E1183 - Love Island Reunion, Tori & Nick MAFS + DWTS Cast Reveal

Did you play any sports, Susie? I dabbled in everything. I swam. I did soccer. Were you more nerdy or were you a popular kid? I was homecoming queen and prom queen. Oh, my God. Okay. And I was friends with everybody because I loved everybody. You've always been crushing. So if your high school reunion, it wouldn't be like, oh, look at what she made of herself. It'd be like, that fucking bitch. So for superlatives, what are they most likely to be famous? I actually won most likely to be famous. Yo, check this out. Check this out. That's so lit. That's so funny. I planned the high school reunion and stuff like that. And I feel like I'm very like, I want everyone to come together. I'm just like a team player. We'd had no reunions. Your class president didn't. We didn't have a 10, a 5, a 15. Or maybe I'm just not invited. You're crazy. What's going on? What's going on, everybody? Welcome back to another exciting episode of the Vow Files Reality Recap Edition. My wonderful, gorgeous, sexy wife. There it is. There it is. I like it. I like it. I don't care what the people say. Okay. We got Jimmy and Susie on the couch. How's everyone doing? Great. How are we feeling? Fabulous. Great. Just had a great cup of coffee. Here at the lake, I'm the barista. I'm not going to lie. I just saw you deliver a latte to Natalie. Tell them about it, babe. Tell them about it. Looks kind of gorge. Listen, I've always been, as you all know, my French vanilla coffee mate or international delight creamer and a regular pot of coffee kind of girl. And then, but when I'd go out, I'd obviously get a nice vanilla latte. And then I was like, you know what? My dad actually bought the Breville espresso machine for our wedding. That's what he got us. Nick's been experimenting while we're up at the lake, and he has perfected a latte with honey. And now I'm like, oh my God, make this for me every single day of our lives. Yeah. Three times scoops of brown sugar, a generous amount of honey. Not too much, though. You got to mix that in the hot coffee. So it melts. And then put the ice in milk. Perfection. I've never tasted it. Do you want to taste it on camera? No, it's not for me. Okay. This is also my love language, so. Yeah, Jimmy's a big coffee guy. Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. What is your go-to coffee order, Jimmy? I've been on a Cortado kick for about a year now. I love a Cortado. Yeah. Okay. Perfect ratio of espresso to milk right there. Okay. Yeah. How much milk? Is that a little bit of milk? Not too much. It's a one-to-one ratio of espresso to milk. One-to-one? Equal parts. Just like a happy relationship, right? That's what you want. 50-50. 50-50. Okay. I actually like that. It's just like, you must drink a lot of caffeine, then. Oh, yeah. Minimum four a day. Really? Yeah. Yeah. How's your nervous system? Trying to cut that back, bud. Jittery, to say the least. Jittery. That's why I'm always on. How's your stomach? That's a good question. Jittery. It ebbs and flows. I have IBS, so it doesn't help. Well, we have a jam-packed episode for you, as always. Nick and Tori from Married at First Sight join us later this episode. It's a real fun conversation. They join us together, and it's a fun kind of roundtable conversation about their experience. They come in with some stories. And some tea. And some tea. And some tea, yeah. And it was great to chat with both. Nick and Tori, I'm excited for you guys to listen to that conversation that we have with them. If you haven't listened to the Corbin interview, the Going Deeper with our time in Corbin, that dropped yesterday, so be sure to check that out. Really enjoyed our time with Corbin, really, especially as someone who, like, came across as so kind of rigid, as they say, AI. It was great to know the person, Corbin. And so, if you haven't listened to that, be sure to check that out. We did have the Love Island reunion, which obviously we'll dive into, but before we do, obviously, the Lindsay. The Lindsay Clancy jury is, they're still deliberating. They're deadlocked. Maybe by the time this episode airs, there will be some kind of verdict, but. That's got to be so frustrating to, like, be like, we've been in here for 17 hours. We're deadlocked. And the judge is like, listen, I'm going to have to ask you to go back in. Because, like, they'll have to. Got to figure it out. It's like, how do you. Millions. Well, objectively, they would have to try it again, which is going to cause, you know, cost millions of more dollars. I mean, I don't even think, I don't think society has the appetite to cover this again. If they come out deadlocked again, and they're like, listen, like, we cannot get to. So she goes home. No, no, no. She doesn't go home. She probably doesn't go home. But she would be tried again. The state, the state, you would have to. I thought you can't be tried for the same crime twice. Well, if you're found. Once convicted or proven innocent. If you're proven innocent, you can't be tried twice. Yeah. But it was, it's like a mistrial. Again, like, where do we draw the line? You know, like. We, we have, we have stopped having the ability to say postpartum is a real thing. We need more awareness from still being able to say, but you can't murder your kids and, and being able to have both empathy and accountability at the same time. And too many people online have lost the plot. And it just like, it just, it's, it just doesn't feel organic. You know, it does, you know, five years ago, we could, this could have this horrible thing could happen. And we, I feel like society. Could have a little bit more of a level headed conversation about this. And you, it's just, I saw someone online being like, who, who thinks like the, the husband did it. And there's like, there's too many of us. We're all saying the same thing. And it's like, instead of recognizing, maybe you've all been influenced by the algorithm in a, you know, in a bubble, you're, you're, you're just thinking we can't be wrong because too many of us are saying the same thing. And it's like, what? It's like, man, algorithms box you into that echo chamber. And then you, you just are literally ignorant to the other side. Yeah. Cause it's like, this is all I see. Every time I scroll, it's all I see. There can't be any other opinions out there. And everybody agrees with me. Yeah. I just, we gotta be careful to, to like, not, you know, again, you can recognize the problem, but at some, you know, like, I don't know. It's just like, it's dangerous, you know, it will be fascinating to see what happens with this case. And, um, I'm just more curious about like, what's the fallout. Like, I just, that's what I was going to say. Like, so just. Just essentially like what happens if they can't reach a verdict on this trial, um, a mistrial would be declared and the case essentially goes back to the same status as before this trial with the 36 year old Clancy, um, being charged with murder held at a psychiatric hospital, awaiting a resolution of the criminal case. She would likely go back on trial, but prosecutors have some options. They would decide whether to try again with a new jury. If they do, the jury selection process will begin again and a new trial will be scheduled. And prosecutors could also offer a plea deal to Clancy. I feel like the, I feel like a new jury is going to be absolutely impossible. I mean, with now this being as, as how do you find, how do you find someone who's never heard about it? And if they haven't heard of it, then I'm also don't want them on the jury because where have you been? No, I'm scared of you. My homies group chat. Like for my homies to be talking about it, I'm like, yeah, this, what is the discourse with the boy, the young men, not to out the boys, but, uh, they have their concerns. Yeah. They need more context. Okay. The third potential outcome of the case is that it's, this is a lot less likely, but the district's attorney office could decide not to retry the case. Um, Lindsay Clancy is currently being held at a state run psychiatric facility throughout her pretrial detention. Yeah. So the facility has become her longterm residence since the events. So she would probably just stay. There is my assumption of it. If something happened where I, I lost my mind and, and. Did this terrible act, I don't, I don't, I don't want the world's grace or sympathy. Everything can't be explained through the lens of empathy and not in, in someone else's and it being someone else's fault. I'm trying to be sensitive to that, like mental health, like illness that like, I don't, I never would know what that's like, but I agree. Like you got to draw the line somewhere and I feel like murdering your children is the line. Yeah. And there are millions of other women who suffer from this horrible thing who don't do that. And I think the way some people are trying to make her the symbol or the face of a postpartum depression, I think is not helpful for the cause. No, Amanda Hirsch, skinny, but not fat, had a great post take on this. Um, I won't read the full thing, but if you're interested, you can, but she basically just said, um, I feel like we're losing the plot a little bit. Three babies were killed. They had their entire lives ahead of them. Yes. Their mother was very sick. That's devastating, but it wasn't their fault. They were strangled to death methodically and left to die in the hospital. I feel like we're losing the plot a little bit. I feel like we're losing the plot. you know it's also fucked up about that whole thing what tell me the way the mainstream press ignored that exactly crazy they were so exactly so uninterested in clayton's innocence and it like we had him on uh and there were other other shows that that followed the case but the mainstream didn't touch it even though it was like it was crazy it just again it also it felt inorganic it is literally true crime a bachelor was being gone girl i mean that was a movie version but like she did the same thing where she was she had a plan she did this with multiple people there were other boyfriends who had similar stories to him there were so many similarities between that crazy movie in this real life situation she wore a fake belly to court this is diabolical where do you draw the line again like crazy injected hormones into herself to be able to pee on a pregnancy test for it to pop positive like the extent that she went is so bizarre it is it is like chilling well we also have the dancing with the stars official lineup okay that came out and everyone who was rumored is in fact confirmed breaking news here it's an interesting cast you have some star-studded big names when it all makes sense in their own right it's just more like in general is a collection of like some you know more mainstream names like uh someone who's like an a-lister like julia styles is a huge name it's a huge name like what an incredible get for dancing with the stars guys incredible i have a confession what i hope my mom's not listening but the only name i recognize is guillermo wait really yeah good for you honestly good for you yeah and i love guillermo but that's all i got mora higgins i've heard tyler cameron and i i he's you're gonna love him yeah yeah i mean he's maybe the the most mainstream name on the men's list yeah because i'm familiar with that name and i love dancing with the stars because of amon shumpert chicago basketball player well running through the list we've got julia styles jenna diwan tatiana ali taylor hansen ezra french oh okay hansen i'm wrong he's the biggest former taylor hansen brothers who's that oh they're like a pop like the band they were massive he's the big that's a that's big sorry guys i'm still i didn't know his name this is maybe not your generation but like they have the hansen brothers i don't know if anyone can recognize that yeah that's it yeah mama i know mama if you watch it okay okay all right that's a big name continuing we've got amber glenn connor wood sarah j nader tyler cameron giotta de la rentez harry shum jr connor levitt guillermo rodriguez mora higgins miller and jackson olsen so this will be a big test for the levitt name it like you know they also brought in some new pros for this i mean we brought back sharna burges yeah sharna's back dancing with tyler i mean have they announced the couples yet they have yeah okay yes they do there's a couple notable ones uh sarah j nader is partnering with hayley bills not only is it a a female duo but i do think they both i mean this is me just you know putting a piece of the puzzle together but i think they both have religious backgrounds because sarah j nader is like small town louisiana christian and now she is openly bisexual and then hayley bills is from salt lake city i think from the mormon community she's friends with all the same salt lake city dancers hayley is jenna johnson's niece stunner i mean i'm just gonna put it on there that's gonna be my i'm gonna yeah i'm gonna say i am gonna be locked in for that same that pairing beautiful we also have connor levitt with the new next pro winner adele zeichman so congrats to adele if you guys didn't watch that finale oh my gosh there was no other option to me i mean she her dance moves her choreography i was like i've never wanted to be a dancer more it was literally i mean to me i was like that's a that's a pro it was so good she stood out amongst the uh very talented guys yeah i also loved selena's moments were really good too selena was great like wow moment choreography yeah i thought aj should have won oh really yeah you thought i like aj really yeah i thought aj cold did you like his online drama too no i didn't know about his tea i thought as a dancer like technically i thought he and as like a coach i thought he was cold okay you were judging from a technical standpoint hey one thing about me is i grew up a dancer i know my mama my dad saw this basketball my mama was a pom-pom girl oh he knows that dolphin move when he was brought up in this world yeah point the toe i do find it interesting that jenna dewan is partnered with val obviously she is a very experienced dancer and he is like considered one of the best pros and so i do like you'd think maybe she'd be with one of the newer ones to kind of even out the playing it's actually a you know the improvement she'll just she's gonna be you know like but i want to see i think it's gonna be i mean like whitney levitt like she was so good every time they went out that it was just so fun to watch because you were like this is just such a performance yeah but i mean despite like i think a lot of people fans of whitney like aware of her talent she you know she became a star as a as a mom on reality tv and for a lot of people who weren't familiar with her seeing her just absolutely crush it was like oh my god she's so good she's so good she's so good she's so good she's like oh damn and she can also do this with jenna dewan most people were introduced to her as a as a dancer as a performer and so the i can't believe she she's also amazing at that is i think it'll be interesting how jen you know like that's a big part of the dancing with the stars vote and the way like fans connect with the dancers they didn't bring back sasha yeah no sasha yeah he comes and goes yeah he comes and goes i don't think he's been on the past couple he was partnered with jen train yeah when jen was on she was was he not on last season i think he might have skipped last season yeah maybe it's a height thing i mean he he often is paired with someone who's shorter my money's on guillermo okay okay that's okay who do i want to oh i mean i have to go i have to go tyler yeah tyler i was gonna say tyler i think tyler cameron he's one he's a charmer he's a charmer good looking lad yeah he's gonna have people's hearts but he's gonna be good too and having sharna back i think she had like her this being her first season back in a while like that's gonna pull out a lot of people i think yeah i think i'm excited to see that duo underdog who's not really an underdog i think connor wood is gonna be really good i think i think his fan base is strong his charm him and riley both single are we gonna get our showmans from them or i hope so i think i think people are gonna eat them up together whether they're single or not that's one thing about like i don't know if i could ever date a dancer because they get intimate on stage like that is a another level like intimacy i don't know if i'm secure enough with like just watch my partner do that yeah they like the way they lock eyes in that moment and they touch the back of the head gleb also isn't there well when you have too many people being like do you think sarah jane nader they were like we're not having like a nader club on the same season i don't think it's just more practical like they i think you had a lot of the women who were like his reputation right now is not great and they were just like i don't want to dance with them you know and why would it's like it's not a good storyline to put sierra or or uh or mora in that situation and then like julia styles like yeah you know um they'll find they'll bring them back well if tyler doesn't win dancing with the stars he can always go and work with them so they're now hiring men to yeah inclusivity can we take a class trip we can take a class for research now it's just tgr for research now it's just chilies what's the like i do feel like they need to change the name to like hooters and hangers you know are the men going to be sexualized we're going to be fitting in chip and dale's outfits i heard that they're wearing the same uniform so if the shorts are the same length then jimmy can work there if anyone's recent social media activity he's got this those are some short shorts hey one thing about me is i'm gonna commit to the bit where did you find those in the wardrobe that was not you know for me it was for the girls but i was like you know what let's do it the legs were popping okay athleticism you know we don't normally see the legs out like that he's called me a quadrosaurus rex quadrosaurus rex is right what's the point when was the last time you went to hooters it's not for the experience but thank you suzy the point is not for you it is for us and we were tired of going with our men and our men being like how many times have you been to hooters i've actually never the fried pickles are great you like their food they're fried pickles oh my god they're so good i used to work by one when i worked in um pharmaceutical marketing and it was down the street from my office and i would go by myself what would you order ladies it's me again get fried pickles like once a week. It'd be like my little treat on Friday. Do you remember your first Hooters trip? I definitely remember mine. Whenever it was, I remember being thoroughly unimpressed. What? How old were you? Yikes. High school. High school. Okay, I was like seventh, eighth grade. I remember just perfect age. Yeah, your height was probably perfect at that point. Yeah, I just remember being overstimulated. Who did you go with, Jimmy? I didn't care less about the Buffalo Wings. My basketball coach took our entire team. Maybe the Hooters in the middle of Wisconsin wasn't serving. I think I would have liked that better. You know what I'm saying? What's with the Hooters in Memphis? I like them homegrown. Homegrown. Just like me. You like- Grass-fed, honey. Natural male. What's her name on Double Lives? 100%. That's my type. Oh my gosh. Well, we have- The Love Island reunion is dropped. It's in the can. What did we learn? Well, first and foremost, it sounds like the one who had maybe the- The worst experience was Keita. She's definitely- She's allegedly lost over 100,000 followers. It's crazy. People think she's up on her high horse, that she was mean. She was slut-shaming. She misspoke. No, I didn't like it. Nah, she didn't just misspeak. Yeah, I didn't like the comment either. Her demeanor, the energy she came in with. She was defensive about things that didn't necessarily even warrant- How do you guys- How do you guys feel about that? How do you guys feel about the fans quite literally using their follow as a currency or weaponizing their follow in the way of like, it's a day-to-day, do I fuck with you or if I not, do I not, and unfollowing? If you had no clue who any of those people were and you just watched that reunion not having any context, you could tell who had the most followers just based on how almost entitled the way people acted. I would agree with that. And I do think that you made a good point. I do think followers are currency and in a way, like just in society as well, we vote with our dollars. So where you're putting your money and where you're putting your follow, it is letting people know like where your values are. And like, I know me personally as a consumer, if somebody gives a bad take, I'm not going to unfollow them. If they give a take I don't agree with, I'm not going to unfollow them. If they say something that I feel like genuinely disrupts my morals or like my nervous system where I'm like, I can, I cannot. I cannot be a part of supporting this person and allowing them to like make money, I'm going to unfollow them. And so I think when people, I think people responding with an unfollow kind of speaks to like the pain people feel like, I don't know, watching that I was like, wow, this feels like a mean girl kind of, and I didn't, I didn't like it. It made me feel like, I don't know, I wouldn't want to be in a room where I'm on the receiving end of that. Cause it didn't feel fair. Especially coming from Kata, her relationship with Zach isn't perfect. You know? Like, and also like, it's a weird blurred line of what their relationship is. Cause they're not boyfriend and girlfriend, but they're exclusive. So her to like be weighing in on Jaden and Caleb's little situation, it was just like, do you, are you, why are you involving yourself right now? I also saw a lot of discourse about Melanie and Kenzie, how it was kind of like, they were saying that Melanie, you know, was being accused, accusing the mean girl, you know, she was like at her neck and then they're crying saying, I love you. Yeah. That was just like some girl shit. That's kind of what they were saying was like, you were mean to her until she started crying. And then it was like, oh, let me stand up, give you a hug and let's go out to dinner. Like this feels like. Yeah. I was lost. I didn't love that either. Yeah. I, it just seems like as ever since season six, the evolution of Love Island and the way, but I have a ton of like empathy for what these Islanders have to experience. There's, there's nothing out there that replicates. How popular it is right now, you know, coming out of the show and this instant reaction and dealing with all that. Like no doubt is a challenge. I think that most of them are making huge mistakes of how they're moving post filming because like outside of maybe Bryce and Trinity are going to have like the Alandria arc where they're just going to be, they're going to have some staying power and they're going to, they're going to have probably limitless opportunities. And a lot of them are going to have a lot of opportunities, but they're being in, and I get it. They're, they're probably scared to say anything and don't know how to move when the reason why you are famous. I have, I have a following is because of your personality. And then, you know, and then you are very restricted of what you show people and you allow people to create narratives. They're not willing to get out there and, and, and kind of let the audience learn about who they really are outside of, of Love Island. And therefore it will be quickly forgotten. Can I ask you about the, the Caleb situation then? Because the audience is kind of learning about who Caleb quote unquote really is. Yeah. We learn he's a little bit. And he's, we learned he's 21. And he's following in like the, who's following in like the Rob, Rob's footsteps. Where like, he started with the same, he has the same reps. And do you think, you know, like he's trying to follow in those footsteps, but his appeal wasn't necessarily that. His appeal was like the nice guy. Yeah. Like the sweet boy that like was wronged. I think you can be both. I think that's why, what I'm fascinated with, what always interests me and why we do this show is to learn how like on reality TV, people get siloed into an oversimplified persona. Caleb was the sweet boy. And the truth is, is like, you know, you can be. Like a 21 year old heartthrob who's overall a gentleman and generally has a sweet demeanor and you can still like, want to like hook up, you know, and fuck around and, and maybe still lack some communication skills because you're 21, where you might need some notes and how you, how you handle a situation and maybe it requires, you know, maybe it results in some hurt feelings. It doesn't necessarily make you a horrible guy. Like, I think you can, I think you can be both. Right. And I think we learned that Caleb is in fact 21. In fact. Yeah. And he has to deal with learning how to be, go about being a single dude, like with millions of followers now, it's going to be tough for him. It's going to be awesome and tough at the same time. The in crowd of Love Island, the, the OGs, the finalists, like they can still critique Caleb and not like, you know, want to rally behind him because he's their boy and he's part of the, and you know, cause that's, you know, to your point, it always kind of gives like people know they feel like the authority that they have or the clout they have relative to their peers. And they feel like speaking up and defending each other in a way that doesn't often make sense. That power dynamic is crazy. It was wild to watch soul, like spin her exaggerations or quote unquote lies that, you know, just the way that she tried to make them forced to walk them back. It was just when they're like, you said that, um, Bryce pulled Kada three or four times and she's like, did you not pull her twice? And they're all like, no, it was one time. But you stood on the red dot and tried to leave the relationship. It's like, whoa, that happened before you were even there. Like what is going on? I think soul has never been rejected in her life and she showed up to love Island and she kind of obviously had an early exit and I think she's, uh, she, she can't make heads or tails of it. Like one plus one is not equaling to in soul's mind. And that's what it seems like the only reason. Cause she seems like a fairly level-headed person, but why is she to this point? Just so I've never seen someone. Have such a short period of time, make such a meal, uh, like trying to like explain why they were right. It's like you, you had, you had kind of everyone on your side until you kept leaning in. Sympathy is a dangerous drug is what it seemed like to me because I agree. I remember you being on the show and you saying soul had the most aura of anybody in the Villa. And I, I left the show feeling like, oh, I'm rooting for her. I want to see her do big things. And then the way she came out. I was like, wow, like you are, this is so different, but I think it's getting a taste of that sympathy that everyone felt where it's like, we want more of you. Like we want to see you and people hyping you up and telling you you've been done dirty. And then it's like, it gets, you know, I don't know. Spirals. Yeah. Feed into her complex or her reality or her experience as everybody fucking says. Everybody's throwing up. That's my experience. That's my perspective. That was my lived experience. What is going on? Like, what's the actual truth. I, I, you don't know. What they're, I mean, we all obviously saw it play out. So we have some semblance of what the truth is, even though it's overly produced and edited, but like. Can we shout out Trinity, Anaya, TT. I'm going to say it. I did not think I was going to be like the biggest TT fan after fire pit night. Like I just, I was like, I don't know. I feel like she came in hot with the girls and the way she moved from that day forward, literally the next episode of her being so honest and so like putting her guard and her ego down. And just like talking to the girls and the way she moved in the reunion, all three of those women showed so much grace. I don't think they're getting talked about enough because it like, wasn't that dramatic because they were, they all seem like pretty healthy and healed. But the three of them, I was like, okay, I think they need their flowers. And I think people are losing the plot a little bit with social media because everyone brings up my experience and they were also all bringing up likes. Like you liked this comment. You liked this comment. I'm like, guys, get off the internet. It has me terrified because I'm active on the internet. Like, I'm like, yo. If anybody would like do a scouting report on me, like I'm not just liking shit, I'm commenting. Like I'm super active. And I didn't realize people read into that so much. How do you also find all of the comments that everyone has liked? I mean, truly, like Bailey said, get off the internet. Like how are you that aware? There's such an easy rebuttal to that. Like why are you liking this? Why are you liking that? Like these are clearly the people that are my fans and are supporting me and I want them to feel like I see you and I appreciate you like, boom, here's your like, keep having my back on the internet. Like nobody's, ugh. like the comment that shay liked to comment about kata fumbling him and i felt like the way she just kind of like shut him down where it was like you're liking these comments and i'm like but that really doesn't even have anything to do with you it's more so him being like yeah i feel fumbled i'm a catch you know like i went on this show yeah he's allowed to feel that way and he sacrificed the same way that those other islanders sacrifice and half of no not even half a handful of them come out with millions of followers millions of dollars and then the other ones get sat on a couch off to the side so i'm like let him have his moment let him like the comment it's okay and that's why i say you could tell like who's clouded and who's not just by the demeanor and the way they feel like they have this like superior like high ground to like just like talk down to other people and it's like yo like it's giving you are yo like to end it i think uh many of these cast members are on a path of like the reality tv star tragedy which is to be too famous to get a real job but not famous famous enough to actually make real money you and there are so many people out there with millions of followers who aren't able to actually monetize it in a meaningful sustainable way like think about this cast how large this cast is how many followers are going around and like we've it was a month ago and it feels like forever ago and final question i feel like the the timing of the reunion's off because like either either had the reunion right away if you're going to talk about everything that happened on the show which is it seemed like what the reunion was about which is like you know breaking down the show like we waited a whole month for that you know there wasn't a lot of like what's happened in between and i don't know it did it did yeah what is the time frame is it two months post show that we're at right now or was it one month one month but it honestly feels like a fucking year if it feels like forever ago that's crazy i know you want to move off this nick but i kind of have a question about like the core four stuff and how like melanie was getting into it with kenzie my question is when and like how did they get established as the core four if kenzie was an og and i feel like if kenzie's not a core four member doesn't shouldn't that like signal to her that like yo melanie is isn't your best friend why would you think that like clearly you're not even part of this little core four comes from the internet it's the internet giving them the name the question is is when they come out of the villa how much do they embrace these titles they embrace that shit that well yeah right so you know it really kind of gives icky uh yeah it's like why are y'all it felt like we're intentionally alienating or not intentionally we want it to be clear like yeah we are the core four you over there like we're not the fab five we could be but the tricky part is i think the challenge is is because you know when you see for example kata lose a hundred thousand followers you know i empathize like you see reality tv people literally be afraid to just be normal and chill or be friends with someone in their space because of what their audience says about them it wouldn't shock me if the core four doesn't feel like it's safe to be friends with some of their cast members because of the because of what the internet is telling you that is like a trapped place to be in like that's it's yeah you i can't be friends with you because the internet is i can't and it causes them to make a million mistakes and bad decisions wow this really is a social experiment it is a social experiment all right well up next it's time to get to our guests nick and tory from married at first sight it's a great conversation we get you get a lot of answers of all your burning questions when it comes to nick and tory who are survived uh some very interesting relationships and they're up next to talk all about it don't forget vile files plus now offers ad-free episodes for all vile files episodes including ass nick reality recap and going deeper plus if you love ass nick you will absolutely love our ass nick updates where you get updates of your favorite calls our deep dive on all your favorite reality recap tv shows and our pop culture roundups where we talk about all your favorite pop culture topics that we didn't get to in this week's episode plus deep dives on our going deeper guests and so much more much more all you have to do is go to vile files plus and you will be lucky you did most dog food brands don't really want you seeing how their food is made just food for dogs is the opposite they actually invite you in you can walk into any of their kitchens and see real human grade ingredients like chicken beef carrots and peas being prepared right in front of you it's real food made in real kitchens nothing is hidden behind labels and that kind of transparency says a lot to hide everything to love go to justfoodfordogs.com and get 50 off your first order emotional processing and wellness are about self-care and discovery bring immediate dopamine boosting joy to your daily journaling with the g2 smiley world collection from pilot combining the smooth vibrant g2 gel writing experience with smiling emoticons that can activate the same brain response as a real smile they're designed to help elevate your mood and bring positivity to your writing g2 smiley world at target today g2 smiley world write happier nick tory welcome to the show what up thank you so excited to have you guys this was a rager of a season how long how long has it been since you guys ended production of the show like mid-october i think is round one wrap okay so we're coming up on a year yeah so uh the show all essentially finished filming like a year ago so it's going to be a year and a half from now so we're going to be filming like a year and a half from now so we're going to be filming like a year and a half from now been some time to reflect whatever but then the reunion only filmed like a month ago so that's still kind of fresh okay it felt fresh yeah well i mean are you saying it kind of opens some wounds so to speak well it's wild because we obviously we have to watch the whole season before the reunion so we know what to talk about so we are like in a hotel room with ipads with the show binge watching all of it in a day and then the whole show is then fresh in your head and then you go right into this reunion so all of your feelings everything are like right on the top of your head you haven't had time to talk to any friends or family about it so you're just going to this reunion raw that's honestly genius yeah yeah i was gonna say that's diabolical too yeah i mean as far as production goes that's a good way to do it yeah um but yeah i think it was just for me i was thinking and hoping maybe that like because it had been a year maybe courtney would apologize during the reunion a little bit um and then when she kind of doubled down on the edit i was kind of like oh it sounds like you weren't expecting apology from courtney and and i guess what was what was the apology you were hoping to get from her going into the reunion you know i thought that maybe the even the experts might encourage it to um that didn't really happen either but like i was fully thinking she was going to be like hey watching it back i realized a lot of what i was doing was actually like really coming off rude and disrespectful from that and now i've learned xyz that i can do differently and i do see that you were trying and like whatever just like a normal apology um but instead she was just like i'm a i'm an alpha and you're off or whatever and it's just like no accountability for just kind of like my experience that i had so that was a little disappointing was it trippy being in a relationship with her um in the sense that it did seem like as a viewer um that like that yeah there you know we all talk about projecting but it was just like anytime she'd have a problem and she kind of like you could see her do this like we're obviously you're just being blamed for something did it feel almost like whoa where's this coming like yeah did she touch on anything or did maybe she after reflecting did you think okay well maybe that's fair or at times where is it like just accusations out of left field so i think like the accusation of me not like fully opening up with her is valid like but it wasn't for lack of trying so like yes the fact that like she didn't really get to know much about me is true but it wasn't for me like not trying to do so and like it took me a while because like when you're in it also it's kind of hard to realize some things that are happening so it took me a while to kind of realize how much projection was happening and like kind of like gaslighting even was happening throughout the show uh and then watching it back obviously you have context of like the interviews that are happening and then you're like oh my god i'm not gonna do this i'm not gonna do this i'm not gonna do this i'm not gonna do this and like what chat she's having with the other girls and so it's like she'd be like talking to other girls like if i have to spend one more second with nick i'm gonna like leave or whatever and then it's like then to my face she's like nick of course i want to spend time with you or like we'll be on the therapy couch dr lee she's like nick obviously i like you and i want to spend time with you and then she's like nope like i want to like not be here i'm like all right amazing courtney impression so yeah confusing but um yeah it was a lot of contradictions i think between what she would say and what she would do and i think the earliest example of projection was like literally right after we got married i don't know if y'all remember but she's doing an interview with a producer and the produce she says something about like i just don't want nick to get bored of me and then the producer's like courtney it's been three hours you're worried about him being bored already and she's like yeah but they air that and then the next day it's an interview of her saying nick is so boring so it went from her fear of her being boring to projecting that onto me like nick is a boring person i think that was like kind of the very first like example of that happening it would have been great if uh that producer would have been like courtney don't worry you're an alpha how can you be boring tori you also had a very well you know incredible run first of all you were really a joy to watch and um and thank you for your sacrifice because obviously it seemed like some of our entertainment and you know it was just it was just like some of our entertainment was your pain um but what was just your general takeaway with felipe because like on one end as a viewer you know he seemed like a nice enough guy guy i think he had a very charming opening you know he has that kind of like i used to be a nerd but now i'm cool and kind of sexy like you root for that guy and then throughout the season just drop some like what the fuck did you say kind of moments and yeah what was it like for you in in real time knowing that like hey i agreed to marry this stranger you know from what were your first reaction of like meeting felipe to like how that evolved throughout the season i'm really curious yeah well i wish i would have saw in the opening seen the opening that you guys saw that would have been helpful um no but i think um going into the wedding i when i first saw felipe i didn't really watch the show previous to this because i didn't want it to dictate how i showed up so i didn't know what to expect i didn't know if i was going to get pranked i saw like there was fake teeth on an episode from him you know a million years ago so i just did it didn't know what was going to happen and so i i always kind of think i'm going to be swindled and so i was like this is for sure a swindle situation and so i was thrilled when i saw him and there was no like fake teeth there was no prank whatever and so i was just like i was really thrilled about that and then i think as like the season went on it definitely took a turn i would say say the least um but i really enjoyed his family and i was just i think i was so in my mindset was basically like i'm getting gonna get pranked and then also tuxedo blindness is very real um but i love that's so funny it's it's for sure real but yeah so i think and i really loved his family like we really started getting along like right off the bat so again though i wish i would have seen the opening that you guys saw that everyone saw because i think when it went out was the first time i saw that and it makes more sense and what do you mean by that because i think when a lot of this stuff it did happen earlier on but like when he started pulling these like blindsiding things which were like mind you like when we were even filming at the apartment or dates or whatever like it was never any of that it was like he admitted that he cheated and then it was like all of a sudden at these like usually group dinners group things he would just like drop these bombs left and right and so then he'd say like afterward he kind of did what he did with the cheating thing where he said to the guys like oh i cheated but i forgot haha but then to me he was like i was so ashamed and like so it was just like you're getting a different story and like you know i didn't pick him he didn't pick me i don't know him that well so like you know i want to hear him out but then as time went on as we see it just kind of really went downhill you know it's interesting you know when you think about this show and its premise and i think if we're all being honest like hearing you that description is fascinating because the truth is it probably wasn't even different a different story it was like him performing differently for his audience right he's with the boys he downplays it you know for whatever reason with you he wants to sound empathetic sincere um and in this situation where you're literally meeting a stranger and and i imagine all of you you hope at least the other person and i think you know many often we're not holding ourselves accountable or at least some of them but to be honest with you i think it's so easy to be so easily a different person in different situations must be kind of an uncomfortable feeling to watch it back knowing that you were like hoping that whoever you met i mean like you know say what you want about courtney she has a hard time not being herself and i like you know it's like okay at least you can trust that but with with felipe this kind of a chameleon kind of uh vibe is is um but yet it's i'm sure it's not so it's so common i don't and in a way that i like regarding courtney i will say and i mean nick and i've talked about this and i've talked with courtney on this too but um you know my experience with her was very different than what nick's experience what we saw and so when we're watching that back i was like it was completely so different and so then when you put that to like felipe i agree though i think it wasn't like he wasn't like completely switching up but it was definitely the story was told very differently you know when he was talking about these things and it was usually from like kind of a victim place and so i wanted to kind of hear him out you know it's stressful to go through this in general so like it's like okay like you know sort your shit out but okay and but i think it was a very much a your audience type of thing at least with felipe yeah well is there anything that he admitted to or anything off-putting or shocking he said that didn't make the final edit that you that stuck with you yeah where do i start um yeah please uh a favorite was he really wanted to go on this was like towards the end and at that point i was just like jesus take the wheels like oh my god he was like we were out on the patio sitting out there and then he was like you know i and i'm not really i watched some rally shows but not a lot and so i didn't know even what the show's premise was but he was like i'd love to go on too hot to handle and i was like no and then he's should have signed up for that and i just was like wow okay okay and that was like peak timing where i just was like literally like i didn't know what was up and what was down and i'm just trying to like jesus take the wheel i'm just trying to get through this right now i'm sorry for that happening but that is an awesome story too hot yeah insane from meredith first sight to like too hot to handle gives you a different name during the casting process because it's so maybe felipe thought married at first sight season 20 was actually too hot to handle he's gonna show up tori are you always this like cool calm and collected while dealing with just an absurd man like watching the show back i was so impressed with how honestly chill you were but it wasn't like oh i'm the cool girl that's cool with everything you were like i'm composed i'm chilling and i'm very confident and he's making a fool of himself like it's almost like you didn't have to call out or or like poke at him you can't it seemed like you knew like oh this is gonna air and he's gonna look like a train wreck yes exactly like are you always that composed or was this you just like trying to i don't know show up for this for the show and be like okay i'm gonna let him dig his own grave yeah well i think i have some practice with fuck boys in general but um i also think that like i grew up kind of in a tumultuous life and i'm like i'm gonna let him dig his own environment and so like with like verbally and things like that and you kind of learn to like not give things control and then when you bring in like you know these like kind of just like silly boys like it's just like the days would love nothing more than you to just like boost their ego by you getting upset and so i think that combination i didn't realize honestly i didn't even think that that was a thing until like it aired and like that like you know people are saying that now or like that's a thing but like i did not think that that was a thing at all and like yeah so i think it was the combination of that two moments that specifically come into my head going off of that suzy is the car ride where your car breaks down and he is just sitting there like finger up his butt cannot help you with literally anything and you're and it seemed like you were like you know what i i can handle this like i can i know how to call a b and c i'll be fine this will be okay but the fact that he didn't even offer like any sort of help any direction nothing no moral support no i mean yeah nick hat on the back nick nick and jimmy you're i mean i don't hold are you nick me i'm turning 33 in like a week okay well happy birthday you look great but yeah you so you're you're younger than me jimmy you're you're even younger younger you know there's a lot of conversations online about like just masculinity what it means what what you know the young modern look like modern man looks like today like me is i'm maybe i'm just the old guy but like yeah like i think that's insane that like a man wouldn't want to be like all right i i need to just like pretend i know what i'm doing here or help problem solve but to be the guy who just like sits in his car on his phone or is that like is that the new young man of today no you you're still supposed to help out okay it's me like i'm not gonna change the tire we call it triple a but i'm gonna help you call triple a do you do you not know how to change a tire fuck no that was one of my fears on perfect match one of the challenges like change a tire my tire went flat i couldn't find because the tire has a like a lock one i couldn't find it so i did have to call triple a but you should know how to do it you should know that nick do you you went to mit nick you must know well dude i do software at mit so let's relax on that hardware is a totally different thing but uh you can't get it right no but i you're still a genius yeah well i mean i'm not denying that but like my um i like helped my dad like fix it like swap out a tire when i was like 13 or something and i haven't done so you don't know how to change the tire yeah there's no way i could we're in the same boat do you do you do you know like you don't even know the basic steps i i've never seen him change a tire before so as much as he's talking this shit i've never seen a game call again i did call triple a last time i'm no i'm no mechanic i'm like but you should know the step like there's a there's a filter there's a there's a filter i'm a problem solver I'll get it figured out whether it's me like using the car. like TBD yeah moral of the story you're still supposed to be a good guy and like help fix the situation whatever the situation yeah at the end of the day it is more than what Felipe was gonna do right oh I mean he was over there just I would have been shocked if he asked me if I could make him a snack at that point I was just like just goes on oh my gosh yeah swipe it on tinder literally the other moment was when it was the same episode I believe that night when he was performing being called like the fuck boy and whatever and he loved it so much and you went up to the room at the retreat and y'all kind of broke up and this like the temper tantrum that this man threw it the way that I would have been like get up and you just sat there so calm and collected and it was it was honestly like Susie said I mean it's just it's brilliant to to watch I loved watching it it was there's nothing more polar more anything more powerful than calmness stillness and situation yeah I I feel like I really do feel like especially when we were at that portion I think maybe like a week or two before that was when I was just like I cannot even like you kind of can't even really like share your emotions or share anything because you're just like I don't know what he's gonna say or do but with that I was just trying to convey like you know I didn't care about the game and I was honestly like having fine it was fine with the game but then he was like enjoying it so much and then you're trying to explain something and it's like this is not even worth my time and I just was over it but yeah yeah and then I lost my car and it's like Penelope Cruz like I'm so sad about that and it was like my like old car but it was like a stick shift and I was so really sad about Penel I'm really sad you know but do you remember the moment um where you're like I can't marry this man yeah I mean I think honestly it kind of went back to like some stuff just got really weird like I did feel like I was getting love bombed and like the last two guys I dated love bombed and so I just was like I told him that and he was like yeah yeah for sure for sure got it and he like proceeds to love bomb and I'm like I love you happy talk good talk yeah for sure shut up shut the fuck up I love you Brazil me and my family are going to Brazil okay great so I think though when we were intimate afterward we were chatting and he said something and that's the reason why I went on the couch was that he was really excited to tell the guys oh and I was really really icked out like just so and I was like what the hell am I doing what am I doing with this experiment like I was like questioning everything so I like waited till he passed out and I just like basically like crawled out of there as fast as I could I was wondering why you went on the couch that yeah that'd make me leave as well that's why you went on the couch did you ask him or did you bring that up to him were you like wait what what do you mean like did you call it out yeah well I talked to him in the moment and I was like well listen like you you're gonna tell Devin or Nick or someone and then there's someone's gonna do an interview and then it's gonna kind of like grapevine throughout like that and I don't want to do that so that's why at the first dinner I just said it because I was like I'm just gonna say it because like you're gonna go yeah and it's gonna be like lord knows how that's gonna go I've never done a show before or like this experiment thing like I don't know how that's gonna go so but that was kind of I think me going to the couch though I do feel like that struck a chord with him ego wise because that's when a lot of this stuff started occurring and I think that he thought it was for different reasons I think that like I don't know how he didn't put two and two together like that was like the weirdest thing I've ever like he was like giddy it was just weird and so I think that like that's kind of what was like a domino effect after that Nick did he ever talk to you or any of the guys about that moment no he actually never um interesting any sort of like or any on that Tori I'm curious did you like why did you share that information about what he said during filming and they just didn't air it no why why what was your decision to kind of keep that to yourself I think it was just early on like we just it was like probably like two weeks after we got back from Cancun maybe and I just like didn't really trust again like I think I'm always going to get swindled like and I was getting swindled I felt like so I was just like I don't you don't know who to trust and like who to talk to and I just was like I'm not like you know what I mean yeah yeah yeah you just you were you were still questioning the experiment even though you were kind of in the experiment yeah and while also like you know I really actually did like Felipe like I really did and so like I actually like gave and I'm as a partner I am really understanding to a point and then it kind of snaps but like I really did give him a lot of grace and a lot of room to like you know just to get to know him and like figure out what's going on in his head which looking back now I'm like oh stupid no I mean like not it's it's you seem like you have a sense of humor but it's like hearing your point of view is fascinating because like the person who is you know questioning this experiment while going in the experiment and then you get partnered with someone like Felipe who's literally like so my next show is going to be too hot to handle that doesn't help your narrative of like is this fucking real like or is like is he it was like most dog food brands don't really want you seeing how their food is made just food for dogs is the opposite they actually invite you in you can walk into any of them and they're like oh my god I'm so excited to be here I'm so excited to be here you can walk into any of them and they're like oh my god I'm so excited to be here you can walk into any of their kitchens and see real human grade ingredients like chicken beef carrots and peas being prepared right in front of you it's real food made in real kitchens nothing is hidden behind labels and that kind of transparency says a lot nothing to hide everything to love go to justfoodfordogs.com and get 50% off your first order emotional processing and wellness are about self-care and discovery bring immediate dopamine boosting joy to your daily journaling with the g2 smiley world collection from pilot combining the smooth vibrant g2 gel writing experience with smiling emoticons that can activate the same brain response as a real smile they're designed to help elevate your mood and bring positivity to your writing find g2 smiley world at target today g2 smiley world write happier nick question for you why lie about the dating show on your wedding day yeah people are accusing me of lying about the dating show on your wedding day yeah people are accusing me of lying about the lying i didn't lie so i had so many so we were allowed to bring i think like 25 friends and family um to the wedding so i had friends from all stages of my life childhood friends high school friends college friends microsoft friends reality tv friends like all these groups and my reality friends were all from the circle so then like right after we you know say our ideas we're like talking about wedding guests and everything and i'm like i've got these people from circle it's like i did this thing called circle it's not a dating show i said that which look it's not a lie the circle's not a dating show but perfect matches yeah yeah so i said i did this circle it's not a dating show and then obviously later not on our wedding day i tell her about all the other shows that i went on but i was like maybe on my literal wedding day it's not the time to like dump all of that onto her obviously i need to address this because i have guests from the circle on there um but yeah then like i will say when i was like it's not a dating show like that did i was like oh should i maybe deeper into that like because i know that might seem but like obviously yes i eventually do tell her that i was on a date show but not on our wedding day um but i do remember distinctly like thinking like maybe that's like not totally fair okay to what context do you feel like that mattered to you or to her for saying that i'm curious like i knew coming into this there was gonna be a huge stigma against me from having done tv shows before um and like you know i'm in the casting process like never before or do we have reality people on here so i'm like okay this is going to be an uphill battle but like i want to be married and so like this is going to be like this stigma i have to fight and so in my head i was like if on your literal wedding day she has her like husband saying like yeah i've done these dating shows and i'm like yeah i've done these dating shows and i'm then it's like it does seem like it's just like another dating show that he's going on but in reality i've only done one dating show is perfect match the other ones were competition shows but but um i was like i don't want to like trauma dump that like on day one i get the logic honestly like i could totally easily seen you saying it on your wedding day now the narrative is the other it's the inverse it's flipped it's you couldn't have waited a day to tell me like i kind of get the logic no literally and people already just me saying talking about the circle because i had five guests from the circle at my wedding so like just me talking about the circle i was getting like tons of hate from people being like really he won't shut up about reality imagine if i told her every single show like it'd be like you can't really win either way so i had to make like a in the moment of like how much should i tell her right now versus later what's fair what how much about me is fair for her to know like right out the gate versus maybe in a day or two and like that kind of stuff so do you think you were in your own head though because of how many how much But everybody on Married at First Sight is on a reality show. So for me, I was like, no one here is going to clock me for being on reality. Like, sure, maybe. I think it's fair for the audience to have their doubts, to be like, Nick's done all these shows this evening. I don't think it's fair for anyone on the cast of Married at First Sight to hold it against me at all, because. by signing up for married at first sight, by definition, you're saying I'm willing to get married to someone who is also willing to go on reality TV. You wouldn't be married to them unless they also signed up for married at first sight. So it's like, you're already saying you're down for someone who's willing to get reality TV. So for me, I was like, it will be such a non-issue. And I was like, I know it'll come up because it's an easy thing to talk about, but I was like, I'll be able to instantly like set that record straight. And I felt like I did with Courtney, honestly, in like the first day or two, she was like, okay, yeah, I actually believe you're here for the right reasons. Like whatever. And I thought that was like the end of it, but it ended up getting brought up like a couple more times. I'm sure like she had producers in her ear or something like continuing to bring it up or something. But yeah, I don't know. I think it's like super hypocritical to go on married at first sight and then be like, actually, if you've done reality TV, I don't want to marry you. My follow-up question to that is not necessarily questioning your intentions. But as someone who's done multiple dating shows, I'm just curious about like your mindset. Obviously, like you're very intellectual, I imagine like thoughtful guy. And so like, as you know, like this, like, it's interesting to have Tori on hearing her perspective. Cause like you had, you've never done reality TV and these shows like, you know, love is blind marriage. They're truly the social experiments. They, they are controlled environments that, you know, like something can happen. These crazy shows, these crazy premises. But part of it is like kind of giving yourself to the experiment, which in like, you know, you can get into all nuance of like, you know, efficacy of producers and the way they guide you. But like, you know, if you really want to make this work, there's a little bit of blind faith and just letting go. And I'm curious for you, Nick, someone who's done reality TV, the more reality TV you do, the more like behind the curtain you see, the more familiar you get with production. It's, it's harder to immerse yourself in the experiment. So like, and this is only my experience. So maybe yours was different. But like every time I went on, you know, by the time I was the bachelor, like I was definitely hoping to meet my person, but I was way more pragmatic and a way more practical. And it was like, I'm the bachelor I'm playing a role, you know, is, and then when I went on paradise, I was like, there's no way I'm telling anyone I love them, but sure. If you want me to come on your silly show, I'll come on, you know? But like, cause I was the guy who like gave into the experiment twice. But by the time I was done with that, it was like, I can't, I can't even, I can't go there. So I'm curious. Like having done the other shows, knowing that you're about to like agree to marry someone you've never met, like, were you at least questioning your ability to tap in to the experiment that you were like, that, that you kind of needed to, for this to work? Good question. Yeah. Honestly, I think this was the show that I was most all in on because I knew that it wouldn't work unless I was all in. And so like, even I get in the first few episodes I'm in or whatever, I'm getting roasted on the internet for being so delusional. Because, you know, I'm poolside on my honeymoon, chilling. And I'm in my interviews, like, things are going great. Like, I like Courtney, we're vibing. And then she's in her interview saying like, everything's terrible. And like, they're like, wow, Nick is so delusional. How can he not read the room? It's because I went in so all in, like wanting it to work and like, so optimistic. I like told my whole family on the wedding day, I was like, guys, I don't care what you think about whoever my wife is. Just tell me that you're happy. And like, you hope it works because I don't need any red. Like, I don't want any negativity or anything. So I actually went in like delusionally optimistic for it. For as long as I could. And then I think I gave the benefit of the doubt for a really long time. Whereas like, some things were coming up, even in the honeymoon, but I was like, maybe it'll be different once we go to Seattle. And then like, you're in Seattle, it's been a week like, well, it's only been a week in Seattle, maybe like, when I get to know her one more week, it'll be different. And so I kept like trying to kind of make excuses for maybe compatibility will be. There at some point, and then eventually, like, obviously, we just had to call it off. But I, I was very much all in on it. When was the moment you were all out? Well, I mean, obviously, when we said we were done the real all out, but like, when you knew when you were like, I can't, there's no fucking way. There were red flags right out the gate, like literally, like day two or three or something. She had said how like her family makes fun of people that hold hands in public, like if they see a couple walking, holding hands, they're like, and I'm like, Oh, you're a whole family. So that was like, kind of an initial difference, which is why I think we got assigned Dr. Lisa as our expert, because she's like the sexology person. And so I think it was like, our first rift was around physical affection. So we got assigned Dr. Lisa. But the real when I knew I was fully all out. We had done a trip to Austin that doesn't get air. And the whole one of the big selling points of the trip was to get to the airport. get to know the real me because for some reason she had this like narrative that like i was reading a script and like just being performative for cameras so it was like nick if you're in the city you live in austin there's no camera crew with us i'll finally be able to get to know you and i was like sick let's do it i'll try anything and so we like come to austin and the very first night was to spend a whole evening together get sushi go like shopping like all this stuff and she tries to cancel on me and says she has a friend's birthday party wait what you're you're in austin for filming and she made other plans we're in well we have like production iphones to like film diary cams but we didn't have a production team with us but yeah it was literally two days to get to know each other and day one she's like nick can we actually maybe not do sushi and i actually also have a birthday party tonight and i was like um in austin yeah like actually no it'd be sick if we maybe like didn't cancel our sushi reservation and so we ended up getting sushi for for one hour and then i was like want to go get a drink she's like nope i'm i'm i feel nauseous or something and like went home so we saw each other one hour for day one so she didn't even go to the birthday party i don't know she might have she might have not i don't know she never like she went to the birthday party yeah wait she went to the birth she definitely went to that birthday party but the sushi made her nauseous yeah i don't know when did this take place in the timeline of y'all story though yeah so so then we had the next day where we get like dinner with her friends and my friends and the dinner's actually really fun and then we go out and i don't really see much of her and then we end up like i kind of tell her like hey i thought we would spend more time together in austin blah blah and then it's kind of what you see in the show too where it's like when i do express my feelings and stuff it gets shut down and so she ended up like crying and leaving um and so we didn't really see each other much that day either so then that night i call production and i'm like i i have to end it like this is not going to work so like at that moment i absolutely knew i was i was fully done i was like this is just not going to work and so then she shows me in the room with courtney saying i don't see how this is going to work long term and that's part of like a bigger discussion where we're like talking about the austin trip and stuff and um then courtney says well she kind of agrees that the trip was terrible and we have like no compatibility but she's like they don't air her saying this but she's like i just don't want to throw in the towel i don't want to give up yet so then i guess stupidly or something i was just like maybe there will be a change and so right after that conversation we go to the group session and that's where the experts keep going and i'm like i don't want to give up yet so then i guess saying like what's the point of staying what's the point of staying and then we're like wait why are we staying we kind of end it how honest with courtney were you in the sense that like it sounds like you just fundamentally disagreed with her point of view and if we're being real like you kind of thought she was the problem and like because you just said okay maybe you'll change right like you know i don't want she doesn't want to give up and you're thinking okay well the only way this works if you change how how honest with you or were you about how much change she needed to make for you to make for you to be happy it was actually a really difficult conversation to have because i would try telling her some things like i don't feel hurt like when i'm expressing my vulnerabilities and my thoughts i feel like you're shutting them down but then she would like shut me down saying that and stuff so like that was hard but then i also didn't want to discredit the fact that she did end up giving me like a hug a day and like a hug a day like a peck on the like left whatever and so like i didn't want to discredit that but it was also like a weird situation because like for me the physical side of things was progressing enough and like there was obvious you can point that's the thing about like physical affection you can point to that and be like i gave you a hug so i'm doing work and like me it was a lot harder to demonstrate that change of me being more vulnerable because it's like how do you quantify that that's hard and it's like i felt like when i was trying it was like not being received it would be like me telling courtney like can you give me a hug a day and then when she tries to hug me i like stiff armor and then i'm like why aren't you hugging me like that's kind of the situation that i was in where it's like i would try to be vulnerable get shut down and then she'd be like why are you not being vulnerable um so like that was hard but so i was like trying to like give her props for what i could obviously see on like the physical affection side but then also somehow try to be like i don't feel like i'm hurt i i want to get feel compliments and feel warm and flirty with you and and whatever and like but like a lot of those softer things i think are hard to at least were hard for me to a like probably fully verbalize and then also i've tried but i'm sure i didn't do the best job and then b it's like hard to track improvement on or like show that someone's putting in effort interesting uh tori i'm curious when when felipe at the end of the finale was like can we just be friends was that super annoying or the perfect kind of button to put on kind of the ridiculousness of like how his expectations of of relationships at that point like i remember like when he was talking to me and he said that i was like whatever he's taking i want some of that i think it just it got to such a point of ridiculousness that you couldn't even justify like oh well you know maybe like we grew up different or maybe like our families are different and i do know i i will say this i think i don't know if i aired at reunion but i did say this of like um i have friends that are from costa rica and they also said and i have some friends from brazil but they also said that like south america um how they raised their sons and daughters like culturally like it's a little different than the u.s and so how he was raised i feel like aligns with that but this is just such a stretch of like can we be friends or and at this point after he said how he cheated on me constantly and i know the show the way they aired that it was like it's gonna be this huge thing or huge bomb but um i think at that point i just was like you know i'm not gonna be friends with him i'm not gonna be friends with him i'm not gonna be so over it but you couldn't even really come to grips of like how he got to that thinking and it was like at this point when he revealed the like cheating on me constantly he's like crying as he's saying it and i mean like if he cried on command it is impressive like i will say but um so i think at that point it just was like i didn't even know what was like real or what wasn't and what was just totally like such a and when he told me the constantly cheating part that's the point where i was like okay so like all of this pretty much was like a complete act for him and so it just was like ridiculous but i was like how i don't know if it's phony or whatever but it just like par for the course at the reunion he said that he you know he was like it's been a year i've really changed i've done the work do you believe that he's capable of changing and doing the work within a year time span i mean i don't know i mean i feel like the things that we were even talking about reunion he was like yeah that was spliced like and it wasn't and it was like for me to like how much have you changed the fact you're like if like marissa and i are both like that's not splice so i don't know it didn't sound like it very much to be totally honest but i also think people who say i've changed and done the work haven't because you would be more specific yeah what did you change and what was the work you thought you needed to do tory i have a question do you know the taxicab theory do you and do you think that felipe is somebody that will ever turn their light green like do you think he'll ever be ready to settle down or do you think that he's just going to live this life forever i don't know because i do know like i mean there's kind of like again going back to cultural and not trying to like um you know totally lean on them but i do think that like there's kind of a stigma with brazilian guys but i also think that there's also a ton of you know just as many brazilian guys who are married and happy so um and monotheists but i feel like with felipe i don't really know because like i said there's this too hot to handle comments and then there's this like giddiness to talk to the guys after we were intimate so i just like there was just so much proof that he just so got in that space were you gonna date felipe um like a couple days before does it like did you see felipe's thread three hours ago where he said my ex-wife asked if i wanted to date after the show three days before decision day story time on tiktok whenever i'm get bored on vacation nick thank you for your question for your um sorry investigating yo woes bomb sam's alert welcome to the vile file nick tori do you wish to comment on this egregious allegation yes so when we were talking at the bedroom basically when he was talking about these cheating comments and things like that and the too hot to handle and those types of things when he was saying that and also as he was saying that i was i was believing him which again this is like this dumbest thing i think ever but um so i really believe that it was kind of an act for him to get clout and so then when we were talking on the bed about this and earlier when he first dropped his cheating comments he basically told me that he was so stressed out because he really wanted to say yes but it would have been like we're married and i was like we don't have to like there's other options in this like we don't have to get married because he was acting really stressed out about it so that's where he was kind of like playing it from that angle and then that's how that conversation got up later is because we were discussing dating after so you're being pragmatic about just the situation you two were in yes and now he's using that as a way to get clout again sounds about right and also like you can change your phone you can a lot can change in three days on reality tv including your point of view and whether you're going to get married or not and so i was like i'm going to get married and i'm going to have a baby and i'm going to have kids and i'm going to have kids and i'm going to have kids and i'm going to have kids and i'm going to have kids and i'm going to have kids and i'm going to have kids and i'm going to have kids and i'm going to have kids and i'm going to have kids and you know have someone in your life um so you know thanks for the tea nick yeah nick you're messy for that and i love it did you know that he had posted that tori i didn't but i had i really had a hunch because he said how to post on instagram like that he was going to do some live that the real truth was coming out so i knew because there wasn't anything that was really well maybe he's gonna write a tell all like um yeah oh we can only hope give us the tell all but i didn't i did have a feeling because that's kind of the only thing that he could kind of like stretch like that um and then the other thing on threads it's he's kind of a hoot to like he just got on there but it is funny but he also said like a couple days ago like i also said no for the record i saw that so he's having a time what do you mean like because he was going to but you beat him to it or something yeah like i think that he just wants for the record i was going to say no also so it's kind of like i said part for the course well i mean technically he did he said he just wanted to be friends and and cheat and cheat on you yeah 100 and also i think at reunion what i think we know felipe yeah we get it but but at corpus retreat i didn't see this because i was crying but when he hopped off the bed did you guys see that he hopped off the bed and it was like he was going to chucky cheese tori i literally was like when you said you can go back to your single life and he was like all right like i'm not going to go back to your single life and he was like i'm not going to go back to your single life and he was like all right like i'm not going to go back to your single life and he was like all right like i'm not going to go back to your single life and he was like all right like i'm not going to go back to your single life and he was like all right like i'm not going to go back to your single life and he was like all right like i'm not going to go back to your single life and he was like all right like i'm not going to go back to your single life and he was like all right like i'm not going to go back to your single life and he was like all right like i wouldn't want to switch spots tori do you feel cheated from this experience because like you know hearing your point of view it does make me sad because i think it's a very human thing to question these experiments the first time you're going in and and you got paired with someone who quite frankly like made it more confusing and because it sounds like honestly felipe didn't take it all that serious um and maybe it's because he doesn't think himself you know maybe he doesn't take his dating life that serious but like for a guy who's you know all jokes aside talking about going on too hot to handle and his partner on the other side is like hey i'm gonna show up to this thing i'm gonna agree to do this crazy thing get married i'm gonna i'm gonna put my trust in a lot of people including the person across from me who's also agreeing to do the scary thing and yet it seems like he didn't take it all that serious yeah i i don't i feel like he didn't also um but i think i like i don't regret it and i don't like you you get through it and stuff but i also think like what i learned in the process and also like when he did all this stuff like when he told me like i thought about cheating on you constantly i like no one knows this but i i completely like again i did not at all give him anything but i was like the way he said it and how he like delivered all this like he was this victim trapped in this body that wants to sleep with everything in sight so much tortured and so i just felt like chill and i just was like babe it's just a show it's just a show and then i just like totally like and because i just couldn't give him a single anything at that point because it just was like a train wreck being drug up and down the street yeah like through this and so um so he didn't know that i did the diary camera at the end and so it was it was awfully um i don't know what to say like it just was like in the end like i feel like i got out alive i hate that you feel that way though it sucks felipe is the uh like personification of my mind's telling me no but my body my body he really is nick should we talk about you trying to come for my husband i was informed of that this morning let's talk about it about the number of shows he's been on or a different oh was there a different one well i just don't know how much research you all did so literally not literally not that's so funny are you gonna spin uh spin the block for uh somebody else partner that relationship didn't work out i'm curious about this with jalissa no no no i'm actually seeing someone we're actually going glamping for a few days right after this i was hoping that's who he was going glamping with how long you've been dating this person like almost two months i think like around the time of the reunion we had only been seeing each other for like - You didn't want to bring her to the reunion? like adam yeah but now yeah it's been a while um it's i would not recommend um starting to date someone as um your marriage is being broadcast on tv it's not the best timing but uh it's been like nice to be able to like talk through too early to say she's the one we'll find out uh see i'm not like a bit married at first sight or something but like oh boy tune in stay tuned next time on let's pick nick are you done with reality tv competition shows if this doesn't work out would you explore love is blind oh i'm absolutely done with reality dating shows would never do another one but competition shows i would for sure do like traitors but not let's marry nick age of attraction uh age of attraction no i'm done with date i'm almost 33 i'm not doing any more dating shows i heard from a bird or maybe you said this already online but it's uh you didn't think what nick said was true i'm not doing any more dating shows i'm not doing any more dating what adam said to courtney at the reunion was that bad what adam said to courtney excuse me what adam said to courtney about the pickleball where like he made her cry yeah yeah yeah like okay so all adam said i mean he said it in a in a mean bad guy tone but all he said was like i would not have been able to last a week with courtney and she also sucks at pickleball like that's not that deep he kind of doubled down though i do we agree that adam's reaction was more insane courtney's response to adam's because like i just couldn't believe he went full-on like high school gym bro who's like i can whip your ass and pickleball and what was what felt mean about it as a viewer is that it was giving the internet's matching him and her and he's offended by it and he had such a weird reaction that it was like and that if you if you received it that way if you're courtney is pretty fucking mean yeah so i think that what in reality happened was he was kind of getting like dogpiled on a bit at the reunion okay like everyone bringing up receipts to different things and so i'm sure he felt like defensive about it and like then that question gets asked and he just had all these like emotions building up and kind of let it out on her and that's why there was so much like heat and emotion behind it but i don't think it was like i mean i'm just guessing but like i don't think it was all actually like because of courtney like directed at courtney but it was like he was taking a lot of heat at the reunion and she was just like the next question i asked about him and it's just like got that feels like it makes it worse it feels like you don't have the emotional maturity maybe like let me not take this out on her right now i'm curious though i know obviously everything said and done now and adam has said that he he couldn't last a week with her but if they were originally paired this is like for both of you guys do you think that it could have worked like if they both stepped into the arranged marriage and were like okay let's see if we can make this work to me on paper they actually seem like they would make sense but they're just very intense what do y'all think yeah i i don't think it would just because i feel like adam i don't know i feel like yeah i i don't think that'd work i think they're both maybe adam like alphas or like wanting to lead the charge like i don't know if you saw but like you know adam wants things a certain way all throughout the season and i think that like courtney also would want to do her own thing and i think that would probably be a problem i also agree with nick i think it was misplaced energy because it was coming off of right after the hinge comment and all of that stuff and i don't think he realized that marissa has been like literally like i mean every other girl she talks to in seattle has receipts of adam so like it's just been like rico case is huge so i think that it was like i think he was really shaking because he wasn't anticipating it happening but all of it was true and all of it did happen but i think he was totally putting it towards courtney um over those things and i don't think what he said was really egregious but i also think it was true and all of it did happen but i think he was totally putting it towards courtney like that it was like he got worked up and he's gotten worked up at group dinners before for like some comments and so i knew that that was probably going to happen so that's why i also said something because it just was like it had nothing to do with courtney why he was worked up it does make i mean him and his new girlfriend if they're still together they do seem like a match made in heaven because she was like and that's why i can beat him in pickleball as soon as his arms healed i'm beating him in pickleball and it's like okay you too was he obsessed with jess keys is is the show let on is jet ski culture bro like if you have a jet ski you like to take girls on a jet ski i do have a jet ski and it's nice for like a spin now and then i am currently up at the lake and i've used it once it's nice you know took my daughter on you rip in the jet ski took it for a spin you know but he seemed he seemed deeply obsessed you and adam should race he was obsessed with uh jet skis and pickleball um but then like obviously when you're watching the show and they're like taking conversation like it it seems more obsessed than it was but he for sure has deep passion for jet ski we actually i haven't said this but like so like i said with like every other girl in seattle has some type of story but i didn't realize this but when we were starting to film and the jet skis got brought up i was like oh i matched on raya like maybe like seven eight months ago or something i was like there was a jet ski guy and it was agonizing did he have swim socks in the photos no swim socks were present no swim socks that was a new that was a new found thing how did adam get on raya that's a great question they had me on the damn waiting list for a minute they do that to reality guys no this was before all right you won't let me on i have 29 referrals and they won't let me on what was the pickup line what did he say to you it was something and like we know from what from the rico case we know that it's the like his line that he uses but um it was something like hey i have a jet ski do you want to like fucking do it around on the jet ski and then i think i said like can i like uh where you are floating or whatever and you like bump them off and you just like whip them around so i was like yeah can i just like whip you off and then um i don't remember what he said but i didn't reply to that so so you've messaged on raya and hinge yeah he is finding you everywhere key message you jet ski dudes man you gotta watch out for them if they single nick not now you know what i'm saying jet skis are fun i like jet ski yeah they're fun but like if you own a jet ski i'm telling man i know no boys with jet skis all red flags i'm telling you i think that he's it's true his passion is true that's fascinating wild tori are you dating anyone no i'm well i'm going on but like not dating it i think there's a really great man out there for you i think you're the full package thank you hey nick were those tears real at the start of the show not at the end oh right at the start those were very real with my dad and everything getting all like emotional for my wedding day um the tears at the end were real but i think they were mainly of relief to be honest like that it was over i can't understand that uh nick and tori really appreciate you guys taking the time this was a fun conversation um it's a it's a fascinating show and uh thanks for the insight on on what you guys went through it um it was a trip to watch i'm sure it was even tripier to experience uh and uh nick have fun on your date thank you clamping trip and tori best of luck uh you don't need it to hear from us but it seems like you have a lot going for you and i'm sure nothing but great things ahead especially for your love life thank you thank you guys so much uh take care guys appreciate you thanks bye bye guys good to see you all right well that will wrap up today episode thank you for listening we'll see you back on uh tuesday uh we have uh the queen herself heather debrow will have also some more cast members from married at first sight to really wrap up that season and so much more thanks for listening don't don't forget to check out the episode with corbin that going deeper dropped yesterday always great to have you jimmy and suzy i love you natalie um i hope that goes without saying uh we will uh see you next time bye you