excuse that one. What do you guys think about all the charity and the 26 million given, because I've seen a lot, that's all over my feet. I don't know if that's on yours, but like, both sides of the camp are like, people are like, oh my god, that's amazing. Like, how great. And then then the other side's like, that's just the PR stunt of it all to like, you shut the city down. People can't get on the subway. People can't get to work. Businesses are closed. Like, what are your thoughts there? I saw, I don't know, Katie, if you sent it, someone else shared it too, like this interesting thread about like billionaires and Taylor Swift of it all. And even her charitable donations, and it's this idea of like, these organizations wouldn't need to exist if we didn't have billionaires. Like if we had a world where everybody had like, their needs fulfilled and food and shelter and clothing and education and all of these things, right? And instead, there's these few like Taylor who have so much wealth that they get to choose who they bestow it upon, right? And it's like, we can look at it as charitable, but we can also look at it as incredibly problematic in the sense that like, no one person should have this much power to influence all the other people who should just have like access to what they need, right? So like, yes, great also, like great for the people who received it. But great for the organizations and the people that's going to impact also like pennies. This wedding probably costs more than that. I don't, I just think 26 million, it's like, when you're a billionaire, what is that? That's nothing. That's barely anything. For Travis, it's a lot. Travis contributed $12 to that, whatever. For Taylor, it's a ton of money or not a ton of money. I just think it's a PR play and it's not like, I don't know, I think it should have been a much, much bigger number if it were me. So I think I totally see all the points we're making. I think where I find trouble with the argument is saying in a world it even is a PR play. Like say, that is the world where it was all just so she would get good press on it. My thing is by lambasting her, what we are doing to the future, because like I agreed, the billionaire should not exist. That is a whole problem. There's no ethical billionaire, I agree with that argument. I think in the future, you are now preventing people from donating because they're like, I can donate 26 million and people are still going to talk shit about it. I think that's where I struggle a little bit is like, do we see how much money Bezos donated to the city of Venice? Exactly. Like, did he donate any money? I don't remember ever seeing anything and not to mention Venice is a sinking city that is incredibly hurt by global warming, which Amazon is massively contributing to. So that's just where I struggle is like, yeah, she could have donated a ton more, but I just think in criticizing her about this, we are going to stop future donations. I don't think so, though, because we criticize Taylor so much about literally everything and she keeps just doing it anyways. So it's like, I think like if you're that impacted by the critique, like you still have billions of dollars, right? It's like, if that's going to be the thing that keeps you from donating to people, that's a little, again, problematic to me. It's like, are you charitable for PR? Are you charitable because you're a charitable person and why do we, why do we have to be charitable to begin with? But I don't disagree with you. What I think is interesting is like, I'm not a Swiftie, right? But I remember working in a startup in Katie. I don't know how you felt about Netflix, but when I was working at a startup at the time, 15 years ago, however long ago, there were certain companies we would talk about, right? Like, you would talk about Amazon. You'd talk about Uber. You'd talk about these companies and their founders, and it's like really positive light. And like, everyone's trying to do what they did. This was like 15, 20 years ago, though, right? Like when it wasn't as, what it is today. But the difference is, I don't, like, there's not an entire group of people who are like Bayzozies or like, you know, Zuckerberg fans, right? Like they liked him, but like, it wasn't this whole group of people. The difference is Taylor didn't start a startup. Taylor was an artist, right? And she creates music. She has concerts and she creates experiences and community. And so I think that is where it gets really blurry and tricky for people because like, you fell in love with Taylor Swift when she was 16. She was a 16-year-old girl singing love songs, and that's why you love her and you've gone to her concert. And like, I was listening to, I knew it. I knew you this morning, whatever that song is. I was listening to that in the car, like, it's a good song. I listened to Taylor, and I am much more empathetic to Taylor because of how she made her money, I think. I think the question people have is like, now that she has, what is she doing with it? Right? It's like, I think the eye or for somebody like, Bayzoz is fair because it's like, he's not only a billionaire, he's exploiting people to get there, right? He's ruining communities, to get there. He's building his business off the box of people who have, aren't earning a living wage, right? In these poor conditions. I think there's a very big difference between a Bayzoz and a Taylor Swift. I just think inherently, there's a very big difference between those two billionaires. And there's no ethical billionaires. So like, what do we do about that, right? And so I think it's like, I think it's silly when people are like, Swifties are stupid, she's a billionaire. And it's like, but she's a billionaire in such a different way. Like, is she got there so differently than everyone else? Totally. And I think that is like a big conversation that comes through it because when we think about Bayzoz and Mark Zuckerberg, it's like, Amazon is ingrained so much into our daily lives, like, especially as mothers, right? Like we need something last second. It's hard to go shopping all the time when you have young kids. And Zuckerberg read it all. Like we're all on Instagram all the time. Like it's so ingrained in our life where like Taylor Swift, it's like you could stop listening to her music. You could choose not to attend the shows. And I think it's just like a very different obviously to your point business model. Yeah. Yeah. I also just like wrote down, it's like, there's a huge population of people that dislike Taylor Swift because they love our current, I say, leader very loosely with heavy air quotes over here. And it's like, can you just imagine all the negativity that was thrown towards her if it was just thrown towards the terrible men or like, Bayzoz? I mean, that's where I struggle because I agree with there is no ethical billionaire. But like you said it very eloquently page of like where she came from and how her money and her business is like influencing the economy in just like different ways versus Bayzoz. It's like, it's not, she's not just a billionaire. Like it's different and I don't know. I just struggle that I'm not putting my thoughts together clearly today. But I just I struggle with all of the negativity there. Like if we could put that towards some other things, I think it would go a lot farther. I will. I will say that was something I want to talk about that has actually pissed me off with her and the in the mega of it all. So I'm in case anybody missed it or hasn't seen. So in my view, okay, Thursday night, Friday morning on the white house account, there was a picture of Trump in the Ares tour poster. You know, like the Ares tour of American history, whatever, he has his main three slots, literally taking verbatim, her Ares tour, the shirt you are wearing and putting it to Trump. Yeah. And then I don't remember if it was Friday morning or pretty quick after that. He also made like an American history video using like the folklore ever more intro from the Ares tour, like the font, the forest, the whatever. First of all, how dare he though because that is my favorite album, like don't fuck with folklore. Okay. Literally. Don't go for the whimsy. Come on. Yeah. You know, while we're having the conversation, I don't think midnight should have won albums of the year because I think that totally cheapened the folklore 1989 and fearless of it all. Okay. Great. That's a separate conversation. Great. Yeah. But so that came out Thursday night Friday morning and immediately the internet was abuzz with this is how you know Taylor Swift is Maga. She's not speaking up about the Ares tour of it all, the intro. And I didn't really agree with that because I do think, you know, the Maga of it all has a very, very smart digital with it team. And I think by strategically posting the Thursday night, the Friday of her wedding, they knew it was going to take the liberal women to pit it against each other. They knew that it's like immediately a fight was going to break out. And I think they were capitalizing on that because they know we've talked about this like something we need to work on on, you know, the liberal side is not eating each other up and the Puritan politics of it all. So I think they need they start lit a match because they knew it would set the internet abuzz. And truthfully that day, I was like, you know, I don't expect her to speak out on this and say anything. It is her wedding day. Tree pain is probably running around the clock and everything PR in order for this wedding. And like it, you know, who if it's PR, if it's not, it's her wedding day, she's busy. I don't expect a statement. It has been days now. I think we should have gotten a statement by now. I know like he's used her music before in promos and she's been compared to like the Sabrina Carpenter's the liberal, Olivia Rodrigo's who said, do not use my music. And she has never spoken out when he has used it and that like always kind of run me the wrong way. But now that it's been days since he used the exact air restored, like especially the copyright lawsuit like Queen of it all, like we need something there. Well, I think like even if it's just from her team, like Camp Taylor, it doesn't have to come from Taylor Swift. Like you just got married. And like in all fairness, like I like to think about it this way. There's Taylor, the human being person getting married, like I don't even want my phone in my hand. So my wedding day. Right? Like that's not why I'm here. Then there's Taylor billionaire, massive team behind her lawyers, everybody. This video should have been taken down already, taken down. We should have like public comment about how that music should not be used. And I think this is my, this is my thing even going back to like the, if we critique her too much, she'll just stop donating kind of of it all. It's like Taylor has kind of positioned herself as this like, I do care. I'm a good person. I do care. Part of me is like girl and goat, like full send. You full send everything, full send it, like be the antithesis to what is happening over here with a baseless Zuckerberg, like speak up, like open your mouth, spend your money wisely. Donate your money. Talk about how there should be no billionaires. Give your money away. Like you want to be this like woman that we all look up to and admire and like look at as this like, I don't know, like fairy tale princess person, like be that then, like be that person instead of what, like everybody's like let her protect her piece. I'm like, no, you don't get fucking piece when you're a billionaire. I'm like, you don't get to have peace when the rest of us don't. And so it's like to your point, Katie, it's like, you don't get to have peace on your wedding day when Donald Trump is using your music in a white house post. Like you don't get that, or at least your team doesn't get that, like somebody's working and somebody's fixing it. And I don't know. I just, I just think this. This is another thing where it's like I have grace for the human being where it's like it's your wedding day. And then there's the business of Taylor Swift and it's a massive business. And so I just, yeah, I think like if she, I think about a base dose, I think about Zuckerberg being at the inauguration, like being in it. Like Zuckerberg went all the way, he's like I'm going on the bro podcast, I'm toot in his horn, I'm going hard here. She could do the like complete opposite of that and she doesn't and I think that's the biggest bummer of it all because she has this huge opportunity to be the person that you look at and be like, okay, like she got to that position and then she did something different with it, right? And I, it's not too late, she's 35 years, 36 years, like she can, she can change. But I think like this wedding is just one of those things where it's like it brings to the forefront. I think everything people feel about her. There's like Taylor, the artist and it's like is she tacky, is she classy? What is she? Things tacky and classy and it's pure Taylor Swift, like there's that conversation. And then there's that like Taylor Swift billionaire of it all. And it's like those, you can't have one conversation without the other anymore. Yes, I do agree with all of you, all of us, of like she has more than enough money to get those videos taken down. She has more than enough people working for her that she doesn't have to come out and say anything, those should be taken down. I think it's hard when it, with the speaking up, I don't know how much, like I always hear that side of it too, like how much of it is a safety issue, like knowing that like she's canceled shows for like terrorist attacks, right? And like threats. And there's, I think there's so much that maybe does go on the go on in the background that we don't know with billionaires that might keep her from being silent. But then I say that. And then she has the Miss Americana documentary where she was very outwardly against, you know, Republicans and she said it all there so she could have kept going, but something stopped her. And that's what's, what's interesting. I think the safety thing is a concern when you're on tour for sure, but she's not on tour. Yeah, right now. But her husband also is playing games at different stadiums. Like they agree. I agree. Yeah, I agree. But I think there's the same thing about like the president has the secret service, right? Like there's like, you can build, she has more money than the United States basically. Like she could build her own secret service to be at every game that Travis plays and every concert she's at. And it's like, that is, she's got that money. She's got that kind of money to be able to do that. Yeah, I hear what you're saying. I think like it's fair to protect people and to like think about people's safety and unfortunately we live in a world where there's not safety at a school or a movie theater or anywhere, right? Like so it's like, I don't know. Like it's, it's tricky. Yeah, it's tricky. But I think like the wedding is just this, I'm really interested to see what they do now. Like if they start to trickle out photos, if they trickle out, like pictures that then, like if that stays private or if it actually, I don't know what do you guys think, do you think it's actually going to come out? I saw it. I'm sorry. Oh, sorry. I saw a video that said it was someone like speculating that they think there's going to be a documentary of it all. I was like, can you imagine, but she has done a lot with Disney. And when you're setting up that much production, like I don't know, maybe there's like a documentary of her life or something or the season of her life and we see the inside. You know what it would be though. I feel like it would be a documentary of like how they made the wedding. And then at the second they start saying there's their vows would just like fade to black and you don't see anything. Well, that's the thing is like, I feel like before the wedding started, like the thought of there being a documentary to me was a huge eye roll. I was like, come on, girlfriend, like it's your wedding. You have one day where you're not like filming for cameras. But then honestly, once everything started, I was like, I need the content just from like the wedding perspectives. Like, I don't know about you guys. But remember all those like shows in like the 2000s on like TLC, like the four weddings where they were like competing and it's like, that's what we have to say as to the dress. Like, I ate that content up. So like, I would love to see a behind the scenes of like all the event as just the event. Yes. I saw a tweet or something or maybe on threads and it was like, hey everyone, we are going to hate the dress. Just prepare yourself. Like, you're not going to like the dress always. Always. And it's like, but it's like we may never ever see the dress. Who knows? I mean, I think we will. I think we will see everything. I think we have everything. I think it'll either be like a collab post with her Travis. I think it'll be maybe with Dior because Dior designed everything. But can we go back really quick? Like there, I just wanted to talk about something before we completely moved on because in talking about how she is no longer political where she was on this Americana. I also wonder how much of it is influenced by her relationship with Travis and Travis's surroundings because I don't believe Travis's MAGA. I think everybody accusing Travis of being MAGA. I don't think that is in line with like choices he has made outside of like, yes, he did the Pfizer commercial, but he was also one of the first to nail with Colin Kaepernick. Like, I think he, if I had to put money on it and like the Kylie Kelsey of it all, like, you know, I do think he is not MAGA at all. That being said in his business, he is surrounded by heavily MAGA people. Like for instance, Patrick Mahomes, it's essential that a Titan and a quarterback have a really good relationship to be successful. And, you know, I think him and the homes are best friends for partially that reason. And it's like when you're surrounded by so much MAGA and she's in Kansas City all the time. I wonder if she feels like she can, it's like, I don't know, she doesn't want to ruffle any feathers. I am also a believer that like, I know there's a lot of people who are like, cut them off. Like, cut everybody off if they are this, cut them off. I'm not a believer that that does anything for us long term to like, cut everybody off. Like, I think you have to decide like, am I going to go out and seek new friends who like have completely different political beliefs than me and bring them into my life? No, probably not. Only members, friends I've had my whole life, partners of my friends, because I think a lot of women have that where it's like me, my girl or great, her husband, not so much, not so much him, right? Am I cutting them off? No. Am I very outspoken when I'm with them? Yes. Do I have lots of conversations with them? Yes. Do we have discussions? Yes. I think there's this world in which it's like, that's actually how you move the needle, right? Like that is actually how you move the needle. And there was once upon a time, which we all forget, because we were like children, where you didn't cut someone off because they were Republican. Like, you might not agree. I remember one of my parents saying the first time that when Trump was to buy it in, they're Republican, but they're like, I'm like, yeah, he lost. Like, that was it. Like, he lost. This is how elections go sometimes to you and sometimes to you lose. Like, it is what it is. I hope we get good things out of this administration. Like, this is where we're at, right? Like, it doesn't have to be so polarizing the way that it is right, like right now, it is incredibly polarizing as it should be, because he's incredibly problematic and there's horrific things going on. But like, you don't need to cut off Patrick Mahomes. The question is like, what do you gain from bridging that divide? Like, what happens there? What are you doing with that relationship? How are you building off of that relationship? Like, we have to have some space for that. Now the guy who owns the ICE detention centers, no space for that. We have no space for that. No space. No space. We have space for maybe a Patrick Mahomes. Like, what does that look like? How do we have those conversations? What does the friendship do? Does it change the way Patrick Mahomes? Does it not? Does it change the way Taylor behaves? Who knows? Right? Like, it could go both ways. But I just think, like, we need to have a little bit of room for that nuance. I totally agree. And I feel like I've made content about this a few times because I used to be in political advertising. And it's like, you put your money towards the people who maybe have gone back and forth who only vote in the presidential, don't vote in the midterms because it's like, there is so much room for nuance and conversation when you sit down with somebody because I also think these elections are so full of misinformation that we are arguing about things that aren't even real and are like totally different perspectives. So if you sit down and you're like, hey, like, why did you vote for him? Like, what are the things you really, really care about? Because I'm sure within the things you really care about, I also have agreeance of what I care about. So why don't we like see that commonality and from there have conversations around the nuance of it. So I agree about not cutting off Patrick Mom's is tough because I'm like, I think the election is like, hey, the economy. That's what people care about most. I'm like, he got a lot of money. So it's like, you know, but I do feel like that whole Kansas City chief's team is a lot of a lot of mega. Yeah, you got to come at it from a place of curiosity and not judgment or shame. Like you were saying page to really move the needle. Like I kept thinking when you were talking page about like, remember back in 2008 when we had Obama and McCain and just like how respectful like they were at debates, like, I don't know if you guys remember any of those clips and stuff and just how different it is now. Like you said of like, even just being friends, like people are like, no, my grandmother or my mom or da, da, da, da, da, and it's like, I get that. There are some very traumatic and hurtful things that can be said, but I do think being in the same rooms as these people and having conversations that create curiosity can go really, really far. Yeah. And there's an asterisk here. Like people who dehumanize people totally, like asterisk asked, like all the things like ice detention center guy out there, there are, there are those people. And then I think there are the people that most of us know, which is like, well, financially, like I voted this way because I thought it would stretch my dollar or whatever it is, right? I think there's like, we, we hacked out those conversations and we've talked about this, the three of us offline a lot, which is like, we create content, we know how algorithms work. We are in silos, right? Sam is seeing the Goo Goo Gaga Taylor Swift got married to love her algo. That's not what I'm seeing. That is also how the world works. And so if we actually want to have these conversations about Taylor Swift and about what's going on. And it's like having that conversation with the mom you hang out with or like your neighbor or your sister's husband, whatever. Those conversations in real life are so much more impactful than what we're seeing online. I always, I've said this to you guys before, but like if I didn't exist on the internet, would I know this and would I care? And would I have this perspective, right? And like if I ask myself that often enough, sometimes the answer's like no, right? So we'll talk to the people in your life. What do you care what are your values? Like how do you feel? And this kind of loops it back to Taylor Swift, which is this idea that like, I don't shame anybody who's a Swift, I am not a Swiftie, but I can enjoy her music. I can get on board for the fun. I can also get on board for the hate. But I don't shame anybody who really likes it because it's like she is an artist. She creates music. She brings a lot of value to people's lives in certain ways. She is meaningful to people. And so of course, they're bought into her wedding. Like of course, there's this parasocial thing. And so it's just that Taylor Swift is not black and white. She's just like, she's transcended so much of what we know of like pop culture and celebrity. She's much bigger than that at this point. - Yeah, and I think speaking to the trans and transundation, I don't know what I don't know the right word for that is. - I feel like that's why even when I say I'm a Swiftie, it's like I think I'm supposed to say I'm a Swiftie because I very much enjoy your music and I've been to her tours. But since she has become a billionaire and the whole business side of it, like I don't defend her for everything. I don't think she's a perfect human being. I think there is a lot of nuance to her as a person and to her business. And but just even speaking to your point of the algo, I think one of the reasons I got so frustrated with everybody being so critical of her wedding and everything this weekend is, yes, I was seeing that. But then the next video down, I was seeing white supremacists march on my city, ride my metro. And I'm like, why are we putting so much heat towards Taylor Swift when there are little white supremacists marching in my city right now? Like out and about, proud, dehumanizing people around them. And I was like, that is something to be very angry about. And it was just like just going between that and Taylor Swift. I was just like, can we take a break from calling her wedding tacky and bring attention to the actual horrific things that are happening in this very moment as well? Yes, yeah. Yes. I feel like that was something like we kind of tried it about earlier, right? Where it's like, yeah, people would take all of it, right? She does deserve some hate and some questioning and some things. But if we could take that and put it towards some other things, like you just said, Katie, I think that could be very helpful. But it's also at the end of the day, I think. I was talking to friends about this this morning at Drop-Off. I still go back and forth about everything. Is there a relationship of the art relationship? Is it not? Like everybody's bread, Evelyn Hugo at this point. I'm like, is there going to be a thousand-hage-funk? I mean, have you been on the algo of like the gala of it all? That's Carly Claw. Carly Claw? So I wanted to add an agron, oh, Diana Agron. Oh yeah, I heard like original, that's supposed to be like her original OG gala relationship. Did it go from Glee, right? Oh yes. Wendy. Yes. Well, Carly Claw, I've seen a couple things. You guys have to fill me in because I was off my phone this weekend. It was the fourth of July. Kids were home. Okay. Don't make me feel like a loser face. Sorry, guys. I saw something about the Carly Claw. And then they're like, she's wearing gold and Taylor talks about like gold. Okay, right. But then I saw something that said Carly Claw's fake detending. She didn't actually-- That's not a tent. Yeah. And I was like, what? And so I was like, she didn't actually go to the wedding. She just looked like she was going to the wedding. And I'm like, I cannot keep track. And I never really understood it to begin with. Also, one side note, I was texting you guys because one of my friends was like, why is Jake Paul at the wedding? Page. The way I screamed. Page text me and goes, why is Jake Paul at the wedding? And I looked at him and it was Cooper Cup. Also like, who's Cooper Cup? I don't know who Cooper Cup is. I do. I know who Cooper Cup is. Who is he? Who is he? Yeah. And he's good too. But yeah, I think in the pictures, he had like the blonde hair was getting Jake Paul. He looks just like Jake Paul in that photo. And then I was like, why is Jake? Once I saw that, I was like, I'm off the train. I'm mad now. Like, get me out of here. Jake Paul is like, I miss this. I don't like him. And then it turned out to be some random football player who looks just like Jake Paul in that photo at least. I don't know like forward facing with that photo. But wait, explain the Carly class of it all to me. Do you think she attended? Yeah. Okay, this is like a whole another podcast episode. And it's also like one of those things where it's like, I want to toe the line, right? Like you never want to accuse somebody of having a certain sexuality, but I will fill you in on the context of it all because probably every six months I spiral down the, the gala or algo. It's always in the back of my algo, just ready to pop up every now and then to remind me. So the whole idea is that this is a lavender marriage, lavender relationship and that. So during the 1989 era, she was out of these. They were besties and she was dating Calvin Harris, dating Calvin Harris. And but was besties with Carly Clause. They were seeing everywhere together very close, they looked like they had a very like intimate relationship. Both like as female friendships are, but like also physically intimate. Like they took this trip to like Big Sur and I don't know, it was giving like, it was giving relationship like a really it really was and there's a theory that a lot of songs unlike 1989 and following reputation albums were actually written about Carly Clause. And because they kind of out of nowhere just stopped hanging out, stopped talking. And so there is a theory, her and Carly had a very long term relationship. Carly was like, there's also a video of them questioning the kissing at a concert. Have you seen that? Look that out. Yeah. Girls in their 20s. No. Like that out of the ordinary. So 100% where it's like, if you line up the evidence, because there's also Sam, you went to the erasure Lavender Hayes, her song like obviously Lavender for many is a euphonism. And the imagery during the Lavender Hayes song. So they're on the stage and there are these clouds and there are ladders going into the clouds. That is like the set up for the Lavender Hayes performance. And people like look that up and we're researching the imagery and it turns out it's a tie to a magazine. And like mind you if I get any of these small details wrong, I haven't been on the out go in a few months. But it was from like the first female I want to say like outwardly lesbian magazine. That was the cover was these ladders going into these clouds. And it's hard because you're like one of these, you know, one side of you is like, this is a reach. People are crazy. But on the other side is like Taylor Swift loves her Easter egg. So it's like at the end of the day. And there's also like the rumors that Travis and his best friend Ross are together because of like, there's this video of like Ross having like a rose on his like watching Travis. But I don't know. So it's like, there's also theories that I think TK just face it it like I said, this is a whole in their podcast episode, like I don't know if you guys know TK and Sara like OG Braze Anatomy, like once at a concert they openly were like Taylor's relationship is like not true. Like she is, yeah, that's on her sexuality. Um, okay, wait, hold on going back to my question. Do you think Curly Coss went to the wedding? I think there were scenes of her leaving, I think that's what I saw. I think this is the thing about Swifties, the fact that any of this exists like what you just were telling me, right? I, that I think is what people are like, wow, like that's a lot of time and energy. Hey, guys, I don't feel crazy. Like the fact that I know this all and I'm on this album, like I feel clinically insane whenever I get there. I'm pissed about this. Like honestly, no, because I'm embarrassed, like you know, like go, I've been trying to get through thrown of glass for a year, go read a book, like literally go for a book, read a book. Like to me, me to me. Go read. But this kind of gives like it's giving, like alternate reality. Like it's giving, I don't know. I feel like you get lost in it. You get lost in her life and feel like it's something else to focus on when life gets a little hard. At least tell myself that. We all have our vices in a sense, right? So like I think this is the other thing about the whole Taylor thing and even when we're talking about base, I was right, it's like the Amazon of it all. Like I think the trickiest thing about say like meta or Amazon is you almost can't escape them, right? Like so like if you go on a small business website and it's run by AWS, like that's Amazon and you don't even know it, right? Like you don't even know. You can't escape it. You buy something on a small business website but they ship with Amazon and you like just get it from Amazon, right? So like there's, there's that, right? People yelling at Taylor Swift on Instagram. People yelling at Taylor Swift on Instagram, like you're on meta. I think that is how I feel about Taylor. It's like we all have the things that are like our non-negotiables. Like I will not sit like I am not supporting. I will never listen to a Chris Brown song anymore, right? Like I'm just that, he's not a billionaire but like I'm just not listening. to that. I'm not going to tell you I'm never going to buy something on Amazon, or interact with Amazon. I do, and it's hard not to. I think we have to have some ability to see people as people. And this is why I say the thing, if I was offline, if I was not online, would I be as crude into the Taylor Swift billionaire of it all, or would I hear her songline the radio? And that's all I would think about. If I was offline, would I know, I remember when the target boycott was happening, I mentioned it to somebody and somebody was like, wait, what? What's happening? They had no idea. They're like, oh, I don't have Instagram. They had no, in social media. They're like, I had no idea. So I love social media for that because we have more information and we can make choices that feel good for us. But I think it isn't helpful to be like throwing stones at everybody left and right and being like, you like Taylor. So like, you're stupid. And it's like you got like Amazon. So you're like, I think we just have to like, we are all just the people living underneath like this. They want us like this because the more divided we are on these small topics, the less we can bond together and rise up to make it so billionaires aren't even a thing. Like that's the whole point. That's why they want skinny back. That's why they want drama because they want women to be so preoccupied with arguing with each other about Taylor Swift that they will not pay attention to voting rights. And like, that's it at the end of the day. >> Yeah, Mike drop. I mean, I do have to also say I do wonder if Taylor would speak out more if any candidate she has ever endorsed one. Because I think that's also something we don't talk about. Like she openly endorsed Kamala. She openly endorsed that was in a representative from Tennessee. I don't remember if it was. >> Yeah, I don't think we need an endorsement. I think what people want to see from her is taking a stance on issues and like fighting against those issues. Or she has billions of dollars where she could put that money behind getting people out of ice detention centers instead of having people who run them at her wedding, right? So like also, yeah, that's how I think about her being like, if I were to dream up the perfect version, it's like she's using her money to support people who need it. She's using her money to fight against the things that are awful about what's going on. And to support the things that we want to happen. As opposed to like, I don't give a shit about an endorsement really. Like I don't actually give it, like I care more about like, what is your action? Like what are you actually doing that can move the needle, that can help people, that can change people's lives? I genuinely don't know that like me saying like, I'm voting for this person. Make someone else vote for them. But if I say like, I'm working really hard because this person is funding our public schools. I know your kid went to public school. My kid goes to public school. Like I want them to have a great education. That's like a different, that's a different thing. And I think like, that's what I would love to see from someone like her is like pushing back against what's happening, not necessarily supporting a candidate. I mean, I agree with you. But I think my problem is is like, if we expect that from her, we need to expect it from every other billionaire out there. We need my right. I agree to stand up. I don't agree with that. F.R. Rinald stands for nobody's ever asked that. That's all I think about. Talk about an endorsement that has no name for her. But like, does anybody have it? Can I finish my thought really? Like, so I think, because you know, ADHD and brain, if we leave it, I never come back to it. So my thing is if we have that expectation for her, we need to have them for every billionaire out there, which, first of all, is never going to happen. And set of all, I don't think is going to move the needle at all. You can yell at her. You like, I think what we need to do is take all of this anger and conversation and use it to vote for things that are going to make it. So it does not matter what she supports because we are already creating these systems and these nets that supply everybody so that the business is in New York and whatnot. And I think it's just like, yes, but I think guess what everybody is saying? She needs, like, she should be more accountable. And but realistically, it's never, like, no billionaires are never going to do that. So what action can we take? So that, honestly, it doesn't fucking matter what she stands for because it's, you know, it's like, and it's also so funny to me, because I think so many people are like, there's the shut up and dribble of it all. But then there's like, the Taylor Swift stand up and tell me everything you believe in of it all. So I just think vote vote vote vote vote like, what can, what actual action can we do? Because she, I mean, she put, I'm sorry, I'm just laughing at Katie's sports and Alex. I don't. I'm just such a sports girl. I have very forced ones on. But like with her endorsement, it was like a one single image feed post, right? Childless cat lady, her, that image. But we know how much influence she has. I know we've talked about this offline before where it's like, did it even matter that she endorsed because the candidate never won. But also, I think she can do so much more because we know how much influence she has. Like, you saw Katie just go in a 30 minute rant about a ladder into a cloud. Like, and, and think about the, the true, not to say you're not a true Swiftie. I don't know if you take offense to that. But like, the people that like, whatever she says or does, like they're gonna do, you know, like she does have an insane influence where if she did speak up more about like you were talking about page like the policies and things that matter versus just like a one feed post of like, I'm a childless cat lady and here's who I'm voting for, I think there would be a difference. Um, I do think there was something, because I listened to a whole podcast on Taylor Swift and the politics of it all. And I think they did say that when she told people to register to vote, voter registration skyrocketed. So like, I think that is something, right? We're like, you do move the needle. There is influence. You're not telling people who to vote for or what to vote, but like get them to register, get the vote out, right? Like, let's do it. TV, baby. Yeah. I'm warning so much slang these days. I'm warning about Taylor. I'm warning about get out the vote. I got both. Get you a girl. You're well-rounded. Katie's well-rounded. Also, like just, we said we were going to talk for 30 minutes. It has been an entire hour. I knew this was going to happen. And we could keep going. I said 20 to 30 minutes stuff. You knew that was going to happen. That was never, that was never even a remote possibility of happening. Well, I know, I am laughing, though, because I do remember when she threw on all those extra areas tour shows at the end, they all happen to be not all of them. Most of them happen to be in swing states. And so people are like, it's all because she's going to try to help get out the vote. And like, that's why she's doing it. It just makes me laugh because it's like, no, no, no, she didn't do it. So to summarize, summarize. Wedding may have been tacky. TBD. I just don't like that word, to be honest. Okay. Now, tacky, um, uh, whimsical. I think because I think that word tacky is so judgmental. And it's like to me, it's like, okay, show me all your wedding pictures. Show me the Mason jars that were on the table. Okay. Mason jars. Guilty with lace and burlap. Exactly. So I'm like, I 2016, baby. Yeah. Yes. Yeah. It's like, I had a light-ups LED sign. Am I wedding, which I'm, you know, non-negletters? Yeah. Yeah. It said, um, it said, Matt found his beach. Oh, cute. To this cute, candy. I mean, the brand is cute, but like, you know, the, you know, the, I had a, a balloon arch. Okay. You were a brand. You were a brand. And Taylor's a brand. But I just, I just think I hate the word tacky because it's like, listen, it's so judgmental. And if you're gonna stand there and call her to wedding tacky, put all your wedding pictures on the internet right now and let us all judge them. Okay. So what is the word you want to use to describe what this was? Over the top. It's like Disneyland land. It's like the wedding. It's Disneyland wedding. Oh, TT over the top. Over the top. Okay. Over the top. Over the top. Over the top wedding. Crazy guest list. Crazy guest list. Problematic billionaire behavior and attendees. And something to talk about on a Monday morning or on the water cooler, you know, like, I mean, yeah, because it's at the end that, like, if you take all the problematic things out of it, which is, I mean, hard to do obviously, but if you take all the problematic things out of it and you just have a woman who's getting married with a billion dollars, you know, who to say? It's just fun. Yeah. She's just being a girl. She's just having her jamming. She's just, she's just, she's just jogging out. She's just being a jug. Okay. All right. Well, we have a lot more to say. I know that we could probably do 20 tangent episodes off of this, but we got to go. Oh, and PS, we're not editing this. So forgive us for our stumbles. Yeah. This is it. But you get just free. I'm just going to say forgive us for our sins. And that's you. I mean, me, especially after that gale or ramp. Oh gosh. All right. All right. Okay. Bye. Thank you so much for listening to the Just Us Girls podcast. We are so grateful that you chose to spend time with us today. If you love this episode, be sure to follow like subscribe, wherever you listen to podcasts and don't forget to rate and review as well. We would appreciate it so, so much coming out with us on Instagram at the Just Us Girls pod. And you can also find us on substack at the Just Us Girls pod dot substack dot com. Where we share even more from each episode, a little behind the scenes and all the good stuff you don't want to miss. We can't wait to chat with you next week. Bye!