Derek Hough: Learning to Live in the Art of Life

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And I was really depressed, really depressed, really down and thinking like, man, I'm supposed to be like on top of the world right now. Like what the heck happened? What's going on? You know, and in that moment, I kind of realized I was like, oh, maybe it's not really about all that. You know what I mean? It's like, I think it was Tony Robbins, you know, he said it really beautifully. He says success without fulfillment is the ultimate failure. And I was like, that's how I felt. I had succeeded all these, you know, did all these amazing things, achieved all these wonderful things, and I felt unfulfilled because I was really doing it because I was seeking something. I was seeking people to like to love me or that I would be loved. And I guess what I realized was like, it's not really about what we achieve in this life. It's about who we become. And I didn't really like who I had become, to be honest with you. I wasn't really, I didn't look at myself and be like, I like this person because I was just doing, it was about the things I did. It wasn't about the person I was. That's when for me, the massive shift started happening where I stopped doing things because I was, listen, I was trained. I grew up in a place where I was a competitor. It was about me. It was about how can I become the best? How can I work on my craft? How can I become number one? How can I, it was very much a selfish thing, which again, there's nothing wrong with that. I think it's okay. I think it's important, especially when you're a competitor. But I reached my limit. It's not sustainable. That mindset, that sort of like me mindset. and reached its, you know, I was out. I was out of that tank. And I switched it around to how can I just now serve? How can I give? How can I, you know, how can I become we? And that tank basically just got like, you know, switched out and filled up. And now I find that it's unlimited, you know, because I don't do it for me. I do it because I really genuinely want to serve somebody. I genuinely want to help somebody. I want to like elevate them. And I feel so thankful for everything that I've been given that I want to like just give back. And I say given. I mean, I've worked really hard. But there's also grace involved. There's also so much grace involved that I feel very fortunate. And I don't take that for granted. So it's not really about what we achieve in this life. But dance, going into the dance studio and listening to music and just feeling what that felt like with my body, having this community, having teachers being encouraging and being like, hey, man. Like, you're pretty good. You understand the counts and the music. And I was like, yeah, well, I played drums. I played drums in a Beach Boys tribute band when I was eight years old at like county fairs and things. And so I had this sort of – I was familiar with music and counts and rhythm. So when I got into dance, I really just took to it. And I loved it. And I just loved the way it made me feel. But more importantly, I loved the community. And I loved the encouraging environment. And so for me, that's where I wanted to be. Yeah. That's where I wanted to be. And so growing up in Utah, like I've spent a little bit of time in Utah. Walk me through like is dance – is everything you're doing sort of within the Mormon community? So like was this dance class for people within the Mormon community and everything, the whole society sort of revolved around that or – I mean, yeah. I think in Utah it's actually interesting. Utah is just sort of this – has become this like epicenter of dance. And I actually didn't realize this, but 80% of schools have a ballroom dance program. Oh, wow. Yeah. I wonder if that's inspired by you and your sister. I don't think so. I think even before. I think before the BYU dance team, they have an incredible dance team there, ballroom dance team. And my coach, Rick Robinson, he actually was on that team. He was from Chicago and he did hip-hop and everything. And he was the guy who got me into it because he did hip-hop. He did ballroom. I was like, wait, this is – you can do both? That's really cool. And I want to learn both. And so you spent a few years dancing. Yeah. Yeah. And at a certain point in time, you realize even at a very young age that this is what you really want to do? Yeah. I was about 12 years old and my parents were just going through a divorce at the time, which in that faith was very, very much frowned upon, especially at that time. And you're the oldest or youngest? No, I have three older sisters, myself, and then Julianne is the youngest. So what was that like when you knew? Did you expect that your parents were going to split or was that a surprise? No, it was a big surprise. It was definitely a big surprise. And we were quite a close family. And so when that happened, everything kind of like – the ground just kind of shook and all the stability just kind of, you know, went away. Do you remember like when they had that conversation with you, like what that conversation was like? I do. I do very much. My dad actually – I was in San Francisco and he actually came and watched a competition of mine. I was competing in San Francisco. And I remember my dad – I was like, why did my dad come? He watched me compete, you know, because he's usually – he's working and being busy. And he came and watched me. I was like, oh, that's cool. But also, what's going on here? And that's kind of what I knew. And he told me. And obviously devastating. But I will say this. I was in a way fortunate because dance became – it was my focus. At that time, I was so focused on dancing. I was so focused on wanting to be better and competing that during that time, these coaches, Corky and Shirley Ballas, came. And they were like, hey, why don't you come train with us in London? And I was like, yeah, let's go. Let's do it. And so I went with them. Was that almost like an emotional escape for you or – No. You know, I think for me, I just – at the time, I had made this decision like I want to – I can do this. And I need to be there in order to do it, in order to become good and become a champion. Because I remember going to their classes and me feeling like I improved like in an hour. I was like, I felt that. I felt me get better in such a short amount of time with you being there. Imagine if I lived with you guys. Oh, my gosh. I'll become a champion if I live with you guys. So being a champion was the goal even from a young age? Oh, yeah. Oh, no. I was like, let's go. The champion of what? Like did you have – I don't know. The champion of Balama Latin dancing. Yeah. I mean it was like there was a clear goal. There was like, you know, that time, the 12 to 13 championships, you know, that age bracket. And then there was like Blackpool. Which is the biggest competition in the world in that, you know, in that world. And that became my goal. That became my like North Star. That became my mission. And everything evolved around that. I remember when I was – I think it was like eight years old or ten years old. And I went off to my first camp. Like I probably cried just leaving my parents and, you know, being like sad, being apart from them. So was there any part of, you know, fear or sadness? Or were you just embracing this like full on? It's interesting. It's interesting because, like I said before, being a young kid, I was a scared kid. Yeah. I was scared. Do you remember the day you left? Yes, actually. I do because I actually went to Miami first. We had a big – we had like the USA championships there first. And then from there, we flew to London overseas. You went by yourself with the other family? Yes. Or you went with your own family? No, by myself. By myself. And there was actually excitement. I was very excited because I had felt like – I was like, oh, yeah, this is it. These things are going to change. I was so naive. I was so green. But I loved – I fell in love with the structure. You know, going from feeling a little bit like uncertain about my future, honestly, and the direction and what I was going to do. And I wasn't great in school. I wasn't great in this. But I was okay in dancing. I, you know, people said that I had promise in it. But then now all of a sudden, I'm like, I'm not going to do it. And all of a sudden, I'm with these top coaches. And they're saying, we're going to get you – like, you got talent. You have something. And I was like, oh. Now all of a sudden, I have this like clear goal, clear vision. And also this confidence like I'm in the right place to do it, even at a very young age. And I just went full tilt, you know. We went to a theater arts school in central London, learning singing and dancing and, you know, acting. And then we're training at night. And then we're going, you know, training on weekends. Then we're competing on the weekends. So you didn't have much of a social life. Oh, no, no. No, it was like – it was relentless. And you didn't care. You didn't want like a social life. You just wanted to do this. I mean, there was times for sure, you know. But we also created a cool little like situation where Mark Ballas, because that's his parents. And he was my – became my brother. We started like a rock band. And so we were like – we're emo. Our hair is long. We have nail varnish and the whole thing. And we would like play music all day. Do you have any pictures? Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. We'd go like to pubs and clubs in London and play and, you know, put our drum kits on the tube, you know, and the amps and try to get there before the doors close. But that was like our sort of alter egos. We would do all that. We'd skateboard. We'd go to skate parks, you know, smoking in the sixth level toilets, you know, all that kind of stuff. And then on the weekends, we would be like Latin dancers. Like Dan and Hannah, who always wait up to meet you. To make sure their daughter gets back to her college dorm room. Or Tiffany, who's running late as usual. And her friends are tracking her trip to make sure she's actually on her way. I didn't like what you said, Odin pauses, about the future. This is the love story of real hinge couple, Odin and Edward. Written and read by me, Curtis Garner. Listen to the free audio book now. And you're living in London. I mean, that actually, like, I remember there was a year in high school where I wanted to move to, like, Canada. Or I think we all have that thought where at some point in our life, like, what would it be like to move to another country? Most of us don't have it at 12 years old. Yeah, that was also was interesting, too, is because going from Utah, which was a very, for lack of a better word, kind of vanilla, if you will, there's one flavor. To then all of a sudden going to London, where it is the, like, it's a microcosm of the world in faiths and beliefs and also cultures. And, you know, just like, whoa, wow. It was such an eye opener in just a richness of culture. Right. And that was really cool to be exposed to. And so while you're in London, now you're training. And then. At a certain point, you win your first competition. So what was that like? For me, it was interesting because being a competitive dancer, we competed every single Sunday. Every single Sunday. There's just different competitions all the time. There's little ones, medium ones, big ones. But we did all of them. It didn't matter if there was three couples competing. We went and competed. Because our coach, Shirley Ballas, was like, she was like, let's get the reps in. So when I looked. look at like certain athletes and certain coaches I hear their stories. I'm like, oh, I, I really, I hear that. I relate a lot to like their stories in some ways because we would do everything. In fact, I wasn't ready for competition. I didn't even have my routines finished. And she's like, you're competing. I'm like, they're not even finished. What are you talking about? So it doesn't matter. You're getting out there on the floor because that's when you're going to learn the most. You're going to learn the most when you're out there doing it. And I was such a, I got to wait till I'm ready. I got to wait till I'm perfect. I got to wait till it's like conditioned and I got to wait. And she's just like, nope, get out there. Was it terrifying at first? Oh my gosh. It was so terrifying. In fact, I remember going in ballroom dancing. There's a thing called line of dance where you go a certain direction and everybody goes that direction. I was going the opposite direction. I was going the wrong way into the point where like the person on the mic, Bill Irvine, who was a legend in the world, um, stopped the band, stopped the music. It was like, Derek, you're going the wrong way. And I was like, I was so embarrassed, but I was on a crash course. I was on a bootcamp. I was on a, this is where I was going. And I loved it. I loved the training. People often ask me, cause obviously I teach and I have this convention called ovation. And a lot of these young kids are in the competitive dance world. And they asked me like, what was like one of your best memories being a competitive dancer and or pivotal moment? And it wasn't the times that I won. It wasn't the times that I achieved the goal. It was actually the times that I, I didn't win that. I didn't make that first round or that I came second when I thought I was going to win those disappointments. Those like heartbreaks were so, so, so, so important. And it sounds so cliche, but it's really true when I reflect on it. And even on dancing with the stars, Sean Johnson, that season with Sean Johnson was the all-star season. And it was, in my opinion, one of my favorite seasons. And it was one of my favorite seasons that I had done on the show. And we came second. And I almost, I felt so confident that we were going to win because it was such a great season. And we didn't, we came second. And I was just devastated. And I felt like I let her down. In fact, Carrie Ann even told me that like, you're letting your partner down or, or lended or somebody. Oh my gosh. But then after that, that gave me so much fuel. It gave me so much drive, so much hunger to come back and to be ready and to be prepared. And that's the same in my Latin competition, you know, world. It just gave me more fuel, more energy. Yeah. So I look back at those moments, you know, and they're, they're super important. I want to explore that for a second because a lot of the audience I'm sure has gone through some tough times, some disappointments. Maybe they have fear of doing things that they want to do, but they're scared of losing. They're scared of judgment, right? It's fascinating to hear you say that, you know, losing is actually part of, you know, your fondest memories. I can back upon my own story when I was starting off as an entrepreneur. Um, I was making videos from, you know, a tiny little studio apartment and I had a rock hard futon, uh, cause I didn't have enough space to actually fit a bed. And I shared that space with a roommate. And so we would take turns where one night I would get to sleep on the futon and he'd sleep on the floor. The other night he'd sleep on the futon, I'd sleep on the floor. And that's where, you know, I was sort of drawing out the vision and writing my first scripts. Wow. And dreaming big, but I was like, I'm going to at the same time was just so embarrassed as to where I was. And so when I talk about those moments, the only regret that I have is that I never took one photo because I was so just again, insecure, embarrassed. I'd ever wanted people to know that this is like my reality. This is where I was. Yeah. It's my reality. Uh, but now I look back and I'm like, Oh gosh, those moments were so cold. Right. Because they shaped me into who I am today. So like, help me explain that or digest that. Like for somebody that is in that low moment in their life right now, why do you think that is a magical time that they should not be embarrassed by? There's a great book and it's called the obstacle is the way. Oh yeah. Ryan, Ryan holiday. Right. It's so good. And it's such a great phrase that kind of sums that up in a way, because you know, that story with the big boulder, you know, on the road and it's like, you know, people going around it, people going around it. And then finally somebody goes through it, they lift this boulder, they work really hard. They, you know, they just, and underneath it is the treasure. Right. And I look at those moments where the problems are the gifts. It doesn't feel like it in the moment. That's for sure. You're like, this is devastating. This sucks. Yeah. But in hindsight, look back at it. You're like, my gosh, man, look at all the gifts in this moment. There's a great expression too, that I love, which is like, what if your enemy is your angel? What if your enemy is your angel? And I was like, what does that mean? That sounds so stupid. But like, what if that person that came in your life, annoying you, is teaching you patience? Right. What if this situation happened to teach you compassion? What if this person's here? What if this, what if you didn't win because you needed to know what it feels like later to appreciate the win even more? Those moments, those challenges, those problems, those obstacles are all really gifts. In the moment, it's hard to recognize that. But I think that for me, I always try to sort of instill that as best I possibly can in these young dancers that I'm like, you know, coaching and teaching in these conventions and stuff is like, because we do these auditions and I bring out these like all-stars and I see the disappointment on some of these kids' faces. And I make it a thing to go on like, first high five every single one of those dancers and tell them great job. And then every once in a while, I'll see somebody with tears in their eyes because they didn't make it. And I'll pull them aside and say, what's going on? Talk to me. And I'm like, you're upset? And they're like, yeah. And I'm like, that's okay. It's like, all right, feel that. That's okay. But I'm going to let you know that tomorrow when I see you, we're going to have a great day, you know? And I want to see you up here up front. And we're going to have a great class together, okay? And the next day they come in and they're working, they're dancing, and they're smiling. And I kind of make a little moment with them. And I just see this like moment. It's so cool to see firsthand the disappointment. And then this next moment, the next day when I feel like it's okay. They slept on it. They feel better. And that, and even some of them come back then next to our other conventions, like, you know, months later and they're better. They're incredible. So again, it's kind of cool. At least for me, like I've lived that and still continue to live that. Obviously there's still problems. There's still challenges and obstacles, but from a dance perspective, it's cool now to be able to be a little bit more of the mentor to some of these young dancers who are competing. Right. When it feels like the end of the world. Um, when in fact it's just, you know, there's still moments that are going to really, you're going to take with you forever. Yeah. One of my favorite quotes is that failure is not defeat unless you give up and you know, you in your own story had lost, right. So many of these dance competitions, but you kept showing up time after time after time. And, uh, if at any given point that you had decided that, Hey, I am just a failure, right. And stop showing up. You clearly never would have gotten to where you are today. So, yeah, I think that's such an important reminder. And I think that's also what just distinguishes people that. Achieve success. In their life. Right. They lock in consistency that no matter what the outcome is, they just fall in love with sort of the practice and they keep showing up. A big part of that too. I'll say this is, is mentors. Because if I'm honest with you, if it was left completely up to me, I don't know. Yeah. I don't know. I don't know if I would have that strength to continue. I don't know if I was mature enough to be like, okay, let's go. But I, I had a coach. I had a mentor that was there with me. Right. That would like push me and nudge me. And then of course I would do that on my own as well. But yeah, so that's why I also having mentors, having those people around you. That's so, so important. I think as well. Yeah. And you know, kudos to anybody who's listening to this part, because anyone who's listening to podcasts and is interested in self-growth, clearly this is a form of mentorship because not everybody has the opportunity. Right. By the way, you're so right. Somebody asked me that again. They said, who are some of you like your inspirations and your mentors? I'm like, honestly, a lot of them don't even know that I exist because they're people that I listen to. Right. And I watch and I, and, and I grow from, you know, and I think it's, we're so lucky that we live in a time now where to, to get good information and, and helpful information and, and wisdom. Right. It's a click of a button, man. We were so lucky for that where we didn't have that back then. Right. It's like you needed somebody there to hold your hand. Yeah. I did this Adobe event at our studio where we brought in a bunch of creators and we were having them teach to aspiring creators, like smaller creators. I was sharing a stage with my friend, Love Lewis. Someone asks, so how do I start a podcast? And just immediately he goes, your question isn't, how do you start a podcast? Because anyone can just quickly go on chat GPT and say, how do you start a podcast? And it'll give you like the top 10 things that you have to do. Yeah. There's something else that's holding you back where you think that you have to ask that question because that makes you feel like you're taking some sort of forward action. But in reality, it's not the steps that you need to know. It's just the first step to actually take. It's the action, right? It's overcoming whatever that insecurity is that's stopping you. Whether that's like the fear of having to commit to something or the fear of failing or the fear of other people's opinions, that's sort of the root cause. We can't really say that the problem for us achieving any of our dreams is not knowing how anymore. No, no. It's, you know, people even like, how do I get into shape? I'm like, it's, you know what I mean? It's like there's gyms on every single corner. How do you become a better dancer? You know, it's really just taking that first step. And that is scary, that is super scary. taking that first step and being vulnerable and putting yourself out there yeah that's by the way dance right very vulnerable oh so scary i mean i'm learning dance right now actually i mean are you doing next season of dance with the stars i've taken like one dance class let's not get too far ahead of ourselves we actually just made a tiktok right before this podcast session where the whole humor of it was how bad of a dancer i am compared to derrick i love asking this because people say like you know oh i don't dance i don't dance i don't dance and i always say like well when did you decide that oh that's interesting when did you decide that because we all dance we all we all danced that's true look at a kid you know you have girls yeah i'm sure you put music on they're dancing around you're absolutely right and then at some point something happens or somebody looks at us a certain way or somebody says don't do that or something and then we go oh okay i mean stop we decide to stop that's a great point it's one of my favorite things about dancing with the stars is teaching somebody how to dance but not really just like giving them permission to dance letting them reclaim a part of themselves that they've forgotten or they didn't even know they had now they're not giving anything to them you're just like you're awakening something in them and every single season it would happen and it was like that was that was it most of the time it wasn't on camera it's not on the show it's a private moment where we're teaching or something and all of a sudden i just see this moment happen where they go and they feel it and they experience it and their eyes open and they go their shoulders go back they breathe deep and they're like oh my god i'm so sorry i'm so sorry i'm so sorry i'm so sorry i'm so sorry deep and they're like they get like connected to something and i'm like that that is yeah it's the best and there's i always say this tell a story where amy purdy she's a paralympian she lost both of her legs at age 19 years old there's no handbook of how to teach somebody how to dance with two prosthetic legs i have no idea but somehow each week she just defined the odds every single week she's incredible and then there's one week where we're doing the argentine tango and she's sitting down and she just starts crying and i'm like oh no i was too hard on her i was too too tough i'm like hey what's going on i'm so sorry what did i say you know she goes no no this is this is the first time i felt feminine since i lost my legs i feel like a woman again i feel like i'm like i feel like me and i was like and for me i get emotional i'm just thinking about those moments that i'm like that's what it's about that's what it's about and that's for dancing yeah that's what i love about dancing with the stars is that it's this sort of crazy show about dancing with the stars and i'm like oh my god i'm so sorry i'm so sorry about dancing with the stars and i'm like oh my god i'm so sorry just reclaiming a part of yourself or or uncovering something that you didn't know existed that just also happens to be covered in rhinestones and glitter and an absurd form of dance in a crazy show but it's there's something really special about it because i think dance in my opinion is it's primal you know it's primal you put a toddler on the ground put music on what do they do they're just like they're moving they're grooving man it's like it's in us you know so it's cool yeah i love it i love what you said about dancing with the stars and i'm like oh my god i'm so sorry i'm so sorry you said i love it now we're gonna get him dancing now he's like i love it i'm not dancing right now no i've had that that feeling i know exactly what you're talking about what you said was so powerful like people that say i don't dance the better question is when did you stop dancing right yeah i think that's just such a great perspective so so in the beginning taking us back to london you're growing up you're dancing in these various competitions so i take it that in the beginning you're losing a lot of these competitions but you keep going and that's because you have good mentorship you're seeing yourself level up like at what point do you think you're going to be at what point are you starting to sort of enjoy the failure embrace the process and see the improvement i love training and i hated competing on any journey using uber it helps to know you're getting into the right car pin verification adds an extra step to make sure your ride is your ride before the trip begins your app gives you a unique pin just tell it to your driver and they'll enter it in their app before the ride can start hey what's your pin 2538 that way you know you're in the right car taking the right trip and your driver knows you're the right passenger make sure your ride is your ride with pin verification from uber one more way uber is putting safety at every turn learn more on the uber app saying how you feel out loud is terrifying but that's what hinge's new free audiobook no ordinary love is all about it's a collection of real love stories about five couples that met on hinge the stories are written and read by temby dinton hurst nicola dynan curtis garner raven smith and rufy thorpe i hunter harris wrote and read the forward the audiobook's out now give it a listen this episode is brought to you by state farm listening to this podcast instead of doom scrolling smart move another smart move getting help from one of state farm's 19 000 local agents when you choose to bundle home and auto bundling just another way to save with the personal price plan prices are based on rating plans that vary by state coverage options are selected by the customer availability amount of discounts and savings and eligibility vary by state i was a terrible competitor actually i would fall apart i would never dance as good as i did in practice at a competition i probably would say my entire competitive dancing career i always dance better in rehearsal than i did on the actual competitive dance floor oh it's interesting there's a few times when i was competing at one of the the world championships was one of them actually where i just hit this like flow state and i was like this is the best i've ever danced oh my gosh when it was important you know yeah but usually it was um i was always better in rehearsal so a lot of these tools and all these things that i would you know i talk about or i would seek out is because i was actually terrible a terrible competitor um i would i would crumble and that's because of nerves or nerves expectation i put a lot of pressure on myself i put a lot of pressure on myself um and my partner i would just be like this doesn't feel as good it was all about feeling right i don't feel right it doesn't feel right and i would just implode i had to learn a lot of different tools and modalities to try to not have all these expectations and all this pressure to perform my best you know in these competitions and a lot of that was letting go of perfection honestly i also heard this quote too one time being a perfectionist is like the lowest standard you could have because it doesn't exist and so you're just constantly setting yourself up for disappointment you're constantly setting yourself up for failure because you're never going to achieve perfection and so going into that if you have if you expect it to be perfect which i did it has to feel perfect even if i won a competition and i won the trophy i'd always be like i couldn't even enjoy it yeah i couldn't enjoy it because it wasn't perfect and so letting go of that perfectionism chipping away that part of it was uh was really really important as well i'm curious when you did have all this achievement you know you said earlier um that your dad was probably a major catalyst for you know you wanting to kind of show him that you were capable of success more importantly you were worthy of love um what was his reaction like did you get the feeling you hoped for you know what's interesting because it was not an acute memory of that by the way it's not like it was like i didn't feel like oh i'm trying to show my dad something or prove something to my dad it never was that it was just something i felt i think only later in life i was like where did that feeling come from you know what i mean i was i was actually trying to uncover it like where did that happen like why did i feel that way you know i grew up not having friends right and so i struggled with that quite a bit what i realized is that for me to have money equaled friendship yes right so how do i get access to money i need to be as successful as possible so i can have money so i can make friends so i could be loved yes so i need to be successful in order to be loved so that's what association i came to realize as an adult and so i wonder if you know you also had a similar experience probably even well hearing your experience talk about how bad you were bullied especially by your neighbor like growing up that sounds you know really bad i wonder if there was a part of it of you just not being accepted you know at a young age and maybe even a part of why you left to london yeah you know it's interesting you say that because you're right i think you're absolutely right where i i think from like that standpoint from like my dad aspect where more of that came from just wanting to make him proud of course and then we all feel that you know we all want to make our parents proud but i think you're absolutely right where a lot of my also my drive came from that young boy that little boy who was tormented and essentially tortured and to honor him and to say i got you you know there's this um this is actually interesting okay this is kind of a fun story i was dancing with jennifer gray and she took me to a chiropractor but it wasn't a chiropractor she took me to some guy's house in the back shed and it was this like australian dude with this like white beard and he was like hey derek you know sit down and i was like what the hell was that the hell's going on here and then she left and i was like where are you going she gave me one of the best gifts ever because this gentleman he looked at me he said i told him a little bit about my story you know just my life and and he said all right it's like you can go pick him up now you can go pick him up and i was like i don't know what you're talking about you know pick who up so you can go pick him up now he's ready and i was like i still understand what you're saying and he said the boy that you left back in utah you still he's still there he's still waiting for you he's like you had to leave him to go do what you need to do to survive, to become this. But he's still there. And you're okay now. Go pick him up. And I've, I mean, I lost it. I like, it was like, and I literally like imagine like going back there and picking this young, you know, bullied kid up and putting him in my arms and holding him and looking at him and be like, I got you. You're coming with me now. And it was incredibly powerful. And even now I feel it, you know what I mean? I feel that young boy, because you imagine those memories and it feels like a separate person. It feels like this other thing. And you realize, oh, that's, that was me. That was, that's him. And being able to bring him along with me now, it's really special. It's really that, that sort of realization was incredibly powerful. Incredibly powerful. Yeah. If you were to pick up that eight-year-old boy, what would you say to him? I would just say, hey man, like I got you and everything's going to be okay. Everything's going to be okay. At that moment, he didn't feel like everything was going to be okay. No, I think there's just a lot of fear and I have a really vivid, like a strong imagination. And so I would just imagine the worst at all times. And, you know, it's interesting now being a father and now I'm holding a newborn and my daughter and I look at her and, and it's now it's a completely different thing. You know, I'm like, my sense of just my love, my heart feels like it's expanded and my, my world has grown and my sense of protection and my sense of just like wanting to make sure she's good. Yeah. Never want your kid to experience what you've been through. Of course. But at the same time as well. They need to, to some extent. Exactly. There's like those gifts. It's the hardest thing as a parent that, yeah, you have to let your child fail, but then you also want to protect them from failure. Yeah. That's going to be an interesting moment when I'm like, oh, how, how much do I interject here? Okay. Just let that happen. Oh no. Wow. It's beautiful. I guess, you know, as we talk about success and achievement, I want to move beyond that, but I do want to just kind of wrap it up by saying like, what, what advice do you give to that person that, you know, objectively speaking, right? Like you want to be the best at whatever it is that you're chasing, right? If you want to be the best dancer, winning dancing in the stars seems like the greatest, greatest gift. If you know, I had, um, Alison Felix, the most decorated female track Olympian on my show. And, uh, she talked about, you know, winning a gold medal in the Olympics. She has won, I think 13 Olympic gold medals. And she's like, the feeling wasn't what it seemed. Right. And so I I've talked to so many people that whether it's, you've sold your company for a billion dollars, or you've won, you know, achieved the highest achievement that that didn't quite give them the feeling that they were hoping for. So what do you say to somebody that is trying to chase that? Like, is that almost like you're prioritizing the wrong thing and you should just be enjoying this process? Or is it like, no, you know what? You have to go, you have to achieve that, you know, to the best of your ability, right? Whatever that thing is, but just know that it's not going to change anything. Universe is funny. How, when we just focus on the outcome, how it can, it can get in our heads a little bit, but when we just live in the art, the outcome will happen naturally. Yeah. Living in the art, living in the experience, you know, and we always say that the process, right. You know, and the experience and, and that's, what's the most important part. The outcome is obviously important to have because there's clarity, you have a vision, you have a direction, you know, you want to achieve. That's important, but living in the art, and by the way, that doesn't just mean like art, the way we think about it, business, relationships, anything, it's all artistic, you know, in a way living in it and, and, and loving it. It's not always easy to do, but if we can bring ourselves back to that, the outcome will, the outcome will happen is I think it takes off this, like, there's this charge, there's an energy when we put this pressure on ourselves, when we put this, this outcome has to happen. Otherwise I'm going to die literally. That's what it feels, right? Yeah. It feels like life or death. And, and it could be something small. I could like, I have to get this thing. And if I don't, I'm just going to die. I don't get this job promotion. If I, this person doesn't text me back, this relationship doesn't work out. It feels that intense. Right. It does. Having clarity, having goals, having those outcomes is very important because we need to have that, you know, that vision. But I think just really enjoying it, man. I know it sounds so cliche and so trite and just so, you know, easy, but yeah, I know. I will say one last little thing too, as well, like with my wife and going back to the success equal love part, we were walking in Yosemite. It was like our first kind of time away, just the two of us. And it was the first time I felt like I didn't have to perform. I didn't have to be on. We walked in silence for three hours, just observing the beauty and just being in that moment. I was like, Oh, this is different. This is interesting. I'm so used to having to be on and perform. Even for my relationships, I had to be this guy, this perfect man or whatever it was. And here I am. And we're just, we're not even speaking, but I feel content. That's when I kind of knew, I was like, Oh, this is different. This isn't what I expected, how my love was going to feel or how the person I was going to fall in love with, I was going to make me feel. How long had you been with her at that time? Very short, actually. It was only like, you know, six months later. And that, I remember that moment happening. So you weren't married at that time? No, no, this was very early on. And so you felt even in relationships, you had to perform a hundred percent. So when you become even more so, by the way. Yeah. Oh yeah. Do you feel like you're performing right now? It's funny that I'm pausing actually. I don't think that it's like I'm performing now. However, I think for me, I, I do feel like, you know, it's interesting actually. I'm not, no, that's a good question. You got me on that one. Cause I'm thinking, I'm like, I'm like, am I performing now? I think sometimes there's still that feeling in me. I think sometimes even now being a judge on Dancing with the Stars, for instance, in this live and make sure that I say what I want to say. I think that's the feeling I get sometimes where I'm like, I have all this in me and all these things I want to say on Dancing with the Stars, all this stuff that I want to say to this person. And then I finished this and I'm like, oh, I didn't say what I wanted to say. You know, I didn't, I, I, a wise person once told me that perfection is standard. That's right. That's right. It's funny that we can share like the knowledge that we've gained from life experience, but then almost like that advice that we share is really the advice that we're trying to tell ourselves. Oh my God. Because we have to try to like remind ourselves the importance of something was said to me today. Like, Hey man, you're, you're so positive. I was like, oh no, it's just cause I'm really up. You know, I'm just really messed up because it's like, I've had to seek out, I've had to seek out people and wisdom and different, different tools to help me and continue to help me and to practice by no means am I a master at anything is I'm still a work in progress. And, but what I feel at my best is when I'm, when I'm helping, when I'm, you know, serving, when I go to this convention with these young kids and I see their eyes and I'm like, and I'm just want to encourage them. And I, I want them to not burn out. I want them to really love what they do and continue to love what they do. And that for me, I feel like at my best without a doubt. Yeah. Yeah. And so catch me, let me hear your story. I know you have like an incredible journey ahead. So, you know, you go from winning lots of competitions, like smaller competitions while you're in London to moving to LA, joining Dancing with the Stars. Have you won more competitions with Dancing with the Stars than any other person at this point or? Yeah. Yeah. I've won, I've won six times. You've won six times. And I say I, but like my partners, my, I helped my partners win six times. Yeah. Six times. Oh, that's incredible. So then from there at the same time, you're also doing choreography and you start to win Emmys and you've also won more Emmys for choreography than anybody else in history as well. I don't know. Or maybe tied with somebody. I don't know. I don't know. At least at one point when you'd won your fourth Emmy, I think it was. I think the most nominations, I think for sure. I think it's like 14 nominations, I think. Now you don't, you can't even count them. Well, no, no, I just, it's funny. Cause even saying like the word choreographer, like I, when people would say that to me early on, they would say like, I love your, your great choreographer. I'm like, I'm not a choreographer. I almost like cringed at the word. Cause I was like, I didn't ever saw myself like that. And then I had to eventually, I started to sort of trust my instincts. I'm like, oh, maybe I have, maybe I do have some good instincts and some good choices and good taste and like some ideas. And, and my, my whole thing like yours in a way is my favorite thing is to tell stories, you know, in the choreography, not every dance has to have a story. It can just be fun and just exciting and just a cool move that we just enjoy. But it's the stories like when I told with Amy Purdy or with Bindi Irwin or with Kelly Pickler or with Amber Riley, like, you know, those stories, they're the ones for me that, that really stand out because it's something a little bit more important than just, you know, a fun routine. We're really sharing something that's part of who they are. Yeah. And so you continue to sort of have this monumental success at some point your shift focuses about being less, less about the accomplishments that you're chasing and more about serving others. And that's sort of unlocked. this new passion this new feel for you at some point during one of your performances on stage something happens that changes your life with your wife yes we had just been married okay we just got married three months prior to what so take what month year are we talking uh 2023 we just got married in august we're about to go on a big tour called symphony of dance and this was also a very special tour because this was the first tour where i really went into this creating this the show with the intention of like i'm gonna do what i love what i like in that moment i'm not going to pick a song or choreograph a dance that i think that the audience will like i'm gonna do something that i just think i love i love the symphonic music i just love the way it makes me feel and so there's something special around the show because i was really putting myself out there but more importantly it was also a love story within the show with between hayley and i and during that tour uh we had an incident where we hit heads in washington dc in front of like 4 000 people and she ended up having a brain bleed what like instantly when that happened did you know something was wrong and the show stopped no no so we actually uh we hit heads the very first number it was the very first number and by the way the the finale of dancing stars happened the night before wow the finale of dancing stars happened the night before and you won that one no no this was this was i'm a judge i was the judge yeah and um val and sochi just won it was like this amazing moment the confetti everywhere and we get on the plane straight from the show and get a red eye flight to washington dc and i remember just being really tired that day she was quite tired and we're like i remember telling her hey honey i'm done now with the show i don't have to fly back and forth now we have 14 more shows left of this like 70 city tour that we've done we're at we're towards the end we just get through tonight and then we can have a day of rest and then we're just getting it's just smooth sailing and that night we hit heads in the first number and i remember just being like whoa that was a hard one but we've hit heads before it didn't seem anything out of the ordinary and then towards the end of the show i just saw her starting wincing and i was like something's something's wrong i thought it was her neck because you know this is like a you know like a wincing like wow i kinked my neck a dancer injury type of thing right so i start protecting her neck as i'm dancing with her i might start bracing her neck with my my forearm and my hand she wanted to keep continuing she kept dancing she kept dancing and eventually there's a moment in the show where i honor the late len goodman and who i've known since i was 15 years old people didn't know that about our relationship we've known each other for a lot very long time and we're about to do a duet where hayley walks on and we do moon river this beautiful version honoring him and before that though i'm talking about how precious life is and how we've all lost somebody and we know what that feels like and little did i know that she was on the side of the stage on the ground having seizures and essentially dying in that moment but i didn't know and we finished the show there was like one more number after that was towards the end and i remember just she wasn't on stage and i thought she again i just thought she might have just hurt her like a dancer injury you know i rushed over to her ran over to her immediately and i just knew something was wrong you know her her pupils were dialed one was dilated one was pinpoint that's either a stroke or brain related we had to do a lot of things we had two decisions to go to the further hospital it's 45 minutes away or go to the one that's 10 minutes away and the paramedics they were looking at me i was looking at them i was like well what do we do they're like well what do you think like they're asking me like like the one 45 minutes was a better hospital they had more you know for brain the other one would have been fine for stroke but the other one in case it was a brain situation because they didn't know and time is really of the essence very much of the essence i eventually met the the the owner of the hospital later on and he told me he goes just want to let you know because i can let you know now that everything's okay if you would have chosen to go to the hospital that was closer she would have been dead she would have died and i was like i'm glad you didn't tell me that earlier but so you chose to go to we went to the further one something inside of you just told you to go to that further one i just felt like i just felt like if i wanted every option whatever you know i didn't want to be there and be like whoops we picked the wrong place i just was like if this has everything we need let's go there and you went in an ambulance or i was in the front seat of the ambulance i remember calling my dad and i remember asking him um i just said to him i said dad i need you to pray for hayley right now and he he jumped on a flight immediately because he i've never asked him to pray for something yeah and i said i need you to pray for her um and we got to the hospital and long story short but the doctor basically i'll never forget this moment actually this was one of the hardest moments actually that i haven't really spoken about she went in to get a ct scan and i remember the nurses having a certain energy to them beforehand and then i was waiting out there sitting on the ground and the nurses were wheeling her out and i just remember them looking at each other quietly thinking that i couldn't see and just shaking their head like it's not good and i quietly to myself knew i was like i was devastated and the doctor came to me said listen the brain bleed is very severe she is is a good chance that she's not going to make it and even if she does make it it's so bad like so it's hard to swelled so much already that the midline shift is so severe that she's going to have speech impediment paralysis she's not going to be the same person and so for me by the way she's still in her dress with her makeup and her hair and everything done in her heels she just was on stage and and did you feel partly responsible because of the head butt so you also felt like well in the moment i didn't know i we didn't know what was going on i was like how did this happen like what happened like oh you didn't know that's what caused didn't know because again we've hit heads many times you know things happen when you dance and nothing felt out of the ordinary it was only later that i was able to do it and i was able to do it and i was later when i was when we did all the tests and things that we realized but i'll tell you what the the one of the most devastating moments to experience was just this franticness you know we're on stage living our best lives we're like this is it love the show love doing it sharing this with my wife and living the dream and 4 000 people cheering and then all of a sudden you're in a hospital and it's frantic energy your adrenaline's going you're emotional i'm on the floor crying in the hospital seeing my wife being ventilated having to sign on this this for the first time i ever wrote down the word husband was basically signing her life away not knowing if it'd be the last time i wrote that word down like all these crazy things and falling asleep at the waiting room waiting for her to have surgery and then the doctor saying you need to go have some sleep because you have a long road ahead and then walking into a hotel room shutting the door and it being absolute silence and just being there by myself the energy the the going from the there to just being like this and knowing that my whole world's changed i'll never forget that feeling it was it was just everything all at once hit me and it was devastating and then hayley you know uh she she still had the uh the tubes you know down her throat and they're basically what we're gonna see if we can take him out this was the next day the next day and at that time too i had seen now i see her and she's you know her half her head shaved she's got like 70 staples in her head her eyes closed up she looks unrecognizable tubes in her mouth her skull is missing 40 of her skull was removed they couldn't put it back on because the brain had swelled up so much so needed to let it the brain you know come down and i'll never forget like whispering to her and they said talk to her and i said honey i'm gonna need you to breathe for me because we need to test your lungs to see if they're strong enough so just breathe with me and so i'm like breathing and then all of a sudden she starts mashing my breath as we're breathing together so i'm like oh she can hear me we keep doing that for about 30 minutes to the point where then when the nurse is like okay she's strong enough to pull it out and so we get there and we we pull out the tube and almost instantaneously like we start um they start asking her questions like what's your name she's like hayley and where are you she's like new york we're like close enough we're in dc but that's close enough and i just told her i said hey honey you know this happened she goes weren't we just dancing and i was like yeah i mean we were just dancing we were just on stage and um and uh but this happened and now you know your head shaved and this thing is that and i said the head shaved she goes didn't i thought oh man you'll just cut my hair you know and she starts laughing kind of like oh my god i'm like oh my god i'm like oh my god i'm joking around i'm like okay there she is she's here she was a great great great example where she was just living the things that i tried to do and i like listen to a podcast or I like read something or I save something and I like look at it and I'm like, okay, I'm going to practice that today. She was just being it. She, the only time she cried was when I told her that there was so much love and so many prayers pouring in. And she looked at me and she said, uh, you didn't have to tell me that. She goes, I can feel it. I can feel it. And she started crying. And that was the only time she cried. Every time she was just like, I'm so lucky to be alive. I'm so happy to be here. I'm so thankful for my body. I'm thankful for that nurse, for the way she smiled at me. I'm thankful for watching Home Alone 85 times on the TV. Cause that was the only thing that was on. She was just this beautiful example of focusing on what was good. It was really beautiful to watch. And, and she, you know, people said, Dan, you were so strong for us. Like, I wasn't strong for her, man. She was strong for us. She was so beautiful. And the way she moved through that was such, grace. And it was incredible to watch really, truly. And then, you know, I remember the doctor saying like, this is going to be a long recovery. It's going to take you about six months to get the implant. And then it's maybe a year or so to, and she literally looks at me, she goes, I'm going to do this in two months. And I was like, you're crazy. And she did. She actually, sorry, two weeks, two weeks, the swelling went down significantly enough to where they could replace the plate. And then it took another two weeks, of course. And then within four months, she's back on stage. It was incredible. And we actually went back to the same venue where it happened. The doctor who saved her life and all the nurses and everybody were there in the audience. And they were just like, afterwards they came up there like, dude, we, we don't even know what to say because we don't get to see, we, you know, we, we do this to perform the surgeries. We see them recover and then they leave. And then we don't really see them. So for us to see her on stage, to see this story play out, they were like, they honestly were like, so, they were like, thank you for giving us this gift. And I was like, shut up. Thank you for giving us this gift. You guys are amazing. And it was this beautiful moment, you know, we got to share all together and it's pretty extraordinary. And actually one of the first things she said when she woke up from a surgery was because it hurt for her to even like cough, it hurt. Sneezing, it hurt. One of the first things she asked, she goes, can I still get pregnant? Can I have a baby? And they were like, yeah, you can. And so now I think about that moment, we're saying that that was one of the first things that she thought about. One of her fears was, can I still have a baby? And then now we look at our daughter and you're like, it's pretty awesome. It's pretty cool. Earlier, you said that when you called your dad, you asked him to pray for you, to pray for Haley. How much do you think prayer changed what happened that day? That moment when I told Haley, I said, honey, man, the love pouring in, the prayers, the, the energy, this is, and when she said to me, she goes, you didn't have to even tell me. She goes, I can feel it, honey. I can feel it. That was, it's like undeniable, you know, in those moments when you experience that, you experience those moments where it's no longer something that you just, it just sounds nice, but that you feel and you experience. And then you, there's like, knowingness where you're like, I know that it helps that there's this collective energy, this collective thing that connects us all, you know, this love and how we can pour that into each other. So, you know, it was, uh, yeah, I think it without a doubt helped. Yeah, absolutely. And I've been following your journey, um, you know, since becoming a dad. Um, so I, I didn't know that story about the first thing that Haley asked for, was whether she was able to still bear children or not at that stage was having children, something that you guys talked about, or were like, did you feel ready to be a dad or did that after that experience? Like, did you realize that you want to sort of accelerate that or experience that feeling of bringing a child into this world? No, I think it was something that we talked about, you know, and especially Haley, that as far as, um, you know, people would ask her, they'd say like, what do you want to do? Like, what's next on your career? And, and she was like, honestly, I don't know. And she said that she kept hitting this like blank wall of what she wanted to do in her career because she realized like the next thing I want to do is I want to be a mom. Like that was, that was the next thing that she felt. And you felt ready or is it easier for her to, I, you know, it's fun. I felt ready because of honest, I mean, I was like, man, I'm, I'm, I'm getting up there. It's time for me to have a baby. But, um, her love and excitement. Yeah. For having a child, like it was just incredible. And now seeing her as a mother, you're like, oh my gosh, you were born to be a mom. She's such a great mama. Like, yeah, it's awesome to see that. It's an amazing. And I just like, I'm so thankful. Cause I'm like, wow, man, I just, yeah, I'm just thankful, man. Yeah. Yeah. So what about, uh, the actual journey of pregnancy? How was that? You know, unfortunately, uh, our first pregnancy, um, we, we lost the child and, uh, that was, uh, incredibly devastating. Um, If you don't mind me asking how far along was she? It was, it was far enough to know we knew like the gender. We were always picking names. I told some friends and it was the first time that I really felt like somebody sharing their story with me that they experienced. It genuinely helped. me, genuinely. Like hearing them say like, we went through that. We understand you. It's not going to help. This is going to hurt, but I promise you it'll be better. I promise you you'll feel better. I've never fully, fully experienced that. Somebody sharing their story and it feeling like a warm blanket where I was like, I actually really needed to hear that. Thank you. And it also was a reminder too, that you just never know what people are going through. You know, you don't. And I think that, you know, we live in a time when people are, it's easy to just like, you know, say something about somebody and comment on them and tear them down or be hurtful. And you don't know. So you kept that a secret from like your followers? Oh yeah. No, we didn't want, you know, it was a very private moment. Very, very private. And then later on, later when we felt like, you know, later. And the reason why we shared as well was because. Sorry, did your followers know that you guys were pregnant? No. Okay. No. So they. They weren't expecting. We were about to announce it. I had a video. I still have the video. Oh my gosh. I had it locked, scheduled on my Instagram to go out at 9am the next day. Oh my gosh. And the day before something wasn't right. And we went and we found out, we realized like, oh, and I had to take it down and the whole thing, you know? So it was, it was really unfortunate. But later we decided to share that part of our story of a pregnancy because when we heard from somebody else in that time, that difficulty, it really, really, really helped us genuinely. So if there was somebody out there that had heard that, we were like, maybe that could help them, you know, perhaps. And so here we are in our little rainbow baby and we were seeing rainbows everywhere. It's the craziest thing, man. Like LA. I've never seen more rainbows in LA in my life. You know, it's like, it feels like we're living in Hawaii or something. There's so many rainbows. It's crazy. Yeah. I was just looking at your Instagram post where you were talking about that. I think like on the second day that your baby was born, you saw a rainbow. Yeah. Even like the baby shower, a rainbow appeared. Oh my gosh. And two days after she was born, it appeared. Four days before she was born, there was a rainbow. Like they were just, they were everywhere. And what is the feeling like now, like being a dad? It's amazing. It really is. It's incredible. And also painful because I, you know, when I go, I have to go away sometimes and work and I'm like, oh, I don't want to go. I want to stay home and I want to be with her and be with my wife and experience these moments. But again, I'm just thankful. I love it, man. It's the best. It's the best. Yeah, it really is. You seem like such an amazing father, such an amazing husband. You inspire me, man. Yeah. You really inspire me. Just seeing like the love in your heart and how connected you are, you know, to the things that really matter. Earlier, you know, I know you had said that you felt like you'd been sort of chasing success for a lot of your life. And to you, you know, success meant happiness. And I know we kind of explored where that came from, whether that was through maybe expectations of trying to make your father happy or maybe, you know, that bullied eight-year-old kid. Yeah. And I think to sort of wrap things up, it'd be great to know, like, what is success to you now? Honestly, right now, where I am, my daughter, like, when I look at her, like, I'm like, I feel like the biggest success, you know, truly. I feel like I look in her face and I look in her eyes and I just, it feels like that's the number one. For me, success right now is enjoying the love. Because my whole life, I felt like, or at least my beginning of my life, was about success equal love, success equal, you know, worthiness. I think my moral, my story is that you're enough no matter what. You always have been and you always will be no matter what. And I think somebody told me that one time. They said, if you're in a field by yourself with no belongings, no shoes, nothing, just you as a man or a woman, that that is enough, you know? So, yeah. Well, this was amazing. Thank you so much for just opening your heart, sharing your story. This was truly incredible. So yeah, Derek, everybody, thank you. Appreciate you, man. Thank you. On any journey using Uber, it helps to know you're getting into the right car. PIN verification adds an extra step to make sure your ride is your ride. Before the trip begins, your app gives you a unique PIN. Just tell it to your driver and they'll enter it in their app before the ride can start. Hey, what's your PIN? 2538. That way, you know you're in the right car taking the right trip and your driver knows you're the right passenger. Make sure your ride is your ride with PIN verification from Uber. 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