91: Dr. Uma Naidoo - Nutritional Psychiatry and What to Eat to Feel Good

The following podcast is a deer media production. Hey, welcome to the Blond Files podcast. I'm your host, Aria Laurie, and I'm here to talk all things wellness. From how to achieve optimal health and well-being to the best beauty tips and everything in between, no topic is off limits. I know there is so much information out there, so I'm here to help you navigate it all and live your best life. Thanks for listening, let's get into it. Hello, everybody. Happy New Year. I hope everybody is feeling good, feeling positive, and hopeful coming into 2021. I personally am feeling pretty good. I had the most boring New Year's Eve. I think I was asleep by like 9/30 or 10, but you know, very on brand for 2020, but yeah, feeling pretty good, cautiously optimistic at this point. Three days as I record this in two of the year. And yeah, at least we're all safe and healthy, and we've made it this far, right? So, I have a fascinating episode today. I'm talking to Dr. Uma Nhaju. She is a Harvard-trained psychiatrist, and she founded and directs the first hospital-based nutritional psychiatry service in the United States. She is the director of nutritional and lifestyle psychiatry at Mass General Hospital, Mass at Houston's General Hospital, MGH. It's a big hospital out there in the East Coast, and she is also the director of nutritional psychiatry at Mass General Hospital Academy while serving on the faculty at Harvard Medical School. She has a new book called This Is Your Brain on Food that is amazing. It combines her knowledge of psychiatry with her knowledge about food, and she draws from over 500 different studies to explain how different nutrients affect our moods, our bodies, and various issues like depression, anxiety, fatigue, low sex drive, OCD, PTSD, and more. She also talks a lot about the gut brain connection, or as she calls it, the gut brain romance, and we talk about all of that in this episode, and more. So, enjoy. So welcome, Dr. Nhaju. Thank you so much for being here. Thanks so much, Ariel. I really appreciate the invitation. I've been reading your book, and I shared it on Instagram, and I'm sure a lot of the audience already has it, but you have a new book. This is Your Brain on Food. It is amazing. It's such a great resource for anybody who wants to learn about nutrition, how it affects your mind, your body, your cognitive function mood, all of that. So, to start out, I would love to just hear about your career trajectory, the evolution of how you went from psychiatry to where you are now with nutritional psychiatry. Thanks. So it's interesting, because I really began in my childhood. My relationship with food was both around family, a very large South Asian family that I grew up in, many generations, large family meals, and I focused on good eating and healthy eating, but also joy around food and nutrients. So, I really stems from way back when, but also my family. There were a large number of allopathic doctors and a couple of diabetic practitioners. So, there was a sense of healthy eating, as well as just learning something about food, and I brought that with me, because in a lot South Asian family, also, many cooks in the kitchen, you know, grandmother's aunts, older cousins, mothers. So, there was much that I needed to do except hanging around and taste food, but it was always really around food. But my mum is a double boarded physician, and she recognized that I loved science, so she taught me how to bake and measure. So, I could bake, but I really didn't come to cooking until later, and when I discovered cooking, it was, as I was studying in Boston, and I realized that when I went to prepare, whichever meal it was, that that was for me a very mindful time, and almost a respite from the rest of my busy day studying. And I found that I was looking forward to it more, even though I was, you know, testing recipes that I'd watched my mum prepare at home or using her spice flence. And it not only brought me a sense of comfort in terms of, you know, having moved far away from where I was born, but also, I realized that this was a great time in my day to decompress. And my interest in love for cooking really developed in a very real way, and I was, you know, watching Julia Childs on television, because very couldn't afford a flawed cable TV in those days. And she was on public television, and that helped me gain confidence as a young cook, really, that, you know, you could make mistakes and fix them. And all of this happened at the same time and without much planning, but also I think that, but I would think looking back is that I followed my instinct. I loved cooking, I did more of it. I loved learning about nutrition. I wanted to study more, and I understood there was a real gap in medical school. And that brought this forward into when I began to see patients in mental health and in psychiatry. I really wanted to ask them more, because also that Hindu background came with mindfulness and meditation learning that as a child yoga practice and that type of thing and really looking at health in a very holistic way. And I guess automatically that kicked in when I began to see patients. And I started to ask about what they were eating, and after being yelled at by patients where I was very early in my career, and being able to take that situation and turn it around by providing information to him that was then valuable about what he was drinking and eating really helped me understand how valuable it was. What a powerful tool nutrition was to someone who was whether they were struggling with emotional well-being or other things, how powerful it could be as a tool, because it was a tool that they could employ, they could use. And I had learnt the power of a prescription pad. But I think that what was very appealing about sharing nutritional strategies with someone was that they could feel empowered and that they could make choices. And it blended into my career in a more longitudinal way, my trip to culinary school was really a trip of passion and wanting to follow something that I love to do. I didn't know that it would fit into my career in a particular way. And I was very blessed that it did come together in the way that my career came together and forming the clinic that I work in in Rondon, Mass General. And that's really how it came to be putting those components together in a recipe that was somewhat unplanned and for which I feel very grateful. New years are all about fresh starts, right? And there's no way to be fresher literally than with native deodorants. So I've been using native for years since I worked with them and I think it was 2018. And since then I have just never deviated. Native has always worked for me. It smells amazing. It doesn't irritate my skin. So, you know, I've just never had any reason to use anything else. Native deodorants are aluminum-free. They use ingredients like coconut oil and shea butter and a big plus is that none of their products are used on animals and almost everything is vegan. So you can choose from over 10 cents including coconut and vanilla, citrus and herbal musk, lavender and rose. I usually use the citrus and herbal musk, but I just ran out. So now I'm using cucumber mint, which is also amazing. They're all really amazing. I'm telling you guys this stuff works. So make the switch to native today by going to native deodor.com/blond. That's nativideodeo.com/blond. Or use the promo code blonde at checkout and you can get 20% off your first order. So again, that's nativedeodor.com. Nativideodeo.com/blond.com/blond. Or promo code blonde at checkout for 20% off your first order. I was reading in your book. You were talking about traditional psychiatry and you said that, you know, psychiatry, you look for symptoms and then you make a diagnosis and often that diagnosis comes with the prescription of medication, right? But oftentimes people come in with depression or anxiety that's very real, but it doesn't meet the criteria for medication. In traditional psychiatry, how would one fill that gap without lifestyle modification or something like what you do? That's actually a great question because I think that when you're seeing a psychiatrist in a hospital or clinic, much of that is insurance driven by time, by coding, by billing, and it's the doctors are really under a lot of pressure to make a decision and see the next client. It's not that they trying in any way to not give you the time you deserve. This is for that issue, but there's also the issue of how the diagnostic and statistical manual DSM-5 is set up. You know, there's no tissue diagnosis in psychiatry, so there's no blood culture, blood test, brain biopsy, or other culture that you can do if you have an infection and you have a cough, you know, the culture that you have. dispute them. They might give blood culture, but it's a severe infection in your hospitalized. But we don't have that in mental health. We don't have that in psychiatry. That really clinically as someone who's been a practicing clinician for a couple of decades now. What I see a lot of is in those individuals who don't quite meet the diagnosis of those criteria from DSM-5, but are still suffering a struggling on some level. And I think bringing it back to the point about the way that doctors are expected to use appointments when you see some in a nucleic or a hospital, the tendency is let me pull out my prescription pad and give you something to try. And I feel like individuals who think, well, you don't need a medication, may then refer you to different forms of therapy, all of which I support wholeheartedly because I really think that if you are taking medication therapies and the different types that we do in psychiatry and in mental health are worthwhile. But I feel that that gap that you pointed to is exactly what is missing in our approach to mental health. There isn't really a holistic or integrated approach. And I think that lifestyle changes individuals who are not suffering to the point that they can function. If you can function, but you're not feeling good if COVID has pushed your mood in wrong direction, it might be that you can actually do these lifestyle changes to fold that gap if it makes sense. And I see that as not really existing in traditional practice right now. Perhaps it will change, I'm not sure, but really it comes from the clinician being willing to look at the other components and sometimes that's driven by not having enough time as well. Right. So I'm curious how you work with your patient, if somebody comes in to see you and they're feeling anxious or they're feeling depressed. Obviously you talk about different cases in the book. And so I would like to hear just kind of how you look at somebody holistically and how you might treat them, understanding that it's very individualized. And then the second part of that question is you said one of your your earliest success stories was a referral from an infectious disease specialist. And I would love to hear a little more about that if you can share what that case was like. Sure. So a couple of things, I think that microbiome is really like a thumbprint. So each case has now, my clinic over the years of running it, has become so much more personalized because of understanding more research and knowing that individuals have different responses. So on that point, the way that I employ a holistic model is I really spend the first visit with someone finding out as much as I can beyond the traditional good and comprehensive history that a doctor or a psychiatrist would take. So I literally want to know what they're doing not only, so just a food log. It's what they're doing, how are they sleeping? What's affecting their sleep, you know, do they have a pet? It could be as important as or someone might think that it's irrelevant, but you know, are you moving? Are you doing any exercise? Are you doing a dance class? Are you walking a dog? So I find out as much as I can, I'm kind of inquisitive and curious at the same time to find out about someone. A lot of the referrals I have now are really for nutritional psychiatrists. So people come in with a good sense of what they're looking for, and sometimes the decision tree for me is, are you, you know, are you doing okay? You still have symptoms that we can help with, but can you manage the rest of your life? And I'll give you an example. I evaluated someone in the last six months that had severe symptoms of OCD that had been lifelong, and I'd taken medications back and forth. But when I truly evaluated the symptoms, I have to say that she didn't necessarily like the conclusion of what I said, but I said, you know, I'm going to give you all my recommendations, but I am also going to tell you as someone who prescribes medication, I wasn't have the scribe issue, seen some of that. I think you should, you should take a little bit of the medication and do the lifestyle strategies because your symptoms of OCD have you locked in. They have you afraid to do certain things. They have you nothing able to enjoy aspects of your life even with COVID restrictions. And, you know, I had to be very honest and transparent about it. I said, I think you need to do a little bit of both to make this what you need. And yet there are other people who have others who may come in with symptoms of OCD, who have milder symptoms. And they actually could engage in the nutritional strategies to help alleviate some of that so that they continue to function. Will all of the symptoms go away? Maybe not, but they could be lessened to the point that the person can really feel they can, they are functioning better. So it gets complicated. And sometimes I go back and say, you know, I'm really sorry, but I think you need to do some of this because there are these reasons that you're not functioning. And that's where clinical training and knowing the psychiatric diagnosis and having some clinical experience becomes quite important. When it comes to specific patients and how they've been, how they've been referred, I was interested that, you know, the, the, the clinician who referred that particular individual had the wherewithal to realize that the gut microbiome research is really burgeoning and is really increased over time. And she figured that the client had actually read about me and and had asked, you know, and said, I really think there's something wrong here. I want to get help from this doctor. Can you arrange it? And so I give both, both people credit for that because the doctor could have said, I think that's, you know, I think that's not going to work for you and you really shouldn't do that. But she didn't, you know, she contacted me. She had a conversation with me, which is very helpful. And I also give the client credit because she had read about something and she said, Oh, there's the Scott microbiome and I want to know more. And I think it was, you know, ended up being very meaningful for everyone because that is to go back to an earlier question for you. That's really how change starts to get implemented in a medical system isn't it that people are open, willing to look at other ways to help, help patients, willing to refer to another colleague and get some input on that. And it's a name is very important for me. If you're staring at a screen all day or looking at your phone constantly or waking up and scrolling Instagram or watching TV before bed, which let's be real, I'm sure a lot of us are doing. I mean, that's life today. I do it too. But if you're doing that, you could be welcoming unnecessary stress, anxiety, discomfort, like eye strain, headaches, insomnia and more into your life. So that's right. Blue light is the culprit here and it is everywhere. Unfortunately, that's why I use blue blocks, blue light blocking glasses. I've been using these for about a year now. 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And I've always shared very openly about them. And I was very overwhelmed by the response that it seems like everybody is dealing with it. And it always kind of, it just makes me wonder why it's so prevalent right now. Maybe is it just that we're more aware of it and learning more about it. And so people are more cognizant of what's happening. And for people who don't know, maybe can you just, in layman's terms, talk about how they are connected. Absolutely. And until about 15 to 16 years ago, let's just say in the last two decades, that's really when they got microbiome research version. So if people weren't hearing, much about it, it was because it wasn't in scientific journals and the research was still being done etc. So I think that the way it starts for people and where it's important in mental health is that the cliche you know you are what you eat becomes much more relevant. The gut and brain may seem far apart in the body for most people but they are actually originating in the embryo from the same cells and that becomes really important to understand their functioning later in life. So they grow into different parts of our body but the government of brain are connected. They're then connected by the vagus nerve which is the 10th cranial nerve which connects the gut to the brain and the brain to the gut and that acts like a two-way superhighway, allowing for 24/7 channeling of information, really chemical messages back and forth throughout the throughout time. So there's that connection and then you know the 39-odd trillion bacteria but really microbes because there are about five different types that live in the gut and they are impacted by food but what's important to know is that you know people are often prescribed medications such as selective serotonin we have taken inhibitors like prozac or so off to many others but the serotonin receptor is more than 95% are in the gut so that's that's really helpful for people to know. The fourth fact that I think is super important about the gut brain access is that the very large component of our immune system is the gut so how we eat as far better immunity becomes important as well it becomes better it becomes a bone farm mental health and it becomes important for immunity as well as our physical health but you know my focus it tends to be on the on the mental health. So your book covers 10 different conditions and you know how nutrition affects those conditions in good ways and in bad ways right so how to use nutrition to treat those conditions and how you might kind of lifestyle your way into that so we can't go over all of them unfortunately but there are some big ones and a lot of people sent in questions particularly around anxiety. Everybody wants to know what do I eat for anxiety. So you know I think that what's super important here is that we start off we start off with things that we should be concerned to avoid and the reason I say that is because so much of our so much of what we are often doing I think you've had the expression that you cannot exercise out of a bad diet well in a similar way you know you you really can't sort of eat your way happy. So in other words what do I mean by that you know eating poorly and taking supplements that doesn't help us and I think that it becomes really important for people to truly know the things to avoid first so they can they can start to be wary of them. Why do I say that? Because there are individuals who have said you know I'm trying to cut back and sugar I know it's bad for me I know worsens worsens how I feel but they go from having a lot of sugar say candy bars maybe that's the person the thing that the person is eating and they start to drink or eat foods that have artificial sweetness and the foods are labeled sugar free so they thinking this is great I can you know come off sugar but unfortunately artificial sweetness worsens anxiety so if we were to go through it very quickly highly processed and ultra processed foods worsens symptoms of anxiety trans fats you know and processed vegetable oils are problematic for anxiety the more high glycemic index carbohydrates can basically not help anxiety refined and added sugars so not necessarily from food which is a natural sugar certain amounts of coffee so less than 400 milligrams a day is what's suggested and if you are sensitive to coffee then cutting it cutting back on it and coming off of coffee may be important you know having a moderate level of alcohol intake and in certain cases also watching the amount of gluten that you eat if in fact it's quite possible gluten may be driving your symptoms of anxiety and why is that important because you know gluten has been shown in studies to worsen in certain individuals sort of level of anxiety and and therefore I think that people need to not necessarily just go out and eliminate it off you know immediately really assess their body intelligence see how they feel see if they start to you know take out the foods that I just mentioned maybe they were hidden in things that you don't realize for example processed vegetable oils are used in many fast food restaurants because it's less expensive but that could be setting up information in your body because of the omega-6 to omega-3 ratio so so small things that someone for example told me that they were buying a healthier version of ketchup because they know that I talk about the added sugars and savory foods like ketchup and water healthy ketchup and then found was reading the label and found that ingredient as an artificial sweetener which was listed in my book and realized you know I'm moving to this healthy ketchup but actually it contains ingredients that are worse than my anxiety so it becomes just a fast thing observed and reading food labels and understanding now what are the things you can add add in and that can help you when you can start in with things like adding fiber which foods why do I say that because fiber which foods break down more slowly in your body therefore there's less of an insulin spike when you have them so if you have a sugary donut or something like that you may have what people will experience as a sugar crash or you know feel feel okay when you have it because you liked it or you enjoyed it and then not feel so great afterwards when you eat more filling and fiber rich foods there's an evening out of your blood sugar level so there's less of those insulin spikes if not in all and the food is broken down and digested in your body and you just don't have those ups and downs which can actually make people feel quite uncomfortable so you know we can't get fiber from animal and seafood protein but adding in veggies and you know servings, one to two servings of low glycemic food like berries are really good so you know load up on the broccoli the process sprouts the cauliflower and then you know things like nuts and seeds have a good amount of fiber them so add those in you know so think healthy salad think lots lots of colors and lots of seeds and crunch and fiber rich foods and then another category food is omega-3s so things like fatty fish which are things like salmon sardines and but then plant-based sources such as algae, flax seeds, chia seeds are also sources of omega-3s to remember and then I go to vitamin D rich foods a very important category because although we get more than 80% of our vitamin D from sunshine there are also vitamin D rich foods that can help anxiety magnesium rich foods to help anxiety easy ones are chickpeas, pumpkin seeds, avocado, black beans and then adding back three in probiotic foods also become important because the pre- and probiotic foods and probiotic foods are usually what would be often see as fermented foods those actually really help cut the gut thrive and those got microbes thrive so adding those in in the form of a probiotic rich yoghurt, dairy, a non-dairy, unsweetened or pre-botic foods, easy to remember the allium fambia there's there's many of them but things like garlic onions leaks are ways to really enrich the in which the diet that those got microbes need to thrive and by doing that you really taking care you're fortifying your mental health by doing that so those are sort of the categories that I go through with people of things to to start embracing and also spices, turmeric with a pinch of black pepper really has hit the high notes and a lot of conditions including anxiety so I would add that to a tea a soup of smoothie if you don't cook and try to add that in the black pepper makes the curcumin and turmeric more bioactive bio available to your brain and body so just add a little pinch of black pepper. When it comes to sugars this is another question that I get anytime I have a doctor on any any expert talking about nutrition and people ask this of you today as well when it comes to sugar is a sugar a sugar a sugar a sugar is coconut sugar it's better than brown sugar is maple syrup better than either of those I mean is it all the same obviously all of it in moderation but is there a difference of how they affect your body and your mental health? Sure so I think that's a great question I sort of look at sugars in this way they're sort of the added and refined sugars that I'm most concerned about that we don't realize on foods because they're probably close to 250 other names for sugar now they're on food labels so it's quite often that people don't even realize they're taking in sugar and something that they eat which they might perceive to be otherwise healthy or have a label that suggests to them it might be healthy. I think of a good way to get in natural sources of sugar through the lead taking to eating fruit, but eating is moderation. So there's certain circumstances. If someone is overweight, struggling with that as one of their mental health conditions, as a part of depression, maybe they've taken a medication or maybe they've had symptoms of depression and really been eating to feel emotionally better, but actually then gained weight. You know, the idea wouldn't be, let's eat a ton of fruit, but you can always eat lower glycemic fruit, like various strawberries and blueberries being my favorite and eat small portions. So one, two, up most, you know, most being three servings, but one to two is what I usually got people to do. And the way that I also like people to use fruit, as you have seen in my book, is to really get that edge of a sweet tooth by including fruit in their diet, either in using whole fruit to make desserts or some kind of snack that you'd like, maybe you'd like something sweet after dinner or lunch. So think of fruit that way. The reality about the type of sugars that it, it's a natural sugar, it is for sugars. So you want to think about getting a trominational sauce and also the fact that the fiber, the vitamins, the phytochemicals and nutrients in that piece of fruit, you are also getting. So think about a little plump blueberry and realize you're getting so much more than if you, you know, you were having some type of other sugar. But the rest of the sugars, they all break down to sugar. So the one that I will say drizzle in a recipe is a little bit of honey, because honey has many other health benefits. So I feel it's one that I've come to terms with as added drizzle of honey to say the chocolate avocado most ever made. And added drizzle to say you want the topping on your oatmeal, although I'm gonna say you're cinnamon because cinnamon can sweeten it too. And so I'd like to suggest to people use low glycemic fruit. If you don't have an issue with so much depends, then expand to other food 'cause those good for you, low glycemic fruit may be healthier just because you won't have the added sugar. Slip up when you eat your food, use it, eat your servings throughout the day and try to eat your fruit, not drink your food. Because I say each of your berries don't drink them because you lose some of the fiber in that as well as nutrients. And in terms of yeah, the sugars, I'm sorry, they ask sugar. Including honey, but honey has a ton of other health benefits too. - I'm just waiting for someone to tell me that I can just eat coconut sugar forever in pounds and it won't affect me at all. (laughs) - I think we always said that was the case. - Okay, so another issue that you talk about that I think a lot of people are dealing with right now is insomnia, fatigue, energy issues. How can we treat that with our nutrition? - So you know, with insomnia, one of the things that I start with is sleep hygiene because especially in COVID times with people working from home, many different sort of age groups of the family being home together, homeschooling in the amount of stress that people are just generally experiencing, age persons situation may be different. Someone may be on their own and isolated from their family to COVID. I mean, it's everyone is different. So starting with sleep hygiene is important and I really personally feel that you know, getting ready for bed, paying attention to when you drink alcohol, if you drink it, when you drink coffee, if you drink it, paying attention to hydration, making sure you adequately hydrated throughout the day is really important. So all of that, and also then thinking about, you know, when do you shut off your phone, or when do you leave your phone in another room? When do you shut off the television, you know, is your bedroom where you sleep, you know, get rest full for the night versus kind of eating your pizza and bed, or you know, happens that may have developed you in COVID because it's such an unusual time. So pay attention to those things because they do affect the brain. They do affect how you get ready, how your body gets ready to rest. Alcohol, you know, if you're having a glass of wine or two to help you sleep during COVID, that's probably disrupting your sleep architecture. So even though it might put you to sleep, it's not the best choice for you. And people don't often realize that because they feel a calming feeling, or they feel a sleepy feeling, and they feel ready for bed. But over time, it affects your sleep architecture. But things that you can do, there's a good amount of evidence for a touch of cherry juice that you can make from touch trees. You can actually get touch trees. They exist. And you can make a little bit of juice. And if you are buying such a juice, just make sure that you're looking at the sugar content in that. But it actually helps people go to sleep. When I've had people try it, and buy some healthy versions and really use drink a little bit of it and really sleep much better. So that's a tip that came out in the research. And the other tip I have around in some is to flip your breakfast. And the reason is that there are several breakfast foods which have melatonin. Things like good quality oats, eggs, certain forms of good quality dairy, certain vegetables have melatonin. So think about making an omelette and having it at dinner time. And if you eat there, you can add in some milk, grass-fed mocus, what I generally prefer. If you are able to get it, and then add in, it'sparagus and broccoli. And you actually have something with several melatonin-rich foods in it. And there's a list of many other foods with melatonin in my book. But just think about putting those foods into your dinner time frame and sort of getting your body ready for sleep. And then watching for hidden sources of caffeine, there are several over-the-counter headache pose which have caffeine. So beware of that because you may be taking that and not realize it has a good amount of caffeine in it. Sometimes it's finding those hidden sources and making sure you are kind of winding down to rest at night. Another question that I get all the time that I wanted to ask you myself as well is about breakfast. I think it's a meal that so many people struggle with because kind of traditional breakfast is either very carb, loaded, and sugary. Or it involves animal protein. And a lot of people now are vegan, vegetarian. So it feels like the options are kind of limited and in more traditional breakfasts. I've had people on who said, well, you don't have to eat breakfast food for breakfast. First of all, that's a mindset that we can break. But I think people are just kind of at a loss as to what to do. So what's a good breakfast in your mind or what do you eat for breakfast? Sure. I think breakfast is all about planning because people, even if they're working from home, they tend to be busy. And so I do as much meal planning as I can because I'm busy. And one of my favorite go-tos is cheer pudding. Something I can prep on the weekend because that happens to be a chunk of time and I can do meal prep for me. So someone also could be a Wednesday. It's just dependent on your work schedule or your life schedule. Cheer pudding is simple. And I like it because it has coconut milk and chia seeds. Chia seeds are super rich in fiber and protein. And they are a great source of short-chain omega-3. So I know they're good brain food for me. So I make-- I prep some ahead in small containers and I therefore have something ready. If I don't happen to eat it for breakfast, I have something else. I can also have that as a snack. And then I top it with my favorite toppings that things like a little bit of chopped hazelnuts or macadamia just for the crunch. Or I put some blueberries or a little bit of both. I might add a sprinkle of cinnamon. So I make it interesting for myself. But I make it interesting with easy things that I end my fridge on my counter, on my spice cabinet, to make-- and I think that that just takes-- it takes a stress-out of breakfast because you have something ready. You maybe have a cup of coffee like I do or a glass of port, whatever it is, and you have it ready. So that, or some people do oatmeal. They do overnight oats. And then they make it for the week or for a few days at a time and add their toppings or maybe a knock moat to it. I like things like that that are easy that I can go to. If people consume eggs, I teach them to make a little frittartas that they can-- in a cupcake bag. So on a Sunday, bake them up. And you can actually freeze them individually. And you're good for a couple of weeks. If you want that as either snack or you want to, you want a two-foot breakfast. And I tell people to put loads of veggies in. Put your spinach. Put your leftover roasted veggies. Add some spices that you like and make it interesting. And all you have to do is-- you have it ready frozen and you have those prepped. I think that that, for me, makes a very big difference in terms of getting something in. A lot of people also doing intermittent fasting. That becomes slightly different. They might want to eat different things or eat at a different time. But for those people who are finding it hard to get breakfast in, I would say number one, do some meal prep. Decide on a few things that you like for breakfast. Maybe for someone else, it's a sprouted piece of whole grain bread and avocado. So great avocado toast. Then just have your avocado in the fridge peeled and ready or have it whole so that it doesn't go-- kind of gets darkened or blackened. And toast up your bread and make it easy for yourself so that it's almost like a no brain on the morning that you don't have to think through that option. And those are for me. but I find the most helpful in getting in other people like a smoothie or something like that. You can actually put the ingredients to your smoothie in a glass jar the night before, pop it into your blender in the morning. Some people even leave it in the blender container, seal it up, but then just blend it in the morning. And that way, again, you don't have to think through those steps when you're busy or you're rushing or you have a tendency to forget breakfast. - Those are great ideas. So something that I wanted to talk to you about around all this is how do we remain cognizant about what we're eating, how we're feeling, how what we're eating is going to make us feel, but also stay out of the more orthorexic end of the spectrum because it's very easy. There's kind of a fine line. So how do you have any tips for that? - Absolutely. I think that embracing a healthy diet is something anyone of us can do, including myself. I mean, we can always up our game, but I think it becomes concerning a problematic way. You find tuning things to the point that you're either starting to exclude entire food groups if you don't have a food, a food allergy of food and tolerance. So if you sort of going down the path of, I cannot eat this food group. I only can eat extra amount of calories. I can only eat, you know, if you're becoming too rigid and structured around what you're doing, to the extent that it's starting to affect just your enjoyment of food, how much you're eating, how much of a variety of foods you're eating because a variety of food and vegetables, for example, the beans, nuts, seeds, legumes, healthy old grains that I mentioned earlier that help bring fiber, also bringing variety and biodiversity to your gut microbes. So if you suddenly decide I'm not eating anything green, and I'm just making that up, and not eating the sun, you know, it actually changes what happens to your gut. And I would say if you are trying to be healthy, but you've noticed in yourself, or your family is saying, some in your love is saying, or friend is saying, you know, we can't take you somewhere, we can't go somewhere because you just cannot eat, you know, all foods that are green, or whatever it is. If some, if people that love you, or know you were saying something that, then maybe just reflect on what you're doing because that starts to become unhealthy for you where you start to exclude things or start to be so rigid about your diet that it's not helping you nourish your body. You know, for me food has always been nutrients and joy and something that, and that's why I don't feel that people should have to eat non-tasty food if they are trying to be healthy. And I really care that recipes are delicious for people to enjoy, but they can still be healthy. Because if not, you don't eat it, you know, you don't want to eat the food. So I think that those things become important. And I think it's a really good question because some people get too, almost fixed on habits which don't end up being best the best for them. - Absolutely. Well, there are plenty of other conditions in your book. You cover PTSD, OCD, depression, what else? Lubito, there are so many. So everybody make sure to go pick up the book and where can everybody find you? - So they can find me in two places. If I'd be on social media, we always share information on Instagram, which is @drumaa and aidou, which is @drumanidou. And go to my website. Please subscribe and you'll get our new seters and get information about what I'm up to. That's umanidoumd.com. And you can also buy the book there, or support your local bookseller, or Amazon, wherever you prefer to get it. - Amazing. Well, thank you so much for coming. - Thanks so much, Ayles. It was lovely to talk to you. - You too. - I hope you enjoyed that episode. If you liked it, and if you like the show in general, please take a second to rate, review, and subscribe. It goes a long way, and it's actually the best way to support the show. Also, if you want to see more about each episode, you can head over to the Blondefiles podcast on Instagram. I am always posting about each episode there, or over on my personal page at AreaLori. (upbeat music)