92. Een kijkje in de keuken bij Waimakers: Eigen operating system - Met Guido Steenbergen

This is the Lockdown podcast network celebrating 10 years of your team every day. Hey sports fans, it's JD, the host of Lockdown Cardinals, and did you know with the Discover Cashback Card, it's payback time when you earn cashback on everyday purchases. Activate and earn 5% cashback in different categories each quarter on up to $1,500 in purchases. That's 5% cashback at different places each quarter, like grocery stores, on gas and at restaurants. It pays to discover, terms apply, see discover dot com slash 5 for details. Hi friend, it's your inner child going, and they want churros. Is Walker Kessler ready to make a leap into the NBA's upper crust? Or at least upper crust adjacent? Some people think so, tell you who next. You are Lockdown Lakers. You are daily Los Angeles Lakers podcast, part of the Lockdown podcast network. Your team every day. Thanks everybody for stopping by Lockdown Lakers, Brian Kiminetski, Andy Kiminetski. I want to let you know that today's episode is brought to you by Square right now. You can get up to $200 off, square hardware at square dot com slash go slash NBA. Run your business smarter with square, get started today. We're getting a training camp open next week, media day is Monday, Rob and JJ Reddick are speaking to the media on Thursday, so we're getting close to the season, Andy, and that means NBA Ranked Time project you and I used to be involved in with the ranking of players, a something we never really liked doing, but excuse me though, we are, though, we should let it be known in case David Locke is listening because Lockdown NBA, we have our own top 100 and I have been incredibly enthusiastic as being a part of this project. Lockdown NBA, by the way, is the channel is doing a series leading up to the official launch or release of our top 100 unless it's been released and I'm just not aware. I'm pretty sure that this is the lead up, there's going to be daily shows breaking down and debating one through 10, 11 through 20, 21 through 30, etc. I am, by the way, going to be on Wednesday and Friday shows, which will be on the locked on NBA channel and I will make sure that they are a part of our feed as well on Lockdown Lakers. So, again, just in case David's listening, rankings are the best thing ever. Yeah, I still think they're stupid. I don't care who knows. All right. So, I guess now we'll find out if people can tell us apart. So ESPN is Brian David. There was Brian put out their NBA rank to do it every year. We haven't gotten to Reeves or Luca who are presumably somewhere in the, they do it in three sections, 50 to 149 to 11 and then, you know, 10 to 1. And you know, Luca's going to be somewhere in that 10 to 1 group. Reeves is going to be somewhere in the 11 to 49 group and Walker Kessler Andy. He had surprised maybe it's not. Walker Kessler came in at 73, which I guess would be a surprise to some. It wasn't surprised to me in all honesty. He was 98 last year for ESPN. The breakdown, this was done by a bunch of different NBA writers for the network at ESPN. But from Dave McMahon, quote, "Kessler's fit a potential fit alongside Luca Dantich has emvolting 25 spots on the NBA rank list despite just playing five games last season," then talked about obviously what the Lakers paid both in salary and in picks to bring him in. But then said, "Banking on him to anchor a defense while providing Dantich, an ideal lob partner, this signature stat provided by ESPN Kessler has averaged 2.4 blocks in his career, 2nd most since entering the NBA in 2023, trailing just Victor Women Yama. His fantasy projection, 11 and a half points, 12.4 rebounds, 2.6 blocks. I think the points could be a little bit higher than that, but that actually feels low to me. It's right in his career average, which for me feels low." Well, either way, the 12.4 rebounds and the 2.6 blocks are pretty awesome as a concept. 73 surprised me, given just the backstory of five games last year never played for a team that's mattered or even trying to win. Not even arguing against 73 as much as I'm just surprised, like as an example, I talked about the lockdown networks, upcoming top 100 rankings. I had Kessler at 100, and that felt to me a bit like calling my shot, just in terms of how I think Kessler will be perceived or is perceived, perhaps incorrectly, by the end of a season on a team that, "A, I think will be good. B, Kessler will fit well with and C is going to get a lot of attention." But it was a pleasant surprise to me to see him at 73, and if nothing else got me thinking about maybe some of the possibilities that even as somebody who liked this trade and did not have an issue with what the Lakers gave up in contract or picks, maybe I am underrating a little bit of what he can do or just hedging it a little bit too much based on that backstory. Yeah, I wasn't super surprised and looking at it, and I've been pretty bullish on the prospects of Kessler in the lineup this year. One sort of getting through the analysis of did they give up too much, was at the right price, seeing how the rest of the summer shook out. For the actual player, I've been actually pretty optimistic about it. Just like kind of look at it too, maybe you look at the guys who are around him in the rankings. John Morant, which is kind of crazy when you consider where he was a couple of years ago, but has had a rough couple of seasons. Dylan Brooks is 76, Kason Wallace is 75, Isaiah Hartenstein, a center, which is an interesting comp, is at 74, you mentioned Kessler at 73, VJ Edgecomb, 72, Tyler Hero, 71, Peyton Critchard, 70. Those are three or four players on either side of Kessler, and I'm not like it's crazy to put him in a group with those guys. When you compare, it's a little speculative, I can understand that just because he didn't especially because he didn't play last year. I think two things, first, the production that he's shown is kind of comparable to being that level, particularly as a center, and particularly I think the group at ESPN is really pricing the defensive metrics that Kessler puts up, including the blocks and the rates around the rim and defending and all that kind of stuff, which have been since he showed up in the league routinely elite. I think that's what's getting a lot of the attention to the same way, by the way, that somebody like Isaiah Hartenstein, who's not a big scoring player himself, is right behind him at 74. Yeah, I want to get into maybe a little bit more during the show about some of the guys grouped around Kessler for ESPN and just what else it speaks to, but you mentioned some of those defensive stats, ESPN also has a piece about one big stat for each team and the one chosen from Zach Kram, for the Lakers, was 54.6% and that was what teams are shooting at the rim around in the restricted area when he's the closest defender, which is third over the course of his career behind Chet Hongram and Wemanyama among players with at least 500 shots defended. Kram went on to say, quote, he'll need to play like Rudy Gaubert, who has been such a stout backline defender throughout his career, that he has allowed his teams to get away with playing offense first players and other positions. Incidentally, Gaubert's career rim protection number per genius IQ is very close to Kessler's 54.1%, also incidentally he mentions that there's the connection between Kessler and Gaubert, not just that Kessler and Gaubert both played for the jazz, but Gaubert was traded for the pick that came Walker Kessler. But the stat from Zach Kram, beyond just potentially boating very well for Kessler's effect for the Lakers defensively, it harps back to remember a couple weeks ago. I talked about some of the stats that I did digging comparing Walker Kessler's last full season 24/25, some of those defensive metrics per synergy, and I compared them to Wembe's last year when he won defensive player of the year, and to be clear, Wembe's are better because Wembe is a better player, but Kessler's are very comparable in a lot of areas. I want to carry this conversation through in the next segment because I think there are a couple of things going on here, and like you said too, the points per game thing feels kind of light even potentially for what Kessler could produce, and in addition, you found another little nugget buried in a John Hollinger piece about ways in which Kessler actually does fit in nicely to what the Lakers are going to do offensively, even though he is not a guy with a deep bag at least by reputation, so we'll get into all of those things next. What the Lakers is brought to you by Wayfair back to school football season, or just the change of seasons, can be a good excuse to refresh your space. Wayfair helps you create a home that stands up to real life with quality products, great value, and trusted reviews. 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Look, we all know you're getting the weekend, you're looking for those things, you're watching for your fantasy team, your favorite team, whatever it might be, how do you make the weekend that much better by getting those extra rewards, FanDuel giving fans something to check in every week, the Rewards Club exclusive offers, exclusive surprises, it's worth opening the app just to see what's waiting for you. Make this your most rewarding season ever with FanDuel, go to FanDuel.com to get started. No bowhoes means I don't, I assume that it is short for Bohemian, but I don't know. I thought that was the bow part, but I wasn't sure about the whole part, maybe somebody can feel it. Easy, phrasing, but it could be, it could be both. I just came from New York though, it's short for Bohemian, no, very good, good congratulations, so I hate all this, locked on fashion, yeah, I don't like interior design, I don't like this sort of, because I get nervous, Andy, when a player that I'm kind of like, oh, I think this could work really well, suddenly everybody starts agreeing with me, like I'm seeing data here, you know, John Hollinger chiming in there, and he's 73 on the top 100. And I think people might say 73 that doesn't sound like a big deal, like you got to be a really good NBA player at the top of the top. You're a top 75 player in the league, you are really, there's like five to 600 players, and let me do the math really quick. There's 15 players on an NBA roster times 30, 30 times, that's 15, yeah, it's 450 players in the league, plus ones that go in and out, yeah, we're talking close to 500 players in the league, but even if you want to say 450, if you're in the top 75 that puts you in what, like the top 6th in the league, something like that, you're really good. You start getting up in there and like, you know, the players, if we get to the Austin Reeves part of this, who again, wasn't in the top, you know, he's somewhere in the top 50 and we'll see where, like the, you know, the 100th player on this list is Lou Dort. I think most people who consider Lou Dort be a pretty good player, Josh Hart, you know, has become a really valuable, you know, I wouldn't even, I mean, yes, a role starter on a next team that just want to championship, right, but like a role player, but like that sort of diminishes, I think, what he does, like, and so he was 89th. So to be 73rd on this list indicates people already think you're a really good player. And so I just start to get nervous because I'm like looking at this going like, huh, an awful lot of people seem to agree, you know, am I overly exuberant? Am I, you know, am I, am I getting too excited about this, something and leaving myself open to let down, but I keep coming back to this, Andy, now I'll let you deliver the stat here in a second because I think it makes me even more pleased at how Kessler could fit in. Most of what he does, he doesn't have to do any differently with the Lakers. This is not a situation, you know, I saw, you know, Caleb Wilson and I saw Booser and the Bansa and some of these, you know, all these, you know, the rookies that are coming in, like that's projection for these guys, like they're going to be top 100 players and they might be in, you know, I hope they are, but you're doing some projecting here. These guys have never done it and you don't have to do that with Kessler. The numbers are what they are, his defensive statistics are what they are. It is admittedly harder to do it on a team where the games matter, but the flip side of that is you are also getting much more structure and are surrounded by players in a program that are actually trying to win games and so some of that pressure is mitigated by a much better support system and oh, by the way, he's got Luca Doncic feeding the ball who has made very pedestrian centers look very, very good, which is why I know you and I both think that 11.2 or whatever they put out, the fantasy projection feels kind of low and so I just, if people are asking of Kessler, we need you to make a little bit of a leap and we think you can and that's why we're, but I don't really think that's even part of it. It's just take what you've done in Utah particularly defensively and show that you can do it with the, you know, with the Lakers and I don't see why it wouldn't work. Well, I don't see any reason why it won't work. I disagree that it doesn't have to do anything better. It's going to be harder doing it on a team like this that opponents are going to be more geared up to play against. I mean, we've, we've talked about this. The effect of playing against the Lakers for opponents is real. Teams, I mean, whether you're talking about the eyeball test or the way players themselves have conceded, they get up for playing against the Lakers. Like that piece of it, he's going to have to, you know, show that he can handle this type of spotlight, this type of scrutiny, like that is a real thing for players to adjust to. You know, there's certain areas like Tony Jones and David Locke have both talked about and needs to become better screener. I think he needs to become a bit better of it, you know, he's not a bad defensive rebound or running stretch. He's good. I think the Lakers will likely need him to be even better than that. And again, I just need to see him do this on a regular basis in this setting. But I don't, so in that sense, there is an element of projection going on simply because this piece of him hasn't been done. That being said though, what people see in Walker Kessler is not pure projection. There's a difference as opposed to saying that Caleb Wilson, for example, is like already the 87th best player in the league and I'm just making up that number. I don't even know. It was somewhere in that neighborhood. It was. - Projection, because Caleb Wilson has never played an NBA game. With Kessler, it's a contextual projection, not a pure projection, there's a difference. - And what you're talking about, I will split hairs just a little bit here. I think what you're talking about, getting better, becoming a better screener, improving his defensive rebounding and all that kind of something because rebounding numbers look really good, but he is an elite offensive rebounder. - He's incredible. - Which, by the way, he's really handy and it is a skill set and all that. - Yes, it does. - But it is, what you're talking about is the type of thing if the scoring average goes up a little bit, the screening goes up, the defensive rebounding, some of those other things. That actually I think takes and elevates him from 75 into the top 50, because now you're talking about a guy who's averaging 15, 14 and 2 1/2 and 3 or whatever, and still putting out the same. So yes, I would agree that there are things that he can improve, but I just think basically what I'm saying is, if he goes out and puts up 12, 12 1/2 and 2 1/2, which is what he's been doing for a lot of his career, basically, especially as a starter. That fits because of how good he is defensively and I think the where Hartnstein is on that list at right behind him is another acknowledgement. And with lower numbers than Kessler has, is an acknowledgement of the role the defense plays here. So talk a little bit about, we didn't get to that stat that you mentioned about Kessler, another reason to be excited, and we'll preview a little bit the Austin Reeves part of this, 'cause I just think he occupies a fascinating place in sort of the NBA hierarchy. So we'll get to that next. Lockdown Lakers is brought to you by Square. Support for today's episode comes from Square, the system powering so many of the places we already know and love, whether you're running a packed game-based spot-a-local restaurant or a growing business square gives sellers the tools to run their business without making the process more complicated. Square brings payments, inventory, payroll, invoices, customer insights and more into one connected system. 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And did you know with the Discover Cashback Card, it's payback time when you earn cashback on everyday purchases. That's 5% cashback at different places each quarter, like grocery stores on gas and at restaurants. It pays to Discover. Terms apply, see Discover.com/5 for details. Subscribing, you never miss a show. And all that good stuff. So this from WM Kachiyo 1556. Kester's variable is he wants to play in big games. He's a competitor, Joe Null 06. Kester has the attitude to become great. Take their word for it, but I will say this, just as a little bit of a counter to the idea of the challenge of playing, doing it when it matters. I actually think you can make an argument, at least defensive metrics and defensive numbers, are even more impressive when you play for bad teams, because defense is hard and kind of unglorious and difficult to do when your team is trying to lose. And so the fact that you're kept doing it, even when, even in the, you know, contextually in those circumstances, I actually think speaks to the ability to translate it. But hit us with that other thing that this isn't just about Kester's. But it also reflects how he fits into the larger program the Lakers are doing offensively. - Yeah, I mean, to your earlier point, my raising the idea that Kessler has not done it in this setting is not the same thing as doubting that he can do in this setting. It's just noting the truth. He has not done it in this setting. I wouldn't be excited about the signing and the trade and all that if I didn't think he could do it. Anyway, over at the athletic, they have 30 piece, about 30 different things to be excited about for each of the 30 NBA teams, so one item of piece. And with the Lakers, John Hollinger pointed out how the Lakers are really set up to thrive at the line, which has been a big part of their offense the last couple of years and certainly was last year. Some of the obvious candidates are Luca and Austin. But, and I was not aware of this off the top of my head, but it does make sense, Hollinger pointed out that Walker Kessler's career free throw rate exceeds what Deandre Aiton did last season. He also noted that even though Marcus Smartis, he said his words not mine, a noted foul grifter, Colin Sexton, his bar, far greater, like that ability to get the line. Like Colin Sexton puts constant pressure on the rim. But I think between Kessler's ability to draw fouls just stylistically, but also I imagine this is a big part of it while getting offensive rebounds. I imagine a big reason he ends up at the line is in the process of grabbing misses and getting fouled there. So just he can be a part of beyond what we've talked about, the lobs and the dunks and, you know, Walker Kessler, his first four full seasons in the NBA or three, whatever it is, the full seasons that he's played. He had something like 120 to 130 dunks in those seasons. He may not be thought of as a high fly act, like, you know, Jackson Hayes or Wembee or whoever, dude is a really effective and prolific dunker. You don't have to fly that high when you're already that tall. Sure, but I mean, but he's also he's just, he's elite in terms of the finishing skills and the ability to dunk like, and that he moves very well. And like, you know, he's not, yeah, you know, he's not, you know, who's the most hyper athletic and the, you know, fastest player in the NBA pick a guy. But he's, you know, if you think of like Donovan Klingen as another really large, you know, very, very large center, you know, playing in Portland, you know, Kessler is a much more nimble and, you know, player like, the ability to be able to, you know, guard the way he does and, you know, pick get the right angle and the body control and all that stuff for a player besides really is impressive. So I'm just hoping, I really am just hoping I'm not getting irrationally exuberant here. The other thing that I thought was interesting too about ESPN's ranking and having Kessler at 73 is all the focus on what the Lakers gave up and gave Kessler, whether you're talking about the picks that they gave up and the Lakers are a team that is very low on trade assets before they made this deal much less after. And then also the contract, you know, around 32 a season. But I started looking at the players that were grouped around Kessler, putting that in that perspective. Like 70 Peyton Pritchard, he is still on a bargain extension that Boston got before he broke out at all. Like he was a single digit per game score then it's very similar to the, to the situation with the Lakers and Max Christie and he is clearly worth more than eight millisies. And now Tyler, you know, when he's a free agent, when he is, that's going to triple probably. Yeah, Max Christie is going to make way more on his next game. - No, I was talking about Pritchard. - Oh, sure, but both, both. - Yeah, for sure, absolutely. - Tyler Hero is 71, 33 millisies and VJ Edge comes on a rookie deal, Kessler 73. Isaiah Hartenstein, it just signed a deal worth three and 75. He's made roughly 27 per year as a Fondarian. He's about three and a half years older than Kessler but it's in that ballpark. Kessin Wallace has not been yet paid at 75 but he's about to be dealing with real story. Atlanta too because they got to pay a case in Wallace. Right. Dillon Brooks makes about 25 a year on a new deal. He's also nearly 31 years old. Ja, you know, in his own situation, but he's making way more than Kessler, AJ Advanced or rookie deal. Nausee read at 79 about 27 a year. I like Nausee read a lot, but I think he is one of those can start. He's better as a six man. I think Kessler's upside is much higher. Gidey, Josh Gidey's at 80, 25 a year. And even guys like 65 through 70, Brandon Ingram's at 65. I have a permanent soft spot for Brandon Ingram. I like him. He is considered massively overpaid at 40-ish mill per season. He's hurt a lot. He's been unceremoniously moved twice over the last few seasons of each of zoo bots at 66. He's only he's making low 20s per season, but that because of CBA rules was the max he could get paid at the time. He also cost the Pacers two firsts a second and Benedict Matheryn. Paul George, I don't need to explain why that's a really really big deal. Kianti, George just got paid 31 a season. There's not one mill a season. An extension. Dame is a very very unusual specific case because of the wave and stretch, but before then he had been making way more than 32 a year, and he cost a lot in that trade. Milwaukee gave up a first two first swaps through holiday, the draft pick or tomorrow as a rookie who's going on to become an outstanding defender. The point being when you look at it in that context with the players around Kessler, assuming you believe in Kessler, it's not an extraordinary amount to either give up for him or to pay him. The criticism the criticism seemed to be like they gave up the last pair of stuff, but like, okay, they gave up the rest of the stuff, but like for a guy who apparently is one of the top 75 players on the NBA. It's also two that's more of a conflict system of their passive management leading up to them. You could have used it on someone, and I mean, I'm glad they used it on somebody who's apparently ascending in the NBA already as a top 75 if you buy it, and Andy, with what you were talking about, that would bump him up like I said into the top 50. So it's like, all right, well, that's money well spent if the defense is why in the grand, not that I don't know if it was ever really an A and B binary choice, but in the grand debate of Kessler versus Jalen Duren, like the defense is really what I think I'm sure put the Lakers and they like, we got to go get Kessler, not Duren. So anyway, looking forward to Thursday's press conference. We'll look forward to the rest of the rankings and some of the debate. That will spark lockdown Lakers on YouTube is where you can hang out with 39,000 subscribers. Subscribe to that, subscribe to the audio product. We'll see everyone next time. The best time to recommit to your gut health goals? Right now, take charge of your gut with nature made. 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