Don’t be a little hoe.

(upbeat music) Welcome back to the set. This is Amberi. Hi, it's Sophia. I'm excited for this episode. Definitely like the most raunchy episode we're probably gonna talk about. - Raunchy. - Raunchy is not the right word. Who knows what this could have all been to? - That's just very true. I think the topic that we're gonna talk about today is a topic that we've talked a lot about. Just since I was younger, I'm just kind of an example that you've always set for me too. - A positive one, guys. - A very positive one, but I just think it's interesting and I think we have a lot to talk about it. So, we wanna talk about not being a little hoe. This is literally how to not be a slut, just kidding. (laughing) Not slut-shaming, disclaimer. We're all for it. - Your body, your choice, do what you're comfortable with, but we are just sharing our morals and values and how we feel about it and the path we've chosen and maybe to resonate with other women that aren't really into hookup culture and might feel like they don't have other women to relate to on it. - Yeah, and this is not to shame anyone. We're all for your choices and my friends are polar opposite of me and I'm always hyping them up about it. I think it's fantastic. And even my older sister is way different on this view than I am. And I just kind of embrace it and I embrace her and I just know me personally. I just know myself. - Yes, yeah. - To me, I always was self-aware to know that a hookup is not gonna make me feel good about myself afterwards. - Yeah. So, let's just talk about how hookup culture has evolved. Like, do you feel like it's way more popular or normal now than it used to be? - I do feel like social media has played into it being encouraged, especially on TikTok. Like, it just feels like-- - Yeah, it's very good. - It's very good. - Live out your 20s, hookup, do that while your young is kind of pushed and that has never been really of interest to me. I feel like it's, I mean, it's different for everyone, but I feel like especially with dating apps. Like, people don't use them half the time to like get to know someone they use them for like a quickie. I think social media played into it because of the conditioning of instant gratification. And now that's why we look at a hookup as like, we don't wanna get to know someone because we are already thinking about the next best person that might bring us joy. - Yeah, joy or like might be able to satisfy us in a different way. It's like, we have less contentment which I think is not a good thing. - Yeah, and what we mean by hookup culture too is different. I feel like everyone defines the label hookup differently. Like it doesn't have to mean all the way all the time. I think, 'cause like in high school, people used to say like all the time, like, oh, that chick hooked up with him and it was like, I make out our second base, so it was never, I didn't always mean third. - That's true. And I don't know. - There's a lot of girls who just like would make out with random, like, different guys in one night. And I never-- - That sounds like Strap Throat to me. - Yeah. - And it sounds like her piece to me. - I was glated so quickly. - Or mono. Yeah, mono, let's stick to mono and strap the boat. - Yeah. - You hear the voice crack? I'm so kind of sick. - Yeah. - Not a Strap Throat, guys. (laughing) - We're just dumbing right in. - Yeah, I think, like, I was never that girl. And like, growing up, that was something super intimate to me in every aspect, like just a kiss. It was never just like a simple kiss. I took it very personally and I put a lot of energy and I think I held it up to the standard that maybe it's not. It doesn't need to be, like just a simple kiss. And I let that go as I got older, but like, comparatively to my friends, like I think I've only ever kissed like five guys total. And that's not like a bad thing or shouldn't be like looked at as like prude because honestly, I think it's really amazing how you did look at it as energetic, like an energy of kissing because doing anything sexual, it is an energy exchange and you specifically sex take on that energy of that person and I don't think people even realize the value that that holds. And for me, I always looked at it as it's like, how much more special is it if you keep it a little bit more sacred to doing it with people you love and care about and have that deeper connection? Yeah, I don't know. I just remember feeling really shitty about it in high school. Like I remember being like 14 and just like, I was not there. Like there was, I didn't wanna have my first kiss yet. I didn't feel comfortable. I had like my first real kiss. I would say like 16, 17 maybe. I was 16. Yeah, 16 and I still felt uncomfortable. And I just, I don't know. Do you think religion played a part in the shame? Yes and no. I grew up in a really religious family, like mom, my dad's side, my mom was not. And my mom was always like, encouraging me to like put myself out more, especially with guys, or just even like when I was figuring out me as a whole, like they didn't really care what I, like they just wanted me to like try stuff. In the sense of like they didn't want me to close off my, myself to the world or to someone. I had like a quote unquote, a little boyfriend when I was like 13, but like I was so uncomfortable with anything like that. It was basically just like, let's hold hands and go on dates. I like I've been wanting to kiss boys since I was in like, I was like freaking three years old. Yeah, yeah. I would lock my parents' friends in their room, in my room. Sorry, that's really bad. But I was like six doing this stuff. No, I was like three. Oh my God. My mom tells a ton of stories about me being a little wild, growing up. I think I was like a teenager at the age of three, truthfully, but my parents had really young friends. They were like 23 when they had me. So their friends were like 23 and Ha, and I was obsessed with like true love's first kiss. It was in a very innocent way of like, I was like, you know, you got to kiss me on the lips. I feel like it's interesting though, because I was surrounded by dancers and I feel like dancers are really sexual humans. Interesting. And I always felt like I was pushed to like, my dance partners. Like they always wanted the dance partners to date. They wanted the dance partners to kiss during certain dance numbers. Like it was a four, like it was a wave for them to like kind of express themselves. And I feel like all my friends growing up were super advanced in everything besides like me. Like I was the only one that never had an interest in that kind of stuff. But I also know that dancers are super experimental. So maybe it's just because we're exposed to more adult things that are younger age. I have no idea. But every dancer like true and try to dance of every man is like the most sexual human ever. We are kind of sexualized out of young age. In a weird kind of way. I think maybe that's why. I don't know. I also think it has to do with dancers being very passionate. Yeah. And that passion comes out in that way. Maybe. I don't know. I was just like polar opposite. Like I feel like I was really picky. And I never really felt like truly comfortable in that situation until I met my boyfriend. Like that was the first person I ever did anything with truly. Like even I never felt comfortable making out with a person until I met him. Well, I just thought it was interesting because I don't think it was necessarily like, it was like a mental block in my head. Do you think that was from past experiences? Yeah, I think a lot of it shaped from like my childhood. But I also think maturity wise, I had never felt like I was on that level. Like I was just so behind. And I even remember like even with my boyfriend, like when we had those kind of conversations, I was like, I've done nothing. And I know you have that I just like, I don't know what I'm doing. And I don't know how to kiss. I don't know like everything that you think I would know I don't know. And so you need to be very like gentle with me and the sense of impatient because I just didn't know when it would freak me out. Like I would get overwhelmed really easily. And guys don't look at that as like a bad thing. I think anytime you have that conversation with a guy, they've got a mature guy. And mature guy. A mature man. They view that as a positive. Like I think girls beat themselves up and are like embarrassed to have that conversation with their partner. And it's like, they actually look at it as like a really respectable thing, the right guy. And they're going to be impressed by your moral code. And I also feel like it's important to have a man that's going to facilitate that like safe space to allow you to have that type of open communication. Yeah, like in high school, I was like named like biggest prude. Like I wouldn't even play like spin the bottle. Like I was just like, no, I'm good. I've actually never played spin the bottle. I bet you'd love it. I love you feel like I would. But like I was just like that always with, I guess with me. There was one would make me feel bad about it. Like when I was a kid, like when I was like, I was a, and up until I meant Ethan, up until I meant my boyfriend, I felt bad about everything. Like it was always like a, again, a turn off for people or they would shy away or like, well, she doesn't know what she's doing. So like, why do I even bother? You know what I mean? And it felt very, I was always super embarrassed to tell anyone. It's kind of like drinking. I feel like in that way where people are peer pressure almost. Yeah, peer pressure and they're like, well, why don't you? And I do think though there's a wave of people that are becoming more conscious and same with a lot of people like cutting back on alcohol and this is just me talking about like my comtability with like sexual stuff. Like it took me a while and you know, all of my first happened with my boyfriend and I'm very lucky. But even when I like when my boyfriend and I took a break, I was still the same way. Like I didn't go and besides guy from the club, that was like it. Yeah, I shut up to have said one, but it's still like I wouldn't go out and just kiss someone that I met randomly at a party. Like I had to know them. Besides the guy from the club story. And I feel like I would still be the same way. If I wasn't in a relationship now, I don't think that I could, you know, go on Tinder, pull up a guy and then like go do that. Yeah. Like I don't think I will ever be that kind of human. I don't know how that like I don't my brain doesn't work that way. I form an attachment immediately. And even like people I've kissed, it's met something to me either in the sense of like I really liked them or I realized I didn't like them. It was one of the two. Yeah. And you had talked to them for a little bit and you kind of I knew them understood. Yeah. Who they were besides one. Besides the guy the first episode we talked about. But you know, like my friends have no problem with it. Like they don't have that attachment. I don't know if that's something for me being like a really deep human. And I just, you know what I mean? Like I don't know. It's not a bad thing though because I feel you on that. And I never look at it as a negative in my life. And I always looked at it as kind of like it's good to be selective. It's important to be selective with who you allow into your space and into your mind and body. Do you feel like? All the dating TV shows and stuff have really just glamorized sex and like hooking up and all that kind of stuff. Not even just like the dating apps, like the date shows. Because all of the shows like all the biggest ones are literally about people trying not to hook up. I immediately think of my friend who was on to hot to handle. Yeah. And I like, it's also staged. But it really like, I don't know if it feeds into it. And I'm just saying like people watching, like people who are reviewing that, does that make them feel like they need to go and have and do that more? Yeah, because they feel like, look at these people who are repressed on the island for eight weeks. Like I would never want to do that. Like do you feel like that feeds into that? Like I don't know. I'm not sure either because I've never been really into reality TV and I have only watched it like watching him on the show. And I kind of saw through the bullshit and was like, well, this is ridiculous. Like this is just so for TV and exaggerated. Like I looked at that and I was like, this is just so for TV and I didn't really think about it in my own beliefs. But like think about this. So like there's some people who really truly believe in reality TV. Like they really think that that shit's real. Like the amount of people who ask me, that's a little foolish. That's the same people who asked me like, was Dan's mom real? A lot of people think that shit's real. Like reality because it's the name of reality TV has to be real. But I also think from a young age, like from the time that you're in like seventh eighth grade, from the time that you're in seventh or eighth grade, it's like who's looking up with who? Like that is the chat. Like that is the conversation. And it's like it's such a young age now and is that because we're exposed to different TV shows that have more like love scenes in them or like there's more nudity in TV now. Like we're not sheltered as much. Like I feel like we're not as like kids aren't as protected to those kind of things. So then the hookup culture starts even younger and then it feeds into the next generation. Like my friends were doing shit in sixth seventh grade. And I had no idea what half the stuff they were talking about was. Yeah. You know, I do think people look at hookup culture as a way to fill validation and voids within themselves. Do you know anyone who is like a total hookup person that is truly happy, hooking up with a bunch of people? Not a lot of my friends are into it genuinely. Most of my friends are in relationships or kind of just prioritizing themselves. That's true. I don't know. If you actually honestly kind of interesting to interview someone on the show that has polarizing beliefs from us and kind of pick their brain and be like, okay, like how does that make you feel like after you do that with a guy, how does that make you feel? I don't know because some people might be like, oh, I feel so empowered in that. But I'm like, I don't know. I feel like it's different for everyone. Like I know a lot of my friends are super into it besides you. Like that they love it. Like that's how they met their boyfriends was on a one night stand. What do you feel like they gained from it? Or what have they said to you that they gained from it? I feel like from what I've heard from my friends who love hook up culture, they like it because it makes them feel really confident, which I find funny. They find that having different guys every night validates them in a certain way that makes them feel more powerful. I feel like it's kind of a short term validation in my opinion. Yeah. But like that rejection isn't there as much. It's very, very, very slim as like a, you know, as a beautiful woman going to go try to sleep with someone, you know, the chances of them saying no, we're very slim. But does it numb us to real connection? I think so. I agree. I think it's much harder. I've noticed patterns just like even with like my siblings, we're like, if they're super into hook up culture, it's because they've been hurt by someone else and they're doing because they don't ever want to be hurt by another human. So they're happy with that instant gratification and they keep feeding back into it. They don't really want to let someone in. Yeah. Or they're just fucking bored. And that's what they do to use their time. Like if someone's bored. Somebody better use their time. I know, but I'm just saying like that, that's sometimes what people think. And I don't think it's a bad thing, but any means like if that's your form of expression, like I know a lot of people like when they're angry or when they feel certain emotions, that's the way that they like sex is the way that they process shit. I know that from just people I've met, I'm not that way. I'm really emotional. I also don't know if that's a healthy coping mechanism. Yeah, that is something that can become an addiction. And like that's not talked about. I feel, yes, sure. But I also feel like hook up culture kind of feeds into like why only fans are so big now and why, you know, like the porn industry is still huge. Like I sex sells. Yeah, sex sells. But that's what I'm saying is like how many girls do we know like personally that we thought would never be like that who are on only fans making a crap ton of money. And then who are also now going back into hook up culture because like that they they went on only fans to like actually personally don't know anyone on only fans really. No, not a single soul. I know a lot of people like not anyone personally, not that is like in my inner circle of people know. I wouldn't say anyone that's in my inner circle, but people I know very well. And who have been friends with for a long time who are doing it, there's like I can not get. Wow. That's crazy. Part of me is always like I see the interest in it because of the money. But I'm like that there's again, instant gratification, the temporary like, yeah, Phil, but I feel like on the on the side that's not posting on only fans. Like that is where hook up culture kind of stems from because you're exposed to so many things, right? I don't know. I don't know if only fans in hook up culture are correlated. I haven't actually thought about that correlation. They're definitely I could see it being a huge part of pushing sexuality and like over sexualization of women. So I could see that. But I don't think the women making money on only fans are happy and that money feels fulfilling to them. I don't think they're proud of that. Yeah. I don't know if I had 350, like 350 came, I'd make an account just for posting bikini photos. I feel pretty fucking good. I don't know. I would feel violated truthfully. Okay. Like I do think it's like yes, that is life changing money that you can invest and not have to work another day in your life. If you kept doing that for a long time, but it's like your kids ask you one day, oh, mom, how does you make money? And you're like, I just watched the Pamela Anderson documentary recently and it was really interesting to hear her son's perspective of how it was really hard for them to grow up with a mom who was so sexualized and how they just wanted their mom to be seen for the caring, loving woman she is and not just like the like sexualized version. So I will be interested to see when these women start having kids, how that plays a part into what their work is and what they're wanting to do or how their kids view it or the long-term effects. Because it hasn't been around long enough to know. That's true. But I feel like from the people that we do know and the people that we idolize, they're so so sexual. Like the people on TikTok were talking about, you know, like let's name a few people who are known for selling sex or knowing like to love like hook up culture and all those kind of things. Like when I think back at them, those are the people who are the most famous. The people who have like the most exes, the people kind of sad. I feel like we kind of, we love hearing gossip, we love to hear who's hooking up with who. Like that's what people ask. Even celebrities, the majority of times you'll see people ask. like the interviewer will ask the celebrity, who are you dating right now? Who are you seeing? Or like the fact that Taylor Swift used to like date a bunch of guys was then used against her. And maybe she just liked dating. Maybe she just liked to fit, like maybe she likes hook up culture. You don't know. Yeah, you know what I mean? So it's just different. I don't know. I see both sides to it in the sense of like, I can see how that could make you feel powerful, but I also know that it wouldn't make me feel powerful. So I really feel like it's like person to person because I know people who feel so much better about themselves when they're in like their hookup era. Just because they feel like they feel empowered by men, but I do think that stems from trauma. So at the end of the day, isn't the whole point of like life is to form like very emotional personal connections. Meaningful relationships. And I do think that hookup culture though makes it really hard to have meaningful connections like that. And I would be interested to see how that kind of effects like divorce, right in the future. Have you ever felt like your body count won't be enough in your future? No. No. Never. Yeah. Like I feel like that's a question that I get all the time is like, will you be happy with just me for the rest of your life? Or like do you feel like you need to have other experiences with other people? Like that's a question of you. That's a question that I get all the time. And I don't think it matters because if I love the human, I love the human. And I'm not in it for that reason with that person. Does that make sense? Yeah. But like a lot of people have a lot of sexual experiences with a lot of people before they find their person. Yeah. And so that's what if question isn't there. But is that just because we have been like trained by society? Yeah. For me, I feel like it's less about the sexual experience and it's more about just the experience of another human in general. Yeah. Like I have learned my wants and needs and what I value in a human as a partner more through dating different people. Like I feel like everyone thinks they're gonna marry their first boyfriend or girlfriend. Like they just are like, oh, I want to love and all these things. But it's after you get to experience other people, you start to realize who is more compatible with you and like long term life vision. And I think that is ever changing as you grow up. So for me, I've never thought about it in like a sexual way because I think those things can kind of get better the more you do it and the more you have a connection and a deep like physical attraction with the person. I feel like I know people who are in their hookup era just so that they feel satisfied once again in a relationship which I think is interesting. That is interesting. Like for someone to be to tell me like, you should hook up with other people just so you like know you're sure. Like I think that's weird. I find that so strange. I find it strange because it's been told to me more than just my group of friends or like people my age been told to me by like older people has been told. So it's like do we fantasize more people, more experiences because we're unhappy with the one situation instead of working on that situation with that human. Our answer is let's go be with other people. Like I don't know. Yeah, I don't know the answer either. I think with hookup culture too something I want to touch on is sexual health. Like people do not talk about how easy it is to get things that can affect you the rest of your life. And how like you can still get things from using a condom. You can still get things by just giving blow jobs. No, I do genuinely like that is an important thing that I feel like we are not taught as women enough about our sexual health men as well. Like but I feel like women are a little bit taken advantage of in that way of like you said when say women goes into it with a man who she feels unexperienced. If it's not someone that has like a good moral code, they might take advantage of her a little bit in a way and not be honest about. Yeah, I was so scared. I was like any time I've ever met any guy that I've ever come like close to being in any shape or form like intimate with. Yeah. I felt like I was really scared to tell anyone like my history because of how little of experience I had because the last thing I wanted them to do is like treat my innocence as a gold win or to take. It's not yours to take. That's what I always felt like and so I was really careful about who I gave myself to in that sense because I knew that people would like use it as kind of a show off thing. Like the wrong guy would be like, yeah, I fucking took her for a journey and like I never wanted that. I never wanted that to be my experience. I always wanted to feel really safe and I wanted to know the person wasn't going to leave the next day. Yeah. A lot of girls make that mistake, especially in high school. A lot of my girlfriends in high school made that mistake and they would say that they didn't care and then after it would happen, they would just be a mess and then instead of dealing with those feelings, they would just dive into more hookups searching for that validation they didn't have the very first time. Yeah, I think that is important. The validation aspect. Yeah, and like, you know, people, I don't think it's a, like I think sex is a great thing. And I think it's, you know, I'm not saying that don't do it or not like, you know, Virgin Mary's over here. But I'm just saying like, be very picky. Yeah. Because that like parts of yourself show when you're into someone and I wouldn't want to have just anyone see those parts of me. Yeah, I mean. And that's why I'm against hookup culture because I'm just a little selfish in that sense. Like I love myself too much to let someone take advantage of me in that way because I know what I have is special and I think a lot of people don't view it that way. Like they don't know their self worth yet. So they look for it from men or women. Yeah, or just humans, you know what I mean? Yeah. And it's definitely interesting because I've always had that point of view since I was younger and I grew up in a religious family so I was like, don't have sex to your married. And I knew that was never going to be my case. Like I didn't feel like I needed to have a contract to tell me that I can have sex. I do feel like religion from people I've talked to that are religious. Religious. It has played a part in them feeling like shame and go around sex. Yeah, for sure. And it's not, it shouldn't be a shameful thing. Like even if you like cooking up with people that's not shameful. I just feel like everyone should be more selective about who they choose. I feel like, you know, just seeing Timmy down the street, you don't know where he's been and then it stems into physical health. Like if anything, worry about your health. I agree. Like you know what I mean? Like that's where I would be stressed out about. And I feel like in school we're taught that like once women have sex, like we're done. Or like that men wouldn't want us anymore. Interesting. I was taught that in school. I'm like, I don't really feel like my school pushed that at all. They pushed that narrative for me and it really so did the Catholic Church. Like no one wants to have children with someone who's had sex before. Like that was what was pushed as a kid. I would just find really interesting. And I know that's still the case for some people. And I just want people to know like that's not true. You can find out a lot about yourself and your desires. Like, I also think it's something that can really unite two people together in a more intense way. Yes. That's what I think also is like don't get blinded by sex. Like a lot of women will start having sex with someone when they like really first meet them. And then they're not able to actually think with their mind because we have already released that like oxytocin and that bonding hormone that totally clouds our judgment. Like love is already blinding and then eat their own sex and you're just like your judgment is really skewed and you're not able to actually think and be like, is this person adding to my life or am I just sexually comfortable with them? And I think sexual comfort is something that keeps people in relationships a lot longer than they should. And it can keep people in toxic relationships because they're like, but the sex is good. Or I'm comfortable with them and I don't want to go vent your out and get to know someone else. Yeah, that's hard. Yeah. I also feel like lusting versus love is like so difficult for men and women, I'm sure, but like on the more male side, men attach love to lust. So they don't go love first. They always go lust in my personal experience. I mean, we all lust first. It's like 60 days, I believe, of lusting where we're literally in that like lust mode. But they correlate lust for love. So they really lust for someone. Okay. They will correlate that to I love them whether or not they actually love them. I explained that in detail. Again, why do you feel like men lust more than women? Because that's really interesting. I would think that women more like fantasize and because we attach, we attach ourselves to people easier. What I'm trying to say is in my personal experience, building that bond first is something really rare for men. I know people in my past, like I was the first girl they'd never slept with on a first date. Like that's how they got to know people was like they got to know people there. I think it's interesting because every guy of every man has wanted like all they think about is like having sex with that human. Or like that's the way that they get to know someone like they don't really feel like they know the person without sex. And guys are very physical. Yeah, but that's what I'm saying. That's what I'm saying like less over love. So the less turns into love for them versus like loving the human as a human and then having that experience with them. I think that's really special. I mean that we don't take the time to do anymore. And I think girls lust in a different way. I think girls lust in a we fill in the blanks of the man we like. We will look at a man and automatically create this story and narrative of who they are and fill in the blanks of their qualities that they might not even have. Yeah, also I just want to put it out there like I were talking like straight females who identify as females. And I know it might be different for everyone no matter how you identify no matter your sexual orientation and your preferences. Yeah. And we're all for that. And I just want you guys to know like this is our point of view as a straight female. And we know that privilege and we understand it. Yes, it's very different from human to human. And I don't want our listeners to think that we know all the answers because this is just our point of view. And I also don't want to put us or to put people in boxes or in labels that they don't feel they belong. So I just want to put that there. So I think that's a good thought. Okay. I thought I've had about love is how every person you like think you love that like next experience of the next person you're with kind of makes you question your last like feeling with that person. And I don't know what that's what you felt before. I have for sure. I felt like a heightened what I felt for my other human. Yeah, where I'm like questioning like was that love like I'm always kind of having that conversation with myself. Oh my god. Yes. Well, this wasn't like with my experience. It had nothing to do with someone. I didn't go all the way with someone. Okay. But it took out that like what a factor between him and I. And I was like, oh, yeah, it was I ever really in love with that human or like was interesting. Because that wasn't what I was hoping for or that wasn't what I was thinking it would be like I had put such a. I put on a pedestal for so like for so many years and then when it happened I was like. Oh, that's not what they write about books. And then I think the only person I've ever had like that moment with where it has felt right and it has felt good. Like even just from a kiss has been my boyfriend like he's been the only person I've really ever felt like really safe with or like comfortable with. It feels like magic. Have you ever been in one sided love where like you feel like you are lusty and loving that person but it doesn't feel reciprocated? Yeah, I've been in a relationship where you know they I was the rebound and they were in love with someone else for months. And I was just kind of like they wanted to love me but they couldn't. Emotions are so complex and like yeah so like I don't know it's so hard and I feel like people always are like when you know you know and I'm like. I don't know if that's I don't know if that's real. I don't think that you know when you know. Yeah, I don't know. You always know until you don't know. Yeah, that's true. You're like I'm pretty sure the person and then like life likes to laugh at us. You know what's so funny is like I know for me I always thought like my first experiences were we're going to be with this like one human. Yeah. And then they weren't and I was like glad. Is that weird? No, I think you grow and evolve and you're like we like to fantasize about things and I think movies and books make us think that we are supposed to have this one true love soulmate. And I think we can have a lot of different soulmates and connections. Yeah, they're all going to mean different things and they're all going to teach us different lessons. I will say this is probably a different topic on the top of everything. I feel like even if you're not in a hook up culture era, you could still really like sex. I feel like that is something that I'm not talked about. Like if you don't like to have sex with strangers, that doesn't mean that you don't like sex. No, you're not like a sexual human. Yeah, that's so not true at all. No, look at us. Call in ourselves out. And I think it's important for women to kind of know what they like. What they like before they try to explain it to a man. Yeah, yeah. This is a very like mature subject but I was just going to say like I do think there are like there's people that love those kind of experiences but they don't need to be with random people and they don't need to be with a lot of people. It could be with one human but they love it. And I think that's something that it doesn't make sense to a lot of people like I find funny. I do think like being in a really loving, amazing, healthy relationship is like the most fulfilling thing. It's like kind of that like for me at least. Like at least I'm just like getting to share your life and be vulnerable and communicate with this other human who values you and sees you for who you are and like loves all of that. Is literally one of the most special things I think. And you love to have any shape or form that you are. Yeah. And I mean like it doesn't matter if you're having a bad day they still love you. And it wants to be there for you genuinely. Yeah. Yeah. I think it's just way more powerful. Like I've experienced two sides of those kind of experiences of those kind of intimacies. And I would take being in love with the human way more. It's what it just is different. It feels different. It feels magical. It doesn't feel like something that's like just what everyone does and it sucks. Like for me I just didn't enjoy it and I felt really shitty about myself. Also don't feel bad if like you're younger and you haven't felt that feeling yet because that was me. And I don't think I felt that feeling until like right now like in my life. Like until being 24. I'm just experiencing like a really like healthy like love and feeling of connection like that for the first time. Yeah. I was always super jealous of my friends who had like high school boyfriends that they were like madly in love with. And I was really jealous of my friends who you know had been in love or had had sex. And I was just like the oldest. Yeah, oldest, Adam and all my friends that had never done anything like not kiss the boy, not anything. Like never been in love, love, never had reciprocated love, never had good love. And it made me feel really bad about myself. And I like wishing back like a note to my younger self, which is to be like don't be in a rush because I think once you find that human, it's so worth the wait. That's how I feel about it. But I just wish I wasn't so like in a rush to get things over with or in a rush to find someone. I wish I was a more chilled back and like just kind of enjoyed the ride and got to know myself more before I before I really wanted that. Like I wish I didn't feel so shameful about it. It looks it seems so silly now. I never rushed it or tried to. I just always chased a mostly unavailable. You really did. She only liked emotionally unavailable. I don't know why like years genuinely. It's something me and my therapist have worked there. Yeah. Where it's like I don't know. I would love to dive into attachment styles and all of that in another episode because I think that's really interesting to work through and to figure out like, okay, why am I attracted to that? Yeah. I was super attracted to people who didn't love me, but I love them. And it's happened to multiple people. Maybe they did love you and it wasn't right time. No. I don't think so. Maybe in the hopeless romantic. I'm like, you never know. I really don't think so. I mean, maybe like my boyfriend now, yeah, because we dated before and it wasn't right. And then we broke up and then it was right. So I guess maybe. Yeah. Maybe right time wrong person, you know, we hope that that episode resonated somehow. Whether you disagree with us, whether you agree with us, I honestly like I'm always open to hearing anything. I never think that my way of thinking is the right way or is the only way. So I personally just want to preface that. This is how I felt as a kid, but I don't think that my way is the only highway. I agree. We're still learning. We're still young. And our opinions might change. Yeah, our opinions are going to change as we go through different experiences and we're just sharing our perspective with where we're out right now in life. And we hope it resonated with you. And if not, we would love to hear your opposing opinions. Yeah. And I realized how lucky I've been. And I realized the damage that could have probably been done if I didn't have such a crud strong people in my life. Or if I didn't have such strong opinions about myself in this topic, I think if I had been peer pressured into what my friends were doing at a young age, and I wasn't so sure about my decisions, even with the shame, I think I would have always regretted those types of decisions. So I'm really proud of myself for always putting my opinions on this topic first. I love that. That's really good. Yeah, it's true. Like I agree with you because we've stood strong to our moral compass, no matter like what everyone else around us might be doing or saying about us. we're able to look at ourselves and be proud of the women that we've become. Yeah. For sure. I love that. All right, guys. Well, thanks for listening. Yeah. You really love and appreciate each and every one of you. And if you don't already, please follow us on Instagram at the Sitch Podcasts, underscore, I believe, right? And leave a review. Yes. Yes. And leave a review on, if you're listening on Spotify or Apple Music, leave a review. And I believe on Spotify, I just checked this out. You could actually drop us a question in Spotify. Oh, I would love that. Okay. So if you have any questions for us, please let us know. With that said, we are going to wrap it up and we'll see you next time. Thank you so much for listening. Bye.